# Cities with more than one CBD



## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

Every major city have their CBDs or Central Business Districts. The CBD is the city's centre of business, finance and economic activity.

Most major cities would have one or more CBDs usually having a main one and several sub ones.

HK is an example of this. Because of it's position as a centre of business and finance in Asia, it has one main CBD as well as other ones scattered thoughout the city.

Here's how I rank HK CBDs and their importance.

From Codino A.C. Divino
http://www.pbase.com/accl

1) Central (including Admiralty)









2) Wanchai









3) Tsim Sha Tsui
4) Causeway Bay
5) Mongkok
6) Tsuen Wan (Vision City)
7) Kwun Tong
8) Tai Koo Shing

If your city have two of more CBDs, how would you rank them?


----------



## dhuwman (Oct 6, 2005)

Rank of Seattle's CBDs

Screw this.. Seattle's got one CBD


----------



## Xusein (Sep 27, 2005)

*Hartford has only dominant CBD, downtown*

There are no suburban downtowns here. Then again, Hartford is far from a major city. 

We are in the top 50 US metros though.


----------



## hkskyline (Sep 13, 2002)

WANCH said:


> Every major city have their CBDs or Central Business Districts. The CBD is the city's centre of business, finance and economic activity.
> 
> Most major cities would have one or more CBDs usually having a main one and several sub ones.
> 
> ...


The bottom ones don't even come close to being a CBD. Hong Kong's CBD area includes Central, Admiralty, Wanchai, and Tsim Sha Tsui. That's it.


----------



## dhuwman (Oct 6, 2005)

Well on a second thought:
I do think Seattle Metropolitan Area (aka the Greater Puget Sound Area) has multiple CBDs.

1. Downtown Seattle









2. Downtown Tacoma









3. Downtown Bellevue


----------



## Yörch1 (Oct 31, 2006)

For Mexico City in order of importance the CBD's would be these:

*Santa Fé*









*Reforma*









*Polanco*









*Insurgentes*









*Downtown*


----------



## _00_deathscar (Mar 16, 2005)

hkskyline said:


> The bottom ones don't even come close to being a CBD. Hong Kong's CBD area includes Central, Admiralty, Wanchai, and Tsim Sha Tsui. That's it.


Hong Kong is strange in that unlike its NA counterparts, it doesn't exactly have a distinguishable "CBD" from "residential" area (Central withstanding). Hence what WANCH actually means are just 'business areas', but for the sake of argument we can consider them to be CBDs.

Not sure what Tsuen Wan has done to be higher than Tai Koo though? Island East is a huge complex with the head quarters of many top Hong Kong companies listed there.


----------



## Skybean (Jun 16, 2004)

DT Seattle looks really green.


----------



## Küsel (Sep 16, 2004)

The morphology of European cities are not compareable with certain Asian or NA cities. Thus you can't say "Every major city have their CBDs". 
- What is the CBD of Paris? La Defense - on the outer limit of the city proper? It has a huge density of offices and shops in the real center as well.
- What about London? After the City of London was "full" parts of the "CBD" moved to the Docklands.
- Sao Paulo: first the CBD was in Se/Republica, then also in Paulista, later another one was growing in Faria Lima and nowadays the boom is in Berrini
- Tokyo: no one knows how much centers and subcenters THIS city has :lol:


----------



## Shawn (Nov 12, 2002)

Tokyo is the most nodal city on the planet, with every major station along the Yamanote having more office space than most other cities have in totality. 

The largest and probably most important "CBD" in Tokyo is the Marunouchi-Hibiya area, centered around Tokyo and Yurakucho Stations. Here you will find, among other institutions, the Tokyo Stock Exchange and the corporate HQs of most of Japan's large financial/securities firms.

