# [DK] Denmark | road infrastructure • motorveje i Danmark



## ChrisZwolle

Denmark has 1071 km of motorway, including a couple of big-ass bridges, like the Little Belt Bridge, the Great Belt Bridge and the Sont Bridge (all on the E20 motorway). 
All Danish motorways have names, but they are not signed on the road. 

Danish Motorways on Danish wikipedia


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E45 Flensburg - Frederikshavn*
Flensburg - Aabenraa - Haderslev - Kolding - Vejle - Horsens - Århus - Randers - Aalborg - Frederikshavn









The E45 is the most important north-south motorway in Denmark. It goes from the German border near Padborg (or Flensburg) via Århus, the second largest Danish city to Frederikshavn, where the ferries to Oslo and Göteborg depart.
The E45 has a large amount of trucks between Kolding and Aalborg, outside of rushhours like 50% of the total traffic. There has been build a large bridge across the Vejlefjord, with a magnificent view over the Fjord. This photoserie contains the entire E45 motorway over it's 350km length.

*Padborg (D) - Kolding -> Part I: 76 pictures*

*Kolding - Frederikshavn -> Part II: 226 pictures*


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Video: E20 København*










The E20 is a busy motorway on the southern side of København. This video begins right after the Öresundbridge from Malmö, Sweden, and goes through the southeastern suburbs of Tårnby and Ørestad, and the international airport of København. Via the suburb of Avedøre Holme leads to the Interchange Motorvejkryds Avedøre with the E47.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Video: E20 Storebæltsbroen *










Official name: Storebæltsbroen - Great Belt Bridge
Crosses: Great Belt sea strait
carries: E20 motorway and railway Odense - København
longest span: West Bridge 110 meters, East Bridge 1624 meters (2nd longest in the world)
Clearance below: West Bridge 18 meters, East Bridge 65 meters
Height Pylons: 254 meters, highest structure in Denmark


----------



## FREKI

Nice thread mate!


----------



## Verso

Great, Chris! I hope you had a great time. :cheers: The emergency lane looks pretty rough, is it gravel? And what's with the two black lines? As for the interchange E20/E45, I expected Copenhagen as a destination.

P.S.: does "nygifte" mean "just married"?


----------



## wyqtor

Yes, excellent photos from both Denmark and Sweden - congratulations Chris :cheers: :banana: !

My first impression: the direction signs in Denmark look very clear and organized. The ones from Sweden... not so much. 

Also I am very anxious to hear more of your opinions about those 2 countries now that you have visited them - many people say that they are the most advanced societies in Europe in some ways. I'm very curious how different or similar they are compared to Central European countries I am familiar with (like Germany).


----------



## wyqtor

Verso said:


> P.S.: does "nygifte" mean "just married"?


I thought it means "new gifts"  , but probably your interpretation is more plausible!


----------



## Bahnsteig4

^^ I confirm this.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Nygifte means indeed "just married". 

Denmark is a very modern country, i can't say too much about Sweden, since i have been there only one day. 
EVERYBODY speaks good English in Denmark, from a woman behind the counter at the gas station, to people in the streets. Besides that, i found Danish an extremely easy language to read (speaking and understanding is another thing), but that's maybe because it is quite similar to Dutch. Swedish doesn't differ very much from Danish to me.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

About the roads, i found the quality of the Motorways only "average", most pavement looks very old, and i have seen only one construction site (near Greve, south of Copenhagen). Some of the track formation has been filled up with asphalt, hence the 2 black lines on the right lane. 

However, the other roads are of a good quality, Denmark isn't very flat, instead, you wave through the country over the road. It's very hilly, although the hills aren't very high, mostly not over 100m. The actual coast is usually 20m lower as the surrounding areas, making often a steep coastline, i saw that on the island of Fyn (Funen) and Jylland (Jutland). On the E45, there are sometimes nice views over low valleys.

I can't say enough about the big-ass bridges they have there, even the Little Belt Bridge is impressive, not to mention the huge Great Belt Bridge and the Sont Bridge. I've taken video's of all these bridges. On the Vejle Fjord bridge, you have a stunning view over the Fjord, specially on the northbound lanes. A disadvantage of these bridges can be difficult driving, even with 5bft winds, because the Great Belt bridge is actually a stunning 65 meter above the waters, heavy crosswinds can appear. This thursday, a northeastern storm occured, with 12bft winds according to the TV3 teletekst, i wonder if they close the bridges, maybe for truck traffic, i can't imagine the trucks won't flip over with those winds.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Video: E20 Oresund bridge*










Official name; Øresundsbroen (DK), Öresundsbron (S)
Crosses: Oresund strait
Between: Malmö and København
Carries: E20 motorway and railwayline Malmö - København
Longest span: 490 meters
Length bridge: 7.845 meters
coast-to-coast: 22km
Clearance below: 57 meters
AADT: 13.602
Tolls: 32 Euro, 245 DKK, 300 SEK.


----------



## x-type

those things... i don't have words for them! except maybe that Struma is more impressive...


----------



## Jeroen669

Chris, the amount of pictures (and video's) is fabolous again. I'll sure watch them when I'm home. I hope you've enjoyed your trip to Denmark. For myself making so much pictures would be a-relaxing.

I've got one question about Danish 'motorvejene'. This weekend I got the little book 'Motorvej' (very interesting btw, every country should have something like this). It says something about a safe (?) speed of maximum 120 km/h (speed limit is 130 of 110km/h). What's with that? My Danish is not that good to read the text about it.


----------



## wyqtor

x-type said:


> those things... i don't have words for them! except maybe that Struma is more impressive...


:nuts: :rofl: :nuts:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Jeroen669 said:


> I've got one question about Danish 'motorvejene'. This weekend I got the little book 'Motorvej' (very interesting btw, every country should have something like this). It says something about a safe (?) speed of maximum 120 km/h (speed limit is 130 of 110km/h). What's with that? My Danish is not that good to read the text about it.


I'm not sure, i saw it only 2 times in Denmark (on the E45). It doesn't make much sense either, the road looks the same when the limit was 130km/h. It was also only for a short distance (1 - 2km). 

I think it's a recommended maximum speed, like the 130km/h in Germany, looking at the brochure you'd mentioned.


----------



## Wallaroo

The Danish motorways are not better than anywhere else, and not very impressive at all. I would refer to them as mediocracy motorways. :lol: They basically have two major faults IMO - too many sharp curves that are not suitable for high speeds, and not enough lanes. Kinda like the horrible Danish railroad system actually. :wallbash:


----------



## x-type

Wallaroo said:


> The Danish motorways are not better than anywhere else, and not very impressive at all. I would refer to them as mediocracy motorways. :lol: They basically have two major faults IMO - too many sharp curves that are not suitable for high speeds, and not enough lanes. Kinda like the horrible Danish railroad system actually. :wallbash:


well, if you haven't noticed, nobody's admiring motorways here, but those fantastic and fabolous objects on them!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20 Esbjerg - Malmö*

*Esbjerg - Kolding - Middelfart - Odense - Slagelse - Køge - København - Malmö*









A staggering 300 photo's of this motorway. First, we head east on the Jylland peninsula (Jutland), towards Kolding, where we meet the E45 motorway to Århus and Flensburg. After Fredericia we pass over the Lillebæltsbridge to Middelfart on the island of Fyn (Funen). We pass by the large city of Odense, whereafter we cross the Great Belt over the stunning Storebæltbridge. We arrive on the island of Sjælland (S/Zealand). After 70km, we pass by Køge, the southernmost suburb of København, and we join the E47 motorway to the northeast. After 30km of suburbs, the E47 leaves us in the direction of Helsingør. Another huge bridge is in sight; the Øresundbridge, between København and Malmö. In Sweden, this picture-serie continues until we join the E6 from Trelleborg at the southern edge of Malmö.

It has become so many pics, because the Great Belt, Little Belt and Sontbridge are just so stunning to see. 

*Part I -> Esbjerg - Odense: 103 pics*

*Part II -> Odense - Malmö: 197 pics*


----------



## Verso

Oh, that's a spectacular ride. :drool:


----------



## Wallaroo

Notice the special Danish concrete crash barrier in the right side - I have not seen them used in other countries. 

Also notice the stippled side marking line, which is made of reflective thermo plastic and makes an awfull sound when you drive on it. We call them "Wake up lines" and they are pretty damn effective.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Route 9 Odense - Svendborg - Spodsbjerg*









This motorway is brand new, and goes from Odense to Svendborg. Other than on maps, the bypass of Svendborg is 2x2 lanes and has no grade intersections. Most people drove 120km/h here. After Svendborg, we pass over 2 larger bridges, to the island of Langeland.

*Route 9 -> 92 photos*http://picasaweb.google.nl/ASWchris/Route9OdenseSvendsborgSpodsbjerg


----------



## Wallaroo

Chriszwolle said:


> *Route 9 Odense - Svendborg - Spodsbjerg*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This motorway is brand new, and goes from Odense to Svendborg. Other than on maps, the bypass of Svendborg is 2x2 lanes and has no grade intersections. Most people drove 120km/h here. After Svendborg, we pass over 2 larger bridges, to the island of Langeland.
> 
> *Route 9 -> 92 photos*http://picasaweb.google.nl/ASWchris/Route9OdenseSvendsborgSpodsbjerg


Did you drive around here in Denmark for no other reason than to look at the motorways? :nuts:


----------



## mlm

Thank you for the photos and videos Chris, it's always interesting to see what "outsiders" have to say about our roads and bridges.

BTW, the next new motorway stretch to open, is the Herning S - Brande. 14 Km's will be opened on monday (as a part of the Herning-Vejle motorway, Route 18). If interested, there's a newspaper about it, which be read online. Go here, and click the first link in the "seneste nyt" box. It's only in Danish though, but there's a lot of aerial photos in it.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Wallaroo said:


> Did you drive around here in Denmark for no other reason than to look at the motorways? :nuts:


Why not take pics, while you are travelling? :cheers: 

Other people take hundreds of pics of trains, metros, buildings, trees etc. I take pics of motorways :cheers: 

But last time in Denmark was in 1991, so it was nice to be back again.


----------



## FREKI

^Awesome videos thanks for sharing! :cheers1:


----------



## Wallaroo

mlm said:


> BTW, the next new motorway stretch to open, is the Herning S - Brande. 14 Km's will be opened on monday (as a part of the Herning-Vejle motorway, Route 18). If interested, there's a newspaper about it, which be read online. Go here, and click the first link in the "seneste nyt" box. It's only in Danish though, but there's a lot of aerial photos in it.


Route 18 is not going to be motorway all the way though.

Here is a map of all the current motorway projects in Denmark. http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/dokument.asp?page=document&objno=82253


----------



## mlm

/\ First, you should probably remove those maps, or atlest don't link directly from vejdirektoratet.dk. I almost got in trouble for doing exactly that some time ago.

And no, not all of route 18 will be motorway, but the part from Herning to Vejle North (E45) will. It will be ready in 2012, and has gotten the name "Midtjyske Motorvej".


----------



## x-type

Wallaroo said:


> Also notice the stippled side marking line, which is made of reflective thermo plastic and makes an awfull sound when you drive on it. We call them "Wake up lines" and they are pretty damn effective.


yes, i have noticed those marking lines earlier, really a lot of those are in Denmark. and that's great because they are effective indeed! here in Croatia we have them at few places, the sound they make is really horrible! :nuts:


----------



## Wallaroo

mlm said:


> /\ First, you should probably remove those maps, or atlest don't link directly from vejdirektoratet.dk. I almost got in trouble for doing exactly that some time ago.


I reckon you are right. Amazing that Vejdirektoratet doesnt even want people to show others their projects - those fucking assholes! :bash: 


> And no, not all of route 18 will be motorway, but the part from Herning to Vejle North (E45) will. It will be ready in 2012, and has gotten the name "Midtjyske Motorvej".


I think the part around Brande is only a motortrafikvej, aint it? Anyway, I think you are a bit too spoiled with motorways around Herning. :|


----------



## mlm

Wallaroo said:


> I think the part around Brande is only a motortrafikvej, aint it? Anyway, I think you are a bit too spoiled with motorways around Herning. :|


Yes it's the only part that haven't been finally approved for "upgrading" yet by the government, but that's only because a "VVM undersøgelse" haven't been made it. As you can see HERE they have just stated making it, and I'm 100% sure it's just a formality to approve it. 

Wheater or not "we're" too spoiled with motorways here, I can't say. Of course there's not as much trafic here as the larger Danish cities, and I'm sure that regional development and "A country in balance" also had something to say. Herning is though, the town/city after Århus in Region Midtjylland, where most people commute to work every day (Was surprised to see that myself the other day in a trafic report from Region Midt.), so it's not like the new motorway aren't used at all.


----------



## Wallaroo

To the foreigners in here: Maybe you can get away with posting maps of planned motorways in Denmark from the homesite of the Danish road administration. It would be nice to discuss the new projects from pictures in here.  
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/dokument.asp?page=document&objno=82253


----------



## Verso

Chriszwolle said:


> *Route 9 Odense - Svendborg - Spodsbjerg*


Pretty calm area. I like white signs.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

It's a pretty calm motorway, yes, but i think on holidays, it can be very busy, because when the nearby city of Odense goes on holiday for the weekends or vacations.

Meanwhile, i uploaded a video of the E45 in Aalborg, in the far north of Denmark.

*E45 Aalborg*


----------



## Wallaroo

Chriszwolle said:


> Meanwhile, i uploaded a video of the E45 in Aalborg, in the far north of Denmark.
> 
> *E45 Aalborg*


You might wanna know that they are talking about building a new motorway west around Ålborg, with a bridge over Limfjorden (the wide river you drove under). Apparently they think the current motorway through Ålborg is too overloaded.


----------



## Verso

Chriszwolle said:


> *E45 Aalborg*


Chris, you're really full of stuff. :cheers:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Verso said:


> Chris, you're really full of stuff. :cheers:


So far it's only a tip of the iceberg.

I have over 13.000 roadpics in 7 countries. And there is a lot more planned;

Poland, Slovakia, Czechia, Spain and Portugal next year if everything goes well. 

Although it's nothing compared to a guy i know in Switzerland, he has over 100.000 pics of roads, maybe you now him; Marcel Monterie. He has an extensive site about road numbering system of all the countries in the world.

Marcel Monterie Check on Index.


----------



## Verso

^ Yeah, I know the website, although I didn't know he had so many pix. Chris, I've forgotten what you study, anything related?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I am not studying anything right now. I work in a traffic & road consultancy.


----------



## Verso

Oh, I see. I was thinking of studying transport (when I'm done with the present study); it would cost me 8,000 €.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

€ 8.000 for the whole study? That's not very expensive... 4 years? That's like € 10 a day.


----------



## Verso

I know, I'm just used to free studying and spending money on other things.


----------



## mlm

A few quick snaps, from the 4 days old 14 km "Høgild - Brande" part of the "Midtjyske Motorvej" just south of Herning. The road was very wet today:


----------



## Wallaroo

mlm said:


> A few quick snaps, from the 4 days old 14 km "Høgild - Brande" part of the "Midtjyske Motorvej" just south of Herning. The road was very wet today:


Why are they using the same pavement in the middle as in the sides - there are usually just grass in there on danish motorways? What is that kind of pavement called, it looks like some kinda discount asphalt?


----------



## mlm

I'm sure it ain't "discount asphalt", but as I wrote, it was very wet, so that's why it looks pretty funny. As you can see on the first photo HERE it's looks like the same type as they use on most other new streches.

------------
EDIT: In the newspaper about the new motorway, there something about the asphalt. I'm no expert on that area, but you can read it yourself, it's on page 29: The newspaper
-------------

I'm not sure why there's no grass in the middle, or wheater that's good or bad, but I think it's the same on the Århus - Herning motorway, atleast the part closest to Herning, as you can see on this photo from last year (and again, wet road ):









And here another one, still the same "middle section":


----------



## Wallaroo

mlm said:


> I'm sure it ain't "discount asphalt", but as I wrote, it was very wet, so that's why it looks pretty funny. As you can see on the first photo HERE it's looks like the same type as they use on most other new streches.
> 
> ------------
> EDIT: In the newspaper about the new motorway, there something about the asphalt. I'm no expert on that area, but you can read it yourself, it's on page 29: The newspaper
> -------------
> 
> I'm not sure why there's no grass in the middle, or wheater that's good or bad, but I think it's the same on the Århus - Herning motorway, atleast the part closest to Herning, as you can see on this photo from last year (and again, wet road ):
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And here another one, still the same "middle section":


I was referring to the brown asphalt (or whatever it is) on the emergency shoulders and in the middle section, which I have only seen used in Denmark. Is *that* some kinda cheap asphalt, or what is it?


----------



## mlm

Wallaroo said:


> I was referring to the brown asphalt (or whatever it is) on the emergency shoulders and in the middle section, which I have only seen used in Denmark. Is *that* some kinda cheap asphalt, or what is it?


Oh sorry, misunderstood your question then. To be honest I have no idea what it is, or how good the quality is. But to me it doesn't looks that much different from what's on these photos of E45 (German border - Kolding), which also is much older (and has grass in the middle part):


----------



## Verso

^^ At first I thought it was gravel:


Verso said:


> The emergency lane looks pretty rough, is it gravel?


----------



## FREKI

Wallaroo said:


> I was referring to the brown asphalt (or whatever it is) on the emergency shoulders and in the middle section, which I have only seen used in Denmark. Is *that* some kinda cheap asphalt, or what is it?


As far as I know it's rough textured to shorten breaking distances in case of accidents... and ofcause to give of a different side when entering it compraed to the normal surfice ( same reason it's coloured brown )

Grass is slippery and imo not suited for high way speeds - having rough asphalt can save lifes - or limit accidents... hence worth every penny


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E39 Hirtshals - Hjørring - Aalborg*










Some pics from the E39, a quiet motorway from Hirtshals to Aalborg. I start from national road 35 at Hjørring, drive north to the Hirtshals roundabout, and turn to the south heading for Aalborg until interchange Vendsyssel with the E45 Frederikshavn - Århus.

*40 pics, Picasa webalbum*


----------



## mlm

Yes that is a quite quiet motorway. A little funny storey about this photo: Without being totally sure it's the exact spot, it could be the place where Jean Michel Jarre held his "Aero" concert in 2002, between the wind turbines, and in extremly heavy rain. 

EDIT: And while we're in the area, the bridge in this photo totally collapsed last year (or 2 years ago) while under construction, and one worker was killed. It's just north of the "Limfjordstunnelen" on E45.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Route 21: København - Roskilde - Holbæk*










Route 21 is one of the most important acces roads to Copenhagen. The road has 2x3 lanes until Fløng, and 2x2 lanes to Holbæk. The road also leads by world famous Roskilde. There are three interchanges; "Brøndby", "Vallensbæk" and "Taastrup".

*62 photo's of route 21*


----------



## mlm

/\ Damn, how long did you drive to get all these photos? 

About the Danish motorway network: We're not allowed to show maps from "Vejdirektoratet", so I've made my own map of the network. I might expand it in the near future, with city names and road numbers.

Orange = Todays motorways. 
Blue = Approved or under construction motorways.


----------



## LT1550

Great photos - very nice!


----------



## RKC

asphalt median also makes it very easy to divert traffic to the opposite lanes wherever needed. And i dont think its any worse, just for different use, allthough it probably is cheaper, than the lanes that are in constant use.
But colour is deffinetly not important in this sense, i think.


----------



## mlm

An updated version of my map of all the Danish motorways:


----------



## SmarterChild

^ Nice work.


----------



## Verso

Chris, you've totaly undressed Denmark. :lol:

Which country is flatter, Denmark or the Netherlands?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Verso said:


> Chris, you totaly undressed Denmark. :lol:
> 
> Which country is flatter, Denmark or the Netherlands?


Denmark isn't as flat as people think. Altitudes aren't high, but it's rolling hills all the time. Netherlands is really flat, Denmark isn't.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

General view from non-motorways;


----------



## Verso

It's interesting though that Denmark's tallest peak is lower than that of the Netherlands.


----------



## mlm

While we're at the maps, I've made one, with *possible* new parts. Some are more realistic than others, and the possible location of these roads are not decided, so it's just my guess of where they could be if build. These possible new ones are all RED:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Ring 5 seems to be the most needed to me. It can divert through traffic around the city of København. A second north-south motorvej on Jylland seems unnessesary to me. I know the part is full of trucks, but it will be much cheaper to widen the existing E45 to 2x3 lanes.


----------



## Wallaroo

Verso said:


> It's interesting though that Denmark's tallest peak is lower than that of the Netherlands.


172,54 meters to be excact. The air up there is so thin that I can hardly breathe! :lol:

I wonder if there are countries in Europe or in the world with a lower highest peak than Denmark?


----------



## mlm

@ Chriszwolle

There are plans to expand the E45 from Århus/Randers to Kolding to 6 lanes too, but I doubt that's enough on the long run (like some of the so called "experts" do). The Vejlefjord Bridge can be expanded to 6 lanes by removing the emergency lane, but no more than that. Building a new bridge, or expanding the excisting one further will be very hard. BTW, there have also been talk about a 3rd Lillebelt connection, though the Vejlefjord Bridge is the biggest problem at the moment. I'm not too sure about the 2nd connection down through Jutland either, and also doubt we'll see that in many years. The Holstebromotorway doesn't seem to be that needed either. Not too much trafic, though a lot of it are trucks. Some 2+1 ways could probably do the trick.

The planners have made a big mistake about the new Herning-Vejle motorway. It will be connected to E45 just north of Vejlefjorbroen, which is very stupid. They should have connected it south of Vejle instead, and still made it include the trafic from road 13 (from Viborg). That's some 20.000 extra cars a day thay will have to cross the bridge now, compared to if they had connected it south of Vejle.

The 3rd connection over "Limfjorden" (around Aaalborg) is also much needed, since there are many trafic jams.

There are also plans to expand the E20 over Funen between Lillebelt and Odense to 6 lanes. I didn't include expansions of excisting road on my map though.

I agree the biggest problem is in the Copenhagen area, and there has also been talk about a long harbourtunnel, to lead a lot of the trafic through, instad of through the city. They're currrently expanding "Ring 3" to 6 lanes, and E20 between Greve Syd-Hundige to 8 lanes and between Hundige-Ishøj to 10 lanes. They are also the 2 motorways with most trafic. Other parts needs to be expanded too though.


----------



## Wallaroo

mlm said:


> While we're at the maps, I've made one, with *possible* new parts. Some are more realistic than others, and the possible location of these roads are not decided, so it's just my guess of where they could be if build. These possible new ones are all RED:


Nice map! What would the total motorway length be if all these stretches are going to be build?

I dont like the idea of the Hærvejen motorway - better to expand the existing north-south with a couple of extra lanes. They should rather concentrate about getting the Kattegat bridge finished ASAP, and forget about that Fehmarn bridge crap.


----------



## mlm

Heh no idea, but it would surely be a lot longer than today.

If we can only have one big bridge in the next many years, I'll also much rather have the Kattegat Bridge, than the Fehmern Bridge. But hey, "We're soon rich enough to buy the whole world" so let's just build both right away.


----------



## Jeroen669

Verso said:


> It's interesting though that Denmark's tallest peak is lower than that of the Netherlands.


In Holland there are just a few areas with have quite some hills but around 90-95% is real flat. The city I live in is about the only city in Holland with real hills. The highest points are in the South of the province Limburg, sort of 'Dutch Ardennes'. Only up to 321 metres above sea level though.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Video: Route 161 Small little Belt Bridge >Middelfart - Fredericia<*

Another video! This time the extremely narrow Small Little Belt Bridge in Middelfart. Until the Little Belt bridge was completed, all traffic to the Fyn island had to cross this bridge, which contains 2 very narrow lanes & a double-track railwayline. Enjoy!


----------



## mlm

/\ It is indeed very narrow. Here's a panorama with it and the new one. The old narrow bridge is the one to the left, should anyone not know. Click for a larger version:



And a few ones of the new one:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I tried to make a panorama there too.



Click on it for it's original size.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20 Little Belt Bridge*

Another video, it doesn't stop 
This one is of the larger little belt bridge, still a lot smaller as the great belt bridge, but still impressive. It is the bridge as shown in the pano's above.


----------



## mlm

And while we're at it, here are two photos of their greather big brother some 60-70 km to the east:


----------



## mlm

A few photos from today of the new part of Road 18:

At exit Arnborg towards Herning:









At exit Brande towards Herning:









At exit Brande towards Brande. This is where this new parts ends for now. 









And finally a closer look at the road and it's equipment:


----------



## Verso

^^ The emergency lanes look like sand. Danish Desert?


----------



## mlm

/\ LOL surely not. But the sand you see next to the emergency lane will most like soon be grass. The road was opend less than 2 weeks ago.


----------



## FREKI

Verso said:


> Danish Desert?


Danish desert! 

















http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubjerg_Knude_Lighthouse


----------



## Rebasepoiss

Do you ever stop that propaganda ?


----------



## Verso

That's interesting, reminds me of Lithuania and Poland, but I didn't know Denmark had it as well! Must have sth to do with the Baltic Sea.


----------



## FREKI

^Most of Denmark's sand dunes are located in north western Jutland facing the North Sea

But we do have something even better facing the Baltic Sea - the Møns Klint located in eastern Zealand 












Rebasepoiss said:


> Do you ever stop that propaganda ?


Yes - for the right norminal fee!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Verso said:


> That's interesting, reminds me of Lithuania and Poland, but I didn't know Denmark had it as well! Must have sth to do with the Baltic Sea.


I guess it's kind of usual with flat coasts. Most of the Dutch coastline is littered with sand dunes up to 50m.


----------



## Maxx☢Power

Mr_Denmark said:


>


That would look awesome with a viaduct on top. The view from the car would be first class.


----------



## wyqtor

^^ Comparing photos of each, seems it looks a lot like the formations on the island of Rügen in Germany.


----------



## mlm

A tiny update, since ~2,5 km new motorway will open on monday. It's another part of the Road 18 in the middle of Jutland. It really wont be very usefull, until another part is ready next year, since it doesn't lead back to the old road (Only leads to a another new smaller road, to Billund airport). 

Updated version of my map:


----------



## x-type

are there any signs or rumours that danish motorways could get A numbers?


----------



## mlm

/\ Don't think so, I've never heard about it.

What good would A numbers do to Danish motorways?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

A-numbers can better show what kind of road you are travelling on. Now a Primærruten (if i spell correctly) can either be a motorway or an ordinary 1 lane road.


----------



## wyqtor

mlm said:


> A tiny update, since ~2,5 km new motorway will open on monday. It's another part of the Road 18 in the middle of Jutland. It really wont be very usefull, until another part is ready next year, since it doesn't lead back to the old road (Only leads to a another new smaller road, to Billund airport).


I hope they will call it "Lego Motorvejen"! 

I read somewhere that Legoland in Billund is the most popular tourist destination in Denmark after Copenhagen.


----------



## mlm

/\ I'm sure they wont, because the motorway is part of the "Midtjyske Motorvej" which will connect Herning and Vejle. It's true that the motorway ends where the new "Diagonalvejen" towards Billund starts, but next year the next motroway part opens, which will continue the motorway to Give (towards Herning).

Without being sure, I wouldn't be surprised if Legoland was the most popular tourist attraction outside copenhagen. 



Chriszwolle said:


> A-numbers can better show what kind of road you are travelling on. Now a Primærruten (if i spell correctly) can either be a motorway or an ordinary 1 lane road.


Ah, right. It's true that it's imporssible to know which roads are motorway and which are normal roads as it is now, if you only look at their numbers. Some kind new naming system for the motorways would be good. I don't think there are any plans for this though, but maybe it will come, since a bunch of the newest motorways are not E motorways.

One solution could be just to add an "M" in front of the numbers of the motorway parts, so for example M18 would be the part of Road 18 that is motorway. Another solution is of course to completely start over, and give all the motorways numbers from A0, A1, A2...or M0, M1, M2 and so on...


----------



## FREKI

I still can't get my mind around why there's no freeway from Holbæk to Kalundborg and Odden..

Eventhough we got the bridges linking Jutland to Zealand over Funen there still seems to be some traffic on that rute.. plenty of ferries there anyway...


----------



## kosimodo

Gr8 thread Chris... I know these roads so very well... Maybe i add some xtra info.. i am pretty good informed about those danish roads

And Mr Denmark: 


Mr_Denmark said:


> But we do have something even better facing the Baltic Sea - the Møns Klint located in eastern Zealand


Møns Klint is ofcourse located on Møn:cheers:


----------



## kosimodo

Chriszwolle said:


> Meanwhile, i uploaded a video of the E45 in Aalborg, in the far north of Denmark.
> *E45 Aalborg*


Should be mentioned that on this part the only 'leftside exit' exist on the Danish motorways...... It is located going to the north on the E39 just after the fork betweeen the E45 and E39. Exit nr 10 Højvejen - Thistedgrenen. Pretty exceptional. I shall see if i can take a pic of that soon. I live in Aalborg, so


----------



## FREKI

kosimodo said:


> And Mr Denmark:
> 
> Møns Klint is ofcourse located on Møn:cheers:


Right you are... but if Fanø is a part of Jutland then surely Møn must be a part of Zealand right?


----------



## mlm

/\ LOL, who has ever claimed that Fanø was part of Jutland?


----------



## FREKI

^Isn't it? 

Ofcause if we did into all the technical stuff it isn't, but on that scale Amager isn't Zealand and the top of Jutland is an independant island too.. 

Møn's Klint is of course on Møn first and foremost - but calling it Zealand isn't that far from the truth.. ( plus even fewer on the board would have an idea where Møn is compared to Zealand - so to help the understanding and all that  )

Okay okay.. but Fanø is still Jutland hmpf!


----------



## mlm

^To stay on the Fanø topic, I doubt you'll find many who consider it a as a part of Jutland. I've never heard anyone say that before. Just as I've never heard anyone call Møn a part of Zealand before. 

But anyway, back on track with the thread....


----------



## kosimodo

Exactly... as promised... (After visiting yesterday the 2 new motorway-stredges at Give and Brande...) 

The lefthand-side exit in Denmark... those are pretty rare this is Denmarks only 1:nuts:





































they r not thats sharp... but u get the picture


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Same location;

Left exit towards E39:









Whole E45 here


----------



## kosimodo

Duh, Chriszwolle does have a picture of the situation... Why rnt i suprised???


----------



## [email protected]

mlm said:


> An updated version of my map of all the Danish motorways:


Any news as to when the bridge/causeway between Denmark and Germany will be started? ( Rodby-Puttgarden )


----------



## SeanT

There are som new plans about a 5.th corridor next to CPH.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

What do you mean with a 5th corridor? Like a beltway?


----------



## SeanT

Sort of. It would start in Helsingør and end south near Køge. But no date and no final plans yet.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Is that really necessary? The motorways around København aren't that busy, and the current widening of E20/E45 Køge - København and a widening of the E45 in København should do the job imo.


----------



## SeanT

I think they are very buisy. Think M3 and near Greve-Hundige always trafficjams and this short 5km 4-5 lanes wouldn´t make that big of a diference.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

These are the traffic volumes in the capital city area. Not very shocking.


----------



## SeanT

...I don´t say shocking but when you have an average speed like 35 on a 3 laned highway then you get pissed, I´m sure you do not have these problems in The Netherlands because every major roads are 6-laned highways, so you do not have these problems.........hopefully


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Dutch traffic is far worse than in Denmark. I drove around Copenhagen during rushhours, and there were only minor delays, I didn't encounter traffic jams longer than 5km.


----------



## kosimodo

The danish motorways arent busy at all.... The E47 en E20 were a bit bit busier, but that 'problem' is almost solved. They both get 1 more lane.

'Rush' hour is mostly only a smal hour!!

I took some pics from the Køgbugtmotorvejen E20 just after the opening of the new lane.. And here they are.

1) 4 lanes now...









2) Not busy.....









3)









4) 5 lanes... close to the exit to Ring 4









5) another 5 lanes









Looks good doesnt it!!

Driving in Copenhagencentre it is perfect.. One off the most car friendly places i know... big 4 or more lane roads crossing the center and hardly any traffic jams Only parking has become pricy the last years...


----------



## Timon91

How long is that 2×4 section?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

All the way from Køge to the E20-E47 near Greve?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Anyway, I drove nearly all Danish motorways. I need to do another roadtrip somewhere April/May next year, need to drive some Sjælland and Southern Sweden. :cheers:


----------



## kosimodo

ChrisZwolle said:


> All the way from Køge to the E20-E47 near Greve?


Nej!

It is only beside Greve, 2 or 3 exits.... Maybe from 29 Greve S to #Ishøj, I have 2 check.. 

But i am living in Aalborg, it is not around the corner.. 

Maybe with the christmasparty from work (YEP! Christmas is coming...)


----------



## SeanT

Between Hundige-Greve S.


----------



## kosimodo

with Hundige, u mean motorvejskryds (#) Ishøj....

But nice visualisation!! thx!


----------



## staff

The red part of Kögemotorvejen is the 5x2 lane stretch, and the blue part south of it is planned to be upgraded to 4x2. So basically all of Kögemotorvejen will be at least 4x2 in the future.


----------



## RoadUser

SeanT said:


> Between Hundige-Greve S.


Does that road really have three numbers at that point?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Yeah, but E55 is completely unnecessary in my opinion, it runs concurrent nearly all the way through Danish territory. They should've made the northern terminus of E55 near Rostock.


----------



## Morsue

But there was a thought behind it. The E55 was supposed to continue into Sweden and follow the route currently occupied by the E4. The E4 is 1,590 kilometres (990 miles) long inside Sweden but since the prolonging of the E8 on Finnish territory it's only about 800 metres (0,5 miles) there. Hence, the E55 in Denmark is an anachronism.


----------



## Wallaroo

They are planning on building a whole new 200 km long motorway down through central Jutland. Its considered a better alternative than expanding the existing motorway in eastern Jutland.


----------



## SeanT

They start the construction of the bridge next year.


----------



## SeanT

hh


----------



## SeanT

[1500 Kms of motorways in the DK now.


----------



## pmaciej7

I don't know if someone posted information, that almost all motorways in Denmark have common exit numbering. It goes like this (red - motorways out of system):


----------



## ChrisZwolle

They have that in France too. I don't really see the advantage of that system.


----------



## H123Laci

^^ yeah.

here in hungary we have distance based exit numbering...
sequential numbering has no sence...


----------



## Timon91

We have sequential in the Netherlands. It makes sense, but if you make a new exit somewhere between two others, you'd have to renumber all exits, so they give it a prefix 'a' or sth. Distance based would be better, but not in urban areas, where two exits are more likely to be within one kilometre.


----------



## H123Laci

^^well, you can use alfabets in distance-based numbering too... 

eg. 11, 11A, 12...

a "little" overview...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exit_numbers


----------



## Dan

I prefer exits by distance, personally.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ Me too.


----------



## Timon91

It's also a good way to indicate how far you still have to drive. If you drive from exit 19 to exit 26 on the A27, it seems to be a small distance, but it is about 40 kms in reality.


----------



## Tom 958

Then there's the loop around downtown Kansas City MO. Each exit in the freeway loop is numbered 2 and suffixed with every letter of the alphabet except I, O and Z (which would look like 1, 0 and 2 on the exit signs).

Map showing all the exit 2's


----------



## Dan

Hahaha that's hilarious.


----------



## Timon91

That's funny. Why would they do that?


----------



## Tom 958

Timon91 said:


> That's funny. Why would they do that?


To avoid confusion, of course. :nuts:


----------



## Timon91

Of course, that's very logic :clown:


----------



## SeanT

:dunnoA big bridge. Is it necessery between Germany and East Denmark?:dunno:


----------



## SeanT

ok, maybe a yes ...It´s going to be an increasing traffic on sealand, when a new port to Germany will be opened. I think the danish goverment has to change it´s policy about "not existing" roadprising in DK.


----------



## SeanT

This is a part of the resently widened part of motorway near Ishøj.

http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/3942/billede033tq3.jpg :banana:


----------



## SeanT

:banana:http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/7747/billede028ux4.jpg


----------



## SeanT

http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/3139/70271551eo8.png[/url]

Section Hundige-Greve


----------



## SeanT

This picture is taken near Solrød N


----------



## kosimodo

^^ It seems like u just missed the pnew widend parts... they look like this as i posted earlier...



kosimodo said:


> I took some pics from the Køgbugtmotorvejen E20 just after the opening of the new lane.. And here they are.
> 
> 1) 4 lanes now...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2) Not busy.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 3)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 4) 5 lanes... close to the exit to Ring 4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 5) another 5 lanes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks good doesnt it!!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Are they gonna pave a shoulder?


----------



## ElviS77

Danish main roads have truly changed since the 80s: When I was a kid on holiday there circa 1983, they were decent enough 2-lane highways with motorway bypasses around the major urban areas. Even when I was bicycling around the country in the early 90s, many important motorway links did not exist (and bicycling along these busy main roads was anything but fun, even with the extensive bike path network) and Copenhagen was still isolated on an island...


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Danish primærruten are quite enjoyable to drive. Most of them are not busy at all and travel through nice rural landscapes with low hills. 

Over a year, I went to Denmark twice, on the first trip in september 2007 I drove mostly motorways, like the entire E20, E45 and E39. The second trip was in May 2008 and was a 4-day roadtrip across Jutland, mostly across the western coast with Primærruten and Sekundærruten.  Now I need to get to København and the island of Sjælland since I didn't drive that much there (only one day).


----------



## SeanT

ElviS77 said:


> Danish main roads have truly changed since the 80s: When I was a kid on holiday there circa 1983, they were decent enough 2-lane highways with motorway bypasses around the major urban areas. Even when I was bicycling around the country in the early 90s, many important motorway links did not exist (and bicycling along these busy main roads was anything but fun, even with the extensive bike path network) and Copenhagen was still isolated on an island...


 You remember wrong. It is only some part of Copenhagen which is an island ( Amager ) the rest of it is on Sjælland


----------



## Verso

And what is Sjælland, if not an island?


----------



## SeanT

ok....a bigger one.
:lol:


----------



## ElviS77

SeanT said:


> ok....a bigger one.
> :lol:


Yup, I arrived on Sjælland by boat from Oslo and left it by boat to either Fyn or Jylland... Those were the days...


----------



## SeanT

Holbæk-motorway will be widened from 4 to 8 lanes between Fløng and Roskilde vest.


----------



## SeanT

There will be constructed an expressway from Tuse-north ( where Holbæk-motorway ends )to Vig-north, starting in 2009. Expected opening in 2013.:cheers:


----------



## SeanT

This motorway is under construction near vestskoven with 6 lanes. Ring-way 3 will be connected with Frederiksund-motorway. Opening in 2013.


----------



## SeanT

Same section.:nuts:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

SeanT said:


> Holbæk-motorway will be widened from 4 to 8 lanes between Fløng and Roskilde vest.


I've driven that Motorvej once. It was busy until Roskilde (slow) and quiet after Roskilde.


----------



## SeanT

Yes Chris, and that´s why the motorway ends near Holbæk (Tuse).
That´s why an expressway is enough for now up to Vig .


----------



## Dan

Why are there no EU plates in Denmark? Online I've seen them but I've never seen a single car in Denmark with one.

Seems silly, since you have to identify the country of your car you're then forced to have lots of DK stickers.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ I haven't seen a real life Danish car with EU plates too. Belgium also doesn't have them. Quite a shame.


----------



## RipleyLV

^^ Belgium has EU plates.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Problem is in Belgium the plates belong to the owner, not the car, so it takes a while before all plates are replaced with new ones. Some Belgians drive with extremely old plates.


----------



## mlm

ChrisZwolle said:


> Back to the Herningmotorvejen; any chance it will be extended to the west coast of Jylland?


/\ Oh okay, thanks. 

There's no way Herningmotorvejen will be extended to the west coast, not in many many years atleast, since there's absolutely no need for it. The westcoast, above Esbjerg, has a very low population desity with Ringkøbing as the biggest town with only some ~9600 inhabitants or so. And there's no big harbour either. In the summertime there can be some trafic, related to many tourists, but nothing that would justify a motorway. They might build some 1+2 parts some time in the future, since there are quite some big heavy transportations with windmills etc, but that's should also do the trick.

Also as written, the Herningmotorway doesn't have that much trafic either, probably some 20-25.000 (daily average) at most closest to Herning and Århus (and expected for the Silkeborg part too). The old Rute 15 was very bad though, so that, the regional development factor and local lobbying is probably why they decided to make it motorway all the way.

Today through Silkeborg there is daily jams because of the bad road, so it will be great when the last parts opens in 2016.


----------



## mlm

Latest version of my Danish Motorway map. The update since last version is that a few of the smaller UC parts have been completed (parts of Rute 18, most eastern part of Rute 15 abobe Århus, southern part of Rute 9 and nothern part of 21). I've also added the new Frederikssund Motorvejen (211) which seems very likely to be finally approved very soon, just like the last parts of Rute 15 and 18. (= last unapproved parts of Herning Motorvejen, the Silkeborg part, and of Midtjyske Motorvej). These two last ones were just a matter of time since the rest of the streches are already completed or UC.

The map. There could be a few things that needs to be corrected in the CPH area:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Why is route 18 connected north of Vejle to E45 and not south of it? Vejlebroen is already quite busy. 

By the way, Route 9 extends somewhat north of E20 near Odense. But it's very short.


----------



## Timon91

Nice map mlm :cheers:

Actually I've seen most main routes in Denmark. I mean, I've seen the entire north-south axis (Flensburg-Hirsthals) and a big part of the east-west axis (apart from the Esjberg-Kolding section), most motorways around Aarhus and Copenhagen, and the motorway from Copenhagen to the Puttgarden ferry. But there are still enough motorways left to explore 

Sorry, I didn't make pics. I was in Denmark on holiday in Denmark in 2002, I was only 10 years old, and the last time was in 2005, sitting in the back of a bus :lol:


----------



## mlm

/\ Thanks. 



ChrisZwolle said:


> Why is route 18 connected north of Vejle to E45 and not south of it? Vejlebroen is already quite busy.
> 
> By the way, Route 9 extends somewhat north of E20 near Odense. But it's very short.


True with Rute 9, I added a tiny part north of E20.

Why Rute 18 won't be connected south of Vejlefjord Broen is a mystery to many. It would indeed make much more sence, since the bridge is already quite congested, and it will be even worse in the future. It will be expanded to 3x2 lanes, but nothing more seems possible. The reasons I've heard is that a southern connection would be much more expensive, since there's quite a lot of hills in the area just west of Vejle. But in the long run it would probably still be cheaper, since the bridge would be able to handle the trafic for much longer time with the ~20.000 less cars each day.


----------



## SeanT

I took some pictures on last sunday on my way to work near my town.


----------



## jpeter

Can somebody post me a picture from Speed Limits in Denmark? Thanks


----------



## mlm

/\ Not allowed to used their maps here in ssc, but you can see the motorway speed limits HERE. Yellow = 130 km/h - Blue = 110 km/h or less.

The map is a little outdated though.


----------



## ElviS77

mlm said:


> /\ Not allowed to used their maps here in ssc, but you can see the motorway speed limits HERE. Yellow = 130 km/h - Blue = 110 km/h or less.
> 
> The map is a little outdated though.


It's actually so outdated the page wouldn't show...


----------



## mlm

/\ Seems lile most pages on www.trafikken.dk gives a 404 error right now. I'm sure it will be up soon again...


----------



## SeanT

It is very stupid that they don´t use "inteligent" roadsigns. In rushhour wouldn´t matter if it was 110Km/h but in the evening it is crazy near Copenhagen with 8 lines (or 10) and you are totally alone on the road and the speed limit is still 110
hno:


----------



## Timon91

You mean overhead signs that adjust the speed limit to the amount of traffic? There is a sign in the Netherlands, when entering the southern part of the A10 and coming from Utrecht (A2). No matter how fast you're going, the signs will always say "U gaat te snel" (You're going too fast). Yes, even in the traffic jams! :lol:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

110 in heavily urbanized area's seems okay to me. Noise pollution can be a problem. I agree it might look a bit slow, but you have to think of the people living near the motorvej.


----------



## LtBk

At least its better than 90km/h like most US urban freeways.


----------



## Dan

Or 70 here!


----------



## FREKI

jpeter said:


> Can somebody post me a picture from Speed Limits in Denmark? Thanks














SeanT said:


> It is very stupid that they don´t use "inteligent" roadsigns. In rushhour wouldn´t matter if it was 110Km/h but in the evening it is crazy near Copenhagen with 8 lines (or 10) and you are totally alone on the road and the speed limit is still 110
> hno:


I fully agree, due to family in the Køge area I often find myself driving back home at night and when there's no cars and 5 lanes of new tarmac and even a fully lit freeway I does feel stupid to only drive 110 ( not that I do that anyways  )

130 would make a lot more sense at night on the "Køge motorvej" and maybe 120 on evernings and between rushhours..


----------



## SeanT

ChrisZwolle said:


> 110 in heavily urbanized area's seems okay to me. Noise pollution can be a problem. I agree it might look a bit slow, but you have to think of the people living near the motorvej.


 What I´m talking about is for example a section between Køge and Ishøj.This section is not an urban motorway as you know. If you take M3 than I´m totally agree with you. Major part of this section goes through urban area.


----------



## SeanT

I´ve just recived a nice picture of me and (my car). I was driving a little too fast in an urban area (50Km). My speed was 58Km.
The ticket I have to pay is € 66.66 (DKK500). I´m lucky I think.
The same would have cost me about € 233 if it would have been in Sweden, my friend told me. He is from Sweden.


----------



## Dan

183 euros (2000 sek) is the largest fine you can in Sweden I do believe, and that's for speeding a lot more than 8km. It would be a lot more than 500 dkk though.


----------



## PLH

SeanT said:


> I´m lucky I think.


Lucky? These fines are sick. hno:


----------



## FREKI

PLH said:


> Lucky? These fines are sick. hno:


Not really, the wages up here are quite high and to be honest 500 DKK is IMO too low to make people be concerned about it when in a hurry.. after all there are lifes at stake

This is why they made a system where you have a number of points connected to your license and if you do serious violations you lose them and can end up having to retake your driver licences or be completely banned from driving..


As much as I personally dissagree with much of the speedlimits here the fines suit me just fine as there are way too many bad and old ( and female  ) drivers out there and I don't want them going faser as they can't even drive properly at the current speeds..


And being cought at 8km/h too fast is lucky based on the speeds most drive with around here 


Never gotten a speeding fine myself... yet...


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Still, 500 DKK for only 8 km/h too fast is a bit over the top. People really won't chance their driving habits because they just drove a tad too fast.


----------



## Morsue

Dan1113 said:


> 183 euros (2000 sek) is the largest fine you can in Sweden I do believe, and that's for speeding a lot more than 8km. It would be a lot more than 500 dkk though.


That was raised a few years ago. Nowadays 2000 SEK is the lowest available fine (1-10 kph over the limit, although not enforced below 5 kph), and 4000 is the maximum.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ I can only say one thing; "Greedy government".

A fine of € 180 for 10 km/h too fast is in no correlation to the increased danger level.


----------



## Dan

I don't think I have anything against it, personally. We know the law and by speeding we're consciously breaking it. We know the consequences if we get caught. Better making money this way than by raising taxes overall I think... plus I'm sure it does keep a lot of people from speeding, which is indeed good for safety. The higher it is, the less likely people will speed -- which is the point of fines anyway. 500 SEK or something and a lot of people wouldn't think twice, it'd be a risk worth taking. 4000 SEK...maybe not so much.


----------



## LtBk

There are worse things out there on roads than speeding. Cops catching speeders for money rather than safety is rather stupid IMO instead of catching people for other violations.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Dan1113 said:


> I don't think I have anything against it, personally. We know the law and by speeding we're consciously breaking it.


It depends on the situation. An extreme amount of Dutch roads has a Vmax of 10 - 20 km/h too low. That encourages speeding much more than if there were a reasonable speed limit.

As for Denmark; most speed limits I've seen were reasonable. I've been on quite some roads in Denmark and can't remember having a feeling of "man this speed limit is low". I have that in the Netherlands nearly all the time except on the 120km/h motorways.


----------



## pijanec

The problem is that majority of people see just one traffic violation, e.g. speed limit. They couldn't care less about other rules as no one will punish them. As long as your speed limit is right you can do whatever you want in your car.

Central and Western European countries has reasonable speeding fines I would say as fines must reflect the danger driver is representing. Luckily, European parliament in wednesday adopted new directive. One of its important point is that fines across EU will be harmonized over time with which they want to prevent unreasonable fines that now can be seen at some countries.


----------



## FREKI

ChrisZwolle said:


> Still, 500 DKK for only 8 km/h too fast is a bit over the top. People really won't chance their driving habits because they just drove a tad too fast.


When you speed you know what you are doing and to me 500 DKK is almost a too small fine here.. 

0 to 20% above the limit triggers the 500DKK and while the fines increase rapidly you have to drive more than 40% too fast before it triggers something serious and usually it takes 70% too much before you have to retake the driver license test..

This means that you can drive up to 180km/h on the freeway as long long as you are willing to pay 1.500 DKK if cought with no other real risk


So sure paying 500 for a small violation is irritating but based on how much such is done and how few is fined it's not bad if you ask me..



ChrisZwolle said:


> I can only say one thing; "Greedy government".
> 
> A fine of € 180 for 10 km/h too fast is in no correlation to the increased danger level.


The idea of fines only work if the fines themself is feared and here in Denmark where 500 DKK is the minimum fine ( you'd get the same if parking illegally ) they aren't feared so people speed way too much..

Reaction time and brake distance is heavily affected even with only 10km/h









The difference between going 80 and 90 f.ex is that where you could have stopped at 80 you will pass with 48km/h if going 90km/h....


----------



## kosimodo

Hmmm, 
i was caught on the danish motorway 200 (!) meters before they end the 110 zone... 

Ofcourse they stopped me after the 130 sign to tell me that i am not allowed to drive 130

Was so stupid after almost 30km being carefull not speeding.. i knew they sign was there.. so i was speeding up. I mean 200 meters with 120 km/h, that is not even 10 seconds.... 
Steeling peoples money that is!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

End of the year. Police need to reach their targets...


----------



## FREKI

kosimodo said:


> Hmmm,
> i was caught on the danish motorway 200 (!) meters before they end the 110 zone...
> 
> Ofcourse they stopped me after the 130 sign to tell me that i am not allowed to drive 130
> 
> Was so stupid after almost 30km being carefull not speeding.. i knew they sign was there.. so i was speeding up. I mean 200 meters with 120 km/h, that is not even 10 seconds....
> Steeling peoples money that is!


Usually they only stop people driving at risky speeds or dangerously, so while they may have been borred or dumb or whatever are you sure you didn't drive a little bit faster and was just fined at the lower level as they usually do 

( why SeanT was only fines for 58 and 60 would have been twice the fine 500 vs 1000 ) 


Never been stopped or fined myself, but I usually only drive 10 over on free ways unless I'm overtalking and blocking for someone even faster


----------



## Robosteve

pijanec said:


> The problem is that majority of people see just one traffic violation, e.g. speed limit. They couldn't care less about other rules as no one will punish them. As long as your speed limit is right you can do whatever you want in your car.


I agree with this. There's a slogan the government keeps promoting around here that says "Safe speeding. There's no such thing." There's some, though much less, emphasis on driver fatigue and mobile phone use, and almost nothing on keeping sufficient space to the vehicle in front, which is probably one of the biggest problems on the roads here.

The really stupid thing about this particular slogan is that in a state where the maximum speed limit is 110 km/h, but there exist some high standard motorways, there really is such thing as safe speeding.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20 Esbjerg - Kolding*

A drive on the E20 in Denmark. The E20 is Denmarks principal (and only) east-west route. 

1. Entering E20 in Esbjerg, a coastal city on the west coast of Jutland.









2. First distance sign. Another Esbjerg exit is next.









3. There ain't much traffic on this part of E20.









4. Nearing the Esbjerg-North exit.









5. Esbjerg also has a small airport.









6. Typical Danish merging sign.









7. Ribe exits not far ahead. Nice town to visit on the way to the north.









8. Korskro exit ahead.









9. Ribe and Varde exit too.









10. At the exit.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

11. I find Kolding a bit too few to sign, they could sign Odense too, but it's a Danish habit to only sign one control city.









12. Ah now we're talking. Additional distance signage.









13. Bramming exit ahead.









14. It's a relaxing drive with this amount of traffic.









15. Kolding is about a half an hour driving.









16. Gørding exit ahead.









17. Note that this motorvej doesn't have patched-up tracks on the right lane. A lot of Danish motorways do have that.









18. Getting closer to Kolding city.









19. Rest area with a bathroom for the disabled.









20. Holsted exit in this fairly wooded area.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

21. Billund. I guess some of you know what that means ---->>> LEGOLAND!









22. Pavement change.









23. Closing in on Kolding.









24. Brørup exit is next.









25. Bække also exits here.









26. Fifteen minutes to Kolding.









27. Vejen exit ahead. Vejen can be translated as "roads"?









28. Simple, yet clear signs.









29. Besides that one sign, Kolding is the only city signed along the road.









30. Did they place this sign twice by accident?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

31. Lunderskov exit.









32. This is the last exit before the E45 interchange.









33. Why do so many license plates start with an "Y"?









34. Approaching Kolding.









35. Another double exit sign.









36. The Kolding-Vest Interchange with the E45 motorvej.









37. While Hamburg is still far away, they might consider signing it here.









38. At the interchange which is also an exit for Kolding-Vest.









39. See?


----------



## SeanT

This"Y" letter means at we are running out for letters. We soon start all over again with a possibility for choosing EU licenceplates.:banana::banana:


----------



## mlm

Thanks for the pics. 

To answer your questions...



ChrisZwolle said:


> 27. Vejen exit ahead. Vejen can be translated as "roads"?


Almost, the correct translation would be "the road".




ChrisZwolle said:


> 33. Why do so many license plates start with an "Y"?


Because the license plates started with AA xx xxx back long ago, and go upwards. Today we have reached Zx xx xxx, so cars that starts with Y or Z are rather new. When the last zz xx xxx plates is made, we start with EU plates, and the numbers will no longer be in order, meaning old "unused" numbers will be used. Then you will see new cars with for example DT xx xxx or PF xx xxx or whatever.


----------



## SeanT

Danish motorways with "names".


----------



## LtBk

Why do many motorways in DK look kinda of crappy?


----------



## kosimodo

^^ Thats the camera!

It doesnt look crappy at allhno:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

He has a point though, you'll see many "tracks" filled up with a different kind of asphalt in DK.


----------



## kosimodo

^^Yup, but it isnt crappy at all

The only pic i could find on this page was this.. That isnt crappy. Quality standard is pretty high!


----------



## Maxx☢Power

Also, the asphalt when you get further north tends to be more rough because of or in order to handle the climate. Not that DK has a harsh climate at all though, which makes it a little weird.


----------



## mlm

^^ It's true that many parts have/had quite rundown asphalt but the simple reason is that that many streches hasn't been repaved in many years. A large renewel of the asphalt on most of the important motorways has been started though, and is currently ongoing in many places like on E45, E20 and others.


----------



## Red-Lion

I for one think that Danish roads are some of the nicest there are, at least those with a bit of scenery. Flat scenery, awesome houses, a lot of windturbines! Too bad the danish motorway system is so good! I can't imagine what the Danish are gonna built next? Well I guess Hel-Hel and Femern strait bridges should be built. Perhaps even a bridge from Langeland to Lolland. 

Norway should pay for a bridge from Norway to Denmark, and the Danes should build it! Don't think it's feasible to build a bridge over skagerrak tho!


----------



## IceCheese

Red-Lion said:


> Norway should pay for a bridge from Norway to Denmark, and the Danes should build it! Don't think it's feasible to build a bridge over skagerrak tho!


Lol, reminds me of some not so serious posts I made in the N&B-section:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=305743&page=52


----------



## ADP

Here is my picture from Midtjyske Motorvej near Herning and Fynske Motorvej near Odense with Svendborgmotorvejen.

http://img200.imageshack.us/i/svendborgmotorvej.jpg/


----------



## SeanT

The current motorwaynet in Denmark.


----------



## SeanT

Roadsigns on motorways in DK.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

From that motorvej publication? I have a couple of them here.


----------



## kosimodo

SeanT said:


> The current motorwaynet in Denmark.


In addition to that, there is a part around Give 
And the part towards Svendborg is extended. The latest part is allready done.. You are guided over one lane towards the city of Svendborg. So this part wil be finished soon. I had a look overthere last tuesday( i do come around, despite what other people think..) and they were very busy If finished i will take some pics


----------



## SuperSergei

ChrisZwolle said:


> From that motorvej publication? I have a couple of them here.


