# Why are asian cities so family-unfriendly?



## Bandit (Dec 6, 2006)

Slartibartfas said:


> Who says that it is necessarily growing so much in the cities? Its not impossible that the rural regions more than compansate trends in those megacities.


Those figure count for all of China not just the cities. And I do agree that in the cities birthrates are lower. But again the "offcial" figures count China as a whole.


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## Bandit (Dec 6, 2006)

Whiteeclipse said:


> One child policy is enforced, in urban China you can only have one child, in rural China if your first child is a girl then your allowed to have another child, also in China if the couple both come from the one child policy then they are allowed to have 2 children and minorities are allowed to have as many children as they like.


Sounds like you agree that the one-child policy in the Western view is incorrect. Because everyone from the UN to human rights groups says only one-child per couple PERIOD! No exceptions.


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## bobdikl (Jul 20, 2004)

1. European countries have better child and family welfare system than in Asia.
2. 2 bathrooms flats is a real luxurious in developed asian cities.
3. The cost of "Proper Education"; it's not uncommon for couple to spend nearly entire of their saving on sigle child's education.
4. Asian perception of "quality" life over ordinary, another deep-rooted over-the-top face culture.


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## Xusein (Sep 27, 2005)

Many Asian cities are going to have an explosion in the elderly population in the future if this trend continues. I know that Japan has more seniors than kids apparently, but I don't think the other places are at that level yet.

Anyway, I don't think that fertility rates cooerlate with the friendliness of a city. Actually, I think that it's the opposite. Less kids means more attention and money on that kid, which means a more friendly enviornment. More kids is more trouble, IMO. I'm only shooting for 2, which is VERY, VERY low from where I come from. 

I believe that the fertility rate in Connecticut (US state) is also below 2.


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## OshHisham (Nov 14, 2005)

parents of east asian (as well as chinese in south east asia) tend to push their children to 'study hard, get a good grade. work even harder, get a good job'

such ideas bring the children into a deep depression. cost of education in malaysia is relatively low. but the idea to have only a 'quality' child makes the population drops.


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## AltinD (Jul 15, 2004)

Chrissib said:


> OK, maybe the title sounds very hard, but I had no idea how to describe the problem in another question.
> 
> It's all about fertility rates (number of children per woman).
> 
> ...


Much higher teenage pregnancy rates!


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## Chrissib (Feb 9, 2008)

Bandit said:


> I don't believe in those figures simply on the basis that the popultion is still growing by ten million a year. That means more than two children per family on average. Mathematically, if a one-child policy is being enforced the population should be dropping not growing. Again why are those figures wrong because it doesn't account for premature deaths. Are there no premature deaths in China due to accidental or health issues or even homicide? If you count that in with the one-child policy, the growth rate should be well below .58. Even with two children per two parents to keep it "level or stable," you stll have a population decline because again of premature deaths.
> 
> Since when does the media or anyone who gives these figures tell the truth? It's a lot more dramatic to drum up a story that also serves the China critics to perpetuate the stereotype.


It's all about the so called 'population momentum'. You can see this on population pyramids:










Watch the pyramid of spain closely. Spain had a very low fertility rate of 1.3 for the last 15 years or so, so the population should halve every 40 years, but it isn't. You can see that the amount of the spaniards aged 0 roughly equals the number of spaniards that are 78 years old, the age when a spaniard typically dies. 
So, although the fertility rate stands at 1.3, the population only stagnates. Of course, in the long run it will shrink, when the baby boomers are moving into the older ages.


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## l'eau (Jul 7, 2008)

cuz asia and asian cities has big population.that's all.


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## Imperfect Ending (Apr 7, 2003)

Family is a waste of time!


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## buildmilehightower (Mar 29, 2008)

simple smmary: 

Its the way society is and wont change for longtime, only way to change will be to wait long time. Quickest way is to share western culture and maybe the families can losen up the tensions, British families are so nice and friendly.


