# Frankfurt, Germany



## Joka (Feb 7, 2006)

The skyline as seen from the airport looks stunning. Those fields right next to the downtown desperately need some urban infill though.


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## carfentanyl (May 14, 2003)

BMXican said:


> just out of curiosity - how many consulates does rotterdam have? frankfurt has 94 ...


But this also means completely nothing. Consulates do NOT give me a multicultural feeling. For example, Tokyo has over a 100 consulates, but would you call Tokyo a multicultural city? Definitely not. An alpha worldcity? Definitely yes.



BMXican said:


> anyway, nice pics guys, Im withdrawing from the discussion. (and I really like rotterdam, just in case ...)


Yeah, let's forget about it. I enjoyed visiting Frankfurt and there are some skyscrapers there that I'd love to see in Rotterdam!


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Joka said:


> The skyline as seen from the airport looks stunning. Those fields right next to the downtown desperately need some urban infill though.


I agree with that. I'm not a bit fan of greenbelts. All they do is push the suburbs further out, creating more sprawl, longer commutes, and this of cause means more pollution.


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## tk780 (Jun 21, 2007)

carfentanyl said:


> Do you have a source? I tried to find demographics figures for Frankfurt either in English, Dutch or German, condisering I understand all 3 languages but I could simply not find them. I'd love to see them.


According to the Federal Statistical Office 39.5 % of the Frankfurt population have an immigrant background and 27.2 % are foreign born ("Personen mit eigener Migrationserfahrung").

http://www.destatis.de/jetspeed/port...83__12521.psml

https://www-ec.destatis.de/csp/shop/...csp&ID=1020312
(Pages 106 and 107).

This ranking confirms that the foreign born population in Frankfurt is virtually the same as in London, Amsterdam and Rotterdam:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._born_per_city



carfentanyl said:


> Again, source, because I don't believe that at all. If what you said above is true, (the 40% 1st and 2nd generation) which I doubt, then they're already behind Amsterdam, Rotterdam and The Hague.
> 
> Also Marseille has definitely more non-eu foreigners with the big amount of Moroccan and Algerian immigrants.


The statistic refers to non-EU nationals, not 1st and 2nd generation non-westerners:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_statistics
http://www.urbanaudit.org/rank.aspx

Frankfurt: 16 % non-EU nationals
Amsterdam: 9 %, 
Rottedam: 8 %, 
Marseille: 5 %




carfentanyl said:


> That's a fact, but the rest of Germany is also not that multicultural compared to GB(England), France or The Netherlands.


Again, you mean multiracial, not multicultural. Germany has a higher percentage of foreign-borns than these countries.

http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/15/37/38336539.pdf


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## fcarvall (Nov 6, 2004)

philadweller said:


> Looks so American in many of the photos.


You had to go and bash the city.


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## Rohne (Feb 20, 2007)

other nice Frankfurt pictures:










































































































































And as I was very disappointed with the pics of the Waldstadion, here are some better (more atmospheric  ):


























































source http://www.uf97.de


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

ahhh, summer pictures. Thanks for those. For a moment, I was almost there...


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## Svartmetall (Aug 5, 2007)

Justme said:


> ahhh, summer pictures. Thanks for those. For a moment, I was almost there...


I don't know - stuck in a humid Auckland summer I wish I was enduring the same weather you are! 

Those Chinese gardens certainly look great - where abouts are they in Frankfurt?


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Svartmetall said:


> I don't know - stuck in a humid Auckland summer I wish I was enduring the same weather you are!
> 
> Those Chinese gardens certainly look great - where abouts are they in Frankfurt?


I love all the seasons here, although Frankfurt can be a bit disappointing in winter as it often lacks snow. The rest of the country can be frolicking in lovely white stuff whilst we just get rain. I guess it's the Hawaii of Germany ;O)

But I don't mind the winter here, although now that we've had a couple of months of it, I'm looking forward to summer. Summer days are a lot hotter in general than Auckland, or at least from my memory of Auckland, but we lack the beaches being inland. And of cause, this being Germany, Air Conditioners are not as common as other parts of Europe or the world.

Those Chinese Gardens are in the inner suburb of Bornheim. Actually, just as you enter Bornheim so an easy walk from the city center. They are small, but very nice in summer and quite relaxing (ironically in the middle of another nice park, but traditional German style). One advantage over say the Sydney version is that they are free and not filled with tourists.

Last I saw, they were closed for renovation. Was supposed to open August last year, but several months past that I walked past and they were still closed. If they are not open yet, I would imagine they would be for this Spring.


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## Svartmetall (Aug 5, 2007)

Justme said:


> I love all the seasons here, although Frankfurt can be a bit disappointing in winter as it often lacks snow. The rest of the country can be frolicking in lovely white stuff whilst we just get rain. I guess it's the Hawaii of Germany ;O)
> 
> But I don't mind the winter here, although now that we've had a couple of months of it, I'm looking forward to summer. Summer days are a lot hotter in general than Auckland, or at least from my memory of Auckland, but we lack the beaches being inland. And of cause, this being Germany, Air Conditioners are not as common as other parts of Europe or the world.
> 
> ...


Britain seemed to get hotter than Auckland, however, the sun in Auckland is MUCH more intense than anything I experienced anywhere else - even compared to up the Jungfraujoch in peak summer where you'd expect the snow to add to the intensity of the sun.

Air conditioning (back as far as 2005) was not prevalent in Britain at all, very few people had it, so I know what it's like. People just opened windows, much easier and far more "natural". I hate aircon, it dries you out too much and makes you thirsty. Never use it myself, not even in the car. 

Frankfurt in general seems to be well blessed with green space and parks. One thing I notice is the amount of allotments (I'm not sure what the Germans call them) for planting vegetables and plants. There seem to be loads around Bornheim (which is mostly ringed by green space in a U shape).


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Svartmetall said:


> Frankfurt in general seems to be well blessed with green space and parks. One thing I notice is the amount of allotments (I'm not sure what the Germans call them) for planting vegetables and plants. There seem to be loads around Bornheim (which is mostly ringed by green space in a U shape).


Actually, I'm not that impressed with Frankfurt's parks. Most German cities (like most cities in the world really) have at least one grand park in the central city. Munich has the English Gardens, Berlin the Tier Garden, London of cause has many like Hyde Park, St James Park, Regents Park etc and Auckland has the wonderful Domain. But there is very little in central Frankfurt, which is a pity as I love parks.

The U Shaped park you mentioned was in fact the old city walls and defences that surrounded the city (you can make it it from the map below) It's a pity they didn't keep the wall, as the park, although nice in some parts is very thin (always the sound of traffic) and quite grotty in the eastern side.










Not putting Frankfurt down too much here, in the "suburbs" as you would call them from Auckland's perspective, are some great parks. Bad Homburg, Bad Nauheim, Wiesbaden, Darmstadt etc all have great city parks. This is where Frankfurt does really well though. It may be a bit boring for me as a city, but it's metro area has many other towns and cities all close to central Frankfurt, and many more historical or attractive than Frankfurt. And being Germany, they have their own dense, lively downtowns that act as cities in their own rights.

There is of cause the forests around Frankfurt. (The Frankfurter Stadt Wald (city forest) to the south is often described as the largest urban forest in the world - if that is actually true, I don't know). The Green belt being very close to the city center, this does mean that they can easily be reached. But I'm not really a forest sort of guy, to be honest, when you walk through them, they are all pretty much the same old, same old. The trees look like trees which ever way you look, and the scenery doesn't change. 

But I'm led to believe that many Frankfurter's like this. I guess it's each to their own. Actually, with my wife, we own a small forest in Germany, though a couple of hours away.

I would say that the forests on the Taunus (big hills to the north of the city) are more interesting as they at least sport great views when you can see past the wood. It also is a lot quieter as it is not right next to one of the world's busiest airports like the Frankfurter Stadt Wald.

The other greenery around Frankfurt is farmlands which again, because of the green belt, start very close to the city center (with the suburbs encircling them). To be honest, I find this a waste of space. I don't see any need for farms to be forced upon a city's urban area. No one walks there, people just have to drive past to get to the urban area on the other side. Quite frankly, I'd be happy to see them built over. All they do is keep the property values higher as there is less housing close to the city. And besides, would you really want to eat food grown there, with all the pollution from the city feeding them? Or buy from a farm outside the city area where the air is cleaner?

The alotments are common though, as many people live in apartments, it gives them a cheap way to have a garden close by. In summer, you see many people relaxing in them catching the sun, or having a few drinks, or doing the gardening.


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## DanteXavier (Jan 6, 2007)

Very impressive thread!


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## Taipei Walker (Mar 7, 2005)

Nice thread, let me add some pictures I've taken last June.

train station
















































































































back to train station


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## Kame (Jan 13, 2007)

^^ Awesome Pics!!!


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## Lucas. (Feb 18, 2007)

really nice pictures


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## Svartmetall (Aug 5, 2007)

Justme said:


> Not putting Frankfurt down too much here, in the "suburbs" as you would call them from Auckland's perspective, are some great parks. Bad Homburg, Bad Nauheim, Wiesbaden, Darmstadt etc all have great city parks. This is where Frankfurt does really well though. It may be a bit boring for me as a city, but it's metro area has many other towns and cities all close to central Frankfurt, and many more historical or attractive than Frankfurt. And being Germany, they have their own dense, lively downtowns that act as cities in their own rights.


It's weird to think of seperate towns and cities as "suburbs". In England they'd be counted as completely seperate even if they acted like overspill communities from the main city (IE commuter cities) they'd still be completely seperate entities. The history of those settlements surely dictates that they're seperate entities too doesn't it? I mean it's not a "suburb" in a traditional sense in the case of Auckland with continuous sprawl. Luton, Watford, Reading and the such like in England act as commuter cities to London and yet are very much seperate even though they couldn't survive without it.

