London on The Esplanade | U/C | 33, 16 st | 108.6, 57.9 m | Downtown

[taal]

Yes you heard me!

Any idea when the London Condos will be built? :bash:

[DRTO]

I think they're about 60% sold now, so it could be very soon.

[taal]

Thanks! - I like the renderings i think it could turn out pretty good
Whats everyone elses thoughts about the project?

[You are to blame]

any renderings?

[kyser soze]

NIce project. I love the location and came really close to getting a flat. Kinda regret not getting one... especially cuz of the shortage of condos in this city... :eek2:

[G_DOG]

i heard 70%

[KGB]

Hello London!!!



ELLOW!!!





KGB

[taal]

http://www.urbandb.com/canada/ontario/toronto/london_on_the_esplanade_1/image2.html

[Travis007]

Pretty bad picture quality though...

http://www.urbandb.com/canada/ontario/toronto/london_01.jpg
http://www.urbandb.com/canada/ontario/toronto/40_the_esplanade_01.gif

Pretty decent tower, good heigts and another Toronto-style tower to add onto the list. Sales were very strong for this I believe, I read that 50% was sold out in the first two weeks. Construction could start this fall I heard and True Spirit is selling well and could start construction this fall too.

[Travis007]

NIce project. I love the location and came really close to getting a flat. Kinda regret not getting one... especially cuz of the shortage of condos in this city... :eek2:

Have you seen my thread...and all the proposals for Toronto?

Far from a condo shortage in Toronto... :lol:

[kyser soze]

Have you seen my thread...and all the proposals for Toronto?

Far from a condo shortage in Toronto... :lol:

I guess the sarcasm was lost in the post! :bash:

[Siopao]

I heard its in downtown :baaa:

[valantino]

" Toronto-style tower "

I don't think so.

[Travis007]

" Toronto-style tower "

I don't think so.

Big box clad in all glass with some pre-cast detailing, I don't see why not. It fits in with Toronto's other new condos including 18 Yorkville, Murano, SP!RE, 22, Radio City, etc.

[Lucky 24]

Construction will begin this fall.

OMB approves Esplanade towers
deck3

W.D. LIGHTHALL
SPECIAL TO THE STAR

The Ontario Municipal Board has approved London on the Esplanade, two condominium towers planned for the historic St. Lawrence Market area of Toronto.

"The OMB decision is an acknowledgement of two towers on the property, similar to the form and height that was originally applied for," says Paulo Stellato, a partner with Cityzen Development Group.

Toronto city council had turned down Cityzen's rezoning application for the site, located at 40 The Esplanade. Cityzen wanted a change from medium- to high-density zoning, to permit construction of 33- and 16-storey condo buildings rising from a shared five-storey podium.

The OMB's decision, released in mid-August, reduces the towers to 32 and 15 storeys and requires all parking in the project to be underground, eliminating a four-storey, above-ground parking structure in Cityzen's original proposal.

"We didn't get everything," Stellato says. "Aside from that, you still have to look at the positive side, the whole acknowledgement of the density, of this site being suitable for intensification," he says.

"The form of the development was not significantly impacted," added Stellato.

Neighbourhood residents found both bad and good in the OMB decision.

Two highrise towers are inappropriate for a historically sensitive neighbourhood consisting largely of low-rise buildings, says Joan Campbell, who handles communications for the St. Lawrence Neighbourhood Association.

"Our feeling is we see the financial district as a background to a low- to mid-rise neighbourhood. This (decision) sort of breaks the pattern and allows the financial district heights to creep into what is really a heritage residential neighbourhood," Campbell says.

The better news is the decision establishes a height ceiling at 15 storeys in the St. Lawrence area, says Paul Smith, treasurer of the St. Lawrence Neighbourhood Association.

The OMB decision establishes 40 The Esplanade as a transitional site, Smith says.

The higher tower on the western portion of the site references the skyscrapers of the financial district. The 15-storey building will be built on the east side, closer to the St. Lawrence neighbourhood, and it references the lower heights of that area.

"I think they've established a line in the sand for future development and that we will be better prepared for any future development," says Smith, noting that proposals exist to redevelop several other properties in the St. Lawrence neighbourhood.

"We feel now that the lower tower, at 15 storeys, establishes the height for future building in the St. Lawrence neighbourhood. So that's good news," Smith says.

With 80 per cent of units sold, construction of London on the Esplanade will begin this fall.

[rapideye95]

Big box clad in all glass with some pre-cast detailing, I don't see why not. It fits in with Toronto's other new condos including 18 Yorkville, Murano, SP!RE, 22, Radio City, etc.

Almost all skyscrapers now are built that way anyway...it just varies on the budget. Even many office buildings are clad all in glass...and it's done all over north america

[look@round]

OK, a few updates about London condos, almost 2 years after the last message!
I guess the construction was postponed a little... So I passed by yesterday night, and there's a big excavation now, and one crane. Next time I will try to take some pictures.
Here's the website: http://www.londoncondos.ca/flash/index.html
Anyone knows the height of the 2 towers (especially the west one)?

[phunky]

Ya, these are really late. They must have had bad sales.

