# FIFA World Cup 2018/2022 - European bids



## JYDA (Jul 14, 2008)

ryebreadraz said:


> They agreed to bid either on the World Cup or the Winter Olympics and chose the Winter Olympics. I think that FIFA will essentially ignore Asian bids for 2018 and 2022 because they want to go to China in 2026. The question is whether Australia is considered Oceania or Asia.


Interesting. First I've heard of that


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## mvictory (Jul 27, 2009)

> They agreed to bid either on the World Cup or the Winter Olympics and chose the Winter Olympics. I think that FIFA will essentially ignore Asian bids for 2018 and 2022 because they want to go to China in 2026. The question is whether Australia is considered Oceania or Asia.


the problem with china is they really need to lift there game if they intend to bid for the world cup. they have only qualified once and they lost 3 out of 3 games, this I think shows a serious lack of interest of the game from a population of over 1,000,000,000. FIFA also cant wait for a Chinese bid for 2026 because they have no way of knowing who will bid when they are deciding on the host for 2022. However a bid from china would be extremely hard to ignore.


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## CaliforniaJones (Apr 9, 2009)

For those who are very sad and concerned about Chicago, WC is a sort of consolation.
Furthermore, Chicago is among the bidding cities and can't be ignored by FIFA.

http://nyunews.com/opinion/2009/oct/01/chamberlain/

I have a suggestion, win the 2022 world cup bid and one city will have more experiences for OG bid.


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## mattec (Aug 2, 2009)

Vicman said:


> I think this, it's the most fair
> 
> 
> 2030...South America *URUGUAY*
> ...


is uruguay large enough for a world cup?


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## CaliforniaJones (Apr 9, 2009)

I understand your pride about celebrating the 100 years of world cup.
However, Uruguay has not many stadiums to host 32 teams, is a small country and may not have enough money to realize it.

As for me,

2018: UEFA (England or Spain)
2022: CONCACAF (only USA)
2026: AFC (China or Australia)
2030: UEFA (England or Spain)


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## hngcm (Sep 17, 2002)

JYDA said:


> I'm still shocked that China didn't bid. They'd be my favourite to get 2022 if they'd submited a bid


I'm really glad they didn't lol. 

I know for a fact that China would easily win the bid for 2022. 

Without China, the USA has a great chance to win it.


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## lemog (Oct 2, 2009)

There is a huge campaign for Uruguay to host 2030, but it's a small country indeed. Current speculations are saying about a joint Uruguay/Argentina for 2030, with Montevideu having the final.


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

How a country like Qatar will host it? It´s too small!! they would need at least 9 large stadiums..


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## ryebreadraz (Sep 4, 2008)

lemog said:


> There is a huge campaign for Uruguay to host 2030, but it's a small country indeed. Current speculations are saying about a joint Uruguay/Argentina for 2030, with Montevideu having the final.


I don't see how that makes sense for Argentina. With work, they are capable of hosting the WC alone and I'd think that they would look to see if they could do it themselves before bringing Uruguay along. Brazil has 2014, but after trips to Europe, Asia, North America and back to Europe, I think that Argentina would stand a good chance on their own in 2034.


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## akamoke (Apr 19, 2007)

This to me is fair

2010 - Africa
2014 - South America
2018 - Europe
2022 - Asia /Pacific
2026 - North America
2030 - Africa
2034 - South America

Now that is FAIR, not wishful thinking


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## ryebreadraz (Sep 4, 2008)

akamoke said:


> This to me is fair
> 
> 2010 - Africa
> 2014 - South America
> ...


Why is it fair to make Asia/Pacific wait only 20 years to get the WC again, while North America must wait 32?


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## Dimethyltryptamine (Aug 22, 2009)

I think that Australia could easily host the WC. A lot of Aussies would attend the games for atmosphere and perhaps take up a liking for the sport which is in dire need for supporters in the region. 

As a country, we've successfully held the only two Olympic Games in the Southern Hemisphere, four Commonwealth Games, and the Rugby World Cup twice. Proving we're more than adequate of hosting such a prestigious event.


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## ryebreadraz (Sep 4, 2008)

Dimethyltryptamine said:


> I think that Australia could easily host the WC. A lot of Aussies would attend the games for atmosphere and perhaps take up a liking for the sport which is in dire need for supporters in the region.
> 
> As a country, we've successfully held the only two Olympic Games in the Southern Hemisphere, four Commonwealth Games, and the Rugby World Cup twice. Proving we're more than adequate of hosting such a prestigious event.


Australia is capable, but they have two things working against them.

1) They can no longer lay claim to the fact that Oceania has never hosted. They are Asia now and as a result, are in direct competition with other Asian nations. Should Australia not get 2018/2022, they will likely have to compete with China, which would be an uphill climb for the Aussies.

2) Australia must build many stadiums and convince FIFA that the oval stadiums are not too bad. There is a lot of work to be done if the Aussies are to host a World Cup.

They are issues that can be overcome, but it presents obstacles for an Australian bid.


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## Dimethyltryptamine (Aug 22, 2009)

ryebreadraz said:


> Australia is capable, but they have two things working against them.
> 
> 1) They can no longer lay claim to the fact that Oceania has never hosted. They are Asia now and as a result, are in direct competition with other Asian nations. Should Australia not get 2018/2022, they will likely have to compete with China, which would be an uphill climb for the Aussies.
> 
> ...


^^ For sure. If we do win either 2018 or 2022 our Gov't would inject a hell of a lot of money into building the necessary infrastructure to host the WC. It's no good that we're considered a part of Asia but perhaps the committee would see through that and realise that we are an island continent of our own. Wishful thinking?

As for the Oval Stadiums. :bash: gah

We might even get to see ANZ Stadium with the stands coming out the sides (Not sure of correct terminology...)


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## Livno80101 (Mar 15, 2009)

2018. 
*England* - reason: Two WC's before 2018. are held out of Europe, 2010. Africa and 2014. Brazil. So England is winner. Russia dont have any chance, distances between cities are huge, and it would be stupid to have three-four stadiums in Moscow.

2022. 
*USA/Australia* - reason: *Australia *is growing football nation, and USA is too, they have money and they have infrastructure, and *Australia *is in better position because that part of world never had World Cup. And other countries dont have chance. 
*Qatar *- funny and REALLY not serious (they have like four cities total, total capacity of stadium would be bigger than countries population, and who would play football under 40 degrees Celsius - but I don't have anything against Qatar as country, only I am against their bid - would be better to bid for Basketball world cup). 
*Indonesia *- not yet, not before 2034.
*Japan *- held WC 20 years ago.
*Korea *- as like as Japan.


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## mvictory (Jul 27, 2009)

ryebreadraz said:


> Why is it fair to make Asia/Pacific wait only 20 years to get the WC again, while North America must wait 32?


1. Asia has many more countries capable of hosting.

2. AFC population is more than 2,000,000,000 more than CONCACAF

3. The only country now bidding in North America is the USA which hosted recently where as all the bids in asia have never hosted before.

4. European/South american cups time coinside quite well with tv viewing in north america.


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## GEwinnen (Mar 3, 2006)

What are the average distances of the russian venues?
And what about the infrastructure in Russia? Will they have high speed trains linking the host cities?
I would prefer a compact country with short distances, for me
1 England
2 NL/Belgium


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

Livno80101 said:


> 2018.
> *England* - reason: Two WC's before 2018. are held out of Europe, 2010. Africa and 2014. Brazil. So England is winner. Russia dont have any chance, distances between cities are huge, and it would be stupid to have three-four stadiums in Moscow.


Distances are not so big if you will look at the map and compare with Brasil for example. And (!) teams of one group will be played in "clusters", where distances even less. Moscow will have 2 stadiums. So writing about that as problems is stupid. Russian bidding committee will solve this problem just building high-speed train roads. It's already exist between Moscow and St.Petersburg (now it's 3,5 hours and 230 km/h, will be 350 km/h). I just wanna say that these are not problems for professionals.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

GEwinnen said:


> What are the average distances of the russian venues?
> And what about the infrastructure in Russia? Will they have high speed trains linking the host cities?
> I would prefer a compact country with short distances, for me
> 1 England
> 2 NL/Belgium


Teams on group round will play in clusters:

North-West: Kaliningrad, St. Petersburg - 820 km;
Central: Moscow, Podolsk (Moscow Region) - 37 km;
Volga: Yaroslavl, Nizhni Novgorod, Kazan, Samara, Saransk, Volgograd - 285, 330, 290, 350, 615 km;
South: Rostov-on-Don, Krasnodar, Sochi - 250, 170 km.
So, 1-3 hours on high-speed train.

To campare - distance between Warsaw and Kiev - 685 km (EURO 2012). Manaus - Cuiabá - 1470 km, Brasilia - Rio - 900 km (Brasil 2014).


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## HendrX (Oct 26, 2008)

Holland and belgium, because we really deserve it!


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=e....013755,24.433594&spn=41.043185,78.925781&z=4


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

A340-500 said:


> Of all great football nations the Netherlands-Belgium (The Low Countries) bid is the only candidate that really deserves 2018. England got it's WC already in 1966 and Spain in 1982.
> 
> The Netherlands national football team is one of the best teams around (ranked 2nd on both FIFA and Elo-ranking), It won Euro 88 and reached two consecutive World Cup finals in 1974 and 1978 but lost both finals to their respective host nations, West Germany and Argentina. Wouldn't it be strange to be the only great football nation NOT to have organized a WC??
> 
> With a lot of new stadium development in both countries and their proven organisational skills (Euro 2000), it seems like a very logical choice to me....


Netherlands' style of football is irrelevant. England could just as easily say that they deserve to host World Cup 2018 because of all the things that they have contributed to the game (including having given the game to the world!). But that would also be irrelevant.

As to England having already hosted the World Cup before, that won't count against them. After all, Italy (1934 & 1990), France (1938 & 1998), Brazil (1950 & 2014), Mexico (1970 & 1986) and Germany (1974 & 2006) will all have hosted two World Cups by 2018.

So why not England?

In 2018, it will have been 52 years since England last hosted the World Cup. By then, the vast majority of England's population won't have been alive in 1966 or they will, like me (six months old at the time!), have been too young to have been aware that there was a World Cup. So hosting the World Cup in 2018 will be every bit as much a new experience for us as it will for the people of Holland and Belgium if they win the right to be hosts.

So the decision will come down purely to the quality of all the European bids (including Russia and Iberia) and how well each of the bidding countries plays the political game.


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

poxuy said:


> Teams on group round will play in clusters:
> 
> North-West: *Kaliningrad*, St. Petersburg - 820 km;
> Central: Moscow, Podolsk (Moscow Region) - 37 km;
> ...



Kalingrad will host it?? That is very interesting! A city that is part of a Russia enclave. I liked it!! BTW, it will be the closest western europe host city.


