# Cities with no defined city centres



## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

Most cities would have its city centre. It is the heart and soul of the city where culture, business, economy are all concentrated. In Chicago for example, the city centre would be around The Loop while for NY, it's Manhattan. But there are cities in the world is no defined city centre especially with large cities like Tokyo or Los Angeles. They are usually spread out or scattered in different areas. 

How about your city? Does your city have a defined city centre or is it spread out?


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## MPOWER (Jun 12, 2007)

My Village´s centre is the pub. (100 Inhabitants ^^)


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## pilotos (Jan 24, 2007)

Yes my city has a center, it's around the two main squares, the "central square" and the "post square", and the ancient and older center of the city is included, the city's population is ~200 thousands by the way.
Generally i believe that small cities always have a center, while big cities usually don't, and if there is one it is only technically and doesn't really exists.


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## philadweller (Oct 30, 2003)

LA has a very defined city center. I would say Santiago or Sau Paulo before LA.


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## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

philadweller said:


> LA has a very defined city center. I would say Santiago or Sau Paulo before LA.


Yes LA has downtown but its not the heart and soul of the city. Other than Downtown there are other district rich in the city's culture like Hollywood


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## Xusein (Sep 27, 2005)

I would say Atlanta is a good candidate.

YES, it has a well-defined downtown, but downtown isn't the only place getting all the action, like in say, Chicago or New York. There's also Midtown and Buckhead...both have skylines themselves and are growing as well. Or at least that's the impression that I got when I visited it. :dunno:


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## philadweller (Oct 30, 2003)

Downtown Manhattan (Lower Manhattan) is not where the action is either. Most US cities have a very vibrant Midtown.


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## eklips (Mar 29, 2005)

Finding a city center for Paris is harder than it seems.

Sure the central administrative city (105 square kilometres) is the center of the metropolitan area. However, once you are inside, the things that make it central are much too spread everywhere inside to really consider that it has a proper center. The nightlife is spread out, business is spread out (and the western suburbs are actualy even more economically developped than the actual city of Paris), shopping is spread out, touristic areas are spread out and so on.

Of course Paris is still much more centralised than the likes of L.A, but it isn't as much as it seems at first glance.


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## Xusein (Sep 27, 2005)

philadweller said:


> Downtown Manhattan (Lower Manhattan) is not where the action is either. Most US cities have a very vibrant Midtown.


Great point.


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## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

philadweller said:


> Downtown Manhattan (Lower Manhattan) is not where the action is either. Most US cities have a very vibrant Midtown.


When I see it, the whole Manhattan can define's NY's city centre compared to its neighbouring boroughs


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## tigerboy (Jun 7, 2006)

eklips said:


> Finding a city center for Paris is harder than it seems.
> 
> Sure the central administrative city (105 square kilometres) is the center of the metropolitan area. However, once you are inside, the things that make it central are much too spread everywhere inside to really consider that it has a proper center. The nightlife is spread out, business is spread out (and the western suburbs are actualy even more economically developped than the actual city of Paris), shopping is spread out, touristic areas are spread out and so on.
> 
> Of course Paris is still much more centralised than the likes of L.A, but it isn't as much as it seems at first glance.



This is a very good point. If we take governmental function for instance most senior ministries and the Matignon ( residence of the Prime Minister ) are found in the 7th but the Elysee, home of the president, is across in the 8th. The presence of au Printemps and Galeries Lafayette the most celebrated dept. stores in France, on Boul. Haussmann would normally indicates its prime position as shopping street but Les Champs is in fact regarded as prime with many other locations as well. There are 2 distinct business CBDs, in Bourse and La defense. One could go on.

It is possible to pinpoint the shopping epicentre of London at Oxford Circus were Oxford and Regent Sts meet, Government's epicentre at Whitehall and theatre on Shaftesbury Ave. but paris is more diffuse.


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## thematrix22 (Nov 20, 2007)

los angeles center is hollywood or downtown los angeles, and miami's center is south beach or downtown miami


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## thematrix22 (Nov 20, 2007)

WANCH said:


> Most cities would have its city centre. It is the heart and soul of the city where culture, business, economy are all concentrated. In Chicago for example, the city centre would be around The Loop while for NY, it's Manhattan. But there are cities in the world is no defined city centre especially with large cities like Tokyo or Los Angeles. They are usually spread out or scattered in different areas.
> 
> How about your city? Does your city have a defined city centre or is it spread out?


i don't know about tokyo but los angeles has different skylines not just downtown so it has a few centers but the true center of LA were everything is happening were the best clubs are ect... is hollywood


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## cernoch (Aug 7, 2007)

there are everywhere centres in Europe (in every small village) but I've never seen any American town where it was possible to recognize the centre


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## Paddington (Mar 30, 2006)

cernoch said:


> there are everywhere centres in Europe (in every small village) but I've never seen any American town where it was possible to recognize the centre


Except by that large mass of tall buildings, which everyone else is able to see. :scouserd:


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## cernoch (Aug 7, 2007)

^^Maybe in Chicago and few other cities. However, taller buildings can stay also in a suburb.