[Holland]

I really like this development... in terms of the street it's on, the neighbourhood, the look of the architecture, the marketing/name/theme of it, etc... it's really something different.

I hope it turns out well... but it seems like it could be awhile before we will even be able to guess!

[Taller, Better]

That rendering looks clunky and scary. I have been nervous about this project since day one, as they never had a rendering of it on the hoarding around the site and I had never seen it advertised with a rendering. Usually if you've got a nice looking project, you want to show it off. If you don't...........

[Waterloo_Guy]

That rendering looks clunky and scary. I have been nervous about this project since day one, as they never had a rendering of it on the hoarding around the site and I had never seen it advertised with a rendering. Usually if you've got a nice looking project, you want to show it off. If you don't...........

Exactly my concern. In situations like this I tend to look at price per square foot to get a sense of what is really being developed.

[bar1967]

Way, way, way back I remeber going to the sales office and thought (at the time) that the building looked pretty good - all based on the model. The Esplanade side 'lofts' seemed to blend well with the street (including retail) and the tower was set back enough. Come to think of it though, I don't ever recall seeing a large rendering of it. hmmm

[kettal]

Who cares what it looks like? It's London, man! London!

[valantino]

have you guys not see the met condo?!?

[isaidso]

Who cares what it looks like? It's London, man! London!

Exactly, who wouldn't want a London style loft: way over priced, shoddy construction materials by Canadian standards, single glazing, creaky floorboards, and water pipes with no pressure. As former Londoners, my entire family laughed our heads off that Canadians would want to live in any building that takes its cues from a country with a vastly inferior housing stock.

What's next Baghdad Lofts?

Now 'Toronto Lofts' in London, UK would be genius marketing. Canadians live in far better housing than the British, and most of them know it.

[Filip]

Exactly, who wouldn't want a London style loft: way over priced, shoddy construction materials by Canadian standards, single glazing, creaky floorboards, and water pipes with no pressure. As former Londoners, my entire family laughed our heads off that Canadians would want to live in any building that takes its cues from a country with a vastly inferior housing stock.

What's next Baghdad Lofts?

Now 'Toronto Lofts' in London, UK would be genius marketing. Canadians live in far better housing than the British, and most of them know it.

I think there's an "Ontario" Condo going up near the MI6 building.

[look@round]

Well, the name isn't worse than some other developments we have in TO right now...
And at least, I guess everyone agree about the fact that the location is really a good one... It's just too bad they build such a "common" condo here... Its neighbour the L tower is 100 times nicer!

[Taller, Better]

Maybe they are referring to London, Ontario!! :D

[w.ll.am]

Woo... my first post :)

One of the worst things about this building is the name. I am actually a purchaser of one of the units of the building so anything about it is of great interest to me.

The number one reason for purchasing this unit was location. Being so close to the iconic St. Lawrence Market makes it a guaranteed good investment.

Now if only they'd build the damn thing. The hole has been dug and there's been a giant crane sitting in it for about 6 months.

The official move in date has finally been released for October 2008. Which means more likely Jan 2009. I have become convinced that they used the purchase capital from the london to finance their other projects like 1 City Hall

[avatar_re]

What's next Baghdad Lofts?



LOL :lol:

[look@round]

As promised, some pictures of the construction which has finally started:

http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/3589/img9314vb9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/7807/img9315ny7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/2433/img9317zp4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[bigcityboy]

i sure hope restaurants occupy the retail space on the ground floor of both buildings and continue the awesome deep patios that run all the way from church st. it's my favourite stretch of patios in the city. maybe the church st keg will relocate here considering they're going to have to move to allow for the condo-ization of the building they're currently in (toronto first police station, btw).

[look@round]

it's my favourite stretch of patios in the city
Very true! I didn't know this place (well, not in summer time and in winter it's not so great...), and I was very pleasantly surprised by all these nice patios! I should go there some day to have a drink!

[phunky]

i sure hope restaurants occupy the retail space on the ground floor of both buildings and continue the awesome deep patios that run all the way from church st. it's my favourite stretch of patios in the city. maybe the church st keg will relocate here considering they're going to have to move to allow for the condo-ization of the building they're currently in (toronto first police station, btw).
There's a Keg on Church St? The only one I know of is the one on Jarvis. The Keg Mansion.

[bigcityboy]

yep, between front and the esplanade. it's quite big, too. been there for 10+ years at least. patio is very small, though. maybe 4 tables of 2. it could use a bigger patio.

and there's another keg in the downtown core as well. right by the four seasons opera house on york street. the old moven pick (sp?) location. for a chain restaurant (i call them the mcdonald's of steakhouses), it's actually one of the most sleek restaurants in town. they went all out on this mother when they built it. and the bar is packed with the bay st crowd on a regular basis.

[Taller, Better]

There's a Keg on Church St? The only one I know of is the one on Jarvis. The Keg Mansion.

There is a Keg at 12 Church Street, and some fine patios around there.

I will be going to the Keg Mansion tonight to mow down a most excellent Rib Eye!! :banana:

[phunky]

I prefer Canyon Creeks' steak for franchised restaurants over the Keg's.