The Akasaka-Toranomon-Roppongi Ichome "CBD", defined loosely by the triangle these aforementioned subway stations form, is home to most of Japan's foreign financial firms' HQs, such as Goldman Sachs, Lehman Brothers, Nikko Citigroup, Prudential, Barclays, the Royal Bank of Scotland, Societe General, HSBC, etc. You will also find nearly all of Japan's national governmental institutions here, such as the Japanese Supreme Court, the Diet (Japanese Parliament) and the thousands of Ministries (my favorite being MEXT: the Ministry of Education, Culture, Technology and Sports . . . the Japanese are trying to consolidate, but this is ridiculous). 

Shinjuku is what most people who are unfamiliar with Tokyo assume to be the city's real CBD, but outside of the Metropolitan Government's offices and a handful of older manufacturing concerns, Shinjuku is largely back-office operations for the companies with front offices in Marunouchi. 

Shinagawa has seen close to thirty 40-story office towers contrusted over the past five years and now is host to lots of consumer electronics companies' front office operations, inlcuding Sony, Sanyo, NTT Docomo and nearby in Mita, NEC and Toshiba. 

It can reasonably be argued that the majority of Chiyoda Ward and almost all of Chuo Ward function as a continuous CBD, with "branch" CBDs centered around Shinjuku-Yoyogi, Shinagawa-Osaki, Ueno, Ikebukuro, Shiodome and Shibuya Stations. 

Of course, downtown Yokohama, Omiya in Saitama and Makuhari Messe in Chiba all have more office space than most primary CBDs can make claim to.


----------



## hkskyline (Sep 13, 2002)

_00_deathscar said:


> Hong Kong is strange in that unlike its NA counterparts, it doesn't exactly have a distinguishable "CBD" from "residential" area (Central withstanding). Hence what WANCH actually means are just 'business areas', but for the sake of argument we can consider them to be CBDs.
> 
> Not sure what Tsuen Wan has done to be higher than Tai Koo though? Island East is a huge complex with the head quarters of many top Hong Kong companies listed there.


To consider a secondary commercial centre as an alternate CBD is downright wrong. There is no way any Hong Konger would consider Kwun Tong or Tsuen Wan, among others on that list, to be a CBD outside Central.


----------



## Küsel (Sep 16, 2004)

But maybe it will become a network of centers and subcenters as many cities have - European ones by history (original neighbour towns) and American (S and N) by alternative artificial centers to put the pressure away from one CBD.


----------



## brisavoine (Mar 19, 2006)

WANCH said:


> Here's how I rank HK CBDs and their importance.


How do you rank the importance of a CBD? Number of workers? Total surface of office space? Number of companies? Total sales of companies? You'd have to define that first.

In Paris there are two main business districts, and several smaller sub-districts. The two main ones are the Opéra business district (aka QCA) and La Défense.

1- QCA
The QCA (Quartier Central des Affaires) is the historical and still largest business district of Paris, extending from the Opéra to the Champs-Élysées. It is also the largest business district in Europe by most criterias:
- 420,000 workers/employees
- 80,400 companies
- 8.5 million m² (91 million sq. ft) of office space
- major transportation hub of Opéra-Auber-Haussmann-St Lazare (all these subway stations are interconnected, creating a massive maze of tunnels and vaulted galleries)









2- La Défense
La Défense, well known on this forum, is the skyscraper district of Paris, and has the highest daytime density in Europe:
- 160,000 workers/employees
- 3,600 companies
- 3.35 million m² (36 million sq ft) of office space
- major transportation hub of La Défense Grande Arche, a large interchange station for the Métro, the RER express subway, suburban trains, and the tramway. La Défense Authority (EPAD) is pushing for the arrival of a new RER line at La Défense Grande Arche.









Apart from these two main business districts, there are several other sub-districts across Greater Paris. I will just list the most important ones, in alphabetical order.

Bercy
In Eastern Central Paris, around the Ministry of Finance and the Gare de Lyon train station. Essentially business services there.