Hehe, me to! Bring one home every year


----------



## kosimodo

There is a new one... 2009/2010

It is lying in front of me


----------



## kosimodo

And if there are some roadsignnerds here.. i think i have some digital from road 15 and 9. I am willing to search if...


----------



## Timoth12

Are there some updates of the Copenhagen Harbor tunnel project? This could be another masterpiece of the capital area.


----------



## Danielk2

Copenhagen and their masterpieces. They should give some money to the ones from Jutland. e.g. in Aalborg, every singly afternoon there's a horrible congestion (only 2km long) north of Limfjordstunnelen, because those politicians don't want to spend money on a third lane (there is a third lane southbound, but not northbound) This extra lane for 1,8km will cost 70.000.000 DKK (9,4 mill. €)!


----------



## kosimodo

Some pics...

Vejlefjordbro, 1712 meter long, 51 meter high.




























Bonus:
And visible from the bridge is this building... there are coming 2 more waves


----------



## Red-Lion

I'm a bit surprised to see the low number of traffic lighting in Denmark. But I guess with proper lights on the car, this should be no problem.


----------



## kosimodo

^^ eh....?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I guess he means lighting poles, like in Belgium.


----------



## Timoth12

Danielk2 said:


> Copenhagen and their masterpieces. They should give some money to the ones from Jutland. e.g. in Aalborg, every singly afternoon there's a horrible congestion (only 2km long) north of Limfjordstunnelen, because those politicians don't want to spend money on a third lane (there is a third lane southbound, but not northbound) This extra lane for 1,8km will cost 70.000.000 DKK (9,4 mill. €)!


The price is really good, in Slovakia D1 widening from Bratislava to Trnava will cost 36,5 mil. eur /1,1 bil. SKK/ for 36 km. Anyway, it is adding an extra lane in both directions. Btw, Limfjordstunnelen has 3+3 lanes, well planned forseeing the increasing traffic volume.


----------



## kosimodo

^^ yup! 

But when just after the tunnel the motorway leads to two lanes you still have a botleneck. 

Another problem is the roadcoming from the center just before the tunnel. The max speedlimit is due to a sharp curve 70 and waves together with the E45 from left. The slow traffic hits the fast traffic and that creates a lot of problems.

Basicly the tunnel could do for years, but there is no alternative. 

My idea is just to make some modifications on the north side towards The E47 crossing and create an extra bridge south at the tunnel so that traffic doesnt come into the motorway from the left side. Maybe the should close the northgoing curve and lead all traffic over an expanded road at exit 24.


----------



## Danielk2

The reason why they can't make some major roadwork is that it would kill Aalborgs economy. It would be like closing the Berliner Ring (of course at a much lower scale, but the idea's the same) It would fill all of Aalborg C with cars waiting in long lines every morning and afternoon. It would increase air pollution in Aalborg (which is extremely high as it is) and it would block all traffic in and out of Aalborg stopping the supplys of critical goods such as food. And nobody wants all that noise. (I already think there are too many cars in Aalborg)


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Well, let's face it, traffic volumes are not very high on E45... 60.900 max in the Limfjordtunnel, and only 45.000 south of it. That shouldn't be to big a problem on 2x2. In the Netherlands we have up to 115.000 on 2x2.


----------



## Danielk2

It isn't the 2x2 that's the big problem, it's the 2 lanes merging onto the E45 at before the Limfjordstunnel, they are driving 70 km/h and the ones on E45 are driving 90 km/h!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I made a video of this tunnel and surroundings back in 2007...


----------



## kosimodo

^^ and in a traffic jam!! 

But rush peek hours are 'huge' here in aalborg. It means that there is no traffic in the nights at all.. Normal during the day and huges in the rush hour.. Which leeds to a total collaps of traffic. With the unlucky traffic sollution south of the tunnel it will forever be a problem


----------



## Danielk2

Unlucky solution? it's the worst solution imaginable. They should rather move exit 23 to within the tunnel (don't know if that's possible) it'll cost a least 10 million €, but it's all worth it.


----------



## mlm

ChrisZwolle said:


> Well, let's face it, traffic volumes are not very high on E45... 60.900 max in the Limfjordtunnel, and only 45.000 south of it. That shouldn't be to big a problem on 2x2. In the Netherlands we have up to 115.000 on 2x2.


You might have 115.000 on 2x2 roads in the Netherlands but that surely also create big problems. I've seen many of your posts about huge jams in your country, doesn't really seem like a "good example" to follow if you ask me...that being said without any knowledge of that exact 2x2 road you're talking about.

Ideally there should never be big jams, but of course it can't be solved alone just be keep widening the roads.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ Sure, but it shows 60.000 is not really the upper limit for 2x2. You can go to 70 - 80 k without much problems.. 

But these problems seem to be of a different kind, not really the roadway capacity alone.


----------



## mlm

^^ There's also ~60.000 on the Vejlefjord Bridge futher south on E45, and that part often has jams too. It has (more or less) been decided to widen that to 3x2 though, both north, south and on the bridge itself. IMO the faster they start recontruction work the better. The longer they wait, the harder it will be during construction phase.

But yes, the "Aalborg problem" is not just a case of how many lanes there are.


----------



## kosimodo

115.000 or 60.000 doesnt say so much when the peak is f.e higher in the 60.000.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The hourly capacity in one direction (2 lanes) is about 4.000 - 4.500, but traffic composition is also a factor. More trucks means less capacity.


----------



## Danielk2

The big problem in Aalborg is crossing the Limfjord. There are 3 connections: 
1 road bridge (Limfjordstunnelen) 1 rail bridge (Unnamed) and 1 motorway tunnel (Limfjordstunnelen). If there's an accident or breakdown on the bridge or in the tunnel (which occurs quite often), crossing the Limfjord is impossible. The traffic jams may only be 3km long, but the traffic density is very high, and the speed is very low (50-70 km/h).


----------



## ADP

Yes there is a lot of traffic in Limfjordstunnel in Aalborg.

But the danish goverment and the Danish Road Directorate has suggest the 3 Limfjordforbindelse over the island Egholm and around Aalborg Airport to Hirtshalsmotorvejen E39 (Hirtshals Motorway)


----------



## Danielk2

Sad thing the 3rd Limfjord connection is going to be over Egholm, the only piece of nature in the area. If is has to be over Egholm, it would be great if the made a rest area or an exit, so you could get to Egholm without using the ferry.


----------



## ADP

Yes but is not sure.
People on Egholm and some of them in Aalborg will not have a motorway cross the island.
So the danish goverment and the Danish Road Directorate lies a 2 line.

Egholmline ( Cross Egholm)

Lindholmline ( Around Egholm)


----------



## Danielk2

I don't think people in Nørresundby would get happy if they made another motorway there. They already have major congestion problems and properties in Nørre Uttrup are already worthless, because of E39, E45, and in the future, The 3rd Limfjord connection hno:


----------



## Red-Lion

I think the traffic through the Limfjord tunnel is varying because of ferries from Norway arriving in Hirtshals and Fredrikshavn. At least it's always clogged when I'm driving there 

I do love the square profile of the tunnel though! Not often you see that.


----------



## Danielk2

There is a lot of ferry traffic from Norway and Sweden, but i don't think it's the ferry traffic that's making the problem, it's the frequent lane closures, the slow traffic from exit 23 and the 3-2 lane merge 500m after the tunnel.


----------



## Danielk2

E45 - Frederikshavnmotorvejen - the motorway from frederikshavn to Interchange Vendsyssel








E45 - Nordjyske Motorvej - the motorway from Interchange Vendsyssel to exit 28


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Route 21 København - Holbæk*

Some pics of freeway 21 from København westbound.

route:









1. 









2. Heading for Roskilde.









3. 









4. Exit 2.









5. busy traffic - rushhour.









6. travel times.









7. Exit 3.









8. Interchange with O4









9. distances.









10. This was a short concurrency with O4.









11. 









12. Exit 6.









13. Traffic jam @ Fløng.









14. Exit 9.









15. Exit Roskilde-East.









16. Photographic against the late september sun...









17. Exit 13.









18. 









19. 









20. Traffic volumes drop significantly after Roskilde.









21. 









22. 









23. Exit 17.









24. Holbæk-East.









25. my exit.









26.


----------



## kosimodo

Nice.. The route i know so well!

Hope you did take the ferry to Ebeltoft or Århus. It is a nice ride


----------



## SeanT

kosimodo said:


> Nice.. The route i know so well!
> 
> Hope you did take the ferry to Ebeltoft or Århus. It is a nice ride


 I took it but from Kalundborg to Århus. It took 2h 45 minuttes with the ferry. I could immagine a new bridge around here some place.:lol:


----------



## kosimodo

2 pics of the Vejlefjord bridge where the 2 Lanes did get extended to 3 smaller ones.. the right lanes is used for local traffic and as extended exitlane

1









2


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Nice. The Vejle Bridge is one of the most overloaded sections of Motorvej outside the Copenhagen area. Always full of trucks.


----------



## ADP

Yes the Vejle Bridge is very traffic, but the Danish government has build a new lane on the bridge. And in 2013 the Midtjyske Motorvej is finished with a new Motorvejskryds (Interchange) Vejle, so that the traffic from Herning to Vejle goes across Vejle Bridge in 2013.


----------



## Gareth

I really dont like Denmark's exit numbering style. It looks too much like a route numbering system to me.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I agree, it confused me the first time too... They could use the exit symbol.


----------



## kosimodo

^^ 'The' exit symbol Chris?? 

Help me out with that one!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

This symbol:


----------



## Danielk2

I'm going on a trip to Bornholm next week through Jutland, Funen, Zealand and of course Skåne. I'll try to get some pics. Gonna be the first time i take roadpics, any advice?


----------



## kosimodo

Keep ur eyes on the road!!


----------



## Danielk2

kosimodo said:


> Keep ur eyes on the road!!


 Jeg er jo ikke dum, Mister


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Danielk2 said:


> I'm going on a trip to Bornholm next week through Jutland, Funen, Zealand and of course Skåne. I'll try to get some pics. Gonna be the first time i take roadpics, any advice?


Few tips;

0) traffic safety comes first!
1) clean windshield
2) avoid driving into the sunlight. Especially this time of the year, this means you can't take good pics before 10 am eastbound and after 4 pm westbound. southbound is always problematic, best to do this in the early morning with sufficient light.
3) just try a few times, it took me a good 100 pics before I got the hang of it.
4) set your camera to "auto" or something that's further away than the windshield, otherwise it might focus on reflection or bugs on the windshield


----------



## Danielk2

Thanks Chris. Well traffic safety and cleaning the windshield, ill let the driver care about. But that with bad pictures before 10am will be a big problem, since ill be leaving Dronninglund at 5am and take the ferry (Ystad-Rønne) at 11am. So i guess sunlight will be a problem.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I drove eastbound at 12 pm and I still had problems with sunlight 

The winter period only allows for a few hours of good sunlight to take pics from a moving car.


----------



## kosimodo

Some pics of the future Funderå-dalbroen. 

This is gonna be the biggest 'talbrücke' in Danmark. 730 long!

Part of the 15 motorway from Århus to Herning.


----------



## SeanT

The danish plates are not "exactly" the same as the swedish. The swedish has 3 letters and 3 digits.


----------



## Danielk2

I think that we should get rid of all those EU-plates, and go back to the countries' original plates... We don't need those EU-ones anyway in a couple of years.. at that time all the EU-countries will be states in the United States of Europe hno:


----------



## Fargo Wolf

Danielk2 said:


> I think that we should get rid of all those EU-plates, and go back to the countries' original plates... We don't need those EU-ones anyway in a couple of years.. at that time all the EU-countries will be states in the United States of Europe hno:


A perfect opportunity to come up with some distinct/nifty looking plates.  :lol:



Fuzzy Llama said:


> ^^
> I agree, now because the EU strip there is no way to distinguish between Danish and Swiss plates. Both looks exactly the same, with their European Union design... oh, wait...
> 
> And don't tell me that somebody working in 'manual traffic control' cannot distinguish German plate in the crowd. They look nothing like Danish, with the control stickers you can tell between them from 50 meters. Just admit, you prefer the plates of 'aliens' to be different so you can shoot them on sight
> 
> And about nationality oval - Why, for heavens sake most of DK ovals aren't white? They are just letters over the car's original colour. In some instances it can be impossible to tell the nationality of the car in country where Danish plates are not so common.


German number plates were/are the most common plates I saw, followed by the Swiss. That's what I liked about working on the highways. In town, you don't see those number plates as often.

Prior to the EU plates coming into general use, I was able to go by the nationality decal, which, from what I understand about them, are SUPPOSED to be white with black letters.


----------



## Danielk2

Some pics of southbound E45 (M80) exit 17-23 and some of exit 23 (Kridtsvinget)

First: Yes, the pics do suck, what are you gonna do??
All the pics are copyrighted by ME, Danielk2. Any replicating of other pics on SSC is unintentional.
Second: The pics

1. Exit 17 - Lyngdrup









2. Exit 18 - Vodskov N - one of the 2 Vodskov exits









3.









4. Danish exit marker. The german one is better at explaining that it's an exit









5. Exit 19 - Vodskov - the other Vodskov exit









6. Hals is signposted here, even though it's more than 30km away from the exit









7. This is the beginnig of the low-speed limit zone called Aalborg









8. Exit 20 - Bouet. This is also the exit towards E39, Aalborg Airport (AAL) and Thisted









9. The big black building is a Kvickly store









10. Limfjordstunnelen is only 3.5km away









11. Entering very-low speed limit zone. these signs can only show speed limits of 90, 70 and 50









12. Interchange Vendsyssel. M80 becomes M70. No southbound exit









13. Exit 21 - Nørresundby N - last exit before the tunnel. The oversized flag is used by Stadsing Denmark to make people notice their building









14. Still very low speed limit. Mercedes-Benz dealer on the other side of the road









15. Right lane exits just after Limfjordstunnelen









16. Inside the 600m long Limfjordstunnel









17. Taking exit 23 - Aalborg N. As you can see, the exits in Aalborg aren't too far apart. Speed limit of 70, because of a very sharp right-left double curve









18. Exit to Østhavnen, Aalborg's industrial harbour









19. Motorway ends in 300m









20. End of motorway. Aalborg city limits









21. Overheads. The billboard further ahead is quite new. JCDecaux have the exclusive rights to put up large scale billboards at major roads in Aalborg and Nørresundby. Generally, billboards are not allowed in Denmark.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Does anybody uses those M-numbers? They're not signed.


----------



## Danielk2

You're a traffic engineer, you shuld know. It's administrative numbers. it's for Vejdirektoratet and the police to use.

M is for Motorvej

The M-numbers on E45 are:
M80: Frederikshavnmotorvejen (Frederikshavn ferry port - Interchange Vendsyssel)
M70: Nordjyske Motorvej (Interchange Vendsyssel - Interchange Århus Vest)
M60: Østjyske Motorvej (Interchange Århus Vest - Interchange Skærup)
M50: Sønderjyske Motorvej (Interchange Skærup - DK/D Border Ellund)


----------



## Danielk2

You can also see the M-numbers on the roadside markers










From the top:
45 - this is km's
2 - this i 100m's
M20 - this is the M-number
Blue arrow - nearest emergency phone


----------



## kosimodo

^^ M numbers are for internal use only... 

Didnt know that the police were using those numbers too. I will ask around to be sure


----------



## Danielk2

I'm not quite sure they do, but i've heard that they use it to make it easier to locate accidents


----------



## Danielk2

Some pics of M70/M80 - this time northbound
First: Yes, the pics do suck, what are you gonna do??
All the pics are copyrighted by ME, Danielk2. Any replicating of other pics on SSC is unintentional.
Second: The pics

1. Starting at the entrance to E45 at exit 23.









2. The southbound E45 can be reached by taking the exit.









3. Very sharp left turn before the merge with E45.









4. Height control for trucks in 200m.









5. Trucks taller than 4.3m won't fit in the tunnel. As you can see, the merge of Kridtsvinget and E45 is right after the sign, meaning that trucks have nowhere to stop but in the middle of the road. + stupid 90 km/h speed limit









6. Exit 22, Nørresundby C is just 2-300m after the tunnel.









7. Exit 22, Nørresundby C. The flyover bridge of this exit collapsed 2 years ago during a widening from 1 to 2 lanes on the bridge. A construction worker was killed. He fell 5 metres down on the motorway, and was drowned in concrete.









8. The right lane ends here, this causes congestions every afternoon. There are 3 southbound lanes, but only 2 northbound. Adding a third lane is planned, and has been financed. Now they just need to start the construction. The flyover bridge that collapsed is visble in the background.









9. 500m to exit 21, Nørresundby N.









10. 1km to E39. The congestions ends aroud here.









11. 650m to the interchange









12. 400m. The only control city on the E39 is Hirtshals, and the only one on Primærrute 11 is Thisted. M80 becomes M70.









13. Exit 10 on E39 is the only left exit in Denmark.









14. Exit 20 - Bouet. 









15. Only distance sign on the E45 with Sæby on it. Speed limit changes from 90 to 130.









16. Exit 19 - Vodskov.









17. 52km to Frederikshavn. I think Sæby should be signed as well.









18. 1200m to Exit 18, Vodskov N.


----------



## kosimodo

I have made an alternatives for some new roads to solve the trafficproblems in Aalborg South.

Some nut placed the Shoppingcenter about 6km south of the City without a proper conncetion to whatsoever.... Now with the coming of the (woohee) Ikea and the possible replacement of the hospital to the way eastern part ( another nut idea....) something has to be done to get us around.

The plan is as follows.. Most stupid parts of the plan are: 1x1 road (A) on map.. and the lack of grade seperated crossings... The main way into Aalborg comming from south (now motorway) should end in an intersection... Going left would be imho impossible to do without trafficlights, making the connection (A) eastwards anoying and slow. 
In addition the plan is to make (a very south going) extra motorway (C2) to west Aalborg for a later extra tunnel west of Aalborg

My idea (in red) is to make use of the existing restarea combining the two new exits C2 and B into one and keeping the existing exits like it is.










The tunnel west around Aalborg will never come due to not enough traffic for a motorway. Instead Aalborg should focus on two new bridges over the Limfjord at Stuhrsvej/Engvej and Skydebanevej/Sydvestvej 

What do you think?


----------



## Danielk2

I pretty much think that a motorway to City Syd is needed. On all holidays, traffic is completely jammed. When the new Ikea store is finished, traffic will collapse from City to City Syd every single christmas.
What i don't get about you map is, Are those roads your proposal, or are they already existing roads??


----------



## Danielk2

My proposal for new Aalborg road network








Youre' from Aalborg, so you might know what i mean when i refer to "the bridge" and "the tunnel"

1: 2nd tube, west or east of the tunnel
2: Widening the bridge to 3+3 lanes
3: Widening Vesterbro to entirely 2+2 and removing smaller acces roads.
4. Moving exit 27 towards north.
5. Normally, the Exit 28 motorway continues as route 187 towards Nibe. the motorway should be moved towards City Syd, so that people going to Centrum shold exit instead of the ones going to City Syd.
6. Motorway connection from E45 to the Storcenter. It's necessary to avoid a total collapse of traffic in southern Aalborg


----------



## kosimodo

Danielk2 said:


> What i don't get about you map is, Are those roads your proposal, or are they already existing roads??


In black the proposals from Aalborg Kommune. Those plans are in a final stadium. 

In red mine... combining proposals B and C2 into one loverleaf interchange.


Your proposals about widening the Vesterbro are impossible, just like moving exit 27, which now is a minor used motorwayexit. Why move that one into a residential area??


----------



## Danielk2

I know that it's impossible to widen Vesterbro, because of all kinds of buildings placed 2 inches off the road. And exit 27, i actually think it should be removed. It has no pupose being there. To Centrum, you might as well use 28 or 26.
But a motorway to the Storcenter is not impossible. City Syd was build on a flat grass field far away from Aalborg years ago. But now, the 2 parts of the city has been connected, creating Aalborg's horrible traffic problems


----------



## kosimodo

If you continue northwards and make that 3rd Limfjordforbindelse at Stuhrsgade. Upgrade the Sønderbro a bit.. And there you are; a cheap, much needed, extra connection. 

I post later a pic of that proposal There is christmas shopping to do


----------



## Danielk2

Never... Christmas shopping is at December 23!!!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Danielk2 said:


> Denmark has 1 left-hand exit and no left-hand entrances.


I happened to make a picture of that situation as well;


----------



## Danielk2

I've always found that overhead stupid. They should largen the Sæby on the left sign or just remove it. With the right sign, i think that Hjørring should be enlargened, and Brønderslev split into 2: Brønder-slev. The current sign looks ugly


----------



## Danielk2

I made this vid of the southbound E45 from Lyngdrup to Aalborg 2 days ago. I'll add descriptions later


----------



## kosimodo

Other good news from Denmark. Work has started on the new motorway from E45 Kliplev towards Sønderborg. The 26 km shuould be finished in 2years

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/imageblob/cache/244278.pdf

And a link with the road..


----------



## Spikespiegel

kosimodo said:


> Other good news from Denmark. Work has started on the new motorway from E45 Kliplev towards Sønderborg. The 26 km shuould be finished in 2years
> 
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/imageblob/cache/244278.pdf
> 
> And a link with the road..


Good news?

I wouldn't define "spending billions of kroner on a new motorway in an area that is barely even populated" as good news.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ The roads get some traffic though:









A combined 20,000 AADT. But I guess the main problems are during the weekends, when driving in Denmark (outside København), I got the idea the weekends were busier than during the workdays.


----------



## Spikespiegel

ChrisZwolle said:


> ^^ The roads get some traffic though:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A combined 20,000 AADT. But I guess the main problems are during the weekends, when driving in Denmark (outside København), I got the idea the weekends were busier than during the workdays.


Three of the main roads into Roskilde has a combined ADT of 55.000. I don't see why you would build an entire motorway to a part of Denmark that is basically a dead-end, when the three main roads combined only has an ADT of 20.000.


----------



## Nikolaj

Spikespiegel said:


> Three of the main roads into Roskilde has a combined ADT of 55.000. I don't see why you would build an entire motorway to a part of Denmark that is basically a dead-end, when the three main roads combined only has an ADT of 20.000.


Do You want a new motorway going into Roskilde, or what is Your point?

It seems like the never ending debate in Denmark whether it is okay to invest in infrastructure in the other part of the country than where You are living.

To your question as to why build to Sønderborg, the answer is the same as why you build a motorway to Frederikssund or other places, that it for technical and political reasons seems a good idea.


----------



## kalaha

Nikolaj said:


> To your question as to why build to Sønderborg, the answer is the same as why you build a motorway to Frederikssund or other places, that it for technical and political reasons seems a good idea.


Have you seen the traffic on Ballerup Byvej and Frederikssundsvej? That's why...


----------



## Spikespiegel

Nikolaj said:


> Do You want a new motorway going into Roskilde, or what is Your point?


My point is: Why waste money building a motorway to a remote point in Denmark, that already has the infrastructure to handle all the traffic going there?

There are lots of places in Denmark that would make more sense to build a motorway, for instance Copenhagen Ring 5, Roskilde-Ringsted or motorways to help the traffic in Aalborg, Silkeborg and on Vejle Fjord. Heck, I would even build a motorway down the west coast of Jutland, before building a motorway to Sønderborg.


----------



## Nikolaj

Spikespiegel said:


> My point is: Why waste money building a motorway to a remote point in Denmark, that already has the infrastructure to handle all the traffic going there?
> 
> There are lots of places in Denmark that would make more sense to build a motorway, for instance Copenhagen Ring 5, Roskilde-Ringsted or motorways to help the traffic in Aalborg, Silkeborg and on Vejle Fjord. Heck, I would even build a motorway down the west coast of Jutland, before building a motorway to Sønderborg.


I am glad I don't live in such a remote point (remote from what ? Roskilde?)
Anyway I don't worry so much. We get 25 km of motorway for 1,2 bn. DKK to Sønderborg where as the 26 km to Frederikssund (not a remote point from Roskilde) will be 4,7 bn. DKK


----------



## kosimodo

Danfoss is f.e located in Nordborg. 

With building a motorway in these remote locations you can keep the industry in that area. It is the life line for a lot of 'remote' areas.


----------



## Fender56

Spikespiegel said:


> Three of the main roads into Roskilde has a combined ADT of 55.000. I don't see why you would build an entire motorway to a part of Denmark that is basically a dead-end, when the three main roads combined only has an ADT of 20.000.


Sønderborg is no more "dead end" than Copenhagen. 

To all those from Sjælland, who envy Jylland the infrastructure investments, please take in account that ALL the highways in Jylland did cost less than the planned railway in the Cph area, and please remember 52% of the Danish population, lives in Jylland.


----------



## Spikespiegel

Fender56 said:


> Sønderborg is no more "dead end" than Copenhagen.
> 
> To all those from Sjælland, who envy Jylland the infrastructure investments, please take in account that ALL the highways in Jylland did cost less than the planned railway in the Cph area, and please remember 52% of the Danish population, lives in Jylland.


First off, "Jydske ø-gruppe" has a population 2.543.568, which is 45% of the total Danish population of 5.511.000 (Both numbers are from dst.dk).

The population density of the entire Sealand is 312 people per square kilometre.
The population density of the Capital Region is 649.
The population density of Copenhagen is 3705.

The population density of Jutland is 85.
The population density of Southern Jutland is 82.
(All these numbers are curtesy of statistikbanken.dk)


So yeah, you really need that motorway more than the people on Sealand does.


----------



## Fender56

Please bring us the same percentages in infrastructure investments and compare them to the population, and you´ll be astounded. :nuts:

Jylland gets way way fewer statevice investments per taxpayer than the same Sjællænder. And nobody prohibits the municipalities around and in Copenhagen to build their own roads, not all roads over there are state roads.


----------



## mlm

@ Spikespiegel: So because Jutland is more spread out there should be no motorways here?

You don't hear me complain when they spend many billions on for example the metro cityring, or when they extend the motorway to Holbæk (which doesn't have that much traffic either), that's fine. But for some reason many Sealanders need to express how stupid it is every single time there's discussion about something in Jutland...


----------



## Spikespiegel

mlm said:


> @ Spikespiegel: So because Jutland is more spread out there should be no motorways here?
> 
> You don't hear me complain when they spend many billions on for example the metro cityring, or when they extend the motorway to Holbæk (which doesn't have that much traffic either), that's fine. But for some reason many Sealanders need to express how stupid it is every single time there's discussion about something in Jutland...


The reason I put up the numbers is to show why billions more is spent on infrastructure on Sealand than in Jutland. Jutland already has decent infrastructure. Because the population is less dense, you don't need as many motorways, as the normal roads can easily handle the load. Ofcourse, there are needs for some intercity infrastructure, but in this aspect, I think eastern Jutland already has what it needs (with the exceptions of below-mentioned expansions). 

I'm not saying that there should be no motorways in Jutland. However, the Jutlandian politicians COULD think twice before making the investments. Building a motorway to Sønderborg, would be equivalent to us building a motorway to Faxe. There are motorways in Jutland that are in as dire need for upgrades, as the motorways in Copenhagen, here I am of course talking about Vejle Fjord and Aalborg.

We Sealanders doesn't mind Jutland getting some better infrastructure, as long as it's put where it is needed.

About the extension of Holbækmotorvejen. It's only the section around Roskilde that is getting expanded. The motorway is the only way for people in the Northwestern Sealand to get to Copenhagen, as Roskilde Fjord is a national heritage site, and thus you cannot build a bridge across the fjord to help traffic. At rush hour, I can walk faster than the traffic moves on the motorway, which is why it's getting upgraded.

About Frederikssundsmotorvejen that is being mentioned. I don't agree on this motorway either. Sure the traffic up to Frederikssund is pretty dense, but I had rather seen the money saved for either O5 around Copenhagen or an expansion of Vejle Fjord.


----------



## Spikespiegel

Had they saved the cash from Frederikssundsmotorvejen, they would already have most of the money needed to build O5 (8 billion DKK). The O5 would solve most of the traffic problems around Copenhagen, even the traffic up to Frederikssund.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ What is this O5 plan exactly?


----------



## Spikespiegel

ChrisZwolle said:


> ^^ What is this O5 plan exactly?


http://byplanlab.dk/plan09/www.plan...1-9C30-2380D72DC86C/0/ArbejdsrapportRing5.pdf

(That is not an official document, but it gives a pretty good idea of the project. It's also in Danish )

It's a new motorway around Copenhagen that is planned to go From Helsingør in the North to Roskilde/Taastrup in the west and all the way down to Køge in the South.
According to Børsen.dk, the motorway is projected to cost 8 Billion DKK, which is a large amount of money, but according to numbers from the Capital Region, the entire region is set to lose 11 billion DKK a year from 2015, is the motorway not built.

Børsen source: http://borsen.dk/politik/nyhed/162879/


----------



## Spikespiegel

Enough being said about Jutland, there is much I don't understand about politicians in Sealand either. A plan to build 2 railroad tracks from Copenhagen to Ringsted over Køge has been approved. The idea is that all the traffic to Jutland will go over Køge instead of Roskilde.

However, this new railroad does not offer any new significant stations, nor does it really improve the traffic from neither Ringsted nor Køge (as the travel time from Ringsted will be pretty much the same, and the new station will be placed many kilometres outside Køge, so the commuters will just use the S-train anyway).

At the same time, Roskilde, Denmarks biggest trainstation outside Copenhagen, will get much fewer trains to Copenhagen, and that is even though the trains currently are completely full between Copenhagen and Roskilde in rush hour.


----------



## Nikolaj

Spikespiegel said:


> Enough being said about Jutland, there is much I don't understand about politicians in Sealand either. A plan to build 2 railroad tracks from Copenhagen to Ringsted over Køge has been approved. The idea is that all the traffic to Jutland will go over Køge instead of Roskilde.
> 
> However, this new railroad does not offer any new significant stations, nor does it really improve the traffic from neither Ringsted nor Køge (as the travel time from Ringsted will be pretty much the same, and the new station will be placed many kilometres outside Køge, so the commuters will just use the S-train anyway).
> 
> At the same time, Roskilde, Denmarks biggest trainstation outside Copenhagen, will get much fewer trains to Copenhagen, and that is even though the trains currently are completely full between Copenhagen and Roskilde in rush hour.



And time for another classic Roskilde - this time the new line via Køge or widening the good old one via Roskilde. Roskilde will be far better of with the new line via Køge. It is not coorect when you say that Roskilde with new line. You will have just as mny as present. In addition you won't have all the goods train currently running through Roskilde making a hell of a lot of noice ans slowing passenger trains. So by all means the best solution for everybody, including Roskilde, will be the new line which finally has been approved. By the way it is not correct that there will be no important station on the new one. Køge will be a new and very important one. (a competitor to Roskilde??)


----------



## Spikespiegel

Nikolaj said:


> And time for another classic Roskilde - this time the new line via Køge or widening the good old one via Roskilde. Roskilde will be far better of with the new line via Køge. It is not coorect when you say that Roskilde with new line. You will have just as mny as present. In addition you won't have all the goods train currently running through Roskilde making a hell of a lot of noice ans slowing passenger trains. So by all means the best solution for everybody, including Roskilde, will be the new line which finally has been approved. By the way it is not correct that there will be no important station on the new one. Køge will be a new and very important one. (a competitor to Roskilde??)


The copenhagen goods terminal is located in Høje Taastrup, so the goods trains would have to move through Roskilde anyway. Besides, I live only some 50 meters from the main line in Roskilde, and I never notice when trains pass.
The station in Køge will be placed outside the city limits, and thus it will not really be an important station. Sure, it will make it easier for people living in Køge to get to Jutland, but you don't choose to live in Køge if you go to Jutland often. People commuting between Køge and Copenhagen will not use the new line, as they would have to take the Roskilde train northbound (only departs twice an hour), then they have to get on another train at Køge Nord.


----------



## SeanT

Now, we are looking forward to see construction of Femern-Bridge (2018) connection between Germany and Denmark.
http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/6695/krselpkgebugtmotorvej.mp4
A little trip on Køge-Bugt motorway


----------



## Spikespiegel

A lot of stuff going on at the motorways in Denmark 

Holbækmotorvejen is getting expanded from 4 to 6(8) lanes around Roskilde. At the same time, most older motorways are getting refurbished.

I drove the E45 last week from north to south, and it has already been almost entirely refurbished.


----------



## SeanT

Spikespiegel said:


> A lot of stuff going on at the motorways in Denmark
> 
> Holbækmotorvejen is getting expanded from 4 to 6(8) lanes around Roskilde. At the same time, most older motorways are getting refurbished.
> 
> I drove the E45 last week from north to south, and it has already been almost entirely refurbished.


 A stretch between Bjæverskov(or even more west) and Køge-interchange got brand new asphalt.


----------



## kanterberg

*Speed limits in DK*

It may have been posted here before, but I thought this was an informative map, providing speed limit information for the Danish motorway network.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

There are slightly too many 110 km/h sections in Denmark in my opinion. For example the southern end of E47 on Lolland, and most Kolding-area Motorveje. The København area motorways seem okay, although Primary Route 21 could do with 130 km/h west of Roskilde.


----------



## kanterberg

ChrisZwolle said:


> There are slightly too many 110 km/h sections in Denmark in my opinion. For example the southern end of E47 on Lolland, and most Kolding-area Motorveje. The København area motorways seem okay, although Primary Route 21 could do with 130 km/h west of Roskilde.


There is no hard shoulder on the southern end of E47 if I remember correctly, I guess that's the reason for the 110-zone.


----------



## SeanT

ChrisZwolle said:


> There are slightly too many 110 km/h sections in Denmark in my opinion. For example the southern end of E47 on Lolland, and most Kolding-area Motorveje. The København area motorways seem okay, although Primary Route 21 could do with 130 km/h west of Roskilde.


 It´s still would be better with different speedlimits in the Copenhagen area too. 110 Km/h is too slow in the late evening/night time with 3 lanes.


----------



## SeanT

I took the expressway from Kalundborg and 100 wouldn´t be a big problem either istead of 90Km/h.


----------



## Danielk2

Max speed on expressways is 90 if signed. Otherwise it's 80.

The problem in Denmark is, that speed limits are set after some standardized rules, instead of adapting the speed limit to the actual conditions.


----------



## Morsue

Nikolaj said:


> As part of the Fehmarn belt project the Rødby-Sakskøbing section of the motorway to Rødby will be upgraded, most likely including hard shoulders and new lay-out of junctions. The Danish Road Directorate are currently doing carrying out the design (including EIA) of the upgrade project. The cost will be carried by the Fehmarn Belt project.
> 
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/dokumentniveau.asp?page=document&objno=259519


From the Swedish thread.


----------



## Danielk2

I have no idea why we need a Fehmarn Belt bridge. It's gonna be more expensive to cross it than taking the ferry. 

It is supposed to improve the economy and transportation conditions on the road from Malmö to Germany.

The danish government also thought that Malmö and Copenhagen would become one big united city, which it yet has to become.


----------



## Nikolaj

Danielk2 said:


> I have no idea why we need a Fehmarn Belt bridge. It's gonna be more expensive to cross it than taking the ferry.
> 
> It is supposed to improve the economy and transportation conditions on the road from Malmö to Germany.
> 
> The danish government also thought that Malmö and Copenhagen would become one big united city, which it yet has to become.


You are talking against facts. The growth in the combined region Copenhagen-Malmö has been amazing over the past decade. Commuting across Øresund was virtually none existing 10 years ago (around 1000 daily commuters), and now 20.000 people are commuting daily accross Øresund. 

You might not feel the change in Northern Jutland, but people in Copenhagen and Malmö and not least business and has certainlu felt it, and in many ways the region has grown together.

Whether Fehmarn will be the same success is to be seen, but since it is stipulated that the project will be self-financing, including railways and roads on shore (like Great Belt/Storebælt and Øresund) it at least is not a problem for the rest of the country, including Northern Jutland.


----------



## Danielk2

What i'm saying is, that the politicians in their own imaginary world thought that a bridge that it costs several hundred crowns to cross, would make CPH and Malmö become one city. They forget to remember that the Øresund is still there.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Commuters only pay something like € 5 in tolls to cross the Øresund Bridge.


----------



## Fuzzy Llama

^^


> Årsabonnement	240,00
> Pris per enkelttur per kalendermåned DKK inkl moms
> Normal / Weekend
> 1-16 : 142,00 / 115,00
> 17-50 : 29,00 / 25,00
> 51-	: 142,00 / 115,00
> Tillæg for anhænger/campingvogn og autocamper over 6 meter	142,00 / 115,00


Which mean that for yearly fee of 240DKK you pay 142DKK for first 16 crossings in month and then you pay only 29 Kroner for further crossings up to 50th one. 
So, if you live in Malmö and commute to CPH only on workdays, you are doing about 2x22 crossing per month which cost you (16 * 142) + (28 * 29) = 3084DKK/month + 20DKK of yearly fee. That's about 415€. Definitely not cheap, but not unbearably-expensive. And remember that nothing in Denmark is cheap 


Moreover, aren't the Øresund- and Storebaelt bridge tolls tax-deductable in case when you use them for daily commuting?


----------



## Ingenioren

If the tolls are too expensive, there is always the train


----------



## Nikolaj

Fuzzy Llama said:


> ^^
> 
> 
> Which mean that for yearly fee of 240DKK you pay 142DKK for first 16 crossings in month and then you pay only 29 Kroner for further crossings up to 50th one.
> So, if you live in Malmö and commute to CPH only on workdays, you are doing about 2x22 crossing per month which cost you (16 * 142) + (28 * 29) = 3084DKK/month + 20DKK of yearly fee. That's about 415€. Definitely not cheap, but not unbearably-expensive. And remember that nothing in Denmark is cheap
> 
> 
> Moreover, aren't the Øresund- and Storebaelt bridge tolls tax-deductable in case when you use them for daily commuting?


You're right it is tax deductable, at least in Denmark. And anyhow since so many have chosen to commute across Øresund it is not prohibitively expensive for commuters.

Copenhagen and Malmö will never be one city in the classical way - and nobody has predicted that, but the region has become more and more one functional city-region instead of two very separated cities. And that is without doubt benefiting the whole region.


----------



## kosimodo

Some maps of new mayor projekts i made with vejdirektoratets help....

Gives some idea whats gonna happen in Denmark the coming 5 years. With in yellow the new roads

1 Frederikssunsmotorvejen










2 Midtjyske motorvej










3 Herningmotorvejen









4 Slagelse omfartsvej









5 Sunds Omfartsvej









6 Sønderborg motorvej









7 Sjællands Odde


----------



## Fender56

Yesterday, the Danish goverment presented a new plan, called "Denmark in better balance", which included two major upcomming road projects.

The first will be an extension of the A18 motorway from Herning to Holstebro, details so far not known.

And the other will be a new or upgrated road from Esbjerg to Tønder at the Danish/German border. This A11 could be a new motorway, according to the plan. The costs for the pre-studys will be 10 mio dkr, and will take approx one year.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ Do you have a link with more detailed information about this? 

By the way, on August 27th, the last section of the Djurslandmotorvejen (PR15) opened north of Århus.

location:


----------



## Coccodrillo

Fender56 said:


> Fully agrees. Imagine a fire in a truck container full of chemicals, where would you prefer to be, in a tunnel or on a bridge.?


Trucks carrying dangerous goods are usually banned or have serious limitations in tunnels, like being allowed to pass only in small gropus without any other vehicle in the tunnel. The same may be true also on ships, at least on Messina strait freight trains with dangerous goods are shipped alone. Maybe in the case of the Fehmarn they would still have to use a ferry.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ So, another disadvantage of a tunnel. 

Another problem are tunnel safety features, which will inevitably need to be upgraded in the future at very high costs. For example the renovation of the Gotthard Tunnel will cost over € 350 million, and a Fehmarnbelt Tunnel would be even longer, with two tubes. 

No, even at the same construction cost, the bridge will remain a far better and safer option.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> ^^ So, another disadvantage of a tunnel.
> 
> Another problem are tunnel safety features, which will inevitably need to be upgraded in the future at very high costs. For example the renovation of the Gotthard Tunnel will cost over € 350 million, and a Fehmarnbelt Tunnel would be even longer, with two tubes.
> 
> No, even at the same construction cost, the bridge will remain a far better and safer option.


Higher maintenance cost for a tunnel (approx. 20% higher annual cost) is also one of the main reasons why the profitability for the bridge option remain higher for the bridge option than for the tunnel option, despite actual construction cost is higher for the bridge option, according to a brief presented to the Parliamentary Comittee on Transport a couple of weeks ago. http://www.trm.dk/da/publikationer/...sskøn/Femern Konsolideret anlægsoverslag.ashx (sorry it is in Danish)


----------



## kosimodo

Another news from DK: Work started at the Vejlefjordbroen. 

The whole section near Vejle becomes a 2x3 road


----------



## Fender56

kosimodo said:


> Another news from DK: Work started at the Vejlefjordbroen.
> 
> The whole section near Vejle becomes a 2x3 road


^^ Like you say, this project now starts, and from 2010 until 2015 this route will be jammed with problems. It´s allready one of the biggest traffic-jam stretches in Denmark, but now it´ll only be much worse, and 4½ years is a long time. 

A map of the construction site, can be found here.:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/wimpshow.asp?type=image&id=267299


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I was surprised by the intense truck traffic on that section. Much more than I expected.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> I was surprised by the intense truck traffic on that section. Much more than I expected.


The section of E45 around Vejle has a truck AADT of 14.200, and even more on a weekday. 

There has been som news report that the construction work will be speeded up, in order for it to be complete by 2013. But so far nothing confirmed. In 2013 E45 will be hooked with the new Herning motorway just north of Vejle. This will add even more to the problems around the Vejlefjord bridge. Today the Vejlefjord bridge has an AADT of around 65.000 (of which trucks 14.200), but by 2020 forecasts predict an AADT between 90.000 and 100.000 including traffic from the Herning motorway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Nikolaj said:


> In 2013 E45 will be hooked with the new Herning motorway just north of Vejle. This will add even more to the problems around the Vejlefjord bridge. Today the Vejlefjord bridge has an AADT of around 65.000 (of which trucks 14.200), but by 2020 forecasts predict an AADT between 90.000 and 100.000 including traffic from the Herning motorway.


One of the worst mistakes on Danish motorways in my opinion. The Vejle Bridge is busy as it is, adding a motorway - even a relatively low trafficked one - will add to congestion. Traffic from Herning to Horsens can already use the high-standard PR 30.


----------



## mlm

^^ I think most people agree that it was stupid connection Route 18 north of the bridge. I'm also pretty sure traffic will rise when Route 18 is completed all the way to E45, today most people going south use 176 from Give to Kolding instead, but when the motorway os completed I think most will use that instead. Add to that trafic from Route 13 from Viborg and maybe some from Silkeborg, and you could proabably have avoided some 20.000 vehicles daily over the bridge. 

Herning-Horsens is not really an issue though, pretty much no trafic between those two cities. The few that travel that distance probably use 185 anyway.

Too late to correct that mistake though, unless the debated "Hærvejmotorvej" ever gets build with start/ending around Kolding. That is not anything that will happen in atleast 10 years though.


----------



## SeanT

With the widening of Vejle-bridge we´re going to win some years, but those years should be used on building a new bridge-connection.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> One of the worst mistakes on Danish motorways in my opinion. The Vejle Bridge is busy as it is, adding a motorway - even a relatively low trafficked one - will add to congestion. Traffic from Herning to Horsens can already use the high-standard PR 30.


The detour using Route 30 is too long, and nobody going south from Herning will use Route 30. The Herning Motorway will actually have an acceptable amount of traffic. From E45 north to the split between Route 13 and 18 at Tørring the motorway is estimated to have an AADT of 35.000 by 2020 (current traffic of 15.000 - 18.000 on the ordinary 1+1 road + traffic on the Route 176 from Give towards Kolding + ordinary growth). 

The big issue being analysed currently is whether the problem Kolding -Aarhus, and especially around Vejle, in the long term shall be solved with a new parallel bridge across Vejle fjord (probably 5+5) and continued widening of E45, or a new parallel motorway from Kolding -Viborg - Aalborg shall be constructed.

Official forecasts the Ministry of Transport predicts that The Vejlefjord bridge will reach its maximum capacity in a 3+3 lay-out (current widening project) by 2025-2030 and the remaining sections of E45 between Kolding and Aarhus will reach max. 2+2 capacity by 2020 and max. 3+3 capacity from 2035-2040.

A parallel motorway Kolding-Viborg-Aalborg can relieve E45 to some extent. The initial screening report published in March 2010 by the Ministry of Transport concluded that a parallel motorway by 2020 will have an AADT of 20.000-25.000 and be able to relieve E45 from Kolding to Aarhus for about 12.000-15.000 cars a day. That will not solve the E45 problems, but for the forseable future only necessitate a widening to from 2+2 to 3+3 between Kolding and Aarhus. In addition a parallel motorway will service Billund Airport and the tourist facilities like Legoland in Billund and places like Viborg (Pop.90.000), that currently has a very bad road connection to the south.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

> The detour using Route 30 is too long, and nobody going south from Herning will use Route 30.


I meant there is technically no need to connect the Herning Motorvejen to E45 north of Vejle. Traffic that want to enter E45 in that area already has the Route 30 available. Otherwise there would be two parallel high-standard routes. So a connection south of Vejle would be better for north-south traffic from Herning to Kolding. 

However, I think it's a bit too late to discuss this right now, as the plans are too advanced to change right now. If they would change it right now it would mean a delay of at least 5 - 7 years, if not more. 

So we'll have to make our peace with the fact Herningmotorvejen will connect with E45 north of Vejle.


----------



## mlm

ChrisZwolle said:


> However, I think it's a bit too late to discuss this right now, as the plans are too advanced to change right now. If they would change it right now it would mean a delay of at least 5 - 7 years, if not more.
> 
> So we'll have to make our peace with the fact Herningmotorvejen will connect with E45 north of Vejle.


Yes, it's too late, it's already under construction.


----------



## sotonsi

Idealistically, from a network point of view, you'd have wanted it plugged in to the E45 at the junction with the connector to the E20.

But north of Vejle does mean less construction and it's not as if congestion on E45 is a massively pressing issue - it will be in 10 years, but not now.


----------



## kosimodo

Some pics of ideas for the Fermern Belt connection..

http://www.bt.dk/danmark/saadan-kan-femern-forbindelsen-se-ud

There is a slideshow overthere...


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Chaos in eastern Denmark.


----------



## mlm

^^ Every year when the first snow appear, people drive like they have never experienced it before.


----------



## mlm

^^ It'll be either a bridge or a tunnel. I think a combination would be much more expensive. Personally I would also go for the bridge, the price is pretty much identical.


----------



## Fender56

Link to the brandnew traffic deal "Aftale om bedre mobilitet", a lot of new projects comming up, like the new A11 from Tønder to Esbjerg.

http://www.trm.dk/da/publikationer/2010/aftale+om+bedre+mobilitet/~/media/Files/Publication/2010/Aftale%20om%20Bedre%20mobilitet.ashx

Comments from some of the politicians, who made this deal come true.:

http://www.dr.dk/Regioner/Esbjerg/Nyheder/Esbjerg/2010/11/26/154515.htm

Interview with the minister for transport, from TV SYD.:

http://www.tvsyd.dk/video/32165


And comments from the local Tønder mayor, from JV today.:



Btw all the political parties, except one (Enhedslisten) voted for the project.!

:cheers:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Some interesting projects:

"Udbygning af Motorring 4 fra Taastrup til Frederikssundmotorvejen"

Construction of Motorring 4 from Taastrup to the Frederikssundmotorevejen

"Nordlig omfartsvej ved Næstved"

Construction of a 7 km 2+1 bypass of Næstved.

"Ny motorvej på strækningen Holstebro - Herning"

New motorway along the Holstebro - Herning route

"Rute 9 (Svendborg – Maribo)"

Feasibility study on the expansion of Rute 9 Svendborg - Maribo (incl. new bridge?)

"Rute 23 (Skovvejen) Kalundborg - Holbækmotorvejen"

Feasibility study on a 3 km new motorway near Regstrup.


----------



## Nikolaj

Ingenioren said:


> Just 2x2, or autobahn standard?


I think it is a bit unclear. The treaty is not specific on that point. Before decision on the fixed Fehmarn link, it was allready decided to widen the B207 to 2+2 across the island of Fehmarn, but without hard shoulder. I believe I have read somewhere that this has been changed now to include hard shoulders, which in essence means Autobahn standard. But that is not the same as it being signed as an Autobahn. Until the day in the future? when the Fehmarnsund Bridge might be doubled, there will in any case be a gap in the Autobahn, and whether this autobahn-gap only will be the actual bridge across the Fehmarnsund or also inlude the road across the island Fehmarn is not clear.


----------



## SeanT

By SeanT at 2011-02-04

So here is an animated picture from the tunnel.It´s going to be 43m wide
www.femern.dk


----------



## SeanT

...as you read the article it´s going to be a motorway with top speed of 110 Km/h.
It´s going to take 10 min. from DK to D and like 7 min. with train.


----------



## Nikolaj

SeanT said:


> ...as you read the article it´s going to be a motorway with top speed of 110 Km/h.
> It´s going to take 10 min. from DK to D and like 7 min. with train.


Well that's the tunnel it self. No doubt that this part will have status as a motorway/autobahn. The question is the stretch of road on the Island of Fehmarn between the tunnel entrance and the Fehmarnsund bridge (going to mainland Germany)


----------



## ChrisZwolle

110 km/h in the tunnel is rather generous by the way. Most tunnel nations apply limits between 80 and 100 km/h.


----------



## metasmurf

Great to see things finally decided. Now we (Sweden at least) need a Helsingborg - Helsingör connection, and a western bypass of Copenhagen.


----------



## Ingenioren

Such a long tunnel with very low speed-limit would induce sleep i guess...


----------



## Fender56

Many new road projects, have been added at VD.dk.:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/temaniveau.asp?page=dept&objno=74356


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Denmark starts signing tourist destinations on motorways:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Kliplev - Sønderborg Motorway*

New aerials from March 2011.

1. interchange with E45.









2. exit Søgard.









3. Near Felsted.


4. exit Vester Sottrup









5. exit Sønderborg-Vest


----------



## SeanT

ChrisZwolle said:


> Denmark starts signing tourist destinations on motorways:


Theese as well.



Stevns Klint
Møns Klint
Middelaldercentret
Knuthenborg
Nakskov Fjord
Bon Bon Land
Ladbyskibet
H.C. Andersens Hus
Odense Zoo


----------



## SeanT

By SeanTat 2011-04-
U/C
Planned
Miner Projects


----------



## Ingenioren

Why so small?


----------



## SeanT

Ingenioren said:


> Why so small?


 Denmark is a little country...as you know:lol:


----------



## kubam4a1

2 questions:
Why entire O4 is not going to be upgraded to motorway standard?
Is the whole O3 2x3 (3+3) now?


----------



## kosimodo

And here a week old update from 15 Bording-Funder with the Funder Aadalbridge.

I was invited at the Transport 2011 in Herning. I couldnt resist taking a small detour 

Most of the bridges are ready and the body is getting visible.


----------



## Ingenioren

kubam4a1 said:


> 2 questions:
> Why entire O4 is not going to be upgraded to motorway standard?
> Is the whole O3 2x3 (3+3) now?


I'm assuming you mean Motorring 3, that is E47+E55 and it's 3+3 except for trough some intersections, O3 is 2+2 bouleward.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Ain't she a beauty?


Great Belt Bridge by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

picture taken today


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The widest Danish motorvej: E20/E47/E55 multiplex between Ishøj Interchange and Greve-Nord. 2x5 lanes for 1 km.


E20 2x5 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## Shifty2k5

Where are you headed Chris?


----------



## kosimodo

the BBQ was heated 2 day....


----------



## SeanT

Indeed, we have a wonderful easter-weather.Lovely


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I'm back from Denmark. Of interest is the catenary lighting you can see everywhere in and around København. Because it's all very rusty it has a great 1960's atmosphere.


Ballerup Boulevard by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Construction of the Kliplev Motorway Interchange. The new Sønderborg Motorway will start here at E45, and run east towards Sønderborg. Opening in 2012.


E45-Sonderborgmotorvejen-1 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


E45-Sonderborgmotorvejen-2 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Frederikssund Motorway*

The Frederikssundmotorvejen is currently U/C between Motorring 3 and Motorring 4 in the western København Metropolitan Area. The western part is mainly the reconfiguration of the existing Jyllingevej. New interchanges will be constructed at the Nordre Ringvej and Motorring 3.

Here are a few pictures from Sunday:

Frederikssundmotorvejen-1 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


Frederikssundmotorvejen-2 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


Frederikssundmotorvejen-3 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


Frederikssundmotorvejen-4 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


Frederikssundmotorvejen-5 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


Frederikssundmotorvejen-6 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20 Great Belt Bridge*


Great Belt Bridge by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

The Storebæltsbroen or Great Belt Bridge is a 19 kilometer long fixed link between the islands of Fyn and Sjælland in Denmark. The bridge carries 4 lanes of the E20 motorway and the tolls are € 31 or 220 DKK each way.

The clearance below the deck is a staggering 65 meters and the pylons are 254 meters tall, taller than any other building in Denmark.


----------



## kosimodo

^^Pfff! 
U beat me.. I took today almost the same pics at Frederisksundmotorvejen. I will take a look this weekend if i have something new to add.


----------



## snowman159

Thanks for the pictures! Looking forward to the rest of your exploits. 

I really like Danish motorway signage - very simple but effective. What a contrast to the mess that are Austrian signs.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

First video!


----------



## Uppsala

ChrisZwolle said:


> I'm back from Denmark. Of interest is the catenary lighting you can see everywhere in and around København. Because it's all very rusty it has a great 1960's atmosphere.
> 
> 
> Ballerup Boulevard by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


More and more of them are changed to new ones in the areas around København. But Denmark never had catenary lighting as much as Netherlands and the UK. And I had never seen SOX-lights in Denmark like they have very much in the Netherlands and the UK.


----------



## katia72

Nice pictures ChrisZwolle
I have been many times in Denmark, like very much to drive there. They have generally much better standard of highways and the streets than Norway. I can`t understand how they can afford it and Norway not. It makes me so angry....!!!


----------



## Uppsala

katia72 said:


> Nice pictures ChrisZwolle
> I have been many times in Denmark, like very much to drive there. They have generally much better standard of highways and the streets than Norway. I can`t understand how they can afford it and Norway not. It makes me so angry....!!!


Many people lives in a small area in Denmark. Very few people live in a big area in Norway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Only eastern Sjælland is densely populated. This is also the only place where six-lane motorways can be found (apart from the Lillebælt Bridge). However, E45 needs six-laning. Especially the section between Århus and Kolding has a huge amount of truck traffic.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

New video: Motorring 3 of Copenhagen. This bypass was recently widened to 2x3 lanes and it looks very good. Also seen is the new interchange with the Frederikssunds Motorway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E47 Køge - Rødbyhavn*

This photo set follows E47 southbound from the Køge-Vest interchange with E20 to the southern terminus at Rødbyhavn. The motorway runs across the islands of Sjælland, Falster and Lolland. There are two major engineering objects; a large bridge and a tunnel that connects the three islands. The speed limit is mostly 130 km/h, but the southern section across Lolland is mostly limited at 110 km/h because shoulders are absent here. Traffic volumes are very low, especially south of Vordingborg. This set follows about 120 kilometers of motorway.

Route map:









1.

IMG_6586 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

2.

IMG_6589 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

3.

IMG_6590 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

4.

IMG_6591 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

5.

IMG_6592 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

6.

IMG_6593 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

7.

IMG_6596 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

8.

IMG_6597 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

9.

IMG_6598 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

10.

IMG_6600 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

11.

IMG_6601 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

12.

IMG_6606 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

13.

IMG_6607 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

14.

IMG_6609 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

15.

IMG_6610 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

16.

IMG_6612 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

17.

IMG_6614 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

18.

IMG_6615 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

19.

IMG_6616 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

20.

IMG_6618 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

21.

IMG_6619 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

22.

IMG_6620 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

23.

IMG_6622 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

24.

IMG_6623 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

25.

IMG_6625 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

26.

IMG_6627 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

27.

IMG_6629 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

28.

IMG_6628 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

29.

IMG_6630 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

30.

IMG_6632 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

31.

IMG_6634 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

32.

IMG_6635 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

33.

IMG_6637 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

34.

IMG_6638 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

35.

IMG_6639 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

36.

IMG_6641 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

37.

IMG_6644 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

38.

IMG_6642 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

39.

IMG_6643 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

40.

IMG_6647 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

41.

IMG_6648 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

42.