[zerokarma]

Good update

[w.ll.am]

An interesting little find...

http://www.ilikelondon.com/

parent/brother/child company of Citizen perhaps?

http://www.londoncondos.ca is the Toronto one.

ps. I like Canyon Creek too... their ribs are fantastic.

[look@round]

^^ Ah, ah, funny... and so original!! Every city is gonna have its London Condos...

Here are some updates from this week-end:

http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/7848/img0122jg4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/8007/img0123bn5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/6749/img0124ts1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/7146/img0125kf6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[ratoronto]

Great to see this project finally rising.

The Esplanade is one of my favourite streets... this stretch has a very European feel to it.

[Waterloo_Guy]

I'm still worried that this project will be cheap and ugly.

[Taller, Better]

I can't believe we haven't seen a decent rendering yet. Why all the mystery?
The rendering we have seen is a very poor one.

[bar1967]

Maybe it is taking so long because they are building the whole thing (foundation included) out of red brick? :)

[Taller, Better]

Well, red brick will just be the facing material, not structural. It is such an odd,
secretive project.

[bar1967]

Well, red brick will just be the facing material, not structural. It is such an odd,
secretive project.

It was a joke based on the Boston Red brick thread.... :)

[Taller, Better]

LOL! Went right over me! ;)

[p5archit]

Maybe it is taking so long because they are building the whole thing (foundation included) out of red brick?

...either that or they using two guys to build the whole thing.

[w.ll.am]

It's not secretive... the sales office had a model of the building and it was quite nice... very simlar to the drawing on their site....

It's a floor of shops, then 4 floors of loft spaces which is topped by a shared common area between the two buildings which has a pool and sitting areas.

I have the giant booklet they handed out at home. I'll see if there is a page in it worth scanning to show.

[thryve]

^^ That would be great! Thank you!

[w.ll.am]

Here is a better idea of what is going up here...

Artists concept drawing...
http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff285/kadian42/building.jpg

Footprint and overview of terrace area... 4 stories up. For orientation the trees are on the north end of the building.
http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff285/kadian42/roof.jpg

[Taller, Better]

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

[w.ll.am]

undecided on the aesthetic of it?

From what I read the west side is supposed to meld with the steel tower downtown business sector of things while the east side brownstone is to meld with the st. lawrence market area that has a lot of red brick and lower rise buildings

my only concern would be what is the red brick actually going to look like. Since that building has the upper scale models I would think they would be very careful in what brick / mortar they use.

stores will also line the bottom floor.

[Taller, Better]

I've never been crazy about buildings built in two different styles... I like the cohesion of one single design strategy. But, I guess we'll just have to wait and see how it turns out.

[valantino]

I agee as I'm really not liking the transition for pre-cast to brick hopefully real brick in the rendering. It probably would look better if they choose an entirely different design for the east tower to make it appear more like two separate projects.

[bar1967]

I wish they would make the Esplanade a ped only street - at least from Church St to the Novotel. Hopefully that hororible parking lot on the south West corner of Church will go soon.

[Wrk_InProgress]

The red "brick" portion is adjacent to the Spaghetti Factory ?

[casaguy]

Pics taken yesterday.

Definitely at street level... finally.

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z133/markus919/DSCN0663.jpg

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z133/markus919/DSCN0661.jpg

[look@round]

Thanks for the update :)

[Waterloo_Guy]

I'm still so worried about this one.

[Marcanadian]

Thanks for the update! I got yelled at last time I tried to snap a few shots.

[Taller, Better]

Thanks for the update! I got yelled at last time I tried to snap a few shots.

I love it when I am on the sidewalk and people tell me I cannot photograph something. I take pleasure in telling them I am allowed to photograph anything I choose! Invariably they have a completely foolish look on their face when they realize the meaning of "public space"! :lol:

[Jackhammer]

I love it when I am on the sidewalk and people tell me I cannot photograph something. I take pleasure in telling them I am allowed to photograph anything I choose! Invariably they have a completely foolish look on their face when they realize the meaning of "public space"! :lol:
So long as your not taking shots of their pubic space ... then yeah, you're fine.

[Taller, Better]

So long as your not taking shots of their pubic space ... then yeah, your fine.

Oh, I've done a bit of that in my time, too! :naughty:

[novaguy]

Any updates?

[Marcanadian]

Any updates?

Yep. I took these yesterday afternoon.

http://i24.tinypic.com/2vmvg9s.jpg

http://i22.tinypic.com/35d9kr5.jpg

http://i23.tinypic.com/oivrwp.jpg

http://i20.tinypic.com/2emmkwm.jpg

[look@round]

2 days ago:

http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/8497/img3966fk2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[current]

March 22

look@round your photo updates are missed. London is now rising above its podium. Photo from Esplanade looking northwest.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2379/2355418678_cbca96370b_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3280/2355418684_9f551fd2c7_b.jpg

From Esplanade looking east.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3063/2355418690_133fd46b86_b.jpg

From the Sony Centre looking east across Scott St. at the rising two towers.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2104/2355418702_bfda8d660f_b.jpg

From Front St looking south with the Sony Centre on the right.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2135/2355418706_a5a548d861_b.jpg

[Taller, Better]

If that statistic that everyone uses about Dubai having some huge percentage of the world's cranes is true, they must have a million.... because there are a hell of a lot of them right here in Toronto.