With regards to the U shaped park, I was referring to the one that ringed Bornheim, not the old city wall, sorry I should have been more clear!

Also, those latest pictures of Frankfurt are amazing. Frankfurt Hbf never ceases to amaze me - it's HUGE!


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Svartmetall said:


> It's weird to think of seperate towns and cities as "suburbs". In England they'd be counted as completely seperate even if they acted like overspill communities from the main city (IE commuter cities) they'd still be completely seperate entities. The history of those settlements surely dictates that they're seperate entities too doesn't it? I mean it's not a "suburb" in a traditional sense in the case of Auckland with continuous sprawl. Luton, Watford, Reading and the such like in England act as commuter cities to London and yet are very much seperate even though they couldn't survive without it.
> 
> With regards to the U shaped park, I was referring to the one that ringed Bornheim, not the old city wall, sorry I should have been more clear!
> 
> Also, those latest pictures of Frankfurt are amazing. Frankfurt Hbf never ceases to amaze me - it's HUGE!


You’re right as traditional perception goes, and in this particular case, Europeans do tend to think in a traditional manner. German’s even more so than the British. Afterall, Offenbach is 10minutes from Frankfurt, in direct urban connection yet few would ever consider it a “suburb” as it is technically a different city.

But the fact is, we live in the here and now, and although history is very important, it doesn’t affect us in everyday life like the real world around us does. What I mean by this, is that although say Bad Homburg is not the same city as Frankfurt, and has a long history all of it’s own. It’s very existence today is that of a commuter town – in this case, a wealthy one. The same can be said for Watford. Which is not part of London city proper, but directly connected to the urban area. Places like Reading or Mainz really aren’t suburbs but part of the metropolitan area of Frankfurt or London. I just used the term “suburbs” because they would be considered as such in Australia or New Zealand (which is where I come from, so my perception is different). Afterall, the Whangaroa Peninsula in Auckland is considered a suburb of Auckland, yet is not directly connected by urbanity (and I remember it called a suburb 25 years ago when I was living there and it was even more remote)

Germans and British people until just a couple of years ago never heard of metropolitan area’s and most still don’t know what they are. But that doesn’t mean they don’t exist. The commuter catchment area around Frankfurt and London is huge, and the very growth of these surrounding towns is very closely linked to the core cities.

Besides, what does political area of a city really mean? Do you actually live in Auckland? Most people in the metro of that city doesn’t, Many like in Manakau city, Waitemata City or the others. When I lived in Waitemata City 25 years ago, there was a clear cut off between that and the rest of urban Auckland, at least the part I lived in. But we all said we lived in a suburb of “Auckland”.

I also remember 25 years ago seeing an exhibit in the Auckland Museum how the city had grown, and how it was quickly larger than most of the major European capitals. What it neglected to point out, was that it counted all of “metropolitan” Auckland including it’s surrounding cities against the city proper’s of Europe. Not quite a fair and accurate comparison.


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## carfentanyl (May 14, 2003)

tk780 said:


> Frankfurt: 16 % non-EU nationals
> Amsterdam: 9 %,
> Rottedam: 8 %,
> Marseille: 5 %


I think they do not count people with two passports here. Which make these figures more logical. Frankfurt has lots of expats only there for a couple of years, who do not own two passports. Marseille is just like Rotterdam close to 25% Muslim (European Union figures), so I doubt that only 5% is non-EU. They probably talk about expats that do not live in that particular city, than the figures eem definitely right.



tk780 said:


> Again, you mean multiracial, not multicultural. Germany has a higher percentage of foreign-borns than these countries.
> 
> http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/15/37/38336539.pdf


Still, all figures aside, my observation remains. When I walk around in Frankfurt I do not find the multicultural/multiracial atmosphere I do find in Rotterdam, Amsterdam, London or Paris.


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## OMH (Aug 21, 2007)

very nice pics indeed!


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## hmueller (Jan 4, 2008)

Hi Guy's.
I've got a few new photos for you.

Some i found on my space:
I don't know where they are from.











































































































































































































































































































I took these pics in winter 2004 with my old 2,1 pixel cam,so the quality is not the best:

rooftop of the "Maintower"(200m/656feet)
































Maintower:









































































A few pics from maintower.de


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## Golden Age (Dec 26, 2006)

Justme said:


> Frankfurt doesn't "feel" small to me at all. The city center is more crowded than Sydney or Melbourne which I was used to before I came here. And of cause feels a lot bigger than Auckland. It only looks a bit small if you see the green belt which is pretty close to the city center.


Frankfurt should do more to market the lovely city neighborhoods Nordend, Sachsenhausen, Bornheim and even Bockenheim. I think Berger Strasse and Schweizer Strasse are some of the most attractive streets in Germany, much more intrigiung than the Zeil or Hauptwache. The direct city center of Frankfurt, however, is undergoing immense transformation, so I'm hopeful for a renaissance.




Justme said:


> And as for taking official city proper population figures into account, they have no meaning in real life at all. Afterall, Sydney only officially has 170,000 people. San Francisco has about 700,000 as well and Berlin is "officially" bigger than Paris, but no one would ever dream of suggesting it is so in reality.


All I'm saying is that comparing Ftown to London or Berlin will always make the bigger cities look more vibrant BUT compared to cities like Geneve, Manchester, Lyon, Milano or Boston (the direct competition) it is not lagging behind in any respects (except for the natural beauty of Geneve and the "young" feel of Boston).


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Golden Age said:


> Frankfurt should do more to market the lovely city neighborhoods Nordend, Sachsenhausen, Bornheim and even Bockenheim. I think Berger Strasse and Schweizer Strasse are some of the most attractive streets in Germany, much more intrigiung than the Zeil or Hauptwache. The direct city center of Frankfurt, however, is undergoing immense transformation, so I'm hopeful for a renaissance.


I quite like those area’s as well. In fact, Frankfurt needs to market them more for tourists as there is very little to do in Frankfurt’s city after the shops close. The city center becomes a ghost town and this is what tourists see. But I wouldn’t think that Schweizerstr and Bergerstr are anything too special in Germany. All major cities have some great streets. I do agree that they are quite nice. Bergerstr in particular has some great bars and restaurants, and Schweizerstr is pleasant with the tram running down it and the view of the skyscrapers.




Golden Age said:


> All I'm saying is that comparing Ftown to London or Berlin will always make the bigger cities look more vibrant BUT compared to cities like Geneve, Manchester, Lyon, Milano or Boston (the direct competition) it is not lagging behind in any respects (except for the natural beauty of Geneve and the "young" feel of Boston).


Of cause there are somethings where Frankfurt does very well. It’s skyline is great for Europe (though rather mediocre outside of Europe) and it’s public transport is very good for a city this size. But I do feel that many other cities of comparable size do better. I am from Sydney, and that has a metro population comparable to Frankfurt (a far smaller city proper population, and about 30% larger urban area population – though those are hard to compare) and Sydney excels over Frankfurt in so many ways. It even has more history in the city center than Frankfurt. I would also say the same for Melbourne which is smaller than Sydney and with the exception of a smaller airport and no actual u-bahn, it probably beats Frankfurt in every other way. I can’t say much for Boston as it’s been so long since I was there, other than the great geographical advantage. Milan has history than Frankfurt could only dream of, and a glamour that Frankfurt lacks. Manchester is different as it is a city that has recently been rejuvenated. In many ways they are probably on par with each other. But for me, as I know Sydney and Melbourne so well, Frankfurt feels so “functional” when compared to them.

What Frankfurt lacks is a vision. Walk along the Yarra River in Melbourne and see the endless developments. Compare the Main in Frankfurt and it is seriously dull. The council can’t even get the grass to grow there. Melbourne is building taller and also with some great architecture. Frankfurt even lacks a proper city park. You have to go out to the suburbs to see some very average ones (though there are great ones in the wider metropolitan area of the Rhein Main)

Let’s put it this way. What do you tell tourists in Frankfurt to see? What _are_ the must see’s in this city? The only thing I can ever think of is the top of the Main Tower. Even then, they look across to the Fernsehnturm and ask why they couldn’t go up that one ;O) Other than that there is nothing special in this city, and nothing they havn’t seen bigger or better elsewhere.

Now, I’m not saying Frankfurt is a bad city, but I do find it rather functional and boring. One of the small jokes we had here was the boat cruise on the river Main. Except for the small central part which has nice views over the skyline, the rest on either side is a tour of the industrial wastelands. With a lack of places to take tourists who come to visit us, we usually dump them on a boat. None has ever had anything nice to say about it, except joke about the view (which is fun in it’s own right). When I was in London with some friends from work, I suggested a boat trip on the Thames. Remembering the awful one in Frankfurt they were not exactly excited about the idea, but afterwards they commented on what a difference it was. 

Frankfurt is simply “functional”
But I guess many locals prefer it that way...


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## Golden Age (Dec 26, 2006)

G'day Justme! Thanks for your honest answer. I enjoy our discussions and agree with a lot of points that you make. Below I'll present where we tend to differ, but maybe we'll find a common demoninator along the way. Here it goes (sorry for this length but a lot was pre-written by me in other forums).



Justme said:


> The city center becomes a ghost town and this is what tourists see.


This is exactly the same thing that happens in Chicago after 7 pm every day (and I've been there 20+ times). The neighborhood Wrigleyville is different, but my point here is: Closing early is not a "typical Frankfurt" phenomenon.



Justme said:


> But I wouldn’t think that Schweizerstr and Bergerstr are anything too special in Germany.


No? Sachsenhausen with its abundance of classy museums, a fantastic river promenade, top-notch 19th century residential areas and countless open-air apple wine gardens (along Textorstr, Brückenstr, etc) is about as uniquely Frankfurt as you can get. I couldn't think of a neighborhood in the world that has a similar offering. If all of Frankfurt looked like Sachsenhausen or Bornheim it would be considered one of the more beautiful cities around.



