# When suburbs build their own "downtown"



## poshbakerloo (Jan 16, 2007)

I think suburbs have always had some for of a centre. They will need it. Can't expect people to have to travel 20miles to go shopping downtown


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## Rascar (Mar 13, 2012)

With regard to the UK and the more densely populated parts of Europe, it is important to remember that nearly all suburbs were at one time small towns and villages in their own right, that have been enveloped by a larger conurbation. At least in the case of England the vast majority of settlements have existed for a very long time (pre medieval). Some of these may still be small farming communities, some may be inner city districts and suburbs.

The point of this being, what we may think of as "commuter land" and sprawl usually has a pre-existing older centre in Europe the equivalent of the US term "downtown".


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## kerouac1848 (Jun 9, 2009)

True, although in London a lot of the classic suburban areas - think rows of semis in zones 4-6 - were built during the late 19th and 20th Century, much during the building boom between the Wars. The part of NW where I grew up was a field at the start of the last century, there were maybe a few houses dotted around. The expansion of tube and commuter rail lines to villages like Harrow, Kingston, etc saw vast housing built between those places and the centre, much of which was 'empty' or just home to scattered settlements.


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## WeimieLvr (May 26, 2008)

Rascar said:


> With regard to the UK and the more densely populated parts of Europe, it is important to remember that nearly all suburbs were at one time small towns and villages in their own right, that have been enveloped by a larger conurbation. At least in the case of England the vast majority of settlements have existed for a very long time (pre medieval). Some of these may still be small farming communities, some may be inner city districts and suburbs.
> 
> The point of this being, what we may think of as "commuter land" and sprawl usually has a pre-existing older centre in Europe the equivalent of the US term "downtown".


The Atlanta suburbs are also this way...not as old, of course, but many of them predating Atlanta. Most of them have an historic downtown area and the suburban neighborhoods have grown up around them. I think that a lot (if not most) American suburbs are of this nature, though some are simply recently-built housing developments where a "downtown" was added afterwards.


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## weava (Sep 8, 2007)

Lenexa(suburb of Kansas City) has a failed attempt at a new downtown, here's its website
http://www.lenexacitycenter.com/
http://joco913.com/news/a-languishing-dream/
https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=38.97002,-94.780061&spn=0.013663,0.028088&t=h&z=16


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## Galro (Aug 9, 2010)

Oslo went through a population boom in the post war years and started constructed sprawling suburbs as was popular at the time. The results is a very American-like metro area with large malls etc., the only differences being that we actually invested a lot of money to build public transport serving these areas. The clear majority of our suburbs have a train, tram, metro and/or buss link. 

Fast forward to today and Oslo is yet again going through a population boom, however what is defined as the building zone (there are for most parts protected farm fields and forest outside of this zone which is a big no-no building on) don't got much space left due to the post war policies. Also add a newfound desire to live urban among the population and a desire to create a "green" city among the politicians, and the result have been a call to density already built up areas. The planners and politicians have come up with something they call "nøkkelpunktutvikling" (in English: Key point development) which in practice means to develop a whole load infrastructure key points (places with tram, metro, train and/or buss stops) into urban hoods, or a "downtown" if you would like. Basically very similar to what you have shown in the US, albeit on a smaller scale like everything else here. 

*A example: *

Heggedal, which is one of the farthest out suburbs. As of now it's only a train stop, a few villas and a abandoned factory. Todays situation:








*Link to google streetview: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Hegg...pBDWvMAD12tCOyW5ts3PGA&cbp=12,307.13,,0,-0.14*

Here is a central pedestrian square, a re-development of the factory site and a few city blocks being planned. There is a few blocks being planned in additional to what is shown on this map, but I don't have any overview over them. 









Central square development:









The factory:









A new street outside of the "downtown":









Similar developments are happening over all the place here ...


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## mhays (Sep 12, 2002)

London_2006 said:


> Kingston and Croydon (the first 2 pics) are definitely suburban though.


Not in the US meaning of the term. Those look like older towns that became part of greater London, or at least grew up in the pre-auto days. US suburbs are generally the auto-centric newer stuff, though the term is subjective.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

weava said:


> Lenexa(suburb of Kansas City) has a failed attempt at a new downtown, here's its website
> http://www.lenexacitycenter.com/
> http://joco913.com/news/a-languishing-dream/
> https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=38.97002,-94.780061&spn=0.013663,0.028088&t=h&z=16


Interesting. Seems like this project did not really fail but never really took off. Still I would not say that its dead, it seems more like it won't be revived for the time being, not before the economy has recovered again.