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## Sir Miles Platting (Nov 28, 2004)

Mississauga ON is one of Canada's largest cities (c600k) with vitually no discernible downtown. Ok, it was formed about 30 years ago as an agglomerate of several smaller townships but you would have to say that considering it's rapid growth, by now there should be some clue as to just whereabouts the center is hiding. It's had the same mayor since day one which may have something to do with it.


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## Mahratta (Feb 18, 2007)

Mumbai


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## RawLee (Jul 9, 2007)

We have downtown,but it doesnt represent neither economic nor business centre, and not even a cultural one. It's just the centre of the city.


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## urbanfan89 (May 30, 2007)

Kitchener/Waterloo is a small city dependent on the student population, so it doesn't have a clear downtown (the inner city of Kitchener has seen hard times lately). As for Toronto, the city centre is fairly clearly defined, with most economic, cultural, and social activities concentrated west of the Don River, south of Dupont, and east of Dufferin. But also important is all the suburban nodes that have developed into their own cities with cores, like Mississauga and Markham.


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## Epi (Jul 21, 2006)

London has 3. The main governmental area (by Parliament), The City, and of course Canary Wharf.


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## canadave87 (Oct 8, 2007)

cernoch said:


> there are everywhere centres in Europe (in every small village) but I've never seen any American town where it was possible to recognize the centre


Most smaller Canadian towns and cities (at least the non-suburban ones) I find tend to have very clear downtown cores which form the center of the city. Peterborough, Ontario and Burlington, Ontario (despite it's somewhat suburban nature) are both good examples of this.


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## bobbycuzin (May 30, 2007)

are you defining city centers by skylines or by the actual "node" of a city (place where everyone/everything comes together)?


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## gabrielbabb (Aug 11, 2006)

In mexico city downtown is the little businesses center and the cultural center or centro as we call it that translated would just be center but there are other city centers or downtowns of other cities that are conurbated with mexico city, but there are like 5 CBDs in all the city


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## Electrify (Mar 19, 2007)

Sir Miles Platting said:


> Mississauga ON is one of Canada's largest cities (c600k) with vitually no discernible downtown. Ok, it was formed about 30 years ago as an agglomerate of several smaller townships but you would have to say that considering it's rapid growth, by now there should be some clue as to just whereabouts the center is hiding. It's had the same mayor since day one which may have something to do with it.


I haven't spent much time in Mississauga, but wouldn't Streetsville or Port Credit be considered a downtown core?

Pretty much even the most sprawled out GTA suburbs have some form of core of some sort. Only one that might not have one is Scarborough, but I could be wrong on that.


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## Ashok (Jul 17, 2004)

Montreal >>> Downtown Montreal (Centre Ville)


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## TalB (Jun 8, 2005)

Initally, CBD isn't the same as saying downtown. The name comes from where businesses are located hence the term. NYC has a known example of a city with no distinct CBD as is LA. The reason is b/c of the size of these cities. However, I can never understand why the main area is always considered downtown, but that's another story.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

WANCH said:


> Most cities would have its city centre. It is the heart and soul of the city where culture, business, economy are all concentrated. In Chicago for example, the city centre would be around The Loop while for NY, it's Manhattan. But there are cities in the world is no defined city centre especially with large cities like Tokyo or Los Angeles. They are usually spread out or scattered in different areas.
> 
> How about your city? Does your city have a defined city centre or is it spread out?


Vienna has a very well defined city center, which has the very creative name "first district" (as its the first of the 23 districts) or alternatively "inner city". Its enclosed by the ring road on three sides and on one by the Danube channel and is located where already the roman legion city Vindobona was to be found. 

Its not only the tourist hub but also hosts the most working places (offices, tourism, politics, culture) out of all districts even though there are far larger districts in terms of space. Apart that it also hosts a huge number of cultural and political (federal as well as municipal) institutions.


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## Bahnsteig4 (Sep 9, 2005)

Berlin? London? Paris?


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## forrestcat (Apr 21, 2006)

Shopping malls are the unofficial city center in Malaysian cities :nuts:..coz that's where everything is..post office, banks and quite recently some colleges are even in shopping malls...