IMG_6650 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

43.

IMG_6652 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

44.

IMG_6654 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

45.

IMG_6655 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

46.

IMG_6656 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

47.

IMG_6658 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

48.

IMG_6660 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

49.

IMG_6661 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

50.

IMG_6663 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

51.

IMG_6666 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

52.

IMG_6667 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

53.

IMG_6669 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

54.

IMG_6668 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

55.

IMG_6670 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

56.

IMG_6672 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

57.

IMG_6673 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

58.

IMG_6674 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

59.

IMG_6676 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

60.

IMG_6678 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

61.

IMG_6680 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Are there speed cameras in Denmark? I have never seen one on my travels. Most people don't seem to speed anyway, even the 130 km/h limit on motorways is not reached by most traffic. 

Another interesting observation I made in Denmark is the way traffic lights work. For instance, I noticed two types of left turns; protected and unprotected left turns. Protected left turns have their own phase with no conflicts. These left turns are usually separated from the other directions by a small traffic island. This is most common on important intersections on multi-lane urban boulevards.

Unprotected left-turns seem widespread, and you will have to await traffic in the other directions that passes straight through the intersection. Another thing I noticed is that right turns and cyclist/pedestrian crossings are usually also not conflict-free. If you make a right-turn, you will notice the pedestrian/cyclist traffic light will go green 2 - 3 seconds earlier, after which you can turn right. However, you must still yield to cyclists/pedestrian going straight ahead.

Comparing this to the Netherlands, I must say I'm very pleased with the Danish system. Although it may seem somewhat less safe, the Netherlands is overprotective, with almost no conflicts. Left, right, ahead, cyclists, pedestrians, etc all have their conflict-free phases. This adds significantly to the whole cycle phase duration of a signaled intersection. In Denmark you usually do not have to wait more than 1 or 2 phases at intersections, while in the Netherlands it's common to have to wait 3 or 4 phases.


----------



## DanielFigFoz

People don't even reach the speed limit in Denmark?! :lol:!


----------



## SeanT

ChrisZwolle said:


> Are there speed cameras in Denmark? I have never seen one on my travels. Most people don't seem to speed anyway, even the 130 km/h limit on motorways is not reached by most traffic.
> 
> Another interesting observation I made in Denmark is the way traffic lights work. For instance, I noticed two types of left turns; protected and unprotected left turns. Protected left turns have their own phase with no conflicts. These left turns are usually separated from the other directions by a small traffic island. This is most common on important intersections on multi-lane urban boulevards.
> 
> Unprotected left-turns seem widespread, and you will have to await traffic in the other directions that passes straight through the intersection. Another thing I noticed is that right turns and cyclist/pedestrian crossings are usually also not conflict-free. If you make a right-turn, you will notice the pedestrian/cyclist traffic light will go green 2 - 3 seconds earlier, after which you can turn right. However, you must still yield to cyclists/pedestrian going straight ahead.
> 
> Comparing this to the Netherlands, I must say I'm very pleased with the Danish system. Although it may seem somewhat less safe, the Netherlands is overprotective, with almost no conflicts. Left, right, ahead, cyclists, pedestrians, etc all have their conflict-free phases. This adds significantly to the whole cycle phase duration of a signaled intersection. In Denmark you usually do not have to wait more than 1 or 2 phases at intersections, while in the Netherlands it's common to have to wait 3 or 4 phases.


 on main roads, very few places


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I found out something interesting. Out of all motorway sections of E20 (Esbjerg - København), either end of the Storebælt Strait were the first to be constructed, both in 1957. In both cases, there wouldn't be a complete motorway until into the 1980's. The Storebælt Bridge wasn't completed until 1998, no less than 41 years after the first motorway connections on either side were constructed. 

Is there a particular reason for this? Was the Great Belt Bridge (Storebælt) already planned in the 1950's? Or were these early sections just places where traffic could queue before the ferry at peak days? 

It's interesting, because these seemingly low-importance sections (at that time) were opened only one year after the first motorway in Denmark. 

I visualized it here:


----------



## Fender56

ChrisZwolle said:


> I found out something interesting. Out of all motorway sections of E20 (Esbjerg - København), either end of the Storebælt Strait were the first to be constructed, both in 1957. In both cases, there wouldn't be a complete motorway until into the 1980's. The Storebælt Bridge wasn't completed until 1998, no less than 41 years after the first motorway connections on either side were constructed.
> 
> Is there a particular reason for this? Was the Great Belt Bridge (Storebælt) already planned in the 1950's? Or were these early sections just places where traffic could queue before the ferry at peak days?
> 
> It's interesting, because these seemingly low-importance sections (at that time) were opened only one year after the first motorway in Denmark.


Chris you know, as early as in the fifties a steel bridge was planned, but at that time it would ruin the afterwar Denmark. During the sixties and seventies, a lot of different plans was discussed, but again other major infrastructure projects came first.

A lot of problems influenced the construction, the Great Belt is a major traffic route from the intire Baltic region, so the hight of the bridge was very important, and thats one of the reasons, we could not build it in the fifties. At that time, it would have had a clearence of only 30-40 meters. 

Today, the excisting clearence hight of approx 65m is allready a problem to the huge newbuildings from the Baltic area. The next major project, the "Fehmarn Sund Tunnel", build by Denmark, will offcourse not have the same problems, unless the ships has a severe and unnatural draft.!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Wow, Vejdirektoratet is on a roll! It seems like the Netherlands and Denmark are the only two countries in northwestern Europe with a lot of road projects these days. Progress has stalled significantly in Germany, Ireland and France, not to mention Belgium and the United Kingdom where not much has happened in the last 2 decades.


----------



## Aphelion

ChrisZwolle said:


> Wow, Vejdirektoratet is on a roll! It seems like the Netherlands and Denmark are the only two countries in northwestern Europe with a lot of road projects these days. Progress has stalled significantly in Germany, Ireland and France, not to mention Belgium and the United Kingdom where not much has happened in the last 2 decades.


Sweden isn't too bad either, considering our population density.


----------



## sotonsi

Worth pointing out that while Ireland's pace has slowed down, it built its network very quickly, with the 'interurbans' all being finished in the last 18 months, and most of the work done in the last few years - when you open 75% of your planned network in 2 years, the pace is going to slow down!

There's not much left of the planned network to actually build - M/N11 from Dublin down to halfway between Enniscorthy and Wexford (but with a gap or two in motorway status - I think it comes out at 2 schemes), Gort to Tuam and Limerick to Cork. The last one being the only one that's actually needed urgently, and others are nice-to-haves with not massive flows of traffic (but then a lot of the current network is quiet anyway). There's still tons of little projects on more minor roads too, but they got held back for the big projects and now due to the debt and lack of demand for lots of new housing which was the driving force behind many of them.

The UK has done a ton of motorway widening in the last few years - the M25 has had billions poured into widening it since the year 2000, and the M1, M6 and M62 have had large scale widening projects planned, with at least some parts coming into fruition, Scotland has had a boom in motorways this year, what with the M80 phase 1 opening in Feb, M74 opening today, M80 phase 2 finishing in the Autumn and M8 completion given the green light. Upgrades to the A/M90 route are planned - a couple of billionaire projects there. So it's not like not much has happened, it's just that not much that wasn't widening or in Scotland has happened.


----------



## Coccodrillo

Nikolaj's link doesn't work!


----------



## Nikolaj

Coccodrillo said:


> Nikolaj's link doesn't work!


We try again:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/Hent/3_Limfjordsforbindelse/Rapport379_net.pdf

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/Hent/3_Limfjordsforbindelse/Rapport379_del2_net.pdf

The second one gives the best overview. The other one is very text heavy.


----------



## Fender56

4 new 130 km/h highway stretches from newyear.:

•Midtjyske motorvej. Det drejer sig om strækningen fra Skanderborg søerne frem til motorvejskryds Århus Syd (M60, fra km 151 til 165)

•Esbjergsmotorvejen. Strækningen er tæt ved Esbjerg havn (M52, fra km 286 til 292)

•Vestmotorvejen. Her er der tale om strækningen fra den østlige tilslutning til Slagelse og frem til det sted, hvor der ikke længere er nødspor på Vestmotorvejen (M20, fra km 86 til 97)

•Nordjyske motorvej. Strækningen går fra Sønderup, hvor rute 13 fra Viborg tilsluttes motorvejen, frem til Dall i den sydlige udkant af Aalborg (M70, fra km 261,7 til 284)

Link.:

http://www.trm.dk/da/nyheder/2011/nye+strækninger+med+130+kmt/


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ Nice.

What I noticed this year (I think it was E20 / Vestmotorvejen) that the median guardrail was lacking every now and then, and they installed a brief 90 km/h speed limit. Any reason why?


----------



## Aphelion

^^ There are some small gaps on E47 / Sydmotorvejen as well, but there is no decrease to 90 km/h. Just before the gaps, there are signs reading "Autovaern mangler" (No median guardrail). These gaps are probably there to facilitate emergency vehicle mobility, or am I wrong?


----------



## Fender56

ChrisZwolle said:


> ^^ Nice.
> 
> What I noticed this year (I think it was E20 / Vestmotorvejen) that the median guardrail was lacking every now and then, and they installed a brief 90 km/h speed limit. Any reason why?


The four stretches I mention above, will *all* have new and safer guardrails, before newyear. That´s why the speedlimit is not raised now.

:cheers:


----------



## kanterberg

From BBC

"Denmark, one of the Schengen states, is to re-impose controls on its frontiers with Germany and Sweden within weeks, amid pressure from the right."

The Danish Parliament approved the bill today, but no one seems to be able to explain what this will actually mean at the border. Is this just customs inspections or actual border checks (passports/id)? If it's the latter it certainly seems like a violation of both Schengen and the Nordic passport union?

Again, if it's only customs inspections maybe this whole thing is a bit exaggerated in the press: Sweden has had customs inspections at the Oresund bridge for years... and the Swedish Customs Service has more people employed in the province of Scania alone than their Danish counterpart has in the whole country.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I think the wild-west stories about the border checks are somewhat exaggerated, I've read the Danish customs will employ 30 people along the German border. I mean, how much can you check with 30 people at a dozen border crossings 24/7? This hardly exceeds the regular "random" checks every country is still allowed to do.


----------



## Fender56

kanterberg said:


> From BBC
> 
> "Denmark, one of the Schengen states, is to re-impose controls on its frontiers with Germany and Sweden within weeks, amid pressure from the right."
> 
> The Danish Parliament approved the bill today, but no one seems to be able to explain what this will actually mean at the border. Is this just customs inspections or actual border checks (passports/id)? If it's the latter it certainly seems like a violation of both Schengen and the Nordic passport union?
> 
> Again, if it's only customs inspections maybe this whole thing is a bit exaggerated in the press: Sweden has had customs inspections at the Oresund bridge for years... and the Swedish Customs Service has more people employed in the province of Scania alone than their Danish counterpart has in the whole country.


The extra controls are only customs, but the police naturally can make controls whenever they like, just like any other country within the EU. But the media have seen it as a big thing which it naturally isn´t.


----------



## sotonsi

Oh it is, because we should be 'one Europe' with no borders and anyone that disagrees is called a Nazi by our esteemed President Rumpey-Pumpey and other top Eurocrats.

Odd that we can have customs barriers, the EU being, first and foremost, a customs union. Then again, Britain has customs (not just passport control) after the Calais-Dover ferry.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I started to work on my video backlog of Denmark.

Here's the latest: 

Primærrute or Primary Route 21 into Copenhagen. It's one of the older motorways of Denmark, which is visible, it appears somewhat worn out.


----------



## Comfortably Numb

ChrisZwolle said:


> I started to work on my video backlog of Denmark.
> 
> Here's the latest:
> 
> Primærrute or Primary Route 21 into Copenhagen. It's one of the older motorways of Denmark, which is visible, it appears somewhat worn out.


Even though the roads do appear somewhat worn, I do like Danish signage and the overhead gantries. It looks simple, concise and easy to read. It appears quite different from other European countries that traditionally use the blue motorway signage. Is there any reason why Denmark uses green, but blue for the exits (as in at 1:37 in the video)?


----------



## Road_UK

COPENHAGEN - Denmark on Friday approved a decision to re-establish permanent customs checkpoints at its borders, removing the last hurdle to a plan aimed at stopping crime and illegal immigration but which has been strongly criticized in Europe as violating visa-free travel rules.

The 17-member parliamentary Finance Committee announced the approval after lawmakers voted to reject an opposition motion to abandon it.

Germany and the European Union say border checkpoints violate EU rules on unrestricted travel in the Schengen zone and regulations on free movement within the bloc. In Denmark, opponents say it is a sop to nationalists, business organizations fear it will harm Danish exports and locals envision long lines of cars waiting to cross borders.

The new controls being introduced over several years include new customs buildings at crossings, lower speed limits at checkpoints and new equipment for reading license plates of passing vehicles.

Danish officials expect to have 98 additional customs offiers at crossing points. On Tuesday, about 50 of them will join the country's 142-man force at the borders with Germany and Sweden.

The government has insisted that customs checks will be random and will not include checking passports.

It has said the plan would not violate any rules and that it will work closely with the EU head office in Brussels. The EU is concerned that the plan will send out a wrong signal at a time when European nations are bickering over both borders and currency.

The finance committee that approved the decision is controlled by the centre-right government and its ally, the nationalist Danish People's Party, which had been pushing for the plan.

The opposition has vowed to make changes to the plan if it wins elections that have to be held before Nov. 12. The opposition has been leading in opinion pools in recent months.

"The plan is useless, expensive," said Anders Samuelsen, chairman of Liberal Alliance, a small centre party. "It is a waste of the taxpayers' money and a hindrance to Danish businesses."

The Schengen zone, considered one of the cornerstones of European unity, was created in 1985. Border controls were abolished and replaced by random customs and police checks. Today, it has grown to 25 nations.

When Denmark joined the Schengen zone in 1991, border barriers, control stations and uniformed officers were removed.

Source: 570news.


----------



## Aphelion

Comfortably Numb said:


> Even though the roads do appear somewhat worn, I do like Danish signage and the overhead gantries. It looks simple, concise and easy to read. It appears quite different from other European countries that traditionally use the blue motorway signage. Is there any reason why Denmark uses green, but blue for the exits (as in at 1:37 in the video)?


The standard of the road you exit unto decides what the colour will be, e.g. blue if you exit unto a regular road.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Funny that regular roads have white signage with red letters, not blue-white signs.

But it's easy to distinguish motorway to non-motorway interchanges, especially where exit density is high such as in the Copenhagen metropolitan area.


----------



## Comfortably Numb

Aphelion said:


> The standard of the road you exit unto decides what the colour will be, e.g. blue if you exit unto a regular road.


That's actually very useful information by colour coding the actual exits, where you might have more complex interchanges with multiple interchanges (motorway, non-motorway and even lesser road).


----------



## kalaha

ChrisZwolle said:


> Funny that regular roads have white signage with red letters, not blue-white signs.
> 
> But it's easy to distinguish motorway to non-motorway interchanges, especially where exit density is high such as in the Copenhagen metropolitan area.


On non-motorways are all overhead signs also blue with white text.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ The same for this bridge, it carries the train service from København to Hamburg. It will be widened to double track of the Fehmarnbelt Tunnel is constructed, however I wonder how they will do it on the existing bridge. It appears to me a new bridge needs to be constructed. Another option is to build a new road bridge and use the entire existing bridge for rail.


----------



## Road_UK

I always thought the train from Kopenhagen to Hamburg uses the Scandlines ferry from Rödby to Puttgarden. I sometimes see that train on the cardeck.


----------



## Uppsala

Road_UK said:


> I always thought the train from Kopenhagen to Hamburg uses the Scandlines ferry from Rödby to Puttgarden. I sometimes see that train on the cardeck.


Most of the trains from Copenhagen to Hamburg use the ferry from Rödby to Puttgarden. But the night trains from Denmark to Germany are going over Great Belt and Little Belt. All freight trains from Denmark to Germany are going over Great Belt and Little Belt.


----------



## Road_UK

Ah, ok.
I never use any of these bridges. It's just as fast and expensive to use the ferry from Puttgarden to Rödby and Helsingör to Helsingborg.


----------



## Uppsala

Road_UK said:


> Ah, ok.
> I never use any of these bridges. It's just as fast and expensive to use the ferry from Puttgarden to Rödby and Helsingör to Helsingborg.


I never use the ferry from Helsingborg to Helsingör. I only use the Öresund bridge from Malmö to Copenhagen.


----------



## Road_UK

Not much difference in time and price, seeing that we get the "Sweden Ticket" at Puttgarden.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Road_UK said:


> I always thought the train from Kopenhagen to Hamburg uses the Scandlines ferry from Rödby to Puttgarden. I sometimes see that train on the cardeck.


Yep, and they also use the Storstrøm Bridge (which is between Sjælland and Falster). 



Road_UK said:


> Not much difference in time and price, seeing that we get the "Sweden Ticket" at Puttgarden.


That's correct. Overall, it makes little difference in time and money to take the ferries or the bridges. However, with a diesel car, the bridges tend to be somewhat cheaper because you spend less on fuel for the detour. But the difference is usually not that big. I guess it's your personal taste to take the bridges or the ferry.

I always use the bridges, first of all because they're awesome to drive across, and second of all, I don't like to be tied to reservation times and/or not knowing if there is a space for you on the next ferry. The only times I went via the ferries in that area was an overnighter by truck. Travemünde - Trelleborg and Malmö - Travemünde back.


----------



## Road_UK

ChrisZwolle said:


> I don't like to be tied to reservation times and/or not knowing if there is a space for you on the next ferry.


On Scandlines there is always room for you. Ferries between Puttgarden and Rödby, and Helsingör and Helsingborg run average every 20 minutes - crossing time between Germany and Denmark 45 minutes, and between Denmark and Sweden 20 minutes. My boss books it over the internet, picks out a random time, and it's up to us if we want to make it on that particular ferry or not. Tickets are usually valid for one year anyway. I like using those ferries, good excuse to stop for a coffee. And food on the German-Danish ferries is exellent!

Edit: There is no detour if you're travelling to for example Stockholm using the above mentioned ferries. Copenhagen to Helsingor runs parallel from Malmö to Helsingborg, which you're passing anyway on your way to Stockholm.


----------



## Uppsala

Road_UK said:


> On Scandlines there is always room for you. Ferries between Puttgarden and Rödby, and Helsingör and Helsingborg run average every 20 minutes - crossing time between Germany and Denmark 45 minutes, and between Denmark and Sweden 20 minutes. My boss books it over the internet, picks out a random time, and it's up to us if we want to make it on that particular ferry or not. Tickets are usually valid for one year anyway. I like using those ferries, good excuse to stop for a coffee. And food on the German-Danish ferries is exellent!
> 
> Edit: There is no detour if you're travelling to for example Stockholm using the above mentioned ferries. Copenhagen to Helsingor runs parallel from Malmö to Helsingborg, which you're passing anyway on your way to Stockholm.


If I go from Stockholm to Germany I take the bridge over Öresund from Malmö to Copenhagen and the bridge over Great Belt from Korsör to Nyborg. No ferry.


----------



## Road_UK

Never been on any of these bridges. Always use Scandlines.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

My latest and probably last video of Denmark from this year's Easter trip.

The Primærrute 16 - Hillerød Motorway in greater Copenhagen.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> ^^ The same for this bridge, it carries the train service from København to Hamburg. It will be widened to double track of the Fehmarnbelt Tunnel is constructed, however I wonder how they will do it on the existing bridge. It appears to me a new bridge needs to be constructed. Another option is to build a new road bridge and use the entire existing bridge for rail.


Not correct. The Railway across The Storstrøm will remain single track, even after completion of the Fehmarnbelt Tunnel. It will be the only section of single track between Copenhagen and the Fehmarnbelt Tunnel. Remaining section will be double track and electrified. It is not yet decided if the railway between Ringsted and Rødby (Fehmarnbelt tunnel) - except for the bridge across the Storstrøm - will be upgraded to 160 or 200 km/h. Between Copenhagen and Ringsted a new 60 km 250 km/h railway is being constructed.


----------



## kanterberg

*Congestion charging in CPH?*

There's an article in a Swedish newspaper today about possible future congestion charge in Copenhagen. According to the article a congestion charge, simular to what we have in Stockholm, would be implemented in Copenhagen in case there's a change of government after the election. 

I know there's been talk of road pricing in Denmark before, but how fast could this be implemented? The article I saw mentioned a high figure, something like 11 000 DKK/year for those who commute every day.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Is there actually severe congestion there, or is it just an easy way to add more taxes?


----------



## kapo311

Yes, the Social democrats want to implement congestions charge in CPH. The fee would be 25 DKK per entry during rush hours, less on other times. 

Here's map of the area and control points.
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UT...d&ll=55.701775




ChrisZwolle said:


> Is there actually severe congestion there, or is it just an easy way to add more taxes?


If you ask me, there is no congestion in Copenhagen. Some danish politicians tend to think that waiting a few minutes at red light is congestion. If compared to other cities in Europe it is a joke to talk about congestion in CPH.

Instead i think they will get a lot more problems after implementing this system, due to drivers finding alternative routes, PT not able to cope with extra passengers, etc. Already now using PT during bad weather days is a nightmare. So it is all a big scam imo.


----------



## Road_UK

kapo311 said:


> Yes, the Social democrats want to implement congestions charge in CPH. The fee would be 25 DKK per entry during rush hours, less on other times.
> 
> Here's map of the area and control points.
> http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UT...d&ll=55.701775
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you ask me, there is no congestion in Copenhagen. Some danish politicians tend to think that waiting a few minutes at red light is congestion. If compared to other cities in Europe it is a joke to talk about congestion in CPH.
> 
> Instead i think they will get a lot more problems after implementing this system, due to drivers finding alternative routes, PT not able to cope with extra passengers, etc. Already now using PT during bad weather days is a nightmare. So it is all a big scam imo.


If they implement the same system as in Stockholm, it can be ignored by drivers of foreign registered vehicles. The amount of times I've driven through Stockholm city centre, in my English registered van... It says 20 SK on the displays, but I wouldn't even know where to pay it. So I keep going - catch that ferry to Finland...


----------



## kanterberg

Road_UK said:


> If they implement the same system as in Stockholm, it can be ignored by drivers of foreign registered vehicles. The amount of times I've driven through Stockholm city centre, in my English registered van... It says 20 SK on the displays, but I wouldn't even know where to pay it. So I keep going - catch that ferry to Finland...


That's because the congestion charge in Stockholm is technically a tax... so far they haven't been able to figure how to tax foreign nationals. 

The Danes, however, seem to have found a way around that problem. To bad for all the Swedes commuting over the bridge everyday... do they get to vote on this?


----------



## cinxxx

These leftish politicians have their brains filled with void. Just taking advantage of high life standard to impose ridiculous taxes...


----------



## eusimcity4

SeanT said:


> Holbæk-Motorvej(Motorway)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> IMG]http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/3298/18072011007.jpg[/IMG]
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By zSeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> By SeanT at 2011-07-25


The highway seems good and renovated!


----------



## Nikolaj

A couple of years ago it was established that there was a huge maintenance backlog on the Danish motorways and other main roads. As a result The Road Directorate (Vejdirektoratet) has received substantial extra funds from government for maintenance over the period 2010-2013. Large part of the network has therefor been renovated over the past couple of years - or will be until 2013. The extra funds are allocated to to surface maintenance - new asphalt layer - and for extra bridge maintenance. Ot is expected that the maintenance backlog will be a thing of the past by 2013.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

They seem to focus mainly on bridge maintenance these days. København was full of short bridge road works.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> They seem to focus mainly on bridge maintenance these days. København was full of short bridge road works.


You are right in that observation. The initial 2 years with extra funding focused mainly on pavement rehabilitation, whereas main focus now and the next cuple of years will be on bridge maintenance. However substantial parts of the network has received pavement rehabilitation and maintenance also in 2011 and the same will happen in 2012, according to Vejdirektoratet press releases.


----------



## Nikolaj

*3rd Limfjord Crossing E39 and E45*

Detailed presentation of the 3 alternatives for a new Limfjord Motorway Crossing - presented at Public Meeting held by Vejdirektoratet.

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/Hent/3_Limfjordsforbindelse/3_LIMFJORDFORBINDELSE_BORGERMOEDE.pdf

The Public Hearing ends today.


----------



## Shifty2k5

ChrisZwolle said:


> They seem to focus mainly on bridge maintenance these days. København was full of short bridge road works.


Too bad for you, the majority of motorways got new asphalt during the summer, right after you did your roadtrip


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Nikolaj said:


> Detailed presentation of the 3 alternatives for a new Limfjord Motorway Crossing - presented at Public Meeting held by Vejdirektoratet.
> 
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/Hent/3_Limfjordsforbindelse/3_LIMFJORDFORBINDELSE_BORGERMOEDE.pdf
> 
> The Public Hearing ends today.


Very interesting. All three variants seem solid to me.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Sekundærrute 501 - Århus*

Secondary Route 501 is one of only two secondary routes which have motorway status. It serves as a southern entrance to the city of Århus. It has a quite nice descent into the city. It's only 9 kilometers long and opened to traffic in 1977.


SR501-1 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-2 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-3 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-4 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-5 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-6 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-7 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-8 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-9 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-10 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-11 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-12 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-13 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-14 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-15 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-16 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


SR501-17 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> *Sekundærrute 501 - Århus*
> 
> Secondary Route 501 is one of only two secondary routes which have motorway status. It serves as a southern entrance to the city of Århus. It has a quite nice descent into the city. It's only 9 kilometers long and opened to traffic in 1977.
> 
> ]SR501-17[/url] by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


Another example of a motorway that was in need of pavement maintenance. Since those pictures were taken (in the spring i guess) the road has received a new asphalt layer.

BTW. on the last 2 pictures a road work can be seen in the distance. That is the first phase of the socalled Marselis tunnel that will continue the motorway all the way to the port of Aarhus (Århus is the old spelling that was changed 01.01.2011). Until now the motorway ends at a signal controlled level crossing with the Ring 2. In the first phase a new underpass will be constructed under the Ring 2, and the motorway will continue as a non-motorway 2+2 road for about 2 km. In the second phase a new approx. 2 km tunnel underneath Marsel Boulevard.


http://www.marselisboulevard.dk/


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*PR 15 - Silkeborg Motorway*

The Primærrute 15, or Primary Route 15, is the principal east-west motorway across central Jutland. It connects Aarhus with Herning, but is still broken into two sections until the Silkeborg bypass will be completed. Here are photos I took in April 2011.

map:










PR15-1 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-3 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-4 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-6 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-7 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-9 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-10 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-12 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-13 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-15 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-16 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-17 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-20 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-21 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-22 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-23 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-25 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-26 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-27 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-29 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-30 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-33 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-34 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-37 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-38 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-39 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-41 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-43 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-44 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-46 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-47 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-49 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR15-50 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Primærrute 18 - Midtjyske Motorway*

The Primærrute 18 (Primary Route 18) will form a motorway across central Jutland (Jylland), connecting Herning with Vejle and the national motorway network. Some sections already opened around 2006, 2007 and 2008, more is underway. 

These photos cover the southern segment near Give. It's partially already a 2x2 motorway, further east it's a half-profile motorway with two-way traffic. 

map:


photos:

PR18-1 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-2 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-3 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-4 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-5 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-6 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-7 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-8 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-9 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-10 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-11 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-12 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-13 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-14 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-15 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-16 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


PR18-17 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## kanterberg

Just curious, how much will infrastructure policy change in Denmark with the new government? As centre-left governments tend to favor public transport, is there a risk that motorway projects will be stopped? How about the congestion charge in Copenhagen, is this likely to be implemented? Is the 130 speed limit at risk?

Denmark has done so much right when it comes to traffic and infrastructure policy in the last years, I sure hope it won't change!


----------



## Durin

When it comes to Copenhagen, the city is already governed by a centre-left coalition and this was only the parliamentary elections. Correct me if I'm wrong, but AFAIK the congestion charge was indeed proposed by the City Council and it is ultimately a local decision. The new government however seem to be very supportive.

On a national level, the outgoing government has indeed prioritized many successful projects over the years but I do hope to at least see some renewed interest for investment in Øresund infrastructure and further regional integration. For example, the outgoing government showed very little interest for the proposed HH-tunnel as they only looked nationally for solutions.

And why on earth would it be the priority of the new govt. to cancel already approved motorway projects and to lift the 130 km/h limit? Danish politics, just as Swedish, is not built on conflict but on consensus and power-sharing agreements. At least the motorway speed limit is definitely not a big issue in Danish society.

As for public transport I do hope to see some serious investment in the national rail network which is still not, in 2011, completely electrified and also carries with it ridiculous speed limitations rendering it incompatible for fair competition, at the same time utterly useless as an alternative to journeys by car.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Leftist governments are not always that bad for roads. German SPD is generally supportive of motorway construction and widenings.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Construction of a new motorway to Kalundborg will commence shortly. It's phase 1 indicated on this map:


----------



## flierfy

ChrisZwolle said:


> German SPD is generally supportive of motorway construction and widenings.


... but is no left-wing party any more.


----------



## DanielFigFoz

ChrisZwolle said:


> Leftist governments are not always that bad for roads. German SPD is generally supportive of motorway construction and widenings.


The PS in Portugal built loads.


----------



## kanterberg

Durin said:


> When it comes to Copenhagen, the city is already governed by a centre-left coalition and this was only the parliamentary elections. Correct me if I'm wrong, but AFAIK the congestion charge was indeed proposed by the City Council and it is ultimately a local decision. The new government however seem to be very supportive.


Well, that's only half true. A congestion charge, or whatever we choose to call it, around a nation's capital is never a purely local issue. I know the city council in CPH has argued for this for years, but hasn't it been blocked by the current government? 

It'll be interesting to see what happens. 



Durin said:


> On a national level, the outgoing government has indeed prioritized many successful projects over the years but I do hope to at least see some renewed interest for investment in Øresund infrastructure and further regional integration. For example, the outgoing government showed very little interest for the proposed HH-tunnel as they only looked nationally for solutions.


I agree! Another example are the ridiculous "increased border checks" along the German and Swedish borders, I imagine they will cancelled by a new majority in Parliament. 

The HH-tunnel would certainly also be very interesting and a great way to strenghten integration in the Øresund region. I guess a tunnel would eventually create demand for a Ring 5 motorway from Helsingör to Köge...



Durin said:


> And why on earth would it be the priority of the new govt. to cancel already approved motorway projects and to lift the 130 km/h limit? Danish politics, just as Swedish, is not built on conflict but on consensus and power-sharing agreements. At least the motorway speed limit is definitely not a big issue in Danish society.
> 
> As for public transport I do hope to see some serious investment in the national rail network which is still not, in 2011, completely electrified and also carries with it ridiculous speed limitations rendering it incompatible for fair competition, at the same time utterly useless as an alternative to journeys by car.


My point wasn't that centre-left governments are generally "bad for roads", I was merely curious as to what - if any - plans that had been presented during the election campaign. As you may be aware, during the last election in Sweden, both the Stockholm bypass (Förbifart Stockholm) and the 120 speed limit were issues settled by the Parliamentary election of 2010.


----------



## Fender56

My personal opinion is, we´ll see much more investment in trains vs motorways, under the new goverment. 

But saying this, I also think the new goverment, will have a short life in the parliament, they are simply to different.


----------



## Durin

kanterberg said:


> Well, that's only half true. A congestion charge, or whatever we choose to call it, around a nation's capital is never a purely local issue. I know the city council in CPH has argued for this for years, but hasn't it been blocked by the current government?


I'm officially neutral on this one as I'm commuting by train myself, which for me personally is both faster and cheaper. I just hope that if the charge is introduced, they will find a way to combine it with the Öresund bridge toll.

When the charge was introduced in Stockholm a lot of investment in public transport was promised, but so far they've managed to build (except for the planned motorway bypass) what exactly, a tram line? In Copenhagen a massive investment has been made to expand and integrate the public transport network by building the metro, which is still ongoing. So I see a Copenhagen congestion charge as more justified as it will at least bring *some* value for money.



kanterberg said:


> The HH-tunnel would certainly also be very interesting and a great way to strenghten integration in the Øresund region. I guess a tunnel would eventually create demand for a Ring 5 motorway from Helsingör to Köge...


A 5th Ring would indeed be a great and very much needed addition!



kanterberg said:


> My point wasn't that centre-left governments are generally "bad for roads", I was merely curious as to what - if any - plans that had been presented during the election campaign. As you may be aware, during the last election in Sweden, both the Stockholm bypass (Förbifart Stockholm) and the 120 speed limit were issues settled by the Parliamentary election of 2010.


I definitely see your point. What we are forgetting, compared to Sweden and Germany, is that the new government will be a 'purely' centre-left one as there is no proper Green Party in Denmark with only rail transport on their mind.


----------



## SeanT

Especially if Helsingør-Helsingborg tunnel will be a reality then a 5.ringway would be justified, maybe before!
Motorring 3 is "soon" finished and there is no space for further widening unless we remove some houses along this aea.


----------



## Nikolaj

kanterberg said:


> Just curious, how much will infrastructure policy change in Denmark with the new government? As centre-left governments tend to favor public transport, is there a risk that motorway projects will be stopped? How about the congestion charge in Copenhagen, is this likely to be implemented? Is the 130 speed limit at risk?
> 
> Denmark has done so much right when it comes to traffic and infrastructure policy in the last years, I sure hope it won't change!


Social Democrats, who will be the main party in a new coalition, have specifically stated that the 130 km/h will remain. The entire infrastructure policy until 2020 is based on a consensus agreement between all parties in Parliament, except for a small leftist party (Red/Greens), and according to Danish parliament "rules-of -the-game" such an agreemnt will not be changed even with a new government.

However it will be a new minister who shall implement the consensus agreement, and - depending on who will be the new minister - we will probably see some changes, especially changes favouring public transport, including lower fares and new light rail projects. But motorway projects allready approved are not at risk, but whether projects not allready approved will be promotes remains to be seen.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The first section of the Frederikssund Motorway will open Sunday 18 December in København, it's the first link between Motorring 3 and O4, which was previously an exit of O4 with traffic lights. The works include a new stack interchange with the Motorring 3.

The inauguration was yesterday, traffic can flow on Sunday.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Sønderborg Motorway*

The Sønderborg Motorway is almost finished. The 26 kilometer motorway will be opened on 31 March 2012. 

photos go from east to west (Sønderborg to E45)


----------



## SeanT

GROBIN said:


> Wow ! Very expensive rates ! Better carry a lot of people in the car !
> 
> Any plans to make a Helsingør (DK) - Helsingborg (S) bridge in the future ?


 Probably a tunnel, but nothing is clear for now.


----------



## Nikolaj

SeanT said:


> Probably a tunnel, but nothing is clear for now.


Sweden is very keen to go ahead with a Helsingør-Helsingborg link (called the H-H connection)for as well motorway and rail. Denmark is however very reluctant for a number of reasons. Firstly a H-H link competes with other big infrastructure projects in Denmark, with much more backing. Secondly it will require a very problematic new infrastructure to the north and west of Copenhagen. 

The current railway line and motorway between Helsingør and Copenhagen is running at full capacity with local traffic. Locally it will be hard to justify new infrastructure, it be upgrading/expanding current infrastructure or building a new Ring 5 connection west of Copenhagen, basically only to serve Swedish transit traffic (heavy goods train and lorrys). The area north and north-west of Copenhagen is sensitive in a number of ways. It is rather scenic and serve as a green lung for Copenhagen, but just as important it is the the most affluent area of Copenhagen and Denmark, meaning citizens crying up is not anybody. The NIMBY's will be those who really have a voice, business men, politicians and higher civil servants who will be personally affected of new infrastucture.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

If you build a Helsingør - Helsingborg motorway / rail tunnel, wouldn't this reduce pressure on the Øresund rail link (freight trains), in a way that the proposed subway from København to Malmö will not be necessary?


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> If you build a Helsingør - Helsingborg motorway / rail tunnel, wouldn't this reduce pressure on the Øresund rail link (freight trains), in a way that the proposed subway from København to Malmö will not be necessary?


Probably, but it will require a dedicated freight line from Helsingør around Copenhagen, which will meet stiff local/Danish opposition. The preferred solution from Danish side on the issue of freight capacity is a dedicated freight line (tunnel) from Peberholm (the artificial island in the middle of Øresund) bypassing Copenhagen Airport and connecting to the railway system just south of Copenhagen. The main capacity problem (especially freight trains in transit) on the existing Øresund connection is not the mainline railway across Øresund, but through the Airport railwaystation and the section from Copenhagen Airport to Copenhagen.


----------



## bongo-anders

Maybe someone will oppose the rail/motorway connection in the Ring 5 corridor but the lands has been reserved for this connection and has for several years (decades) so it can´t come as a surprice for the locals.


----------



## ultrags

Anybody now when Silkeborg highways finished? Are they pictures from Highway U/C Silkeborg environs.

I now they are highway to Laasby, and again from Bording.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

It will be finished in 2016. I don't know why it takes so long, the large viaduct was already significantly completed back in April when I drove there. Sønderborg Motorway is constructed much faster.

The Silkeborg area is worth a stop though. Probably the most scenic place of Denmark.


----------



## kalaha

Bording - Funder is to open in 2012. http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/dokumentniveau.asp?page=document&objno=85776
Hårup - Låsby in 2015 and Funder - Hårup in 2016. http://silkeborg.vd.dk/


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Some visualizations of the E20 widening between Odense and Middelfart:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/dokument.asp?page=document&objno=301526


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Today it's exactly 56 years ago the first motorway of Denmark opened to traffic.

Even though construction of the E47 Sydmotorvejen in Lolland started in the 1940's, the E47 Helsingørmotorvejen just north of København was the first motorway to open to traffic, on January 23rd, 1956. It was almost 8 kilometers long and ran from Kongens Lyngby to Hørsholm.


----------



## Uppsala

ChrisZwolle said:


> Today it's exactly 56 years ago the first motorway of Denmark opened to traffic.
> 
> Even though construction of the E47 Sydmotorvejen in Lolland started in the 1940's, the E47 Helsingørmotorvejen just north of København was the first motorway to open to traffic, on January 23rd, 1956. It was almost 8 kilometers long and ran from Kongens Lyngby to Hørsholm.



Looks quite similar to the Malmö-Lund motorway. And thats not so strange. Maybe they looked at that motorway when they built this one. Malmö-Lund motorway opened in 1953 so its only 3 years older.


----------



## Fender56

The VVM trials for Route 26 Viborg-Århus has been completed, and can be seen here in details.:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/pdf/MSL/Rute26_Viborg.pdf

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/pdf/MSL/Rute26_Aarhus.pdf


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Nice, at least 12.5 kilometers of new motorway planned.


----------



## Fender56

Despite hard frost, the Danish minister of transport, today took first sod on the Silkeborg Motorway. 

29 km to be completed 2016.:

http://www.trm.dk/da/nyheder/2012/minister+tager+første+spadestik+på+silkeborgmotorvejen/


----------



## kapo311

A short but very illustrative clip showing how the Femern tunnel will be built:

http://ing.dk/artikel/126510-se-hvordan-femern-vil-konstruere-saenketunnellen?bund


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The new 26 kilometer Kliplev - Sønderborg Motorway will open to traffic next Saturday, March 31st, 2012.


----------



## Fender56

Next saturday, the new Sønderborg motorway will be opened for traffic, today a marathon was arranged, probably the last time pedestrians will be alloved on the motorway.:


----------



## NordikNerd

My impressions of the danish motorway E47

Helsingör-Copenhagen: heavy traffic, lots of trucks
Copenhagen area: wide 6 lane motorway, fast paced, probably the most intense traffic in all Scandinavia. 

South of Köge where E20 splits of: Quite normal traffic, but dense
South of Storströmmen-Rödby: Few cars, easy to drive.

Danish motorways have high standard, good signage, driving is mostly relaxed (except Copenhagen area) It's a pleasure to drive on danish motorways !


----------



## Nikolaj

By the way - the pictures shown, except last one from the Farø Bridge approach, are from the section between Sakskøbing and Rødby. This section is the longest remaining unchanged section that was started during German occupation. Construction started in 1942m though it was only completed in early 60'es. The AADT remains very low at this section (7000-12000) which is probably why it has never been updated.

In conjunction with the Fehmarnbelt tunnel towards Germany - which will be located at the southern end of this section - this section will be updated with emergency lanes and modern netry and exit lanes. It is still discussed whether it will be updated to 130 km/h standard, or if sthe speed limit will remain at 110 km/h. 
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/pdf/Rapport389.pdf




NordikNerd said:


> My impressions of the danish motorway E47
> 
> Helsingör-Copenhagen: heavy traffic, lots of trucks
> Copenhagen area: wide 6 lane motorway, fast paced, probably the most intense traffic in all Scandinavia.
> 
> South of Köge where E20 splits of: Quite normal traffic, but dense
> South of Storströmmen-Rödby: Few cars, easy to drive.
> 
> Danish motorways have high standard, good signage, driving is mostly relaxed (except Copenhagen area) It's a pleasure to drive on danish motorways !


----------



## Groningen NL

^^

Is this expressway or motorway? Because it lacks emergency lanes...


----------



## Ingenioren

Motorway with 110km/h speed limit.


----------



## kalaha

A hard shoulder will be constructed as part of an upgrade prior to the Fehmarn Belt Fixed Link together with alteration of some junctions. Although, the speed will not be raised to 130 km/t, as the hard shoulder will not be contructed under some existing bridges there are too narrow.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Vejdirektoratet has a new website:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk


----------



## kosimodo

ChrisZwolle said:


> Vejdirektoratet has a new website:
> 
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk


That i should read it here from you....


----------



## Fender56

ChrisZwolle said:


> Vejdirektoratet has a new website:
> 
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk


Short comment. They have completely ruined the VD website. Earlier it was much easier to use, now its a complete disaster....

hno:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Yeah, I especially miss the press releases, now you have to click multiple times to get there.


----------



## MattiG

Fender56 said:


> Short comment. They have completely ruined the VD website. Earlier it was much easier to use, now its a complete disaster....


Have you ever seen a release 2.0 website being better than the release 1.0 in terms of usability?


----------



## Zanetti

I know this article is danish, but I guess most of you is danes in this thread 
http://jp.dk/indland/trafik/article2792774.ece

Here is some other pictures:
http://haervejskomiteen.dk/billeder-2/kort/

Which solution do you prefer?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

It surprises me they are rather serious about this motorway. The project doesn't strike me as particularly urgent, especially if its function should be to relieve E45. 

I think it's best to construct a motorway from Esbjerg to Herning and further via Viborg to E45 south of Aalborg, and maybe widen the E45 from Vejle to Aarhus to 2x3 lanes. I don't think this new motorway will attract a large volume of traffic, but it will improve the integration of central Jutland by providing fast and safe links between all major centers.


----------



## Attus

Is it really needed? I mean, Midtjyske is under construction, Viborg Hovedvej (road 13) is in very good condition and bypasses all towns.


----------



## Zanetti

I drive every day between Vejle and Aarhus and I do my best to avoid the rushhours. The lane is always filled up with trucks, so the cars has only one lane to drive. In Vejle and Skanderborg we often end up an a que and often we have stop, not because of any accident or road maintenance, it's just because there are to many cars and to low capacity. 

So we have to do something about this before it get stucked. 

A new parallel highway from Vejle to Viborg and further to Aalborg is a very good idea from my piont of view. It will also relieve the dangerous highway 13 from Vejle to Viborg.


----------



## Zanetti

Attus said:


> Is it really needed? I mean, Midtjyske is under construction, Viborg Hovedvej (road 13) is in very good condition and bypasses all towns.


I disagree.... I try to avoid road 13. There are may trucks and slows cars and diffecult to overtake these cars many places. There are also many secondary roads coming out to road 13, which also end up in dangerous situations. Last time it drove I saw at least 4 situations which have could end up in a bad way.


----------



## Fender56

Many off all your thoughts, can be seen in this pdf.:

http://www.ft.dk/samling/20111/almdel/tru/bilag/233/1083962.pdf

It looks more and more, to a western solution (A13). Widening the E45 is seen as a secondary solution!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I was thinking about expressways. Most countries have 4-lane, grade-separated expressways. Denmark doesn't have such roads to my knowledge, except maybe for a short section of Primærrute 9 in Svendborg. Is there a particular reason for this "all or nothing" phenomenon? 

I'm not aware of any 4-lane, divided & grade-separated motortrafikvejer.


----------



## Spikespiegel

ChrisZwolle said:


> I was thinking about expressways. Most countries have 4-lane, grade-separated expressways. Denmark doesn't have such roads to my knowledge, except maybe for a short section of Primærrute 9 in Svendborg. Is there a particular reason for this "all or nothing" phenomenon?
> 
> I'm not aware of any 4-lane, divided & grade-separated motortrafikvejer.


Because such a road takes up as much space as a motorway, and frankly, we'd much rather have motorways.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> I was thinking about expressways. Most countries have 4-lane, grade-separated expressways. Denmark doesn't have such roads to my knowledge, except maybe for a short section of Primærrute 9 in Svendborg. Is there a particular reason for this "all or nothing" phenomenon?
> 
> I'm not aware of any 4-lane, divided & grade-separated motortrafikvejer.


Adding to Spikesspiegel comments it is rather hard to see the reason for such a type of road. It requires as much land and the cost is more or less the same.

However the motorways around Herning (route 15 and 18) was initilly planned as as grade separated, 4-lane expressway (motortrafikvej) with emergency lanes. Allready during detailed plannig it was decided that the route 18 part shoud be signed as a motorway, but it was only very late - shortly before opening - that it was decided that the short route 15 section to the south of Herning also should be signed as motorway. It was easily done, as the Danish design specifications was/is the same as for a motorway within a city/town, ie. 3,5 m lanes and 110 km/h speed limit, where it is 3,75 m lanes and 130 km/h in open land.

Recently when Vejdirektoratet presented the plan for route 26 (Aarhus-Viborg) upgrading on the sections close to Aarhus and around Viborg, it was announced that the section close to Aarhus was planned to be a 130 km/h motorway, where the relatively short section around Viborg, which will be within Viborg city/townboundaries, was to be 110 km/h 4-lane grade separated expressway/motortrafikvej. My interpretation for this was that until the Viborg section was connected to the motorway network this section would be signed as a expressway/motortrafikvej, and then when connected to the motorway network easily re-signed as a motorway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Another motorway project is shaping up now the EIA has been released of the upgrade of Skovvejen to motorway to Kalundborg. It will mainly use the existing alignment, except for the last few kilometers near Kalundborg.

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/skovvejen/nyheder/Sider/VVM-redegørelse-klar.aspx


----------



## Nikolaj

Another EIA for a motorway project was published a week ago. This time it is the Route 18 Herning-Holstebro.
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/holstebro-herning/Documents/Rute18_rapport416_web.pdf

The main issue is whether the motorway should go south-west around Herning or more logically east of Herning, and whether it at the northern end should end south of Holstebro or north of Holstebro.

Local politicians want it to go south-west around Herning and end to the north of Holstebro, but looking at the trafiic forecast for the different alignments, it is obvious that it should go to the east of Herning and end before Holstebro.

According to the EIA the motorway can be completed 2017-2020, depending on funding.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Today 12 years ago 









July 1, 2000: the Øresund Bridge opens to traffic, linking Denmark and Sweden.


----------



## SeanT

What about the upcoming route 21 expressway? Is it going to be a 2+2 or a single one? Big signs indicate that the danish goverment gives 1.6 billion DKK to this project. I saw these signs last weekend and last summer as well!


----------



## SeanT

Probably Holbæk-west - Vig expressway?


----------



## Nikolaj

SeanT said:


> Probably Holbæk-west - Vig expressway?


It will be 2+1 expressway, and the first Danish one with a cable barrier in the median. Cable barriers has been a no-go i Denmark since mid-90'es with some motorway accidents, where it was claimed that the cable barrier was the cause. All cable barriers/guardrails on Danish motorways were replaced with the usual steel guardrails, which since that has been standard equipment.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*PR-21 Holbæk Motorway*

The widening of the Primærrute 21 - Holbæk Motorway - has been completed this weekend. The motorway has been widened from 2x2 to 2x3 lanes, partially also 2x4 lanes. The widening took 3 years and has cost 2.2 billion DKK / € 295 million for 11 kilometers.


----------



## kosimodo

ChrisZwolle said:


> I was thinking about expressways. Most countries have 4-lane, grade-separated expressways. Denmark doesn't have such roads to my knowledge, except maybe for a short section of Primærrute 9 in Svendborg. Is there a particular reason for this "all or nothing" phenomenon?
> 
> I'm not aware of any 4-lane, divided & grade-separated motortrafikvejer.


South of Viborg, RNR 26; Hillerød, RNR 19 are other examples


----------



## Nikolaj

kosimodo said:


> South of Viborg, RNR 26; Hillerød, RNR 19 are other examples


Route 26 south of Viborg is not an expressway (motortrafikvej). It has dual carriageway (4-lanes), but only partly grade separated.

Route 19 around Hlillerød is an expressway (motortrafikvej), but not dual carriageway (as far as i remember)


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Primærrute 19 is a 1x2 / 2+1 road near Hillerød. The 2x2 section starts at the southern exit of Allerød. Motorway status also begins at this point.


----------



## metacatfry

Are you confusing route 19 with 16? Route 19 does not pass very close to Allerød, and is only briefly 2x2 at one or two grade separated intersections. Route 19 goes north of Hillerød. It is signed as a 'motortrafikvej', and it does have sections that are not grade separated.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

You're right. 

Primærrute 19 has only a very short 2x2 section at the PR6 interchange. It's less than 500 meters long. 

There is also a 2x2, grade-separated section of Primærrute 9 in Svendborg. It's not motorway status, but also not an expressway.

I think that would establish there are no 2x2, grade-separated expressways in Denmark?


----------



## metacatfry

Sounds right to me. As to your original question about why this is; as I see it, the purpose of designating a road a motorway or an expressway is to indicate to drivers that special conditions apply, so you see the motorway sign, and you know that a different maximum speed is allowed than on the general road network, and that no stopping is allowed, for example. An expressway is the same just with slightly different (worse) conditions and hence a lower speed, but still sufficiently different design speeds from the general road network that special rules apply. Different countries put the standards for expressways at different levels, in Denmark a 'motortrafikvej' is just a bit closer in design to an ordinary main road than it is in, say, Poland, where the differences also seem to cover factors other than the technical features of the road.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*PR-15 Bording - Funder*

*August 31* is the opening date for 12 kilometers of Primærrute 15 between Bording and Funder, between the larger cities of Herning and Silkeborg. This is a 2x2 motorway and part of the larger Silkeborg bypass which is currently under construction.










The new motorway includes the Funder Ådalsbro, the largest land bridge in Denmark. It spans 740 meters and is 30 meters high. I took a photo of it last year:

Funder Adalsbro 2011 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## mlm

I don't think it was mentioned here but in week 30 another 8 ½ KM of motorway was opened on route 18 on the strech between Ølholm and Riis (10 ½ KM). The last 2 km, and the final strech to Vejle, will open late 2013.

The news in Danish: Nu åbner del af motorvej mellem Riis og Ølholm


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ that infamous road that already looked like a motorway.


PR18-13 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

I've read an interesting story about it. Apparently there was a maze in Danish road law, that a divided highway not necessarily meant a central divider or 2x2 lanes. So when they contracted to build a motorway, the contractor built this 1x2 road with a very narrow gap between both lanes (1 cm, just visible on the photo). The Danish government sued the contractor because he only built half a motorway, but the contractor eventually won the case. After that, the road law was amended.

Not sure if this is true though. It would've been a truly unique case.


----------



## kosimodo

mlm said:


> I don't think it was mentioned here but in week 30 another 8 ½ KM of motorway was opened on route 18 on the strech between Ølholm and Riis (10 ½ KM). The last 2 km, and the final strech to Vejle, will open late 2013.


not the final.. Around Brande is under construction to!! Then the motorway to Herning is finished


----------



## mlm

^^ Oh yes of course.  Was thinking of the final part from the newly opened part to E45.


----------



## Penn's Woods

metacatfry said:


> Are you confusing route 19 with 16?....





ChrisZwolle said:


> You're right.
> ....


:eek2:

;-)


----------



## NordikNerd

ChrisZwolle said:


> Today 12 years ago
> July 1, 2000: the Øresund Bridge opens to traffic, linking Denmark and Sweden.


This year traffic is decreasing drastically on the bridge, mainly because of the number of danes/swedes living or working in either DK/S is declining.

The highest numbers of cars passing through was in the year 2006.

This also concerns the railway traffic. I dont think anything changed on the Stora Bält-Bridge, is traffic increasing ? At least that bridge is not dependent on 
commuters and economic change.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I happened to check out the numbers last week.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> ^^ that infamous road that already looked like a motorway.
> 
> 
> PR18-13 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> I've read an interesting story about it. Apparently there was a maze in Danish road law, that a divided highway not necessarily meant a central divider or 2x2 lanes. So when they contracted to build a motorway, the contractor built this 1x2 road with a very narrow gap between both lanes (1 cm, just visible on the photo). The Danish government sued the contractor because he only built half a motorway, but the contractor eventually won the case. After that, the road law was amended.
> 
> Not sure if this is true though. It would've been a truly unique case.


I am afraid that this story can best be described as a hoax.
In the Construcion Bill (bill no. 1998/483 - approved by Parliament July 1st, 1998) it was clearly stated that the road is to be constructed as a Motortrafikvej https://www.retsinformation.dk/Forms/R0710.aspx?id=87616
Further in the notes to the the proposed bill https://www.retsinformation.dk/Forms/R0710.aspx?id=81398
it is noted that the road shall be a 2-lane motortrafikvej with a total width of 15 m (Vejen anlægges som facadeløs to-sporet motortrafikvej med 8,0 m bred kørebane og 2,5 m brede nødspor, i alt 15 m kronebredde).
After some deliberation it was accepted by the then Minister of Transport, who was fiercely against motorways that the bridges on the new motortrafikvej should be prepared for a future widening to a full motorway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Both bridges are making profits. Some of the profits may be government compensations, much like railways (both bridges actually carry rail traffic). The bridges are at least not directly subsidized. Some countries allow specific audiences to travel for free, like students or senior citizens, the government pays for them. It's just regular revenue for the operator, but paid for with tax money by the government.


----------



## metacatfry

To my knowledge the toll bridges in Denmark are not subsidized in any way that the rest of the transport infrastructure isn't already, and since they are the only user paid stretches in DK they are in fact less subsidized. The economies of both links are quite sound, and are scheduled to be paid of before time. the Great Belt fixed link much before time actually, due to higher traffic than forecast at the beginning of the project.
One slightly worrying thing is that the Great Belt company actually pays back some of its revenue to the state since 2009. So far the deal is for a fixed sum of 9 billion dkk paid through to 2022, but who knows if the government will allow it to stop once they have gotten used to the extra money..

Oh.. actually one quite significant financial aid the big bridges have are state backed loan guarantees.

Annual reports can be found here:
http://www.sundogbaelt.dk/uk/menu/publications/annual-reports


----------



## Nikolaj

metacatfry said:


> To my knowledge the toll bridges in Denmark are not subsidized in any way that the rest of the transport infrastructure isn't already, and since they are the only user paid stretches in DK they are in fact less subsidized. The economies of both links are quite sound, and are scheduled to be paid of before time. the Great Belt fixed link much before time actually, due to higher traffic than forecast at the beginning of the project.
> One slightly worrying thing is that the Great Belt company actually pays back some of its revenue to the state since 2009. So far the deal is for a fixed sum of 9 billion dkk paid through to 2022, but who knows if the government will allow it to stop once they have gotten used to the extra money..
> 
> Oh.. actually one quite significant financial aid the big bridges have are state backed loan guarantees.
> 
> Annual reports can be found here:
> http://www.sundogbaelt.dk/uk/menu/publications/annual-reports


There is no government subsidy towards the big bridges. In fact it is the other way around ,as Storebaelt was forced by the owner (The Government) to contribute with 9 billion DKK to the National Infrastructure Fund, which is funding all government rail and road projects until 2020. However there is a large cross-subsidiation between rail and road on Storebælt and Øresund, in the sense that the rail trafiic only is paying a fraction of the cost of the railway part of the fixed link. The bulk of the cost of the railway crossing are paid by the motorist.

This method will also be applied on the Femern Link, and is also anticipated on the proposed Kattegat Link. Currently nobody really knows whether traffic in a Kattegat Link will be sufficient to pay for the link. It is all awaiting a comprehensive national traffic forecasting model, which is expected to cpmpleted early 2013 (delayed from April 2012).