[Regan4000]

I walked by the site today. The sign said Cytizen. What is that?

[ratoronto]

Cytizen is the developer (or at least one of the developers) of this project. They are also involved with the curvey marylin monroe tower in Mississauga. They're small but hopefully their projects leave a big/positive architectual mark.

[Regan4000]

^^

Cool, thanks!

[Wrk_InProgress]

Cityzen works with Fernbrook a lot, and they are also behind the "L Tower" and "Pier 27".

[look@round]

Thanks for the update current :)
Good to see this building, because even though it's not so great, at least the "flat-iron" building (by Novotel, the one you can see on the last picture) will be "not so lonely" in the skyline.
Of course, a great addition will be L-tower :banana:

[current]

April 29

Looking east from Scott St. brick is being installed on the east tower.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2337/2453317830_699af1b644_b.jpg

Looking southeast from Front St.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2157/2453335696_df613ed276_b.jpg

The northeast corner of Esplanade and Scott.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3167/2453335706_5649902168_b.jpg

Brick being installed next to the Old Spaghetti Factory.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2374/2453335712_0b9ee9da2e_b.jpg

[vancouverite/to'er]

Wow 35 Esplanade's cheesiness is too hilarious when you look at it from that angle! Gotta love this a real '89 throwback. Those mullions on the huge arched window are soo goofy.

[isaidso]

Which one is 35 Esplanade? Is it the beige brick building south of this condo? If so, that's one of the coolest buildings in the city. I'd take that over almost any of the glass towers going up today. It is 80's, but one of the few towers from that decade that isn't cheesy.

The similar coloured building to it's east with the Mansard roof is also done very well. Most reproductions are very tacky. This one was a success. Even at street level, these buildings are much more successful than most of the towers going up today.

My admiration for them might have to do with growing up in London, UK, but I don't think they are out of place in Toronto. They seem to bridge the gap between the typical London city block and the less fussy Toronto city block well.

[Toronto2008]

35 Esplanade is one of my favourite towers in tdot

[Marcanadian]

London is rising on the left side of the photograph.

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/7594/img5044ph1.jpg

[bar1967]

London is rising on the left side of the photograph.

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/7594/img5044ph1.jpg

Taken from Kings Court? Looks like a very familiar vantage point!! :)

FYI, you can see it from the Gardiner now.

[Number 6]

Love the picture! Interesting angle.

Any other purchasers in this project besides myself out there?

[InTheBeach]

Love the picture! Interesting angle.

Any other purchasers in this project besides myself out there?

Not me, but a great nabe to live in.

[Marcanadian]

Taken from Kings Court? Looks like a very familiar vantage point!! :)


Indeed it was.

[w.ll.am]

Love the picture! Interesting angle.

Any other purchasers in this project besides myself out there?

I am... we will be in the east tower on the 11th floor.. s/e facing

We just got our appt to pick out all the trimmings. :)

[Number 6]

I am... we will be in the east tower on the 11th floor.. s/e facing

We just got our appt to pick out all the trimmings. :)

Great! We got ours too for mid-June. We will be inthe west building facing west/north.
We were sent a letter a while back telling us that we would get our unit in early October/08. I really doubt that.

[Number 6]

I am... we will be in the east tower on the 11th floor.. s/e facing

We just got our appt to pick out all the trimmings. :)

Didn't want to bore the readers on this forum with stuff that would only be interesting to us, so I have sent you a private message.

[current]

May 25

From the TD Centre
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3294/2525886042_3c989755c8_b.jpg

[Waterloo_Guy]

This building is such a mystery. I have no idea what to expect.

[Taller, Better]

I'm not holding my breath.... I just can't see this as being a very interesting result. I hope I am wrong.

[Marcanadian]

I think it looks pretty decent so far. From UT.

May 25

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3023/2522962632_10344a64b1_b.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2052/2522142167_5958c614e9_b.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2188/2522964050_afeeefe742_b.jpg

[Number 6]

OOHHHHHHHH YAH!
This one is singing to me. It says " Don't you think I'm sexy..and don't you want to live here.." Oh Ya baby!

[valantino]

Met turned out decent or at least much better than its renderings so I don't know why there is so much worry/hesitation. However, too beefy to be sexy and no, I love my apartment and building too much.

[Taller, Better]

However, too beefy to be sexy

Most things that catch my eye as being sexy are "beefy".



(now I am going to get yelled at because children should not read about 'beefy'!!)

[isaidso]

:| You should buy one of those t-shirts at Priape that say: "Sorry Girls, I Prefer Bears". Just ambiguous enough to be wearable.

That sub-culture always have the best merchandise.

[Wrk_InProgress]

This stretch of The Esplanade is fantastic. Best stretch of patios in the city. It has a great central location but it's still "tucked" away.

Congratulations to those who purchased here.

[CrazyCanuck]

Is that faux brick I see? Gah.