Justme said:


> It even has more history in the city center than Frankfurt.


Frankfurt is extremely historical. The Kaiser was crowned here for centuries, Germany made its first attempts at democracy at the Paulskirche in 1848, the flourishing middle class of Frankfurt was extremely influential with the many early banking houses, the trade fair (now the world's second biggest), the stock exchanges, the Bundesbank and now the European Central Bank (it's not mere coicidence Frankfurt was chosen). Bonn was narrowly chosen over Frankfurt as capital in the 1950's which shows its importance in German history. Also Frankfurt is Goethe's home and many important intellectual movements initiated here (the center of student protests in the 1968 era) and the "Frankfurter Schule" (philosophical wave). The list goes on and on.



Justme said:


> I would also say the same for Melbourne which is smaller than Sydney and with the exception of a smaller airport and no actual u-bahn, it probably beats Frankfurt in every other way.


I can't judge that statement as I have yet to visit Australia and I've heard many positive things and am very impressed by the pictures I see of Sydney, Adelaide, Melbourne (looks very livable).



Justme said:


> Walk along the Yarra River in Melbourne and see the endless developments. Compare the Main in Frankfurt and it is seriously dull.


I find the new developments (all within the last 5 years) of the Westhafen, the Deutschherrnufer and the Oscar von Miller Str (next to the future ECB) quite eye-catching for German standards. It shows that investors in Germany build quickly and nicely if they want to. The result are some of the nicest penthouse appartments in Germany (especially along the Westhafen).



Justme said:


> Frankfurt even lacks a proper city park.


I can ride my bike from the Deutsche Bank towers to the Grüneburgpark or Holzhausenpark in less than 5 minutes. Those parks are drop-dead gorgeous and have great open-air cafés. In addition, the Main river promenade has taken over many functions of a park. You see picnickers, businesspeople and athletes and all within a 5 minute walking distance from the financial district. What more can you want?? Most businesses in Munich are very far away from the Englische Garten (which is Germany's nicest park by far) and Hyde Park is miles away from Canary Wharf in London.



Justme said:


> Let’s put it this way. What do you tell tourists in Frankfurt to see? What _are_ the must see’s in this city?


Are you serious? Here's a list I wrote on a tourism website just last week. 
1.) a visit to the renowned Römer market square and the Paulskirche (where Germany made its first attempts at democracy in 1848)
2.) a round of apple wine ("Äppler") and a sampling of the hearty local food in one of the traditional restaurants in Sachsenhausen (along the Schweizer Str or Textor Str) 
3.) a leisurely stroll along the south side of the Main river promenade which runs parallel to the highly recommended Museum mile and offers phenomenal views of the Frankfurt skyline; most of the museums have popular cafés (especially the Liebighaus) 
4.) a visit atop the MainTower and its open-air public platform/bar/restaurant (there is hardly a more elevated/elevating view you'll get of a city in Europe)
5.) a visit to the Alte Oper market square (one of the more impressive opera structures in Europe) and the adjoining Fressgass with its many outdoor cafés
6.) a visit to the birthplace of Germany's most famous author, Johann Wolfgang von Goethe in the "Goethehaus" (near the Hauptwache)
7.) a cultural excursion to the Staedel Museum with its impressive collection of impressionists, expressionists, naturalists and typical local artists (the painiting of Goethe in Italy being the most well-known)
8.) a shopping excursion to the suprisingly spacious Kleinmarkthalle (the grocery market hall; similar to Covent Garden in London) is an absolute must (it is about half-way from the Zeil to the Roemer); the colorfoul display of foods and plants, free food samples, intriguing aromas and hustle/bustle of the shopkeepers are a sight to behold
For an extended visit be sure not to miss:
9.) a visit to the Frankfurt zoo (a family favorite) with its famous ape house
10.) a visit to the Palmengarten and the Botanischer Garten with its beautiful display of lush green, exotic plants and English-inspired landscaping (also be sure to visit the Siesmayer Café)
11.) a visit to the Berger Strasse in Bornheim (similarities to NYC's Greenwich Village) with a very urban, yet laid back feel
12.) a visit to the beautifully laid-out parks Grüneburgpark (and the lovely university campus next door) and Holzhausenpark (in the gorgeous Holzhausenviertel) to get a feel for the leisurely side of this financial hub city
13.) a visit to the Long Island Summer Lounge situated atop a parking garage (7th floor) right next to the Boerse (behind the Frankfurter Volksbank building), this open air bar is probably the most breathtaking view you're going to get of Frankfurt. Or simply go to one of the other 8 beach clubs in the Frankfurt area
14.) the excursions to Taunus villages, Bad Homburg, Wiesbaden, Mainz, Rheingau, Rhine Valley, Heidelberg, Schwetzingen, Speyer, Baden-Baden, Marburg, Würzburg, Limburg, Odenwald, Spessart all within a 1 hour radius (where else in Germany do you have such a selection??)



Justme said:


> Now, I’m not saying Frankfurt is a bad city, but I do find it rather functional and boring. One of the small jokes we had here was the boat cruise on the river Main. Except for the small central part which has nice views over the skyline, the rest on either side is a tour of the industrial wastelands. Frankfurt is simply “functional”.


Agreed, if you pick out certain parts (Hoechst, Hanau, Ostend) it might look industrial. If you take a walk through 19th century Sachsenhausen, Bornheim and Holzhausenviertel you'd think you're in Paris. It's not coincidence that Frankfurt is the fourth most visited city following only Berlin, Hamburg and Munich. Frankfurt had a really bad reputation from the 1980's and has made a real turnaround since then. The World Cup in 2006 played a huge role in changing people's minds. There is no scarcity of people saying that Frankfurt staged by far the most impressive events in that month and left a lasting impressions on tourists (as numbers have been rising ever since).

Here's my conclusion. In order to get a good understanding of Frankfurt's architecture one must differentiate between the starker direct city center and the drop-dead gorgeous city neighborhoods surrounding it. Combined, both illustrate a modern and traditional side, which blend together in a very fascinating/sometimes clashing sort of way. The inner city is worth visiting with the Goethehaus, the Roemer and Alte Oper as highlights, but only visiting these places would do a disservice to the wonderful non-business side of Frankfurt.


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Golden Age said:


> G'day Justme! Thanks for your honest answer. I enjoy our discussions and agree with a lot of points that you make. Below I'll present where we tend to differ, but maybe we'll find a common demoninator along the way. Here it goes (sorry for this length but a lot was pre-written by me in other forums).
> 
> Why thankyou very much :O) :cheers:
> I would certainly enjoy a discussion here, and I am sure there are many points where we would agree.
> ...


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## VicFontaine (Jan 10, 2006)

lots of shit being told in this thread but some nice pics


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## Rohne (Feb 20, 2007)

First, I wasn't born in Frankfurt nor had I lived here the longest part of my life. I've experienced the way of life in some other cities (i.e. Munich) before I moved to my city of choice.



Justme said:


> All quite true, which makes it even more tragic. Frankfurt has history, but now most of it is resigned to the history books. This was of cause due to the destruction of WWII, though afterwards it does seem to continue, like that beautiful old school recently lost on Schweizerstr (why, when there are so many horrible 1950's atrocities that could be replaced instead).
> 
> I really do believe that many American or even Australian cities have more history in their downtowns than Frankfurt. Certainly more notable historical buildings. Google "Queen Victoria Building" in Sydney for example. Frankfurt has no significant historical building that I can think of. And the fact it is smack in the middle of Western Europe does seem rather ironic.


Of course it's a shame seeing how there are still beautiful old buildings torn down and replaced by more or less ugly pieces of crap. But there are still many historical buildings left. I don't think you can find any building in Sydney being 500 or even more than 1000 years old. In Frankfurt you still have dozens of them. Not many in the Innenstadt survived the war and the 50s, there's only left some oldtown buildings (the areas around Goethehaus, Paulskirche, Römerberg and Cathedral), a few timberframe and a bit more 19th century buildings in northern, eastern and western Neustadt. But around downtown (Sachsenhausen, Nordend, Bornheim etc are everything but not "suburbs") you will find many many more. Very many beautiful 19th century buildings, often complete ensembles of them and nearly every district has its own oldtown. There are still more than 1000 timberframe buildings (not only in Höchst and Sachsenhausen) within the city limits. And the most important part of the old town, the Krönungsweg between Kaiserdom and Römer will be reconstructed with its picturesque timberframe buildings from 12th till 18th century (I'm quite sure most of the 50 buildings will be reconstructed, not only the actually announced 7) which for centuries formed Frankfurt's identity - all this just a few steps away from the banking district.
Yes, the downtown is still not very eye catching, but it's getting better and better and a city and especially Frankfurt has to be defined by way more than just its downtown.



> Of cause, Frankfurt could have done it another way. Some German cities after WWII rebuilt their historical landmarks, and Frankfurt chose not it. Instead, it _could_ have rebuilt itself as an ultra modern city, an example to the rest of the world. But it didn't...
> 
> Imagine if Frankfurt chose this option. To rebuild it's city center in an ultra modern way. Sort of like a downtown version of Valencia's Science Park area (though it would be better to not all be from one architect ;O)


Frankfurt chose the medium way between completely old (Nuremberg, Munich) and completely new (Cologne, Hanover) and I'm very glad it did not try to rebuilt itself in an "ultra modern" way. Those ugly buildings between Braubauchstraße and Zeil have been "ultra modern" by then...
Additionally, Frankfurt would have totally lost its cultural (architectonical) heritage this way.