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

....


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

For me will it always be:

2018: Europe
2022: Asia/Pacific
2024: South America
2028: Africa
2032: Europe
2036: North America
2040: South America
2044: Asia/Pacif
2048: Europe


But I dont belive that this rotation policy will remain much longger.. When Blater leaves the FIFA presidency, I think will be again all bids from anywhere.


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## Escalabitano (Jun 12, 2009)

I'm from Portugal but England 2018.


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

Livno80101 said:


> 2022.
> 
> *Qatar *- funny and REALLY not serious (they have like four cities total, total capacity of stadium would be bigger than countries population, and who would play football under 40 degrees Celsius - but I don't have anything against Qatar as country, only I am against their bid - would be better to bid for Basketball world cup).
> .


I feel the same way about it. But I think Qatar could bid as a join bid with other Arab Small Countries like UAE, Bahrein, Kwait, Oman and maybe even Saudi Arabia. Host Cities would be:

UAE: Dubai and Abu Dhabi
Oman: Mascat
Qatar: Doha
Bahrein: Manama
Kuwait: Kuwait
Saudi Arabia: Riyad, Jiddah


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## Escalabitano (Jun 12, 2009)

Australia 2022!


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## boyerling3 (Jun 1, 2009)

TEBC said:


> For me will it always be:
> 
> 2018: Europe
> 2022: Asia/Pacific
> ...


Your years are a bit off. It seems silly to give Africa some so close together when North America will not have had it in forever. I think it should be: 
2014: South America (Brazil)
2018: Europe (England)
2022: Asia/Pacific (Australia)
2026: North America (Mexico)
2030: South America
2034: Europe
2038: Asia
2042: Africa


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## hngcm (Sep 17, 2002)

TEBC said:


> Kalingrad will host it?? That is very interesting! A city that is part of a Russia enclave. I liked it!! BTW, it will be the closest western europe host city.


Exclave actually lol. 

Just read it on wiki a couple of days ago.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enclave


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

The new site is on!!

http://www.qatar2022bid.com/


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

boyerling3 said:


> Your years are a bit off. It seems silly to give Africa some so close together when North America will not have had it in forever. I think it should be:
> 2014: South America (Brazil)
> 2018: Europe (England)
> 2022: Asia/Pacific (Australia)
> ...


Yes, I forgot.

2018: Europe
2022: Asia/Pacific
2026: South America
2030: North America
2034: Europe
2038: Africa
2042: South America
2046: Asia/Pacif
2050: Europe


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## lemog (Oct 2, 2009)

TEBC said:


> Yes, I forgot.
> 
> 2018: Europe
> 2022: Asia/Pacific
> ...


2050, doesn't look like.. too early to think? :nuts:


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## ryebreadraz (Sep 4, 2008)

TEBC said:


> Yes, I forgot.
> 
> 2018: Europe
> 2022: Asia/Pacific
> ...


Europe needs to host one of every three World Cups. Because of their influence in FIFA it will happen and because Europe accounts for nearly 1/3 of FIFA countries, it makes sense. Also, why would the World Cup go back to Asia 20 years after they last had it and to South American only 12 years later when North America is forced to wait 36 years?


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

I hate doing this kind of predictions.. I always miss somethng. My point: South America and Europe should host on of every three World Cups. Africa, North America and Asia/PAcif should host the other years.

For instance:

Europe
Asia
South America
Europe
North America
South America
Europe
Africa


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## lpioe (May 6, 2006)

Europe should definately host at least every third, South America not.
They have 4 or 5 nations in a WC, Europe has 13.


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## Balaputradewa (Jul 11, 2008)

*Indonesia Goes to WC 2022*

*Some Pictures of Indonesian Stadium *

*Bung Karno Stadium, Jakarta*






*Palaran Stadium, Samarinda City*


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## Balaputradewa (Jul 11, 2008)

*Indonesia Goes to WC 2022*

*Preparing to Host of Green World Cup 2022 - New Stadium*

*Gedebage Stadium, Bandung City*









*Taman BMW Stadium, Jakarta*


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## xlchris (Jun 23, 2006)

The Holland Belgium Bid

*STADIONS*










*Nederland*

_HEERENVEEN - Abe Lenstra Stadion - 26.800_










Expansion: The stadium wants to upgrade to 40 to 45.000 seats. 

_ENSCHEDE - De Grolsch Veste - 24.000_










Expansion: The stadium wants 44.000 seats for the World Cup.

_EINDHOVEN - Philips Stadion - 35.000_










Expansion: The stadium is trying to find a way to expand to 42.000 seats. 

_AMSTERDAM - Amsterdam ArenA - 51.628_ 



















Expension: Amsterdam wants to expand the ArenA to approx. 80.000 seats. 

_ROTTERDAM - Nieuwe Kuip - 87.000(?)_










Expans: This stadion has not been built yet.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

*België*

_BRUGGE - Loppern Stadion(?) - 40.000_










Expanson: This stadium hasn't been built yet.

_GENT - Arteveldestadion - 20.000_










Expansion: This stadium is now u/c and will open in the season of 2010-2011.

_ANTWERPEN - The Port of Antwerp Stadium - 25.000_










Expansion: This stadium hasn't been built yet, but if it will it will have space over to expand to 45.000 seats. 

_GENK - Cristal Arena - 24.604_










Expansion: If NL & BE will host the World Cup this stadium will get a facelift and probably expand to 45.000 seats. 

_BRUSSEL - Nieuw Stadion - 65.000_










Expansion: Brussels wants to expand the old stadium or built a new one. 

_LUIK - Nieuw Stadion - ??????_










Expansion: The club Standar wants a new stadium. 

_CHARLEROI - Nieuw Stadion - ???????_










Expansion: The club Sporting needs a new stadium.​


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## boyerling3 (Jun 1, 2009)

TEBC said:


> I hate doing this kind of predictions.. I always miss somethng. My point: South America and Europe should host on of every three World Cups. Africa, North America and Asia/PAcif should host the other years.


I agree that Europe should have it quite frequently, but South America has few teams and they've already hosted it many times. It's sort of like Rio's bid for the Olympics, spread the World Cup around to new(er) countries that haven't traditionally been huge football nations (including but not only the US). Europe and South America have been very successful and reliable at staging games, but I think they should give Asia, Africa, and N. America the WC a little bit more often.


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## SSE (Jul 28, 2009)

TEBC said:


> I feel the same way about it. But I think Qatar could bid as a join bid with other Arab Small Countries like UAE, Bahrein, Kwait, Oman and maybe even Saudi Arabia. Host Cities would be:
> 
> UAE: Dubai and Abu Dhabi
> Oman: Mascat
> ...



That's the most ridiculous suggestion ever. None of those countries are footballing powers, and aren't guaranteed (or even likely for most of them) to qualify. FIFA isn't going to let a 6 way joint host bid and give away 6 places in the tournament to teams who would struggle to beat a fourth tier English league team. It would completely undermine the tournament, and be extremely bad for Asian football.

The biggest problem for the middle east is the temperature. Yes, the stadiums themselves might be temperature controlled but what everywhere else? Teams need to train everyday, are they going to build facilities for 32 teams to have access to grass pitch indoor facilities? The cost would be astronomical. FIFA won't want to expose players and fans to Qatar in June. During the games it might be fine, but that's only 90 minutes out of the day, what happens for the rest of the team? Do they expect players to just sit in their hotels?

Obviously, being English I want us to win the 2018 tournament. I think it is important that UEFA gets a tournament every 12 years as it's the centre of world football. South America has great players, but they all come to Europe in the end (most of them before they are even 22). It's also the only place where high quality stadiums are available in high enough numbers, but without ridiculous travel distances.


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## JoseRP (Jun 13, 2007)

definitely Australia


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## CaliforniaJones (Apr 9, 2009)

I am making a projection about vote for 2022 world cup bids.
Each executive commitee member will have to vote.
I suppose the USA, Australia will make a possible final. It would be CONCACAF vs AFC.

Joseph S. BLATTER (Switzerland) : USA

Julio H. GRONDONA (Argentina ) : USA 

Issa HAYATOU (Cameroon) : Australia 

CHUNG Mong Joon (Korea Republic) : Australia 

Jack A. WARNER (Trinidad and Tobago) : USA 

Ángel María VILLAR LLONA (Spain) : USA 

Michel PLATINI (France) : Australia

Reynald TEMARII (Tahiti) : Australia 

Geoff THOMPSON (England) : USA

Michel D'HOOGHE (Belgium) : USA

Ricardo Terra TEIXEIRA (Brazil) : USA 

Mohamed BIN HAMMAM (Qatar) : Australia 

Senes ERZIK (Turkey) : USA

_Chuck BLAZER (USA) : non voting_ 

Worawi MAKUDI (Thailand) : Australia

Nicolás LEOZ (Paraguay) : USA

Junji OGURA (Japan) : Australia

Amos ADAMU (Nigeria) : USA

Marios LEFKARITIS (Cyprus) : USA

Jacques ANOUMA (Côte d'Ivoire) : USA 

Franz BECKENBAUER (Germany) : Australia

Rafael SALGUERO (Guatemala) : USA

Hany ABO RIDA (Egypt) : USA 

Vitaliy MUTKO (Russia) : Australia


If Australia stayed in OFC, it could be normal for them to organize a WC. However they went to AFC and it would do it after 20 years and CONCACAF would have to wait 32 years.
The objective of actual politic is to have a rotation between confederations.


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## CaliforniaJones (Apr 9, 2009)

This could be a first round for 2018 WC bids.

Joseph S. BLATTER (Switzerland) : England

Julio H. GRONDONA (Argentina ) : Spain/Portugal

Issa HAYATOU (Cameroon) : Spain/Portugal

CHUNG Mong Joon (Korea Republic) : England

Jack A. WARNER (Trinidad and Tobago) : England

_Ángel María VILLAR LLONA (Spain) : non voting_

Michel PLATINI (France) : Spain/Portugal

Reynald TEMARII (Tahiti) : England

_Geoff THOMPSON (England) : non voting_

_Michel D'HOOGHE (Belgium) : non voting_

Ricardo Terra TEIXEIRA (Brazil) : Spain/Portugal

Mohamed BIN HAMMAM (Qatar) : Russia

Senes ERZIK (Turkey) : England

Chuck BLAZER (USA) : England

Worawi MAKUDI (Thailand) : England

Nicolás LEOZ (Paraguay) : Spain/Portugal

Junji OGURA (Japan) : Belgium/Netherlands

Amos ADAMU (Nigeria) : England

Marios LEFKARITIS (Cyprus) : Russia

Jacques ANOUMA (Côte d'Ivoire) : England

Franz BECKENBAUER (Germany) : England

Rafael SALGUERO (Guatemala) : Spain/Portugal

Hany ABO RIDA (Egypt) : Russia

_Vitaliy MUTKO (Russia) : non voting_


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## Its AlL gUUd (Jan 24, 2006)

A340-500 said:


> ^^
> 
> That's not entirely correct. Blatter stated that he didn't liked an organisation like Japan/South-Korea back in 2002, which were indeed two separate organisations.
> 
> ...


i do give credit to the Benelux bid as they do seem like one organisation. however they still get 2 automatic qualification places, since they are 2 host nations. Thats the only downfall of the Benelux bid.