This model will be the big test for a number of big project currently being investigated for construction after 2020, including Kattegatlink, Ringway 5 around Copenhagen, Harbour tunnel in Copenhagen and Central Jutland Motorway (Kolding-Støvring) and a number of large railway project.

Those strategic Studies are planned to be completed late 2013, after which a political decision is expected.


----------



## jsfox

ChrisZwolle said:


> Compared to other Scandinavian countries, Copenhagen has very little congestion, not to mention compared to other European countries.


I would assume that this is largely due to the high number of people who cycle rather than drive?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

A high(er) number of people cycle in the Netherlands as well and it's significantly congested.

No, Copenhagen has an adequate road network, especially since they widened Motorring 3.


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> A high(er) number of people cycle in the Netherlands as well and it's significantly congested.
> 
> No, Copenhagen has an adequate road network, especially since they widened Motorring 3.


I think it is heavily about geography and demographics, too.

Among the capitals of Scandinavia, Copenhagen is the only one located rather properly in terms of current traffic volumes. Oslo lies on a narrow area between the sea and mountains. Helsinki lies on a peninsula extending into the sea, and Stockholm is the most desperate one being built onto islands and a narrow land between the sea and a lake. For all these cities, it is an expensive task to build an effective traffic network.

The changes in demographics is an other significant factor. According to some statistics, the population in Copenhagen has gone down some 9% since 1960, and about 33% in the inner areas. This potentially relieves the pain.

During the same period, the population in the Helsinki metropolitan area more than doubled, and the area grew significantly. Heavy investments to the road network have been made, but still the growth seems to outperform them. The major congestion seems to gradually shift from the inbound radial roads to the ring roads. A rather new phenomena is the congestion of outbound radial roads during the afternoon rush hours. This results from the metropolitan area growing because of families escaping the high housing prices in the inner areas.


----------



## kosimodo

There is no through traffic in Copenhagen.. Thats why it is not that busy.

And the motorways around Copenhagen are mostly 3 lanes with no big bridges and tunnels. So no big bottlenecks.

Only reason for the congestion is that everybody wants to start working at the same time. The rush hour is very short.


----------



## g.spinoza

kosimodo said:


> Only reason for the congestion is that everybody _wants_ to start working at the same time. The rush hour is very short.


I think it's more that they are _forced_ to start working at the same time.


----------



## MattiG

g.spinoza said:


> I think it's more that they are _forced_ to start working at the same time.


Are they really?

I do not what is the situation elsewhere, but I think quite a big fraction of the office workers in Scandinavia have an option to follow flexible working hours, or even work remotely at home. 

Of course, there are constrains limiting the flexibility. If people carry their kids to school or daycare working on fixed hours, then the flexibility is more limited.

I think quite many people just follow their old habits related to working hours.


----------



## g.spinoza

MattiG said:


> Are they really?
> 
> I do not what is the situation elsewhere, but I think quite a big fraction of the office workers in Scandinavia have an option to follow flexible working hours, or even work remotely at home.
> 
> Of course, there are constrains limiting the flexibility. If people carry their kids to school or daycare working on fixed hours, then the flexibility is more limited.
> 
> I think quite many people just follow their old habits related to working hours.


So it means that if a big fraction of workers decide to go to work half an hour later, rush hour and jams are just delayed by half an hour :nuts::nuts:


----------



## Nikolaj

*New Motorway project*

Vejdirektoratet (Road Directorate) has just released released feasibility studies for 2 proposed motorway projects.

1. Næstved-Rønnede (E47) approx. 14 km, currently an ordinary 1+1 road http://www.ft.dk/samling/20121/almdel/tru/bilag/82/1191300.pdf
where 2 options (in different alignments) have been studied, a 2+1 expressway and an ordinary 130 km/h motorway. The conclusion is that the 130 km/h motorway is the best solution with the highest internal rate of return (allmost 10 %)

2. Extension of the Djursland motorway approx. 17 km (Primary Route 15) eastwards, currently a 1+1 expressway http://www.ft.dk/samling/20121/almdel/tru/bilag/83/1191335.pdf. Here also 2 options have been studied, widening of current 1+1 expressway to a 1+2 expressway or widening to 110 km/h motorway (110 km/h due to current alignment). It is concluded that the motorway is the best solution vis-a-vis cost benefit ratio, but that the internal rate only is approx. 5 %.


----------



## MattiG

g.spinoza said:


> So it means that if a big fraction of workers decide to go to work half an hour later, rush hour and jams are just delayed by half an hour.


My experience tells a different story.

Earlier, the blue-collar hours begun at 7 and the white-collar ones at 8. That caused two rather sharp peaks in the morning. Nowadays, most of the white-collar people can begin any time between 7 and 9 or be even more flexible. The duration of the rush hours is longer, but the peaks are lower.


----------



## g.spinoza

^^ I was just joking. Don't take it too seriously


----------



## MattiG

g.spinoza said:


> ^^ I was just joking. Don't take it too seriously


It is not necessarily joke... People sometimes behave like you said.


----------



## NordikNerd

kosimodo said:


> There is no through traffic in Copenhagen.. Thats why it is not that busy.


I think there is a great deal of traffic on the outer motorway-ring, but it decreases abruptly after Roskilde where the E20/E47 splits.

The main reason that traffic volumes are not higher is probably because Copenhagen is located on an island, 

There are few bigger cities (by scandinavian means) close to Copenhagen, so
the danish capital does not have to cope with that many long distance commuters. 

As an example there are 4 cities with pop. +65.000 within a 100km radius of Stockholm, so that generates a great deal of traffic there. Pop density within 100km of Stockholm is about 150 inhabitants/km2

If you take the same 100km radius from Copenhagen, most surrounding cities are smaller, Roskilde the biggest one with pop 47.000. To the east is only water. Malmö transit traffic is petty in this context. 

Despite the smaller surrounding cities danish pop density is 303 inhabitants/km2 on the island Själland. Twice as dense as Stockholm surroundings.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

København is significantly suburbanized. Even the outer parts of the København muncipality consists chiefly of detached single family housing. Apart from port facilities, nearly all industrial areas are in the suburban areas, which results in intersuburban commutes, in an area with a fairly adequate road network.

What are the plans for Ring 5?


----------



## kalaha

ChrisZwolle said:


> What are the plans for Ring 5?


There are none at the moment....

Or.. The Ministry of Transport are having a "strategic analysis" (which is a pre-pre-assessment) produced, to be published next year.


----------



## jsfox

ChrisZwolle said:


> A high(er) number of people cycle in the Netherlands as well and it's significantly congested.
> 
> No, Copenhagen has an adequate road network, especially since they widened Motorring 3.


With 49% modal share, major cities in The Netherlands have almost twice the automobiles per capita as Copenhagen .

Copenhagen has the lowest automobile modal share (27%) of any major city in the world. Most cities are well over 50%. What would happen if the 39% of people who currently cycle decided to drive their cars instead? Even just a quarter of them deciding to drive would instantly increase auto traffic by 30%.


----------



## Nikolaj

jsfox said:


> With 49% modal share, major cities in The Netherlands have almost twice the automobiles per capita as Copenhagen .
> 
> Copenhagen has the lowest automobile modal share (27%) of any major city in the world. Most cities are well over 50%. What would happen if the 39% of people who currently cycle decided to drive their cars instead? Even just a quarter of them deciding to drive would instantly increase auto traffic by 30%.


I don't know where you got that number from, but it seems that you got it wrong.

According to p. 2 in the link (Ministry of Transport/Trafikstyrelsen) (i am not able to upload an image), showing the market share (modal share) in a number of European cities, Copenhagen (together with Stockholm) has the highest car share, and the lowest public transport share.

http://www.trm.dk/~/media/Files/Pub...øde/Trængsel i den kollektive trafik - TS.pdf

Gang=Pedestrians
Cykel=Bikes/Cycling
Kollektiv Transport=Public Transport
Bil= Car


----------



## flierfy

jsfox said:


> Copenhagen has the lowest automobile modal share (27%) of any major city in the world. Most cities are well over 50%.


Hong Kong and Tokyo are not only bigger and arguably more important than Copenhagen. Their mode share for private motorised traffic, 11% and 12% respectively, is also way lower than that in the Danish capital.
[source]


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Motorring 5*

What is the status of Motorring 5? I can't find a real project site about it, but I did find some traffic studies.

I think Motorring 5 becomes more urgent when the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel opens (and maybe a tunnel at Helsingør as well), especially coupled with rail infrastructure because København is a bottleneck.


----------



## metacatfry

I can't find anything much official. I think there is very strong and organized opposition and the political will has disappeared. I predict it will become a very strident topic in the coming years because the necessity will only keep rising while opposition will remain strong.
the most information at one site is this NIMBY site, only danish: http://www.nejtilring5.dk/


----------



## metasmurf

Motorring 5 will clearly lead to more sprawl. It would be great for Sweden but I don't think its a good idea for the Copenhagen region.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Not building motorways doesn't stop suburban growth. Just look at the Primærrute 17 corridor to Frederikssund (the only missing radial motorway of Copenhagen).


----------



## metasmurf

ChrisZwolle said:


> Not building motorways doesn't stop suburban growth. Just look at the Primærrute 17 corridor to Frederikssund (the only missing radial motorway of Copenhagen).


You really had to state something that obvious? Please.

I don't know enough about the traffic around Copenhagen to propose anything, but I'm sure there are better solutions than another ring. I seriously doubt that transit traffic from Sweden brings enough traffic to justify it.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*2013 tolls*

The tolls for the Great Belt Bridge and the Øresund Bridge go up in 2013.

Great Belt Bridge: 235 DKK / € 33
Øresund Bridge: 325 DKK / € 45

In my opinion the tolls for the Øresund Bridge are too high for occasional users. Frequent users get heavy discount, but occasional users have to pay the full price. The price increased by € 10 in just 4 years. The bridge has been making profits since 2009, while toll rates have increased by 90 DKK since then.


----------



## kosimodo

Expensive, i 'always' take the ferry

One of the reasons why it is so expensive.


----------



## Ingenioren

HH-ferries are just as expensive as the bridge ffs.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> What is the status of Motorring 5? I can't find a real project site about it, but I did find some traffic studies.
> 
> I think Motorring 5 becomes more urgent when the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel opens (and maybe a tunnel at Helsingør as well), especially coupled with rail infrastructure because København is a bottleneck.


There is no project site as it is'nt an appoved project, or anywhere near it. It is one of several ring projects currently being studied at a very preliminary stage byt he Ministry of Transport. http://www.trm.dk/~/media/Files/Pub...gninger for en Ring 5 i hovedstadsområdet.pdf

Other ringway projects being investigated is an upgraded Ring 4 option http://www.trm.dk/~/media/Files/Pub...acitetsforbedringer i Ring 4-korridoren.pdfor an eastern Harbour tunnel http://www.trm.dk/~/media/Files/Pub...unnelscreening - endelig version med logo.pdf

All of the projects are part of the socalled Strategic Studies launched in 2009 and planned to be completed in 2013, followed by a political decision in 2013-2014.

The Strategic Studies have 3 focus (roadwise): Ringway options around Copenhagen, East-west options (Kattegat link or not) and Jutland North-South (E45 widening and/or ned Parallel motorway). Of the Ringway projects in Copenhagen the harbour tunnel project is the most advanced one, as Ministry of Transport together with Municipality/City of Copenhagen in late 2012 decided on an alignment.


----------



## OulaL

ChrisZwolle said:


> The tolls for the Great Belt Bridge and the Øresund Bridge go up in 2013.
> 
> Great Belt Bridge: 235 DKK / € 33
> Øresund Bridge: 325 DKK / € 45


With rates like these, one might start considering the Gothenburg-Frederikshavn-ferry, bypassing both of these bridges. Depending on the destinations, of course.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Yes, it's possible to use that ferry, if you travel at night, the ferry is slightly cheaper than both bridges combined (I did a test return booking 1 week ahead). If you travel during the day, you'll dish out about € 80 more on a return trip. The problem is that this ferry does not have that many departures. The advantage of the bridge is that you can arrive at any time for the same tolls, so no surprises there.


----------



## Orionol

Ingenioren said:


> HH-ferries are just as expensive as the bridge ffs.


Try Scandlines, they are cheaper, I presume. Anyway ferry via Helsingborg-Helsingör is much more cheaper than Öresund bridge. When I drive to continental Europe or Germany, I usually buy a Kombi H+H and Rödby-Puttgarden or Gedser Rostock. Its cheap. 
http://www.scandlines.se/farja/priser/hbg-hor--rodby-puttgarden/


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> Yes, it's possible to use that ferry, if you travel at night, the ferry is slightly cheaper than both bridges combined (I did a test return booking 1 week ahead). If you travel during the day, you'll dish out about € 80 more on a return trip.


I checked the prices for Gothenburg-Frederikshavn v.v. at http://www.stenaline.se for the next July being the high-season. During the non-weekends, the pricing does not depend on the departure time, but the ferry and ticket type: Slow ferries SEK 599/899/1447 (eco/flexi/premium) and fast ones SEK 949/1249/1797 one-way. The approximate prices in euros are 70/105/170 and 110/145/210. 



> The problem is that this ferry does not have that many departures.


Anyway, if you depart from Finland, a planning is necessary, because there are less connections between Finland and Sweden. 

The bridges still are flexible in terms of timing. If I remember right, after their completion, I have never taken ferry, even if that would deliver savings in driving kilometres. The bridges cost 10 euros more than the ferries that is peanuts for the infrequent traveller.


----------



## cinxxx

^^what about taking direct ferry from Finland to Poland, Germany, Baltic States?
Is that an alternative?

I know it's not really on topic, just asking...


----------



## Orionol

^^
http://www.finnlines.com/
If you like to spend some looong and good time at boat, than go for it.


----------



## OulaL

cinxxx said:


> what about taking direct ferry from Finland to Poland, Germany, Baltic States?
> Is that an alternative?
> 
> I know it's not really on topic, just asking...


It depends on your priorities and destination.

Sweden and Denmark are connected into the Central European motorway network, unlike the Baltic States. In fact, Estonia and Latvia don't have motorways at all, and even the Lithuanian motorways are next to useless for Finns driving to Central Europe, since they only radiate from Vilnius.

In other words, when driving through the Baltic States, count an extra day when compared to Sweden and Denmark.

But on the other hand, you could still save some money, since motels and meals are so much cheaper in Baltic States and Poland than in Sweden or Denmark. (And don't forget the bridge tolls...!) So basically, it's a question on whether you prefer time or money.

The ferry from Finland to Poland, let alone Germany, is a waste of both; but I guess those who don't like driving at all (and still travel with car...) could prefer that.


----------



## MattiG

OulaL said:


> But on the other hand, you could still save some money, since motels and meals are so much cheaper in Baltic States and Poland than in Sweden or Denmark. (And don't forget the bridge tolls...!) So basically, it's a question on whether you prefer time or money.


There is one additional dimension not to forget: The high crime risk in the Baltic counties is reflected in the car theft insurance policies of the Finnish insurance companies. The deductible may be 20%-25% of the loss: If your car worth of 20000 euros is stolen there, your own risk is 4000-5000 euros. That is why people tend to avoid the east route and instead to drive via Sweden and Denmark.



> The ferry from Finland to Poland, let alone Germany, is a waste of both; but I guess those who don't like driving at all (and still travel with car...) could prefer that.


The Finnlines combo ferries Helsinki-Travemünde are quite fast: the sailing time is 27 hours. Not a big difference from taking ferry to Stockholm and driving to Germany. The route is mainly for cargo, and the time table is not very traveller-friendly: The departure from Travemünde takes place at 03:00 in the morning. The price is next to astronomic: 891 euros for two persons plus a car in the cheapest cabin during the summer high season.


----------



## NordikNerd

Orionol said:


> Try Scandlines, they are cheaper, I presume. Anyway ferry via Helsingborg-Helsingör is much more cheaper than Öresund bridge. When I drive to continental Europe or Germany, I usually buy a Kombi H+H and Rödby-Puttgarden or Gedser Rostock. Its cheap.
> http://www.scandlines.se/farja/priser/hbg-hor--rodby-puttgarden/


The Öresund bridge is not very usefull if you live anywhere north of the southernmost part of Sweden. It's an additional 50km drive to reach it. 

The ferries from Helsingborg take only 20 min and they depart every 20 or 30 minutes.

On the ferry you have a break get some fresh air and order a meal which you don't do on the bridge. 

If I go to continental europe I definately choose the route Helsingborg-Helsingör then Rödby-Puttgarden for western europe & Gedser-Warnemunde for eastern europe.

If you book the tickets in advance you save money. If you buy an instant ticket 4ppl+car Helsingborg-Rödby-Puttgarden it's about 110EUR for Gedser about 130 EUR One Way.

If you stay only 4 hours in Puttgarden though (for shopping) you pay only about 65EUR 5 ppl+car BOTH WAYS.

This summer I will probably choose the Trelleborg-Sassnitz line, which is an good option to the Gedser-Warnemunde ferry. It takes 4 hours
and cost about 90EUR. A lot cheaper than the Helsingborg+Gedser ferries but it takes longer and it departs only 3 times a day.

Actually now in january the Trelleborg Sassnitz charge as little as 45EUR for a 
4 hour shopping tour in sassnitz 5ppl+ar BOTH WAYS, so prices vary alot.


----------



## OulaL

NordikNerd said:


> The Öresund bridge is not very usefull if you live anywhere north of the southernmost part of Sweden. It's an additional 50km drive to reach it.
> 
> The ferries from Helsingborg take only 20 min and they depart every 20 or 30 minutes.


It's a kind of gambling... if you don't need to wait for the ferry at all, you save some time. If you have to wait 30 minutes in the port you lose some time, since you could easily have driven that extra 50 km in 30 minutes, and more.

Last time I was lucky, it took maybe 10 minutes from exiting the E6 to the departure of the ferry, with me aboard... and with no reservation! 

But since you have to drive on city streets, it also depends more on the traffic conditions than the bridge (all way motorway).



NordikNerd said:


> If I go to continental europe I definately choose the route Helsingborg-Helsingör then Rödby-Puttgarden for western europe & Gedser-Warnemunde for eastern europe.


From Copenhagen to Germany, I have always chosen the motorway via Kolding (with the Great Belt bridge), despite the fact that it's 150 km longer, mostly because the Puttgarden ferry has been so expensive. But since it seems that the rates have changed, I might think again on my next trip.


----------



## MattiG

OulaL said:


> It's a kind of gambling... if you don't need to wait for the ferry at all, you save some time. If you have to wait 30 minutes in the port you lose some time, since you could easily have driven that extra 50 km in 30 minutes, and more.


There are many things to consider. If I am driving from Finland to somewhere in the central Europe, this is always about my leisure time. Adding 50 kilometres or 50 minutes is next to nothing. I hate queueing in the ferry harbours, so I am somewhat biased towards taking the bridge alternatives.

The "bridge route" from the E4/E6/E20 interchange NE of Helsingborg via the bridges and Kolding to the Horster Dreieck S of Hamburg is 605 kilometres. It is 215 driving kilometres longer than the "ferry route" to the Horster Dreieck where the routes merge. Because of the waiting and crossing times on the ferry route, there is no much difference in time.

Anyway, I seldom optimize the driving in Denmark by cost or time. Instead, I select interesting places to visit, and avoid motorways whenever possible.


----------



## NordikNerd

MattiG said:


> It is 215 driving kilometres longer than the "ferry route" to the Horster Dreieck where the routes merge. Because of the waiting and crossing times on the ferry route, there is no much difference in time.


It's not a matter of money or time when comparing the choise of a bridge or a ferry, because in the end both factors are somewhat the same.

The bridges mean longer drive= additional time & extra gas money.

The ferries mean longer waiting and additional cost but less driving=less gas money but higher cost.

That cost equals the gas money for the longer drive but you will get a break on the ferry. 

You have to add pauses into your long driving schedule. When using the ferry your car is moving while you have your lunchbreak. It's much more pleasant to rest on the ferry than to stop along a noisy motorway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

It's a matter of preference really. At the ferry you are forced to take a break. Maybe you don't want to take a break at that time. Not everyone uses the ferry at lunchtime. Some people may have been driving for only one hour when they take the ferry. Stopping along the motorway gives you plenty of options that fit according to your schedule, instead of a forced break at the ferry.


----------



## MattiG

NordikNerd said:


> It's not a matter of money or time when comparing the choise of a bridge or a ferry, because in the end both factors are somewhat the same.
> 
> The bridges mean longer drive= additional time & extra gas money.
> 
> The ferries mean longer waiting and additional cost but less driving=less gas money but higher cost.
> 
> That cost equals the gas money for the longer drive but you will get a break on the ferry.
> 
> You have to add pauses into your long driving schedule. When using the ferry your car is moving while you have your lunchbreak. It's much more pleasant to rest on the ferry than to stop along a noisy motorway.


Well, well...

As said, on my vacations, the other things are the decision making drivers than savings in pennies, minutes or kilometres. If I want to save them then I stay home.

A lunch on the Rødby-Puttgarden ferry is far from being a culinary experience of any class. The trip duration is 45 minutes only, and that allows a quick sandwich in a lousy cafeteria. If small kids follow, 45 minutes is equal to about nothing. No go.

As far as I know, Denmark is full of nice places to have a lunch. There are other roads in Denmark than the motorways, too. Be brave and take the next exit!


----------



## OulaL

Is it risky to try the Rødby-Puttgarden-ferry with no reservation?

It's not a big problem in Helsingborg - if the lines are too long, you can simply return to the motorway and drive to the bridge. But from Rødby it's a relatively long way back to E20.


----------



## NordikNerd

OulaL said:


> Is it risky to try the Rødby-Puttgarden-ferry with no reservation?
> 
> It's not a big problem in Helsingborg - if the lines are too long, you can simply return to the motorway and drive to the bridge. But from Rødby it's a relatively long way back to E20.


The only time a reservation is needed is when the Roskilde festival is going on, otherwise there is no risk to miss the ferry.

BUT getting a reservation 14 days in advance will save money. A normal ticket without reservation costs about 75 EUR one way. If you buy online 14 days before departure you pay about 58 EUR.

This ferry takes only 45 min but is outrageously expensive.


----------



## Pannyers

Reservation is indeed not necessary, the main waiting time is not more then one hour, even in the summer.


----------



## OulaL

Thanks for the info!


----------



## bongo-anders

The concept for the intersection Between Sydmotorvejen (E47 and E55) and the new motorway to Næstved.


----------



## ADP

The Danish Road Directorate had invited citizens, local politicians and others who were 
interested, to a public meeting in Toksværd at Holme Olstrup. During this meeting, it 
was decided that the possible motorway (Næstvedmotorvejen) should be connected by 
a interchange (Motorvejskryds Rønnede) near the outskirts of Rønnede, by the upcoming 
business area of Eco Park, near the South Motorway (Sydmotorvejen). 

At the same time, both municipalities, and politicians will work for the completion of the 
motorway in approx. 10 years in 2023.

In Danish :

http://www.sn.dk/Der-gaar-10-aar-foer-motorvejen-er-paa-plads/Faxe/artikel/250776


----------



## metacatfry

I don't like putting the connections to the local road network so close to a interchange between motorways. It leads to hectic decision making by motorists about what exit/direction to take.


----------



## bongo-anders

Yeah its a tight fit.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I don't think it's really a problem with the traffic volumes in that area.


----------



## metacatfry

I don't really either. It's just an instinctual or aesthetic dislike. I'm sure it'll be fine with the low traffic as you say.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20 Storebælt Bridge*

I made a little graph of the Great Belt Bridge traffic volumes, using the latest data that includes 2012. As you can see it has nearly recovered from the recession in terms of traffic volumes. The 2012 average daily volume was 29 850 vehicles per day. 2012 volumes were only up by 0.7% though.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20 Øresund Bridge*

The traffic volumes of the Øresund Bridge between Denmark and Sweden show a slightly different development. After a first few years of relative stagnation, a rapid growth followed, eventually leading to a topping out during the recession. The Øresund Bridge however, has shown declining volumes in 2011 and 2012, in contrast with the Storebælt Bridge which showed traffic growth. The average traffic volume in 2012 was 18 540 vehicles per day, down by 3.2% compared to 2011.


----------



## RV

Assuming it's a bridge between two metropolitan areas just 10 Kms from eachother the traffic volumes on the Oresund bridge are really low.


----------



## metacatfry

The traffic across Øresund is shaped by the differences in economic development between DK and SWE. When unemployment was low in DK and house prices in SWE were low it was very beneficial to live on one side and work on the other. But things have changed, and economic differences has evened out, house prices in DK has come down and the Scanian job market has improved.
Coupled with the bureaucratic hurdles of living in one country and working in another, and the high bridge fares, fever people find it attractive to commute over the Sound. Still many that do though, and of course, many take the train rather than car.

Also, the distance between the center of Malmö and Copenhagen is more like 30 kilometers. I think the commuting figures are pretty decent for this distance.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Don't forget that daily users of the Øresund Bridge pay only about 10% of the regular tolls.


----------



## metacatfry

Yeah, if you are a commuter, the cost is a fairly minor factor I think. A bigger hassle is figuring out all the taxation issues, and entitlements like child care and health care. And there's the language differences obviously, however much we Scandinavians like to think we are all the same, it does introduce a barrier. so I wouldn't quite compare commuting between Cph and Malmö to cities lying in the same country.


----------



## MattiG

metacatfry said:


> And there's the language differences obviously, however much we Scandinavians like to think we are all the same, it does introduce a barrier. so I wouldn't quite compare commuting between Cph and Malmö to cities lying in the same country.


This is interesting.

The Swedish language is a mandatory subject in the schools in Finland. This is justified by a number of reasons, like the country being bilingual (5% Swedish speaking minority and bilingual areas being less than 5% of the total) and the Scandinavian heritage (Finland being under the rule of Sweden for several hundreds of years). The key marketing point is that if you learn Swedish, you will understand people from Denmark and Norway, too. Not true.

Earlier, I believed the speech disorders called Scanian and Danish (sorry guys, cannot resist) are about the same language. During the construction time of the Öresund bridge, I happened to read an article in some local newspaper in Malmö telling me that the language barrier between Malmö and Copenhagen might jeopardize the birth of the commuting area across the cities. That was a big surprise to me after all that marketing Swedish as the Lingua Franca across the Scandinavia.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

For me as a native Dutch, Danish, Norwegian and Swedish are all fairly easy to understand in written text, with Norwegian probably being the easiest. However in speech, Danish almost sounds like a Slavic language, while Swedish is probably the easiest to understand.

I can understand that especially Danish - Swedish is a substantial language barrier in both written text and speech. Danish - Norwegian appear to be a bit closer to eachother than Danish and Swedish. 

If you look at traffic patterns, you see about 18 500 vehicles using the bridge and about 30 000 train passengers. Of course you cannot compare those numbers directly because the average car contains more than one passenger (especially on links like these). I don't know the numbers for the Helsingør - Helsingborg ferry, but truck volumes on the Øresund Bridge are pretty low, in fact the truck share as a percentage of total traffic is extremely low for an international connection. Usually truck shares at borders can go up to 30 - 45%, but in this case it's only about 5%.


----------



## Penn's Woods

The summer I studied in France, there were lots of Swedes and Norwegians attending the same program, and I hung out with them. I found it striking that they could speak to each other in their own languages and understand each other. But there was a girl from Malmö who told me she couldn't understand spoken Danish.


----------



## metacatfry

MattiG said:


> This is interesting.
> 
> Earlier, I believed the speech disorders called Scanian and Danish (sorry guys, cannot resist) are about the same language. During the construction time of the Öresund bridge, I happened to read an article in some local newspaper in Malmö telling me that the language barrier between Malmö and Copenhagen might jeopardize the birth of the commuting area across the cities. That was a big surprise to me after all that marketing Swedish as the Lingua Franca across the Scandinavia.


There are significant enough differences that I believe many are discouraged from seeking jobs across the Sound solely due to this. Nonetheless Copenhagens shops and restaurants are full of working Swedes, speaking swedish but still being understood well enough to service customers.
Danish and Swedish are different languages, but the differences are such that many are able to learn to understand the other language quickly without special lessons.
It depends on the direction though, Danish understanding Swedish: Ok. Swedish understanding Danish: More difficult.
That's what I hear anyway.

Chris, is truck traffic really different to other borders if we go by numbers of trucks?
I was just wondering if it is so low relative to total traffic because there is so much more car traffic across this border than most.


----------



## Sunfuns

Which are the main arteries for the commercial traffic between Scandinavia and the rest of Europe? Judging by ultra low numbers of trucks obviously not this bridge.


----------



## NordikNerd

RV said:


> Assuming it's a bridge between two metropolitan areas just 10 Kms from eachother the traffic volumes on the Oresund bridge are really low.


Two very different cities in two different countries and an expensive toll result in poor traffic volumes.

But the rail traffic is quite busy, last time I took that train it was very crowded at rush hour.




Sunfuns said:


> Which are the main arteries for the commercial traffic between Scandinavia and the rest of Europe? Judging by ultra low numbers of tracks obviously not this bridge.


I would definately say that Rödby-Puttgarden is the main artery if you count all Scandinavia.

Gedser-Warnemunde /Trelleborg-Sassnitz for traffic to eastern europe.


----------



## MattiG

Sunfuns said:


> Which are the main arteries for the commercial traffic between Scandinavia and the rest of Europe? Judging by ultra low numbers of tracks obviously not this bridge.


My guess is that many truck companies prefer the ferry routes Sweden-Denmark-Germany to the bridge one, as they save 200+ kilometres, and enforce taking the mandatory break. There are number of ferry routes to choose.

From Finland, there are four main arteries: 1) The ferry from Helsinki, Turku or Naantali to Sweden, then E4 to south Sweden etc, 2) Container feeder traffic to main hub ports Hamburg, Bremerhaven and Rotterdam, 3) Regular cargo/passenger combo ships from Helsinki to Travemünde, Rostock and Gdynia, and 4) Ferry from Helsinki to Talliin and then E67 via Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania to Poland and other eastern Europe.

The ferries between Finland and Sweden look luxury cruise boats. They are floating restaurants, but still a big part of their business comes from cargo. For example, the brand new m/s Viking Grace has 1250 lane meters for trucks and trailers, and 550 lane meters for cars. Part of the cargo area can be converted to a double-deck area allowing more space for cars.


----------



## metacatfry

Sweden-Germany truck traffic transits Trelleborg in great proportions.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Travemünde - Trelleborg and Travemünde - Malmö were also popular among truckers. I've done those by truck some 10 years ago on a ride-along. These ferries indeed look like cruise ships wih all kinds of amenities on board.


----------



## Aphelion

Two ferry lines with increasing volumes are Klaipeda (Lithuania)-Karlshamn and Gdynia (Poland)-Karlskrona.


----------



## cinxxx

metacatfry said:


> It depends on the direction though, Danish understanding Swedish: Ok. Swedish understanding Danish: More difficult.
> That's what I hear anyway.


On this topic, I've heard that:
Portuguese understands well Romanian, the other way around it's very difficult. And Romanian understands Italian and Spanish very good, while the other way around it's very difficult.

Another thing, many Germans coming from outside Bavaria complain they don't understand the people here, I came from Romania, while learning German (Hochdeutsch) as a child, so no Bavarian, but can't say that it is so difficult to understand them as their fellow Germans say. And I don't mean full spoken Bavarian at the country (that's hard to understand), but the city people, who mostly speak with accent, a little different pronunciation, but you can figure it out also by context if not 100% understandable at first...


----------



## g.spinoza

^^ As an Italian, I understand Spanish very well (without ever studying it), but both Portuguese and, to a greater extent, Romanian are like Arabic to me.


----------



## cinxxx

g.spinoza said:


> ^^ As an Italian, I understand Spanish very well (without ever studying it), but both Portuguese and, to a greater extent, Romanian are like Arabic to me.


Exactly as I know it. For me Italian and Spanish are very similar, still I spot 99% the difference.
Do you have the same problem with reading in Romanian? I would say you should find many similarities with Italian...


----------



## g.spinoza

cinxxx said:


> Exactly as I know it. For me Italian and Spanish are very similar, still I spot 99% the difference.
> Do you have the same problem with reading in Romanian? I would say you should find many similarities with Italian...


Two consecutive lines from Barack Obama article in Romanian Wikipedia:


Romanian Wikipedia said:


> De la șase până la zece ani a trăit în Jakarta, împreună cu mama lui și cu tatăl vitreg, indonezian.


I only understand Jakarta and "indonesian". (And maybe "zece ani" means "ten years"?)



> Absolvent al Universității Columbia și al Facultății de Drept de la Harvard, înainte de a candida pentru intrarea în administrația publică și de a deveni membru al Senatului statului Illinois între 1997 și 2004, Obama a lucrat ca mobilizator comunitar, docent universitar și ca avocat specializat în apărarea drepturilor civile.


This in pretty clear to me, instead.

EDIT: But this is Danish page, let's end the OT here.


----------



## Penn's Woods

g.spinoza said:


> ^^ As an Italian, I understand Spanish very well (without ever studying it), but both Portuguese and, to a greater extent, Romanian are like Arabic to me.


Yes, but do you understand Sicilian?


----------



## g.spinoza

Penn's Woods said:


> Yes, but do you understand Sicilian?


I had a Sicilian girlfriend for a while 

But I think I can understand Sicilian a little less than I understand Spanish. It's northern Italian dialects that trouble me: Brescian (let's say - eastern Lombard) is Chinese to me.


----------



## SeanT

There are som swedish guys at work. It was nearly impossible to understand them in the begining. Now, no problem. Lots of words are totally different, but you learn them very quickly. On the other hand the pronunciation is different in every words. Actually norwegian was easier to understand to begin with.


----------



## Nikolaj

MattiG said:


> My guess is that many truck companies prefer the ferry routes Sweden-Denmark-Germany to the bridge one, as they save 200+ kilometres, and enforce taking the mandatory break. There are number of ferry routes to choose.
> 
> From Finland, there are four main arteries: 1) The ferry from Helsinki, Turku or Naantali to Sweden, then E4 to south Sweden etc, 2) Container feeder traffic to main hub ports Hamburg, Bremerhaven and Rotterdam, 3) Regular cargo/passenger combo ships from Helsinki to Travemünde, Rostock and Gdynia, and 4) Ferry from Helsinki to Talliin and then E67 via Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania to Poland and other eastern Europe.
> 
> The ferries between Finland and Sweden look luxury cruise boats. They are floating restaurants, but still a big part of their business comes from cargo. For example, the brand new m/s Viking Grace has 1250 lane meters for trucks and trailers, and 550 lane meters for cars. Part of the cargo area can be converted to a double-deck area allowing more space for cars.


The landborder between Denmark/Jutland and Germany/Schleswig-Holstein is by far the largest transport corridor for goods transport between Scandinavia and The Continent

P. 10 in
http://detgodeliv.regionsyddanmark....eutschland Ein Vergleich DE total feb2012.pdf (for those who understand German)

http://www.stringcorridor.org/media/37966/factsheet_5_changes_in_scania_s_transport_structure.pdf

Four times as much is transported across the landborder Jutland/Schleswig-Holstein than across the Baltic (Rødby-Puttgarten + Gedser-Rostock), and two times as much goods are transported across the landborder than across Øresund (Øresends bridge + Helsingborg-Helsingør). Total goods transport directly from Sweden/Scania (by ferry) is on slightly larger than the one across Øresund.


----------



## NordikNerd

SeanT said:


> There are som swedish guys at work. It was nearly impossible to understand them in the begining. Now, no problem. Lots of words are totally different, but you learn them very quickly. On the other hand the pronunciation is different in every words. Actually norwegian was easier to understand to begin with.


I join the language discussion:

As a swede I understand norwegian without any problems. Danish you have to study a bit to understand, danish text easier to understand.

Danish/swedish have many false "friends" that is words that look the same but have different meanings, so misunderstandings are common.





Nikolaj said:


> Four times as much is transported across the landborder Jutland/Schleswig-Holstein than across the Baltic (Rødby-Puttgarten + Gedser-Rostock), and two times as much goods are transported across the landborder than across Øresund (Øresends bridge + Helsingborg-Helsingør). Total goods transport directly from Sweden/Scania (by ferry) is on slightly larger than the one across Øresund.


But that goods does probably come from Jutland/Fyn only, not from Själland/Sweden ??


----------



## Kjello0

ChrisZwolle said:


> I can understand that especially Danish - Swedish is a substantial language barrier in both written text and speech. Danish - Norwegian appear to be a bit closer to eachother than Danish and Swedish.


Written Norwegian (bokmål) originates from Danish from the time Norway was under Danish rule (1536-1814). In fact, the people of Oslo was at that time considered to be the ones that spoke the most fluent Danish. And this was an important factor when the capitol was placed in Oslo in 1814. Despite both Bergen and Trondheim being bigger cities. Bergen was over twice as big as Oslo at that point.

Spoken Norwegian on the other hand, has much closer ties to Swedish. Mainly because we share a huge land border. But also because we were under Swedish control for 91 years from 1814 to 1905. Before we finally became independent again.

These facts makes the Norwegians the ones that understands the other languages the best. Sweden and Denmark on the other hand, has been two different countries since the end of the Kalmar Union in 1523. 

A report from last year shows these numbers.

Norwegians understanding (few or no problems)
Spoken Danish (65 %)
Spoken Swedish (83 %)

Swedes understanding
Spoken Norwegian (79 %)
Spoken Danish (35 %)

Danes understanding
Spoken Norwegian (65 %)
Spoken Swedish (46 %)


----------



## MattiG

Nikolaj said:


> The landborder between Denmark/Jutland and Germany/Schleswig-Holstein is by far the largest transport corridor for goods transport between Scandinavia and The Continent
> 
> P. 10 in
> http://detgodeliv.regionsyddanmark....eutschland Ein Vergleich DE total feb2012.pdf (for those who understand German)
> 
> http://www.stringcorridor.org/media/37966/factsheet_5_changes_in_scania_s_transport_structure.pdf
> 
> Four times as much is transported across the landborder Jutland/Schleswig-Holstein than across the Baltic (Rødby-Puttgarten + Gedser-Rostock), and two times as much goods are transported across the landborder than across Øresund (Øresends bridge + Helsingborg-Helsingør). Total goods transport directly from Sweden/Scania (by ferry) is on slightly larger than the one across Øresund.


The only conclusion to be done based that chart is that most of the freight flow from and to Sweden, Norway and Finland bypasses Denmark.


----------



## OulaL

Apparently schools teach different things in different countries.

Another viewpoint: this is a logistics-oriented forum. In the land-logistical point of view, the Baltic Sea and Skagerrak-Kattegat make an obstacle. Obviously this is a bigger issue to Sweden and Norway than it is to Denmark. In this context it is practical to have a common name to include Sweden and Norway but exclude Denmark.

There is also a name which is used to include Finland and the Russian Karelia and Kola peninsula with Sweden and Norway; that's Fennoscandia.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Primærrute 18 - Midtjyske Motorvej*

Brande bypass is currently being widened to a motorway. The project is due for completion in October 2014. Then there will be a continuous motorway from E45 at Vejle to Herning.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Some good news.

Funding has been secured for the construction of the Herning - Holstebro motorway. 3.4 billion DKK goes to this project, that should be completed in 2018.

Additionally, funding has also been secured for the replacement of the Storstrøm Bridge. The main function of this bridge is to carry trains from Hamburg to København once the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel is completed, but it also carries a secondary road. 4 billion DKK will flow to this project. The current bridge dates from 1937 and is in poor structural condition. The new bridge will be constructed between 2018 and 2021, in time for the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel opening (2021).


----------



## kalaha

ChrisZwolle said:


> Some good news.
> 
> Funding has been secured for the construction of the Herning - Holstebro motorway. 3.4 billion DKK goes to this project, that should be completed in 2018.
> 
> Additionally, funding has also been secured for the replacement of the Storstrøm Bridge. The main function of this bridge is to carry trains from Hamburg to København once the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel is completed, but it also carries a secondary road. 4 billion DKK will flow to this project. The current bridge dates from 1937 and is in poor structural condition. The new bridge will be constructed between 2018 and 2021, in time for the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel opening (2021).


Not quite yet... Nothing official on the Herning - Holstebro motorway yet. Regarding the new Storstrøm Bridge, only the funding for the detailed design has been agreed so far. Funding for the construction works itself will be discussed next year.


----------



## bongo-anders

The proposed alignments between Herning and Holstebro.


----------



## bongo-anders

The Holstebro motorway is decided today.


Also an expansion of the Køge Bugt motorway from 6 to 8 lanes from Greve S to Køge Vest, the first part from Greve S to Solrød S is already decided.


http://www.trm.dk/da/publikationer/2013/transportaftale+21+marts/



Not a motorway but a new road bridge is being constructed south of Frederikssund, it will be denmarks 4rd toll road after Storebælt, Øresund and Fehmarn Belt fixed link.


----------



## cinxxx

One question, why are all Nordic flags at the entry in Denmark?
http://goo.gl/maps/MZaZm


----------



## bongo-anders

These pictures was posted in the Danish subforum a few days ago.




Xed said:


> A series of photos from what will - in my opinion - probably be the most spectacular highway stretch in Denmark, the high through and around Silkeborg:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Source of all images: Vejdirektoratet


----------



## bongo-anders

cinxxx said:


> One question, why are all Nordic flags at the entry in Denmark?
> http://goo.gl/maps/MZaZm




I´m not sure but perhaps its because of the Nordic Union where no passport checks are done between the countries (even Norway that are not a member of EU)

This predates the Schengen union.


----------



## Fender56

ChrisZwolle said:


> Some good news.
> 
> Funding has been secured for the construction of the Herning - Holstebro motorway. 3.4 billion DKK goes to this project, that should be completed in 2018.
> 
> Additionally, funding has also been secured for the replacement of the Storstrøm Bridge. The main function of this bridge is to carry trains from Hamburg to København once the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel is completed, but it also carries a secondary road. 4 billion DKK will flow to this project. The current bridge dates from 1937 and is in poor structural condition. The new bridge will be constructed between 2018 and 2021, in time for the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel opening (2021).


Funds for the VVM trial, for the new A11 bypass west of Ribe was also found, and when they invest money for a VVM trial in Denmark, that means the project is approved.:


----------



## bongo-anders

The expansion of the Helsingør motorway from 4 to 6 lanes is now begun.

These pictures is from the demolition of the bridge at Elleslettegårdsvej in Vedbæk north of Copenhagen.













It must be scarry to drive under that bridge. :nuts:


----------



## PLH

In two weeks time I'll be visiting Denmark for the very first time. I have therefore a few questions:

Can you park on the left side of the road or not?
Do cyclists have right of way and when specificly?
Are daytime running lights enough or you need dimmed lights?

If you know about anyother peculiar rules considenring driving on B roads and in cities please tell.


----------



## NordikNerd

PLH said:


> Are daytime running lights enough or you need dimmed lights?


Dipped headlights are compulsary since 1990. But nowadays many cars are equipped with LED DRL lights, so you don't have to use the rear lights. Some models have dipped headlights with reduced voltage.

I don't know about the fog lights in DK. Can you use them as DRL lights during the day when there is no fog ?

Giving the right of way for bicyclists and pedestrians are far more obeyed than in other countries like Poland.
Copenhagen is a very bicycle friendly city with bicycle paths. I don't think you have that many cyclists in Warsaw?
In Copenhagen bicyclists tend to speed and if you accidently walk or park on a bicycle lane you will create great irritation.


----------



## SeanT

Good news, widening the Køge-bugt motorway from 6 to 8 lines (Greve S - Solrød S (8 Km) is going to be finished in 2015 and not in ´16.:banana:


----------



## bongo-anders

Do you know if they have a opening date for the part between Solrød S and Køge Vest.

They have to build the Lyngvej bridge in cooperation with the railway construction (Copenhagen - Ringsted) but will they widening the motorway at the same time.


----------



## SeanT

I don´t have info of the opening date. I think I´ve red that the railway/motorway project i going to be built at the same time.


----------



## Nikolaj

SeanT said:


> Good news, widening the Køge-bugt motorway from 6 to 8 lines (Greve S - Solrød S (8 Km) is going to be finished in 2015 and not in ´16.:banana:


Ministry of Transport announced a couple of weeks ago that it was decided/approved that widening of the section Solrød S - Motorvejskryds Køge Vest (E20/E47 split) from 6 to 8 lanes will be carried out in conjunction with Greve S - Solrød S section due to cost saving considerations. However unless the tender for the Greve S - Solrød S section, which has been completed, included an option for the Solrød S- Køge Vest section, it is unlikely that this section can be carried out within the same time frame (until 2015). A completion in 2016-2017 is more likely.


----------



## PLH

Quick one:

Is a regular German-style parking disc enough or do I need the Danish version sticked to the windshield when parking in Denmark?


----------



## NordikNerd

PLH said:


> Quick one:
> 
> Is a regular German-style parking disc enough or do I need the Danish version sticked to the windshield when parking in Denmark?


When I drove in Grenå, DK last time in 2007 they provided free parking discs in kiosks and at the tourist office.


----------



## Nikolaj

Nikolaj said:


> Ministry of Transport announced a couple of weeks ago that it was decided/approved that widening of the section Solrød S - Motorvejskryds Køge Vest (E20/E47 split) from 6 to 8 lanes will be carried out in conjunction with Greve S - Solrød S section due to cost saving considerations. However unless the tender for the Greve S - Solrød S section, which has been completed, included an option for the Solrød S- Køge Vest section, it is unlikely that this section can be carried out within the same time frame (until 2015). A completion in 2016-2017 is more likely.


The Minister of Transport has asked the Financial Committee of the Danish Parliament for approval to start detailed design and construction of the section Solrød S - Køge Vest. In the application to the Commitee it is stated that the widening will be completed in 2018. http://www.ft.dk/RIpdf/samling/20121/aktstykke/aktstk83/20121_aktstk_anmeldt83.pdf


----------



## SeanT

The last image is next to Karlslunde gasstation.
The work on Køge-Bugt motorway is "visible" now. The pictures are taken between Solrød and Karlslunde.


----------



## SeanT

This is near Karlslunde gasstation


----------



## kosimodo

^^ 3 years of fun!!


----------



## Fender56

The Danish politicians just decided on the final routing of the Herning-Holstebro motorway, pricetag DKK 3.855 mio. To be completed 2018:










:cheers:


----------



## Nikolaj

Fender56 said:


> The Danish politicians just decided on the final routing of the Herning-Holstebro motorway, pricetag DKK 3.855 mio. To be completed 2018:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :cheers:


A rather bizar decision on the alignment around Herning. Local politicians in Herning were adamant that they wanted an alignment to the west of Herning They wanted the Route 18 motorway to be routed south and west of Herning instead of the current alignment to the east of Herning, including an upgrade of current route 15 to the south of Herning from 1+1 expressway (orange) to full motorway. The argument for this solution was quicker access to the new hospital (purple dot), but primarily for local development concerns.

Road Directorate (Vejdirektoratet) on the other hand, wanted the current route 18 1+1 expressway (orange) to the east/northeast of Herning upgraded to motorway, whereas a new connecting road to the new regional hospital should be an ordinary 1+1 road. 

The argument from Road Directorate were quite strong: 

1. lower cost, and significantly lower benefit/cost ratio

2. low traffic amount on an western aligment (AADT around 5.000), but around 15.000 on eastern alignment

3.insignificant (less than a minut) time gain with motorway access to hospital instead of ordinary 1+1 road

In a typical, but not very pretty, political give-and-take-decision, a compromise was decided: Route 18 will remain aligned to the east of Herning (the shortest route, which will be chosen by the motorists anyway), Herning will get its underutilised motorway to the west, but due to the high cost having the motorway option to the hospital, neither the current 1+1 route expressway to the east nor the current route 15 1+1 expressway to the south (the orange parts) will be upgraded to motorway standard.

The end result of the compromise is that Holstebro will not have full motorway access, as no matter which route you choose around Herning you will encounter a short section (5-7 km) of 1+1 expressway standard. 



[/LIST]


----------



## kapo311

^^
Thanks for the good explanation, and what a stupid outcome indeed.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Femernbelt Tunnel*

The cross-section of the Femern / Fehmarn Belt Tunnel between Denmark and Germany.










The tunnel is 18 kilometers long, as you can see it has full motorway standard, including full-width shoulders, something you don't see often in long tunnels. 

I wonder what the speed limit will be, I expect 110 km/h. 

It's an immersed tube tunnel with segments of 42.2 meters wide, 8.9 meters tall and 217 meters long. To be constructed in a temporary site near Rødbyhavn. Each segment weighs 73500 tonnes. 

To be constructed between 2015 and 2021. It will be the longest immersed tunnel ever constructed. It will be the second longest tunnel in Europe when it opens, but it will likely be passed by the planned Boknafjord Tunnel (25.5 km) in Norway within a year.


----------



## devo

I wonder what the train speed limit will be... 220 km/h?


----------



## NordikNerd

I wonder how much it would cost me if my car broke down in that tunnel ? and where is the emergency exit if I have to abandon my vehicle ?

I prefer the ferry and will probably use the Gedser-Warnemunde route in the future instead or other ferries.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Tunnels like these are statistically safer than regular motorways in the open air. There are emergency exits every 100 m.


----------



## Galro

How deep will it go?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Probably not much deeper than 30 - 35 meters. I haven't seen any official figures though.

The speed limits;

* road: 110 km/h
* freight trains: 140 km/h
* passenger trains: 200 km/h


----------



## flierfy

ChrisZwolle said:


> I wonder what the speed limit will be, I expect 110 km/h.


Similar sea crossings have limits of *90 km/h for road traffic* and *160 km/h for the railway*. I presume that such speed limits will be applied on this tunnel as well.


----------



## OulaL

NordikNerd said:


> I wonder how much it would cost me if my car broke down in that tunnel ? and where is the emergency exit if I have to abandon my vehicle ?


Not much, I guess. It's everyone's interest that the tunnel is not blocked.

For instance at Mont Blanc the staff tows you out free of charge, if your car breaks for any reason other than running out of fuel. (Running out of fuel will cost you €300, though.)

An emergency exit should never be more than 200 metres away.


----------



## MichiH

ChrisZwolle said:


> The speed limits; * road: 110 km/h


Source?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

http://www.femern.com/home/engineering-how-to-build-a-tunnel


----------



## Sunfuns

It's a very long tunnel for cars, but nothing special for trains. Not even in the top 20, I believe.


----------



## IceCheese

^^The Follobane-tunnel in Oslo will be longer and support trains running 250 km/h by 2019.  19,5 km will be the longest rail tunnel in the Nordics.


----------



## OulaL

Sunfuns said:


> It's a very long tunnel for cars, but nothing special for trains. Not even in the top 20, I believe.


It would barely make top 20 today (number 18 if twin tubes are counted as one, or 19 and 20 if not).

However, it won't make it at the time it will be completed.

http://www.lotsberg.net/data/rail.html


----------



## SeanT

I made a little trip and took som pictures from Virum to Hvidovre.

http://imageshack.us/a/img812/2636/imag0630ws.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img854/9453/imag0631u.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img818/281/imag0632p.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img191/5820/imag0633vl.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img855/5583/imag0634p.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img835/4889/imag0635d.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img407/2558/imag0636i.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img547/3622/imag0637k.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img163/1192/imag0638b.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img197/9035/imag0639d.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img51/7577/imag0640x.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img441/1542/imag0641l.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img822/8564/imag0642s.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img812/7328/imag0643b.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img6/8688/imag0644q.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img577/4554/imag0645u.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img42/1850/imag0646b.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img607/3563/imag0647e.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img829/4817/imag0648m.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img819/7449/imag0649i.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img706/8904/imag0650x.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img594/8868/imag0651w.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img708/3286/imag0652v.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img545/9222/imag0653t.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img211/715/imag0654w.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img441/8031/imag0655v.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img35/2071/imag0656d.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img27/5845/imag0657o.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img10/4879/imag0658hj.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img844/1307/imag0659j.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img600/1112/imag0660x.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img90/8333/imag0661d.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img809/8702/imag0662e.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img841/6396/imag0663e.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img823/5867/imag0664k.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img29/8503/imag0665gc.jpg


----------



## javimix19

Hi I have a question:

- If you want to go between Copenhagen and Berlin for example what route is the best? 

Go to Jutland or cross Fehmarn Strait? If I go to Jutland there are a lot of kilometres. But if I go to the strait there are regular ferries to go with your car?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

There are frequent ferries in both directions. It's one of the most heavily used ferry routes in Europe. However overall it makes little difference in time and cost whether you take the bridge route or ferry route. If you drive a diesel car, the bridge route is cheaper (the higher amount of kilometers has less impact). I prefer the flexibility of the bridge route, others like the break on the ferry.


----------



## Road_UK

My boss has always made us use the ferry. (Puttgarden to Roedby and Helsingor to Helsingborg.) 

I think it works out a bit cheaper in a van...


----------



## NordikNerd

javimix19 said:


> Hi I have a question:
> 
> - If you want to go between Copenhagen and Berlin for example what route is the best?
> 
> Go to Jutland or cross Fehmarn Strait? If I go to Jutland there are a lot of kilometres. But if I go to the strait there are regular ferries to go with your car?


You dont need the Fehmarn strait. If you choose the ferry you choose Gedser-Warnemunde. If you choose the StoreBält bridge you will have an 330km extra drive (434km or 763km.) Storebelt bridge is 280DKK=37 EUR. Gedser-ferry booked in advance~80EUR. Petrol to spend on 330km ~43EUR.

I think it's almost even, both costs and time. I would definately pick the ferry. After a long drive you are exhausted and want to take a rest, have a cup of coffee and some fresh air. The ferry is like a rolling rest area. My advice take the ferry !

Berlin-Copenhagen: Drive to Rostock and take the ferry Rostock(Warnemunde)-Gedser.

The ferries Puttgarden-Rödby & Warnemunde-Gedser are very expensive compared to other ferries in the Baltic. A one direction trip 5 ppl+car, 45min on the sea equals ca 75EUR. The Gedser ferry costs about 115EUR

If you book at least 14 days in advance there is a 30% discount.

If you buy something at the bordershop and only stay a couple of hours, you can travel Rödby-Puttgarden both directions for less than 50 EUR.
You pay full price but get money back on the return-trip if you show the receit from the bordershop.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Ah Copenhagen - Berlin, I thought Copenhagen - Hamburg. In that case, I think the ferry via Gedser is indeed the best option, the detour via the bridges is very long and a detour via Rødby - Puttgarden is unnecessary since you're taking a ferry already. 

A Gedser - Rostock Bridge was considered, but the length is quite long and economic ties between Denmark and Western Europe are tighter than between Denmark and Central Europe. The Femern Strait has proven traffic volumes to construct a bridge or tunnel, but the Gedser route does not (I don't know exact ferry data, but according to traffic counts, there are only 2.800 vehicles per day on E55 north of Gedser, which includes traffic with an origin or destination in Gedser itself).


----------



## NordikNerd

ChrisZwolle said:


> Ah Copenhagen - Berlin, I thought Copenhagen - Hamburg. In that case, I think the ferry via Gedser is indeed the best option, the detour via the bridges is very long and a detour via Rødby - Puttgarden is unnecessary since you're taking a ferry already.



Actually if you have a fuel-efficient car the route Berlin-Puttgarden-Copenhagen is an alternative, because the Puttgarden-Rödby ferry is about 30% cheaper than the Gedser ferry. 

Berlin-Puttgarden-Copenhagen: 587 km
Berlin-Gedser-Copenhagen: 447 km


----------



## Nikolaj

NordikNerd said:


> You dont need the Fehmarn strait. If you choose the ferry you choose Gedser-Warnemunde. If you choose the StoreBält bridge you will have an 330km extra drive (434km or 763km.) Storebelt bridge is 280DKK=37 EUR. Gedser-ferry booked in advance~80EUR. Petrol to spend on 330km ~43EUR.
> 
> I think it's almost even, both costs and time. I would definately pick the ferry. After a long drive you are exhausted and want to take a rest, have a cup of coffee and some fresh air. The ferry is like a rolling rest area. My advice take the ferry !
> 
> Berlin-Copenhagen: Drive to Rostock and take the ferry Rostock(Warnemunde)-Gedser.
> 
> The ferries Puttgarden-Rödby & Warnemunde-Gedser are very expensive compared to other ferries in the Baltic. A one direction trip 5 ppl+car, 45min on the sea equals ca 75EUR. The Gedser ferry costs about 115EUR
> 
> If you book at least 14 days in advance there is a 30% discount.
> 
> If you buy something at the bordershop and only stay a couple of hours, you can travel Rödby-Puttgarden both directions for less than 50 EUR.
> You pay full price but get money back on the return-trip if you show the receit from the bordershop.