Évry-Massy-Saclay
This is the "Silicon Valley" of Greater Paris. It's often presented as such, or, more precisely, I think they label it as the "Scientific Valley" of Paris. It is located to the south of Greater Paris. Biotech industries in Évry, hard science in Saclay (in particular nuclear physics):
- 12,000 researchers and 23,000 scientific students in Saclay; 4,000 companies (1,000 in high-tech); plans to turn the Saclay area into one of the largest scientific campuses in the world
- 80,000 employees/workers in Évry (1,850 in genetics), 13,500 students
- 22,000 employees/workers around the TGV and RER train station in Massy, 3,000 private sector jobs created there between 2003 and 2005.

View of the genetics campus in Évry:









Issy-Val de Seine
Immediately to the southwest of Central Paris, this area has become France's largest cluster of medias (televisions, radios, newspapers, magazines).









Orly-Rungis
Business district around Orly Airport and the Rungis wholesale food market, the largest food market in the world:
- 100,000 workers/employees
- 4,900 companies
- specialization: transport, logistics, foodstuff industry, wholesale trade, biotech industries

Rungis in the foreground, with Central Paris on the horizon (tiny Eiffel Tower):









Plaine Saint-Denis
Immediately to the north of Central Paris, around the Stade de France sports arena, this derelict manufacturing area has undergone massive regeneration in the last 10 years:
- 2,700 companies
- specialization: business services around the Stade de France; most of France's television studios as well as some major movie studios are also located in the area
- two RER express subway stations near the Stade de France









Roissy
Business district around Paris CDG Airport:
- between 70,000 and 100,000 employees
- 700 companies
- specialization: air transport, logistics


----------



## wjfox (Nov 1, 2002)

Following WANCH's explanation by PM, I'm re-naming and re-opening this thread...


----------



## Unsing (Apr 15, 2006)

This map shows how daytime population are distributed in Tokyo.
Major CBDs lie all along the Yamanote loop. The unpopulated part of the main CBD is the Imperial Palace.


----------



## Sen (Nov 13, 2004)

*Beijing's CBD*

Beijing has one main CBD, two secondary CBDs and numerous commercial areas.

The main CBD is centered around the China World Trade Centre at the intersection of Jianguomen Wai Avenue and East 3rd ring road. This area by far has the highest concentration of foreign companies in any Chinese cities. Volkswagen, Motorola, Ford, LG, etc etc are all located here. It has also seen the most construction of all areas in Beijing. It is a mixed commercial/residential area with both office towers and high rise apartment blocks. It is served by Subway line 1 and line 2 and surface
public transportation.


















































The second CBD is the "Financial Street" located at the intersection between West 2nd ring road and Fuxingmen Wai Avenue, the headquarters of all the major domestic banks are located here, including China's central bank PBOC.

http://forum.xinhuanet.com/detail.jsp?id=35796551&pg=1

The third CBD is the Zhongcuancun area about 20 km northwest of Beijing's city centre, it used to be a rural area, became a suburb in the 80s and gradually become an area attractive to the hi-tech companies due to its proximity to Peking and Tsinghua universities as well as Chinese Academy of Sciences, the rent here is comparable to the office towers in downtown.

Some would also classify Wangfujing/Dongdan area as one of the CBD's as there is an abundance of office towers there, but most people would associate it with shopping and entertainment, also it's quite close to the main CBD (10 mins by subway) so it could be classified as part of the main CBD.

In conclusion there is no real CBD in Beijing, the concept is American and doesnt really apply to most Chinese cities, you can find office space anywhere in the city, but the aforementioned areas resemble the american CBD the most.


----------



## nygirl (Jul 14, 2003)

Downtown, Midtown, Brooklyn Downtown, Long Island City, Flushing Downtown, Newark, Jersey City, AND... white plains, New Rochelle? I guess....


----------



## sebvill (Apr 13, 2005)

*Lima*
In order of importance
*San Isidro*









































*City Centre* -- old city









































*Miraflores*

























There are other important comercial-financial areas like Chacarilla, Los Olivos, Jockey area, but are much less important than this three.