> To be honest, I find them quite blocky and uninteresting. They wouldn't lift an eye of a tourist. Compare this with the South Bank developments in Melbourne. In fact, both cities seem to have a lot in common, but where Frankfurt just talks of renovating Osthafen, Melbourne is nearly finished rebuilding their version (and both look so similar on a map ;O)


Agreed. In my opinion Frankfurt could have done much better with the new buildings along the river bank. Only some buildings at Westhafen and Deutschherrnufer are nice, the rest is just boxy standard crap of temporary architecture.



> Actually, I can see you like Holzhausenpark from your Avatar, so I won't knock it. But it is very small and both parks are in the suburbs, not city center. In my opinion, they are nothing special. Great parks in Germany are like the Tiergarten in Berlin or the Englische Garten in Munich.


As I already said, they still belong to central Frankfurt. That's definitely not suburbs! Nordend's population density is as high as Paris' within the Périphérique (also the buildings are comparable to Paris - nice urban 19th century architecture, of course in Frankfurt style meaning black roofs and often red sandstone, but more middle-class, the upper class especially built in Westend, Bahnhofsviertel and Sachsenhausen).
Ok, the parks are not downtown, but if you argue this way Tiergarten and Englischer Garten also aren't.

Römerberg:


> Half of it's a nice plaza with the rebuilt buildings to look old. Then the other side has those 1950'+ atrocities. How does it compare as a plaza to Trafalgar Square, Plaza Cataluna, and countless others around the world... ?


I doubt Plaza Cataluna's historical importance is comparable to the Römerberg's which is one of Germany's most important city squares. It was scene to the crowning celebrations of nearly every German emperor (by that time the biggest part of Europe belonged to the Holy Roman Empire) and many other historic events.
Yet, it's not considered the center of the city. This role is played by the Hauptwache since more than 100 years.



> How to describe Apple Wine. Cider with less fizz?


Blasphemy! It's nothing to do with wine or even cider. It's just Ebbelwei and Frankfurt's national drink! (German) beer is good, but Ebbelwei is best! Especially as a fanatic Eintracht Frankfurt supporter that's a holy cow for me.



> Sorry, but with all the grand Opera Houses in Europe, how does Frankfurt's rebuilt one compete? The great ones in Italy, Spain, London, Paris etc are far more impressive.


You can't say, Frankfurt's opera didn't belong to the top league in Europe. And the opera square is one of Frankfurt's most attractive downtown squares.
By the way, Frankfurt is very different to cities like Paris, Berlin, Munich or London. It's never been a capital (though it nearly had become the capital of Germany after WWII) or a monarch's official residency. For centuries it was a Freie Reichsstadt and it can be very proud of it. While the main buildings of most other cities were built by the monarch, Frankfurt's main buildings were build by the citizens.

Goethehaus:


> This is a tourist attraction?


Yes it is. Especially the Japanese love it  though the neighboring buildings aren't very beautyful.



> A lovely, but very very small zoo.


More size isn't possible at this location in central Frankfurt.
Those who like larger zoos visit the Opel Zoo between Kronberg and Königstein (by the way Germany's towns with the most wealthy inhabitants). Both still belong to the contiguous built-up urban area.



> Again lovely place, but it's no Kew Gardens


But it's the Palmengarten.  There's no need to copy other cities' parks. Frankfurt is Frankfurt and not Dubai which copies Big Ben & Co 



> I myself believe this city could improve drastically. It's a nice town, with excellent living standards and conditions. It has some nice inner city neighbourhoods, and some wonderful suburban and metro area centers.


Of course it can, and it already does. Just compare it with the Frankfurt of the 80s which was considered as cold, ugly and criminal. It's already undergone a huge improvement, is way better than it's reputation and I hope it continues this way.


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## Golden Age (Dec 26, 2006)

VicFontaine said:


> lots of shit being told in this thread but some nice pics


Great comment, unbelievably insightful and constructive.


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## Golden Age (Dec 26, 2006)

Thanks for your answer!



Justme said:


> However, it is not a common sight in Europe, nor other country's around the world.


Check out Munich's Kaufingerstrasse (Germany's pedestrian zone with the highest sales volume) or the Mönckebergstrasse in Hamburg after 8 pm during a weekday, not exactly a happenin' place. Berlin is a different story.



Justme said:


> I really do believe that many American or even Australian cities have more history in their downtowns than Frankfurt.


If you judge a city by the abundance of historical buildings then yes Chicago, San Fran, Boston and NYC have more old buildings, but Frankfurt was already of historical relevance long before Columbus set off to discover the US of A. Thus, I'd call it a tie. 



Justme said:


> Of cause, Frankfurt could have done it another way. Some German cities after WWII rebuilt their historical landmarks, and Frankfurt chose not it.


Of the big cities, it's really only Munich and Hamburg (and partly Düsseldorf, Dresden) that did this. The other big cities like Stuttgart, Leipzig, Essen, Berlin and Cologne are not really known for drop-dead gorgeous inner cities with historically preserved city ensembles either.



Justme said:


> But it is very small and both parks are in the suburbs, not city center. In my opinion, they are nothing special.


Now that the entire Frankfurt university is moving right next door to the Grüneburgpark it is bound to become an even more interesting park than it already is (meaning even more outdoor cafés). Imagine the Englische Garten in Munich without the neighboring university (it would a lot blander). In the summer, there are open-air theater performances in the Grünerburg- and Günthersburgparks, a wonderful way to use a park. 

Again, if I can reach the Grüneburgpark or Holzhausenpark by bike within 5 minutes from the financial district, it's hardly "out of reach" or "periphery".



Justme said:


> To be honest, Frankfurt's river frontage is very very average. Yes, it's a narrow green park, but it has nothing special, which is why outside of Frankfurt it doesn't roll off the tongue like many other rivers...


Average? Compare it to the Isar in Munich or the Tiber in Rome, two completely underused river promenades, then Frankfurt looks pretty sweet with its narrow green. Go to the area around the Main Café any summer night, there must be at least 400-500 people sitting on the grass taking in the beautiful views. The 3.5 Million people that come for the never-disappointing Museumsuferfest certainly can't have a bad taste either. The response by newbies to the promenade from my experience is usually nothing but favorable and friends/family that have visited me are usually not shy with their opinions. 

I used to be relatively hostile towards the Main until I did bike tours in the summer. The path between Höchst and Mainz is one of the nicer ones I've been on. Also, the Main is a paradise for rowers (my favorite Frankfurt activity). Only Hamburg and Berlin have more to offer here.



Justme said:


> Sorry, but with all the grand Opera Houses in Europe, how does Frankfurt's rebuilt one compete? The great ones in Italy, Spain, London, Paris etc are far more impressive.[/COLOR]


Yep, but in Germany only the Semperoper, the Baden-Baden Opera, the Munich Opera or the Gendarmenmarkt in Berlin compare to it. Pretty soon Hamburg will have Germany's most impressive opera structure with the Elbphilarmonie and I'm looking forward to a visit.



Justme said:


> This is a tourist attraction? I know Goethe is very famous in germany, but very few people outside this country has read his works or even heard of him, let alone wish to visit his birthplace.


It's their loss if they haven't heard from him. It's one of the top 3 visited attractions in Frankfurt, so it can't be bad.



Justme said:


> Nice museum, and along with the Communications Museum, the best in Frankfurt. But at an international level it is very unastounding.


The current exhibition "Cranach the Elder" has a constant line of 150-200 people waiting outside the museum and is hailed by the Spiegel as "probably Germany's most important art exhibition of the year". Again, Prada, Louvre and Rijksmuseum have the Staedel beat, but within Germany, the Staedel is looking pretty good right now (maybe the Pinakothek or Lenbachhaus in Munich is similar).



Justme said:


> The Kleinmarkthelle is a wonderful place to buy great foods. I visit all the time to stock up - but it is in a hidious concrete atrocity of a building.


Never judge a book by its cover. The Markthalle is a jewel like no other shopping building in Frankfurt. In fact, I would protest if they made changes to it that could hurt the grocery stands inside. Frankfurt has to do a much better job at marketing this place.



Justme said:


> Again lovely place, but it's no Kew Gardens


Hey, if I'm driving a solid BMW I wouldn't complain that it's not a top-of-the-line Lamborghini. Same argument goes for many other Frankfurt attractions.



Justme said:


> Every major city in the world has cool and trendy bars, cafe's and restaurants. This is not a selling point for the city.


The Summer Lounge isn't just run-of-the-mill cool, the unique view of the skyline is worth the price of admission in itself. I could take some pics and post em on here perhaps, prepare for raised eyebrows. 



Justme said:


> Hamburg has Keil/Laboe, Lübeck the North Sea and the Baltic


Rain clouds all inclusive (I'm joking here, I'm a big fan of Hamburg actually). Yet, I'll take the sun-soaked wine countries of the Rheingau, Bergstrasse and Rheinhessen...



Justme said:


> As for the city having the fourth largest number of tourists, well.. to be honest, that's more to do with it's transport connections.


Agreed, if one detracts the business-only visitors from the total number of visitors Frankfurt wouldn't be as high on the list, NONETHELESS, these people leave more money at the restaurants, operas, shops and hotels than the average Joe Shmoe tourist visiting Dresden. The city worked hard for its big airport, the world's second biggest trade fair, the big train station and the many headquarter buildings, it certainly wasn't simply handed to them, but is a result of hard, honest work against cut-throat competition that would love to attract more business travel.

Touristically, Frankfurt is usually part of a Germany itinerary that includes the Black Forest, Elsace, the Romantic Road or Heidelberg. Also, check the Michelin, Frommer's or Fodor's travel guides, Frankfurt usually does very well (easily beating Stuttgart, Leipzig or Düsseldorf). If you go to a Barnes & Noble book store in NYC, you will not see books on Hamburg, Stuttgart and Cologne, but most likely Munich, Berlin, Dresden and Frankfurt. 



Justme said:


> As I said, the city itself is a nice place, but it is not a noteworthy place. It doesn't hold most people's imagination around the world. When visitors come, they don't leave with a bad feeling but they don't leave thinking it's a great place either.