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## cjav (Jun 24, 2006)

Meh the Netherlands wont need an automatic qualification, we can let the belgian have that one. 
Organizationally belgium/netherlands will be very strong. Good public transport and small distances. 

@californiajones, what do you base your predictions on?


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

Seems to be a fairly high proportion of 40-45K stadiums in the Benelux bid.

That might count against it.


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## PortoNuts (Apr 26, 2008)

England :cheers:.

We don't want to be Spain's maid.


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## CaliforniaJones (Apr 9, 2009)

cjav said:


> Meh the Netherlands wont need an automatic qualification, we can let the belgian have that one.
> Organizationally belgium/netherlands will be very strong. Good public transport and small distances.
> 
> @californiajones, what do you base your predictions on?


Michel Platini seems to prefer Spain/Portugal over England.
Sepp Blatter is not hot with coorganisations.
South americains members have special relations with Spain or Portugal.
Some national teams have some stars playing in Englad or Spain.
Beckhenbauer supports England.


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

CaliforniaJones said:


> This could be a first round for 2018 WC bids.
> 
> Joseph S. BLATTER (Switzerland) : England
> 
> ...


We cant predict it, because even though is quite clear that 2018 will possible be in Europe, People still can vote for USA and AFC bids.


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## hngcm (Sep 17, 2002)

Like I've said before...I think FIFA would rather have China host the 2026 WC...


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

I got some inside information:

The FIFA is afraid of the hooliganculture in England, thats a big problem for there bid. Spain and Portugal are 2 seperated organisations, just like South-Korea and Japan. The also don't like that idea. The Netherlands and Belgium got some good advantages (1 organisation, great transport, small distances), but don't have extrodonary stadiums. 

It's going to be interesting!


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## A340-500 (Sep 25, 2007)

Skycrap said:


> The Netherlands and Belgium got some good advantages (1 organisation, great transport, small distances), but don't have extrodonary stadiums.


But, the stadiums are very modern and safe (some even brand new, like the New Kuip). 

And don't forget the proposed new stadium of FC Utrecht, which will be a 44.000 seater probably (very recent information).

It makes a total of 6 suitable WC stadiums in the Netherlands.


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

^^

At this time there are 8 WC stadium plans in 6 different cities. In Rotterdam the old Kuip has been proposed to use, and in Amsterdam a temporary enlargement (also for other events such as the EC athletics) of the Olympic Stadium (22.288 seats now) has been proposed.


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## 1772 (Aug 18, 2009)

If Russia has it and uses "kaliningrad", I sure hope Germany meets them there and crushes them! 
And the german fans will go "Königsberg, Königsberg, Königsberg!


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

1772 said:


> If Russia has it and uses "kaliningrad", I sure hope Germany meets them there and crushes them!
> And the german fans will go "Königsberg, Königsberg, Königsberg!


Germans would be too late  I think the best city for Germany to play games on group stage will be Volgograd (Stalingrad). Though it's not funny.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Skycrap said:


> I got some inside information:
> 
> The FIFA is afraid of the hooliganculture in England, thats a big problem for there bid. Spain and Portugal are 2 seperated organisations, just like South-Korea and Japan. The also don't like that idea. The Netherlands and Belgium got some good advantages (1 organisation, great transport, small distances), but don't have extrodonary stadiums.
> 
> It's going to be interesting!


Inside information? Who are you? I could have made that lot up off the top of my head.

England doesn't have a problem with hooliganism, and certainly compared to places like Poland/Ukraine, who've just been awarded 2012, it's nothing.

The last incident was at the West Ham v Millwall match, and other Europeans who saw that said that that wasn't hooliganism compared to what they see in their own countries now.

England has one of, if not _the_ safest matchday experiences in Europe. Why do you think the Italians are looking to the British policing/stewarding/stadium model for reforming their own game?


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

RobH said:


> Inside information? Who are you? I could have made that lot up off the top of my head.
> 
> England doesn't have a problem with hooliganism, and certainly compared to places like Poland/Ukraine, who've just been awarded 2012, it's nothing.
> 
> ...


Exactly.

It's not as if hooliganism is unheard of in Holland either. Feyenoord v Ajax always leads to some trouble.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

A340-500 said:


> But, the stadiums are very modern and safe (some even brand new, like the New Kuip).
> 
> And don't forget the proposed new stadium of FC Utrecht, which will be a 44.000 seater probably (very recent information).
> 
> It makes a total of 6 suitable WC stadiums in the Netherlands.


I don't doubt that all the Benelux stadiums will be of an excellent quality. But there's no getting away from the fact that all but four or five of them will be in the 40-45K range - which is at the smaller end of the allowable scale.

Contrast to Iberia - where only three or four stadiums will be in the 40-45K range, with the rest ranging from 50K to 100K.

....or England - where only four or five stadia will be in the 40-45K range, with the remainder ranging from 50K to 90K.

I don't know enough yet about Russia's stadiums to be able to say how they compare.

Stadium size alone won't be a deal-breaker as far as FIFA is concerned but, given the size disadvantage, the Benelux bid will have to be far stronger than the other European bids in most other respects in order to stand a chance of winning the vote.

Either that, or the Benelux bid team will have to play an outstanding political game.


----------



## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

SSE said:


> That's the most ridiculous suggestion ever. None of those countries are footballing powers, and aren't guaranteed (or even likely for most of them) to qualify. FIFA isn't going to let a 6 way joint host bid and give away 6 places in the tournament to teams who would struggle to beat a fourth tier English league team. It would completely undermine the tournament, and be extremely bad for Asian football.
> 
> The biggest problem for the middle east is the temperature. Yes, the stadiums themselves might be temperature controlled but what everywhere else? Teams need to train everyday, are they going to build facilities for 32 teams to have access to grass pitch indoor facilities? The cost would be astronomical. FIFA won't want to expose players and fans to Qatar in June. During the games it might be fine, but that's only 90 minutes out of the day, what happens for the rest of the team? Do they expect players to just sit in their hotels?
> 
> Obviously, being English I want us to win the 2018 tournament. I think it is important that UEFA gets a tournament every 12 years as it's the centre of world football. South America has great players, but they all come to Europe in the end (most of them before they are even 22). It's also the only place where high quality stadiums are available in high enough numbers, but without ridiculous travel distances.


You don´t have to be rude!! I just said that Qatar alone is completly impossible to host it. But I dont see why in future FIFA wont consider a 4-6 joint bid. UEFA already did with Scandinavian bid fr UEFA and Asia Cup was hosted by 4 countries. They don´t need necessarily be automatic qualified. We could have a main Host, like Saudi Arabia and the others countries only taking part as host. But anyone, I was just saying that Qatar alone is not viable. They will host ASian CUp 2011 though.


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## jostein (Dec 9, 2005)

It's time to *PORTUGAL&SPAIN*
It's time to *IBERIA*

:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana:


----------



## cjav (Jun 24, 2006)

SSE said:


> Absolute rubbish.
> 
> The West Ham v Millwall incident was nothing compared to what happens in Europe much more often. In the Netherlands Feyenoord v Ajax attracts far more trouble than anything in England. Even in Spain I'd say there were more problems than in England, Atletico Madrid received a two game stadium ban and were fined over racist abuse and violence against Marseille a couple of years ago.
> 
> As someone else said, England is the safest place in the world to watch a football match.


Bit double here. England has a reputation and history for WC and EC hooliganism and trouble. The Netherlands might have Ajax vs Feyenoord, but if you look at WC or EC then you will notice their are never problems with hooliganism or violence. Dutch hooligans completely ignore WC and EC, which are family events. 
The hooligans I know make a huge but seriously huge distinction between the two. 
That said, the organization in the Netherlands will be superb, you can count on that. Money wise it will be attractive for FIFA as well.


----------



## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

xlchris said:


> Yeah well, Feynoord will not play against Ajax during the WC  The hooliganism in England is a bit worse.


You're living in the past. Hooliganism hasn't been a problem in England or with the England team for a long time.

And, given English clubs' perennial strength in the Champions League, there isn't a country in the world that is better equipped or has more experience of staging big football matches. That's why countries around the world look to England as the model for policing and stewarding football.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

HendrX said:


> **** England...............
> 
> 2018 World CUP Belgium and the Netherlands period!
> 
> They will have the best bid! And that´s what its all about!


A very good bid in some respects.

But there's no getting away from the fact that, overall, the Benelux stadiums won't quite be able to match the stadiums in Iberia and England. Maybe Russia too.

Will that prove to be Benelux's undoing? Who knows....


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

ryebreadraz said:


> I have serious doubts about Venezuela and Colombia's ability to host a World Cup. They hosted Copa America, but I think that's about as big a tournament as either could hold. There's also the financial and political instability that both have had issues with. Committing to either 8-12 years in advance is a dangerous proposition.
> 
> I think Brazil, Argentina and Chile are really the only three capable of hosting.


I Think even with the controvertial Hugo Chavez on power, Venezuela could host it because doesnt have many conerns and have a lot of petrodolars. The stadiums from Copa America are new and very modern would be very good. 

Colombia would have some problems with FARCs though


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

Skycrap said:


> I'm a privat driver for a very influence person in the soccerworld. Can't say anymore ofcourse.
> I don't give my opinion about the situation, I only tell you guy's what I know.


I smell bullshit.

If not from you, then from this fella that you drive around. Hooliganism hasn't been a problem in England for a long time. It's worse in many other countries. So I can't believe that anyone important in FIFA is stupid or ignorant enough to believe that hooliganism is still rife in England.

Besides, FIFA doesn't speak as one voice. There are, what, 23 delegates who vote? And each will have a different opinion about each of the bidding countries.

At most, what you heard (if you did, in fact, hear anything) would have been the opinion of one man. Nothing more.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

cjav said:


> Bit double here. *England has a reputation and history for WC and EC hooliganism and trouble*. The Netherlands might have Ajax vs Feyenoord, but if you look at WC or EC then you will notice their are never problems with hooliganism or violence. Dutch hooligans completely ignore WC and EC, which are family events.
> The hooligans I know make a huge but seriously huge distinction between the two.
> That said, the organization in the Netherlands will be superb, you can count on that. Money wise it will be attractive for FIFA as well.


Yes - the important word here being..........history.