----------



## SM247 (Dec 5, 2006)

Sydney has several satellite cities - a so-called 'city of cities'

- Sydney CBD itself
- North Sydney
- Parramatta
- Chatswood
- Bankstown
- Liverpool
- Campbelltown
- Penrith

Several other regional centres too, such as Sutherland, Blacktown, Epping, Bondi Junction etc that you would be hard pressed calling CBDs, built up though they are.


----------



## Greens! (Feb 13, 2006)

Houston has three.

Uptown:









Downtown:









Texas Medical Center:


----------



## samsonyuen (Sep 23, 2003)

I'd argue Toronto only has downtown, Mississauga and Uptown (North York). Scarborough civic centre and Sherway Gardens are just retail areas.


----------



## sprtsluvr8 (Aug 5, 2006)

Atlanta has 5 major business districts:

*Downtown*










*Midtown*










*Buckhead*










*Perimeter*


*Galleria/Vinings*








(flickr)


----------



## gappa (Mar 13, 2007)

Melbourne really only has one CBD. Instead of new ones developing the central core has just been expanded, firstly down St Kilda Rd, and now to the west with the new docklands precint. There are a couple of minor (minor, minor) suburban CBD's in Box Hill and Dandenong, but nothing comes close to Melbourne CBD.


----------



## -Corey- (Jul 8, 2005)

San Diego has 3
# 1 Downtown
# 2 Fashion Valley (hotels)
# 3 La Joya


----------



## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

c0kelitr0 said:


> the agglomeration of Manila also has several CBDs.
> 
> *1. Downtown Makati*
> 
> ...


I'm back in Manila 

I agree with Makati and Ortigas' rankings. But I think The Rockwell area is part of the Makati CBD instead of being a separated one. 

Also, there is no such thing as Downtown Manila. In fact the area within Roxas Blvd. along Manila Bay is more *residential* and hotels. It is more of a tourist / entertainment district, there are not too many office buildings concentrated here.

Binondo on the other hand is more of the business area within The City of Manila is still a main CBD for the Filipino-Chinese community. By ranking, it can rank no.3. 

Makati still remains as the centre of business and finance for the whole metro and The Philippines.


----------



## rocky (Apr 20, 2005)

i like altanta & houston secondaries


----------



## trainrover (May 6, 2006)

> Cities with more than one CBD


Just what are you trying to ask?! (response unnecessary.......really)


----------



## kix111 (Jun 14, 2007)

shanghai has more than 4 CBD, but all very close together, if its me i would say the whole urban part of shanghai will be 1 huge CBD


----------



## Jim856796 (Jun 1, 2006)

www.sercan.de said:


> the planned one in Kartal
> by Zaha Hadid


The Kartal CBD looks like a cancelled project.


----------



## sweek (Jan 30, 2006)

Evil Bert said:


> the *'west end' *is londons second largest and the most expensive commercial district. rents in mayfair have been sold for up to £120 per sq ft and not sure on the working pop but it is far more than Canary Wharf


Wouldn't you be able to add Kensington too? There are a whole lot of businesses in that area.


----------



## Northsider (Jan 16, 2006)

trainrover said:


> Just what are you trying to ask?! (response unnecessary.......really)


Just read the 70 responses...


----------



## ncon (Apr 6, 2005)

*Jakarta*

*1. SCBD*


*2. Mega Kuningan*


*3. Senayan*









*4. Thamrin*









===============================================

Other than that Jakarta also have residential places
Maybe like Fort Bonifacio in MM
*1. Kelapa Gading*









*2. Kemayoran*









*Kuningan*

If I forgot some places
Other Jakartian forumers maybe can add

:cheers:

if talking about JKT metro 

we have Karawaci and Tangerang skyline


----------



## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

encon said:


> *Jakarta*
> 
> if talking about JKT metro
> 
> we have Karawaci and Tangerang skyline


BTW, what CBD is Wisma 46 located at?