Couldn't agree more. If I travel to Europe I consider London, Barcelona, Paris, Munich and Dublin to be great cities. However, if visitors skip Frankfurt because they've heard it's dull, too business-like and not tourist friendly, I have to say it's their loss and the opposite is true. I would simply take an average of somewhat objective sources like the travel guides and magazines, then those people stand corrected. 



Justme said:


> I hope my discussion hasn't upset you or anyone else. I won't knock or berate this town, but I do feel that I have to have my say with the hope that one day it will improve.


No offense taken, criticism is vital otherwise improvements won't happen anytime soon, but with new university campus, the new ECB, the FrankfurtHochVier shopping and reconstructed palace, the new old town ensemble, the Opern Turm and Degussa construction, the direction of Frankfurt is a good one.


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## Rohne (Feb 20, 2007)

Golden Age said:


> Never judge a book by its cover. The Markthalle is a jewel like no other shopping building in Frankfurt. In fact, I would protest if they made changes to it that could hurt the grocery stands inside. Frankfurt has to do a much better job at marketing this place.


Ah, but the area around the Kleinmarkthalle is the shittest area in the city center. Looking from the Zeilgalerie you might think it's a slum (and I've even often heard comments in this direction from visitors). The neighboring buildings - especially those at the Berliner Straße - should all be torn down and even the Kleinmarkthalle itself should get a complete redesigning to get a 100% different look. If not this will remain the ugliest area in central ffm.


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## goschio (Dec 2, 2002)

Rohne said:


> Ah, but the area around the Kleinmarkthalle is the shittest area in the city center. Looking from the Zeilgalerie you might think it's a slum (and I've even often heard comments in this direction from visitors). The neighboring buildings - especially those at the Berliner Straße - should all be torn down and even the Kleinmarkthalle itself should get a complete redesigning to get a 100% different look. If not this will remain the ugliest area in central ffm.


Totally agree. The whole area needs a redevelopment.


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## boaking (Aug 4, 2007)

the best German city in my heart! cool pics


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Rohne said:


> Of course it's a shame seeing how there are still beautiful old buildings torn down and replaced by more or less ugly pieces of crap. But there are still many historical buildings left. I don't think you can find any building in Sydney being 500 or even more than 1000 years old.


You are quite right. When in the suburbs and metropolitan area you do find some wonderfully old buildings. It's also not hard to find, often in most old town centers.

Though I was talking about downtown, and let's face it. That _is_ the most important part of any city. And Sydney's downtown does indeed have far more history than Frankfurt's downtown. But of cause we all know the reason why.



Rohne said:


> In Frankfurt you still have dozens of them. Not many in the Innenstadt survived the war and the 50s, there's only left some oldtown buildings (the areas around Goethehaus, Paulskirche, Römerberg and Cathedral), a few timberframe and a bit more 19th century buildings in northern, eastern and western Neustadt. But around downtown (Sachsenhausen, Nordend, Bornheim etc are everything but not "suburbs") you will find many many more. Very many beautiful 19th century buildings, often complete ensembles of them and nearly every district has its own oldtown. There are still more than 1000 timberframe buildings (not only in Höchst and Sachsenhausen) within the city limits. And the most important part of the old town, the Krönungsweg between Kaiserdom and Römer will be reconstructed with its picturesque timberframe buildings from 12th till 18th century (I'm quite sure most of the 50 buildings will be reconstructed, not only the actually announced 7) which for centuries formed Frankfurt's identity - all this just a few steps away from the banking district.


These are wonderful parts of Frankfurt, but they are still suburbs to me. Whether they are inner suburbs or outer suburbs, it's not the city center. No problem with that, and I'll say one thing... I think Frankfurt's suburbs on average are far nicer than Sydney's suburbs (not including the coastal ones of cause)



Rohne said:


> Yes, the downtown is still not very eye catching, but it's getting better and better and a city and especially Frankfurt has to be defined by way more than just its downtown.


I do agree that Frankfurt is improving, but for me it has such a long way to go. There is no wow factor here, and with the exception of the rather nice skyscrapers, the average building is very limited in appeal. The social housing in downtown also completely flips my mind. Downtown is not the place for social housing, I don't know whose idea it was to have social housing in the most prime possible real estate area in the metropolitan area.



Rohne said:


> Frankfurt chose the medium way between completely old (Nuremberg, Munich) and completely new (Cologne, Hanover) and I'm very glad it did not try to rebuilt itself in an "ultra modern" way. Those ugly buildings between Braubauchstraße and Zeil have been "ultra modern" by then...
> Additionally, Frankfurt would have totally lost its cultural (architectonical) heritage this way.


I guess each to their own. :cheers: For me, the middle way is the boring way. It's not one, nor the other. We have a great building or an ugly building, a great film or a shit film, a great city, or a crap city. Frankfurt's middle way is exactly what I was saying in my first rant ;O) It's a "functional" city. Nothing to write home about, but nothing to complain too much either. It's a bit like the boring guy at a party. He doesn't cause any fights or get drunk and throw up on the carpet, but he's no fun to hang around and chat to as well. He's just there, sort of on his own minding his own business. He's Frankfurt ;O)



Rohne said:


> As I already said, they still belong to central Frankfurt. That's definitely not suburbs! Nordend's population density is as high as Paris' within the Périphérique (also the buildings are comparable to Paris - nice urban 19th century architecture, of course in Frankfurt style meaning black roofs and often red sandstone, but more middle-class, the upper class especially built in Westend, Bahnhofsviertel and Sachsenhausen).


Forgive me, it seems we have different cultural definitions of what a suburb is. Where I come from, everything outside of downtown is a suburb. Whether inner suburb, or outer suburb. Basically, it's where the commercial and business hub of a city ends, and residential neighbourhoods take over. To me, Bornheim and Sachsenhausen fall into this class as most of the buildings are dedicated to residential needs.



Rohne said:


> Ok, the parks are not downtown, but if you argue this way Tiergarten and Englischer Garten also aren't.


This is a good point, though the Tiergarten starts right at the Brandenburg Gate and Unter der Linden which is probably the main street of the city.



Rohne said:


> I doubt Plaza Cataluna's historical importance is comparable to the Römerberg's which is one of Germany's most important city squares. It was scene to the crowning celebrations of nearly every German emperor (by that time the biggest part of Europe belonged to the Holy Roman Empire) and many other historic events.
> Yet, it's not considered the center of the city. This role is played by the Hauptwache since more than 100 years.


With such an important history it's a pity the platz is so average in design.



Rohne said:


> Blasphemy! It's nothing to do with wine or even cider. It's just Ebbelwei and Frankfurt's national drink! (German) beer is good, but Ebbelwei is best! Especially as a fanatic Eintracht Frankfurt supporter that's a holy cow for me.


:lol: Sorry, I apologize if I offended your spirit here. But let's be honest about this. My German friends often have to explain what Cider is to other Germans, and even they say sweeter Ebbelwei with more fizz ;O) :cheers:











Rohne said:


> You can't say, Frankfurt's opera didn't belong to the top league in Europe. And the opera square is one of Frankfurt's most attractive downtown squares.
> By the way, Frankfurt is very different to cities like Paris, Berlin, Munich or London. It's never been a capital (though it nearly had become the capital of Germany after WWII) or a monarch's official residency. For centuries it was a Freie Reichsstadt and it can be very proud of it. While the main buildings of most other cities were built by the monarch, Frankfurt's main buildings were build by the citizens.


I agree with part of this. The square is one of the nicest in Frankfurt, actually, I would be inclined to say the nicest. But on a global scale it is quite average. As for not being a capital, yes, this probably has something to do with it, although Barcelona was not one as well and their opera house is beyond description ;O)



Rohne said:


> More size isn't possible at this location in central Frankfurt.
> Those who like larger zoos visit the Opel Zoo between Kronberg and Königstein (by the way Germany's towns with the most wealthy inhabitants). Both still belong to the contiguous built-up urban area.


I know, I never complained about the zoo, just pointed out that it is a rather small one, and this is something that would be noticed by an international tourist who visits the city and then the zoo. No tourist will care if there is space to expand or not, it will just be a pleasant, but small zoo and unlikely something they will recommend to someone else in their own country. For Frankfurters though, it is a nice visit, as is the Opel zoo.

Thanks for your comments Rohne, I have enjoyed this discussion with you. As you hopefully can see, I am not bashing Frankfurt but thinking of it's position in Germany and on a global scale and how it compares with other cities of similar size around the world.


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## mbuildings (May 6, 2007)

stunning pics


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Golden Age said:


> Thanks for your answer!


Not a problem :cheers: Any criticism I vent is simply in the hope to encourage positive discussions on ways this city could improve. When I was living in Sydney, I would also criticize many aspects of that town which were in need of improving, and some of those improvements could be found by looking at Frankfurt (transport was one such point and drinking laws was another)



Golden Age said:


> If you judge a city by the abundance of historical buildings then yes Chicago, San Fran, Boston and NYC have more old buildings, but Frankfurt was already of historical relevance long before Columbus set off to discover the US of A. Thus, I'd call it a tie.


Ahh, but one is a memory and the other is reality. Yes, Frankfurt's history is far longer than any of these new world cities but it has very little visual history in downtown today (please remember that I know outside of downtown are many historical centers and buildings). This is a sad thing of cause, but also it's sad in my opinion how Frankfurt tackled it. Not only is it not a city with wonderful historical buildings, it is also not a city with great modern buildings either. There is no "landmark" building in this town which many other cities - even those of the same size or smaller around the world have.




Golden Age said:


> Again, if I can reach the Grüneburgpark or Holzhausenpark by bike within 5 minutes from the financial district, it's hardly "out of reach" or "periphery".