History is something that happened in the past; something that is not current.

And moneywise, England will be even more attractive for FIFA. As will Iberia. Bigger stadiums. More ticket sales.


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## ryebreadraz (Sep 4, 2008)

TEBC said:


> I Think even with the controvertial Hugo Chavez on power, Venezuela could host it because doesnt have many conerns and have a lot of petrodolars. The stadiums from Copa America are new and very modern would be very good.
> 
> Colombia would have some problems with FARCs though


Relying on petro dollars 8-12 years down the line is risky and can you guarantee a stable government that far down the line? I'm not saying that the money and stable government won't be there, but I'm not betting my multi-billion dollar even on it.

As for stadia, only five are capable of hosting a World Cup match capacity wise and all but one of them is on the low end of the capacity window with 40,000 or in the low 40,000's. There would have to be a minimum of five upgrades/new stadiums.


----------



## mattec (Aug 2, 2009)

Also, depending on how Chavez progresses, some countries, like the US and it's closest allies may boycott it...


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

I wouldn't worry Jim. If something in the past with little current relevence is the biggest thing our rivals can find to criticise about England 2018, I'd say we're in pretty good shape.


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## lpioe (May 6, 2006)

^^ If they really host someday chances are very slim that Chavez will still be in power. And I also don't think they would boycott it..
Football needs to grow a lot in the country before they can do it. I wonder what attendances the stadiums they built for the Copa America get in the league?

I also don't see Chile hosting it, at least not alone. The country has only some 16m inhabitants and nearly half of it live in or near Santiago.


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## HendrX (Oct 26, 2008)

I'm getting a bit nauseous here.

It's like you guys think that every time England makes a bid for a mayor event, they will get it because of their great stadiums,infratructure etc.... luckely it doesn;t work that way.


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## jandeczentar (Aug 14, 2009)

Poxuy, do you, by any chance, work for the Russian government? Attempting to blame the US and foreign media for every problem is the sign of a government and a country unsure of itself. The North Korean, Zimbabwean and Iranian governments all do that. Blaming outside influences deflects attention from their own failings. Russian foreign policy has been noted in the wider world lately for its sabre-rattling. Many of its near neighbours are concerned that Russia wants its old bloc back. The Polish government was most disappointed that the US decided not to place a missile shield in it's country. Whether their fear is justified or not is irrelevant. The fact is, many people believe worry at Russia's intentions and Russia itself does nothing to aussage their concerns. There is also the assassination of exiled Russian dissidents in foreign countries such as Alexander Litvinenko. The man accused of killing him will never stand trial, Moscow made sure of that. Or perhaps you think I'm being unfair or a mouthpiece of the US and the evil foreign media and Russia really is the beacon of democracy and free speech that you make it out to be. 

Moscow to Sochi = 844 miles (1,358Km) in a straight line (according to Google Earth). Sounds like a long way to me. It's certainly a lot further than the distance between venues in the other European bidders.

A340-500 - Football, and sport generally, shouldn't be political but it is because it costs so much money to stage big tournaments and brings in so much money in tourism. Politicians are needed to pass planning laws to get stadiums and infrastructure built. In addition, they are needed to sweet-talk the FIFA delegation into voting for their country (and greasing their palms if necessary). There is also the question of the World Cup sponsors who will apply pressure to get it in the country that is going to make them the most exposure or open up new markets for them. It is the same in all big sporting events. The best bid never wins; it is all political.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

HendrX said:


> I'm getting a bit nauseous here.
> 
> It's like you guys think that every time England makes a bid for a mayor event, they will get it because of their great stadiums,infratructure etc.... luckely it doesn;t work that way.


_None of us_ think we will get it for certain; we all know what happened to the 2006 bid. We just get annoyed when people throw unwarrented criticism towards us like grossly overexaggerating the hooliganism problem.

So, sorry if you feel _nauseous_ but that's just the way it is.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

HendrX said:


> I'm getting a bit nauseous here.
> 
> It's like you guys think that every time England makes a bid for a mayor event, they will get it because of their great stadiums,infratructure etc.... luckely it doesn;t work that way.


You couldn't be more wrong.

Let me remind you of your last post:



> **** England...............
> 
> 2018 World CUP Belgium and the Netherlands period!
> 
> They will have the best bid! And that´s what its all about!


Very classy, huh?

Seems to me that it is YOU who is the arrogant one who is assuming that your country's bid will win.

By contrast, all I've done is to point out that:

a) hooliganism is no longer a problem in England and that it is therefore ridiculous for people from Benelux countries to claim that the issue will damage England's bid.

b) the Benelux stadiums WILL, on average, be considerably smaller than the stadiums in Iberia and England (and possibly Russia too?). There is no getting away from it. It is a fact. And that means that the Benelux bid will have to compensate by being far better in almost every other respect than the other European bids. Can they do it? Of course they can. But it won't be easy for them.

You want to believe that the English are arrogantly assuming that we will win the vote because you want us to conform to some sort of hateful stereotype that is lodged in your imagination. You are allowing prejudice against the English to have clouded your judgement.

The truth is that no one has made any arrogant claims about England winning the vote. Which is more than can be said for you and your claims about the Benelux bid.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

*jandeczentar*
Working on government? What a typical brainwashed crap? If you want to talk politics go in other branch of forum. First you are writing that Russia is threatining Europe to cut gas, which is simply a lie of misinformed person and result of propaganda. Even this alone showing that next dialogue with you is useless. I can give you all facts about every moment in your comment and prove how US is using this to blackmail Russia. But not here. Poor victim of black/white bs. "Democracy" is just a beautiful word to justify political interests. World is not divided by democracy/non-democracy. There is a group of bankers, which owning Federal Reserve and printing dollars (paper, which doesn't connect with anything) and their controlled organisations like IMF, WHO, NATO,... which is spreading their interests under huge media propaganda, and protecting their actions by "democracy". US is slowly waking up, information is opening, people are protesting and understand what's going on.
But if you don't have a clue about politics and want to write bullshit without any fact, it's only YOUR problem. Next offtop will be ignored.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

poxuy said:


> *jandeczentar*
> Working on government? What a typical brainwashed crap? If you want to talk politics go in other branch of forum. First you are writing that Russia is threatining Europe to cut gas, which is simply a lie of misinformed person and result of propaganda. I can give you all facts about every moment in your comment and prove how US is using this to blackmail Russia. But not here. Poor victim of black/white bs. Really, if you don't have a clue about politics and want to write bullshit without any fact, it's only YOUR problem. Next offtop will be ignored.


Poxuy - this may have been discussed earlier in the thread but I don't know where and can't be bothered to search...........what will be the capacity of each of Russia's bid stadiums?


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

JimB said:


> Poxuy - this may have been discussed earlier in the thread but I don't know where and can't be bothered to search...........what will be the capacity of each of Russia's bid stadiums?


9 October, a day before Russia-Germany match, is an official beginning date of Bidding company. I will write all that will be known.


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## Adriel Ambrózio (Jan 17, 2009)

*I go for Australia 2018!*


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## Luke80 (Jul 1, 2009)

HendrX said:


> I'm getting a bit nauseous here.
> 
> It's like you guys think that every time England makes a bid for a mayor event, they will get it because of their great stadiums,infratructure etc.... luckely it doesn;t work that way.


That's how it should work!

What the **** is it with this hooligan problem? I think pretty much every country in Europe has a bigger problem with hooligans than England. We don't have terraces, we don't have any 'ultras' groups and our stadiums are the safest around. All the haters are living in the past and denying it - it just gets more heavily publicised here whereas across Europe it is just shovelled under the carpet.

Provided our stadiums are developed/expanded as promised then we should definitely win this bid. Our bid would be unigue in many ways - not least in the stadia! The percentage of possible stadia in our bid that would be the boring bowl shape is actually fairly low (especially compared to other countries). The only reason for these joint bids in because each of the respective countries don't have the resources or the money to host the tournament on their own. They are therefore inferior!

As for Platini, he hates England so of course he's against it!


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## Luke80 (Jul 1, 2009)

Every one of those Indonesian stadiums is an athletics venue not a football venue. They all look the same and would provide a terrible experience for fans.

WCs should be given to countries who have football as their first sport more often than those where it is not seen as important. I think there needs to be an obvious improvement in some countries football system before the WC is given. What motivation is there for FIFA otherwise.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Yes Luke, but we've seen a _technically_ inferior bid win the 2016 Olympics in the last week. There are a multitude of other factors to consider beside the technical ones which is why England is by no means a shoe-in and why we shouldn't get too ahead of ourselves.


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## bigbossman (Jun 25, 2007)

Luke80 said:


> Every one of those Indonesian stadiums is an athletics venue not a football venue. They all look the same and would provide a terrible experience for fans.
> 
> WCs should be given to countries who have football as their first sport more often than those where it is not seen as important. I think there needs to be an obvious improvement in some countries football system before the WC is given. What motivation is there for FIFA otherwise.


Football _is_ the number 1 sport in indonesia (check out the indonesian threads for pictures). Having athletics stadiums is not an indicator, just look at Italy and how Germany used to be. It just means that local government tries to leech of the success of the game by forcing teams to play in substandard venues.

However I do agree that athletics stadiums should be banned from world cups and Indonesia shouldn't get it until they have a decent football team.


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## bigbossman (Jun 25, 2007)

I personally think Russia may come with the best bid, the geography is not bad (better than the states, australia and brazil) and it's somewhere different.

We've had "recent" Euros in both England and the Benelux. 

As far as i am aware stadium capacity is irrelevant as long as you meet the criteria as FIFA makes it's money from TV and sponsorship.

It's a shame that the best 4 bids are European ones because we have this rotational policy. I would love it England, I'd love it the benelux, i'd love it in Russia (not so much portugal, spain solo yes).



Luke80 said:


> As for Platini, he hates England so of course he's against it!


Stop it Luke


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## CaliforniaJones (Apr 9, 2009)

TEBC said:


> I Think even with the controvertial Hugo Chavez on power, Venezuela could host it because doesnt have many conerns and have a lot of petrodolars. The stadiums from Copa America are new and very modern would be very good.
> 
> Colombia would have some problems with FARCs though


I have no doubt these stadiums are modern. But FIFA has asked 11 stadiums with 40000 places and 1 stadium with 80000 places. I saw stadiums of Venezuela and none have 80000 places, only 6 stadiums have the required minimum of places.

http://www.worldstadiums.com/south_america/countries/venezuela.shtml

Venezuela will have to work harder, even with oil revenues.

Colombia will also have lots of works to do to host a WC.

Argentina can host a WC, but they will have to upgrade some stadiums.

http://www.worldstadiums.com/south_america/countries/colombia.shtml


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## ormey (Jul 15, 2007)

from reading this thread a lot of jealousy from our european friends Holland and belguim imo dont have a chance russia is a interesting one though the moscow bid for the olmypics in 2012 downfall was down to the lack of infastructure. as Luke said plantini hates the uk so we will see .