----------



## dattebayo (Mar 21, 2007)

another shot of the different CBD of Metro Manila

*Fort Bonifacio Global City*










*Ortigas Center (Pasig city and Mandaluyong)*










*Makati City*










*Manila City*


----------



## trainrover (May 6, 2006)

northsider1983 said:


> Just


Ah! Just, *eh?*


----------



## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

shippuden said:


> another shot of the different CBD of Metro Manila
> *Makati City*


The Makati one would have look nice if it wasn't block by those tower blocks.


----------



## Pavlov's Dog (Aug 2, 2007)

Roch5220 said:


> Interesting thread.
> 
> Though, it appears that some people's idea of what constitutes what a CBD is includes, an intersection with 5 or 6 20s office blocks, residential nodes, or small clusters of highrise, regardless of use.
> 
> A prime example of a CBD would be the financial district and midtown manhattan, where the core is primarily office buildings. But it wouldn't include some of the satelite clusters.


I imagine a person's definition of what constitutes a CBD is highly subjective and relative to the person's metropolitan area.

A CBD is an area where business congregate to transact with each other. As the Paris examples show they don't even have to feature skyscrapers. Lot's of suburban areas with skyscrapers don't seem to be a CBD in my opinion because they don't seem to interact much with their neighbors.


----------



## ncon (Apr 6, 2005)

WANCH said:


> BTW, what CBD is Wisma 46 located at?


i believe it is belong to Sudirman CBD 

Sudirman-Thamrin is JKT main CBD  (long strecth of Road)


----------



## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

Pavlov's Dog said:


> I imagine a person's definition of what constitutes a CBD is highly subjective and relative to the person's metropolitan area.
> 
> A CBD is an area where business congregate to transact with each other. As the Paris examples show they don't even have to feature skyscrapers. Lot's of suburban areas with skyscrapers don't seem to be a CBD in my opinion because they don't seem to interact much with their neighbors.


Most European CBDs aren't even high-rise. In fact some of them are not even in the city centre.

Paris though is interesting since non Parisians look at La Defense as the city's main CBD. It is a CBD to some extent and is also HQ to major French banks such as Societe Generale. But it doesn't mean its the main one. 

When I see it, major cities would have a main CBD and some sub ones. That is the case with cities like HK, Manila, NY, Shanghai, LA or Tokyo


----------



## James Saito (Nov 6, 2002)

WANCH said:


> When I see it, major cities would have a main CBD and some sub ones. That is the case with cities like HK, Manila, NY, Shanghai, LA or Tokyo



What is Tokyo's main CBD?


----------



## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

James Saito said:


> What is Tokyo's main CBD?


It was mentioned earlier, Marunouchi


----------



## Cristovão471 (May 9, 2006)

For my current (temporary) city Canberra (Australia), Other than the CBD (civic) 

My current city was designed not to have a main cbd but instead divided into satellite cities, but that is quickly changing. Anyways other than Civic, Woden, Belconnen.


----------



## James Saito (Nov 6, 2002)

WANCH said:


> It was mentioned earlier, Marunouchi


But Shinjuku is much bigger than Marunouchi...
Does it make sense to have a bigger sub CBD than the main CBD?


----------



## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

James Saito said:


> But Shinjuku is much bigger than Marunouchi...
> Does it make sense to have a bigger sub CBD than the main CBD?


Shinjuku is bigger. Also, skyscrapers in this area are taller. But the HQ of most of Japan's corporations are located in Marunouchi. Their "back" offices are located in Shinjuku


----------



## gabrielbabb (Aug 11, 2006)

For Mexico City in order of importance the CBD's would be these:

*Reforma*









*Santa Fé*









*Polanco*









*Insurgentes*









*Downtown*







[/


----------