[valantino]

Do you not see the piles of brick just inside the building? I repeat for the "last time". these are not pre-cast panels and those "evenly spaced" gaps are to allow air circulation and any moisture trapped in behind the "porous" brick facade to drip out.

[Ziggy]

This actually has some of the nicest brickwork detailing of any recent project.

[Number 6]

Is that faux brick I see? Gah.

Hi Canuck

If someone dropped one of those bricks on your toe
I'm sure you would quickly realize that it wasn't Faux
I suspect I just pulled off a rhyme
I find myself doing that all the time

[Taller, Better]

We have a poet and didn't knowit!

[bar1967]

This stretch of The Esplanade is fantastic. Best stretch of patios in the city. It has a great central location but it's still "tucked" away.

Congratulations to those who purchased here.

I wish the city would get off its ass and make part of the Esplanade a pedestrian street. Church St to the begining of the Novotel.

[Taller, Better]

That would be a good candidate for a pedestrian street. This from two weekends ago.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/dawnd_01/Autumn%202007/winter%202007/Summer%202008/IMGP6344iMay1508-1.jpg

[Number 6]

Absolutely beautiful photo, Taller. A real framer. This one could be in any tourist travel promo piece for a European destination.
I truly love this neighbourhood during the warm weather months. The summer evenings around here are almost magical.

I hope they keep the feeling going further down the street with some decent sized transplanted trees in front of the London condos.

[Taller, Better]

I'm always astounded how the bars on that street are packed every night of the year... that area is an incredible magnet and a credit to the planning of that neighbourhood.

[Canadian Chocho]

I like this area.

[urban 2.0]

That would be a good candidate for a pedestrian street. This from two weekends ago.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/dawnd_01/Autumn%202007/winter%202007/Summer%202008/IMGP6344iMay1508-1.jpg

... this is what John St. should look like.

[InTheBeach]

I wish the city would get off its ass and make part of the Esplanade a pedestrian street. Church St to the begining of the Novotel.

That would suck. Really. It would suck.

[InTheBeach]

... this is what John St. should look like.

That would suck. Really. It would suck.

[bar1967]

That would suck. Really. It would suck.

Why?

[ggaleazz]

cuz it's too screwball european!

[valantino]

replacing streets will pedestrian malls is just so contrived and every third rate city in North America now has one .... NEXT!

[w.ll.am]

What's wrong with trying to emulate the romantic European pedestrian thoroughfare?

Calling is contrived and for third rate cities isn't really a rebuttal of any kind. In reality it's a one line disrespectful response.

If you'd like to have an actual conversation about the pros (promotes community, romantic, quiet) and cons (???) then let's have at it in the general thread.

[urban 2.0]

... well it's just so nice sitting on the edge of a Toronto street sucking in the fumes of dump trucks, city buses and delivery vans.

It's nice for a bit of solitude with your pint.

[sumisu]

well it's contrived when it's done half-ass, as it has been done in NA. now it wouldnt work here, because it's just not that kind of street. not enough use by people, and enough room to walk as is.

[CrazyCanuck]

cuz it's too screwball european!

I miss arebe.

[InTheBeach]

Why?

I'm still searching for a pedestrian mall that leaves me impressed. They are always contrived artificial zones.

It's fun when we close the street off for a festival, but it is not realistic to create a street where the only transit option is walking (and biking, I guess).

Perhaps you could get away with something like this if it included a streetcar line too.

Don't get me wrong, I hate cars as much as the next guy, but can't help but notice that the best parts of town for flourishing pedestrian traffic also have the best transit options (Yonge St., Queen St., King St., Spadina, etc).

[valantino]

What's wrong with trying to emulate the romantic European pedestrian thoroughfare?



For the same reason that emulating Paris at the corner of Richmond & Jarvis doesn't work.

Kensington Market perhaps and, if it were doable, Yonge Street but not some side street that doesn't even have the combined traffic to appear busy

[Taller, Better]

The Esplanade is the perfect street to be converted to pedestrian. I'm opposed to taking streets like Yonge Street, or Church Street and artificially convert them to a pedestrian thoroughfares, but the car is so secondary on Esplanade that it would not be missed. Probably Baldwin could go that route, too.

[DENTROBATE54]

The Esplanade is the perfect street to be converted to pedestrian. I'm opposed to taking streets like Yonge Street, or Church Street and artificially convert them to a pedestrian thoroughfares, but the car is so secondary on Esplanade that it would not be missed. Probably Baldwin could go that route, too.

^^ Pedestrianizing the Esplanade would fit right into my subway proposal to put a subway line through the St Lawrence Market area. With the metro handling the flow of people in and and out of the general Church-Front-Esplanade-Jarvis area, who needs surface traffic spoiling the ambience. Now that I'd drink to! :cheers:

[bar1967]

The Esplanade is the perfect street to be converted to pedestrian. I'm opposed to taking streets like Yonge Street, or Church Street and artificially convert them to a pedestrian thoroughfares, but the car is so secondary on Esplanade that it would not be missed. Probably Baldwin could go that route, too.

Here here Taller!! Plus we are only talking about a couple hundred meters if that so it is not like I'm suggesting to close Church St. from Dundas to the Esplanade or something..... The Esplanade would be even greater if that horrible parking lot on the corner of Church and Esplanade was built out with some nice active retail/patio along the base of it.