Just a slight correction: The Gedser-Warnemünde ferry has been closed for the last 20 years. The ferry connection from Gedser lands in Rostock Überseehafen just at the end of the A19/E55 motorway towards Berlin.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The first 6.5 kilometers of the new Kalundborgmotorvej (Primærrute 23) will open on August 27. It runs from the former Tølløse exit of PR-21 (Holbækmotorvejen, which is now a motorway-to-motorway interchange) to Kvanløse.


----------



## SeanT

I was driving from Holbæk to Ringsted the other day and I noticed that the old expressway is now motorway -towards Copenhagen but still expressway to Kalundborg.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Road map of Denmark in 1941.


----------



## Penn's Woods

^^Exonym of the Day: Elsinore!

(I thought that went out of fashion after Shakespeare...)

But that printer needs the capability to show those Os-with-slashes-through-them.


----------



## Heico-M

Penn's Woods said:


> But that printer needs the capability to show those Os-with-slashes-through-them.


In those days it was quite common to use Ö instead of Ø, Ä instead of Æ and AA instead of Å. 

Sweden still uses Ä and Ö.

In today's Danish, AA is only allowed in names.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Penn's Woods said:


> ^^Exonym of the Day: Elsinore!
> 
> (I thought that went out of fashion after Shakespeare...)


Apparently Elsinore is still used, but hardly ever mentioned, because, what news is there about Helsingør that makes the international media today? Pretty much nothing. :lol:

It's time to build that proposed tunnel and motorring 5. That would allow for extremely good access to the rest of Scandinavia. Motorring 5 would only make sense as a tax-funded road, but the tunnel to Helsingborg could easily be tolled to raise the money needed to construct the link.


----------



## Galro

Heico-M said:


> In those days it was quite common to use Ö instead of Ø, Ä instead of Æ and AA instead of Å.
> 
> Sweden still uses Ä and Ö.
> 
> In today's Danish, AA is only allowed in names.


I believe Denmark first (at least officially) introduced the Å in 1948. I'm unsure about the Ø and Æ though.


----------



## NordikNerd

ChrisZwolle said:


> Road map of Denmark in 1941.


Isnt that a railway map ?

One interesting aspect here is the opening of the Lillebelt bridge in 1935.

Before that, Assens was an important harbour for the ferries from Fyn to Jutland.

The city prospered, the population was growing and buisness was going well. After the opening of the bridge Assens lost a great deal of its importance.

I also believe that the cities of Nyborg and Korsör lost buisness when the Storebelt bridge opened. Motorway travellers dont stop there for shopping anymore.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

That's the price of moving forward. The last segments of the Interstate Highways in the western U.S. to open were all the bypasses around towns, because they would lose a lot of business from travelers. 

It looks like a railroad map, even though the site said it was a road map. You can also see other fixed railway links, such as the Oddesund Bridge and the Storstrøm Bridge, which opened in the 1930s.


----------



## Fender56

NordikNerd said:


> Isnt that a railway map ?


It must be a combination of rail and roads, because there has never been a railway between Varde and Bramming! 

Correct me if i´m wrong, i´ve never heard about it. Could be it was planned then but never build?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The Copenhagen congestion charge is now scrapped by the minister who previously campaigned in favor of it. 

http://jyllands-posten.dk/politik/ECE5863879/pia-olsen-dyhr-opgiver-endegyldigt-betalingsringen/


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The Swedish city of Landskrona has proposed to build a tunnel under the Øresund to Copenhagen. They specifically mention the Nordhavn area. A tunnel between these points would be circa 22 - 23 kilometers long. It would be in addition to the Øresund Connection (E20) and the proposed HH-connection (E47). 

I doubt if such a tunnel is viable. It will have a very high cost due to its significant length and will attract only local traffic. There is no good connection to the motorways around Copenhagen. They should focus on getting the Helsingør-Helsingborg Tunnel constructed.

The HH-connection could serve both road and rail traffic and will bypass Copenhagen when combined with the proposed Motorring 5. This will greatly improve access for both road and rail to the Scandinavian peninsula. The current rail route through Copenhagen is congested and slow. Motorring 5 + HH-connection will reduce distance by 40 kilometers.


----------



## SeanT

...The HH tunnel. I´ve been living in DK for the past 20 years and those plans keep popping up from nowhere ....and disapear there too from time to time.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I think the construction of the Femernbelt Tunnel will make a stronger point for Motorring 5 and the HH-connection, especially if this project is without delays and cost overruns.


----------



## NordikNerd

ChrisZwolle said:


> The Swedish city of Landskrona has proposed to build a tunnel under the Øresund to Copenhagen.


There was a regular ferry route Landskrona-Copenhagen (Tuborg harbour) but it closed as the Öresund bridge opened.

But now it seems like the ferry route opened again during the summer. 

It takes 1 hour. I think this could be a better choice than the train for those who live in Landskrona.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> I think the construction of the Femernbelt Tunnel will make a stronger point for Motorring 5 and the HH-connection, especially if this project is without delays and cost overruns.


In Denmark the HH connection (and to some extent) is more or less only sponsored by the town of Helisingør (Elsinore). It is primarily a Swedish driven project. There is no real interest in the project from the Danish government, and it will be a nightmare (NIMBY's) to have a corridor through Northern Zealand, with the well-off suburbs where all the politicians and top civil servants are living.

If and when extra capacity (primarily rail capacity) is needed across Øresund the preferred Danish solution is extra capacity in some way or the other between Copenhagen and Malmö. There is absolutely no wish to have more goods transport (rail or trucks) through Northern Zealand.


----------



## NordikNerd

Nikolaj said:


> In Denmark the HH connection (and to some extent) is more or less only sponsored by the town of Helisingør (Elsinore). It is primarily a Swedish driven project. There is no real interest in the project from the Danish government,


The germans aren't to keen about the Fehmarn project, because it is not as important for them as it is for the danish to get a fixed link to continental Europe from Själland. Similar thing about connections between S-DK.

But the HH-connection must be a very local idea in Helsingborg because I have never heard of it. 

I must add though that when I drove from Roskilde to Helsingör I noticed that although Helsingör is a quite small city, through traffic was very dense, especially the road to the harbour. During July I can imagine that some congestions could occur, while many swedes pass through Helsingör when going to Europe. It's the best route for most motorists living north of the southernmost part of Sweden. Next time I'll drive to Germany I will not drive through DK though, I will choose the Trelleborg-Sassnitz ferry which is cheaper than the HH & Rödby-Puttgarden ferries.


----------



## Shifty2k5

Why is Motorring 5 even discussed? Wouldn't widening Helsingørmotorvejen and motorring 3 suffice?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Motorring 3 was recently widened to 2x3 lanes. A further widening would be quite expensive. Motorring 5 would serve chiefly regional traffic, international traffic would be relatively small. The idea is to combine it with a commuter / freight railway that bypasses Copenhagen. The HH proposal even goes for 5 tunnels (2 tubes for motorway, 2 tubes for passenger railway and 1 tube for freight railway).


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> Motorring 3 was recently widened to 2x3 lanes. A further widening would be quite expensive. Motorring 5 would serve chiefly regional traffic, international traffic would be relatively small. The idea is to combine it with a commuter / freight railway that bypasses Copenhagen. The HH proposal even goes for 5 tunnels (2 tubes for motorway, 2 tubes for passenger railway and 1 tube for freight railway).


But again in official Danish planning, only a Motorring 5 motorway is considered at a preliminary level - no railconnection. And the same with the HH fixed link - is not considered at the official national level. It is entirely a local proposal.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*new road openings*

The new motorway Riis - Ølholm - Vejle (E45) will open to traffic on 30 September 2013. 

Additionally, the western bypass of Slagelse (Primærrute 22) will open to traffic on 28 September 2013.

Also, construction of the bypass of Næstved (Primærrute 54) will begin on 27 September 2013. This will open in 2016.


----------



## bongo-anders

Nikolaj said:


> But again in official Danish planning, only a Motorring 5 motorway is considered at a preliminary level - no railconnection. And the same with the HH fixed link - is not considered at the official national level. It is entirely a local proposal.


That is not correct, the ring 5 corridor is projected with both a motorway and a railway and a huge area is already reserved for this purpose and has been in many years.
Maybe not a with a railroad in mind when it was made in the 60'ies but I think that the general consensus is that it will get build with a railroad because Ring 5 will only get build if the H-H tunnel is build.

There will be stations at Helsingør, north of Allerød, A relocated Kildedal station and at Køge Nord.
The line will also branch of towards Roskilde.

The Rambøl study shows that this project without the H-H tunnel will costs around 19 billion DKK.

I have linked to the Rambøl report here on SSC before and I will find it again if you are interested.


----------



## Nikolaj

bongo-anders said:


> That is not correct, the ring 5 corridor is projected with both a motorway and a railway and a huge area is already reserved for this purpose and has been in many years.
> Maybe not a with a railroad in mind when it was made in the 60'ies but I think that the general consensus is that it will get build with a railroad because Ring 5 will only get build if the H-H tunnel is build.
> 
> There will be stations at Helsingør, north of Allerød, A relocated Kildedal station and at Køge Nord.
> The line will also branch of towards Roskilde.
> 
> The Rambøl study shows that this project without the H-H tunnel will costs around 19 billion DKK.
> 
> I have linked to the Rambøl report here on SSC before and I will find it again if you are interested.


H+H and a railway in the Ring 5 corridor are locally sponsored project (helsingør primarily),and the Rambøll study is locally sponsored study aiming at convincing the national authority to go into the project. 

From the official national authorities only a motorway is considered, and only at a very preliminary stage


----------



## bongo-anders

Baggrund
I efteråret 2008 igangsattes projektet Infrastruktur og Byudvikling i Øresundsregionen (IBU) med
midler fra Interreg IV-programmet. Projektet koordineres af Region Skåne, Region Hovedstaden
og Region Sjælland samt involverer 30 partnere i form af kommuner, samarbejdsfora og institutioner i hhv. Danmark og Sverige.

Well I see more than just Helsingør here.


http://www.regionh.dk/NR/rdonlyres/...D1FC50F/0/RING_5_motorvej_og_banekorridor.pdf


That is correct that Trafikministeriet is only looking at a motorway but a railway tunnel will be useless if there is no connection to the mainline that bypass Copenhagen.
And forget about freight trains running through Kystbanen and the central station :lol:


Here is the link for the tunnel study.

http://www.regionh.dk/NR/rdonlyres/...55A3D/0/HH_forbindelsen_tekniske_analyser.pdf


----------



## bongo-anders

Vejdirektoratet has taken these areals that the user Silkebaronen reposted in the danish section. 
































































































































More aerials here:
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...der/Documents/Planche-LUFTFOTO-ALLE_rev01.pdf

3D renderings here:
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...Planche-VISU_Bystrækningen-Silkeborg_ALLE.pdf

Source:
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/Funder-Laasby/Visualisering/Sider/default.aspx#


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Primærrute 15 around Silkeborg, right?


----------



## bongo-anders

Oh sorry I forgot to add that info, but off course it is.


----------



## Nikolaj

bongo-anders said:


> Baggrund
> I efteråret 2008 igangsattes projektet Infrastruktur og Byudvikling i Øresundsregionen (IBU) med
> midler fra Interreg IV-programmet. Projektet koordineres af Region Skåne, Region Hovedstaden
> og Region Sjælland samt involverer 30 partnere i form af kommuner, samarbejdsfora og institutioner i hhv. Danmark og Sverige.
> 
> Well I see more than just Helsingør here.
> 
> 
> http://www.regionh.dk/NR/rdonlyres/...D1FC50F/0/RING_5_motorvej_og_banekorridor.pdf
> 
> 
> That is correct that Trafikministeriet is only looking at a motorway but a railway tunnel will be useless if there is no connection to the mainline that bypass Copenhagen.
> And forget about freight trains running through Kystbanen and the central station :lol:
> 
> 
> Here is the link for the tunnel study.
> 
> http://www.regionh.dk/NR/rdonlyres/...55A3D/0/HH_forbindelsen_tekniske_analyser.pdf


Correct but the point is that the Ministry of Transport is not looking into an H+H link at all. The H+H link is entirely a Swedish and locally (in Helsingør) sponsored project. To the extent that Ministry of Transport and its agencies are looking into added capacity across Øresund (rail capacity) it is added capacity between Copenhagen and Malmö that has the focus.


----------



## MattiG

Nikolaj said:


> Correct but the point is that the Ministry of Transport is not looking into an H+H link at all. The H+H link is entirely a Swedish and locally (in Helsingør) sponsored project. To the extent that Ministry of Transport and its agencies are looking into added capacity across Øresund (rail capacity) it is added capacity between Copenhagen and Malmö that has the focus.


Not very surprising. Germany is not very interested in paying the access from Denmark to Germany. Denmark is not very interested in paying the access from Sweden to Denmark. Sweden is not very interested in paying the access from Finland to Sweden. Logical, isn't it.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

IMHO, the EU should fund such major projects with a larger share than they do today. Construction of motorways with EU-funding in Poland and Romania is good and necessary, but let's not forget the infrastructure in the older EU countries.


----------



## Heico-M

ChrisZwolle said:


> IMHO, the EU should fund such major projects with a larger share than they do today. Construction of motorways with EU-funding in Poland and Romania is good and necessary, but let's not forget the infrastructure in the older EU countries.


We have the same problem in Germany. After 1990, a lot of infrastructure funds went into the Eastern states, which was right because there was a lot to do. But the consequence today is, that there has been done too little in the Western states. 

But in my opinion and seen from the distance, the HH link does not look like a "must have", but rather a "nice to have".


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> IMHO, the EU should fund such major projects with a larger share than they do today. Construction of motorways with EU-funding in Poland and Romania is good and necessary, but let's not forget the infrastructure in the older EU countries.


Well, I don't know. Anything the EU touches turns bloody expensive because of massive bureaucracy. Secondly, most of the EU money is collected from the older EU countries. I cannot see much benefits from routing the money to Brussels and back.


----------



## bongo-anders

The car traffic over Øresund is not the problem, its the rail traffic that is pushing on to the limits.

The problem is a high density of passenger trains mixed up with alot of freight trains, the trains are packed in the rush hour and for the moment there is very little spare capacity.

But the point is that in order to build the tunnel they also need to build a tunnel for cars in order to make it financial viable.

But the motorway along the ring 5 corridor will also move cars away from motorring 3, 4 and also to some extend ring 2 and 3, relieving congestion on these ring roads.

A study showed that even the roads around the lakes in central Copenhagen would have a small decrease in traffic if the Ring 5 corridor was build.


----------



## RV

Why are all Scandinavian/Baltic countries expanding their roads, except Finland...


----------



## Heico-M

Too few people, too much wood *hehe*


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Has it ever been proposed to turn O4 between Ballerup and PR-16/Hillerødmotorvejen into a four-lane road? 

The current road is two-lane undivided, but has a very wide carriageway (10-11 meters) and intersections already feature 2x2 lanes. It appears to be possible to widen the road to four-lane undivided (perhaps even 2x2 with a barrier). There is about 20 meters of space between the bike paths.


----------



## kalaha

There is current proposal to extend the motorway some of the way (I think it is to Sortemosevej), but not all the way, as it will take up too much area and will be too complex regarding the benefits. 

The proposal is although only on strategic analysis level so far.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> Has it ever been proposed to turn O4 between Ballerup and PR-16/Hillerødmotorvejen into a four-lane road?
> 
> The current road is two-lane undivided, but has a very wide carriageway (10-11 meters) and intersections already feature 2x2 lanes. It appears to be possible to widen the road to four-lane undivided (perhaps even 2x2 with a barrier). There is about 20 meters of space between the bike paths.


A recent report from Ministry of Transport summarizing a number of strategic studies proposes to extending the Ring 4 motorway to Sortemosevej http://www.trm.dk/~/media/Files/Pub...portering for de strategiske analyser rep.pdf p.61 and http://www.trm.dk/~/media/Files/Pub...apacitetsforbedringer i Ring 4-korridoren.pdf (Ringway 4 Report) and widening the remaining section until Route 16 Motorway /Hillerød Motorway to a 2+2 divided road without grade separated junctions. It is concluded that a full motorway until Route 16 is not feasible (to costly) especially because a full junction with Route 16 will require to much build-up land.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Yes, I didn't mean a motorway, but simply a widening of the existing road to a four-lane urban arterial with traffic lights. This appears to be possible within the existing right of way. 

Another idea is that Motorring 5 would relieve O4 from through traffic, depending on how far Motorring 5 will be from O4.


----------



## Nikolaj

It appears from the report from Ministry of Transport that they are going for a Ring 4 upgrade (partly motorway and partly 2+2) as a short term and cheap solution (only 120 Mio. Euro) and then perhaps a Ring 5 in a longer term perspective, perhaps starting with a southern section from Køge (E20/E47) until Route 21 towards Roskilde or The new Route 17 motorway towards Frederikssund (partly under construction). The northern section of Ring 5 is the environmentally most problematic section, and least needed section.


----------



## bongo-anders

I think that the northern part of Ring 5 will only get build if they build the HH tunnel.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E45 Kolding*

Shoulder running will be applied to E45 around Kolding. It should become operational by summer 2014. This is the second location in Denmark with shoulder running.

map:


----------



## sponge_bob

What is the speed limit on Danish 2+2 , is it 100kph and of a similar spec to Swedish/Finnish 2+2 ???


----------



## ChrisZwolle

You mean four-lane, non motorways? Roads like that are pretty rare outside urban areas. 

The general rural speed limit in Denmark is 80 km/h. There are a few 90 km/h stretches on 2+1 / 2x2 but they are fairly rare compared to other countries. I am not aware of any 100 zones.


----------



## sponge_bob

ChrisZwolle said:


> You mean four-lane, non motorways? Roads like that are pretty rare outside urban areas.


Not in Sweden or Finland. They are built instead of 1+1 on National Roads in rural areas that do not justify a motorway. The entire carriageway is c 18m across inc median. Much of western Denmark is pretty rural.

EG > http://goo.gl/maps/myZ9X


----------



## Shifty2k5

I found a video of the recently opened Rute 21 in north-western Sjælland. It features a 2+1 design for most of its length, which is rather uncommon in Denmark.







Here's a video of a Swedish 2+1 (and 2+2) for comparison.


----------



## Ingenioren

It's a test for new road standards, it's also the first time since 90s a new road is fitted with wire-barrier in Denmark.


----------



## sponge_bob

Most Swedish 2+1 roads are retrofits of former wide 1+1 , Ireland will no longer build 2+1 although they may consider 2+1 as a retrofit standard. 

The land take difference between 2+2 and 2+1 (both new build options) is only 3.5m more anyway and less at 80kph where you might even consider 3.25m wide lanes.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> You mean four-lane, non motorways? Roads like that are pretty rare outside urban areas.
> 
> The general rural speed limit in Denmark is 80 km/h. There are a few 90 km/h stretches on 2+1 / 2x2 but they are fairly rare compared to other countries. I am not aware of any 100 zones.


New 2+2's in Denmark are generally built as full motorways (standard 29 m profile/130 km/h). Next step from full motorway (if new road) is normally a 2+1 expressway/motortrafikvej (16 m standard/90 km/h). However according to the newest standards from 2013 http://vejregler.lovportaler.dk/ShowDoc.aspx?schultzlink=vd-anlaeg-tvaer-aabent2013#pkt5 - a 2+2 standard exists. It is a 19 m/90 km/h standard. I have never seen it implemented anywhere. A few older 2+2 non-motorways exist in open land. They are generally with level crossing, and speed limit is thus 80 k/h. I can recall 2 sections of 2+2 with 90 km/h. That is Route 8 east of Sønderborg and Route 26 south of Viborg. Both features mostly controlled access, but also includes a couple of level crossings. They are not signed as espressway/motortrafikvej.


----------



## sponge_bob

Nikolaj said:


> However according to the newest standards from 2013 http://vejregler.lovportaler.dk/ShowDoc.aspx?schultzlink=vd-anlaeg-tvaer-aabent2013#pkt5 - a 2+2 standard exists. It is a 19 m/90 km/h standard. I have never seen it implemented anywhere. A few older 2+2 non-motorways exist in open land. They are generally with level crossing, and speed limit is thus 80 k/h.


I am surprised at that. In Ireland Sweden and Finland ( I think) the limit is 100kph on the same spec of road with 3.5m running lanes. 

The reason for 2+2 is simple. In develOPED countries infinite traffic growth can no longer be assumed along with an eventual need for motorway ...in rural areas. 2+2 gives the safety benefits of motorway without the cost, EG the removal (by design) of most collision scenarios that can cause serious injury. 

So leaving a road as 1+1 'pending' a motorway is no longer a good idea. The difference between a good 1+1 with a 13-14m carriageway and a much better 2+2 with an 18-19m carriageway is very small and with greatly enhanced safety and overall flow.

I think that a 'rural expressway standard' is the most accurate description. 

One important factor that influenced 1960s/1970s 1+1 designs was that

a) cars were unreliable
b) tractors were slow, barely able to make 30kph

Therefore hard shoulders along 1+1 roads were common. 

Now cars are far more reliable and most farmers nowadays seem to have air conditioned tractors that can do 60kph even when pulling a load. 

_*Therefore*_ a hard shoulder is a waste and can be better used as a running lane. 

Ireland, apart from having a 2+2 100kph standard with 17m Carriageway width also has a 120kph 'Rural' or low flow Motorway standard with a 22m Carriageway width. Works perfectly well at 120kph too. Obviously the geometry is not as twisty as a 2+2 100kph road could be. The disadvantage of a 2+2 is that it would be very expensive to ever upgrade it to a motorway ...mainly owing to the alignment. 

See > http://nrastandards.nra.ie/road-design-construction-standards/func-startdown/459 and http://nrastandards.nra.ie/road-des.../chk734277ba0f6c9f787d4d0e58e9c844f8/no_html1


----------



## Nikolaj

I am not familiar with the situation in Ireland, but in Denmark in those cases where it has been considered to widen an existing road the cost is relatively high, especially compared to the price of constructing a new "green-field" motorway. The reason in Denmark is the large number of access roads along an ordinary road, and also because of relatively many houses along the roads in those areas where more capacity is needed. Therefore the conclusion usually have been that widening an existing road is not feasible.


----------



## Fender56

The transformation of the 2+2 motorway E20/E45 north around Kolding, will be a 110km/h 3+3 motorway. The trick is removing the rescue lane, and build new short rescue zones every 500m. 

Just to remove any mistakes, this will NOT be a 80 km/h, 90 km/h or 100 km/h, but simply a 110 km/h 3+3 highway! Topspeed on highways in Denmark, outside rural areas, is still 130 km/h.

So this is a first in DK.










http://www.fdm.dk/nyheder/noedspor-skal-fjerne-propper-ved-kolding


----------



## javimix19

Well, I have one question about danish motorways:

- In Denmark all motorways are toll free, I know. But there are two bridges with tolls: Great Belt Fixed Link and Oresund Bridge.

- My question is about tolls in these two bridges: As 2014 Great Fixed Link by standard car costs 33 euros. Oresund Bridge costs 46 euros.

All right, I'm from Basque Country, and I don't know if this is expensive or not... For salaries in very corrupt Spain (I'm basque, nor spanish) these tolls are very expensive. Well, I live in spanish Basque Country, not in french Basque Country, when life is good and salaries are like Netherlands.

My question is: Is there many traffic in those bridges? Is not very expensive?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Keep in mind that Danish salaries are much higher than in most other European countries, and that there are discount programmes for frequent users. For example daily users of the Øresund Bridge do not pay € 46 each way, but € 5 (between 17 and 50 single trips per month). Basically only tourists pay the full price, in fact one return trip per year with BroPass is already cheaper than two single trip tolls.


----------



## Heico-M

The point is: before there was a bridge, there used to be ferries. 
People had to pay anyway, so today, they pay for the bridge what they used to pay for the ferryboat. Perhaps some more.

For me, being German, the bridges are expensive too, and even for Danes, and Swedes, who are countries with some of the highest salaries in Europe, it is not cheap. Still, there is a lot of traffic on those bridges. 

There are ways to get discount. If you are a commuter - yes, there are people who cross the bridge twice a day - you can save a lot of money using a "BroBizz", an electronic toll system that gives a high rebate.

I crossed the Great Belt Bridge last weekend, and paid like 235 DKK (€ 31,50), and when I returned, it was only 140 DKK (€ 18,80). I got the weekend return discount, using the same credit card is enough to recognize that. Quite smart solution.

(On the other hand, I remember crossing the Vasco da Gama bridge in Lisboa, Portugal which is the same length - 17 km - and paid like € 2,50)


----------



## NordikNerd

Heico-M said:


> I crossed the Great Belt Bridge last weekend, and paid like 235 DKK


I drove across this bridge last year. When driving eastbound from Nyborg you pay first when you arrive in Korsör. Why ? It would be more appropriate to pay before entering the bridge. If someone cross the bridge and realizes he has no money when he arrives, what happends ? can he pass through and receive a bill that he pays later ?


----------



## Heico-M

NordikNerd said:


> I drove across this bridge last year. When driving eastbound from Nyborg you pay first when you arrive in Korsör. Why ? It would be more appropriate to pay before entering the bridge. If someone cross the bridge and realizes he has no money when he arrives, what happends ? can he pass through and receive a bill that he pays later ?


Possibly. Never tried it though.
But there are really big sings that you are entering a toll road and you have the chance to exit before you enter the bridge. So you don't take the road just accidentally.


----------



## Mirror's Edge

The high toll on the bridge is more or less what's keeping "Öresund" from being a reality, yeah you can take the train but what shopper is A buying only in the town center and B can carry all the sh*t all day. And it's so convenient to travel with your kids on a crowded commuter train right? Older ppl love the endless walking the train ride is sure to guarantee. 

Nah the dream is dead, the bridge is all about a few commuters and a lot of long haul traffic today, most ppl don't go often at all even as DK territory begin only 4km away from our 3rd largest city.

If they lowered the price a lot, say first weekend of the month, then if only for this one weekend the vision "Öresund" would be real. New costumers, new friends = Öresund!

Obviously the 2 regions would gain a lot from increased business(+ taxes) with lower tolls , hell they might even make more in tolls from larger volume..but no, it wont happen.


----------



## MichiH

*Primærrute 18 - Midtjyske Motorvej*



ChrisZwolle said:


> Brande bypass is currently being widened to a motorway. The project is due for completion in *October 2014*. Then there will be a continuous motorway from E45 at Vejle to Herning.


Sorry, I haven't noticed that info .



Nikolaj said:


> PR-18: Brande By-pass
> Length: 7 km
> Construction period: 2012-*June 2014*
> Addding one carriageway, and reconstruction of old carrigeway to motorway standard (adding width and hard shoulders)]
> 
> Map: http://wikimapia.org/#lang=en&lat=55.940644&lon=9.183712&z=13&m=o
> 
> Project: http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/da/vejprojekter/brande omfartsvej/Sider/default.aspx#.Uu9V1vl5Ph4


When will the 2nd carriageway of the _Brande_ bypass be opened, June or October 2014?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

My quote was from over a year ago, but Vejdirektoratet still lists October 2014.


----------



## MattiG

NordikNerd said:


> I drove across this bridge last year. When driving eastbound from Nyborg you pay first when you arrive in Korsör. Why ? It would be more appropriate to pay before entering the bridge. If someone cross the bridge and realizes he has no money when he arrives, what happends ? can he pass through and receive a bill that he pays later ?


It is cheaper to build one two-way toll plaza rather than two one-way ones. I addition, it is more efficient in terms of resourcing: The toll booth agents can change the side easily if the distribution of traffic volumes changes by time.

These benefits are widely recognized, and a similar setup can be seen at many toll bridges and tunnels.


----------



## OulaL

javimix19 said:


> All right, I'm from Basque Country, and I don't know if this is expensive or not... For salaries in very corrupt Spain (I'm basque, nor spanish) these tolls are very expensive. Well, I live in spanish Basque Country, not in french Basque Country, when life is good and salaries are like Netherlands.
> 
> My question is: Is there many traffic in those bridges? Is not very expensive?


You can't really compare these bridges to tolled motorways in Spain or France since these are the only options there are for these routes; drivers cannot save money by choosing a local road and not the motorway.



NordikNerd said:


> I drove across this bridge last year. When driving eastbound from Nyborg you pay first when you arrive in Korsör. Why ? It would be more appropriate to pay before entering the bridge. If someone cross the bridge and realizes he has no money when he arrives, what happends ? can he pass through and receive a bill that he pays later ?


What does it matter to the driver where the toll plaza is anyway? After you pass the last interchange before the bridge to either direction, you are obliged to pay - was it 0,5 km or 20 km after that interchange doesn't matter.

What matters is that you are forewarned about not only the toll road, but also about the amount of the toll itself, like this.

https://maps.google.fi/?ll=55.30560...=kbhPSkWKlOI1s6ltvtOQtQ&cbp=12,143.13,,0,7.97

Then again, if you see the sign above and you are on your way to Zealand, there isn't really much you can do if you don't have money. You can exit the motorway, sure, but as said above, there isn't really any cheaper way to get yourself and your car from that sign to Zealand.

As an answer to your question: what happens might be the same as on petrol stations, when you refill your tank and cannot pay. If you are cooperative, you might find a way to settle the issue later and police might not be needed, but however I strongly recommend against trying.


----------



## Ingenioren

Remove your license plate, then ram it


----------



## Sunfuns

Swimming the strait is for free, I think all other modes of transport will cost something.


----------



## devo

I guess you will get a bill in the mail if you just drive through without paying. Also, my guess is, "soon" there will be a europe-wide single system for tolled roads, AutoPass, BroBizz and so on. Less administration, easier for travelers and no ridiculous toll booths where you have to stop and pay on a road designated for 110 km/h+ speed. ANPR will take care of those who don't have any tags in their cars.


----------



## OulaL

Ingenioren said:


> Remove your license plate, then ram it


... and replace your windshield after hitting the barrier :lol:


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> My quote was from over a year ago, but Vejdirektoratet still lists October 2014.


The signs along the road still says October, but I think I have seen a Vejdirektoratet spokesperson being quoted for June as the opening month. 

I drove on the road this weekend, and the widening looks literally only few weeks from completion. Final layer of asphalt, including road marking, has been applied, crash barriers allmost complete and road signage are being erected. Best guess is completion before the holiday season.


----------



## Nikolaj

javimix19 said:


> Well, I have one question about danish motorways:
> 
> - In Denmark all motorways are toll free, I know. But there are two bridges with tolls: Great Belt Fixed Link and Oresund Bridge.
> 
> - My question is about tolls in these two bridges: As 2014 Great Fixed Link by standard car costs 33 euros. Oresund Bridge costs 46 euros.
> 
> All right, I'm from Basque Country, and I don't know if this is expensive or not... For salaries in very corrupt Spain (I'm basque, nor spanish) these tolls are very expensive. Well, I live in spanish Basque Country, not in french Basque Country, when life is good and salaries are like Netherlands.
> 
> My question is: Is there many traffic in those bridges? Is not very expensive?


For the users the prise for using the fixed links has more or less been accepted (you allways hear someone complaining). The reason for this is basically that (as least for the Great Belt/Storebælt link) prices are cheaper than before - with the ferries - plus you save 1 hour each way and the hazzle of having to speed to reach the ferry you had booked. For frequent users and for users with a Brobizz tag you don't pay the full price. But the main reason for the prize is that the construction cost (4-5 bn Euros - as far as I remember) has to be recovered. The Fixed Links are constructed without government subsidy, and the construction cost has to be recovered through bridge tolls. The toll has been set to recover (pay back the loans) in the shortest possible period/maximising income. Right now it is expected that the construction cost of the Great Belt Fixed Link will be recovered in about 30 years (around 2030). Studies have been made on the price elasticity for users of the bridge, and the conclusion is that if prices were reduced the number of users will not increase enough to achieve the same income for the Bridge company, and thus there ability to recover the construction cost.


----------



## NordikNerd

Nikolaj said:


> Right now it is expected that the construction cost of the Great Belt Fixed Link will be recovered in about 30 years (around 2030).


I wonder what the maintennance costs are on those bridges. I have read that there is constant service and repairs going on all the time due to corrosion and cracks in the concrete slab. How many maintennanceworkers are employed on the Öresund/Store Bält bridge just to keep it in order or do they only use contractors occasionally ?

The Store Bält bridge is making more profit than the Öresund bridge because it connects two separate parts of one country. Although connecting two major scandinavian cities, lack of integration means the Öresund bridge will never be as profitable as the Store Bält bridge. Same thing about the future Fehmarn-bridge.


----------



## Nikolaj

I took a look at the Annual Report 2013 from A/S Storebæltsforbindelsen http://www.e-pages.dk/sundblt/142/ and from Sund & Bælt A/S (the holding company owning A/S Storebælt as well as A/S Øresund) http://www.e-pages.dk/sundblt/137/

Main figures:

AADT 2013: 29817 (+ 0,2% from 2012)
Outstanding debt: DKK 24.3 bn (approx. Eur 3,3 bn)
Debt expexted to be downpayed: 2029
Profit after tax: Eur 300 mio. (for dividend to owner and downpayment of debt)
Maintenance and operation cost: Eur 55 mio.
Operation and Maintenance is outsourced, but the annual report states that approx. 200 people are employed with operation and maintenance.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E45 Limfjord Tunnel*

The Limfjord Tunnel turns 45 years today. It opened 6/5/1969. It was the first large road tunnel in Denmark and the first immersed tunnel.


Limfjordstunnellen opføres by Aalborg Stadsarkiv, on Flickr



Limfjordstunnellen opføres by Aalborg Stadsarkiv, on Flickr


Limfjordstunnellen opføres by Aalborg Stadsarkiv, on Flickr


----------



## ChrisZwolle

MichiH said:


> When will the 2nd carriageway of the _Brande_ bypass be opened, June or October 2014?





ChrisZwolle said:


> My quote was from over a year ago, but Vejdirektoratet still lists October 2014.





Nikolaj said:


> The signs along the road still says October, but I think I have seen a Vejdirektoratet spokesperson being quoted for June as the opening month.


Well, it's even better, the new carriageway and upgrade to motorway will open on 27 May! :cheers:

http://vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/om-os/...ortministeren-indvier-Brande-Omfartsvej-.aspx


----------



## Natomasken

Nikolaj said:


> The toll has been set to recover (pay back the loans) in the shortest possible period/maximising income. Right now it is expected that the construction cost of the Great Belt Fixed Link will be recovered in about 30 years (around 2030).


What will happen when the construction costs are paid off? Will the tolls be reduced to just cover ongoing operating and maintenance costs and company profits? I assume the company will not be allowed to keep the same toll rates and vastly increase their profits. This is a big advantage of having a well-regulated private company owning the bridge instead of the government. The temptation is too great to keep the tolls in place (which the public is already used to paying) after construction costs are paid off, and divert the funds to other purposes. I believe this is typical with US toll facilities, although I do recall hearing of cases where tolls have been removed. (Probably some of the Midwest and Northeast folks here know more about this than I do, since they live where most of the toll facilities are.)


----------



## MattiG

Natomasken said:


> What will happen when the construction costs are paid off?


The tolls are used for the endless repair of the bridge. Big bridges are like cathedrals: They are always under repair.

The bridge is a private company. There is no oblication to lower the prices.


----------



## Ingenioren

Those companies are state owned and once downpayed, tolls will be removed sometime mid 2030 decade.


----------



## Nikolaj

Ingenioren said:


> Those companies are state owned and once downpayed, tolls will be removed sometime mid 2030 decade.


Don't think so. It has neven said they will be free, when downpayed, and the general belief i Denmark is that it won't be free. 

The income from Storebælt will most likely be channelled to other infrastructure projects. A likely candidate is a Kattegat-link from Kalundborg to south of Aarhus, which is a hot infrastructure topic i Denmark. The Kattegat link has a big political backing, but it is hugely expensive and will probably need som outside financing, outside of the direct users.


----------



## NordikNerd

Nikolaj said:


> Don't think so. It has neven said they will be free, when downpayed, and the general belief i Denmark is that it won't be free.


Denmark is a fragmented state dependent on bridges and ferries. I wonder if the cost of groceries and other goods that need daily transport is higher in Denmark compared to other countries due to that. Is Själland dependant on Jylland & Fyn 
or vice versa or has the Great Belt made these two parts of the country selfsupporting ?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The Great Belt Bridge carries a decent amount of traffic considering the tolls and lack of local traffic generation (larger cities are farther away). The Great Belt Bridge carries 30,000 vehicles per day.


----------



## Nikolaj

NordikNerd said:


> Denmark is a fragmented state dependent on bridges and ferries. I wonder if the cost of groceries and other goods that need daily transport is higher in Denmark compared to other countries due to that. Is Själland dependant on Jylland & Fyn
> or vice versa or has the Great Belt made these two parts of the country selfsupporting ?


Before the Great Belt fixed link Denmark used to be fragmented logistically, and most companies, not only supermatkets etc., had one west and one east logistics center. That has changed a lot since 1998, when The Great Belt fixed link was inaugurated. The general trend has been moving towards one logistics center for the whole country, usually located along the motorway corridor from Aarhus to Odense. 

Denmark generally has relatively high prices, but I have never heard that its is caused by high transport cost. It is due to a generally high level of cost and salaries, and a relatively high tax level, including VAT. The bridge tolls amounts to very little in the overall price of transport, and in Denmark The Great Belt is only to a very small extent seen as a "toll" barrier.


----------



## Heico-M

Driving in Denmark does not differ very much from driving in other countries, apart from the Great Belt bridge, of course. The ferries are mostly connecting minor places like - say - Ærø, or can be considered as nice-to-have short cuts but not as vital links. 

Regarding the bridge toll, in Norway, it is in fact common that tolls are removed as soon as the road is paid down. I would not believe this to happen in Denmark. But it would be fair to lower the toll all the same.


----------



## NordikNerd

Heico-M said:


> Driving in Denmark does not differ very much from driving in other countries, apart from the Great Belt bridge, of course. The ferries are mostly connecting minor places like - say - Ærø, or can be considered as nice-to-have short cuts but not as vital links.


I still think it differs quite much. It's a fragmented country meaning it consists of
3 major parts; Jylland, Fyn & Själland which are separated by water. 

There are only two bridges connecting these parts (Little & Great Belt bridges) in many areas resulting in long drives compared to the actual bird's distance.


----------



## MattiG

Heico-M said:


> Regarding the bridge toll, in Norway, it is in fact common that tolls are removed as soon as the road is paid down. I would not believe this to happen in Denmark. But it would be fair to lower the toll all the same.


Norway is not to compare. The idea is totally different there. The toll roads/tunnels/bridges are owned by the state, not a company. The toll covers a predetermined *fraction* of the *construction cost* only, plus the cost to collect the money. For example, the only 20% of the construction of Eiksundsambandet was financed by road tolls, and 80% was taken directly from taxpayers' pockets.

Everyone owning a house knows that the cost of ownership does not drop to zero when the loan gets paid down. The same applies to bridges and any other infrastructure, too. Typically, they are financed by a 30-year load, just to pay it down before it is time to get a new load for the major reparations. The cost of the major reparations is comparable to building a new bridge.


----------



## Mirror's Edge

NordikNerd said:


> I still think it differs quite much. It's a fragmented country meaning it consists of
> 3 major parts; Jylland, Fyn & Själland which are separated by water.
> 
> There are only two bridges connecting these parts (Little & Great Belt bridges) in many areas resulting in long drives compared to the actual bird's distance.


I've worked in transportation in both DK/SW for years and Sweden is by far a more fragmented country then DK. Hours and hours in empty woods are just the worst.

When in DK you really don't feel the (short)distances at all in part because it looks the same on all the islands and traffic remain fairly dense all over. 
Fyn/Jylland are real tight BTW, it's Ålborg and Lolland/Falster that are the most odd ones being hours from any other major towns.


----------



## Ingenioren

MattiG said:


> The toll roads/tunnels/bridges are owned by the state, not a company.


----------



## Festin

Has the tunnel to Germany been started yet?


----------



## MattiG

Ingenioren said:


>


So?

As the chart shows, the bridge is owned by holding companies, directly or indirectly. The ownership of the holding companies is irrelevant here: The government-owned companies must operate following the same rules as all other companies. Any deviation from typical financial principles can easily be interpreted as a violation to the competition policies of the EU.

As the cost to maintain the bridge will rocket close to its 30th birthday, and the also the maintenance costs are to be covered by the tolls, do not expect a major decrease in tariffs, even if the loans for the initial construction will be paid down.

The system in Norway really is fundamentally different. Do not compare apples to oranges.


----------



## MichiH

Festin said:


> Has the tunnel to Germany been started yet?


No. The German plan approval procedure for the tunnel has recently started. It is (officially) planned to start the works in 2015 and open the tunnel in 2021.

If it would be a "common" German project, I would guess the plan approval procedure should last 2-4 years. But on one hand it is not a normal project, and on the other hand the opposition is big and they will probably take action at the court...


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Many Germans believe that not building the tunnel would save a lot of money to fund other projects, from what I've read in the media. Most don't realize the tunnel itself is toll funded and doesn't cost the German taxpayers anything. However the adjoining infrastructure in Germany has a big pricetag (they're talking about a 55 kilometer new rail alignment, plus upgrade of B207 in Germany.


----------



## MichiH

^^ Yes and no. I think most Germans which are against the tunnel are against because:
- They are again every (big) (infrastucture) project
- They are NIMBYs
- They are Greens
- They think the costs for the new rail alignment are too high
- They think the new rail alignment could affect them or destry the nature

I read less about the B207 upgrade. I am sometimes reading about the Fehmarn*sund* crossing, but at maximum once a year about the road upgrade. The discussion is just about the railway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The German and Danish government signed a treaty to improve hinterland infrastructure. The treaty specifies a four-lane highway from Heiligenhafen to the tunnel, but it allowed the single carriageway Fehmarnsund Bridge to be maintained for the time being. 

The Danish hinterland cost is near zero for roads (the motorway ends at the ferry terminal in Rødbyhavn), but they too need to expedite a large rail project (replacing the 3 km long Storstrøm Bridge).


----------



## MichiH

ChrisZwolle said:


> The German and Danish government signed a treaty to improve hinterland infrastructure. The treaty specifies a four-lane highway from Heiligenhafen to the tunnel, but it allowed the single carriageway Fehmarnsund Bridge to be maintained for the time being.


Yes. But government decisions and planning procedures with public participation differ. The German hinterland road is not discussed that means "no problem" or no big opposition.


----------



## Festin

MichiH said:


> No. The German plan approval procedure for the tunnel has recently started. It is (officially) planned to start the works in 2015 and open the tunnel in 2021.
> 
> If it would be a "common" German project, I would guess the plan approval procedure should last 2-4 years. But on one hand it is not a normal project, and on the other hand the opposition is big and they will probably take action at the court...





ChrisZwolle said:


> Many Germans believe that not building the tunnel would save a lot of money to fund other projects, from what I've read in the media. Most don't realize the tunnel itself is toll funded and doesn't cost the German taxpayers anything. However the adjoining infrastructure in Germany has a big pricetag (they're talking about a 55 kilometer new rail alignment, plus upgrade of B207 in Germany.


Seems as 6 year is a short deadline to complete such a big Project, but it sure would be nice if it would. Hopefully Germany can speed things up since they will no be funding the tunnel itself, if I am not misstaken.


----------



## MichiH

Festin said:


> Seems as 6 year is a short deadline to complete such a big Project, but it sure would be nice if it would.


The contract says, that it is planned to be complete the tunnel until 2018 (Art.1,Abs.3). There is already a delay...



Festin said:


> Hopefully Germany can speed things up since they will no be funding the tunnel itself, if I am not misstaken.


Yes, Denmark is funding the tunnel, Germany only its hinterland infrastructure wherefore I have no idea how Germany should be ablt to speed up the project?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The toll for the Øresund Bridge was € 35 in 2010. It is € 49 today. That's a huge increase way above inflation.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20 Great Belt Bridge*

Driving across the Great Belt Bridge. It's great! :cheers:


----------



## Heico-M

OulaL said:


> As for The Great Belt - I don't know, is it possible that it is partly subsidized by the state?


As far as I remember: yes, it is.

A colleague told me that Nordjylland had made it a precondition to approve the financing of the Great Belt bridge, that the Hirtshals motorway be built.


----------



## Heico-M

ChrisZwolle said:


> Driving across the Great Belt Bridge. It's great! :cheers:


Always stunning!


----------



## OulaL

ChrisZwolle said:


> The toll for the Øresund Bridge was € 35 in 2010. It is € 49 today. That's a huge increase way above inflation.


Seems huge indeed. Has the price for the ferry ticket risen similarily?


----------



## Mirror's Edge

Yes after one of the companys operating the HH link went under prices are now much higher + fuel has gone up.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Imagine if they built a tunnel at Helsingør - Helsingborg. The route from Hamburg to Sweden would be 175 km shorter than today via the bridges.


----------



## mcarling

ChrisZwolle said:


> Imagine if they built a tunnel at Helsingør - Helsingborg. The route from Hamburg to Sweden would be 175 km shorter than today via the bridges.


Makes sense. Even Copenhagen - Stockholm would be shorter.


----------



## Ingenioren

Heico-M said:


> As far as I remember: yes, it is.
> 
> A colleague told me that Nordjylland had made it a precondition to approve the financing of the Great Belt bridge, that the Hirtshals motorway be built.


Rather the state is subsidized by these bridges tough. They take out a profit from the company each year.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Old Little Belt Bridge*

The Old Little Belt Bridge (1935) in Middelfart. This is a combined road/rail bridge and was the only connection from Jylland to Fyn until the larger bridge opened in 1970.


Old Little Belt Bridge pano by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> I drove the Øresund Bridge today again. The tolls are really too steep for tourists, it's just a scam. I know it's a bit cheaper if you get a BroBizz, but I don't want a subscription, or go through the hassle of returning it every year if I'm not sure I drive across the bridge next year...
> 
> The toll is € 49 one way. I wonder why the tolls are so much higher than at the Great Belt Bridge. Also, the Øresund Bridge tolls have increased quite a bit over the last 5 years.


The pricing regime for the two fixed link is different because the traffic structure on the two fixed link is very different. But the pricing system for each of the fixed link is decided by the best way of maximizing the income for the Brdge Company and primarily determined by two main conditions:

1. The total construction cost for each of the fixed links shall be recovered within a 30-40 year period
2. No subsidizing from government at all (on the contrary - as mentioned - the owner (the government) takes out a profit every year) and no cross subsidizing between the fixed links.

It has been discussed to stretch the pay-back time to more than 40 years, in order to reduce the price for crossing, but it turned out that this will only reduce the price marginally, as the main component of the price - with a 40 year pay-back period - is the interest payed. If the pay-back time is extended to more than 40 years, paying back the debt will be very sensitive to small increases in the interest rate, and the bridge company will thus risk the so-called "interest death".

The traffic across the Oresund is characterized by many commuters and few occcasional users - hence the income is maximized by a good discount for daily commuters and a relatively high price for the occasional user. The trafffic accross Storebælt on the other side is characterized by many occasional users, but relatively few daily commuters. Income is thus maximized by a relatively lower price for the occasional user and a relatively low discount for daily commuters.

It has also been discussed to lower the price, and thus generating more crossing traffic, and the outcome of this has been thoroughly analyzed. The problem is the nature of the traffic and how the users react to a changed price (priceelasticity), and it has turned out that the useres have a relatively low priceeleasticity - meaning that reducing the prices to lets say half price doesn't double the traffic, and that means that total income for the bridge company is reduced.

As a curiosum the price for the future Femern Tunnel will be even higher, as this fixed link faces the problem that the traffic here is charecterized by relatively little daily commuting a relayively few occasional users!

But again the price for crossing Storebælt or Øresund is not an issue in Denmark. The price is lower than the old ferry crossing and you save approximately 1 hour for every crossing.


----------



## OulaL

ChrisZwolle said:


> Imagine if they built a tunnel at Helsingør - Helsingborg. The route from Hamburg to Sweden would be 175 km shorter than today via the bridges.


This is a problematic thing, since the existing bridge hasn't been paid yet.

If the prices were the same, the amount of users on the existing brige would of course drop and thus make it even harder to pay. So should the toll on a new fixed link be actually more expensive, despite the fact that the strait is narrower?

Then again, we should remember that people like us are the minority. Despite the motorways stretching through all Europe in the south and (in the near future) through Oslo and Stockholm in the north, a vast majority of the users only travel between Zealand and Scania.


----------



## jajaK

ChrisZwolle said:


> Imagine if they built a tunnel at Helsingør - Helsingborg. The route from Hamburg to Sweden would be 175 km shorter than today via the bridges.


Hmm, I don't really get this. Is the Öresundbridge-detour 175 km? The Fehmarn-connection is going to cut non-ferry-transports a lot, but a HH-tunnel?


----------



## OulaL

jajaK said:


> Hmm, I don't really get this. Is the Öresundbridge-detour 175 km? The Fehmarn-connection is going to cut non-ferry-transports a lot, but a HH-tunnel?


175 km is roughly the difference between the existing ferry free route (with Great Belt and today's Øresund bridges) and what it would be, with both Fehmarn Belt and Helsingør-Helsingborg tunnels.


----------



## Ingenioren

jajaK said:


> Hmm, I don't really get this. Is the Öresundbridge-detour 175 km? The Fehmarn-connection is going to cut non-ferry-transports a lot, but a HH-tunnel?


Save 150km with Fehmarn tunnel + 25km with HH. (More or less.)


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The Femern Belt Tunnel will only be profitable for me if the tolls are below € 50. Otherwise it's cheaper to drive around Kolding and take the Great Belt Bridge (€ 12 in fuel + € 36 in tolls). 

But for most people time is money, so the Femern Belt Tunnel will pay off rather handsomely. But for leisure trips, time has less value. 

Another upside is that you can avoid the boring trip up A7 through Schleswig-Holstein. There's absolutely nothing to see, except for the bridge across the NOK.

The ferry price is 499 DKK at the cheapest (about € 67). http://www.scandlines.dk/billetter/billettyper-og-priser/rodby-puttgarden


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> The Femern Belt Tunnel will only be profitable for me if the tolls are below € 50. Otherwise it's cheaper to drive around Kolding and take the Great Belt Bridge (€ 12 in fuel + € 36 in tolls).
> 
> But for most people time is money, so the Femern Belt Tunnel will pay off rather handsomely. But for leisure trips, time has less value.
> 
> Another upside is that you can avoid the boring trip up A7 through Schleswig-Holstein. There's absolutely nothing to see, except for the bridge across the NOK.
> 
> The ferry price is 499 DKK at the cheapest (about € 67). http://www.scandlines.dk/billetter/billettyper-og-priser/rodby-puttgarden


A price of around 450-500 DKK (approx. current ferry price) is the expected price for a Femern Belt crossing. 

But even at this currrent ferry price very few choose the Jutland route. The motorway across Funen/Southern Jutland is only expected to be relieved bye 200-300 vehicles a day after completion of the Femern Tunnel. This is probably a good indication that users value the time savings relatively highly.


----------



## OulaL

ChrisZwolle said:


> The Femern Belt Tunnel will only be profitable for me if the tolls are below € 50. Otherwise it's cheaper to drive around Kolding and take the Great Belt Bridge (€ 12 in fuel + € 36 in tolls).
> 
> But for most people time is money, so the Femern Belt Tunnel will pay off rather handsomely. But for leisure trips, time has less value.
> http://www.scandlines.dk/billetter/billettyper-og-priser/rodby-puttgarden


Time may also be money for tourists, because there is a huge drop in accommodation prices between Denmark and Germany.

Starting from Stockholm early in the morning (as Finnish motor tourists, and of course the Swedish living in Stockholm area often do), it's an all day's journey through Sweden and Denmark. The question of whether Germany is reached 1,5-2 hours sooner or later may be relevant to the question about in which country the first night is spent. The difference in tolls is well compensated with a cheaper hotel.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ A good point. The tunnel will also bring Göteborg within 1,000 km of my city  Stockholm is still out of reach in one day of reasonable driving. I know some people drive 1,600 km in a day, but that's too much for me. 1,000 km is doable, 1,200 km too if it makes or brakes one day driving to home or destination.


----------



## Eulanthe

ChrisZwolle said:


> I drove the Øresund Bridge today again. The tolls are really too steep for tourists, it's just a scam. I know it's a bit cheaper if you get a BroBizz, but I don't want a subscription, or go through the hassle of returning it every year if I'm not sure I drive across the bridge next year...
> 
> The toll is € 49 one way. I wonder why the tolls are so much higher than at the Great Belt Bridge. Also, the Øresund Bridge tolls have increased quite a bit over the last 5 years.


They really are absurdly high, considering that it's possible at the minute to get a single trip (car + driver) from Poland to Sweden for the same price on a ferry. 

200 Euro return for Hamburg-Malmo is just ridiculous - and I would expect the ferry crossings to Trelleborg from Rostock/Sassnitz to remain busy.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

That is quite a significant traffic growth, especially if it continues for a couple of years.


----------



## Nikolaj

It seems to be a pattern that Motorway traffic again is growing significantly in Denmark, at least the last 4 quarters:


1st Quarter 2013: 0,1 pct.
2nd Quarter 2013: 2,3 pct.
3rd Quarter 2013: 3,2 pct, 
4th Quarter 2013: 4,4 pct.
1st Quarter 2014: 6,8 pct
2nd Quarter 2014: 5,0 pct

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...n_sig/Documents/Indikatorer for 1_kv_2013.pdf
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...n_sig/Documents/Indikatorer for 2_kv_2013.pdf
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...dan_udvikler_trafikken_sig/Sider/default.aspx


----------



## bongo-anders

Silkebaronen posted these aerials of Silkeborg motorvejen in the Danish subforum.


New aerials of Silkeborgmotorvejen october 2014. The part from Låsby to Hårup will open december 1. That's about one year ahead of schedule.

Connection to the existing highway at Låsby.









rest area at Låsby









Hårup









Nordskoven









Bridge across Gudenåen









Soon there will be 300 meters of "tunnel" here









Resenbro









Resenbro









Dyrehaven









Høje Kejlstrup









Bridge across Gubsø









And finally the connection to the existing higway in Funder









Some more photos here:
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...Visualisering/Sider/default.aspx#.VEoZGvmsWap


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The bypass of Nykøbing F will open on 15 November 2014.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20 Øresund Bridge*

A video of the Øresund Bridge. I filmed this in June.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> Some photos of the Kalundborg Motorway I took in June 2014. This motorway segment (7 km) opened to traffic on 27 August 2013.
> 
> 
> 1.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-1 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 2.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-2 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 3.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-3 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 4.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-4 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 5. This is the connector road within the Holbæk motorway interchange.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-5 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 6. This interchange was originally only accessible to and from Kalundborg, since 2013 also to and from Copenhagen.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-6 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 7. First a 90 km/h speed limit
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-7 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 8.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-8 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 9. Then 110 km/h, no shoulders.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-9 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 10.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-10 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 11.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-11 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 12.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-12 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
> 
> 13. End of the motorway, beginning of the express road which will soon narrow to one lane.
> 
> Kalundborgmotorvej-13 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


The draft act for the continuation of the Kalundborg Motorway has been published http://www.ft.dk/samling/20141/almdel/tru/bilag/34/1418382.pdf
According to this draft act, which will be presented to Parliament early in 2015, it is stipulated that the 6 km continuation will be constructed between 2016 and 2019. It will be 1,5 km upgrade of existing expressway, and 4,5 km new alignment. The presentation for Parliament is a formality, as political agreement has been reached, and funding has been allocated.


----------



## SeanT

A little trip from Vemmedrup to Hvidovre on Køge-bugt motorway...


----------



## bongo-anders

When we talk about Køge Bugt :lol:


Taastrupvej overpass













The new bridge for Solrød Byvej




Roskildevej, exit 31A






Engtrupstien bridge




Egedesvej, future exit 31B




Karlslunde Rasteplads (service station)




Mosede Landevej exit 29


----------



## bongo-anders

The next part of the Silkeborg Motorway (route 15) in western Denmark opens today, its the 11 kilometers between Hårup and Låsby.


Now there is only the 18 kilometer stretch through Silkeborg left and that part opens in 2016.


http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...y/OmProjektet/Sider/default.aspx#.VHxZNDGG_kM


----------



## MichiH

bongo-anders said:


> The next part of the Silkeborg Motorway (route 15) in western Denmark opens today, its the 11 kilometers between Hårup and Låsby.





> There is traffic on the motorway between Hårup and Lasby
> At around 14:05 today, 1 December, the last barriers have been removed, and the first cars could drive onto the new motorway between Hårup and Lasby.


source: http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...afik-på-motorvejen-mellem-Hårup-og-Låsby.aspx.