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## KingmanIII (Aug 25, 2008)

I wish Russia would've filed a joint bid with the Ukraine so we could see matches played in Donbass.


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## Ribarca (Jan 28, 2005)

Spain and Portugal will win. They will have the support of Europe and importantly Latin America.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

KingmanIII said:


> I wish Russia would've filed a joint bid with the Ukraine so we could see matches played in Donbass.


hehe, if only a Donbass Arena, Donetzk is few kms from Rostov-na-Donu, but this will be already a joint bid, so I doubt.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

Ribarca said:


> Spain and Portugal will win. They will have the support of Europe and importantly Latin America.


They'll have the support of Latin America, certainly. But Latin America only has a small minority of the votes. It won't be enough, on its own, to get the Iberian bid very far.

Whatever gains Iberia makes in Latin America may be lost in Asia and Africa.

As to Europe, I see no reason why Iberia would get a significantly higher proportion of the vote than any of the other European bids.


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## ormey (Jul 15, 2007)

england has the majority of europe on its side and i imagine oceania because i cant see australia getting anywhere in there bid


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

ormey said:


> england has the majority of europe on its side and i imagine oceania because i cant see australia getting anywhere in there bid


Just as I don't think that Iberia will win most of the European votes, I don't think that England will either.

Each of the European bids will most likely win similar levels of support from within Europe.

As to Australia, forget about them. England are not in direct competition with them. Australia are in competition with all the other non European countries for whichever of WC 2018 or 2022 isn't held in Europe - and they stand as good a chance as any. Besides, Australia is no longer, in footballing terms, an Oceania country. It joined the Asian Football Confederation a couple of years ago.

You're right, though, to hope that Oceania's votes will go to England. Historical and cultrural ties make it more likely.


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## AGB93 (Jun 16, 2009)

England will win, no doubt about that...


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## ormey (Jul 15, 2007)

JimB said:


> Just as I don't think that Iberia will win most of the European votes, I don't think that England will either.
> 
> Each of the European bids will most likely win similar levels of support from within Europe.
> 
> ...


exactley if some of the country votes get knocked out england will get them thats why i think we will get the wc 2018


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## Joop20 (Jun 29, 2004)

Why do all Indonesian stadiums have athletics tracks? FIFA doesn't like them, and I think there's even a limit to the amount of stadiums that can have an atheltics track. Indonesia will have to build 6 to 8 rectangular, football specific stadiums for the world cup. I would love to see a world cup in Indonesia, but I really can't see them pulling it off before 2022. Maybe next time around guys, this one is for the USA or Oz...


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## krudmonk (Jun 14, 2007)

Honestly, why invest so much in a stadium and compromise the main draw (football) with running tracks that will rarely pack the stands?


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## Luke80 (Jul 1, 2009)

bigbossman said:


> Football _is_ the number 1 sport in indonesia (check out the indonesian threads for pictures). Having athletics stadiums is not an indicator, just look at Italy and how Germany used to be. It just means that local government tries to leech of the success of the game by forcing teams to play in substandard venues.
> 
> However I do agree that athletics stadiums should be banned from world cups and Indonesia shouldn't get it until they have a decent football team.


Sorry my 2nd point was not related to my first. Pretty obvious that Indonesia's first sport is football. My complaint was regarding the stadia. I agree with you.


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## Vicman (May 28, 2007)

TEBC said:


> Brazil, Chile, Argentina, Venezuela, Colombia. *50% of Conmebol Members*.
> 
> Equador and Uruguay would probably able if it is a join bid with other major country.


:nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts:

What?????? jaja (LOL), let's see. Man!!!, you're brazilian right yeah of course, look, I don't know exactly why you're talking that Europe and South America deserve a WC each 12 or 16 years (i don't remember ur comment), if u say it because of football level there, you're a little wrong, Europe ok, I agree, but South America, come on man, teams from the North are better than some of southamerican, african and asian countries. 

If you talk about the number of countries...Asia has more than another continent, then Africa and Europe.

Now, talking about economy...Colombiaaaaa??, Colombia wasn't able in order to host the WC in 86, Mexico was the solution, I think the really able countries now in South America are Brazil, Chile and Argentina and I got my doubts about them, maybe Venezuela but no. In North America obviously, United States, Mexico and Canada, (by the way, I don't know what's the true reason cuz of Mexico decline the host of WC), is complicated that Central America or Caribbean can host a WC.

I vote for United States!!


----------



## Vicman (May 28, 2007)

TEBC said:


> I feel the same way about it. But I think Qatar could bid as a join bid with other Arab Small Countries like UAE, Bahrein, Kwait, Oman and maybe even Saudi Arabia. Host Cities would be:
> 
> *UAE: Dubai and Abu Dhabi
> Oman: Mascat
> ...


:nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts:NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO 

Is the same as:

Guatemala: Guatemala City
Honduras: Tegucigalpa, San Pedro Sula
El Salvador: San Salvador
Costa Rica: San Jose
Trinidad & Tobago: Port Spain
Jamaica: Kingston

:lol:


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## Rekarte (Mar 28, 2008)

TEBC said:


> Brazil, Chile, Argentina, Venezuela, Colombia. 50% of Conmebol Members.
> 
> Equador and Uruguay would probably able if it is a join bid with other major country.


:yes:

I think Colombia, Argentina and Venezuela, and perhaps Peru, in the future would be able to host a World Cup


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## Rekarte (Mar 28, 2008)

Vicman said:


> :nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts:NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
> 
> Is the same as:
> 
> ...


Go Reggae Country!:banana::lol:


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

*Russia 2018/2022*

http://www.russia2018-2022.com/










*NORTHERN CLUSTER
Kaliningrad








St. Petersburg









CENTRAL CLUSTER
Moscow








Podolsk









VOLGA CLUSTER
Kazan








Nizhny Novgorod








Yaroslavl








Samara








Volgograd








Saransk









SOUTHERN CLUSTER
Krasnodar








Rostov-on-Don








Sochi









EAST OF URAL
Ekaterinburg*


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

Vicman said:


> :nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts::nuts:
> 
> What?????? jaja (LOL), let's see. Man!!!, you're brazilian right yeah of course, look, I don't know exactly why you're talking that Europe and South America deserve a WC each 12 or 16 years (i don't remember ur comment), if u say it because of football level there, you're a little wrong, Europe ok, I agree, but South America, come on man, teams from the North are better than some of southamerican, african and asian countries.
> 
> ...



Yes, Mexico is so perfect and better than South American Countries!! That´s why they want to play Copa Libertadores!! And If Mexico, no doubt, is more capable to host, why withdraw the competition?? You should visit more south american countries to learn about they capacity.


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## Ecological (Mar 19, 2009)

One thing English football fans can be proud off though. If they dont get the chance to see the tourament in thier home country. They will make sure thier national team feel like they are playing at home wherever the world cup may take place. Thats something alot of nations dont have the luxury of having. 

Take nothing for granted but depending on history of the event I think it's a two horse race between Russia and England.


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## Bogus Law (Mar 6, 2009)

@ Russian bid: after first glance at the map I'd rather add Volgograd to the southern cluster - it's much closer to Rostov-na-Donu and Sochi than Samara and Yaroslavl. 
It's an interesting bid but still England's an absolute favourite for me


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

Bogus Law said:


> @ Russian bid: after first glance at the map I'd rather add Volgograd to the southern cluster - it's much closer to Rostov-na-Donu and Sochi than Samara and Yaroslavl.
> It's an interesting bid but still England's an absolute favourite for me


It's not in South Cluster, because it's *Volgo*grad, on river Volga and in its cluster  . I have some feeling that except other opportunities to travel between cities, our Committee is preparing water excursions on Volga between matches for fans  , nature is very beautiful there.


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## Vicman (May 28, 2007)

TEBC said:


> Yes, *Mexico is so perfect and better *than South American Countries!! That´s why they want to play Copa Libertadores!! And If Mexico, no doubt, is more capable to host, *why withdraw the competition?? *You should visit more south american countries to learn about they capacity.


 :nuts:

What a sarcasm man!!!!hno:

I don't know why the hell but Mexico is the first who wants to organize a WC, politics are stronger, maybe FIFA doesn't want that Mexico organize it, we have 2 tournaments and FIFA knows that Mexico is so capable to do it for third time, we have population, we have a lot of stadiums, we can create more infrastructure. You know Mexico wants too a Copa America and what happens? CONMEBOL doesn't give us the host why?? I don't know why but Copa America should join CONMEBOL and CONCACAF and make a REAL COPA AMERICA, not only as invited countries.

And I dont' know why your comment??? "LEARN ABOUT THE CAPACITY"????, about which country??? or which stadium?? or what???..Mexico city, Guadalajara, Monterrey, Puebla, Querétaro, Torreon, Morelia has a good capacity stadiums.

By the way Mexico doesn't want to play Copa Libertadores, we play it!!, what we want to play again is Copa Sudamericana which CONCACAF and CONMEBOL take off us.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

Ecological said:


> One thing English football fans can be proud off though. If they dont get the chance to see the tourament in thier home country. They will make sure thier national team feel like they are playing at home wherever the world cup may take place. Thats something alot of nations dont have the luxury of having.
> 
> Take nothing for granted but depending on history of the event *I think it's a two horse race between Russia and England*.


I don't think it is at all.

Plenty of votes to be won and lost between now and December 2010. England may be the early favourites. But recent FIFA and IOC bidding votes have have thrown up a number of surprises. 

All four European bids will very much be in the running.


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## ryebreadraz (Sep 4, 2008)

Unlike proposed clusters for a USA World Cup, which has an equal number of cities per cluster, which would allow two groups per cluster, the Russian proposal has an uneven number per cluster. How will they assign groups to each of the clusters to assure that all of the cities host a decent number of matches, while also keeping any team from having to leave their cluster?


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## Bogus Law (Mar 6, 2009)

poxuy said:


> It's not in South Cluster, because it's *Volgo*grad, on river Volga and in its cluster  .


Yes, obviously I understand that the name Volgograd derives from the river. But still I find it quite an artificial solution to assign a city to a particular cluster by its name rather than by geografical proximity. 
Unless water transport is better developed in Russia than roads and railways and travelling by boat along the Volga river would be faster and more comfortable than by car or train. In this case it would make more sense.


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## lemog (Oct 2, 2009)

It will be interesting to have the exclave of Kaliningrad on the World Cup. It would be great to see it in Vladivostok, but it won't ever happen.


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## SuCumaethor (Sep 10, 2009)

lemog said:


> It will be interesting to have the exclave of Kaliningrad on the World Cup. It would be great to see it in *Vladivostok*, but it won't ever happen.