A Downtown park is where you can walk on foot from a major shopping or central city area. i.e. The Tiergarten is right next to the Brandenburg Gate or Unter der Linden (and a very short walk from Potsdamerplatz), Hyde Park is right next to Oxford Street, the city's main shopping street and St. James Park is right next to Trafalgar Square. Hyde Park in Sydney is a couple of minutes walk from George or Pitt Street, that cities main shopping street and The (free) Botanical Gardens is right next to the Opera House. The list goes on. Many cities have beautiful downtown parks you can walk to in a few minutes to take a break from shopping or on your works lunch break. Frankfurt lacks this. 



Golden Age said:


> Average? Compare it to the Isar in Munich or the Tiber in Rome, two completely underused river promenades, then Frankfurt looks pretty sweet with its narrow green. Go to the area around the Main Café any summer night, there must be at least 400-500 people sitting on the grass taking in the beautiful views. The 3.5 Million people that come for the never-disappointing Museumsuferfest certainly can't have a bad taste either. The response by newbies to the promenade from my experience is usually nothing but favorable and friends/family that have visited me are usually not shy with their opinions.


Actually, I am not that fond of the Isar as it seems to lack water for a good portion ;O) And I have to admit that the Tiber really is a river in need of some renovation. There are lots of overgrown weeds there that are quite unattractive. That said, the buildings fronting it are of far higher quality than Frankfurt. This is one of the problems I have with the Main. Along the main city part there seems to be a pile of social housing (or at least houses I would never want to live in) despite this being the premier real estate in the city. 

Yes, I like the green park as well along the river, but why not something else in a small part. Something with imagination and a little bit... well, with more zest (remember I say Frankfurt is "functional") Look at what Brisbane or Melbourne do with their rivers. And yes, they still have the traditional "park" sections as well, so if you don't like the modern part you still have the traditional section - but it offers a choice. (the beach is fake like the ones in Frankfurt, but they actually put water in so people can swim - of cause Frankfurt doesn't have the year round weather for that, but much more effort has gone into these riverbanks than what Frankfurt has done)




































fireballs every hour in Melbourne


















I'm not saying Frankfurt should copy these things (like Berlin doing that copy of the big Wheel in London), it should do something of it's own, but something that turns heads and makes people remember this city and locals something to show that people from other parts of the world haven't seen before.



Golden Age said:


> Yep, but in Germany only the Semperoper, the Baden-Baden Opera, the Munich Opera or the Gendarmenmarkt in Berlin compare to it. Pretty soon Hamburg will have Germany's most impressive opera structure with the Elbphilarmonie and I'm looking forward to a visit.


Ah yes, the Elbphilarmonie. That certainly will be one of the world's great modern opera houses. Now, I wish that was being built here ;O)



Golden Age said:


> It's their loss if they haven't heard from him. It's one of the top 3 visited attractions in Frankfurt, so it can't be bad.


Yes, but ever heard of Gary, Indiana? Not a pleasant town in the US, do a google search and you'll see what I mean. But I'm sure it also has a list of tourist attractions if people are misfortune enough to be there, and I'm sure one of them is labelled number "three" on the list. Just because it's number three for that city doesn't mean it's anything special.

Now of cause, Frankfurt can't be compared to Gary ;O) I was just using an Analogy there. But let's be honest, if Goethe's birthplace was the third most visited tourist attraction in the city, it doesn't say much for the top 10 of Frankfurt.
This is the third most visited place in Frankfurt, and it's not even an old building but a replica.











Golden Age said:


> The current exhibition "Cranach the Elder" has a constant line of 150-200 people waiting outside the museum and is hailed by the Spiegel as "probably Germany's most important art exhibition of the year". Again, Prada, Louvre and Rijksmuseum have the Staedel beat, but within Germany, the Staedel is looking pretty good right now (maybe the Pinakothek or Lenbachhaus in Munich is similar).


Yes, I must check out that exhibition. However, I still believe that the Staedel is not that grand a museum at an international level. Let's take the War Memorial Museum in Auckland, New Zealand. A much smaller city of 400,000 and 1.3million in the wider metropolitan area, yet a museum far larger and grander than anything in Frankfurt. Recently completed a wonderful new wing. Now keep in mind this isn't in a large and globally important country like Germany smack in the middle of densely populated Europe, this is in possibly the world's most remotest country which nationwide has less people than Frankfurt's metropolitan area!











Golden Age said:


> Agreed, if one detracts the business-only visitors from the total number of visitors Frankfurt wouldn't be as high on the list, NONETHELESS, these people leave more money at the restaurants, operas, shops and hotels than the average Joe Shmoe tourist visiting Dresden. The city worked hard for its big airport, the world's second biggest trade fair, the big train station and the many headquarter buildings, it certainly wasn't simply handed to them, but is a result of hard, honest work against cut-throat competition that would love to attract more business travel.


This is true, but let's also be honest, business travellers do not "chose" to visit Frankfurt, they visit because they have to. A city that "attracts" visitors rather than forces them to come means that the city has a lot to offer ;O)



Golden Age said:


> Touristically, Frankfurt is usually part of a Germany itinerary that includes the Black Forest, Elsace, the Romantic Road or Heidelberg. Also, check the Michelin, Frommer's or Fodor's travel guides, Frankfurt usually does very well (easily beating Stuttgart, Leipzig or Düsseldorf). If you go to a Barnes & Noble book store in NYC, you will not see books on Hamburg, Stuttgart and Cologne, but most likely Munich, Berlin, Dresden and Frankfurt.


Interesting point. I know from my overseas experience that Berlin and Munich get most of the attention (and Munich is mainly due to Oktoberfest). Frankfurt gets attention in the financial news, or due to it's transport connections. It does have excellent transport connections though, I have to admire it for that.



Golden Age said:


> Couldn't agree more. If I travel to Europe I consider London, Barcelona, Paris, Munich and Dublin to be great cities. However, if visitors skip Frankfurt because they've heard it's dull, too business-like and not tourist friendly, I have to say it's their loss and the opposite is true. I would simply take an average of somewhat objective sources like the travel guides and magazines, then those people stand corrected.


I would imagine travel guides and magazines to be reasonably positive about Frankfurt. As I said, it's not a _bad_ place, so they would most likely look at the positive sides. A European based magazine or guide may mention the skyscrapers as this is the city's best asset and for many Europeans, it maybe something they have never seen before. But for outside Europe where such towers are the norm, it would unlikely rate much a mention. They would probably look into other area's where the city is interesting. I doubt they would pick it apart though.



Golden Age said:


> No offense taken, criticism is vital otherwise improvements won't happen anytime soon, but with new university campus, the new ECB, the FrankfurtHochVier shopping and reconstructed palace, the new old town ensemble, the Opern Turm and Degussa construction, the direction of Frankfurt is a good one.


Yes, Frankfurt is a nice town, and with all the criticism I have bestowed, I also have to point out it's good feature. It has a fantastic transport network for a city it's size (and a great hauptbahnhof that many cities would dream of), a fantastic metropolitan area in terms of lovely towns and cities and overall a very pleasant place to live. I love the pubs and bars, the cafe's and the restaurants. I love how easy it is to get to the city from where I live. I also think it is improving, though just not at the speed I would like.

What I really would love is for Frankfurt to build some grand landmark buildings, parks or plazas. Something that has a wow factor. If Frankfurt done one of these, others would follow and the whole atmosphere in the city would change.

Thanks for your input here, I have been enjoying this discussion.


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## Golden Age (Dec 26, 2006)

Rohne said:


> Ah, but the area around the Kleinmarkthalle is the shittest area in the city center. Looking from the Zeilgalerie you might think it's a slum (and I've even often heard comments in this direction from visitors). The neighboring buildings - especially those at the Berliner Straße - should all be torn down and even the Kleinmarkthalle itself should get a complete redesigning to get a 100% different look. If not this will remain the ugliest area in central ffm.


The term "slum" is a clear exaggeration, the area between Konstablerwache, Main and Zoo can be described as such, but the Kleinmarkthalle area is now full of life. The Töngesgasse has some really interesting shops, the neighboring library opened in November 2007 (one of the best new venues in downtown Frankfurt in years) and the 7th floor park deck of Peek & Cloppenburg now has a beach club over the summer and an ice skating rink for the holidays. If anything, this area is booming and will continue to do so in the coming years. I agree though that the Berliner Strasse is horrendous and needs a facelift.


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## Rohne (Feb 20, 2007)

Have you ever stood on the Zeilgalerie and looked towards the Kleinmarkthalle? This is definitely the ugliest area of central Frankfurt. And slum (concerning the look of this area) is not an exaggeration it's the truth.


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## Golden Age (Dec 26, 2006)

Thanks for again going into such detail to explain your point of view and making a point to differentiate certain arguments. This kind of worldly and constructive criticism is sadly becoming rarer in these sort of forums by the day. With other words: I'm thoroughly enjoying this discussion.



Justme said:


> When I was living in Sydney, I would also criticize many aspects of that town which were in need of improving, and some of those improvements could be found by looking at Frankfurt (transport was one such point and drinking laws was another).


If not earlier, then the Olympic Games proved Sydney to be one of the true city jewels in the world. Its setting, its harbour and beaches make it a real standout. It'll be hard for Sydney to improve even more.



Justme said:


> This is a sad thing of cause, but also it's sad in my opinion how Frankfurt tackled it. Not only is it not a city with wonderful historical buildings, it is also not a city with great modern buildings either.


Well, many now view Barcelona as one of most beautiful cities around. Let's not forget how the city looked before its 1992 Olympic Renaissance. It practically had no attractive beach promenade, its historical squares were run down and the place was known for its high criminal rate. Ever since the Catalan economy has been booming. Also, a city like Bern, a UNESCO Wolrd Heritage sight with its old town, feels kind of run-down (not a wall without graffiti) and too dark. The point I'm making is, that even world-class historical towns seem to have had or are having real problems maintaining a nice city.