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## AltinD (Jul 15, 2004)

^^ What are you talking about ... seriously. :nuts:


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## Jonesy55 (Jul 30, 2004)

AltinD said:


> Much higher teenage pregnancy rates!


I don't think that is the answer, the average age of births is going up and teenage pregnancies only make up a very small % of total births.


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## the spliff fairy (Oct 21, 2002)

buildmilehightower said:


> simple smmary:
> 
> Its the way society is and wont change for longtime, only way to change will be to wait long time. Quickest way is to share western culture and maybe the families can losen up the tensions, British families are so nice and friendly.


'Westernisation' is what is lowering birthrates the world over. The richer, more urban, more commercialised a population gets, with a stronger sense of individualism over community, the faster the birthrate plummets.


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## bayviews (Mar 3, 2006)

Well, its unfair to generalize about all Asian cities. I doubt that the birthrate in Karachi has fallen down to replacement levels! But generally in the places where people have become well-educated, & that's a feature of the Confusionist societies like those in East Asia in particular, they realize that having too many kids just creates more responsibilities & problems. That the cities are large & crowded isn't necesarily a major factor, as the same can be said for African cities, which have really high birthrates.


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## Sweetmother (Aug 13, 2008)

i want 4 children


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## Chrissib (Feb 9, 2008)

bayviews said:


> Well, its unfair to generalize about all Asian cities. I doubt that the birthrate in Karachi has fallen down to replacement levels! But generally in the places where people have become well-educated, & that's a feature of the Confusionist societies like those in East Asia in particular, they realize that having too many kids just creates more responsibilities & problems. That the cities are large & crowded isn't necesarily a major factor, as the same can be said for African cities, which have really high birthrates.


Oh, i should've written 'East Asian Cities'. But it's also interesting that the city with the highest fertility in the developed world is also located in Asia. It's Jerusalem with just over 4 children per woman on average.


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## Chrissib (Feb 9, 2008)

the spliff fairy said:


> 'Westernisation' is what is lowering birthrates the world over. The richer, more urban, more commercialised a population gets, with a stronger sense of individualism over community, the faster the birthrate plummets.


That's true, but the east asian cities have fallen even below the western niveau. Maybe it's the speed of modernisation, that creates lowest low fertility levels. The developement of Japan was rapid, but South Korea developed even more rapid. I fear that we'll see even lower fertility rates in the Chinese cities. The Problem of China is not overpopulation, but the lack of young people that will lead to a fast shrinking labour-force.


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## gladisimo (Dec 11, 2006)

bayviews said:


> Well, its unfair to generalize about all Asian cities. I doubt that the birthrate in Karachi has fallen down to replacement levels! But generally in the places where people have become well-educated, & that's a feature of the Confusionist societies like those in East Asia in particular, they realize that having too many kids just creates more responsibilities & problems. That the cities are large & crowded isn't necesarily a major factor, as the same can be said for African cities, which have really high birthrates.


What does Confucian ideology have to do with the birth rates? Cities being crowded is actually a factor, as families who have too may children may run into trouble finding accommodation for all those children, especially once they get older! You are right about the responsibilities part, particularly the financial responsibility, which can be very costly (as Wanch mentioned)


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## Koen Acacia (Apr 17, 2007)

Chrissib said:


> That's true, but the east asian cities have fallen even below the western niveau. *Maybe it's the speed of modernisation, that creates lowest low fertility levels.* The developement of Japan was rapid, but South Korea developed even more rapid. I fear that we'll see even lower fertility rates in the Chinese cities. The Problem of China is not overpopulation, but the lack of young people that will lead to a fast shrinking labour-force.


Is it the chicken, or the egg?
Could also be that deciding to have less children meant both parents were able to take fulltime jobs which, then, led to faster development.


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## BOM (Jun 4, 2006)

hoosier said:


> China, South Korean, and Japan are already overpopulated so a decline in population would be a good thing for them.
> 
> Economic prosperity is not brought about through superior numbers.


That may be true in some aspects, but for Korea and Japan they do not have much else other than human capital.


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