Yea  . And Novosibirsk too. It would be nice to develop east Russia.


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## TEBC (Dec 26, 2004)

Why the hell they merged 2018 and 2022 threads?!?!?!!?!?!?!


----------



## ryebreadraz (Sep 4, 2008)

TEBC said:


> Why the hell they merged 2018 and 2022 threads?!?!?!!?!?!?!


Because both 2018 and 2022 will be awarded at the same time and only Qatar and South Korea are bidding on just one. Just because you assume 2018 will go to Europe doesn't mean much and considering the bid process will be the same for both, it makes no sense to have separate threads. If the bids won't differentiate, why should we?


----------



## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)




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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

The bids will have an Expo in Cape Town in December this year, during the Final Draw week of events.


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## Jim856796 (Jun 1, 2006)

For a FIFA World Cup in Russia, these five cities already have the required stadiums built: Moscow, St. Petersburg, Kazan, Nizhniy Novgorod, and Sochi (the last four are actually proposed or under construction). Several other cities will have to come up with their own plans for new football stadia. Those cities are Podolsk, Kalingrad, Yaroslavl, Somara, Volgograd, Saransk, Krasnodar, Rostov-na-Donu, and Yekaterinburg. Russia may be the largest country in area, but it is seriously lacking in the football stadium department.


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## ormey (Jul 15, 2007)

the uk 15 cities that are applying to be host cities only nottingham and bristol dont have a stdium built in mind for the wc other cities stadiums would just need upgrading .


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

> *FIFA head Blatter praises Russia's World Cup bid*
> 
> MOSCOW, October 15 (RIA Novosti) - Russia's bid to stage the World Cup has won the "whole-hearted" support of FIFA President Sepp Blatter.
> 
> ...


http://en.rian.ru/sports/20091015/156478014.html



> *Prime Minister Vladimir Putin met with FIFA President Joseph Blatter*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


http://premier.gov.ru/eng/events/3907.html


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

> *On 4 December 2009, FIFA will host a media event in which the 11 bidders for the 2018 and/or 2022 FIFA World Cup will be able to present their bids to the international media at the Cape Town International Convention Centre (CTICC) in South Africa.* The accreditation procedure will be conducted via the FIFA Media Channel.
> Teams bidding include Australia, Belgium-Netherlands, England, Indonesia, Japan, Korea Republic, Mexico, Qatar, Spain-Portugal, Russia and the USA. The event will include interview opportunities with representatives of the bidders. Media transport will be arranged from the media hotels and the CTICC.
> 
> The event is independent from the Final Draw and a separate media accreditation will be required to access the event. The accreditation procedure for this bidders media event will be conducted via the FIFA Media Channel, where a specific accreditation form will be available from 1 October to 30 October 2009.
> ...


http://www.bizcommunity.com/Article/410/147/41444.html


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## Big Cat (Dec 1, 2008)

*My prediction:*

1. The 2018 bid will go to Europe - *Russia*.

2. The 2022 bid will go to *Australia*.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

> *Russians put England's 2018 World Cup bid in the shade*
> 
> Executives behind England's 2018 World Cup bid today announced they had finally secured the full £15m budget needed to fund it. However, their relief was short-lived after their Russian rivals announced a target figure of $40m (£24m) and revealed they planned to ask Roman Abramovich and other oligarchs to dip into their pockets for a few roubles more.
> 
> ...


http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/dec/01/england-russia-2018-world-cup

There will be first bid presentations at december 4th, before the draw.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

*Rauball: Deutsche Unterstützung für WM in Russland*

In English: Germany will support Russian WC bid  .


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## GEwinnen (Mar 3, 2006)

poxuy said:


> *Rauball: Deutsche Unterstützung für WM in Russland*
> 
> In English: Germany will support Russian WC bid  .


Is this a late revenge for England's bid for the 2006 WC? Beckenbauer as german's and the world's football - "Lichtgestalt" has a big influence in Fifa's executive committee, his favourite was England up to now, but who knows...


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Beckenbauer has said all along he's supporting England. So either they've changed their mind or something's amiss.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

> However, their relief was short-lived after their Russian rivals announced a target figure of $40m (£24m) and revealed they planned to ask Roman Abramovich and other oligarchs to dip into their pockets for a few roubles more.


Considering the billions they've (in essence) stolen from the Russian populace I think this would be fair of them.






:|


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## cmc (Oct 4, 2005)

*2018*-England or Russia

*2022*-USA or Australia


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## 1772 (Aug 18, 2009)

GunnerJacket said:


> Considering the billions they've (in essence) stolen from the Russian populace I think this would be fair of them.
> 
> :|


Come again?


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

Where will be the bid presentations online today?


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

1772 said:


> Come again?


To put it lightly, the current Russian business oligarchs like Abromovich came about their wealth through shady political arrangements that adversely impacted local economies. Swindlers with political connections. Thus, there is no nobility in approving of their wealth, let alone celebrating it.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

All videos from today's presentations:

http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/bidders/index.html


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Holland/Belgium's is great! :lol:


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## alikerem (May 10, 2008)

My prediction:

1. The 2018 bid will go to Russia

2. The 2022 bid will go to Indonesia


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## entreact333 (Jun 3, 2007)

Portugal & Spain


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## SSE (Jul 28, 2009)

GEwinnen said:


> Is this a late revenge for England's bid for the 2006 WC? Beckenbauer as german's and the world's football - "Lichtgestalt" has a big influence in Fifa's executive committee, his favourite was England up to now, but who knows...


It sounds like England is still being supported by Beckenbauer but the League President is supporting Russia.

It still seems a bit strange, but if I had to pick between the two as to who supported the English bid I'd pick Der Kaiser every time.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

The best one was Australia's; really excellent film which got its point across and was slick.

I liked Holland/Belgium's next. Well made, got the point across and you've got to love their crazy sense of humour.

I think England's comes after these two; it got the point across very well indeed but wasn't as slick as either of the above.

The USA, Russia, and Spain/Portugal come next. The USA was substance over style, lots of stats but somehow not as exciting as I thought it should be. Russia and Spain/Portugal were the opposite, nicely made, but didn't tell me why FIFA should go to either.

Qatar's I only watched to see how much they put into it really; I don't think they've got much of a chance. And, despite being the most expensive looking, it was a lovely piece of spin and not much more. I didn't believe any of it, it felt very fake. The least convincing of the ones I watched.

The others I didn't bother watching. Japan and Korea are a bit cheeky bidding so soon after 2002, and I don't think Indonesia will be getting either world cup.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

^^ you know, the message about why WC should be in their country, were sent not only through these videos. It was just an addition to presentations and few days of Bid Expo before, where every country could explain everything and answer on any questions. I want to say that analyzing bids only by videos is not enough.


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## rus (Nov 20, 2009)

Russia is a very good! Spartak Moscow forewer!


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

poxuy said:


> ^^ you know, the message about why WC should be in their country, were sent not only through these videos. It was just an addition to presentations and few days of Bid Expo before, where every country could explain everything and answer on any questions. I want to say that analyzing bids only by videos is not enough.


Did I say it was? Where did I say in my post I was doing anything more than analysing the videos?


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

I was talked mostly about this:
"but didn't tell me why FIFA should go to either."

They didn't show it in video, because were explaining it during all Expo.


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## ryebreadraz (Sep 4, 2008)

Brchc said:


> Do u people only think about England and Russia?
> 
> ok, qatar is not a good choice, but indonesia and australia have a chance in 2022
> 
> ...


Why would we be discussing Indonesia and Australia in a thread on EUROPEAN bids?


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## Brchc (Jan 2, 2010)

ryebreadraz said:


> Why would we be discussing Indonesia and Australia in a thread on EUROPEAN bids?


Maybe because it's fun? Or because their bids may influence European bids?
If you read some posts you'll see you people discussed a lot about indonesia and australia in this thread...
Be patient, i'm still new here...


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

RobH said:


> Well, that article implies to me the biggest problem is for the Iberian bid. If Blatter has softened his position and accepts smaller countries can't host on their own, he and FIFA may be willing to consider Belgium & the Netherlands. But he'd surely wonder what Spain was playing at, wouldn't he? I know Portugal can't host on their own, but Spain certainly can and the Iberian bid is, to all intents and purpouses, Spain plus two or three venues over the border. If he only wants joint bids from countries incapable of hosting on their own, that puts Spain in a very awkward position indeed.
> 
> I think 2018 is between England and Russia at the moment, and I wouldn't like to call it either way. I might be wrong, but from everything I've read that's what I think these are the two out in front in the European race.


Blatter supporting a single nation bid is not news.

While they will still be allowed is perhaps a surprise, its not news that FIFA will prefer having to deal with one nation and its issues rather than two nations and the issues between those countries e.g. visas, transport, politics, funding etc.

Portugal/Spain would host a great world cup and so would NED/BEL, but when there are other single nation bids, FIFA will favour these.

How the members vote though will be another story.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

I know it's not news, but the fact that he keep reiterating his stance despite letting the bids in _is_ news. And the more he says this, the less likely a joint hosting is to occur I would have thought.


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

RobH said:


> I know it's not news, but the fact that he keep reiterating his stance despite letting the bids in _is_ news. And the more he says this, the less likely a joint hosting is to occur I would have thought.


I suppose but assuming there is no "shortlist". A vote is a vote, and if 13 members like Portugal/Spain, then thats where the WC is going.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

Intreresting moment.

Based on latest news about Russia-2018/2022 on places of future stadiums, at least 12 stadiums (of all 15) will be in nearest location to water (river/sea):

*Kaliningrad










St.Petersburg










Moscow



















Kazan










Nizhny Novgorod










Yaroslavl










Samara










Volgograd










Saransk










Sochi










Yekaterinburg*










+ Rostov-on-Don (Don), Krasnodar (Kuban), Podolsk (Pakhra), it will be known later.


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## CaliforniaJones (Apr 9, 2009)

This is some technical views of strength and weaknessess of European bid received. 

*Belgium/Netherlands*
Government:strong support
Public: ???
Stadiums: 14 stadiums in 12 cities
Training facilities: Excellent facilities
Standard of football: not bad
Transportation: excellent air and urban transport
Media & Telecommunications: excellent facilities
Hotels: excellent hotel infrastructure
Safety and security: very good facilities
Medical centres: excellent network

*England*
Government: strong support
Public: huge support
Stadiums: 15 stadiums in 12 cities
Training facilities: Excellent facilities
Standard of football: great clubs (Manchester United, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal) & great history in World cup
Transportation: excellent air & urban transport infrastructure
Media & Telecommunications: Excellent facilities
Hotels: excellent hotel infrastructure
Safety and security: very good facilities
Medical centres: very good network.