In Frankfurt we have a different situation. The Fall of the Berlin Wall required the richest parts of Germany to dig in deeply into their finances. While Leipzig, Weimar and Dresden for example are building one prestige project after the next and beautifying their inner cities, the rich cities like Frankfurt, Cologne and Stuttgart are stuck with their infrastructure from the 1970's. The tit-for-tat regional thinking in Germany (Rhein Main does NOT get along) and the Länderfinanzausgleich in which Hessen has always been a big-time payer (in contrast to Bavaria) is a major reason why Frankfurt is barred from investing solely in its own infrastructure. This trend will stop very soon as Saxony is already taking jobs away from Frankfurt with its own money. 

My point here is: Almost like no other country in the world, Germany paid a HUGE price for the end of the Cold War (as great an event as it was). The East had to be completely redone and now the West looks outdated/stuck in the past (time machine into the 70's). Give Germany another 15-20 years to get back to "normal". Already Frankfurt is investing heavily into its historic structures and once they are built, many more will follow, I'm sure of it (Schuman Theater, Schauspiel Theater, Konstablerwache, Neue Börse being some of the candidates)



Justme said:


> A Downtown park is where you can walk on foot from a major shopping or central city area. i.e. Many cities have beautiful downtown parks you can walk to in a few minutes to take a break from shopping or on your works lunch break. Frankfurt lacks this. .


Although I know that we had already discussed this point, in Frankfurt the Main river promenade simply does take over this function to a degree. As you may know Sachsenhausen does not have a park if you don't count the Stadtwald, hence the posh Sachsenhauseners flock to the river along with the many businesspeople and hipsters, making for an intriguing mix of people. In Germany, only Hamburg's Alster-region, Düsseldorf's promenade and perhaps Berlin with the Spree can offer a similarly wide attractive river front. There is social housing, no question, but the Museumsufer is largely free of it and scenic locations like the Nizza, the Gerbermühle, the Main Cafe, the Weseler Werft beer garden or the Brazilian open-air stand with about 100 seats are only the tip of the iceberg.



Justme said:


> beach is fake like the ones in Frankfurt, but they actually put water in so people can swim - of cause Frankfurt doesn't have the year round weather for that, but much more effort has gone into these riverbanks than what Frankfurt has done).


Brisbane looks stunning, I agree. The swimming part is now finally being fixed in Frankfurt after a long period of planning and finding sponsors. Most likely will be a spacious "swimming boat", especially designed for the Main river front and the banking crowds. This will have its own pool water, bar, restaurant etc and will most likely be such a success that more of this kind will follow. Berlin as always has been the originator with such "mobile swimming pools". 



Justme said:


> But let's be honest, if Goethe's birthplace was the third most visited tourist attraction in the city, it doesn't say much for the top 10 of Frankfurt.


There seem to be a lot of people who have read "Faust" or "Die Leiden des Jungen Werthers", it speaks for them I think. The Goethe Haus in itself is in a nasty area, agreed, but the museum is just as good as the Beethoven Haus in Bonn or much better than the Salzburg's Mozart Haus (which is a low-brow, overpriced, tourist nap). Again, if it were up to me, then Berger Strasse and Schweizer Strasse should be the real attractions as this is where Frankfurt's soul is most alive.



Justme said:


> Yes, I must check out that exhibition. However, I still believe that the Staedel is not that grand a museum at an international level. .


You haven't seen the Cranach exhibition? I haven't seen lines this long since the MoMa had its exhibition in Berlin. Don't go on the weekends..

Also, the Schirn will host another collection that is likely to become one of the Top 5 of the year in Germany, the "Impressionists' Wives", 120 impressionist pictures by wives or female friends of famous French impressionist painters. 

All I'm saying is that I don't need to travel to Munich, Cologne or Hamburg to see Germany's most interesting/well-received exhibitions of the year. That's quite an asset!



Justme said:


> This is true, but let's also be honest, business travellers do not "chose" to visit Frankfurt, they visit because they have to. A city that "attracts" visitors rather than forces them to come means that the city has a lot to offer ;O).


Every business trip is mandatory, be it Geneve, Prague or Istanbul. For most of these businesspeople it, however, is an eye-opener. Visits to Frankfurt's best restaurants, bars, opera plays and hotels are all part of the deal. One doesn't have to be wowed by them, but I don't hear too many complaints.



Justme said:


> Interesting point. I know from my overseas experience that Berlin and Munich get most of the attention (and Munich is mainly due to Oktoberfest).


Here is a point where Frankfurt can improve its image immensely. The abundance of summer festivals is almost unrivaled. There's not a week between May and August that there isn't a street/market square festival. Especially the Museumsuferfest with 3.5 million visitors is a real favorite. The live music at this fest almost always blows me away. They could market it the way Chicago does with its successful Blues Festival (also its most revered event).



Justme said:


> A European based magazine or guide may mention the skyscrapers as this is the city's best asset and for many Europeans, it maybe something they have never seen before. But for outside Europe where such towers are the norm, it would unlikely rate much a mention. They would probably look into other area's where the city is interesting. I doubt they would pick it apart though.


Actually, during the Confedarations Cup and World Cup of football, the Brazilians twice chose Frankfurt as their base. Why? Not only is one close to the airport, but the city feels metropolitan, tolerant and most similar to a city in Brazil. Although one should never try to compare Sao Paulo or Rio with Frankfurt, I think the tolerant/"the world is welcome" spirit of the city is a definite selling point. Ronaldinho was often spotted in the Sachsenhausen area having a grand old time, why can't Joe Shmoe from outside Europe?



Justme said:


> Yes, Frankfurt is a nice town, and with all the criticism I have bestowed, I also have to point out it's good feature. It has a fantastic transport network for a city it's size (and a great hauptbahnhof that many cities would dream of), a fantastic metropolitan area in terms of lovely towns and cities and overall a very pleasant place to live. I love the pubs and bars, the cafe's and the restaurants. I love how easy it is to get to the city from where I live. I also think it is improving, though just not at the speed I would like..


Nicely said and fully agreed. Frankfurt is a city that demands to be discovered and is not as immediately accessible as Munich, but once one is immersed in the city's culture/greenery/international feel, it becomes very hard to think of a different city that can offer this in Continental Europe.

In general though, to reiterate my point from earlier. The end of the Cold War is now nearly 20 years in the past and rich cities like Frankfurt have had little opportunity to concentrate on themselves. The mistakes Frankfurt made in the 50's, 60's and 70's (which Munich and Hamburg thankfully did not make to that degree) in architecture, are now being erased slowly but surely. I'll predict that once Eastern German cities become financially self-sufficient (in the next 5-10 years) and no longer need to rely on the rich parts in the West, then Frankfurt, Cologne and Stuttgart will be much more active in their own front yard.


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## Golden Age (Dec 26, 2006)

Rohne said:


> Have you ever stood on the Zeilgalerie and looked towards the Kleinmarkthalle? This is definitely the ugliest area of central Frankfurt. And slum (concerning the look of this area) is not an exaggeration it's the truth.


Yes, but the Zeilgalerie is the total opposite. While the outside and the architecture might be impressive, the shops/restaurants are of the poorest quality, dominated by the typical chains and run by the city's unfriendliest/least attentive shop keepers.

I prefer the Kleinmarkthalle, very grey/boxy from the outside, but a feast for the senses in the inside.

If we could somehow combine the positive qualities of both without ruining the unique attributes of the other then we'd have something.


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## Rohne (Feb 20, 2007)

@Golden Age: Of course it's nice what the Kleinmarkthalle has to offer inside, but the exterior is uke:



Justme said:


> Though I was talking about downtown, and let's face it. That _is_ the most important part of any city. And Sydney's downtown does indeed have far more history than Frankfurt's downtown. But of cause we all know the reason why.


Yet, the remaining old buildings in Frankfurt's downtown are far more old than those in Sydney 




> Forgive me, it seems we have different cultural definitions of what a suburb is.


Well, you can't compare American or Australian cities with their relatively strictly separated residential areas and CBDs that easily with a European one. What you call inner suburbs is in fact the true Frankfurt with an extremely diverse usage, reaching from residential over shopping, nightlife and public use to offices - even much better mixed up than in the "Innenstadt". Northern Sachsenhausen, Bahnhofsviertel and especially the southern Westend offer very much office space (the largest part of the Banking District belongs to Westend and Bahnhofsviertel) - and there are a lot of old buildings...


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## marrio415 (Jun 18, 2006)

just going through all the pics on this post i gotta say frankfurt looks really stunning the night pics make it look like a us city but the day pics really define the modern german city very dynamic


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## Ni3lS (Jun 29, 2007)

Frankfurt  Only city in Germany with real Supertalls  ( I'm not talking about highrises) I really want to visit that city.


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## erbse (Nov 8, 2006)

Post: Work by Erbse


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## alejoaoa (May 11, 2006)

This city is amazing. Will be there on October!!


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## Taller Better (Aug 27, 2005)

erbsenzaehler, are you a professional photographer? Your work is amazing...


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## Chrissib (Feb 9, 2008)

Rohne said:


> You're right. But metros say just nothing (does Frankfurt with its 5-6mln metro area feel bigger than Berlin with under 5mln or Hamburg with 3.5mln?) and are as comparable as city proper statistics: not at all. I prefer urban areas. Frankfurt is 4th in Germany with 1.8mln behind Berlin (4mln), Hamburg (2.5) and Munich (1.9) then.


You know that Wiesbaden, Mainz and Darmstadt are within the urban area? I've calculated 3.5 million people, it's a figure that lies between the two other figures. It's implausible to count Gießen or even Marburg in the Frankfurt area, which lie up to 100km away from the core. It's difficult, as most of the time, the borders of the counties are counted. So this comes to the third place after Rhein-Ruhr and Berlin.