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## agnwstos (Oct 18, 2007)

Athens does not have a city centre because it has no skyscrapers (they are not allowed)


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## PedroGabriel (Feb 5, 2007)

MPOWER said:


> My Village´s centre is the pub. (100 Inhabitants ^^)


:lol: eheheh

As for my city (around 40,000 in official city and 100,000 in the urban area), we do have a downtown area, but I would say my city has several centres, even if it is small in an international scale. Each district developed its own character. In Portugal, downtown is usually the oldest part of the city. Not in my city's case, downtown is from the 17th/18th century, but the city started, by royal decree in 1308, in another neighbourhood near downtown (so 14th century), but even this one can't claim to be the oldest, even neighbourhoods that look very young, and developed recently (20th century) the Northern district, in fact it is from 1st century BC and can also claim to be the origin of the city, but the south is the one which is culturally richer (thus older in culture), although it is from the 17th century. It is a bit complex. So Póvoa is a multi-centre city, with a clear downtown area, though. :yes: The area with highrises is not downtown here, but some visitors think it is...


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## Jim856796 (Jun 1, 2006)

I don't think Las Vegas, Nevada has a proper city centre or central business district.


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## Cherguevara (Apr 13, 2005)

Epi said:


> London has 3. The main governmental area (by Parliament), The City, and of course Canary Wharf.


Canary Wharf is just a massive office site. It doesn't serve any central function, even for business whose central infrastructure (stock exchange etc.) is all in the City. And what about the office and retail districts in the west end? Are they not central?

Most of the original congestion charge area is in effect one giant city centre. Canary Wharf isn't part of it.


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## AltinD (Jul 15, 2004)

Dubai doesn't have a city centre either ... well it actually have a shopping centre called" "City Centre"


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## Unionstation13 (Aug 31, 2006)

My old home town's(Lafayette) centre was the courthouse square, where mostly pubs are. My current home(Indianapolis) revovles around monument circle.


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## drunkenmunkey888 (Aug 13, 2005)

San Jose is one of the largest cities in the US but isn't it essentially one very large suburb?


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## rocky (Apr 20, 2005)

I disagree for Paris. The central area of the municipality of Paris is the center. Its still a small area.

La defense is nowhere near being central in Paris.


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## rocky (Apr 20, 2005)

Cherguevara said:


> Canary Wharf is just a massive office site. It doesn't serve any central function, even for business whose central infrastructure (stock exchange etc.) is all in the City. And what about the office and retail districts in the west end? Are they not central?
> 
> Most of the original congestion charge area is in effect one giant city centre. Canary Wharf isn't part of it.


agree.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

agnwstos said:


> Athens does not have a city centre because it has no skyscrapers (they are not allowed)


You dont need skyscrapers obligatory for having a center.


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## gladisimo (Dec 11, 2006)

drunkenmunkey888 said:


> San Jose is one of the largest cities in the US but isn't it essentially one very large suburb?


Well it's still got a significant downtown with an urban feel, but most of it is very suburban, yes


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## mikkrikk (Dec 1, 2007)

LA has a very large downtown. It does not appear to be the economic center of the metro area but it has huge potential. Broadway has about 8 magnificent movie theatres that are about to be renovated at last. Most people have the mistaken idea that downtown LA does not exist, but I was just there and was surprised that it covers several square miles and contains human scale historic buildings. I have no idea why this area is never seen in the movies. The glass towers that one sees in photos are nearby in a relatively small area.


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## allurban (Apr 7, 2006)

forrestcat said:


> Shopping malls are the unofficial city center in Malaysian cities :nuts:..coz that's where everything is..post office, banks and quite recently some colleges are even in shopping malls...


to add to that, many of the newer semi-urban areas are designed with commercial centres....so there are lots of mini "downtowns" and a few "mega" downtowns (with Megamalls at the centre of everything)...as well as the original town area....

The problem with Malaysian cities is that they are totally car focused outside of the original city centres....

Cheers, m


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## Squiggles (Aug 21, 2007)

My city has a very definate center. The downtown is located on an isthmus between two lakes, with the rest of the city around the two lakes.


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## Taylorhoge (Feb 5, 2006)

San Juan doesnt have a ver defining area its scattered around somewhat of a minature americanized Sao Paulo as for other cities I would have to agree with Tokyo being scattered around as well as it feels the same in most north american edge cities.


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## melbguy (Jan 23, 2007)

Melbourne has a very well defined city-center. Simply the Central Business District. It combines everything in a very convenient and easily accessible area.


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## krudmonk (Jun 14, 2007)

drunkenmunkey888 said:


> San Jose is one of the largest cities in the US but isn't it essentially one very large suburb?


Don't take hate speech so literally.


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## columbusguy (Sep 12, 2005)

Columbus is an example of a city that is in processing of developing into either one (no center or multiple centers)

Before the 80s, yes columbus was a centered middle size city. After extreme growth, 80s, 90s, 2000 and on, Columbus is a city that started to look more multi-centered.