----------



## Protteus

*I got two questions; just makes me feel curious the circles with stagnant rain water in the last pics, are they made by purpose to avoid any problems of water leaking in the slopes of the ramps?

* What are the benefits of putting roundabouts in the exits of highways,
pretty common in Europe, instead of regular intersections. Is it a security measure so all the cars coming out from the highways don't go all the way straight and hit another car?


----------



## korbendallas

Protteus said:


> * What are the benefits of putting roundabouts in the exits of highways,
> pretty common in Europe, instead of regular intersections. Is it a security measure so all the cars coming out from the highways don't go all the way straight and hit another car?


There are many reasons: flow, safety, maintenance cost. But it's important to remember that they also choose intersections with and without traffic lights, so there are several factors to consider.


----------



## Autoputevi kao hobi

There are no roundabouts in the exits of highways in Serbia.


----------



## Nikolaj

Protteus said:


> *I got two questions; just makes me feel curious the circles with stagnant rain water in the last pics, are they made by purpose to avoid any problems of water leaking in the slopes of the ramps?


Yes they are made on purpose. It is part of the higway run-off treatment system. What you see is a (tight) rainwater detention basin, where rainwater is kept until it gradually is led to the usual wastewater treatment ssystem to a wastewater plant. The highway rainwater run-off is kept in a separate system in order to avoid it leaking into the groundwater, which is used for drinkingwater etc. The cost of the highway run-off system is usually a quite significant cost item in highway/motorway cnostruction in Denmark.


----------



## bigic

Autoputevi kao hobi said:


> There are no roundabouts in the exits of highways in Serbia.


I have seen a few in Belgrade (Novi Beograd).


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E47 Femern Bælt Tunnel*

The construction method of the immersed tunnel. There is experience with this type of tunnel, especially in Denmark. The major difference is that other immersed tunnels are generally not longer than 1 or 2 kilometers, this one will be 18 kilometers long.


----------



## bongo-anders

Various works on the Køge Bugt motorway, pictures taken by me.

We start up at Egedesvej at the new exit 31B


----------



## Autoputevi kao hobi

I think that building a bridge is going to be less expensive then building a tunnel.


----------



## bongo-anders

Solrød Byvej is located between exit 31 (future 31A) and 30












The new ramp leading up to the new Solrød Byvej on the western side will have a tunnel for the new high speed line out of Copenhagen.


----------



## bongo-anders

Autoputevi kao hobi said:


> I think that building a bridge is going to be less expensive then building a tunnel.



It is but the problem is that it will be in crosswinds for most of the year so it can be closed for to many days, and lower construction risk was also a reason.


The bridge costed 5 billion euro and the tunnel costs 5,5 billion euro, both numbers includes upgrades to Danish railways and motorways for 1,5 billion euros.


EU will support the project with between 600 million or 1,2 billion euros in the TEN-T programme.


----------



## Nikolaj

Nikolaj said:


> It seems to be a pattern that Motorway traffic again is growing significantly in Denmark, at least the last 4 quarters:
> 
> 
> 1st Quarter 2013: 0,1 pct.
> 2nd Quarter 2013: 2,3 pct.
> 3rd Quarter 2013: 3,2 pct,
> 4th Quarter 2013: 4,4 pct.
> 1st Quarter 2014: 6,8 pct
> 2nd Quarter 2014: 5,0 pct
> 
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...n_sig/Documents/Indikatorer for 1_kv_2013.pdf
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...n_sig/Documents/Indikatorer for 2_kv_2013.pdf
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...dan_udvikler_trafikken_sig/Sider/default.aspx


Motorway traffic in Denmark continues to grow significantly (compared to same period previous year):
3rd Quarter of 2014: 4,4 Pct.
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...rafikken_sig/Documents/Indikatorer_3_2014.pdf


----------



## bongo-anders

The first part of the expansion of the Køge Bugt motorway opens tomorrow.

Its the northernmost 4 kilometers from Karlslunde service station to exit 29 where they with put the 4th lane in use in the northern direction.

The 4th lane in the southern direction on the same stretch will open in the beginning of the new year.

The rest of the expansion from 3 to 4 lanes in each direction to exit 31A (now just 31) will open by the end of 2015 and the last part from 31A to motorvejskryds Køge Vest will open in 2018.


----------



## SeanT

Here is a little trip from Fløng near Roskilde to Glostrup exit.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The toll rates for the Femern Belt Tunnel will be announced just before opening. However, a financial analysis shows they anticipate a toll of *€ 65* for passenger cars and *€ 276* for trucks (2014 prices). 

At current fuel prices, driving 130 kilometers more / 70 minutes longer via E20/45 and pay the Great Belt Bridge tolls will save me € 20 compared to the Femern Belt Tunnel. 

It appears that time saving will be the biggest attraction of the tunnel, not cost saving. The tunnel is more advantageous compared to the current ferry link, because it will cost the same but requires considerable less time and planning ahead. The prices are also fixed.

Via Great Belt Bridge: 480 km (€ 38 fuel, € 33 tolls) - € 71 
Via Femern Belt Tunnel: 345 km (€ 27 fuel, € 65 tolls) - € 92

This assumes 19 km/l fuel consumption and a fuel price of € 1.50 per liter at 2014 prices.


----------



## Ingenioren

It costed me 70 € this summer for the ferry and i had to wait over one hour at Rødby. Besides fuel is not the only per kilometer cost of driving.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

People usually only consider the out of pocket costs such as fuel and tolls when comparing alternatives. Time is interesting for business users mostly. Maintenance cost is usually not considered.


----------



## korbendallas

bongo-anders said:


> The first part of the expansion of the Køge Bugt motorway opens tomorrow.
> 
> Its the northernmost 4 kilometers from Karlslunde service station to exit 29 where they with put the 4th lane in use in the northern direction.
> 
> The 4th lane in the southern direction on the same stretch will open in the beginning of the new year.
> 
> The rest of the expansion from 3 to 4 lanes in each direction to exit 31A (now just 31) will open by the end of 2015 and the last part from 31A to motorvejskryds Køge Vest will open in 2018.


Well, color me surprised when the southbound direction was open this morning. Those damn dirty liars


----------



## SeanT

I´m going to the airport today, I make some pictures...


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*PR-53, Frederikssund*

The government has approved a law which makes the construction of a new four-lane expressway possible on the southern side of Frederikssund, including a high bridge.


----------



## SeanT

I have a video from Karlslunde to Kastrup, it will be ready soon when I have more time.


----------



## SeanT

Karlslunde - Gl.Køge Landevej





 
Avedøre - Kastrup


----------



## ChrisZwolle

http://jyllands-posten.dk/indland/t...iet-tester-ny-fartkontrol-i-Øresundstunnelen/

Average speed check coming to the Øresund Tunnel (Drogden Tunnel).


----------



## Søren L

*Infrastructure projects in Denmark*

If you want to check the infrastructure projects in Denmark you can go to vejdirektoratet.dk and then press the "projekter" button


----------



## bongo-anders

Egedesvej in Køge Nord will become the future Exit 31B, it should be ready in May so its about time that one can see some progress.


----------



## bongo-anders

The first stage of the widening of the Køge Bugt motorway south of Copenhagen is almost done.


The 4th northbound lane from Solrød Byvej and upwards will open tomorrow and the 4th southbound lane will open from the Karlslunde service station and down to Solrød Byvej in 2 weeks time.

During the summer months there will however only be 3 lanes in each direction as they can´t lay the new asphalt now because of the temperature.

The last part of stage 1 down to the Solrød Syd exit 31 (future 31A) will open sometimes in the fall.


Stage 2 from exit 31A to Køge Vest intersection opens in 2018, but exit 31B at Egedesvej is scheduled to open on May 1st this year.


http://koege.lokalavisen.dk/plads-o...-koebenhavn-/20150209/artikler/702099901/1418


----------



## bongo-anders

New aerials from the combined motorway widening/high speed rail construction along the Køge Bugt Motorway.


Karlslunde Service station




Egedesvej exit 31B




Karslunde Mosevej




Cementvej and to the left Tåstrupvej




A little bit further south Tåstrupvej passes under the motorway


----------



## bongo-anders

One of the biggest construction sites is along exit 32 where a new bridge will be build and the exit ramps has to be rearranged to fit in the high speed line that as this point will be 12 meters up in the air.






Mosede Landevej





Looking south towards Køge





Roskildevej




From Roskilde looking north




The now finished Solrød Byvej.





From exit 32 looking north.


----------



## Ni3lS

Came across this picture. 


Oresundsbron Curving Sunset by Mabry Campbell, on Flickr


----------



## -Valentino-

I love the text font Denmark uses on their signs!


----------



## Mirror's Edge

Ni3lS said:


> Came across this picture.
> 
> 
> Oresundsbron Curving Sunset by Mabry Campbell, on Flickr


All but the background is Sweden


----------



## bongo-anders

The border is located on the middle of the bridge, so only the first half of the bridge is Swedish. :lol:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The main span is fully in Sweden.


E20 Oresund Bridge-2 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


----------



## bongo-anders

Okay almost in the middle, but my point is still valid :lol:


----------



## bongo-anders

Just like the last time they opened an extra lane on the Køge Bugt motorway in the northern direction they opened the southern lane without telling us. :lol: 



So now there is 4 lanes in each direction from Solrød Byvej an upwards, they only need to replace the asphalt on the old lanes but that happens in May.


I´m thinking that the last lanes down to Roskildevej opens when that bridge is replaced in 2016, and I suspect that the 4 lanes down to Egedesvej is ready at that point as well.

And then the final part to Køge Vest in 2018.


----------



## NordikNerd

Danish minister of transport threatens to stop the Fehmarn-project if contractors dont lower their price offer. It's getting too expensive to build the underwater tunnel. 

http://ing.dk/artikel/transportminister-truer-med-droppe-femerntunnel-174242


----------



## MichiH

^^ Costs increased to 6.6 billion € and German planning procedures are too slow. Source.


----------



## MichiH

*New motorways u/c*

The subsequent list contains all new motorway sections which are currently u/c in Denmark:

*PR17:* Smorum – Ballerup 3.8km (Fall 2012 to 2015) – project – map
*PR15:* Funder – Harup 17.5km (2010 to 2016) – project – map

If I got it right, the exact estimated opening dates should be:
- PR17: September 2015 (source; see dates on the map)
- PR15: Fall 2016 (source: "Vi forventer, at strækningen mellem Funder og Hårup åbner i efteråret 2016.")

Can anyone confirm?

Are there more motorways or expressways currently u/c (without widening projects)?
Are there any motorways or expressways announced to begin in 2015?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/holstebro-herning/Tidsplan/Sider/default.aspx

PR18 Herning - Holstebro will begin construction this year.


----------



## Nikolaj

According to this press release from 30 January 2015 http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...ider/Motorvejsbyggeriet-går-snart-i-gang.aspx the actual construction on the southern section should start in February and on the northern section in May. It is also said that The Road Directorate is planning an event to mark start of construction. This event is yet to be announced. The southern section is planned to be complete in spring 2017, and the remaining section in late 2018.

Regarding Route 15 from Funder to Haarup (2 a's in Haarup) I don't think that we can expect anything more exact than "fall 2016" until next year. On Route 17 the updated timeschedule http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve.../M1220 Oversigtskort dec 2014 rev. 7 copy.jpg says September 2015.


Except for the above mentioned there is no other projects where actual construction on the ground has started. The question is a bit tricky, as The Road Directorate/Vejdirektoratet categorizes a project as "under construction" as soon as final approval from Parliament has been granted. This means that a project like the 10 km 2+2 expressway across Roskilde fjord, where final approval was granted by Parliament in December 2014 http://www.ft.dk/RIpdf/samling/20141/lovforslag/L21/20141_L21_som_vedtaget.pdf , is now listed on the Vejdirektoratet website as "under construction" no matter that actual works on the ground won't start until 2016. Likewise will Parliament before June this year formally grant approval for an 6 km extension of the Kalundborg Motorway (Route 23). The bill is right now in process in Parliament http://www.ft.dk/RIpdf/samling/20141/lovforslag/L133/20141_L133_som_fremsat.pdf, and all parties in Parliament, except for a small left-wing party, has already announced their support to the project. When approved in May-June this project will also be listed by Vejdirektoratet as "under construction" although actual construction won't start until 2016.

In Vejdirektorat jargon "under construction", means that they have the formal appropriation to spend money on detailed design, land expropriation, tender process and actual works.


----------



## bongo-anders

NordikNerd said:


> Danish minister of transport threatens to stop the Fehmarn-project if contractors dont lower their price offer. It's getting too expensive to build the underwater tunnel.
> 
> http://ing.dk/artikel/transportminister-truer-med-droppe-femerntunnel-174242


He´s just talking to his voters.

The general opinion is that the project is so advanced that it can´t be stopped.

It can however be delayed a little bit (I have hear 6-12 months) so its cheaper to build and then the opening will be more in line with the german investments.


----------



## bongo-anders

They work fast at the Køge Bugt Motorway.

Another section with 4 lanes opens on Monday, this time in both direction 

Its the part from Solrød Byvej and south to Åsvej just before the exit ramps at Roskildevej.

When looking at google maps it looks like the exit ramps will turn into the 4th lane.

https://www.google.dk/maps/place/Ås...2!3m1!1s0x4652f6c62101a17d:0xcbf6a4ee56c462f9


http://koege.lokalavisen.dk/koege-b...afikanterne-/20150226/artikler/702269789/1418


----------



## bongo-anders

The future exit 31B at Egedesvej is progressing fast.

All signs still says that the opening date is 1st of May, but on Køge municipality´s website its 1st of June. 
Lets see what happens.

I took on a little bicycle trip around the northern part of Køge and took some pictures and here are my photos from Egedesvej.


----------



## bongo-anders

Here seen from the Ølsemaglevej bridge, Køge Nord Station is on the left.








2 bonus pictures of the Tesla charging station


----------



## ADP

*New motorway towards Næstved*

The new motorway Rute 54 (Næstvedmotorvejen) between Rønnede and Boserup, expected adopted in 2017, the motorway expected to be finished in 2021.

http://sn.dk/Naestved/Heunicke-klar-til-at-bygge-motorvej-om-to-aar/artikel/456557


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The first sod will be turned on the Herning - Holstebro motorway on 19 March:

_19. marts 2015. spadestik – Holstebromotorvejen_

http://www.trm.dk/da/ministeren/kalender/2015/marts


----------



## Søren L

What I love doing is watching the webcams from vejdirektoratet.dk there you can watch the danish roads when you want. If you want to do so, then go on vejdirektoratet.dk and then scroll the little minibar in the middle to the side and then press "webkameraer" 

Have fun and have a nice day from me


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The Svendborg Bridge (primary route 9). It opened in 1966.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Take it easy on E20/47/55 Køge Bugt Motorway

_New speed camera police vehicles (ATC) positioned on the Køge Bugt motorway yesterday brought in just under 2 million kroner in fines in just five hours._

http://cphpost.dk/news/new-speed-cameras-paying-off-big-time.12933.html

Steep fines by the way. 2.000 kroner is almost € 270.

_ Each motorist photographed will be hit with a minimum fine of 2,000 kroner. The normal penalty would have been 1,000 kroner, but fines are doubled in construction areas. _


----------



## SeanT

It is very needed. There were 3 accidents there yesterday. One was killed.


----------



## bongo-anders

Wasn´t it 4 accidents?


----------



## SeanT

Might be so.


----------



## bongo-anders

Well either way its way to many.


----------



## Nikolaj

Nikolaj said:


> Motorway traffic in Denmark continues to grow significantly (compared to same period previous year):
> 3rd Quarter of 2014: 4,4 Pct.
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...rafikken_sig/Documents/Indikatorer_3_2014.pdf


And the pace continues. Vejdirektoratets has just released 4th Quarter 2014 figures http://vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/viden_...rafikken_sig/Documents/Indikatorer_4_2014.pdf

Motorway traffic in Denmark has grown 3,8 Pct. in 4th Quarter of 2014, and the total for 2014 is 5,0 Pct. Motorway traffic is now 14,3 Pct higher than in 2008 (start of the Financial Crisis).

Traffic on the 2 major fixed links is also growing. On the Great Belt Fixed Link, traffic grew with 4,4 Pct. in 2014, and traffic is now 3 Pct. higher than the previous peak in 2008. On the Øresund Fixed Link traffic grew with 3,5 Pct. in 2014, but is still 2,6 Pct. below the 2009 peak.


----------



## Nikolaj

*Speed Limits on ordinary roads to be raised*

It seems like speed limits on non-motorways outside of towns will be raised from 80 to 90 km. http://www.dr.dk/Nyheder/Politik/2015/03/11/185100.htm

According to press a majority in Parliament supports a proposal from the junior partner in Government to raise the general speed limit on ordinary roads from 80 to 90 kph. Trials have been carried out over the past 4 years on around 100 km of non-expressways, and the conclusion has been that fewer were speeding above 100 kph on these roads than on other roads, and that the traffic flow has been more steady on these roads.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ Nice. I read a report earlier that a 90 km/h speed limit caused less people to overtake other vehicles and actually resulted in less excessive speeding.


----------



## kalaha

Took a detour home from work today to have a look at the Frederikssund Motorway (route 17), opening later this year. The pictures are from the Hold-An Vej overpass.

Notice, on the first two pictures you can easily see the contract boundary between the interchange contract and the large design-and-build motorway contract.





































The overpass is partly a regular road overpass and partly a fauna passage for horses, which is why it has a rather strange almost 2 m high bridge guardrail in one side next to a gravel path, which is seperated from the road with a wooden kerb. I have never seen this solution before!










I also drove past the Ledøjetoften overpass, but I couldn't park my car anywhere near the bridge, so no pictures from there, but I can tell, that they are not even closely to do asphalt works at that location - they haven't even finished the earthworks. The new junctions on the overpass for the exit and entry ramps are however all done, a roundabout at the future exit ramp and a regular T junction at the entry ramp - the latter is currently used as entrance to the construction site.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*PR-18 Holstebro Motorway*

The first sod was turned on the Holstebro Motorway project. It is a 39 kilometer new motorway that will run along the western side of Herning, along current primary route 18 to Holstebro, and turning around Holstebro. 

The first 10 kilometer segment around Herning is planned to open early 2017. The rest to Holstebro will open in 2018. Many motorway projects in Denmark are finished ahead of schedule, so it seem plausible it could open earlier than planned if there are no unforeseen problems.

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/om...-gang-i-byggeriet-af-Holstebromotorvejen.aspx


----------



## ChrisZwolle

A map of the Holstebro Motorway with the construction schedule and speed limit.


----------



## bongo-anders

Its a shame that they don't make the part of route 18 northeast of Herning to motorway standard.


----------



## Autobahnftw

Nikolaj said:


> It seems like speed limits on non-motorways outside of towns will be raised from 80 to 90 km. http://www.dr.dk/Nyheder/Politik/2015/03/11/185100.htm
> 
> According to press a majority in Parliament supports a proposal from the junior partner in Government to raise the general speed limit on ordinary roads from 80 to 90 kph. Trials have been carried out over the past 4 years on around 100 km of non-expressways, and the conclusion has been that fewer were speeding above 100 kph on these roads than on other roads, and that the traffic flow has been more steady on these roads.


If Swedish politicians some day would think like you in Denmark about roads....


----------



## Nikolaj

bongo-anders said:


> Its a shame that they don't make the part of route 18 northeast of Herning to motorway standard.


It will eventually. Traffic is allready around 11.000 - 12.000 on this short stretch of 1+1 expressway (6-7 km), and is expected to increase by another 5-6.000 when the motorway has been completed to the north. Local politicians hopes that upgrading of this short stretch can be financed within the 30 % budget reserve of the Herning-Holstebro project.


----------



## bongo-anders

I though there was more traffic that 12.000.

Here in Køge we have our own bypass trouble, everyday there is 18.000 cars coming down south from the stevns peninsula.

In Køge they only have 2 roads o choose from in order to hit the motorway.

They can continue along Strandvejen/Toldbodvej/Østre Banevej and Væftvej, its the most direct way but especially Strandvejen is only suited for local traffic.

The other route is Søndre Viaduktvej/Ringvejen/Københavnsvej, this route is more suited for the heavy traffic and has 2 lanes in each direction for most of the route.
But here the traffic is around 25.000 cars per day.

And with huge project like Køge Kyst, the expansion of the port, Køge Park and the University Hospital then Køge is pushing the limits on how much traffic it can handle.

Stevns Municipality has suggested to build a bypass from around Strøby Egede and ti either north or south of Herfølge and out to Sydmotorvejen with an exit between 33 and 34.

Køge Municipality doesn't want a route so close to Herfølge and has instead suggested a route that goes all the way from Hårlev and over to Slimmingevej and exit 34 on the Sydmotorvejen.
This route only moves around 4-5.000 cars away from the streets of Køge but a route much closer to Køge will move away 10-12.000 cars and will be cheaper to build as the route to Sydmotorvejen willl be shorter.


----------



## Nikolaj

Yes - but is hard to compare a long distance national route outside a town, with a local access road within an urban area. The access road from Stevns is a local municipal road. A new local access road to the national network is a matter for the local authorities to finance/build, like many other local access roads around the country, with just as high AADT, as the one in Køge. 

For another matter, the Minister of Transport has announced that he will seek political approval to start up the EIA procedure for an extension of the Hillerød Motorway, north of Copenhagen. http://sn.dk/Nordsjaelland/S-vil-forberede-ny-motorvej/artikel/477042
Right now the motorway (Route 16) stops at Allerød and continues as a 2+1 expressway, with som provisions for future widening to full motorway. The current AADT on the 2+1 section is between 23000 and 30000


----------



## bongo-anders

Perhaps you are right but it hasn't stopped both Stevns and Køge from asking their local Folketings politicians for help with financing of this road.

And the local politicians in Køge are very certain that the Stevns traffic isn't for them to fix.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I stayed on that campsite near Søndre Viaduktvej a few years ago. Københavnsvej has separate left turns, which is uncommon in the Netherlands. The road felt a bit like an American urban arterial as a four-lane divided highway.


----------



## Nikolaj

bongo-anders said:


> Perhaps you are right but it hasn't stopped both Stevns and Køge from asking their local Folketings politicians for help with financing of this road.
> 
> And the local politicians in Køge are very certain that the Stevns traffic isn't for them to fix.


Of course they have to try, but they don't stand a chance. Other municipalities/local authorities in the completely same situation are right now investing local money in a number of similar projects, with new local roads connecting areas to the national motorway network, and thus relieving existing urban roads. Køge/Stevns is no different. 

Odense: Local authorities funded the Ring 3 connection connecting North-eastern Funen (including Kerteminde) with motorway E20, and relieving local roads through Odense with an AADT of 17.000-25.000. Cost: DKK 120 mio. in 2005

Horsens: The municipalities of Horsens and Hedensted has agreed to fund and construct a new access road between the Juelsminde-Peninsula and motorway E45 in Horsens over the next 3 years, relieving urban roads in Horsens with an AADT of 10.000-22.000. Cost for local authorities of DKK 150 mio.

Aarhus: The city of Aarhus have approved a new access road connecting the Odder-area south-east of the city to motorway E45, and relieving urban roads in the southern part of Aarhus with an AADT 15.000-30.000. The new acess road has a price tag of DKK 150-200 mio.

Aalborg: Has started construction of a new access road connecting the Eastern Himmerland area with motorway E45, south of Aalborg, and thus relieving local urban roads in the south-eastern part of Aalborg, with an AADT of up to 20000. City of Aalborg is investing DKK 257 mio. in this project 

Not to mention Nordhavnsforbindelsen in Copenhagen, where the City of Copenhagen is investing DKK 2 bn, in what is basically a new access road to a development area (Nordhavn) and at the same time relieving existing local roads.


----------



## Søren L

New pictures of motorway 15 in Silkeborg has been released on Vejdirektoratet.dk vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/Funder-Laasby/Visualisering/Sider/default.aspx#.VRRnqFxFAie[/url]

(I have only written 3 posts, so I couldn't make a link. Sorry)


----------



## SRC_100

^^
You`re welcome vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/Funder-Laasby/Visualisering/Sider/default.aspx#.VRRnqFxFAie


----------



## bongo-anders

ChrisZwolle said:


> I stayed on that campsite near Søndre Viaduktvej a few years ago. Københavnsvej has separate left turns, which is uncommon in the Netherlands. The road felt a bit like an American urban arterial as a four-lane divided highway.


Hehe Ringvejen and Københavnsvej is also a result of the booming 50'ies/60'ies so no wonder why they have that murica feeling.

The northern part of Københavnsvej has ben given a little facelift since your visit, the light poles has been replaced and I think the new light bulb is some kind of LED lights and the overhead cables/wires has been placed underground now.

Also the intersections has been rebuild in order to ease the traffic to and from the motorway via Lyngvej.


----------



## bongo-anders

Little bit of highway construction around Køge.


New exit 31B at Egedesvej.


First seen from the relocated Egedesvej west of the motorvej.















From the motorway, coming from the north


----------



## bongo-anders

The motorway construction has started on stage 2 around Køge widening the motorway from 6 to 8 lanes.


----------



## bongo-anders

And the finished section from north of exit 31 (future 31A) to the service station at Karlslunde.


First the 3 lane section.








4 lanes and new Solrød Byvej bridge


----------



## SeanT

Yes, I had noticed that around 11 pm the Køge interchange went from 4 to 1 lane on one side but later became 2.


----------



## bongo-anders

It will be 1 lane from Vestmotorvejen and 2 lanes from Sydmotorvejen.


Already in the reduced holiday traffic it has coursed traffic jams so i expect chaos tomorrow :bash:


----------



## bongo-anders

Today i took pictures from "my" side of the Egedesvej bridge.


Finished in 2 months!!!!, lets see.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Denmark gets a diverging diamond interchange (DDI)! It will be located at exit 52 Odense SV along E20.

DDIs are growing in popularity in the United States, but it's extremely uncommon in Europe, as far as I know there are only two or three such interchanges in Europe (all in the Paris area).


----------



## bongo-anders

The motorway construction at the Køge bugt motorway has finally reached Køge, so its finally interesting to see 2nd division football at Rishøj Stadion. :lol:


----------



## bongo-anders

On the western side of the motorway they have started to build the bridge that will carry the new high speed line over the relocated exit ramps. (from Copenhagen and towards Odense/Rødby)


----------



## bongo-anders

The new exit ramps at 32 Køge N can be seen here on page 106.



http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/m10/OmProjektet/Documents/VVM Rapport_355.pdf


----------



## Schnoor17

ChrisZwolle said:


> Denmark gets a diverging diamond interchange (DDI)! It will be located at exit 52 Odense SV along E20.
> 
> DDIs are growing in popularity in the United States, but it's extremely uncommon in Europe, as far as I know there are only two or three such interchanges in Europe (all in the Paris area).


Additional info can be found here (danish):
http://ing.dk/artikel/nu-skal-du-til-koere-i-venstre-side-af-vejen-175324


----------



## Sunfuns

ChrisZwolle said:


> Denmark gets a diverging diamond interchange (DDI)! It will be located at exit 52 Odense SV along E20.
> 
> DDIs are growing in popularity in the United States, but it's extremely uncommon in Europe, as far as I know there are only two or three such interchanges in Europe (all in the Paris area).


I don't think I've ever seen one of those in real life. I'd probably be confused if I suddenly needed to drive over one :lol:


----------



## Mirror's Edge

DK is so far ahead of most of Scandinavia it's ridiculous, Scania is blessed to have such cool neighbors!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I had some footage of Denmark left from last year. This is the Old Little Belt Bridge near Middelfart. The pavement on the bridge is quite deteriorated.


----------



## NordikNerd

ChrisZwolle said:


> I had some footage of Denmark left from last year. This is the Old Little Belt Bridge near Middelfart. The pavement on the bridge is quite deteriorated.


Interesting, when I crossed this bridge in june 2013 it was raining.
It is quite narrow between the lanes especially if you meet a truck.




*My Little Belt bridge video*


----------



## PovilD

ChrisZwolle said:


> Denmark gets a diverging diamond interchange (DDI)! It will be located at exit 52 Odense SV along E20.
> 
> DDIs are growing in popularity in the United States, but it's extremely uncommon in Europe, as far as I know there are only two or three such interchanges in Europe (all in the Paris area).


Another one will be near Kaunas, Lithuania.










The interchange is between E85 and E262. It is quite a significant interchange in Lithuania.


----------



## RV

What is the ADT of E20/E47 near Copenhagen?


----------



## korbendallas

RV said:


> What is the ADT of E20/E47 near Copenhagen?


2013 numbers are between 111000 and 66700, depending on where you look.

Numbers are available here: http://vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/viden_og_data/statistik/trafikken%20i%20tal/hvor_meget_trafik_er_der_paa_vejen/Trafikstr%C3%B8mskort/Sider/default.aspx


----------



## Nikolaj

Her you can see the actual counted numbers for 2014 and even preliminary numbers for 2015 (got to be actual numbers so far seasonally 
adjusted). http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...n/Trafik på målestationer/Sider/default.aspx#

Click on the map, zoom in and out , and click on "Vis trafiktal 2015" for 2015 numbers. Remember to click "Vis tallene/Opdater tal" to update when moving cursor


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The next phase of the Nordhavnsvej in Copenhagen will be a tunnel to Nordhavn.


----------



## RipleyLV

ChrisZwolle said:


> DDIs are growing in popularity in the United States, but it's extremely uncommon in Europe, as far as I know there are only two or three such interchanges in Europe (all in the Paris area).


DDI in Ljubljana, before it was cool.


----------



## bongo-anders

The first stage of Køge Bugt Motorvejen looks almost finished, there are 2 weeks to go.

Seen here from Solrød Byvej


----------



## Søren L

Vejdirektoratet has put up some cameras near Roskilde (route 21, M11), I just discovered today.
Vejdirektoratet.dk > webkameraer


----------



## bongo-anders

From the horse´s mouth, 31B Køge Nord aka Egedesvej will open by the end of this month.

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...bner-i-slutningen-af-august.aspx#.Vci45yaqqko


----------



## MattiG

bongo-anders said:


> The first stage of Køge Bugt Motorvejen looks almost finished, there are 2 weeks to go.[/URL]


I was there a few weeks ago. The roadworks caused long queues on the lanes bound for Copenhagen, stretching several kilometers to west of the Køge Vest interchange E20xE47/E55. 










In order to avoid getting stuck there, I made the return trip to home over Holbækmotorveijen to Roskilde and then over the H-H ferry instead of taking the Öresund bridge.


----------



## bongo-anders

Most of the traffic jams comes from Vestmotorvejen (E20) as the the 2 eastbound lanes becomes 1 just before the intersection.


Jobs that has to be done on this section are from west/south to north.


Ølbyvej bridge has to be raised because of the nearby railway construction.

Bellingestien tunnel has to be widened.

Exit 32 will get new ramps on the western side of the motorway and a new bridge will be constructed just north of the current bridge.

The tunnel that leads the Lille Syd railway line under the motorway has to be widened.

A new railway tunnel for connection between the new high speed line and the Lille Syd line.

A new bridge on Ølsemaglevej, when done it will only be for pedestrians and cyclists.

New Egedesvej bridge is done, ramps for the new exit 31B will open later this month.

New wider bridge over the Lille Skensved Å (small creek) 

New exit ramps and new bridge on exit 31A at Roskildevej.

All this happens over a distance of 6 kilometers.

Stage 1 consists of 8 kilometers from exit 31A at Solrød Syd to 29 at Greve Syd and here only the asphalt is missing but that should be done next weekend according to schedule.


----------



## bongo-anders

The latest aerials from Silkeborgmotorvejen.

I will try to arrange them in a east to west direction but the pictures have been mixed up after I uploaded them. hno:hno:



Service station west of Låsby.




Near Hårup




Fauna passage at Nordskoven







A socalled landscape bridge at Nordskoven





Resenbrokrydset.







Gudenå river bridge, just north of Resenbro


----------



## bongo-anders

We are now in Silkeborg


Cut and cover tunnel at Gødvadbakke








Fauna and pedestrian bridge at Dyrehaven (The Deergarden)







Kejlstrupvej road and exit ramps at Høje Kejlstrupvej.


----------



## bongo-anders

The Østre Ringvej road´s new crossing of the motorway.






Back at Gødvad Bakke that as you can see on the previous pictures is located close to Østre Ringvej.













More Pictures from the exit at Høje Krejlstrupvej.




:cheers:


----------



## bongo-anders

The bridges at Skægkær Bæk creek and Gubsø lake












Exit ramps at Viborgvej.


----------



## bongo-anders

Another landscape bridge, this time at Hvinningdal.






The crossing of Nørhedevej.






Now we are near the end, Funder Kirkevej is in focus here.


----------



## milipumba

On Monday we will see the opening of the fourth lane, on the Køge Bugt motorway(E20, E47, E55), between Solrød S and Greve S.
And thus we only need the last piece between Solrød S and Køge West.

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vej...x#.Vc3yQfntlBc


----------



## ChrisZwolle

German media reports that the opening of the Fehmarnbelt Tunnel has been delayed from 2021 to 2024 due to the extremely slow procedures of the plan approval process on the German side.

In addition, the Fehmarnsund Bridge (connecting the island of Fehmarn with the German mainland) is in very poor condition. It was originally not planned to replace or expand the bridge, but a bridge inspection and static calculations in 2014 found out the bridge was in much poorer condition than thought and could not support the increase of freight trains.

At the same time, the bridge is in such poor condition that the speed limit for trucks has been reduced to only 50 km/h since yesterday. The speed limit for cars has been reduced to 60 km/h since March (it originally only applied during strong winds). 

The bridge may have been closed to truck traffic over 7.5 tons like elsewhere in Germany, except that in this case that would mean trucks could not reach the ferry at Puttgarden anymore, cutting off this vital link between Denmark and Germany. There are significant economic stakes at risk with the rapidly deteriorating infrastructure in Germany. Many bridges have now come into a phase of complete write-off instead of repairs.


----------



## Festin

ChrisZwolle said:


> German media reports that the opening of the Fehmarnbelt Tunnel has been delayed from 2021 to 2024 due to the extremely slow procedures of the plan approval process on the German side.
> 
> In addition, the Fehmarnsund Bridge (connecting the island of Fehmarn with the German mainland) is in very poor condition. It was originally not planned to replace or expand the bridge, but a bridge inspection and static calculations in 2014 found out the bridge was in much poorer condition than thought and could not support the increase of freight trains.
> 
> At the same time, the bridge is in such poor condition that the speed limit for trucks has been reduced to only 50 km/h since yesterday. The speed limit for cars has been reduced to 60 km/h since March (it originally only applied during strong winds).
> 
> The bridge may have been closed to truck traffic over 7.5 tons like elsewhere in Germany, except that in this case that would mean trucks could not reach the ferry at Puttgarden anymore, cutting off this vital link between Denmark and Germany. There are significant economic stakes at risk with the rapidly deteriorating infrastructure in Germany. Many bridges have now come into a phase of complete write-off instead of repairs.


That is just sad since Denmark is going to pay for it (and get the income from it) so Germany should not try to slow it down. But Germany will also benefit from it since more will be likely to travel down on weekends compared to now when you have to wait over an hour for the ferry transport, including time spent paying/showing ticket and waiting for the ferry.


----------



## MichiH

Festin said:


> But Germany will also benefit from it since *more will be likely to travel* down on weekends compared to now


That's bad! Residents and generally opponents don't want to have more traffic. That's why they are fighting against the project.


----------



## Festin

MichiH said:


> That's bad! Residents and generally opponents don't want to have more traffic. That's why they are fighting against the project.


Well sure, the world need less traffic and especially germany. But perhaps the effect would not be bigger compared to now, if the motorway from hamburg was to be extended to the tunnel so they dont drive on the local roads.

But there would also be the option to take the train, once the tunnel is done you could easly take the train and the heavy transport could also be taken care on the rails. But overall I dont think they will suffer more than today since a lot of transit traffic to Sweden and Norway also goes through Rostock or Sazznitz.


----------



## MichiH

Festin said:


> Well sure, the world need less traffic and especially germany.


It's not my opinion. I just write what I get from media.



Festin said:


> But perhaps the effect would not be bigger compared to now, if the motorway from hamburg was to be extended to the tunnel so they dont drive on the local roads.


There is already a motorway (2x2, mostly w/o hard shoulders and in a damn bad condition). There are no cross-town links on Fehmarn island (where motorway is not yet built), there's no traffic on local roads.......



Festin said:


> But there would also be the option to take the train, once the tunnel is done you could easly take the train and the heavy transport could also be taken care on the rails.


The discussion is (almost) only about railway. The opponents don't want to have the existing railway route to be widened and they don't want a new railway route! The road is just a minor problem which is usually not mentioned in discussion.


----------



## Festin

MichiH said:


> It's not my opinion. I just write what I get from media.


No, I got that , but just wrote my thoughts on the subject.




MichiH said:


> There is already a motorway (2x2, mostly w/o hard shoulders and in a damn bad condition). There are no cross-town links on Fehmarn island (where motorway is not yet built), there's no traffic on local roads.......


I ment that part where it is not a motorway, as a local road, since a slow vehicle can create longer lines of cars. 



MichiH said:


> The discussion is (almost) only about railway. The opponents don't want to have the existing railway route to be widened and they don't want a new railway route! The road is just a minor problem which is usually not mentioned in discussion.


Thats interesting to hear. I would have thought they would be in favour of a better railway.


----------



## MichiH

Festin said:


> I ment that part where it is not a motorway, as a local road, since a slow vehicle can create longer lines of cars.


It's B207, a "Federal highway". Local traffic has to use the Fehmarnsund brigde but on Fehmarn island, there are "parallel" local roads and B207 is almost just used by transit traffic.



Festin said:


> Thats interesting to hear. I would have thought they would be in favour of a better railway.


I quote wikipedia:



> There is also criticism on the *increase of noise for some residents and visitors* when moving the freight train traffic from the Jutland-Schleswig route to this route. These critics have been the loudest and they have been able to get a realignment of the planned railway route.


The realigned route has ecological issues...

Citizens' initiatives incorporated their activity in June 2015: http://beltretter.de/ (belt rescuers). There's also an English article: Become a beltretter.



> Experts assume that the swirling will turn the Baltic Sea between Denmark and Germany into a downright sludge. And that in view of the fact that the tunnel might not make any economical sense at all.


----------



## Søren L

The last stripe has been put on the pavement from Solrød S - Greve S (E20/E47/E55 Køge bugt motorvejen), so now the first section is finished. 4 lanes in each direction is now available. The last section from the Køge junction - Solrød S will be finished in 2017/2018, so the motorists will not be total free of traffic jams in the upcoming text 2 or 3 years. the widening was needed because it serves 113700 vehicles per day in the area with most traffic (according to Vejdirektoratet "average traffic per day 2014").


----------



## MichiH

Søren L said:


> it serves 113700 vehicles per day in the area with most traffic (according to Vejdirektoratet "average traffic per day 2014").


I couldn't find the document. Does it contain the AADT figures of all Danish motorways?


----------



## Søren L

MichiH said:


> I couldn't find the document. Does it contain the AADT figures of all Danish motorways?


I found it in the magazine "På vej" which Vejdirektoratet made. But you can find it on Vejdirektoratet.dk > statistik > trafik på vejene > trafik på målestationer. 
Then find "Køge bugt motorvejen" and you can se how much traffic there is at certain areas (the number i found is at the Ishøj intersection)


----------



## Søren L

IGNORE!!! this was so that i could get my 10th post so i can post pictures and links SORRY


----------



## Søren L

By the way if you want to read the magazine online you can do it here. (it is in danish of course, but you can look at the data or the pictures)
http://vejdirektoratet.dk/SiteCollectionDocuments/På Vej - web.pdf


----------



## Nikolaj

MichiH said:


> I couldn't find the document. Does it contain the AADT figures of all Danish motorways?


If you are looking for AADT 2013 numbers for Danish Motorways (and other main roads) look here:
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...Attachments/816/Samlede strømkort 2013_ny.pdf

If you want more recent numbers (including preliminary 2015 numbers) look here:
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vi...en/Trafik på målestationer/Sider/default.aspx

Just double-click the map - zoom in and out - and click in the box "Vis trafiktal for 2015" (Show 2015 numbers) You then get a pop-up informing you that 2015 numbers are preliminary. After that click "Opdater tallene.


----------



## bongo-anders

The latest aerials from Køge Bugt Motorvejen.



Cementvej/Tåstrupvej in Solrød.




Egedesvej





Karlslunde Mosevej






Karlslunde service station.






Mosede Landevej





On the northern part looking south.






Exit 31A Solrød S.


----------



## bongo-anders

Solrød Byvej.





Kildestien north of Mosede Landevej.






Back at Tåstrupvej.





Skensved Å





Ølsemaglevej








Finally an older picture from June showing the crossing of Lille Syd line and the future connecting line to the high speed line.


----------



## Nikolaj

*New record across Storebælt (Great Belt)*

The fixed link across Great Belt/Storebælt made a new day record last Sunday (9th August) as 48.257 cars crossed the Fixed link in 24 hours. Monthly, weekly and weekend records was also beaten in July this year. 2014 AADT for the fixed link was 31.127, but July this year was 6,7 % higher than July 2014, and the monthly record in July 2015 was 37.314 cars a day.
http://finans.dk/live/erhverv/ECE79...rt-over-Storebæltsbroen-på-én-dag/?ctxref=ext


----------



## bongo-anders

Combined railway and motorway construction at exit number 32 in Køge.


----------



## kalaha

^^That new rainwater basin between the motorway and the railway is really huge! So much earth have been moved :nuts:


----------



## bongo-anders

The first stage of the Køge Bugt motorway is done, only a few minor works is missing.

The first stage is just north of exit 31A at Solrød S to Greve S.



Were starting at Solrød S, here they are constructing a new bridge because the old one isn´t wide enough to fit in 2 extra lanes and one exit ramp (the southbound)


----------



## bongo-anders

Solrød S seen from south in a northern direction.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ You should zoom in a bit, so you don't get the dashboard and less reflection on the photo


----------



## bongo-anders

Some miscellaneous photos from stage 2, Solrød S to Motorvejskryds Køge Vest.

We a driving south from just before Solrød S


----------



## bongo-anders

Finally the second stage of Frederikssundmotorvejen was done not so long ago.


This trip went from Motorvejskryds Ballerup towards west, then using the exit at Smørum Parkvej, driving up to Frederiksundsvej and then enter the motorway again from Tværvej and driving back to motorvejskryds Ballerup.


----------



## bongo-anders

And finally the huge railwaybridge over Motorring 4.



First driving from the Køge Bugt Motorway towards the Holbæk motorway in direction of Copenhagen.




















And now coming from the north from Ballerup on Motorring 4 towards the Køge Bugt Motorway.


----------



## bongo-anders

ChrisZwolle said:


> ^^ You should zoom in a bit, so you don't get the dashboard and less reflection on the photo


I do realize that most of the pictures wasn´t any good but I didn´t want to waste them. 


But I will use your advise for the next time.


----------



## bongo-anders

Some shots of exit 31A at the Køge Bugt motorway taken out of the windows of a bus.

Its not allowed to access this site on my bike so the photos will be from a car or in this case a bus.


----------



## bongo-anders

Construction around exit 32 at the Køge Bugt motorway.


First from the eastern side, here at Rishøj stadion.











Also east of the motorway, but here outside Karlemosevej.








Still east of the motorway, here the tunnel for Bellingestien.


----------



## bongo-anders

Now west of the motorway, the western side of the Bellingestien tunnel.









The railway bridge over the soon to be relocated western ramps.





Here they are both building a new railroad tunnel under themotorway but also expanding the old one.


----------



## NordikNerd

The *E47 *"sydmotorvejen" had to close yesterday due to walking refuguees.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Kronprinsesse Marys Bro*

The planned bridge across the Roskilde Fjord near Frederikssund has been named after Crown Princess Mary of Denmark.

The name will be Kronprinsesse Marys Bro (Crown Princess Mary Bridge).


----------



## [atomic]

The people of Torslev Hage won't be happy about the route :lol: but there seems to be a right of way right through it.


----------



## bongo-anders

Talking about new bridges.


Last weekend the new Ølsemaglevej bridge was mounted over the Køge Bugt motorway between exit 32 and 31B.

But when the bridge is done by summer 2016 it will only be for pedestrians and cyclists.

In the next few weeks the bridge over the 4 future train tracks will be mounted.
It seems like they will keep the old road bridge over the 2 S-train tracks but I´m not sure about that.


----------



## Nikolaj

[atomic] said:


> The people of Torslev Hage won't be happy about the route :lol: but there seems to be a right of way right through it.


Tørslev Hage is a summer cotteage area, and the right of way has been reserved for ages (since 60'es-70'es when most of the cottages were built. But for sure they weren't happy about the new bridge and 4 lane expressway, and suggested a number of alternativ alignments outside of their area.

The project including a bridge and 10 km 4 lane expressway is currently in the tendering procedure, with 5 consortia selected:
- Fjordforbindelsen Frederikssund Contractors JV which include Per Aarsleff A/S (DK) og Ed. Züblin AG (D) with subcontactors Rambøll A/S (DK) og Strabag SE (AT)
- Joint Venture Rizzani de Eccher s.p.a (IT), N.V. Besix S.A. (BE), Acciona Infraestructuras S.A. (ESP) with subcontractor MJ Eriksson (DK)
- Joint venture Vinci Construction Grand Projects SAS (FR), Hochtief Infrastructure GmbH (D) and MT Højgaard A/S (DK)
- JV 3B which include BAM Infra bv (NL), Max Bögl International SE (D) and Barslund (DK) with subcontractors Max Bögl Nederland B.V. (NL)
- TBI Infra B.V. (NL) and Compagnie d´Entreprises CFE S.A./N.A (BE)

The bridge and expresway is planned to be ready in 2019, and will have a free flowing toll system with a toll of 14 DKK (Euro 1,85) per car and DKK 41(approx. Euro 5) for a truck

Presentation of the project: http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...P til Info-møde 19-03-15_rettet af LENS_1.pdf


----------



## bongo-anders

Its time for some updates on the expansion of the Køge Bugt Motorway.



First we are at exit 31B driving north.


----------



## bongo-anders

Then we are getting closer to exit 31A where the new bridge is growing fast.

















Same bridge but know in the southern direction.


----------



## bongo-anders

The new Ølsemaglevej pedestrian/bicycle bridge just south of the future Køge Nord station.











A little bit further south they are building a railroad tunnel.


----------



## bongo-anders

Now we are at the 2 new railroad bridges over the western ramps at exit 32 and the relocated Lyngvej.


----------



## bongo-anders

New photos of the Silkeborg motorway.



http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/Funder-Laasby/Visualisering/Sider/default.aspx


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Great Belt Bridge + Øresund Bridge*

2015 traffic data has been published for both the Great Belt Bridge and Øresund Bridge.

*Great Belt Bridge*

The Great Belt Bridge or Storebælt Bridge saw its highest AADT ever, at 32500 vehicles per day. This is a clear growth over 2014, when the AADT was at 31100 vehicles per day. 2014 was the previous peak year. The average daily traffic varies from 24100 in January to 38000 in August. The peak day was 9 August with 48250 vehicles.











*Øresund Bridge*

The Øresund Bridge logged a small growth from an average of 19200 vehicles per day in 2014 to 19300 vehicles per day in 2015. It varies from an average 15200 vehicles per day in January to 25900 vehicles per day in July. The peak day was 18 July with 31000 vehicles.

The Øresund Bridge traffic is not growing as fast as the Great Belt Bridge since the Great Recession. While the Great Belt Bridge has traffic volumes clearly above pre-recession levels, the Øresund Bridge is still stagnating somewhat. The Sweden-to-Denmark commute growth may have also plateaud. Another factor is the high toll for infrequent users and more competition from ferries.


----------



## bongo-anders

Some driveby action on the Køge Bugt motorway.


First we are driving south towards exit 32.


















And then north towards exit 31A


----------



## bongo-anders

Latest aerials from the expansion of the Køge Bugt motorway.


http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/m10/Visualisering/Sider/default.aspx


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Silkeborgmotorvejen*

The Primærrute (Primary Route) 15 motorway around Silkeborg will open to traffic on 11 September 2016. They plan to hold a big party, which they called 'Denmarks biggest road party'.

http://vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/om-os/...vejen-åbner-med-Danmarks-største-vejfest.aspx

http://www.danmarksstørstevejfest.dk/


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E47 Femern Belt Tunnel (Denmark-Germany)*

The Danish parliament has approved the contract for the construction of the Femern Belt Tunnel / Fehmarn Belt Tunnel that will link Denmark and Germany by motorway and railroad. 

http://www.trm.dk/da/nyheder/2016/politisk-aftale-om-femern-baeltprojektet

There was a large parliamentary majority; both the government, supporting parties and most of the opposition voted in favor. Only the green parties voted against. 

Construction cannot begin for some time though, as the German approval procedure has been delayed by several years. 

*Immersed tunnel and tunnel factory*

_Consortium: _
* Femern Link Contractors (FLC)
_Contractors: _
* VINCI Construction Grands Projets S.A.S. (France)
* Per Aarsleff A/S (Denmark)
* Wayss & Freytag Ingenieurbau AG (Germany)
* Max Bögl Stiftung & Co. KG (Germany)
* CFE SA (Belgium)
* Solétance-Bachy International S.A.S. (France)
* BAM Infra BV (Netherlands) 
* BAM International B.V. (Netherlands)
_Sub-contractor:_
* Dredging International N.V. (Belgium)
_Consultant: _
* COWI A/S (Denmark)


*Dredging and Reclamation*

_Consortium: _
* Fehmarn Belt Contractors (FBC)
_Contractors:_
* Boskalis International B.V. (Netherlands)
* HOCHTIEF Solutions AG (Germany)
* Ed. Züblin AG (Germany)
* Van Oord Dredging and Marine Contractors B.V. (Netherlands)
_Consultants: _
* SWECO Danmark A/S (Denmark)


----------



## The Polwoman

^^

Quite many Dutch companies being involved :cheers1: (proost/skål!)


----------



## OulaL

Will they build border control facilities, or at least reserve space for them, should the need arise in the future?

Since nobody wants queues to form in the tunnel, these facilities have to be located on each side for entering traffic. This will hardly be a problem for Denmark, but what about Germany?


----------



## MichiH

^^ No.


----------



## metacatfry

ChrisZwolle said:


>


Look at all those bridges, Denmark is a very rich country to be able to afford to build so many so closely, with some of them for relatively marginal uses.
Normally you see at least some transversal barriers appearing when a motorway is constructed, but here almost every single existing path and road seem to have been preserved.


----------



## OulaL

MichiH said:


> ^^ No.


What about toll plazas, or are they assumed to be automatic anywhere anyway by the time of completion?


----------



## MichiH

^^ There will be (or could be?) a toll plaza in Denmark. Source: Treaty b/n Denmark and Germany (German version).



> page 13:
> (1) Für die Benutzung der Straßenverbindung auf der Festen Fehmarnbeltquerung mit Kraftfahrzeugen wird das Königreich Dänemark Mautgebühren erheben. Die Mautgebühren stehen dem Königreich Dänemark zu.
> [...]
> (4) Die Gebühren für die Nutzung der Straßenverbindung auf der Festen Fehmarnbeltquerung werden an *Mautstationen im Königreich Dänemark* erhoben.






 (@0:10)


----------



## MattiG

MichiH said:


> ^^ No.


Or yes but more probably maybe. The planning is not in the phase this question can be answered.

If the decision making at the German side takes time, the system might be ready to launch in 2028. In 2016, nobody knows which will be the requirements in 2028. I would be somewhat surprised if there were no plans to make some reservation for an area to be quickly transformed to a control plaza.

(My prediction is that Norway takes over Denmark in 2026 after Sweden surrended to Finland in the War of Surströmming late 2025. Norway closes its borders and requires a visa to enter.)


----------



## OulaL

The toll plaza can be used as a border control area (which is what Sweden is doing in Malmö anyway), but it might turn into a hazard if it causes queues in the tunnel.

Of course the toll plaza doesn't need to be in Rødbyhavn, particularly so if Rødbyhavn doesn't need its own motorway exit anymore (does it?). Even if it does, this exit is probably well sufficient with a single lane with a single booth; the toll plaza for those going to the rest of Denmark may be located deeper inland to avoid the risk mentioned above.

It is already mentioned in the border crossing thread that there was a queue of 8 km on A7/E45. This is just a too stupid and simple thing to be ignored while it would be so easy to solve at this stage of planning.


----------



## MichiH

MattiG said:


> Or yes but more probably maybe. The planning is not in the phase this question can be answered.


The planning documents are completed but could be modified.



MattiG said:


> If the decision making at the German side takes time, the system might be ready to launch in 2028.


There are thousands of complaints against the current plan from Germans. But the documents which are discussed are completed documents. The plan approval procedure is just about approving them. Of course, if the complaints are justified and the planning authority fears that it could go to court, the documents are usually modified. But this kind of modification is usually a "litte" modification. If it is a bigger modification, the documents must be laid out again which would take more time. A modification like a border crossing building is a bigger modification.



MattiG said:


> In 2016, nobody knows which will be the requirements in 2028. I would be somewhat surprised if there were no plans to make some reservation for an area to be quickly transformed to a control plaza.


Maybe Denmark did :dunno:.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

They could periodically close the tunnel Denmark-bound if a long queue is forming. They would just buffer traffic on the German side.


----------



## MattiG

MichiH said:


> The planning documents are completed but could be modified.


Of course, they will be modified. There is always a need to even major re-planning, especially in projects spanning for decades.



> There are thousands of complaints against the current plan from Germans. But the documents which are discussed are completed documents. The plan approval procedure is just about approving them. Of course, if the complaints are justified and the planning authority fears that it could go to court, the documents are usually modified. But this kind of modification is usually a "litte" modification. If it is a bigger modification, the documents must be laid out again which would take more time. A modification like a border crossing building is a bigger modification.


I can see no space for being blue-eyed here. If Denmark needs a control plaza for the sake of national security, then there will be a control plaza. The same applies on the German side.


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> They could periodically close the tunnel Denmark-bound if a long queue is forming. They would just buffer traffic on the German side.


There is an automatic buffer on the German side if no action is taken: The 1+1-lane Fehmarnsund bridge.

AFAIK, the bridge is in bad condition, and it does not necessarily last until 2028. If Germany is not able to decide what to do with a protected but a bad bridge, the car ferries could perhaps be moved from Fehmanrbelt to Fehmarnsund.


----------



## MichiH

MattiG said:


> I can see no space for being blue-eyed here. If Denmark needs a control plaza for the sake of national security, then there will be a control plaza. The same applies on the German side.


I agree that there a border crossing could already be necessary for Denmark but I'm quite sure that there will be no need for Germany! Of course, 2028 is remote future and "everything" can change.



MattiG said:


> There is an automatic buffer on the German side if no action is taken: The 1+1-lane Fehmarnsund bridge.
> AFAIK, the bridge is in bad condition, and it does not necessarily last until 2028.


The planning procedure for a 4-laned Fehmarnsund crossing has _already finally_ been started. The Fehmarnbelt crossing will most likely be opened earlier than the new Fehmarnsund crossing though.



MattiG said:


> If Germany is not able to decide what to do with a protected but a bad bridge, the car ferries could perhaps be moved from Fehmanrbelt to Fehmarnsund.


I think that's not likely / not (easily) possible!


----------



## Nikolaj

metacatfry said:


> Look at all those bridges, Denmark is a very rich country to be able to afford to build so many so closely, with some of them for relatively marginal uses.
> Normally you see at least some transversal barriers appearing when a motorway is constructed, but here almost every single existing path and road seem to have been preserved.


That's the price you have to pay for the chosen alignment. Silkeborg is surrounded by very sensitive natural areas, and the initial proposed alignment crossed some of those natural areas. But due to pressure from various interest groups it was instead chosen to use an lignment through built-up area through the northern part of Silkeborg. In order to compensate for this a lot of bridges , fauna bridges and a tunnel next to a residential areas has been built.


----------



## Ingenioren

What's the big deal about queues in the tunnel? I mean in Oslo the whole E18 is one long queue in a tunnel every day.


----------



## OulaL

Ingenioren said:


> What's the big deal about queues in the tunnel? I mean in Oslo the whole E18 is one long queue in a tunnel every day.


Trying to avoid them (queues, not particularly tunnels) when possible. Somewhere the avoiding is just more difficult than elsewhere.

And what's the problem... well, bad air and increased risk on relatively small accidents escalating into catastrophes.


----------



## MattiG

Ingenioren said:


> What's the big deal about queues in the tunnel? I mean in Oslo the whole E18 is one long queue in a tunnel every day.