[NorthYorker]

But why does it have to be fully pedestrian? You could simply line the sidewalks with plantlife; the street would be marginally narrower, and we could all breath a little easier.

[valantino]

Again .. there's hardly any foot traffic on the Esplanade and doubtful that would change if you pedestrianized a block or two. Yonge has the pedestrian traffic at least however its too integrated into the street grid to ever become any more than a week attempt. And therein lies the problem, our grid.

[valantino]

Pedestrianizing the Esplanade would fit right into my subway proposal to put a subway line through the St Lawrence Market area.

care to explain that subway proposal?

[Taller, Better]

I'm still searching for a pedestrian mall that leaves me impressed. They are always contrived artificial zones.

It's fun when we close the street off for a festival, but it is not realistic to create a street where the only transit option is walking (and biking, I guess).

Perhaps you could get away with something like this if it included a streetcar line too.

Don't get me wrong, I hate cars as much as the next guy, but can't help but notice that the best parts of town for flourishing pedestrian traffic also have the best transit options (Yonge St., Queen St., King St., Spadina, etc).

In general when it comes to artificially imposing a pedestrian mall in North America, you are absolutely correct. Most I have seen have been stupendous failures, with the Academy Award going to the disastrous Granville mall in Vancouver which took a healthy, fun active street (that I remember from the 70's) and turned it into a graveyard filled with junkies. There are inherent differences between North Americans and Europeans (whether that meets with anyone's approval or not), and North Americans have traditionally interacted with the automobile on a far more comfortable scale than Europeans. Try and imagine walking around Manhattan with the honking cars and taxis removed. Often the throngs of pedestrians seem to thrive on their interaction with the cars.. take Yonge Street for example; turning it into a permanent mall would be the kiss of death. There are a few small streets downtown that would probably make excellent malls, but by and large most busy thoroughfares do not lend themselves to that kind of permanent conversion.

As a side note, a few years back they decided to make Church Street a pedestrian mall every Sunday. The first Sunday there was a street fair, and it was packed. The second/third/fourth Sundays consisted of people wandering quietly and awkwardly, mostly still sticking to the sidewalks, or self consciously down the centre of the road wondering why the road was blocked off. The feedback was mostly negative, so they scrapped the idea half way through the summer. Once the cars got back on the street Church Street returned to its former rollicking jolly (one might say even "gay") self! :)

[Taller, Better]

edit.
posts were duplicating this afternoon due to gremlins in the system.

[Ziggy]

You might think I'm crazy, but I think it would be better to eliminate the sidewalks. Just pave the whole thing in cobblestones and let cars, pedestrians and bikes mingle freely.

[Taller, Better]

^^ That is kind of the way it is now! :D
Anyhow, here is what I mean about people rather enjoying the interaction with cars. I took this picture this evening at Yonge and Dundas:

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/dawnd_01/Autumn%202007/winter%202007/Summer%202008/IMGP7360.jpg

[Marcanadian]

You can see London, Success, and RBC.

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/6388/img5391hi2.jpg

[current]

June 11

Bricks.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3130/2578572018_b24873b752_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3073/2578572028_2cc626e5bd_b.jpg

[thryve]

Amen for brick being used on this project. :cheers:

[Number 6]

Lovely Pics there , Current. Excellent composition.

Now.. What do you suppose could be happening down at the corner under that green tarp? I mean, it's summer for crying out loud, so its not like they need to protect anything from the cold. ..something's up..

[Taller, Better]

what would we do without current?

[valantino]

take a shower, dress, and see it for ourselves?

[current]

^^:lol:

June 17

Looking at the northwest corner. Bricks are now up to the fifth level of the east tower and it is topping out at 16 storeys. Glass is being installed on the west tower.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3074/2588475374_f83c237219_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3020/2588475386_ec262f8895_b.jpg

[Marcanadian]

London rising with Success.

http://img95.imageshack.us/img95/1286/img5546do6.jpg

[yyzer]

Incredible shot! :)

[Mollywood]

Imagine what that view is gonna look like with the L-Tower in it. SWEET!

[WinnipegPatriot]

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/6388/img5391hi2.jpg

The skyline looks more dramatic without the CN Tower, which in this photo looks like an extension/antenna of TD/Canada Trust Tower...

[Taller, Better]

I think just the opposite... this baby has been making the skyline dramatic for the past generation!

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/dawnd_01/Autumn%202007/winter%202007/Summer%202008/IMGP9738.jpg

[Number 6]

The skyline is more dramatic without the CN Tower???!!!!

The Paris skyline would be so much nicer without the Eiffel tower.

Big Ben in London? Knock it down.

The Empire State building, Chrysler building.. Boy they sure mess up the skyline don't they.

Well we we don't have to worry about the World Trade Centre marring Manhattan's skyline anymore.

Oh, lets not forget the statue of Liberty.

All of these above and many others are 'Icons' (including the CN Tower) that give great cities their signature trademark.

A comment like that should have you banished to some god-awful mosquito ridden, banal, boring, dead after 9 Pm, city, in the middle of nowhere......like......like Winnipeg..... ...for life!