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## Rohne (Feb 20, 2007)

Chrissib said:


> You know that Wiesbaden, Mainz and Darmstadt are within the urban area?


No they aren't. Urban area is just the contigous built-up area from the Taunus suburbs to Hanau and Oxxenbach county with ~1.6-1.9mill inhabitants (depends on how strict you see the max-200m-unbuilt-area rule which could exclude i.e. the area around Rüsselsheim). This makes Frankfurt #4 in Germany following Berlin (~4mill), Hamburg (2.5mill) and Munich (2mill). Wiesbaden/Mainz and Darmstadt are beyond the borders of Frankfurt's urban area and even have their own urban areas. They directly border on Frankfurt' urban area, but for a short stretch only and there's still much free space in between.
Nevertheless those urban areas also belong to the metro area with 4.5-5.8mill inhabitants (officially 5.8, but I wouldn't say that Marburg is still a part of the RheinMain metro area, so I'd prefer 4.5  ). Of course, this is #2 after RheinRuhr, cause Berlin's metro area only has 4.4 :cheers:


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Rohne said:


> No they aren't. Urban area is just the contigous built-up area from the Taunus suburbs to Hanau and Oxxenbach county with ~1.6-1.9mill inhabitants (depends on how strict you see the max-200m-unbuilt-area rule which could exclude i.e. the area around Rüsselsheim). This makes Frankfurt #4 in Germany following Berlin (~4mill), Hamburg (2.5mill) and Munich (2mill). Wiesbaden/Mainz and Darmstadt are beyond the borders of Frankfurt's urban area and even have their own urban areas. They directly border on Frankfurt' urban area, but for a short stretch only and there's still much free space in between.
> Nevertheless those urban areas also belong to the metro area with 4.5-5.8mill inhabitants (officially 5.8, but I wouldn't say that Marburg is still a part of the RheinMain metro area, so I'd prefer 4.5  ). Of course, this is #2 after RheinRuhr, cause Berlin's metro area only has 4.4 :cheers:


Well, if you are using the 200m definition, then yes, technically, Mainz and Wiesbaden _just_ miss out. But not by much. You can trace the route between Frankfurt and Wiesbaden via urbanity and there is only a couple of gaps of around 250m. This does include crossing the river at two points, but rivers don't constitute a break in urban areas (usually).

This makes it a pretty much debatable point. By technical definition, Frankfurt and Mainz/Wiesbaden miss out from being a single urban area by 50meters or so. However, in a realist terms it pretty much is the same urban area.


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## frank hannover (Oct 5, 2005)

Btw nice pics and nice Frankfurt

Hamburg with its very next neighbors (urban-area) is about 2.5 mill., with the countys souruonding Hamburg (metro - area ) its about 4,3 mill.,even not not as far as Luebeck,which is only 70 km away.The Hamburg metro area is beside Berlin the largest monocentral area in Germany (only one big city in the center ), the Frankfurt metro and others are counted as polycentral area (several bigger or political important cities in the area ).


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## Rohne (Feb 20, 2007)

Depends on what you define as "polycentral" and "monocentral". The existence of Oberzentren is absolutely unhelpful in this context. The only metro area which definitely is polycentral is the Ruhr area. In Rhein-Main, well, the political decissions are made in Mainz and Wiesbaden, but Frankfurt is definitely the center of this metro area, be it geographical, cultural, economical, traffic or population.

Btw, Hamburg's metro area is as senseless marked out as the ones of Nuremberg, Leipzig/Dresden or Los Angeles (or the 5.8mill version of RheinMain  ). More outback than everything else. What does a county like i.e. Soltau-Fallingborstel or Lüchow-Dannenberg have to do with Hamburg? It's metro would rather have a population of around 3.5 than 4.3 mill. Ok, I mark out metro areas on my own, coz I don't believe in politicians


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## tk780 (Jun 21, 2007)

Btw, The Los Angeles Metropolitan Area covers about 12,500 km², which isn't exactly excessive for an area of 13 million people. I suppose you are referring to the Los Angeles-Riverside _Combined_ Statistical Area with an area of almost 90,000 km². This is only due to the inclusion of San Bernardino County though (incidentally the largest county in the US).


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

It is true that Frankfurt's metropolitan area is in many ways a cross between a monocentral and polycentral region.

It is polycentral because there are several other important cities surrounding it, which although nowhere near the size and importance of Frankfurt, they are still significant.

It is monocentric because Frankfurt's dominance is so large that the others, despite their historical significance, they are still minor players in comparison.

If anything, Frankfurt's is closer to a monocentral metropolitan area, just in the same way that Sydney is. In other words, how many people know the names of the dozens of other cities that make up Sydney's metropolitan area, some nearly as large as Sydney itself, such as Parramatta. This city has it's own history, it's own suburbs and it's own downtown. This is very similar to how few people outside of Germany (and I suppose the Germanic nations) have heard of Mainz or Wiesbaden, but surely every educated person on this planet has heard of Frankfurt.

The Ruhr area is completely different. None of the major cities that make up the polycentral metropolitan area are significantly more dominant than others.


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## erbse (Nov 8, 2006)

About time to kick off again! 

*Frankfurt aerial views* 









http://fotothek.slub-dresden.de/fotos/elb/euroluftbild/0056000/elb_euroluftbild_0056044.jpg









http://fotothek.slub-dresden.de/fotos/elb/euroluftbild/0055000/elb_euroluftbild_0055758.jpg

Around Zeil, the main shopping street:








http://fotothek.slub-dresden.de/fotos/elb/euroluftbild/0056000/elb_euroluftbild_0056119.jpg


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## Nando_ros (Nov 21, 2008)

https://www.flickr.com/photos/daniel-ster/15167218619/


https://www.flickr.com/photos/slavlee/24753383650/


https://www.flickr.com/photos/volkerk/24755027553/


https://www.flickr.com/photos/tarantynoo/25065295386/


https://www.flickr.com/photos/sebastiandeptula/24876254606/


https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/24502659329/


https://www.flickr.com/photos/mc-80/22694692456/


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## erbse (Nov 8, 2006)

That skyline is getting denser as ever, ha. 









https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/13475224443/









http://www.heliflug.net









The Day's last City Lights - Wide Version by www.flowtation.de - Florian Leist Photography, sur Flickr









https://scontent-frt3-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...941_970900342987691_6347441140201347881_o.jpg









https://scontent-fra3-1.xx.fbcdn.ne...88_1291157064243590_8925503798004898518_o.png









Frankfurt am Main - Altstadt (Old Town) by Jorbasa, on Flickr









Frankfurt: "The Wall" by frawolf77, on Flickr









When Frankfurt is going to sleep... Skyline Mainhattan by Ansgar Hillebrand, on Flickr

That unique setting with fairy-talish medieval remnants and reconstructions plus modern skyscrapers... Amazing.


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## christos-greece (Feb 19, 2008)

Frankfurt I by zouberiphotography, on Flickr


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## erbse (Nov 8, 2006)

*Unusual Frankfurt. Sort of. *

Some rather unusual views of Frankfurt and its skyscrapers:









Tunnel view by DasKameraAuge, auf Flickr

Frankfurt_327 by Karl-Alwin Hiller, auf Flickr

MainPlaza, Frankfurt by Codex IV, auf Flickr

2014-009-FrankfurtOsthafen by jp.selter, auf Flickr

IMG_9795-20160313 Canon EOS 5D Mark II Frankfurt am Main FB2048 by Jens Heyde, auf Flickr

IMG_8585 by isopics, auf Flickr

Frankfurt am Main by Focushaus, auf Flickr

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=440890&page=115


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## Patrick (Sep 11, 2002)

for the first time since 2002, I recently made some non-digital photos using an analogue camera with a miniature film


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## erbse (Nov 8, 2006)

Hipster! 

Very interesting photos though, I love their nostalgic feeling, yet it's clearly all 2016 stuff.


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## erbse (Nov 8, 2006)

Frankfurt's skyline is growing radically in the next few years! kay:









Frankfurt Skyline by Carsten Frohn, auf Flickr


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## AXIS of EVIL (Aug 15, 2010)

erbse said:


> Frankfurt's skyline is growing radically in the next few years! kay:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Nice.


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## erbse (Nov 8, 2006)

Summer Gradient @ Frankfurt am Main por 2d-chris, en Flickr









http://www.bild.de/regional/frankfu...er-stadt-lieben-und-hassen-44198170.bild.html









The Day's last City Lights - Wide Version by www.flowtation.de - Florian Leist Photography, sur Flickr









Skyline seen from Schaumainkai, Frankfurt, Germany by Jochen Hertweck, sur Flickr


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## Runninlikehell (Sep 25, 2011)

Wow, Frankfurt is such a wonderful city! What a great skyline you have there! I'm planning to go visit the city next year.


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## erbse (Nov 8, 2006)

*Frankfurt, Opernplatz* (Opera Square)









/Charles Schrader


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## christos-greece (Feb 19, 2008)

^^ Great, very nice photos from Frankfurt :cheers:


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## the man from k-town (Sep 8, 2008)

amazing shot
Frankfurts Bankenviertel ( Frankfurt Germany ) by FREEDOM STREAMING, auf Flickr

Skyline FFM by Alejandro Jardinero, auf Flickr

Grand Tower by Alejandro Jardinero, auf Flickr

Ohne Titel by dennisview, auf Flickr

Frankfurt a.M. Harbour railway by Ray Stingray, auf Flickr

main station
Hauptbahnhof Ffm by Maik Seegebrecht, auf Flickr


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## Rekarte (Mar 28, 2008)

*Flickr Leo D *​


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## Rekarte (Mar 28, 2008)

*Flickr Leo D *​


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## Rekarte (Mar 28, 2008)

*Flickr Leo D *​


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