The tunnels in Oslo seem not to be free from trouble.

http://nortrail.no/service-messages...program-in-oslo-2015-2020-article548-372.html


----------



## MattiG

OulaL said:


> And what's the problem... well, bad air and increased risk on relatively small accidents escalating into catastrophes.


The air quality is an interesting challenge in long tunnels. There is a ventilation hole close to the midway of the Lærdal Tunnel. The Fehmarn tunnel runs under a very busy ship traffic corridor, thus no ventilation towers are possible. 

The projected AADT in the Fehmarn tunnel is 6000-9000 while the AADT oof the Lærdal Tunnel is about 2000. Thus, managing the exhaust gases needs much more effort.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

A semi truck has struck a bridge across E47 near Rødbyhavn and then caught fire. The bridge has been demolished yesterday.

This stretch of E47 has no shoulders. It was the first motorway in Denmark that started construction (1941), but was not the first to open (1963).


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*PR-53 Crown Princess Mary Bridge*

Construction on the new bridge across the Roskildefjord near Frederikssund will commence on 25 April, the calendar of the traffic minister shows.

It is a 1.3 kilometer long bridge that forms a bypass of Frederikssund, northwest of Copenhagen. It is part of a new tolled expressway, likely Primary Route 53 (Primærrute 53). The bridge project is known as the Frederikssund Connection or Frederikssundforbindelsen. The bridge itself is named the 'Kronprinsesse Marys Bro'.


----------



## bongo-anders

Then we just miss the last 28 km or so of the Frederikssunds motorway into Cooenhagen.


----------



## bongo-anders

Works on the median at the Egedesvej exit (31B) at the Køge Bugt motorway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20, Odense*

The new Exit 50 of E20 at Odense opens to traffic tomorrow. It replaces a diamond interchange a little further west. It also includes a new access road into the city.









Photo by Vejdirektoratet


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The construction of the new Roskilde Fjord crossing near Frederikssund has started (see also post #1834).

There were no press releases by Vejdirektoratet or TRM but I found this article: http://www.fdm.dk/nyheder/tre-maend-saetter-gang-marys-bro

The bridge project also includes nearly 10 kilometers of four-lane expressway. It is going to cost 2 billion DKK and will open in 2019. It is a toll road.


----------



## Blackraven

ChrisZwolle said:


> A semi truck has struck a bridge across E47 near Rødbyhavn and then caught fire. The bridge has been demolished yesterday.
> 
> This stretch of E47 has no shoulders. It was the first motorway in Denmark that started construction (1941), but was not the first to open (1963).


It's a shame that it has to be destroyed.............but the bridge has been in service for more than 50 years so it's okay to build a new one.

Denmark is a rich country (with lots of $$$) so they can easily build a new replacement bridge


----------



## MattiG

Blackraven said:


> It's a shame that it has to be destroyed.............but the bridge has been in service for more than 50 years so it's okay to build a new one.
> 
> Denmark is a rich country (with lots of $$$) so they can easily build a new replacement bridge


Most probably such a bridge was approaching the end of its lifecycle anyway.


----------



## satanism

There are indeed many broken down and also abandoned cars on the hard shoulders in Denmark...partially because the danes still drive a lot of old clunkers....which has to do with the crazy tax(now a bit less crazy) they pay on the new ones.


----------



## bongo-anders

Some motorway construction pictures.


First up is Cordozavej/Roskildevej bridge at exit 31A.














And around exit 32 with new ramps on the western side and the new Lyngvej bridge.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I drove through Denmark today, E20 and E45, plus PR-17 and PR-14. Again, there were 0 cars on the shoulder in Sweden, but around 15 in Denmark, including broken down, abandoned and even crashed cars, there was one car on its roof in a ditch near Odense, and has been there for some time, judging by the red-white line across it. Also, there was a broken down car on E20 east of Kørsor where the motorway has no shoulders... quite dangerous, it was parked in the tall grass.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Single tickets for the Øresund Bridge are really becoming unaffordable. Today it's 390 DKK / € 54, while in 2007 it was 245 DKK / € 35. This is much more than a consumer price indexation. I know they're pushing to get a BroPass, but an annual subscription isn't really what tourists are looking for. They cross the bridge two times per year or less. The subscription fee is too high for when you don't use it every single year.


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> I drove through Denmark today, E20 and E45, plus PR-17 and PR-14. Again, there were 0 cars on the shoulder in Sweden, but around 15 in Denmark, including broken down, abandoned and even crashed cars, there was one car on its roof in a ditch near Odense, and has been there for some time, judging by the red-white line across it. Also, there was a broken down car on E20 east of Kørsor where the motorway has no shoulders... quite dangerous, it was parked in the tall grass.


As the cars are extremely cheap in Denmark, they abandon them when they run out of gas, you know.


----------



## kostas97

What is the progress on the Silkeborg bypass? I just spotted that road on Google maps and i wonder about it.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

It will open in September.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20, Fyn*

A few photos of the widened E20 across western Fyn. The Middelfart - Nørre Aaby segment was widened to six lanes in late 2014. It is planned to eventually widen E20 across Fyn to Tietgenbyen east of Odense, but it may partially be shoulder running for the time being.

1. The Little Belt Bridge. It already had 2x3 lanes prior to the widening.

E20 Little Belt Bridge by European Roads, on Flickr

2. 

E20 Fyn-1 by European Roads, on Flickr

3. 

E20 Fyn-2 by European Roads, on Flickr

4. 

E20 Fyn-4 by European Roads, on Flickr

5. 

E20 Fyn-5 by European Roads, on Flickr

6. 

E20 Fyn-6 by European Roads, on Flickr

7. 

E20 Fyn-8 by European Roads, on Flickr

8. 

E20 Fyn-10 by European Roads, on Flickr


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E47/55 Helsingør Motorway*

The final paving works for the widening of the Helsingør Motorway (E47, E55) between Gammel Holte and Hørsholm-South will be done during the summer vacation. It is planned to be completed by early August.

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/om...jen-får-sidste-lag-asfalt-i-sommerferien.aspx


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E47 Femern Belt Tunnel (Denmark-Germany)*

A renewed consultation process for the German side of the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel project will be held from 12 July to 12 August.

After circa 3,000 comments on the German part of the project, they changed some of the plans. The new plans equals 26 ring binders worth of documentation.

The Danish part of the project is long completed, there were only 30 comments.


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> A renewed consultation process for the German side of the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel project will be held from 12 July to 12 August.
> 
> After circa 3,000 comments on the German part of the project, they changed some of the plans. The new plans equals 26 ring binders worth of documentation.
> 
> The Danish part of the project is long completed, there were only 30 comments.


Germans are quite thorough. Years ago, I ramped up a new function and hired a dozen of delivery managers to make an international team. After reaching the business as usual mode, I asked everyone to write a report for the lessons learned analysis. The Frenchman wrote the shortest one, 4 pages. The German-born gentleman living 30 years in Finland sent me a long report with a number of appendices, total of 80 pages.


----------



## italystf

ChrisZwolle said:


> A renewed consultation process for the German side of the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel project will be held from 12 July to 12 August.
> 
> After circa 3,000 comments on the German part of the project, they changed some of the plans. The new plans equals 26 ring binders worth of documentation.
> 
> The Danish part of the project is long completed, there were only 30 comments.


It's quite OT, since it isn't related to roads but with public infrastructures in general, but while reading an European Commission paper for a project I was involved into (it was related to the TEN-E plan, about energetic infrastructures in different EU countries), there was a comparison of the average documentation lenghts in Germany and Denmark.
The average documentation for energetic infrastructures in Germany appeared to be a lot longer (I think it was in the 10 times order!), than the average documentation for Danish projects.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Odins Bro*

I drove through Odense last week, via O2. The northern ring road of O2 opened in 2014, it contains an interesting swing bridge: Odins Bro.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Storstrøm Bridge*

There are plans to expedite the replacement of the Storstrøm Bridge by two years. The road/rail bridge was built in 1937 and needs replacement due to increased (freight) trains, especially after the opening of the Femern Belt Tunnel. They are now discussing if the bridge could open in 2022 instead of 2024. The bridge is 3.2 kilometers long.

http://www.tveast.dk/artikel/ny-storstroemsbro-forventes-fremrykket


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Midtjyske Motorway*

A cost-benefit study has been released for the planned Midtjyske Motorway (Mid-Jutland Motorway).

http://www.trm.dk/da/publikationer/2016/rapport-om-midtjysk-motorvej

All variants have a positive cost-benefit ratio. 

Corridor A+C will attract the most traffic. Corridor B+ relieves E45 the best. Travel time savings are best with corridors A, B and B+ and the least with C. 

* Corridor A: 185 km (146 km motorway), 15.3 billion DKK
* Corridor B: 167 km (167 km motorway), 19.9 billion DKK
* Corridor B+: 181 km (181 km motorway), 21.8 billion DKK
* Corridor C: 152 km (135 km motorway), 17.5 billion DKK










I prefer corridor B+. It's the most expensive variant, but is the best at relieving E45 (especially Vejlefjord Bridge) and provides the most new motorway mileage. It also stays away from precious Silkeborg more than C while not being out of range for Silkeborg.

Corridor A is better for Herning - Viborg traffic, but less for Silkeborg. I think corridor A is best at creating regional links while B/B+ is better at the overall picture for longer distance traffic.

Projected traffic volumes in 2030 and relief of E45 (%)


----------



## Heico-M

I think I like B best. It makes absolutely sense to stay west of Kolding to relieve the current E45/E20 route which can be quite busy many times. It would also give a better connection for Billund (airport!) to the motorway network. Furthermore it will give Silkeborg a direct north-south connection. 

I like how all proposals create a bypass around Aarhus for long distance traffic. Aarhus can also be bad, nowadays. 

Herning can be reached by road 18 which is also motorway, so no need to go there.


----------



## Nikolaj

Reading the report it is quite apparent that B+ is the preferred option. All the corridors are desribed thoroughly, but from then on it is B+ that is used as the reference corridor when showing various benefits from such a motorway - time savings, potential labour market benefits etc.

But as noted by Chris it certainly makes sense. B+ is the only option adressing the issue of the Vejlefjord Bridge. According to the report Vejlefjord Bridge will reach its max. capacity before 2030. However that is based on 2010 numbers, and since then traffic on a Vejlefjord has increased dramatically. In 2016 65 % of the forecasted growth from 2010 to 2030 has allready been reached. B+ will relieve Vejle Fjord Bridge for around 19 % of traffic, whereas the other corridors only will relieve with around 6-7 %.


----------



## satanism

I would much rather see option A built...the only loser is Silkeborg, but travelling from there to Herning is very quick and traffic-free so it's not really a big deal. Also primærrute 13 is quite Okay to drive and so can be 52, with a little investment.
And with the savings, I would much rather see works on the Ringe Bøjden Fynshav corridor which will not only relieve Trekantområdet but also the Odense to Nørre Åby stretch which is a proper nightmare, as well as connect Fyn much better to the rest of the world.


----------



## NordikNerd

satanism said:


> I would much rather see option A built...the only loser is Silkeborg, but travelling from there to Herning is very quick and traffic-free so it's not really a big deal.


Is the purpose of this motorway to serve the commuters of the surrounding cities of Silkeborg and Herning or should this motorway be designed for the long distance travellers driving from Ålborg to Åbenrå ? it seems like someone is going to be disappointed either way.


----------



## milipumba

Vejdirektoratet opens all four lanes, on the Køge bugt motorway, later this fall. It is between Køge west and exit 31A

But there will still be some work, on the roadside over the winter.
It will mostly be construction of the sound barriers.

The high speed rail is being build just "over the fence". 
So fortunately there are aerial images of the area.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Roskildefjord Bridge*

The contract for the main bridge of the new Roskildefjord Crossing (Crown Princess Mary Bridge) has been signed today. A joint-venture consisting of Rizzani de Eccher (Italy), Besix (Belgium) and Acciona Infraestructuras (Spain) will construct the bridge. 

The bridge will open to traffic in 2019. The entire project cost is 2 billion DKK (€ 270 million).


----------



## ChrisZwolle

A video (narrated in English) about the three megaprojects in Denmark; Great Belt, Øresund and Femern Belt.


----------



## kostas97

Is the Silkeborg bypass open?


----------



## Nikolaj

kostas97 said:


> Is the Silkeborg bypass open?


Yep 11th of September - look at post 1950


----------



## kostas97

Nikolaj said:


> Yep 11th of September - look at post 1950


Thank you for letting me know!!


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E47 Femern Belt Tunnel (Denmark-Germany)*

Haha, Femern A/S poking fun at the ridiculously extensive documentation for the German side of the Fehmarn Belt Tunnel. (40 binders with 14,000 pages). The Danish environmental study had only 1,600 pages.


----------



## OulaL

Is this for German federal government, Schleswig-Holstein state government or both?


----------



## MichiH

OulaL said:


> Is this for German federal government, Schleswig-Holstein state government or both?


The pic shows the German plan approval documents. The plan approval authority is the state of Schleswig-Holstein. There's no federal approval required (well, generally the federal government approves the preliminary design / costs. Afterwards, the plan approval procudure may begin. The Fehmarn crossing is not paid by the German federal government and does not approve anything about the tunnel but there are road and railway feeder projects which are approved, e.g. B207 upgrade or Fehmarnsund crossing)

Note: There were more than 3,000 objections about the plan approval documents. There was a hearing and documents were modified. Now, there are more than 9,000 objections about the plan supplement approval documents. That means, there are much more objections about the modifications than about the original documents. It's not allowed to complain about anything which has not been modified.

IIRC, there were 30 objections about the Danish documents...


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Does the German plan approval include the whole railroad upgrade in Schleswig-Holstein? 9,000 comments / objections seems like an incredibly high number given the fact that the only village near the tunnel portal is Puttgarden (population unknown, but can't be higher than a few hundred people). 

How many of these 'objections' actually make it to court?

In the Netherlands, people objecting on ideological grounds or not otherwise directly impacted by the project are considered 'not admissible', so the court doesn't even take their objections into consideration. I don't know how it works in Germany.


----------



## MichiH

ChrisZwolle said:


> Does the German plan approval include the whole railroad upgrade in Schleswig-Holstein?


No, just the tunnel.



ChrisZwolle said:


> 9,000 comments / objections seems like an incredibly high number given the fact that the only village near the tunnel portal is Puttgarden (population unknown, but can't be higher than a few hundred people).


It is.



ChrisZwolle said:


> How many of these 'objections' actually make it to court?


0. We just talk about the public review process (öffentliche Auslegung) which is the beginning of a plan approval procedure. People raised their objections (> 3,000), engineers tried to find a solution and discussed it with the complainers during a hearing (Erörterungstermin). Afterwards, they've modified all documents and published them again. Now, they got more than 9,000 objections just about the modifications...

I guess there will be another hearing and maybe another public review. Once the planner are "sure" that the documents are legal, the plan approval documents will be sent to the plan approval authority, the Ministry of Transport Schleswig-Holstein. They can pass the order. Afterwards, there will be another public review process. Opponents can complain about any detail of the documents (it's not required that they've already raised objections during the plan approval procedure). This would be a court procedure which might be end in a court hearing.



ChrisZwolle said:


> In the Netherlands, people objecting on ideological grounds or not otherwise directly impacted by the project are considered 'not admissible', so the court doesn't even take their objections into consideration. I don't know how it works in Germany.


I'm not sure about details how it works during the plan approval procedure but it's the same once the plan approval order would be passed. However, there's the so-called 'Verbandsklagerecht'. Any organization, e.g. nature conservation organisation, can complain.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I see.

There are usually two types of 'objections', the comments on a plan in the draft phase, and the objections against a final plan, which are sorted out in court. Comments don't necessarily have to be negative towards the project (but usually are). 

I also noticed that the time between a 'Planfeststellungsbeschluß' (final plan approval) and the verdict in court can be very long (years) in Germany. In the Netherlands the deadline is 6 months. I'm not sure how it is in Denmark, but it is apparently not an issue given the low number of comments / objections on the plans on the Danish side.


----------



## MichiH

^^ You're right. I think there was no final* court decision within 6 months since I monitor road projects (2008/09). I think 12 months are quick, 18-24 months are normal.

*Complainers must raise a "Eilantrag" (= "Vorläufiger Rechtsschutz" = "preliminary injunction") to postpone the construction. If there's no "Eilantrag" or the judge dismisses it, construction works could begin anyway.


----------



## Nikolaj

In Denmark it is quite a lot easier, but depends to some degree on whether it is a national project (government sponsored/financed) or a locally or private project. The Fehmarn project is a national project.

For both types of projects the entity/authority responsible for project (project owner) prepares an EIA (Environmental Impact Assessment). This EIA is presented for a public hearing lasting 8 weeks. After that the project owner deals with the various objections. It should be said that except for The Nature Conservation Association (equivalent to the German BUND) and a number of public authorities, only objections from citizens directly affected by the project are taken into consideration. After that the conclusions and recommendations, based on the public hearing, are presented to the competent body, the Minister of Transport for national projects or the local council for local projects.

For national projects The Minister of Transport then submits a bill to parliament describing the project, including various mitigating requirements. After the required 3 readings in parliament, and final approval by a majority, the bill becomes a so-called Construction Law which gives the permission to start construction and which mitigating activities that has to be included. This Construction Law cannot be challenged in any court or any other body, and construction can in theory start immediately. For large national projects individual Construction Laws are passed for each project. For smaller projects the construction law will be the annual Budget Appropriation Law, where funding for the project is allocated. The Budget Appropriation Law can likewise not be challenged in court. 

For local projects the EIA and construction permission is approved through a so-called Municipal Plan or Municipal Plan addendum. This approved local plan can be challenged in court within 8 weeks of publication, but it seldomly happens. If a project has been approved by a elected local council the courts in general only rules against a Municipal plan if it includes grave errors.


----------



## bongo-anders

They are still working on the cladding on the sound barriers at Køge Bugt motorvejen.


The opening of the 4th lane is very close but no date is announced yet.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Nice sound barrier. Are they going to keep it that way, or let vines grow on it?

edit: and are they going to repave the old lanes next year?


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> Nice sound barrier. Are they going to keep it that way, or let vines grow on it?
> 
> edit: and are they going to repave the old lanes next year?


I am not sure about the sound barrier, but i guess they will have vines grow on it. That is the usual way forward. A new top layer asphalt will be applied to all lanes of the motorway during the summer months of 2017.


----------



## bongo-anders

I think they will let the vines grow, atleast I hope so.


And yes they will open the lanes now and repave it next summer.


----------



## bongo-anders

I forgot to post pictures from last Friday that shows that they have opened up for 4 lanes on the last part towards Motorvejskryds Køge Vest.


----------



## Attus

bongo-anders said:


>


Traffic lanes seem to be pretty narrow. Are they, or is it only some optical illusion?


----------



## bongo-anders

Look at the space out to the median.


The lanes will get bigger.


----------



## g.spinoza

Is the Øresund bridge profitable for the managing company?


----------



## Nikolaj

g.spinoza said:


> Is the Øresund bridge profitable for the managing company?


According to the annual report for 2016, The Bridge consortia had a net profit of DKK 809 millions (EUR 109 mio.) in 2016. The profit is used to pay-back a net-debt of DKK 15,45 bn (EUR 2,07 bn). The debt is - according to the annual report - expected to be paid back in 2034.

https://data.oresundsbron.com/cms/download/Annual-Report-2016.pdf


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> Not compared to route via the Øresund Bridge, which seemed quite obvious to me. Ferries suck, I avoid them when I can. What is a 'coffee break with a sea view' for some may be an unwanted stop for others.
> 
> The Helsingør - Helsingborg ferry cost is € 55 one way (plus coffee  ), more expensive than the Øresund Bridge tolls + fuel and it doesn't save travel time either despite the shorter distance.


Well, well...

The toll of the bridge is the same as the ferry ticket at the ticket box, DKK 410 for a passenger car. The crossing time plus the average waiting time is about 30 minutes. The time is quite well compensated by the 40 km shorter driving: The E6 Malmö-Helsingborg leg is a lousy 2+2 motorway at its capacity limit, and prone to congestion. The market share by the number of vehicles is about 25% for the ferry and 75% for the bridge. The share of the ferry would not be that high if it were not a liable choice.

For the sake of the other people's safety, I recommend taking coffee breaks during the driving day.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The big plus for the bridge instead of the ferry is convenience. No reserving a spot, no planning for arriving at a certain time, no waiting time, no loading / unloading, etc. You just arrive and proceed right away. 

I do think the Øresund Bridge is overpriced for tourists and one/two-time users though. The Great Belt Bridge has more reasonable tolls.


----------



## Ingenioren

If the ferry was directly connected to motorway it would be a better alternative, the road trough Helsingør is no good.


----------



## bongo-anders

MJ Eriksson has won the 200 million kroner contract to build the 6 kilometer extension of the Kalundborg motorway.

This part is from where it ends today at near Kvanløse and then a new motorway outside Regstrup (the part MJ Eriksson will build) to Damstrup.

Rest of stage 2 is to rebuild Skovvejen to motorway standard.

http://www.building-supply.dk/article/view/546283/de_skal_bygge_for_200_millioner_motorvej


http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/da/vejprojekter/kalundborgmotorvejen/Sider/default.aspx


----------



## keber

4,5 million euro per km, that is really cheap.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Those are prices you would usually find in Spain. Though I think it excludes planning and expropriation cost.

It is not a simple twinning of the existing road, but a greenfield route. Only the Kvanløse - Søndre Jernløse section runs across the existing road, but that is already a four lane divided highway (without shoulders). That section has only one bridge, but it is wide enough for a motorway cross section (including shoulders).


----------



## bongo-anders

Well the 200 million is only for the blue part, according to the article the total price is 450 millions but I think it includes planning work etc.


----------



## bongo-anders

The minister of traffic had released the 7 most important motorway projects until 2025.

Improvements and widening of E45 Østjyske Motorvej and E20 Fynsmotorvejen. 

New Hærvejs motorway through the middle of jutland. 

Final stages of the Hillerød, Frederikssund and Kalundborg motorways.

And the 3rd crossing of Limfjorden in Aalborg.


----------



## SeanT

Hm.. What happened to Næstved connection?


----------



## bongo-anders

The mayor is not happy. 

But I think its fair that at least Hillerød and Frederikssund gets build before Næstved as they were planned before. 

But I don't think they have cancelled the planned first stage but I'm not sure.


----------



## korbendallas

SeanT said:


> Hm.. What happened to Næstved connection?


The Næstved connection progressed because Magnus Heunicke (Social Democratic politician from Næstved) was minister of transport. That was a couple of transport ministers ago.

It may not be the whole story, but it has something to do with it.


----------



## bongo-anders

The villages west of Kolding doesn´t like the idea of a motorway through their area, in this case the southernmost part the possible Hærvejsmotorvej.


The article is in danish but there is a picture.

http://ekstrabladet.dk/nyheder/samf...-sig-sammen-siger-nej-til-ny-motorvej/6761707


----------



## MattiG

Storstrømsbroen. A magnificent piece of old steel. But in a miserable condition.


----------



## bongo-anders

But also soon to be replaced.


----------



## korbendallas

Expansion of Køge Bugt Motorvejen is now nearing the real completion with the southbound direction being finished. The northbound direction will likely be finished during next weekend.


----------



## Grotlaufen

As for Storstrømsbroen and its replacement, are there any issues with Lillebæltsbroen at all? For one thing, Lillebælt carries all railway traffic from Sjælland/Fyn to Jylland and vice versa and is of the same age but AFAIK there are no issues with that bridge at all. Was Lillebælt built more robust?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ Both were built during the 1930s. Gamle Lillebæltsbro opened in 1935 and Storstrømbroen in 1937. Besides the obvious pavement quality (Storstrømbroen has terrible concrete pavement, but Gamle Lillebæltsbro has okay asphalt), I haven't read about any replacement for the Old Little Belt Bridge. 

Railroad bridges were typically built more robust than road bridges. The weight of trains has not increased that much since the early 20th century while the weight and amount of truck traffic has increased substantially since the mid-20th century rendering bridges structurally deficient, or shortening its projected lifespan. 

However, both the Little Belt Bridge and Storstrøm Bridge are dual rail/road bridges.


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> However, both the Little Belt Bridge and Storstrøm Bridge are dual rail/road bridges.


Still, their construction are totally different. The steel truss bridges seem to be quite durable everywhere. The Little Belt bridge is a camelback truss bridge, and the Storstrøm bridge is a girder bridge with three steel arcs. I believe the Storstrøm bridge is located in a place with more harsh weather conditions, and those ones might have a negative impact on the maintainability.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Kalundborgmotorvejen*



bongo-anders said:


> MJ Eriksson has won the 200 million kroner contract to build the 6 kilometer extension of the Kalundborg motorway.
> 
> This part is from where it ends today at near Kvanløse and then a new motorway outside Regstrup (the part MJ Eriksson will build) to Damstrup.
> 
> Rest of stage 2 is to rebuild Skovvejen to motorway standard.
> 
> http://www.building-supply.dk/article/view/546283/de_skal_bygge_for_200_millioner_motorvej
> 
> 
> http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/da/vejprojekter/kalundborgmotorvejen/Sider/default.aspx


The ceremony to start construction is planned for tomorrow.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ Articles: 

https://www.tveast.dk/artikel/lokale-virksomheder-der-mangler-30-kilometer-af-kalundborgmotorvejen

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...ang-på-2.-etape-af-Kalundborgmotorvejen-.aspx

The guy with the glasses in the middle is the minister of transportation.


----------



## Grotlaufen

*Storstrømsbroen*

The Italian joint venture Itinera, Condotte, Grandi Lavori Fincosit and Seteco Ingegneria won the contract to start the construction of the new Storstrømsbroen next year:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/storstroemsbro/nyheder/Sider/De-skal-bygge-den-nye-Storstr%C3%B8msbro.aspx


Article from the local newspaper (Danish):
http://folketidende.dk/Lokal-nyt/Italienere-skal-bygge-den-nye-Storstroemsbro/artikel/442101

Construction starts autumn 2018, opens for car traffic in 2022 and rail in 2023.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I took a look at the websites of those construction companies. Quite frankly they don't seem very experienced in the European construction sector, judging by their portfolio, which is mostly limited to construction projects in Italy. 

And these portfolios are often exaggerated. Not rarely are these lesser-known construction companies only a junior partner, subcontractor or part of a larger group at major construction projects. 

* Itinera has built only one road project outside of Italy: the Vác bypass in Hungary
* Condotte d'Aqua has built one motorway project in Romania. Most of their portfolio consists of projects that were completed decades ago. They are a partner in the Follobanen project near Oslo, which raised concerns about liquidity problems
* Grandi Lavori Fincosit does not list any infrastructure projects outside of Italy.


----------



## Grotlaufen

ChrisZwolle said:


> I took a look at the websites of those construction companies. Quite frankly they don't seem very experienced in the European construction sector, judging by their portfolio, which is mostly limited to construction projects in Italy.
> 
> And these portfolios are often exaggerated. Not rarely are these lesser-known construction companies only a junior partner, subcontractor or part of a larger group at major construction projects.
> 
> * Itinera has built only one road project outside of Italy: the Vác bypass in Hungary
> * Condotte d'Aqua has built one motorway project in Romania. Most of their portfolio consists of projects that were completed decades ago. They are a partner in the Follobanen project near Oslo, which raised concerns about liquidity problems
> * Grandi Lavori Fincosit does not list any infrastructure projects outside of Italy.



Given that the main reason for building this bridge in the first place (Fehmarnbelt tunnel) likely won't be completed until 2027-2028 or so a delay for a few years you could cynically say might be acceptable. Though I must say it is really disturbing none of them seems to have any experience in building longer bridges in maritime (salt water) environment.


It could also be noted that there have been several problems with the Italian consortium constructing Copenhagen metro Cityringen. The local construction union 3F have reported mafia connections  on the construction sites.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Grotlaufen said:


> Though I must say it is really disturbing none of them seems to have any experience in building longer bridges in maritime (salt water) environment.


Exactly. This is not your average rural motorway or railroad project, but a large, sea-crossing dual road/rail bridge. It's great that one of those companies built that cable-stayed bridge in Genova, but that was 50 years ago.

I'm guessing the Danish authorities will be on edge with this contract being awarded to a joint venture that seems to lack the proper credentials. 

The EU is a single market, but there are always subtle and not-so-subtle differences between countries.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Holstebromotorvejen*

Two connector roads built as part of the Holstebro Motorway open to traffic on 2 November:


----------



## Grotlaufen

ChrisZwolle said:


> Exactly. This is not your average rural motorway or railroad project, but a large, sea-crossing dual road/rail bridge. It's great that one of those companies built that cable-stayed bridge in Genova, but that was 50 years ago.
> 
> I'm guessing the Danish authorities will be on edge with this contract being awarded to a joint venture that seems to lack the proper credentials.
> 
> The EU is a single market, but there are always subtle and not-so-subtle differences between countries.



Today the local paper (Folketidende) writes all about that:
http://folketidende.dk/Femern/Dansk-bedst--Italiensk-billigst/artikel/442747

Apparently the Italian offer was 400 million DKK cheaper. But the other contracts were better in quality.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> Two connector roads built as part of the Holstebro Motorway open to traffic on 2 November:


And the exact date for opening of the 2nd section of the Holstebro Motorway - 14 km from Sinding to Tvis has been set to 27th November 2017.
http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/om...-14-nye-kilometer-af-Holstebromotorvejen.aspx


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*AdBlue manipulation*

_Miljøstyrelsen_ has set up NOx emission checkpoints to get a better picture of trucking companies using AdBlue manipulation devices. These devices disable the AdBlue system which cleans the exhaust while not initiating any errors in the engine management system. You can buy such devices for under € 100 on the internet. Without AdBlue, the NOx emissions from truck engines are significantly higher than allowed. Early tests show that about 25% of trucks are in violation.

Målingerne foregår, ved at en sensor sender en usynlig lysstråle gennem lastbilens udstødning, når den kører forbi. På den måde måles udstødningsgassens indhold af NOx.​
They use sensors that emit an invisible light beam into the exhaust of a truck. This measures the NOx content. 

Here you can see it in action:








Via: http://mst.dk/service/nyheder/nyhedsarkiv/2017/nov/ny-teknologi-skal-afdaekke-lastbilers-nox-snyd/

It's a good thing they are checking this. Enforcement in the European trucking industry is way too limited. For example, Norwegian _Statens Vegvesen_ inspections regularly show incredible deficiencies with trucks. AdBlue manipulation, tachograph manipulation, brake discs with giant cracks, overloading, insufficiently secured loads, tires with almost no tread, etc. These cowboys need to be taken off the roads.


----------



## vespafrederic

ChrisZwolle said:


> _Miljøstyrelsen_ has set up NOx emission checkpoints to get a better picture of trucking companies using AdBlue manipulation devices. These devices disable the AdBlue system which cleans the exhaust while not initiating any errors in the engine management system. You can buy such devices for under € 100 on the internet. Without AdBlue, the NOx emissions from truck engines are significantly higher than allowed. Early tests show that about 25% of trucks are in violation.
> 
> Målingerne foregår, ved at en sensor sender en usynlig lysstråle gennem lastbilens udstødning, når den kører forbi. På den måde måles udstødningsgassens indhold af NOx.​
> They use sensors that emit an invisible light beam into the exhaust of a truck. This measures the NOx content.
> 
> Here you can see it in action:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Via: http://mst.dk/service/nyheder/nyhedsarkiv/2017/nov/ny-teknologi-skal-afdaekke-lastbilers-nox-snyd/
> 
> It's a good thing they are checking this. Enforcement in the European trucking industry is way too limited. For example, Norwegian _Statens Vegvesen_ inspections regularly show incredible deficiencies with trucks. AdBlue manipulation, tachograph manipulation, brake discs with giant cracks, overloading, insufficiently secured loads, tires with almost no tread, etc. These cowboys need to be taken off the roads.


You can buy these emulators from 50€....


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Nordhavnsvej in Copenhagen will open to traffic on 17 December, according to the calendar of the minister of transport.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

An agreement has been made with the Danish People's Party about the E20 expansion and Great Belt Bridge toll rates.

Sund og Bælt will pay 2.1 billion DKK of the 2.4 billion DKK expansion of E20 between Nørre Aaby and Odense-Southwest. Also, the toll rates on the Great Belt Bridge will be reduced. This is paid for by extending the concession by 5 years. The E20 expansion will be completed by 2022, the lower toll rates will start on 1 January 2018. 

The toll rate reduction seems only for transponders, not cash or cards. 

_Takst for personbil ved an-vendelse af automatisk betaling, fx BroBizz eller automatisk nummerpladegenkendelse_

The toll rate for cars will go down from 228 to 194 DKK in 2018 and to 187 DKK in 2023. The current cash / card rate is 240 DKK. So from 1/1/18, the toll rate difference between transponders and cards/cash will be about 6 euros if the cash toll rate stays at 240 DKK.

I guess it will be more clear once the 2018 toll rates are published by Sund og Bælt.


----------



## metacatfry

When the Great Belt Bridge was sold to the public it was with the understanding that no tax money would go to finance it, it would be entirely financed by the users. The other side of this was that the income from tolls would only go to pay off the bridge. Eventuelly the bridge would be toll free.
My long term prediction, ever since the success of the bridge had proven itself, has been that this income will prove much to attractive to just let go.
Now the money is being diverted to finance motorway construction, with the promise that this is just a temporary extension of the toll period, which still will end one day.

My guess is that this extension will happen again.

I'm not against user financing at all. However at the time this model was decided it was hard fought because the social democartic party was ideologically against it, and still hold reservations, due to a belief that it works against the aims of allowing everyone equal access and opportunity.

But if the tolls are here to stay, it is time to decide if it makes sense to have this one section of the Danish motorway system that is tolled, and used to finance the rest of the system. This is arbitrary and represents a border between Funen and Zealand for no good reason. either make the whole system user financed or none.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

France and the United States also use this approach of cross-subsidies from a tolled facility to pay for upgrades on a non-tolled facility.

I too think the concession will be extended indefinitely. If it is not for financing other road projects, it is to maintain the bridge itself. Perhaps the toll rates can be reduced further once the initial construction cost is paid off and no other road projects are financed through the bridge tolls.


----------



## Nikolaj

metacatfry said:


> When the Great Belt Bridge was sold to the public it was with the understanding that no tax money would go to finance it, it would be entirely financed by the users. The other side of this was that the income from tolls would only go to pay off the bridge. Eventuelly the bridge would be toll free.
> My long term prediction, ever since the success of the bridge had proven itself, has been that this income will prove much to attractive to just let go.
> Now the money is being diverted to finance motorway construction, with the promise that this is just a temporary extension of the toll period, which still will end one day.
> 
> My guess is that this extension will happen again.
> 
> I'm not against user financing at all. However at the time this model was decided it was hard fought because the social democartic party was ideologically against it, and still hold reservations, due to a belief that it works against the aims of allowing everyone equal access and opportunity.
> 
> But if the tolls are here to stay, it is time to decide if it makes sense to have this one section of the Danish motorway system that is tolled, and used to finance the rest of the system. This is arbitrary and represents a border between Funen and Zealand for no good reason. either make the whole system user financed or none.


I fully agree that the Great Belt Bridge/Tunnel never will be free to use, and that is for a number of reasons:
A) You wrongly assume that it was promised that the bridge/tunnel eventually would be come free after the debt had been payed off. That is not correct. Although it is sometimes claimed by som local politician that they were promised that the connection ecentually would become free, it was never stated and never promised by those parties that were behind The Great Belt Law.
B) If it became free it would have some serious repercussions. Traffic would increase substantially requiring very soon expansion of adjoining motorways and within a relatively short period an additional fixed link, which without tolls would be impossible to finance.
C) A free Great Belt Bridge would completely undermine the economy behind the Femern Belt Tunnel, as most travellers between Germany and Scandinavia/Eastern Denmark would prefer a free Great Belt Bridge instead of paying 50-60 Euro to cross Femern Belt.
D) A free Great Belt Bridge would completely undermine the dream of many Danish politicians to construct a Kattegat fixed link between Kalundborg and Hou (south of Aarhus) which is supposed to be financed by tolls.
E) Lastly - as Chris mentioned - The Great Belt has substantial maintenance cost, which would have to be financed.

I agree with you that it is probably not the last time we have seen money from Great Belt diverted to other projects, and not the first time either. During the last 10 years approx. 1 bn Euro has allready been diverted to the socalled Infrastructure Fund, funding various infrastructure projects. My prediction is that in a number of years construction of a new fixed link across Kattegat will be pooled with Great Belt in the same state-owned company, in order to tolls from both bridges to fund the 15 bn Euro Kattegat project.

I have never heard - as claimed by you - that the social democrats shold be against the user-pay model for the fixed links (Great Belt, Oresund, Femern and in the future Kattegat). To the contrary. They were an original party to the Great Belt agreement/law, and the held the government when the Oresund agreement was agreed with Sweden, including the user-pay model, and are fully supporting th Femern Belt link, including user tolls, and the same goes for the Kattegat project.

On the now agreed reduction in tolls Storebælt has published the new officail 2018 rates https://www.storebaelt.dk/oplevdanmark/artikler/priser-privatkunder-2018 i.e. for cars DKK 240 for cash and card customers, and DKK 193,80 for socalled Club Storebælt customers. Cluc Storebælt customers are those customers with and Brobizz/E-tag and from 2018 also for those with an account with number plate recognition and a credit card, which would be open for all customers Danish or internationals.

The new scheme, with discounts for Brobizz/number plate recognition, makes sense. Allready now 62 % of all passages are made with Brobizz/E-tag, while 38 % of passages are cash/card customers. With an average of 35.000 passages per day, and peaking at 50.000 vehicles on summerdays (especially saturdays and sundays) and with an expected increase of 10% due to the reduced toll on top of the annual increase of 3-5 % in traffic, capacity in the toll plaza in its current lay-out is about to reach its maximum. Further capacity can most most easily be added by having more customers use the Brobizz/E-tag or new number plate recognition system instead of adding more lanes.


----------



## MattiG

Nikolaj said:


> E) Lastly - as Chris mentioned - The Great Belt has substantial maintenance cost, which would have to be financed.


After its 40th anniversary, the bridge most probably will need a major refurbishment, with the cost comparable to the initial construction cost.

Still, I can understand the discussion whether the bridge should be free or not. It is a good question why passing one spot on the national backbone network costs quite a lot of money while all other roads are financed by taxpayers' money. No, there is no single answer to that question, I know.


----------



## metacatfry

I will take your word for it that there has never been an offical promise that the bridge would become free to use, just because that sounds like the beginning of a dreary discussion about legalese.

The financing method for the bridge was naturally a major part of the debate about it thoughout the 80's, and this was when the opposition to the user-financing method was fairly strong on the center left. I seem to recall Arne Melchior being one, although I admit he is not the best example of a social democrat. there were certainly others though, if you really want to I can try to dig up some articles from the time. 
and you are naturally correct in that they voted for the law, my recollection is that in typical danish fashion there where some horse trading that had to be done although I don't remember what they got in trade.
since then the concept have become more acceptable to the social democratic politicians.

I think this book touches on some of those developments: 
"_det forenede land. fem år med storebæltsbroen: af Jan cortzen"_


And regards to your other points I'm very much in agreement. Also, practically speaking the great bridges are the easiest points to toll with the least amount of spillover to alternative routes, and that speaks strongly in favour.


----------



## Nikolaj

The project for a user financed Great Belt Connection was launched by the then Socialdemocratic government, led by Anker Jørgensen, in 1976, but postponed when Venstre entered in a coalition with the Socialdemocrats in 1978. In 1986 the project was re-launched by the then Conservative led government in agreement with the Socialdemocratic opposition.

In the original law governing the construction and operation of the fixed link, approved by the parliament 16th May 1987, it is clearly stated in paragraph 11 
https://www.retsinformation.dk/eli/ft/198612K00177 that upon the debt having been paid back the continued toll will be decided by the Minister of Transport with approval from the Finance Committee of the Parliament, i.e. it will not be free.


----------



## geogregor

ChrisZwolle said:


> I took a look at the websites of those construction companies. Quite frankly they don't seem very experienced in the European construction sector, judging by their portfolio, which is mostly limited to construction projects in Italy.
> 
> And these portfolios are often exaggerated. Not rarely are these lesser-known construction companies only a junior partner, subcontractor or part of a larger group at major construction projects.
> 
> * Itinera has built only one road project outside of Italy: the Vác bypass in Hungary
> * Condotte d'Aqua has built one motorway project in Romania. Most of their portfolio consists of projects that were completed decades ago. They are a partner in the Follobanen project near Oslo, which raised concerns about liquidity problems
> * Grandi Lavori Fincosit does not list any infrastructure projects outside of Italy.


I wonder if construction projecst in Italy are drying up?
Italian construction companies seem to be desperate to get contracts anywhere. There is bunch of them offering very low bids in Poland. Unfortunately some of them got to serious difficulties on their contracts. It looks like they underestimated costs of local contractors as well as local regulations and conditions.


----------



## g.spinoza

ChrisZwolle said:


> I took a look at the websites of those construction companies. Quite frankly they don't seem very experienced in the European construction sector, judging by their portfolio, which is mostly limited to construction projects in Italy.
> 
> And these portfolios are often exaggerated. Not rarely are these lesser-known construction companies only a junior partner, subcontractor or part of a larger group at major construction projects.
> 
> * Itinera has built only one road project outside of Italy: the Vác bypass in Hungary
> * Condotte d'Aqua has built one motorway project in Romania. Most of their portfolio consists of projects that were completed decades ago. They are a partner in the Follobanen project near Oslo, which raised concerns about liquidity problems
> * Grandi Lavori Fincosit does not list any infrastructure projects outside of Italy.


Not to mention that Fincosit has the tender for the construction of 2nd Tenda Tunnel tube, and it is involved in the investigation for the underuse of construction materials.
Itinera also built the Fez-Meknes stretch of Moroccan A2, and a tunnel on A1 in Slovenia.

Condotte d'Acqua has a long portfolio of works abroad...


----------



## ChrisZwolle

g.spinoza said:


> Condotte d'Acqua has a long portfolio of works abroad...


That portfolio includes only one motorway project in Europe (outside of Italy). A section of A1 in Romania. And a flatland motorway is not exactly similar to a sea crossing. 

Several other projects on their portfolio were completed decades ago. Viadotto Polcevera near Genova was built half a century ago, as was the Mont Blanc Tunnel.

Also, they are often not clear about their contribution to projects on their portfolios. Sometimes they are lead constructor, but often they only built portions of the project.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Nordhavnsvej*

The Nordhavnsvej in Copenhagen was inaugurated yesterday.


----------



## kosimodo

Hh, was there this morning.... closed


----------



## korbendallas

kosimodo said:


> Hh, was there this morning.... closed


Yup, it opened at 12:00


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Political pressure is emerging to not sign the contract for the Storstrøm Bridge with the Italian consortium. 2 out of 3 construction companies are evidently involved in a corruption and bribery scandal in Italy.

https://www.tveast.dk/artikel/polit...stroemsbro-byggefirmaer-i-stor-korruptionssag


----------



## kosimodo

korbendallas said:


> Yup, it opened at 12:00












Shared with Urbie (http://urbie.city)

not busy at 17.24


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> Political pressure is emerging to not sign the contract for the Storstrøm Bridge with the Italian consortium. 2 out of 3 construction companies are evidently involved in a corruption and bribery scandal in Italy.
> 
> https://www.tveast.dk/artikel/polit...stroemsbro-byggefirmaer-i-stor-korruptionssag


Contract signing, which was supposed to happen to day, has been postponed at least until after a meeting in the Parliament Transport Committee later today. The problem is that it can be very complicated not signing a contract with a company winning an EU bid just based on newpaper stories and various allegations.

http://politiken.dk/indland/art6259...-annullere-kontrakt-til-21-milliarder-kroner«


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The politicians pull the emergency brake on the Storstrøm Bridge contract signing: https://www.tveast.dk/artikel/polit...sidste-oejeblik-underskrift-af-kontrakt-om-ny

Reportedly it is not just allegations, top executives have been convicted for corruption, according to the TV Øst report.

Still, besides the corruption and bribery stories, it is still remarkable that they want to award such a complex project to a consortium that appears to lack experience with such projects. 

There's only so much you can mess up with a general road project, in the worst case scenario you'll repave it. But this is a much more challenging project, a very large rail/road bridge in a saltwater environment with labor laws and oversight probably more strict than in most countries.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Vejdirektoratet published a video about the Storstrøm Bridge:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Storstrøm Bridge*

The national lawyer (Kammeradvokaten) has concluded that the contract for the Storstrøm Bridge replacement cannot be awarded to another company solely on the allegations and convictions of bribery and corruption alone. 

However, one of the consortium's partners (Condotte) is in financial trouble. This should be sorted out before the contract will be signed.

Awarding the project to a different consortium would mean a 15 month delay.

https://www.trm.dk/da/nyheder/2018/kammeradvokatens-gennemgang-af-udbud-af-storstroemsbroen


----------



## Grotlaufen

ChrisZwolle said:


> The national lawyer (Kammeradvokaten) has concluded that the contract for the Storstrøm Bridge replacement cannot be awarded to another company solely on the allegations and convictions of bribery and corruption alone.
> 
> However, one of the consortium's partners (Condotte) is in financial trouble. This should be sorted out before the contract will be signed.
> 
> Awarding the project to a different consortium would mean a 15 month delay.
> 
> https://www.trm.dk/da/nyheder/2018/kammeradvokatens-gennemgang-af-udbud-af-storstroemsbroen



I guess this is good news for a great deal of govt. workers and in financial department. The real need* for the bridge won't arise until the Fehmarnbelt tunnel gets finished, and at this rate the construction might start in 2019-2020 at earliest.


Anyways given the nature of the project itself (4 kms of length, double-track electrified railway and casual highway with bike lanes - over maritime climate with salt water) I do hope they'll re-do the bidding process even as this waste of time has costs in itself. 



* Yes I know about the dilapidated state of the current bridge, but as we're talking about connecting one of the poorest and least populated area of Denmark to Zealand the new bridge isn't much of a priority in itself either. Though I suppose it spoils the real estate market of Falster for a few more years as there'll never be a commuting distance of 1h to Copenhagen by train without this project.


----------



## MattiG

Grotlaufen said:


> I guess this is good news for a great deal of govt. workers and in financial department. The real need* for the bridge won't arise until the Fehmarnbelt tunnel gets finished, and at this rate the construction might start in 2019-2020 at earliest.
> 
> Anyways given the nature of the project itself (4 kms of length, double-track electrified railway and casual highway with bike lanes - over maritime climate with salt water) I do hope they'll re-do the bidding process even as this waste of time has costs in itself.


Such cases are not rare, because the competition is hard, and the public sector seems sometimes to be in a trouble with the local act of public contracts.

The selection of the contractor for the 10 km section Lohjanharju-Lohja of the motorway 1/E18 in Finland 15 years ago got succeeded no earlier than at the fourth round. The first three ones were rejected by the Market Court because some of the candidated appealed.

Some cases are quite desperate. Today, the Finnish company Lemminkäinen appealed against the Finnish Road Agency for the 75 million euro project to upgrade 23 km of the road 5. The justification: One of the eleven persons, which the winner had nominated to the project lead, is not fully qualified according to the spokesman of Lemminkäinen. (The company has experience about courts: nine years ago, it was convicted to penalties of 68 million euro for leading an asphalt cartel of seven companies.)


----------



## NordikNerd

*NEW SIGN for Local speed limits*

Local speed limits are being introduced along more places on the danish roads , these are often higher than the usual general speed limits on rural roads and motorways.

For example, on many rural roads you may drive 90 km/h compared to the the usual 80 km/h.

However, many places with local speed limits increase the risk of drivers being in doubt as to what the speed limit is.

This problem will now be solved with a new traffic sign according to the FDM.(Danish motorist organization)


----------



## ChrisZwolle

'end 90' means 80 then?


----------



## Heico-M

ChrisZwolle said:


> 'end 90' means 80 then?


Yes, it does, because 80 is the standard speed limit on Danish country roads. The "80" sign below is apparently meant as a reminder. 

The same applies inside cities when major roads have a higher speed limit than the standard 50, let us say 60. Then they have an "end 60" sign with a city sign below, as a reminder that you are inside the city speed limit zone.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Why not just install an '80' sign then?


----------



## g.spinoza

ChrisZwolle said:


> Why not just install an '80' sign then?


The same reason you don't wallpaper motorways with "130"... it's implicit.


----------



## Heico-M

ChrisZwolle said:


> Why not just install an '80' sign then?


In Germany we do just that ... (well, 100 in our case )


----------



## Attus

g.spinoza said:


> The same reason you don't wallpaper motorways with "130"


Actually the Dutch do it


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Only when there is change of speed limit. It is not repeated after every on-ramp, unless the speed limit is lower than the default 130.


----------



## Attus

NordikNerd said:


> This problem will now be solved with a new traffic sign according to the FDM.(Danish motorist organization)


Nice, but in my opinion unnecessery complicated. Something like that would do it without new signs.


----------



## MattiG

Heico-M said:


> Yes, it does, because 80 is the standard speed limit on Danish country roads. The "80" sign below is apparently meant as a reminder.
> 
> The same applies inside cities when major roads have a higher speed limit than the standard 50, let us say 60. Then they have an "end 60" sign with a city sign below, as a reminder that you are inside the city speed limit zone.


It would be nice if the new traffic signs were introduced in a coordinated manner as amendments to the Vienna Convention. That would be a more fruitful approach than every country inventing their own funny ones.


----------



## Attus

ChrisZwolle said:


> Only when there is change of speed limit. It is not repeated after every on-ramp, unless the speed limit is lower than the default 130.


It's repeated in every km-sign. OK, it's small, but it's there


----------



## OulaL

I really dislike the use of the "end of speed limit" sign when the speed limit actually gets lower. (And in Finnish planning instructions that is explicitly forbidden.)


----------



## 54°26′S 3°24′E

MattiG said:


> It would be nice if the new traffic signs were introduced in a coordinated manner as amendments to the Vienna Convention. That would be a more fruitful approach than every country inventing their own funny ones.


I could not agree more. And, as already mentioned, the new sign is completely unnecessary, simply using an ordinary 80 sign would be clearer, and is how this "problem" also is solved in Norway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Why is there no apparent development on the Frederikssund Motorway extension? Especially now with the Roskildefjord Crossing being under construction. You'd think that would be a priority. I haven't read any news for some time now.


----------



## kalaha

^^It is the same as a lot of other infrastructure projects: The EIA was completed along time ago, and now it is awaiting funding and a political agreement to continue the project.


----------



## Nikolaj

As Kalaha correctly states, there is a number of motorway projects ready to be launched, i.e. completed and approved, but yet not funded:


E45/E39: New link across the Limfjord, west of Aalborg
Route 26: First section of Viborg Motorway Aarhus-Hammel
E20/E45: Widening around Kolding
E20: Widening south of Odense
Route 23: Motorway all the way to Kalundborg
Route 17: the remaining sections to Frederikssund, mentioned by Chris
E47: Widening around Hørsholm
Route 54: Næstved Motorway

They won't go ahead until a new trenche of the Infrastructure Fund is allocated. The current Infrastructure Fund period is 2009-2020. A new Infrastructure Fund period is expected to be negotiated either this year or in 2019. Whether it will be for a 5 year period 2020-2025 or a 10 year period 2020-2030 is yet unknown. All other projects recently been initiated has been funded from other sources, i.e. widening of E20 on Western Funen from A/S Storebælts coffers.

In addition to the above mentioned projects, and a few other minor projects, some other projects, currently in the EIA process, will most likely be included in the next Infrastructure Fund period. They include:

New eastern ringway in Copenhagen (harbour tunnel)
Capacity expansion on the western motorways of Copenhagen
New Central Jutland Motorway Haderslev-Hobro via Billund
Widening of E45 in eastern Jutland (Vejle-Randers)


----------



## Nikolaj

*New 120 km/h speed limit on some motorways*

It was allready announced in the fall that some of the current 110 km/h section will have 130 km/h speed limit. Today it was further announced that some of the remaining 110 km/h sections will have a new 120 km/h speed limit.

Map with new speed limits:
https://www.trm.dk/-/media/files/pu...1/kort-hastighedsgraenser-paa-motorvejene.pdf


----------



## MattiG

Nikolaj said:


> They won't go ahead until a new trenche of the Infrastructure Fund is allocated. The current Infrastructure Fund period is 2009-2020. A new Infrastructure Fund period is expected to be negotiated either this year or in 2019. Whether it will be for a 5 year period 2020-2025 or a 10 year period 2020-2030 is yet unknown. All other projects recently been initiated has been funded from other sources, i.e. widening of E20 on Western Funen from A/S Storebælts coffers.


How does that Infrastructure Fund work? As soon as the new period begins, all projects are started in the same time? Or is there some governance procedure to prevent from activity peaks from happening?


----------



## Nikolaj

MattiG said:


> How does that Infrastructure Fund work? As soon as the new period begins, all projects are started in the same time? Or is there some governance procedure to prevent from activity peaks from happening?


It is a "virtual" fund, as it only exist on paper. The planned budget allocations for infrastructure investments for a period (5 or 10 years), are bundled together and allocated to a number of projects. The various projects are distributed over the period in order to keep a steay flow of investments. Actual funds for the various projects are then allocated on the annual budgets, according to this plan. 
The Ministry of Finance oversees that activity peaks are avoided. That is actaully the case right now, where Ministry of Finance are holding back available allocations from the current Infrastructure Fund period, as total public investments, according to the Ministry of Finance, is too high at the moment.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Motorway traffic continues to show strong growth. In 2017 there was a 4.1% growth in motorway travel. Since 2010, motorway travel has increased by almost a third, by 31.5%










I think there are a couple of reasons:

1) the economy. There is a strong correlation between economic growth and traffic growth. A strong economy means less unemployment, less underemployment, more business, more cargo transport, etc.
2) car ownership. The amount of cars in Denmark has grown by 19% since 2010, which is a really significant growth. I think this is partially a catch-up effect. Denmark's car ownership has traditionally lagged behind other countries in the region. 
3) more motorway mileage. Since 2010, almost 150 kilometers of new motorway opened to traffic. This represented a growth of almost 15% of the motorway network, so as a result, it means more travel is done on motorways. Earlier statistics also showed a much stronger traffic growth on motorways than on city streets and rural roads. 

There could be more effects. For example in the Netherlands, the amount of employed persons over 55 years of age has doubled to 1.6 million since 2006. This means there are 800,000 more commuters just due to this age group. Before 2006 people retired much earlier due to extensive (and now unaffordable) benefits. 

Another factor in the Netherlands is increased concentration of employment in larger cities. This means that people have to commute longer distances. In Denmark you can see that traffic growth was the strongest in the regions around the largest cities. In large countries like France or the United States, distances would become too great to commute and towns would just die if employment relocated, but in countries like the Netherlands or Denmark, commutes from rural areas to larger cities are more doable.


----------



## Grotlaufen

*Ny Storstrømsbro*

Contract was signed earlier today for the new Storstrømsbro. All three Italian companies were included but the most controversial one (Condotte is currently under reconstruction) has now only 0.01% of the ownership in the joint venture:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/storstroemsbro/nyheder/Sider/Kontrakten-p%C3%A5-Storstr%C3%B8msbroen-er-underskrevet.aspx

Construction starts in Autumn this year. The bridge opens for vehicle traffic in 2022, the double-track rail bridge in 2023 and from then onwards there'll be work on dismantling the old bridge.


----------



## MattiG

Grotlaufen said:


> Contract was signed earlier today for the new Storstrømsbro. All three Italian companies were included but the most controversial one (Condotte is currently under reconstruction) has now only 0.01% of the ownership in the joint venture:


Sounds a weird hidden agenda. Why would anyone join a joint venture with 0.01% ownership?

Perhaps it is something like this:


----------



## MichiH

MichiH said:


> *PR18:* Holstebro-North – Tvis 22km (May 2015 to May 2018) – project – map


To be opened in fall 2018 according to the project page.


----------



## Nikolaj

MichiH said:


> To be opened in fall 2018 according to the project page.


Correct. According to a press release today it will open 29. September 2018 http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/om...bromotorvejen-indvies-29.-september-2018.aspx


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Interesting how they have an exact date almost half a year in advance...


----------



## satanism

And was the messemotorvej expanded from junction 42 to where the new one starts?It used to be a 1+1 at its western side, towards Ringkøbing....


----------



## ChrisZwolle

According to May 2017 imagery in Google Earth, it has been resurfaced but not expanded.