*Portugal/Spain*
Government: strong support
Public: ???
Stadiums: ???
Training facilities: Excellent facilities
Standard of football: great clubs & good national teams
Transportation: excellent air and urban transport
Media & Telecommunications: ecellent facilities
Hotels: excellent hotel infrastructure
Safety and security: very good facilities
Medical centres: excellent network

*Russia*
Government: strong support
Public: ???
Stadiums: 15 stadiums in 12 cities
Training facilities: Excellent facilities
Standard of football: 
Transportation: good air and urban transport
Media & Telecommunications: very good facilities
Hotels: excellent hotel infrastructure
Safety and security: very good facilities
Medical centres: very good network


You can make corrections.


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

The support in the Netherlands is huge. It wouldn't suprise me at all if support here would even be higher than in England. It is one of the few topics where there is 100% support from the politics (so even extreme left and rightwing parties really want the WC). From public view it is by far the most wanted event that people can imagine. 

At the last event the national team had 50.000 supporters at the first game and at the end about 100.000 in Switserland and Austria. When Bon Jovi had a concert in the Amsterdam ArenA when Holland had to play, they decided to start the the football match and start the concert later. Bon Jovi fans are not typical football fans, but they are clearly fan when Holland has to play:





For Belgium it is a little bit hard to say for me what the support is and will be. I am sure it is high, but can't say how high.


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## I_live_cement (Jan 5, 2009)

Wuppeltje said:


> It wouldn't suprise me at all if support here would even be higher than in England.


Sorry, but what does that even mean?


----------



## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

I_live_cement said:


> Sorry, but what does that even mean?


Support by the public for the Dutch/Belgium WC 2018/2022 bid.


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## BobDaBuilder (Jun 7, 2005)

We should not have the World Cup in Russia until it alters those Draconian visa rules for tourists, become a democratic nation which respects human rights.

When this happens I would love Russia to stage the World Cup. Maybe the world should consider South African apartheid style bans on places like Russia.

FIFA should not reward criminal states like the IOC does.


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## alekssa1 (Jan 29, 2009)

Russian visa is easier and faster to get than many other visas. Dislike many countries, it does not even ask for fingerprints


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

BobDaBuilder said:


> become a democratic nation which respects human rights.


hm, are you drunk? Don't fall for US media propaganda, which specially creates false vision of other countries to make US foreign policy "spread" so-called "democracy", but in fact, just install puppet governement and steal resources. Wake up.

There is no "democracy" in USA/UK and other so-called western countries. There is only illusion of "democracy". Residents are selected (not presidents are elected). In USA, 2 parties are two hands of one body. I think adequate people already should realise it, isn't it?
Your comment is really full of shit.



BobDaBuilder said:


> FIFA should not reward criminal states like the IOC does.


Most criminal state today, with biggest number of prisoners, thieves, rapes, total crimes is USA. This is statistics. But you may be not know it, because you are brainwashed and don't want to know facts.

I think you understand that you are totally wrong and will stop offtoping.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

About visas, from interview with A.Sorokin:

*- Given the difficulties in acquiring a Russian visa from an EU country and the heavy police and army presence at the recent Russia v Germany World Cup qualifier, what measures will you take to make FIFA's flagship event a more fan-friendly experience?*
- I’m sure by 2018 there will be no visas, because Russia is fully prepared to abolish visas processes. We’re just waiting for an okay from the European Union and other countries to do that, as we did during the 2008 Champions League final. Then we said everyone who comes with a ticket comes without a visa and it was beneficial experience. There were no complaints.

Full interview is here: http://www.worldfootballinsider.com/Story.aspx?id=32887


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Ignore Bobby, he's obviously trolling.


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

> *Russia sign up auditors who helped Sochi win 2014 Olympics to World Cup bid*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


http://www.insideworldfootball.biz/...cs-to-world-cup-bid&catid=70:russia&Itemid=83


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

Some of Bid Ambassadors (Ruud Gullit, Ronald de Boer, Alexey Smertin, Fernando Hierro) will play on "Legends Cup" in Moscow, February 6-7th.










Platini and Blatter will also visit Moscow at 22-23 January, during "CIS Insurance Cup"  .


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## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

> *Markus Siegler Joins Russia Bid as Blatter Flies to Moscow*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


http://www.worldfootballinsider.com/Story.aspx?id=32930


----------



## poxuy (Apr 27, 2008)

> *FIFA head, Medvedev talk Russia World Cup bid in freezing Moscow*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


http://en.rian.ru/sports/20100122/157653547.html


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## nomarandlee (Sep 24, 2005)

poxuy said:


> hm, are you drunk? Don't fall for US media propaganda, which specially creates false vision of other countries to make US foreign policy "spread" so-called "democracy", but in fact, just install puppet governement and steal resources. Wake up.
> 
> There is no "democracy" in USA/UK and other so-called western countries. There is only illusion of "democracy". Residents are selected (not presidents are elected). In USA, 2 parties are two hands of one body. I think adequate people already should realise it, isn't it?
> Your comment is really full of shit.
> ...


 I love how goofball Russian sheep will go on wild tangents against the US when they criticism they face isn't even from the US or has any context about the US in it. They are such reflexive Putinites that they just start throwing wildly throwing out cliches about the US that Putin TV has told them for a decade. 

I could respond and talk about the Russian alcoholism, murder rate, corruption, extra judicial killings......oh well, I guess I just did.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

^^ Well, not really. Since we can't have two European world cups in a row, it's effectively asking which European country would you like to host in 2018 or 2022 (most likely 2018). FIFA will give one of these tournaments to Europe and not the other; that's certain.


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## Kenni (Jul 26, 2007)

I get you. But that doesn't reflect preferences.

I would've done something like this..

England 2018
England 2022
Portugal Spain 2018
Portugal Spain 2022

.......and so on.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Platini is 90% sure the US will withdraw from 2018, meaning the 2022 options are really no longer valid for a thread on European bids. The only scenario in which I can see FIFA awarding 2022 to Europe is if they favour Russia and want to give them longer to build their venues and infrastructure (handing 2018 to the US by default), but even that scenario is probably unlikely. Realistically, European nations are going for 2018, with Qatar, Australia, the US, Korea and Japan looking to 2022. This poll, for all intents and purpouses, is asking who you want to be the 2018 host.


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## Kenni (Jul 26, 2007)

Fair.

I just thought since we are asking SSC forumers on what they would like/prefer.


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

Any ideas for when we should do the live "24hr" vote? Should votes be public? Should we first vote for 2018 in the first 24 hrs, followed by a new poll with only the relevant bidders in the following 24 hrs?


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Is there an inspection report due? If so, a few days after that is released maybe?


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

You mean the "your bid is good" or "your bid is very good" or "your bid is excellent" report?

Who knows.

Oh wait. I like these reports. It ranked RSA above England for 2006


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

A good little interview with Vitaly Mutko and a summary of Russia's bid and their reasons for bidding:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2010/sep/09/russia-england-world-cup-2018

More propaganda from the British media. Disgusting isn't it?


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## LarisaCh (Apr 12, 2010)

RobH said:


> A good little interview with Vitaly Mutko and a summary of Russia's bid and their reasons for bidding:
> 
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2010/sep/09/russia-england-world-cup-2018
> 
> More propaganda from the British media. Disgusting isn't it?


OK, in your article Harding quoted Vitaliy Mutko. Here is *personal position of Luke Harding:*

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2010/sep/09/russia-england-world-cup-2018

*Russia battle England once more – and this time it's for the World Cup*

*While England promote their 'safe' option, Russia's bid team for the 2018 World Cup want the tournament to be a historic moment.*

Vitaly Mutko is in a confident mood. Surveying Moscow's Luzhniki Stadium, with its luridly green artificial pitch, Mutko recalls watching Russia beat England 2-1 here during their 2007 European qualifier. It had seemed like England's night, he recalled. "Everyone was in a miserable mood at half-time. We were losing 1-0. I predicted we would score twice. And we did," he says happily.

The next installment in Russia's rivalry with England takes place on 2 December, when Fifa's executive committee meets in Zurich to decide who will host the 2018 World Cup. Mutko refuses to make any hubristic pronouncements about Russia's chances. "Self-confidence sometimes leads to tragedies in sport," he says.

And yet with three months to go until Fifa's secret ballot, the Russians appear quietly certain that they and not England will emerge victorious. Mutko's optimism stems from a single powerful idea – that a Russian World Cup would be a more dynamic, more compelling, and more nation-transforming event than a 'safe', and possibly dull, English one. It would, in short, be a moment in history.

At a time when Fifa's president, Sepp Blatter, is pondering his legacy to world football, *the Russians are pledging to bring the tournament to the former communist bloc for the first time.* Asked whether Russia's bid might be more interesting than England's, *Mutko jumps off his feet, and sweeps his fist through the air with a triumphant and affirmative "Da".* "I would just grab this country Russia and say there will be so much done for football!" he says.

Mutko, Russia's minister for sport, is clearly irritated by recent stories in the British press reporting how Lokomotiv Moscow fans celebrated Peter Odemwingie's recent sale to West Bromwich Albion with a banner showing a banana and the message: "Thanks West Brom." He is also rattled by reports suggesting widespread corruption in Russia, believing these themes have been deliberately overblown to sabotage Russia's bid.

But it is the concept, and not the on-going Anglo-Russian information war, that Mutko believes will win over Fifa. Intriguingly, Sergei Fursenko, the president of Russia's Football Union, talks about Russia's 2018 bid in highly mystical terms. He says that many fans have only a vague idea of what Russia is like, and says that hosting the tournament would enable visitors who come to Russia to experience the "Russian soul". "People are very hospitable and very open. The soul is all embracing, including of foreigners. You have to be not scared of Russians."

Russia's well-organised bid committee – which hosted Fifa's inspection team last month – talk about their ambitions in sweeping terms. *They see a Russian World Cup as nothing less than an event of historical proportions, on a par with the second world war and the heroic defeat of the Nazis.*

"England had everything," said Alexander Djordjadze, the director of bid planning and operations. "You ruled the world. You invented football. You have the richest league. You are solid and strong as a cultural entity.

"For us the entire 20th century was an immense sacrifice. We are now building a new country. The World Cup would help us make a different people and a new nation. For Fifa to give it to [post-communist] Russia would be a bold political gesture."

Alexei Sorokin, Russia's multilingual 2018 bid chief, believes that the influx of fans to Russia would transform the way the country is perceived by the rest of the world. It would help overcome what he views as a negative and unfair image of Russia, concocted erroneously, he feels, by the western media. "We would be perceived the way we merit to be perceived. It would eliminate this prejudice against us."

The tournament would also showcase what Russia had achieved "in a record period of time" since the collapse of communism.