[NorthYorker]

^^ I get where you're coming from, but I think there is something to his comment. We all know the CN throws the rest of the city out of scale, and I would have to agree that its more "dramatic" without, from a midrise perspective. Naturally, at street or skyline, the CN makes for a more "dramatic" shot. Besides, no ones sayign we should knock the sucker down, so relax.

[Number 6]

^^ I get where you're coming from, but I think there is something to his comment. We all know the CN throws the rest of the city out of scale, and I would have to agree that its more "dramatic" without, from a midrise perspective. Naturally, at street or skyline, the CN makes for a more "dramatic" shot. Besides, no ones sayign we should knock the sucker down, so relax.

Ok, I took a pill and I'm starting to relax.
Wow, there sure are a lot of anal uptight humourless people on this forum. Thought maybe I could just get into the flow of the stream, so to speak, and appear just as equally agitated and bothered.

[the Monkey's Uncle]

Regarding the earlier discussion on pedestrian malls...

I think pedestrian malls can actually work really well, but not on streets as wide as the esplanade. The malls you see in europe are often only one or two lanes wide (not including sidewalks!), and are not lined with skyscrapers. Most importantly, it is not a good idea to convert a place that is both a vehicle and pedestrian thoroughfare into a pedestrian mall: partly because cars are part of the vitality, and partly because cars have an important place in our cities as well. IMO, the best place for a pedestrian mall is an area that is surrounded on all sides by busy vehicular traffic streets, but still has a strong atmosphere. That means not just good nightlife, but bars, and low/medium rise residential. The fringes of the pedestrian zone should be well serviced by public transit, parking garages, and lots of traffic, combined with the aforementioned atmosphere within the zone.

[WinnipegPatriot]

The skyline is more dramatic without the CN Tower???!!!!

The Paris skyline would be so much nicer without the Eiffel tower.

Big Ben in London? Knock it down.

The Empire State building, Chrysler building.. Boy they sure mess up the skyline don't they.

Well we we don't have to worry about the World Trade Centre marring Manhattan's skyline anymore.

Oh, lets not forget the statue of Liberty.

All of these above and many others are 'Icons' (including the CN Tower) that give great cities their signature trademark.

A comment like that should have you banished to some god-awful mosquito ridden, banal, boring, dead after 9 Pm, city, in the middle of nowhere......like......like Winnipeg..... ...for life!


You are a sad little creature! About as appealing as something on the bottom of a shoe! Grow some pubes, then come back...

[Number 6]

Whats a pube? LOL Is it something like a 'roid'? ..cause I have those!

[yin_yang]

Regarding the earlier discussion on pedestrian malls...

I think pedestrian malls can actually work really well, but not on streets as wide as the esplanade. The malls you see in europe are often only one or two lanes wide (not including sidewalks!), and are not lined with skyscrapers. Most importantly, it is not a good idea to convert a place that is both a vehicle and pedestrian thoroughfare into a pedestrian mall: partly because cars are part of the vitality, and partly because cars have an important place in our cities as well. IMO, the best place for a pedestrian mall is an area that is surrounded on all sides by busy vehicular traffic streets, but still has a strong atmosphere. That means not just good nightlife, but bars, and low/medium rise residential. The fringes of the pedestrian zone should be well serviced by public transit, parking garages, and lots of traffic, combined with the aforementioned atmosphere within the zone.


right now, if there was to be a pedestrian zone in toronto...it would be on yonge, right between dundas and bloor. it's likely that the only public space that could support businesses without a road is yonge, or MAYBE some parts of bloor.

[Taller, Better]

^^ why take a hugely successful thoroughfare like Yonge Street and turn it into a mall? Any urban planner worth their salt knows that to do so would be the kiss of death for Yonge Street. Pedestrian malls work best for small side streets like Baldwin, etc... not for a bustling auto/pedestrian thoroughfare. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[isaidso]

I'd have to agree. What I'd love to see developed into a pedestrian mall is the extensive north-south alley that runs parallel to Yonge on the west side.

[kettal]

right now, if there was to be a pedestrian zone in toronto...it would be on yonge, right between dundas and bloor. it's likely that the only public space that could support businesses without a road is yonge, or MAYBE some parts of bloor.

Distillery distruct, i mean district.

[InTheBeach]

I'd have to agree. What I'd love to see developed into a pedestrian mall is the extensive north-south alley that runs parallel to Yonge on the west side.

and destroy a great laneway???

I love that stretch, plus the stores use the lane for deliveries.

[w.ll.am]

in barcelona there are tons of streets closed to regular traffic. they have a law or something I guess that allows only taxis and delivery vehicles on these roads? Not sure what the law is but while walking along streets a taxi would creep along while people meandered out of the way.

Could something like that work here? probably not with our car-centric mentality.

Imagine instead removing two lanes of trafic on yonge street and widening the sidewalks? madness!

[Me Too]

I think there are a few streets where a pedestrian walkway could work. Yorkville between Bay and the Four Seasons, Kensington Market and Baldwin just West of McCaul. None of these are major traffic routes, they are narrow and have a large amount of pedestrian traffic already.