There seem to be two very different categories of new suburban "downtowns", Lenexa is an empty field development in the middle of suburbia, where not even car oriented central functions were before. Reston Town Center on the other hand is located in an area that served centre functions in a completely car oriented way already before. 

It is of course a lot more likely to succeed in transforming an already existing car oriented suburban centre (ie, a big sea of parking lots with malls and strip malls lost somewhere in between) into something walkable than it is to create it out of nothing.


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## Nexis (Aug 7, 2007)

In the New York City Region , there was a push during the 70-80s to create a Suburban downtowns due to the Urban areas dying and become unsafe. So you have large towns that had alot of space transform there Downtown's into mini Cities with High rises and some skyscrapers. Some Satellite Cities like New Rochelle haven't done so well , others like White Plains or Stamford have done very well. Plans are to have both cities by 2030 changed completely from a Suburban City to a true City. These plans call for narrowed streets , increased Transit options in the form of the Bus Rapid Transit , Streetcars (Trams) and Bike sharing to connect the City with the surrounding towns and cities... 

The Core of White Plains , with the nearby city of Yonkers in the Distance ....


Downtown White Plains, New York by Intiaz Rahim, on Flickr

The Core of White Plains , with the Failed Suburban City of New Rochelle in the Distance 


HPN - White Plains looking a little brown by TerminalMan, on Flickr


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## Manila-X (Jul 28, 2005)

Our area in Southern Metro Manila (Parañaque, Las Piñas, Muntinlupa) is seeing various developments including satellite cities. 

One of the most distinctive would be *Filinvest Corporate City* in Alabang, Muntinlupa.










On the other hand, Makati and newer central business districts around Metro Manila are in the same situation but a different story.

Especially Makati, southeast of The City of Manila. Back in the 1950s, The Ayala family planned to develop a large swamp to a fully integrated city with office buildings in the central core surrounded by middle to upper class residential homes. This is also to decongest Manila's old downtown of Binondo and Quiapo when it comes to commercial space.










But with large amount of land for construction of office buildings plus well organized planning, Makati transformed from a new city in Manila's suburbs to becoming the centre of business, finance and to some extent culture and entertainment for Metro Manila. And with Makati's development, the areas in the southern part of Metro Manila developed including the areas I mentioned earlier.










Makati is now the "downtown"


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## BE0GRAD (May 29, 2010)

Svartmetall said:


> Many suburbs in Stockholm for example are built completely around railway stations.


Do they build both the station and the suburb in the same time or the station was there previously for some reason?


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## Ocean Railroader (Jun 18, 2011)

In Richmond VA we have a big suburb called Short Pump and if drive down from the downtown area of Richmond with all the old Skyscrapers and the modern buildings in Short Pump you will think that Short Pump is larger than downtown Richmond in terms of highrises.


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## gabrielbabb (Aug 11, 2006)

Santa Fé in Mexico City, started developing in the 90's




















Vista aérea de Santa Fe por Hotu Matua, en Flickr


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## Skyrazer (Sep 9, 2009)

Canberra is a pretty good example of this. The city is basically split between "town centres" (Belconnen, Woden, Tuggeranong and Gungahlin)that could represent a downtown (though they're basically just shopping malls with some commercial and office around it) from which suburbs radiate out from. They were built from scratch like this.


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## julesstoop (Sep 11, 2002)

In the Netherlands it is normal for metropolitan area's to be poly centric. And - as was mentioned before - most of our suburban centers have a history. Zoetermeer is an example of a 'new town' (close to The Hague and Rotterdam - linked by freeway, rail en light-rail) in which constructing a city center was actually part of the original plan and the designated area was (I suppose intentionally) left open for the first few decades until the town gained critical mass. Nowadays Zoetermeer has about 120.000 inhabitants and it has become a place for people to shop, recreate and work besides live. It's not the cosiest place in the world, but I guess it's a more or less successful example of turning a suburb into a town. 

Somewhat similar to Zoetermeer are - amongst others: Purmerend, Spijkenisse, Alphen aan de Rijn, Houten, Nieuwegein, and Almere.

Zoetermeer City centre is the triangular area directly to the left of the tiny lake smack in the middle of the picture:


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