However, Columbus still may be young in its high growth development, the city could still swing either way.

Downtown is gaining again (after 2000 when the city began to push downtown development.) However, retail wise, Columbus is multi-centered.

But downtown still captures a great amount of daily employement numbers, cultural theaters/music venues, and now wealthy housing.

So maybe Columbus, with higher gay prices and a shift away from sprawl, could move back to being a centered city. 

At this point Columbus can be argued as either one, centered or not centered. I would say Columbus is both at this point, but leans toward multicentered.

You can work, eat, live, and shop at one of columbus' centers like Tuttle, Polaris, Easton (dense suburban in development) and never step foot into downtown columbus more than a few times in your life.

You could also work, eat, and live downtown and never step foot into the Tuttle, Polaris, Or Easton centers but you might find that a challenge if you need certain retail items.


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## eklips (Mar 29, 2005)

rocky said:


> I disagree for Paris. The central area of the municipality of Paris is the center. Its still a small area.
> 
> La defense is nowhere near being central in Paris.


It is the center to an extend, but not totaly.

If you walk from the Porte d'Orléans to the Porte de Clignancourt or from the porte de Montreuil to the porte d'Auteuil, you will see, residential districts, animated areas, business centers, shopping districts, touristic areas and so on.

This does not constitute a center, because the activites that nomrally make a zone central are disseminated around the city and are seperated by residential areas.


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## LordMandeep (Apr 10, 2006)

in Toronto the CBD is busy but its midtown that is busy all week and all day.

However midtown and the CBD are all considered as downtown..


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## gabrielbabb (Aug 11, 2006)

If you consider city center to be an urban and not suburban area, then all mexican cities don't have city center as the commercial, residential and industrial centers are all combined and the only suburbs would be in Las Lomas, and the new highrise suburbs in santa fe district, but if you count city center as the commercial center then mexico would have like 10 city centers, and if you consider city center as the historical center then mexico would have 4 city centers, (The Zocalo and downtown, Coyoacán which can be considered as a second downtown, and the old cities of Tenochtitlan and Teotihuacan...)


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## the spliff fairy (Oct 21, 2002)

allurban said:


> to add to that, many of the newer semi-urban areas are designed with commercial centres....so there are lots of mini "downtowns" and a few "mega" downtowns (with Megamalls at the centre of everything)...as well as the original town area....
> 
> The problem with Malaysian cities is that they are totally car focused outside of the original city centres....
> 
> Cheers, m


Its not purely a carcentric problem in Malaysia, its the heat. The air conditioned mall is so successful there as it doesnt have to entail the going to the night markets, the traditional way to escape the humidity.

Its a shame I hate malls!


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## Sukkiri (Feb 8, 2007)

Belgrade's city center is quite a labyrinth and takes up a large portion of the city and it is difficult to know where is the center of this city center. A lot of businesses are moving out of the 'city center' to New Belgrade where there are excellent Class A office space avaliable and transport flows are better as its closer to the airport and the freeway that runs through New Belgrade.


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## xlchris (Jun 23, 2006)

My city's city centre has a realy big collection of malls (over 300 shops), so it has quite a big city centre yes, (70.000 inhabitants)


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## Pavlemadrid (Nov 30, 2006)

Hong Kong? :? (I don't know )


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## Occit (Jul 24, 2005)

*Caracas has technically 3 city centres with different functions (all with skyscrapers).

- West Centre: historical, governmental and cultural. Name: Casco Central de Santiago de León de Caracas. Tallest Skycrapers: Parque Central Complex, 225 meters each one. 

- Middle Centre: national highway node and caracas' geographical centre with a group of national private companies within skyscrapers. Name: Plaza Venezuela: Tallest Skyscraper: Polar Tower, 122 m. 

- East Centre: financial, commercial and technological centre with worldwide companies in modern buildings. Name: Chacao Municipality and Las Mercedes. Tallest Skyscraper: Corp Banca Tower, 124 m. *


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## jarbury (Aug 20, 2007)

Auckland has a fairly well defined CBD. Only 10% of the region's jobs are located there though. It does have 2 universities there however so many of the people in the CBD are students.


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## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

Pavlemadrid said:


> Hong Kong? :? (I don't know )


HK has. The northern part of HK Island plus central Kowloon is the city centre. HK also has one main CBD which is Central.


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## Küsel (Sep 16, 2004)

Sao Paulo and Tokyo I think are the most obvious cities to name here I would say...


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## Delirium (Oct 8, 2005)

although Tokyo does have several _clusters_ that are quite central that are close to one another (shijuku at one end, Shibuya and Roppongi at another with Ginza and the palace at the other :blahblah :yes: so all that area around and in between could be considered the centre roughly, even though it's not as a _solid _ like the ones London, paris or NY has?


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