[Mollywood]

Pedestrian malls have not been tried very much in Toronto. I loved when they turned Yonge St. into a pedestrian mall. My family used to go there a lot and always had a great time. I wish we had a few in Toronto now. It just needs to be done right but it would be a huge asset to the city. The ones in Europe are amazing!
Has anybody seen a really great pedestrian mall in North America? Prince Arthur St. in Montreal is OK but nothing special. I can't think of any good ones I've seen in North America but in Europe I saw many.

[Mollywood]

I would love to see a pedestrian mall built in one of the new neighbourhoods being developed on the east side. If the scale and size was right, I think it could work and be quite wonderful. A night market, like they have in Asia, would also go a long way in adding character to this city. I'm tired of the same old, same old. No traditional shopping malls, PLEASE!!! (especially big box) What a terrible waste of land.

[Taller, Better]

the key to a successful pedestrian mall is a very narrow street.. not a four lane road. A street like Yonge can be hugely successful for a one day event, but make it permanent and watch the pedestrians move out.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/dawnd_01/Autumn%202007/winter%202007/Summer%202008/july0806YongeStfestivaliii.jpg

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/dawnd_01/Autumn%202007/winter%202007/Summer%202008/july0806YongeStfestivalii.jpg

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/dawnd_01/Autumn%202007/winter%202007/Summer%202008/july0806YongeStfestivali.jpg

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j251/dawnd_01/Autumn%202007/winter%202007/Summer%202008/july0806YongeStfestivalclosedoffstr.jpg

[Number 6]

What a fascinating forum!!!:lol:

Last time this thread was on topic this condo was probably 5 floors lower!!!
And the (Moderator??) seems to be leading the parade:banana:

No wonder hardly no one seems to come here.

Pretty Micky Mouse.:ohno:

BUH BUH BYE FOLKS!

Good luck on the whole pedestrian mall thing..

[Mollywood]

What a fascinating forum!!!:lol:

Last time this thread was on topic this condo was probably 5 floors lower!!!
And the (Moderator??) seems to be leading the parade:banana:

No wonder hardly no one seems to come here.

Pretty Micky Mouse.:ohno:

BUH BUH BYE FOLKS!

Good luck on the whole pedestrian mall thing..

The reason nobody comes to this post is because this condo is nothing to get excited about, but right next door, oh yeah, now we're talking.
I totally agree with You, Taller. You need a much more narrow street than Yonge St. to make a pedestrian mall work.

[Taller, Better]

And the (Moderator??) seems to be leading the parade:banana:

No wonder hardly no one seems to come here.

.

If you are referring to me, I am not a moderator in the Toronto forums.

Are you leaving us so soon?

[CrazyCanuck]

What a fascinating forum!!!:lol:

Last time this thread was on topic this condo was probably 5 floors lower!!!
And the (Moderator??) seems to be leading the parade:banana:

No wonder hardly no one seems to come here.

Pretty Micky Mouse.:ohno:

BUH BUH BYE FOLKS!

Good luck on the whole pedestrian mall thing..

You won't be missed.

[Taller, Better]

methinks, somehow, that "number 6" is not quite the noob he professes to be. Perhaps in his next profile he will be "number 7"! :D

[Waterloo_Guy]

Smells like a different number to me.

[valantino]

methinks, somehow, that "number 6" is not quite the noob he professes to be. Perhaps in his next profile he will be "number 7"!

but Adama blew up the frackin' resurrection hub!!

[Wrk_InProgress]

I personally think this building is going to be one of the best, if not a bit understated, to go up in the last few years.

I was at Bier Market over the weekend and the combination of dark glass + brick looks really nice IMO.

[Taller, Better]

I rode my bike past it the night before last, and I have to agree.... this project, for all its mystery, seems to be coming along rather nicely!

[current]

July 30

From Front St. I also agree, this project is becoming a positive surprise.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3060/2720795359_2053d8ff55_b.jpg

After the prep work for the L Tower construction is over the Sony Centre will re-open for the 2009-10 season.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3015/2720795369_bcf065a3c7_b.jpg

From Bay and Front.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3073/2720795375_6ca6db4e85_b.jpg

From Rogers Centre.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3279/2720795381_63a88f0d8e_b.jpg

[Marco Polo]

Love your updates, Current. You really take photos from different spots - there is always some novelty in them.

Thanks.

[valantino]

I don't get the surprise. As I have mentioned before, Met renderings sucked compared to the end product as well

[Taller, Better]

This project seemed so secretive. There were no renderings on the hoardings, and I never saw any indication of what it will look like before a tenth rate rendering in the distance surfaced. I think a lot of people were nervous it would be crappy because of that, so hence the surprise.

[Waterloo_Guy]

I was certainly nervous. And I'm pleasantly surprised.

[current]

The building is turning out better than the rendering. I like the colour of the glass they are installing.

Here is a better idea of what is going up here...

Artists concept drawing...
http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff285/kadian42/building.jpg

Footprint and overview of terrace area... 4 stories up. For orientation the trees are on the north end of the building.
http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff285/kadian42/roof.jpg