----------



## dysharmonica

SeanT said:


> About time, but it won't be enough. Rush hour started around Solrød for 20 years ago. Now Køge junction.


Widening highways never eases rush hour traffic. Tryin to pretend otherwise is just wishful thinking and the waste of precious public money. 

Traffic in any city is self-leveling -- always annoying, but sort of moving ... if it gets much slower, more people switch to transit. If it gets easier, more people switch from transit ... so it always stays congested.


----------



## Uppsala

ChrisZwolle said:


> E20-E47 Køge - Ishøj-14 by European Roads, on Flickr


Note the downwards positioned arrows. In Germany and Sweden there are upwards positioned arrows.

Note the exitnumber that is 27 here. In Denmark they still dont have the European symbol for that. They are using this hexagon-shaped symbol instead. People from Germany and Sweden sometimes dont understand this is exitnumbers. They think this looks more like roadnumbers. They think sometimes this is road number 27, not exit number 27.

Germany and Sweden are using the European symbol for exitnumbers, but not Denmark.

I think this font and style of the signs looks more American than European


----------



## MattiG

Uppsala said:


> Note the downwards positioned arrows. In Germany and Sweden there are upwards positioned arrows.
> 
> Note the exitnumber that is 27 here. In Denmark they still dont have the European symbol for that. They are using this hexagon-shaped symbol instead. People from Germany and Sweden sometimes dont understand this is exitnumbers. They think this looks more like roadnumbers. They think sometimes this is road number 27, not exit number 27.
> 
> Germany and Sweden are using the European symbol for exitnumbers, but not Denmark.
> 
> I think this font and style of the signs looks more American than European


There is not such thing as an European exit symbol, even if several countries share a similar layout.


----------



## Chrismo1

The font is not american. The font is called “Dansk Vejtavleskrift” and is a modification of the British “Transport” font.


----------



## bongo-anders

There is a motorway in the pictures so I´m guessing I can post it here as well.

Its from the weekends lift of the station bridge at Køge Nord.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

60 million DKK / € 8 million has been allocated in the 2019 budget to start a feasibility study for the Kattegat Link. 

The Kattegat Link was deemed too expensive in a 2015 report, as it would require a 50 billion DKK investment from the government, as the project was too expensive to be paid by user fees entirely. However later in 2018 it was said that a road-only link would be feasible as a user fee funded project. 

So it appears that the Kattegat Link is moving forward as a road bridge or tunnel, not a combined road/rail link.

However this made me think about Danish road investment. It appears cyclical to me, with years with massive investment followed by years of low investment. What is the reason for this? 

For example in 2006-2007, 96 kilometers of motorway opened, followed by 31 km in 2008-2011 and then 81 kilometers in 2012-2014 and 45 km since.


----------



## MichiH

^^ http://cphpost.dk/news/government-takes-next-step-towards-kattegat-connection.html

It's minimum 70km.... :hmm:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

^^ This was the 2015 plan. Much less than 70 km, but impressive nonetheless.


----------



## Grotlaufen

I wouldn't count out a change back to the 2015 plan in the coming years though. Danish investments are often subject to changes in political swings and at least next year there will be a new election to the parliament (DK has no fixed term of office to national parliament but it has to be set at least in four years. The last date for an election will be in June 2019 as last election was in June 2015).


All new constructions have to pass through legislation in parliament in order to get approved (anlægslov). After that you have the funding issue which could also go either way depending on what the political majority looks like then. As a recent example the legislation for the new Storstrømsbroen was passed under the former center-left govt. in 2015. After the election of the new center-right govt. some of the new politicians in charge wanted to scrap funding for the new construction altogether which (luckily) in the end didn't happen.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> 60 million DKK / € 8 million has been allocated in the 2019 budget to start a feasibility study for the Kattegat Link.
> 
> The Kattegat Link was deemed too expensive in a 2015 report, as it would require a 50 billion DKK investment from the government, as the project was too expensive to be paid by user fees entirely. However later in 2018 it was said that a road-only link would be feasible as a user fee funded project.
> 
> So it appears that the Kattegat Link is moving forward as a road bridge or tunnel, not a combined road/rail link.
> 
> However this made me think about Danish road investment. It appears cyclical to me, with years with massive investment followed by years of low investment. What is the reason for this?
> 
> For example in 2006-2007, 96 kilometers of motorway opened, followed by 31 km in 2008-2011 and then 81 kilometers in 2012-2014 and 45 km since.


Correct observation. Part of the explanation (the most important i think) is that for the past many years infrastructure investments has been scheduled in 10 year periods - the ongoing period going from 2010-2019. A lot of project was planned and prepared before the start of this period, and at start of the period a lot of allready prepared projects were launched right away and completed (i.e. 2012-2014), and then investment funds for the period ran out.

We see the same thing happening right now. A new investment plan/period is expected to be launched in 2020, and right now we have quite a few projects alleready prepared and and ready to be launched, and some more being prepared and ready to be launched by 2020. Those projects includes:

*1. Allready completed planning/EIA approval (ready to be launched):*
-Widening of E20 across Western Funen (Nørre Aaby-Odense V) - funding allocated and construction starting 2019
-Widening of E20 south of Odense (Odense V - Odense SØ)
-Widening of E20/E45 around Kolding
-New Route 26 Viborg Motorway - sections Aarhus-Hammel and through Viborg
-New 3rd Limfjord motorway crossing (probably numbered E39) west of Aalborg
-Remaining sections of Kalundborg Motorway (route 23) - Knabstrup-Kalundborg
-Remaining sections of Frederikssund Motorway (route 17) - Tværvej-Frederikssund
-Widening of E47 Helsingørmotorway - Hørsholm S - Isterød
-New route 54 Næstved Motorway - Rønnede-Næstved 
-Full motorway on 2 short sections south (route 15) and north (route 18) of Herning

*2. In planning/EIA process - ready for launch in 2020*
-Widening to full motorway of Route 16 Hillerød Motorway - Allerød-Hillerød
-Widening of E45 in Eastern Jutland: Vejle N-Skanderborg S and Aarhus S-Randers N
-New central Jutland Motorway - southern section Haderslev-Billund-Give

*3. Early planning stage/feasibility - Not ready to be launched in 2020*
-Northern section of Central Jutland Motorway - Give-Viborg-Hobro
-Eastern Ringway Copenhagen/Harbour Tunnel
-2nd Øresund crossing (HH-connection)
-Continuation of the route 15 Djurslands motorway - Løgten Skødstrup
-NEW Kattegat Crossing - motorway Kalundborg-Aarhus (feasibility study starting in 2019)

*4.Very early planning stage (feasibility studies not yet launched/decided)*
-Extra capacity on Ringway 4 - Copenhagen
-New Ringway 5 in Copenhagen (or at least the southern section)
-Widening of Hillerød Motorway from E47 to Farum

*In addition a number of locally sponsored and promoted projects, but without and formal Road Directorate planning*
- Continuation of the Route 54 Motorway Næstved-Slagelse-Kalundborg
- New Motorway from Odense-Sønderborg, crossing Lillebælt

We would therefor most likely se the same happening from 2020, with a lot of new projects being launched in 2020 (1 and 2 listed projects) and completed before 2025, and then a more dry period with only some of the projects listed under 3 or 4 being completed 2025-2030.


----------



## 54°26′S 3°24′E

The proposed link is in the southern outskirts of Kattegat. When I first saw the name "Kategat Link" i though it was a link across the whole of Kategat, i.e. from Jutland to Sweden. That would have been an impressive feat, but of course not very realistic today.

BTW, if anyone is in doubt, the HBO-Kategat has nothing to do with the real Kategat. The former is a fictous town at the end of a narrow Norwegian fjord surrounded by mountains (see below), whereas the latter is a broad strait separating Jutland and the Swedish west coast, both being relatively flat.


----------



## devo

And, to shake things up even more, that scene isn't even from Norway, it's in Ireland. Though it is most likely entirely CGI, so much so that it doesn't look real even if it is blended with reality.

https://emerald-heritage.com/blog/2017/where-in-ireland-is-vikings-filmed

So that is a settlement, based on a strait between Denmark and Sweden, supposed to be in Norway but it's actually in Ireland. And we have to take care of the lost tourists trying to find these spots! :lol:

PS: The name Kattegat means "Somewhere the cat can sneak through", literally "Cat's gate".


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*E20/E47 Køge Bugt Motorvejen*

I made a video of the eight lane section of E20/E47 from Køge to Ishøj. The eight lane expansion was completed last year. 

Someone commented about how good the lane discipline is.


----------



## Ale92MilanoSpA_

Driving from Københavns Lufthavn to Roskilde (Denmark) 2.06.2018 Timelapse x4


----------



## ChrisZwolle

A groundbreaking ceremony for the new Storstrøm Bridge will be held on 27 September:

http://vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/om-os/...borgmestre-sætter-gang-i-Storstrømsbroen.aspx


----------



## belerophon

There is a small section around Kolding, where E20 and E45 use the same motorway. It has three lanes instead of two but was busy when i was there. Is that usual? Are there any plans? I heard of other norway-drivers that denmark usually is quite relaxing compared to germany. But we had a jam around Renders, and there is not much of an alternative, so i saw plans for an ring road there. So for me this jam was unusual, whilst the facts show more problems around Kolding on a regular basis. What do you think? TY.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Nikolaj recently posted about that:



Nikolaj said:


> *1. Allready completed planning/EIA approval (ready to be launched):*
> -Widening of E20/E45 around Kolding



I've been stuck in traffic near Kolding as well, especially on the E20/E45 merge (both from Aarhus and Odense). 

Did you drive during the weekend? Outside of Copenhagen it appears to me that motorways have heavier traffic during the weekend than on workdays, especially outside of rush hour. 

E20 and E45 have reached traffic volumes high enough that it begins to plug up traffic, not necessarily a huge traffic jam, but you can tell some sections are nearing capacity. Especially the four lane sections of E20 on Fyn and E45 Kolding - Aarhus - Aalborg.


----------



## Ale92MilanoSpA_

Driving from Roskilde to Helsingør (Denmark) 4.06.2018 Timelapse x4


----------



## belerophon

ChrisZwolle said:


> Nikolaj recently posted about that:
> 
> I've been stuck in traffic near Kolding as well, especially on the E20/E45 merge (both from Aarhus and Odense).
> 
> Did you drive during the weekend? Outside of Copenhagen it appears to me that motorways have heavier traffic during the weekend than on workdays, especially outside of rush hour.
> 
> E20 and E45 have reached traffic volumes high enough that it begins to plug up traffic, not necessarily a huge traffic jam, but you can tell some sections are nearing capacity. Especially the four lane sections of E20 on Fyn and E45 Kolding - Aarhus - Aalborg.


Well i am sorry. I see that nikolaj posted it, whild not explaining exactly, which section it should be. It might be a good idea to extend further south than E20, at least until Kolding south, where road 25 merges. 

I went to Hirtshals on Friday 7th and came back on sunday 16th. Going north there were more problems in denmark than in Germany. I went from Chemnitz over Leipzig, Berlin passing Hamburg at B404, which was a good idea. Starting at 5 in the morning, i was in denmark in the afternoon, where i lost 2 hours around Randers and other places without jam but just much traffic. 

It seemed obvious to me, that north of Aarhus things get better, after the division north of aalborg its fun driving. But of course also time passed by, i reached hirtshals in half past 6 pm...

The amount of trucks has an impact, but still there is space between. Once they fill a given amount of the right lane, everything slows down significantly. By now it is something in mechanical engineering is called Slip-Stick-Effect. I don't know how fast traffic is growing to argue when it will reach capacity, right now its useable.

Coming back, idrove until Hobro in saturday evening, which was of course no problem. On sunday i started quarter to 9 in the morning, so there was already enough traffic. Instead of trucks the caravans caused the problems, all going home, much more than in the northward direction before. I found, that sections with a 110kph limit are more peaceful, like i found out in switzerland before. 

I did not see much police, but the rules are more or less accepted. So the difference in speed is smaller. It takes a bit longer, but is more enjoyable driving. Also the danish seem to keep distance better than we do. 

For me this encouraged me again to think positive about speed limits. It must not be very low, but even a general limit of 160kph for germany would be a good idea, it could also be restricted to several hours a day.


----------



## Nikolaj

belerophon said:


> Well i am sorry. I see that nikolaj posted it, whild not explaining exactly, which section it should be. It might be a good idea to extend further south than E20, at least until Kolding south, where road 25 merges.
> 
> I went to Hirtshals on Friday 7th and came back on sunday 16th. Going north there were more problems in denmark than in Germany. I went from Chemnitz over Leipzig, Berlin passing Hamburg at B404, which was a good idea. Starting at 5 in the morning, i was in denmark in the afternoon, where i lost 2 hours around Randers and other places without jam but just much traffic.
> 
> It seemed obvious to me, that north of Aarhus things get better, after the division north of aalborg its fun driving. But of course also time passed by, i reached hirtshals in half past 6 pm...
> 
> The amount of trucks has an impact, but still there is space between. Once they fill a given amount of the right lane, everything slows down significantly. By now it is something in mechanical engineering is called Slip-Stick-Effect. I don't know how fast traffic is growing to argue when it will reach capacity, right now its useable.
> 
> Coming back, idrove until Hobro in saturday evening, which was of course no problem. On sunday i started quarter to 9 in the morning, so there was already enough traffic. Instead of trucks the caravans caused the problems, all going home, much more than in the northward direction before. I found, that sections with a 110kph limit are more peaceful, like i found out in switzerland before.
> 
> I did not see much police, but the rules are more or less accepted. So the difference in speed is smaller. It takes a bit longer, but is more enjoyable driving. Also the danish seem to keep distance better than we do.
> 
> For me this encouraged me again to think positive about speed limits. It must not be very low, but even a general limit of 160kph for germany would be a good idea, it could also be restricted to several hours a day.


The current EIA for widening around E20/E45 around Kolding, is only for the section between Kolding Vest and the split between E20 and E45 north of Kolding. The section between Kolding S (Route 25) and Kolding Vest is not part of the current planning, and widening is also not as urgent as the rest of the section around Kolding. Between Kolding S and Kolding Vest (2+2) the current 2018 AADT is 55.500 (avr. weekday traffic 58.000), whereas between Kolding Vest and E20/E45 split north of Kolding the AADT is 69.000 on the remaining 2+2 section and 85.500 on 3+3 sections (weekday avr. 72.700 and 93.200 respectively).


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Two major events are planned for this week.

This Thursday, 27 September, the groundbreaking ceremony will be held for the new Storstrøm Bridge, which is a major road/rail cable-stayed bridge.

>> Project site: http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/storstroemsbro/Sider/default.aspx


This Saturday, 29 September, the final 15 km section of the Holstebro Motorway (primary route 18) will be inaugurated. It is currently the largest greenfield motorway project in Denmark, to extend the motorway from Herning to Holstebro. It is already partially in service.

>> Project site: http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vejprojekter/holstebro-herning/Sider/default.aspx


----------



## korbendallas

And today, E45 between Skanderborg and Aarhus Syd opened in three lanes Northbound. Southbound will follow in two weeks.

The remarkable part is that the works started in January. As per the usual way of doing things, the final layer of asphalt is applied next summer.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*PR-16 Hillerød Motorway*

The environmental impact study (VVM) for the Primary Route 16 upgrade north of Copenhagen has been published.

PR-16 will be upgraded from 2+1 to a 2x2 motorway with a 110 km/h speed limit between Allerød and Hillerød. The road has a spatial reservation for a second carriageway on the east side along the entire route. All bridges over PR-16 have a second span.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*PR-18 Holstebro Motorway*

The second stage of the Holstebro Motorway (Primary Route 18) will be inaugurated today. Traffic opening is scheduled for tomorrow morning.










There is still a motorway section missing however, a portion of the Herning bypass between exits 15 and 17 has not been expanded to a motorway and is a two-lane express road. Perhaps this will be expanded at a later time.


----------



## satanism

Nope, what will be expanded is in fact Messemotorvejen, to the south.The northern part stays as is.


----------



## Nikolaj

satanism said:


> Nope, what will be expanded is in fact Messemotorvejen, to the south.The northern part stays as is.


That is not entirely correct. EIA/planning procedure has been carried out and completed/approved for as well the north-eastern Route 18 section as the southern Route 15 section, but no funding has yet been allocated to any of the two.
There is political pressure from Holstebro and the north western region for completion of the Route 18 section, as it is the most direct and shortest route, and from the Municipality of Herning for prioritizing the Route 15 section highest, as it is mostly in line with their urban planning. A likely outcome is that both sections will be funded in the same instance.


----------



## Nikolaj

Nikolaj said:


> That is not entirely correct. EIA/planning procedure has been carried out and completed/approved for as well the north-eastern Route 18 section as the southern Route 15 section, but no funding has yet been allocated to any of the two.
> There is political pressure from Holstebro and the north western region for completion of the Route 18 section, as it is the most direct and shortest route, and from the Municipality of Herning for prioritizing the Route 15 section highest, as it is mostly in line with their urban planning. A likely outcome is that both sections will be funded in the same instance.


At the inauguration ceremony on Saturday the Minister of Finance, who has his constituency in that region, promised that completion of the Route 18 section (the north eastern) will be included in the next Infrastructure Investment Plan (to be approved after next years general election) https://dagbladet-holstebro-struer....til-at-betale-hel-motorvejshul/artikel/383889


----------



## satanism

That makes the most sense anyway, especially since the interchange southeast of Herning has quite a bad profile for the north flowing traffic, so no one in their right mind will deviate if they are going towards Holstebro.
That being said, the initial plan was to upgrade the southern route and leave the northern as is.It is also why the interchange where those two merge was constructed in a way, giving priority and leading traffic to the western bypass.


----------



## Nikolaj

satanism said:


> That makes the most sense anyway, especially since the interchange southeast of Herning has quite a bad profile for the north flowing traffic, so no one in their right mind will deviate if they are going towards Holstebro.
> That being said, the initial plan was to upgrade the southern route and leave the northern as is.It is also why the interchange where those two merge was constructed in a way, giving priority and leading traffic to the western bypass.


Not quite correct either. At completion of the EIA/planning process in 2012 the official recommendation of Vejdirektoratet to the Ministry of Transport http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...ndstilling rute 18- Hovedforslag 05122012.pdf was to construct the Route 18 Motorway all the way from the Herning North exit 15 (thus widening the current 1+1 expressway from Hernng N to Tjørring) until Holstebro South and then widen the remaining section of old Route 18 and current ringroad around Holstebro to a dual carriageway, and construct the western ring in Herning as an ordinary 1+1 road only. However on the political side it was first of all decided to construct the motorway all the way to Holstebro North, and secondly construct the western ring in Herning as a motorway (which is and was completely overkill with an AADT of only 3.000-5.000 on that section - but politics..). As the overall budget for the Holstebro Motorway was more or less fixed, other saving was needed, and it was then decided to leave the Route 18 northeast of Herning as it was, for the time being.http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...aftale om linjeføring for Holstebromotorvejen[1].pdf

But how they are going to cope with the the current exit 17 at Tjørring when Route 18 around Herning is widened is a valid question.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

satanism said:


> That makes the most sense anyway, especially since the interchange southeast of Herning has quite a bad profile for the north flowing traffic, so no one in their right mind will deviate if they are going towards Holstebro.


It's not ideal indeed:


----------



## Nikolaj

satanism said:


> That document you cited there has a total of 5 alternatives, none of which suggested expansion of both southwest and northeast bypasses to motorway standards so this must be a newer development, hence the problem with the interchanges main direction they have now.
> http://www.falkenvig.dk/upl/9232/MotorvejAlleforslag.pdf As i mentioned in the past, based on what we see completed in this very moment, i'd say alternative 4 was picked from those as the initial game plan.


Not quite sure what you mean. The first document cited is the Road Directorate/Vejdirektoratet recommendation to the Ministry of Transport, recommending only one alternative: Motorway from Herning N to Holstebro S and 1+1 road as Herning western bypass (and not including upgrading Holstebro ringroad to 2+2 as I wrongly wrote in last post).

The second document http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/ve...ndstilling rute 18- Hovedforslag 05122012.pdf was supposed to be the political decision reached April 2013, where the politicians cherry-picked between various alternatives analyzed in the EIA analysis. What they picked is closest to Alternative 4 in the document you have cited, BUT without upgrading the existing Route 15 south of Herning to Motorway. In the political decision is was noted that some of the politicans behind the agreement wanted an upgrade of Route 18 northeast of Herning to full motorway, but accepted that funding was not available for that. A future upgrading of neither Route 15 nor Route 18 was mentioned in the political agreement.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Neither bypass of Herning has been designed to accommodate a future motorway;

* Primary Route 15 (Messemotorvejen) has several overpasses not long enough to span a motorway. In addition, the Route 15/18 interchange is substandard, a full build-out (making it the through route) would be very expensive)

* Primary Route 18 (Midtjyske motorvej) has three ecoducts only sufficient for two lanes. In addition, no overpasses are long enough to span 2x2 lanes. 

So both upgrades are expensive. Upgrading the Route 15/18 interchange can be done in several ways, cheaply by adding a second lane and maybe addressing some of the curvature (especially south > west), or completely rebuilding the interchange by taking 2x2 lanes at high speed from south to west.


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> Neither bypass of Herning has been designed to accommodate a future motorway;
> 
> * Primary Route 15 (Messemotorvejen) has several overpasses not long enough to span a motorway. In addition, the Route 15/18 interchange is substandard, a full build-out (making it the through route) would be very expensive.
> 
> * Primary Route 18 (Midtjyske motorvej) has three ecoducts only sufficient for two lanes. In addition, no overpasses are long enough to span 2x2 lanes.
> 
> So both upgrades are expensive. Upgrading the Route 15/18 interchange can be done in several ways, cheaply by adding a second lane and maybe addressing some of the curvature (especially south > west), or completely rebuilding the interchange by taking 2x2 lanes at high speed from south to west.


I fully agree with you Chris, and have many times wondered what on earth they have been thinking.

I agree with you on the observations concerning Route 15 (Messemotorvejen) where at least a bicycle path bridge and the overpass of Dronningens Boulevard has to be reconstructed. The southwestern bypass has never been intended to be the main throughfare towards Holstebro (at lest not by Vejdirektoratet), and i think the Route 15/Route 18 interchange at Herning Syd therefore is adequate. I don't think the curvature will be in need of change as long the speed limit is kept at 110 km/h.

On the Route 18 - the northern bypass - there will be some expensive reconstruction of three ecoducts (with a wider median the existing could be re-used, and then another ecoduct build next to it for the other carriageway), and overpasses of Trehøjevej, Sikjærvej, Sebbesandvej and Trælundvej and a bicyclepath overpass will have to be reconstructed. On the Route 18/Route 502 interchange at Tjørring, I think the northern carriageway of Route 18 and southern carriageway of Route 502 (Messemotorvejen) will be kept as they are. There is plenty of space between those two carriageways 
https://www.google.com/maps/@56.1953267,8.8879214,1786m/data=!3m1!1e3 to construct a new Y-shaped interchange like the one at Kolding (E45/E20) https://www.google.dk/maps/@55.5468389,9.5323558,1253m/data=!3m1!1e3
All it takes is one single bridge carrying the southern carriageway of Route 18 cross the northern carriageway of Route 502. Note that the overpass of Schæfervej seems to have been prepared for more and wider carriageways. https://www.google.com/maps/@56.196...4!1sE5j2bgo2eKQwLeabEws9IA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656


----------



## SeanT

http://imgur.com/gallery/TXalE5V


----------



## Ale92MilanoSpA_

Driving from Taastrup to Københavns Lufthavn (Denmark) 9.06.2018 Timelapse x4


----------



## lambersart2005

I have the impression that rush hour in metro Copenhagen has become much more intense than a few years ago. I’ve been following google maps for quite some time now. Is it just a subjective impression or do figures actually show an increase? Why would this be so? Just the economy?


----------



## korbendallas

lambersart2005 said:


> I have the impression that rush hour in metro Copenhagen has become much more intense than a few years ago. I’ve been following google maps for quite some time now. Is it just a subjective impression or do figures actually show an increase? Why would this be so? Just the economy?


Cheaper cars, and the economy. In the last few years, both Køge Bugt and Helsingørmotorvejen has been expanded.

It's not just subjective either. There's been an overall increase of 32% in the last ten years.

See this article: Here, and the report page 17, for 10 year growth in traffic.


----------



## metacatfry

lambersart2005 said:


> I have the impression that rush hour in metro Copenhagen has become much more intense than a few years ago. I’ve been following google maps for quite some time now. Is it just a subjective impression or do figures actually show an increase? Why would this be so? Just the economy?


There's an underlying trend in society that everyone travels more km every year that has been going on for essentially hundreds of years. i cannot really explain why that is except vaguely point to increased transportation capability and wider affluence.
the public transport system in and around Copenhagen, which has been defined by the famous finger plan suince the 70ies, has come up against capacity constraints for many years now, and in combination with other factors people have taken to personal vehicles in greater numbers.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

What about housing prices? 

The Netherlands has seen a dramatic reduction in housing affordability in the largest cities in the years following the crisis, with house prices increasing by 25% over the past 3 years, with year-on-year prices increasing by 10% in recent months, pushing buyers farther from the city. In my city of 126,000 people, the average price per m² increased by a stunning 20% in just one year.

I think this will be a main driver for congestion growth in the Netherlands in the coming years. Almost nobody can afford to buy a house in or near the major cities. A recent report said that an median income means you can't afford 90% of the houses on the market.


----------



## metacatfry

^^ Yes definitely. Nowadays it is fairly normal to commute from Helsinge or Ringsted to Copenhagen everyday, but, of course the people who do this would not do so if they could get the same kind of housing at the same price closer to work.
There is a bubble in property due to the very low costs of loans, and limited new supply within Copenhagen.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Øresund Bridge*

I found out that another payment option has been added to the Øresund Bridge: pre-payment ticket.

https://www.oresundsbron.com/en/cash-ticket

An online ticket for passenger cars saves DKK 30 per journey compared to payment at the toll station. All you need to do is to provide the registration number of your vehicle and use the green lanes. You have to buy your online ticket at least 30 minutes before you drive through the toll station at the Øresund Bridge. You will receive your online ticket by email.​
30 DKK = € 4, but the English page shows a price of € 47 as opposed to the standard € 52 crossing if you pay by card or cash.

I'm definitely going to use this next time.


----------



## General Maximus

What's it like at those toll booths? Busy? Quiet? I've never used any of those toll bridges. When going to Sweden I find it faster and cheaper to use the ferries from Puttgarden to Roedby and Helsingor to Helsingborg.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Both the Great Belt Bridge and Øresund Bridge have only 1 cash lane. The Great Belt Bridge has 5 card lanes and a number of transponder landes. The Øresund Bridge has 3 or 4 card lanes. 

So it doesn't take much traffic to result in some queuing, though most Danish drivers have a transponder. 

One time I took the credit card lane and it measured my small car as a large van (which has twice the rate). I found it shocking how their sensors would mistaken a Hyundai i10 for a Ford Transit size van. But I got my money back.


----------



## General Maximus

Yes, rates on French roads are based on height as well. SANEF has no problems detecting the height of a class 2 vehicle (standard panel vans), however, VINCI often has problems measuring heights, resulting in beeping angry Frenchmen behind me, as it sometimes takes up to a few minutes. It has happened that I took my book out while waiting.

In Austria, ASFINAG rates are based on weight. When going through a manned toll booth, they often require to see documents, as they still haven't figured out that a Sprinter van is <3.5T.


----------



## korbendallas

I haven't experienced more than 30 seconds waiting time on either. And it's usually without stopping in the transponder lanes. No clue about the cash lane, but Danes and Swedes love their credit cards and transponders.


----------



## Ale92MilanoSpA_

Driving through Region Sjælland (Denmark) from Gåbense to Bogø 5.06.2018 Timelapse x4


----------



## g.spinoza

How is Fehmarn fixed link coming? I heard there are some bureaucracy issues...


----------



## ChrisZwolle

It's still awaiting final approval on the German side. 

You can read between the lines that the Danish are fed up with the bureaucratic mess in Germany. The Danish plan approval was completed 5 years ago.


----------



## MichiH

g.spinoza said:


> How is Fehmarn fixed link coming? I heard there are some bureaucracy issues...


It was announced that the plan approval supplement procedure will be finished by the end of 2018 but there was a press release from 1st November: https://www.schleswig-holstein.de/D...18/181101_FBQ_Aenderungen_Planunterlagen.html

The documents for the 2nd plan approval supplement modification was laid out in December 2017 but I really don't know what the hell a "correction and supplement to the supplement modification" means.... These documents lay out till 23rd November 2018... hno:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Things are really messy in Schleswig-Holstein. Under the previous SPD-led government, projects like A20, Elbe crossing and A21 extension have seen almost no progress. Not a single plan approval has been issued for A20 despite earlier plans to have the entire route approved by 2010.

Only the A7 PPP is going more or less as scheduled. Some others have required dramatically long construction times, such as a the A23 completion at Itzehoe (9.5 years) and the renovation of the Canal Tunnel in Rendsburg which was planned to take 2.5 years but is now going into the 9th year of construction. They seemed to have absolutely no clue what they were getting into. hno:


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> Things are really messy in Schleswig-Holstein. Under the previous SPD-led government, projects like A20, Elbe crossing and A21 extension have seen almost no progress. Not a single plan approval has been issued for A20 despite earlier plans to have the entire route approved by 2010.


The application for the building permit for the Fehmarn fixed link tells a lot: The application sent to the Danish authorities consisted of 1500 pages and to the German ones no less than 11,000 pages.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The updated German plan approval even included 14,000 pages in 40 ring binders.


----------



## General Maximus

Has anyone told the Germans to get a move on? Has a complaint been filed? EU perhaps?


----------



## MichiH

^^ Again, German authorities claim that it is because of EU!

Because of EU laws which seem to be fulfilled quite accurate (or too accurate)


----------



## devo

Ordnung muss sein.


----------



## Ale92MilanoSpA_

Driving through Region Sjælland (Denmark) from Bogø to Køge 5.06.2018 Timelapse x4


----------



## ChrisZwolle

A 1959 highway map of Denmark showing the old road numbering.


----------



## Grotlaufen

^^Nice map. It also shows the most prioritised routes of that era - A1 across the land from Esbjerg (with ferries to England) - Copenhagen/Elsinore across the Great Belt and along the coast of the Sound, A2 Copenhagen-Gedser with ferries to both Germanies in Grossenbrode (FRG) and Warnemünde (GDR), A6 as the by-pass of Copenhagen for traffic going to and from Elsinore (with ferries to Helsingborg in Sweden). And A10 as the back-bone throughout the eastern Jutland.


One thing I wonder about this numbering though - Did the A2 change in 1963 with the opening of the Fehmarn ferry connection (Rødby-Puttgarden)? From that time onwards the ferries between Gedser-Grossenbrode ceased and Gedser became a much less important port for the traffic to GDR. I'd imagine A2 would have its start/end point moved from Gedser then.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

They plan to roll out another 270 kilometers of truck passing bans on motorways with 2 lanes in each direction. It will mostly affect E45.

Red = current passing ban
Blue = proposed passing ban


----------



## sbondorf

Grotlaufen said:


> One thing I wonder about this numbering though - Did the A2 change in 1963 with the opening of the Fehmarn ferry connection (Rødby-Puttgarden)? From that time onwards the ferries between Gedser-Grossenbrode ceased and Gedser became a much less important port for the traffic to GDR. I'd imagine A2 would have its start/end point moved from Gedser then.


That would've been logical, but apparently it did not happen. I have a 1976 map on which the Gedser route is still A2. On that map the Rødby motorway is E4 without an A designation. My guess is that the situation stayed like this until the A routes disappeared in the 80s.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Here are the 2020 traffic volumes of the Great Belt Bridge and the Øresund Bridge. You can see that the Øresund Bridge is impacted much more by the travel restrictions than the Great Belt Bridge.


----------



## 54°26′S 3°24′E

I am actually a bit surprised that the decrease at Øresund was not larger, but I guess there has been somewhat less restrictions on the Dk-S than the S-N through 2020.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Fehmarn Belt Tunnel progress:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The main scenario for the Helsingør - Helsingborg Link between Denmark and Sweden.

Väg = road
Järnväg = railroad


----------



## MichiH

ChrisZwolle said:


> The main scenario for the Helsingør - Helsingborg Link between Denmark and Sweden.


What does it mean? Has a feasibility study been published? Has any euthusiast just drawn a line on a map?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

It's the map from the feasibility study. It's called the 'main scenario' because no official position has been taken yet, so it's not a preferred / selected alternative. This is up to government evaluation.


----------



## earth intruder

dysharmonica said:


> Ugh. Wasted money.


Why? And that's based on what? Any date to support your statement?


----------



## riiga

MichiH said:


> What does it mean? Has a feasibility study been published? Has any euthusiast just drawn a line on a map?


Here is the document. (PDF)

(From Fast förbindelse mellan Helsingör och Helsingborg)


----------



## 54°26′S 3°24′E

The report has interestingly alternating chapters in Swedish and Danish. For Norway, and most of Sweden, realization of this project would of course be positive, as it not only would mean a shortcut to the Danish capital region, but also together with the Fehmarn Belt the European continent would get closer.

It seems like the study believes in the economy of the motorway tunnel, but subsidies are needed for the railway.


----------



## MattiG

54°26′S 3°24′E said:


> The report has interestingly alternating chapters in Swedish and Danish. For Norway, and most of Sweden, realization of this project would of course be positive, as it not only would mean a shortcut to the Danish capital region, but also together with the Fehmarn Belt the European continent would get closer.
> 
> It seems like the study believes in the economy of the motorway tunnel, but subsidies are needed for the railway.


I believe that the business case should be evaluated very carefully. The route would save about 40 kilometers only to the Öresund bridge when arriving via E6 from Gothenburg or E4 from Stockholm. The saving of the Fehmarn tunnel is about 150 km if driving to the south of Hamburg. Because the current ferry connection represents quite a short delay, especially in the summertime when there are departures every 15 minutes, I do not believe that there would be a dramatic shift from the brigde to the HH tunnel.


----------



## Ingenioren

Unfortunatly another tunnel, why do they always want tunnel when they can have another shiny megabridge...


----------



## MattiG

Ingenioren said:


> Unfortunatly another tunnel, why do they always want tunnel when they can have another shiny megabridge...


As it is not possible to reserve large land areas for approaches in the cities, something like this would be needed to reach the minimum vertical clearance of 70 meters.


----------



## 54°26′S 3°24′E

MattiG said:


> I believe that the business case should be evaluated very carefully. The route would save about 40 kilometers only to the Öresund bridge when arriving via E6 from Gothenburg or E4 from Stockholm. The saving of the Fehmarn tunnel is about 150 km if driving to the south of Hamburg. Because the current ferry connection represents quite a short delay, especially in the summertime when there are departures every 15 minutes, I do not believe that there would be a dramatic shift from the brigde to the HH tunnel.


Would not also Helsingør-Helsingborg offer more options during rush-hour?


----------



## sbondorf

MattiG said:


> I believe that the business case should be evaluated very carefully. The route would save about 40 kilometers only to the Öresund bridge when arriving via E6 from Gothenburg or E4 from Stockholm. The saving of the Fehmarn tunnel is about 150 km if driving to the south of Hamburg. Because the current ferry connection represents quite a short delay, especially in the summertime when there are departures every 15 minutes, I do not believe that there would be a dramatic shift from the brigde to the HH tunnel.


A faster route from Gothenburg to Germany is not the primary business case for the HH link - long distance traffic will never dominate the traffic flows here.

Shortening regional routes and freeing up capacity on other roads is what really makes a difference here. For example: The link will shorten the public transport journey time from Helsingborg to Copenhagen by around 23 minutes, effectively putting these two cities within reasonable commuter distance. That is new!
Generally, the northern parts of Sjælland and Scania will be brought much closer to each other. This will generate new traffic on one hand, but on the other hand a substantial part of the already existing car journeys can be shortened by shifting them north from the Øresund bridge to the new link. This will free up road capacity and reduce energy consumption.


----------



## Ingenioren

MattiG said:


> As it is not possible to reserve large land areas for approaches in the cities, something like this would be needed to reach the minimum vertical clearance of 70 meters.


I understand a lot of demolition would be required in Högasten if a bridge were to be built on the suggested tunnels route, i'm more frustrated by the Fehmarn one. Hopefully we will see a megabridge on the Kattegat project


----------



## ChrisZwolle

A contractor has been selected to widen the last 13 kilometers of E20 west of Odense, between Nørre Aaby and Arup. This is the second stage of the E20 widening west of Odense. The widening will be completed in two stages in 2021 and 2022.









Entreprenør er valgt til udbygning af den sidste etape af Fynske Motorvej


Der er nu valgt entreprenør til udbygning af den sidste etape af den Vestfynske Motorvej. Det bliver M. J. Eriksson A/S, der skal udbygge de cirka 13 km motorvej mellem Nørre Aaby og Gribsvad.



www.vejdirektoratet.dk


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Automatisk fartkontrol på vej til Storebælt og Øresund


<p>Hvis du kører for stærkt på vej over Storebælt eller Øresund, vil du i fremtiden blive fanget på Rigspolitiets kamerarulle.</p>




www.trm.dk





Average speed checks are coming to the Great Belt Bridge and Øresund Bridge in 2022. The speed limit on these bridges is 110 km/h.

An average speed check was announced years back for the Drogden Tunnel (near Øresund Bridge) but I'm not sure if they actually implemented it. The last time I drove there, there were many locals going way over the speed limit.

In my experience of driving back and forth across both bridges every other year, people do tend to speed a bit on the bridges. The Øresund Brige has low traffic volumes, the Great Belt Bridge - while busier - tends to be a less busy stretch of motorway than E20 on both Fyn and Sjælland.


----------



## devo

ChrisZwolle said:


> Automatisk fartkontrol på vej til Storebælt og Øresund
> 
> 
> <p>Hvis du kører for stærkt på vej over Storebælt eller Øresund, vil du i fremtiden blive fanget på Rigspolitiets kamerarulle.</p>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.trm.dk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Average speed checks are coming to the Great Belt Bridge and Øresund Bridge in 2022. The speed limit on these bridges is 110 km/h.
> 
> An average speed check was announced years back for the Drogden Tunnel (near Øresund Bridge) but I'm not sure if they actually implemented it. The last time I drove there, there were many locals going way over the speed limit.
> 
> In my experience of driving back and forth across both bridges every other year, people do tend to speed a bit on the bridges. The Øresund Brige has low traffic volumes, the Great Belt Bridge - while busier - tends to be a less busy stretch of motorway than E20 on both Fyn and Sjælland.


I'm curious regarding one thing (I think Denmark administers the entire Øresund bridge) but would you get fined in SEK speeding in one direction and DKK in the other? Or would there be a brief change on the border? I mean technically you could argue that you were speeding in the other country's section... or would you get fined in both SEK and DKK or does the cameras operate on the Danish part of the bridge only? Makes you think.


----------



## Nikolaj

devo said:


> I'm curious regarding one thing (I think Denmark administers the entire Øresund bridge) but would you get fined in SEK speeding in one direction and DKK in the other? Or would there be a brief change on the border? I mean technically you could argue that you were speeding in the other country's section... or would you get fined in both SEK and DKK or does the cameras operate on the Danish part of the bridge only? Makes you think.


As far as traffic regulation Denmark only administers as far as the state border, which is located in the middle of the cable-stayed bridge to the east of Saltholm. In both directions you will get fined in DKK on the Danish side, and SEK on the Swedish side (in both directions).
As far as maintenance etc. of the bridge, it is administered by the owner, Danish-Swedish Øresund Bridge Consortium owned 50/50 by respective Danish and Swedish state-owned companies.


----------



## devo

Nikolaj said:


> As far as traffic regulation Denmark only administers as far as the state border, which is located in the middle of the cable-stayed bridge to the east of Saltholm. In both directions you will get fined in DKK on the Danish side, and SEK on the Swedish side (in both directions).
> As far as maintenance etc. of the bridge, it is administered by the owner, Danish-Swedish Øresund Bridge Consortium owned 50/50 by respective Danish and Swedish state-owned companies.


I guess the split makes sense somehow but it would mean a change at the border.

The reason for the comment about Denmark administering the bridge is because of the Danish road edge markers which continues all the way until a bit after the Swedish toll booths far inside Sweden. 
I believe this technicality has been discussed here on the forum before. The marker can be seen here looking back in the westbound direction, there is another pair going east until the Swedish style edge markers begin (under the gantry):









Google Maps


Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.




goo.gl


----------



## milipumba

The government has approved the widening from 2 to 3 lanes(or from 4 to 6 ud you will) on the following motorways:

E45 from Vejle Nord to Skanderborg syd ca 38 km.

E45 from Aarhus syd to Aarhus Nord ca 16 km.
Plus the first part of highway 15 to Skejby.

Around Copenhagen will E47(03) be extended to 4 lanes (or 8). They will use the hard shoulder to do so. Plus they will make the lanes shorter, and by that reduce the speed limit to 90 km/h(from 110)

The extension of the Hillerød motorway(16), from Allerød syd to Hillerød.
Will be extended from a 2+1 highway to a propper 2 lane motorway.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

milipumba said:


> Around Copenhagen will E47(03) be extended to 4 lanes (or 8). They will use the hard shoulder to do so. Plus they will make the lanes shorter, and by that reduce the speed limit to 90 km/h(from 110)


Probably a compensation for scrapping the reserve for Motorring 5?


----------



## milipumba

The first part of the Funen motorway E20
Extension between Gribsvad(55) and Nørre Aaby (57), is opening ca 4 month before before time.

By august(the lastest) will the part between Nørre Aaby(57) and Ejby(56) be ready for 3x3 lanes. 
The rest will be done by November/December.
And by then will there be 3 lanes, all the way from Odense V(53) to Fredericia V(60).


----------



## Nikolaj

ChrisZwolle said:


> Probably a compensation for scrapping the reserve for Motorring 5?


It wasn't the government approving the various motorway projects yesterday, but parliament which through approval of a construction bill approved a government proposal, and by that also allocating an appropriation for the projects. Approving the construction bill was also an implementation of first part of the large Infrastructure Plan 2035 agreed by all parties parliament last June. All major projects in Denmark has to be approved by parliament through a construction bill.

Widening Motorring 3 to 4+4, by using the hard shoulders was part of last years 2035 plan, and came before the proposal to scrap Motorring 5. Scrapping Motorring 5 is still just a proposal from parties outside the government, and not yet approved by government. But the last thing is probably only a matter of time.


----------



## Søren L

Here are the schedules for the E45 widenings that were approved yesterday: 

For those who don't understand Danish:
Both projects will be finished in the end of 2026 with the finishing touches (including top layer asphalt) to be done in the warm months of 2027

E45 Aarhus S - Aarhus N:



















E45 Vejle - Skanderborg 

















Sources: 
(Vejdirektoratet project pages - Vejdirektoratet.dk --> Projekter --> Find projekt)

Direct links to sources:
Aarhus S - Aarhus N
Vejle - Skanderborg


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Søren L said:


> Both projects will be finished in the end of 2026 with the finishing touches (including top layer asphalt) to be done in the warm months of 2027


I've noticed this is somewhat of a routine in Denmark. But why is that? I don't see this regularly in other countries, the top layer of asphalt is usually not as much work.

Especially with the lack of early winters nowadays you can pave roads quite far into fall, even in Germany they do this until November or December.

The Danish road construction is also seemingly quite cyclic: periods of many widening and new construction projects are followed up by a number of years with low activity. It was discussed earlier that this is due to the Danish political approval cycles. But it may not be so favorable for the construction sector to have to deal with uneven demand.


----------



## 54°26′S 3°24′E

I think it is quite common also in Norway to establish the top / wear layer after a year or two. I am not a road engineer, but I suspect it is done to let the foundations / base layers settle properly, which probably is more of an issue in colder regions. Another explanation (probably more likely, when thinking about it) could be that they want to roughen up the second top layer a bit before adding the top layer, to increase adhesion and hence durability of the top layer. With studded tires, repeated freeze / thawing, and snow chains, road wear is a much larger problem up here than in areas without winter. But all of this is just speculations from a layman ;-)


----------



## Nikolaj

Some of the projects in recent years have only been completed, except for the top layer, a few days before christmas, and correctly it is not only the top layer, but also repair of the second layer before adding the top layer. It is therefore a bit more than a top layer, where January is not the best time.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Traffic statistics of the Øresund Bridge: Øresundsbron

Traffic is rebounding quite quickly after two years with depressed traffic volumes due to the pandemic. Daily traffic volumes dropped from 20,000 in 2019 to around 12,000 in 2020 and 2021. However April 2022 shows an average of over 17,000 vehicles per day, with traffic volumes in April 2022 being 89% higher than April 2021.


----------



## MattiG

54°26′S 3°24′E said:


> I think it is quite common also in Norway to establish the top / wear layer after a year or two. I am not a road engineer, but I suspect it is done to let the foundations / base layers settle properly, which probably is more of an issue in colder regions. Another explanation (probably more likely, when thinking about it) could be that they want to roughen up the second top layer a bit before adding the top layer, to increase adhesion and hence durability of the top layer. With studded tires, repeated freeze / thawing, and snow chains, road wear is a much larger problem up here than in areas without winter. But all of this is just speculations from a layman ;-)


The first one is the most correct analysis. Like in Norway, it is a standard procedure in Finland to put the final layer next year of the year after that. It takes time for the foundation to settle down, and the melting frost in the springtime delays the process.

The top asphalt layer usually is different from the bottom ones. Its material mix is optimized for durability while the lower layers are for strength.


----------



## Nikolaj

MattiG said:


> The first one is the most correct analysis. Like in Norway, it is a standard procedure in Finland to put the final layer next year of the year after that. It takes time for the foundation to settle down, and the melting frost in the springtime delays the process.
> 
> The top asphalt layer usually is different from the bottom ones. Its material mix is optimized for durability while the lower layers are for strength.


You don't ever see studded tires or snowchains in Denmark (and very little snow), and therefore certainly not part of the answer. It is quote simple. December/January is not the best session in Denmark for repairing the base layer and applying the final layer, and when the major widening Works are completed in mid December, the final works are therefore postponed to April.


----------



## MattiG

Nikolaj said:


> You don't ever see studded tires or snowchains in Denmark (and very little snow), and therefore certainly not part of the answer. It is quote simple. December/January is not the best session in Denmark for repairing the base layer and applying the final layer, and when the major widening Works are completed in mid December, the final works are therefore postponed to April.


The reason for the procedure in Finland is not studded tires but the possible deformation of the foundation. The final layer makes the deformed surface even again.

The climate might make differences in standards. In the arctic areas, the foundation usually is more than 100 centimeters thick, consisting of various types of crushed rock and insulation layers. Such a thick structure takes time to settle down even if road rollers are in an intensive use.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

*Fehmarnbelt tunnel achieve an important milestone in dredging operations*
_
*Dredging operations for the 18 km Fehmarnbelt tunnel to Germany have achieved a major mile-stone. 50 per cent of the tunnel trench for the immersed tunnel in the Fehmarnbelt has now been dredged.*

The Dutch consortium, FBC, who are responsible for dredging the tunnel trench, are using some of the world’s largest dredgers plus barges, tugs and other specialist vessels. Some 1,200 tunnel workers are now engaged in the construction of the immersed tunnel and the tunnel factory at Rødbyhavn. 

According to the plan, up to 19 million cubic metres will be dredged from the seabed. Most of the material will be reused east and west of Rødbyhavn and on Fehmarn on the German side to create new nature and recreational areas. 

Dredging operations for the Fehmarnbelt tunnel got underway in July 2021 and are expected to be completed in 2024. This will be followed by the immersion of the first tunnel element._

Press release: Fehmarnbelt tunnel achieve an important milestone in dredging operations


----------



## Nikolaj

MattiG said:


> The climate might make differences in standards. In the arctic areas, the foundation usually is more than 100 centimeters thick, consisting of various types of crushed rock and insulation layers. Such a thick structure takes time to settle down even if road rollers are in an intensive use.


But not applicable in Denmark. Not arctic area, and crushed rocks not used in foundation at all (we don't have rocks). Sand and gravel are used in the foundation.


----------



## 54°26′S 3°24′E

Nikolaj said:


> (we don't have rocks)


Not correct ;-)


----------



## MattiG

Nikolaj said:


> But not applicable in Denmark. Not arctic area, and crushed rocks not used in foundation at all (we don't have rocks). Sand and gravel are used in the foundation.


As you might see, my comment was a reply to a previous comment that had expanded the scope of the thread to cover Norway and other comparable areas. Such things happen.


----------



## The Wild Boy

Sorry for going off - topic, but how would concrete instead of asphalt work in areas with colder climate?


----------



## MattiG

The Wild Boy said:


> Sorry for going off - topic, but how would concrete instead of asphalt work in areas with colder climate?


No-go. The foundation always deforms. Asphalt is elastic material and it survives small movements but concrete cracks. Having DDR-like concrete slabs is not an option, because the seams make noise and traveling is pretty uncomfortable.

There were a number of tests on the Finnish roads in the past decades, and everyone more or less failed. The most ambitious one was a four-kilometer test section on the new motorway 3/E12. The pavement was supposed to last 40 years. However, the stretch got repaved by asphalt after 13 years, because the surface was in a miserable condition. The Road Administration told that maintaining the concrete surface is ten times more expensive than asphalt. The result was a big disappointment, and it put an end to the era of concrete roads.

It became clear that concrete is not good on resisting studded tires, salt on roads, and repeated freezing and melting snow and ice. 

Sweden has faced similar issues. The E4 close to Uppsala was paved by concrete in 2007. The surface began cracking in a few years. After 11 years, the topmost 4 centimeters of concrete were removed, and replaced by asphalt.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I recall that E4 north of Helsingborg also had pretty bad concrete.


----------



## 54°26′S 3°24′E

Concrete has been used in a lot of colder areas over the years, particular in the US midwest. It was also tried on e.g. E6 Trondheim and E6 north of Gardermoen in Norway. But the results in Norway were more or less as in the other Nordic cases mentioned: The actual durability of concrete was not long enough considering the cost.


----------



## Shifty2k5

ChrisZwolle said:


> I recall that E4 north of Helsingborg also had pretty bad concrete.


Was repaved in 2018. Other infamous swedish concrete motorways are E6 Falkenberg and E4 Uppsala.


----------



## Søren L

The preliminary study of a new fixed link between Sjælland (Zealand) and Jylland (Jutland), going over Samsø, has been released today. If politicians want to continue with the project, it is necessary to conduct a so called "Miljøkonsekvensvurdering" (Environmental consequence assessment) before the project can be startet. All information about the project can be found on "kattegat.dk", where the preliminary study can be found under "om forbindelsen" and then "dokumenter".

Very interesting if this project will become a reality. It would probably be the biggest construction project ever in Denmark and it would have a very big impact on tranport times but also have a great impact on the environment.

One thing to note is that actually two studies have been conducted as it is not yet clear if this connection will be with or without railway


----------



## MichiH

Søren L said:


> The preliminary study of a new fixed link between Sjælland (Zealand) and Jylland (Jutland), going over Samsø, has been released today. If politicians want to continue with the project, it is necessary to conduct a so called "Miljøkonsekvensvurdering" (Environmental consequence assessment) before the project can be startet. All information about the project can be found on "kattegat.dk", where the preliminary study can be found under "om forbindelsen" and then "dokumenter".
> 
> Very interesting if this project will become a reality. It would probably be the biggest construction project ever in Denmark and it would have a very big impact on tranport times but also have a great impact on the environment.
> 
> One thing to note is that actually two studies have been conducted as it is not yet clear if this connection will be with or without railway


If it will be built one day, will it definitely be 2x2 motorway standard as the pics on Kattegatforbindelsen - Kattegat suggest, or could it be "downgraded" to lower road standard?


----------



## Søren L

MichiH said:


> If it will be built one day, will it definitely be 2x2 motorway standard as the pics on Kattegatforbindelsen - Kattegat suggest, or could it be "downgraded" to lower road standard?


Only a motorway (and railway) is planned. In the the studies it even says that the plan is to have a speed limit of 130 km/h


----------



## Nikolaj

MichiH said:


> If it will be built one day, will it definitely be 2x2 motorway standard as the pics on Kattegatforbindelsen - Kattegat suggest, or could it be "downgraded" to lower road standard?


The traffic forecast, included in the analysis, predicts an AADT on the bridge af around 35.000. Anything else than a 2+2 motorway would be madness.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

https://www.trm.dk/nyheder/2022/tour-de-france-giver-svaere-trafikdage



The Great Belt Bridge will be shut down for 5 hours, this Saturday, 2 July, due to the Tour de France passing over it. From 12:30 - 18:00 hours.

They expect great traffic problems, as Saturdays are typically peak days for travel in Denmark.


----------



## Ingenioren

5 hours seems bit excessive no?


----------



## MattiG

ChrisZwolle said:


> https://www.trm.dk/nyheder/2022/tour-de-france-giver-svaere-trafikdage
> 
> 
> 
> The Great Belt Bridge will be shut down for 5 hours, this Saturday, 2 July, due to the Tour de France passing over it. From 12:30 - 18:00 hours.
> 
> They expect great traffic problems, as Saturdays are typically peak days for travel in Denmark.


But most people stay at home watching Tour de France Stage 2 taking place in Denmark?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

The prices for the Øresund Bridge appear to be seasonal, but I haven't seen an official pricing schedule.

Last summer, the prices for a single trip were € 64 cash / € 57 online ticket. In January 2022, they were € 55 cash. Right now, they're € 65 cash and no discount for online tickets (5% discount if you sign up for their newsletter.  )


----------



## ChrisZwolle

A 5 kilometer segment of the E20 six lane expansion on the island of Fyn has been completed, east of the Nørre Aaby exit.


----------



## Ni3lS

I recently uploaded a video of the E20 & E47/E55 motorway from Copenhagen Airport to Rønnede. I didn't know that Denmark had a 2x5 motorway (although it's a very short section).


----------



## ChrisZwolle

YouTube kills the thumbnail quality since a couple of months.


----------



## Ni3lS

ChrisZwolle said:


> YouTube kills the thumbnail quality since a couple of months.


Yea I have been trying different thumbnail sizes and formats but nothing seems to be working..


----------



## korbendallas

It appears that a sneaky expansion of Køge Bugt Motorvejen is underway. In the southbound direction between Greve N and Greve C, the asphalt is being replaced only on the hard shoulder, and more telling, the arrow markings on the road leading up to has been removed for the rightmost lane.

If this turns out to be correct, another 2 km of Køge Bugt Motorvejen will be 5+5 lanes. However I can't seem to find any documentation to back up my observations.


----------



## PovilD

Do you find Danish motorway signage complicated? Arrows are not used on some overhead signs, mostly on direction straight signs.
It seemed somewhat complicated on 2x5 motorway section.

On the other hand, I find to like minimalism on regular Danish junctions to some minor towns.


----------



## Søren L

korbendallas said:


> It appears that a sneaky expansion of Køge Bugt Motorvejen is underway. In the southbound direction between Greve N and Greve C, the asphalt is being replaced only on the hard shoulder, and more telling, the arrow markings on the road leading up to has been removed for the rightmost lane.
> 
> If this turns out to be correct, another 2 km of Køge Bugt Motorvejen will be 5+5 lanes. However I can't seem to find any documentation to back up my observations.


As part of the "Infrastrukturplan 2035" it was decided to give money to small projects in many different areas of Denmark. The project you are referring to is one of these projects. And indeed the plan is to have 5 lanes all the way to "Greve C". The project is mentioned here as: "Håndtering af trængselsplet Ishøj-sammenfletningen ved TSA 27 Greve N"

Here is a link to an overview:
https://www.trm.dk/nyheder/2021/nye-projekter-til-bedre-sammenhaeng-mellem-land-og-by

And more details about the projects can be found here:
https://www.trm.dk/media/ywzmb3cg/projektoversigt_landby-a.pdf
and
https://www.trm.dk/media/nxahyqyy/2...al_sammenhaeng_mellem_land_og_byn_final-a.pdf


----------



## ChrisZwolle

An update of the Storstrøm Bridge. It doesn't seem to be going very fast...


----------



## Stuu

ChrisZwolle said:


> An update of the Storstrøm Bridge. It doesn't seem to be going very fast...


Is there any more deck than in your post from last August?


----------



## kchoo

Hello, Do you happen to know why 'boom barriers' are installed on Storebaelt Bridge on exit roadways:









Google Maps


Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.




www.google.pl













Google Maps


Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.




www.google.pl





I saw similar solutions at some tunnel exits... to me they should be placed at entrances, where they do not exist. Strange.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Progress at the Storstrøm Bridge, aerial photos from October.


----------