England's stadiums and facilities are more or less complete – so much so that in August Blatter admitted it would be "easy" to hold the World Cup in England. Paradoxically, this fact may work to England's disadvantage.

Russia, by contrast, is proposing a once-in-a-generation investment in infrastructure, which would transform sport across the world's largest country, and bring football to backward regions stretching from the Polish borders to the Pacific coast.

It has promised new stadiums, high-speed rail links between host cities, new airports, hotels and training pitches. Some of this is happening anyway. Russia is already building six stadiums and has promised to construct nine more if it wins the World Cup. Portraying itself as the meeting point between east and west – in fact the border between Europe and Asia runs through the potential host city of Yekaterinburg in the Urals – Russia plans to stage the tournament in clusters.

The final, a semi-final and the opening match would take place in Moscow's Luzhniki, the venue for the 1980 Olympic Games. Other matches would take place in a northern cluster centred on St Petersburg, a Volga cluster along Europe's longest river, and a southern cluster that includes Sochi, the balmy seaside resort that will host the 2014 Winter Olympics, and is a favoured chill-zone for Kremlin politicians.

Mutko points out that Vladimir Putin – Russia's prime minister, who is travelling to Zurich for the Fifa vote – has personally guaranteed all stadiums will be built on time. The bill? For sporting infrastructure alone it will come to $6bn. *Over the past decade, eight as president and two as prime minister, Putin has had an overriding mission: to restore Russia's greatness after what he regards as a period of chaos and humiliating weakness under Boris Yeltsin. The later half of his presidential stint coincided with a dramatic downturn in relations between London and Moscow, and England's bitter Luzhniki defeat.

A Russian World Cup would confirm that Russia's is back as a great world power. And it would also be another defeat for England, the icing on Putin's cake.*


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

That's nice.


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## Walbanger (Jan 10, 2006)

LarisaCh said:


> A Russian World Cup would confirm that Russia's is back as a great world power. And it would also be another defeat for England, the icing on Putin's cake.[/b]


Would a Benelux, Australian or Qatari World Cup confirm them as a Great power?

I'm not anti Russian, I don't even mind their bid. Russians really have to know that the whole world doesn't hate them or think them inferior. Some may have reservations about the Russian Government but that doesn't mean that the Russian people or Culture is held in contempt by anyone. I don't know what Russians think the West thinks of them but I assure you most in the West or the whole world for that matter don't think much about it at all, too busy doing their own thing.


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## AILD (May 1, 2010)

Walbanger said:


> ...


"West" usually has artificially created vision based on such "films" like "Salt" and it's enough to be an "expert on Russia" :lol: .

How many people I know were in Russia and repeated that it has nothing common with those vision they had before.

It's nothing new, booring and very predicted, based on information which "west" receives from its media. And this is already creating problems for national interests. Best example - in business.

So there is a direct connection. If you want to press country economically - create idiotic vision of its people and repeat it million times.

It's not a "coincidence". It's a deliberate tactic.

I hope you understand that it's not a "complex" like many think. It's an adequate concern, based on lessons from the past.


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

AILD said:


> "West" usually has artificially created vision based on such "films" like "Salt" and it's enough to be an "expert on Russia" :lol: .


do you seriously think people in the west consider a movie like Salt as a doco on Russia?

next thing you will be telling me Australian's consider Crocodile Dundee a doco on life in Australia

Salt had Angelina Jolie in it for gods sake - you took it seriously?!?!? :lol:


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## AILD (May 1, 2010)

T74 said:


> do you seriously think people in the west consider a movie like Salt as a doco on Russia?


Doesn't matter how people consider it. This is how propaganda works. Repeat the same false vision during decades in thousands of films, and people will have exact stupid negative assossations with everything Russian.

It works as sum of all parameters - TV, media, education, computer games, films, etc.


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

AILD said:


> Doesn't matter how people consider it. This is how propaganda works. Repeat the same false vision during decades in thousands of films, and people will have exact stupid negative assossations with everything Russian.
> 
> It works as sum of all parameters - TV, media, education, computer games, films, etc.


you need to get a grip mate - no-one thinks Australian's walk around wrestling crocs and saying "thats not a knife, this is a knife"

likewise we don't think China is full of gung fu warriors, France full of playboys out to steal our women, Egypt con-men who sell ancient artifacts to evil millionaires, and of course Antarctica full of dancing penguins

ITS ONLY A MOVIE


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

> This is how propaganda works.


Yeah, I feel the same way about Notting Hill, Mary Poppins, Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels and Oliver!

Fucking anti-British propaganda :lol:

What people abroad must think of my country hno:


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

RobH said:


> Yeah, I feel the same way about Notting Hill, Mary Poppins, Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels and Oliver!
> 
> Fucking anti-British propaganda :lol:
> 
> What people abroad must think of my country hno:


dude....what about SHAMELESS!!! :banana:

then again, we have Home and Away, Neighbours, and Prisoner :nuts:


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## AILD (May 1, 2010)

RobH said:


> Yeah, I feel the same way about Notting Hill, Mary Poppins, Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels and Oliver!
> 
> Fucking anti-British propaganda :lol:
> 
> What people abroad must think of my country hno:


You didn't catch the point  . Propaganda is when country and its people are imaged as the same idiotic false vision in ALL (biggest majority) of films where it somehow has.

Your example fails.


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## AILD (May 1, 2010)

T74 said:


> ITS ONLY A MOVIE


This is not an argument.

Fundament for vision of the world is constructing in childhood. When kid sees anyone as the same crazy moron in all of his sources (films, education, computer games, "documentaries"), he will have this vision in all of his further life, if he will be too lazy to find real information.

Also, it was already proved by Goebbels work: no matter what you want to show, just repeat it thousand times, and people will accept it as truth.

Of course, these "movies" will not have big influence on vision of grown-up people. But how can you guarantee that kids will not fall for these very smart lies. Seeing drunk cosmonaut in Armageddon (what, americans don't know who was first cosmonaut in space? And what country had more than 40 "first" achievements in space? And now "great americans" are flying in space on Russian Soyuz, driven by "drunk" consmonauts, yeah); playing "No Russian" mission in CoD:MW or killing Soviet soldiers (who fought for his life during WW2) in Singularity, etc. Examples have no end.

If you don't see continuation of anti-Russian (already against Russian culture and people, not ideology) propaganda in information sphere, you must be blind or just don't want to accept it.


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

pixel2008 said:


> The 1996 European Football Championship hosted by England was amazing. I loved the atmosphere and the stadiums.
> 
> I can imagine the atmosphere during The World Cup in England, not to mention the world fameous venues at which the games would be played.
> 
> ...


Love it, Come on ENGLAND!


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

*Pressure is growing on FIFA Executive Committee member Vitaly Mutko to resign as Russia's Sports Minister after it emerged that he claimed expenses for the equivalent of five breakfasts a day while he was attending the Olympics in Vancouver earlier this year, where the team had its worst ever performance.

Mutko was already facing questions following details of an investigation carried out by the Audit Chamber and ordered by Russian President Dmitry Medvedev had revealed that his hotel suite during the Games in Canada cost $1,500 (£986) a night - more than ten times what he was legally allowed to claim under Government rules.

The total bill for Mutko's 20-day trip to Vancouver and his two deputies was $34,000 (£22,000).Now it has been revealed that Mutko claimed for an additional $4,500 (£2,959) during his stay for 97 breakfasts - which translates to nearly five a day.

It is widely accepted that Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin would have forced Mutko to resign after Vancouver if it were not for the fact that he is a lynch-pin of the country's bid to host the 2018 FIFA World Cup.

Mutko is a key and influential member of the FIFA Executive Committee and the fear is that if he is damaged at home politically it will affect Russia's bid, which has emerged as the favourites ahead of England.

Mutko denied accusations of misspending, calling them "speculation" and "total rubbish".*

http://www.insideworldfootball.biz/...e-breakfasts-a-day-&catid=70:russia&Itemid=83


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## JYDA (Jul 14, 2008)

MysteryMike said:


> The total bill for Mutko's 20-day trip to Vancouver and his two deputies was $34,000 (£22,000).Now it has been revealed that Mutko claimed for an additional $4,500 (£2,959) during his stay for 97 breakfasts - which translates to nearly five a day.


Canadian maple syrup on pancakes is an addictive mix


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

JYDA said:


> Canadian maple syrup on pancakes is an addictive mix


Oh yeah and you can never find the top quality stuff these days, I mean no wonder the guy paid that much, it's really understandable. Canada has to make more maple syrup. The situation is just getting ridiculous, we can't have FIFA committee members going down for maple syrup charges. I mean they didn't go down for ticketing rorts, bribes or blackmail, so it'd be a real shame if he went down, just because he wanted the best syrup for his food, I mean we've all been there :runaway:


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

maybe he's just hungry.....you know how small those hotel breakfasts are :lol:


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## Fobos2030 (Mar 18, 2009)

hehehe *Mo Rush* forgot, we still have this poll


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

CustomSignBanner said:


> U.S. will hopefully host the 2022 games !!!! fingers crossed


Please remove your signature. It is not in line with SSC guidelines.


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## TheoG (Mar 20, 2010)

Mo Rush said:


> Please remove your signature. It is not in line with SSC guidelines.


Gotta love subtle plugging, it's one of the great joys in life.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

*England to withdraw Russia 2018 complaint after apology*

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/9134479.stm

England's 2018 World Cup bid team is to withdraw a complaint to Fifa about Russia's campaign following an apology from their rival bidder.

The Russian sports minister Vitaly Mutko has apologised for comments made by Alexei Sorokin, who is general director of the nation's bid team. England's official complaint was that Russia had broken bidding rules when he made disparaging comments about London. Fifa's committee met on Thursday to receive reports on the bids. 

The English bid team had complained that Sorokin highlighted London's "high crime rate" and youth alcohol problems in an interview with Russian media that appeared to contravene Fifa's rules about talking about rival bidders. Mr Mutko approached England 2018 chairman Geoff Thompson with a genuine apology in an honourable manner England 2018 spokesperson.

Tensions between the two bids then intensified after Viacheslav Koloskov, honorary president of the Russian Football Union, referred to England's 2018 bid as "absolutely primitive" and "comical". 

Yet the England 2018 team say they are keen to move on from the controversy, and believe Russia's bid team are genuinely sorry. "We, of course, accepted this apology and appreciate the gesture. We now wish to move on from this matter." 

Aside from England and Russia's bids, Spain and Portugal have a joint bid on the table for 2018, as do Netherlands and Belgium. Meanwhile the 2022 World Cup hosts will be from Australia, the United States, Qatar, Japan and South Korea. 

The winning bids are set to be announced following a vote by the Fifa executive committee in Zurich on 2 December.


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## TheoG (Mar 20, 2010)

Yeah, seems like the most mature response from both sides, best to avoid a full on war of words, I think, just forgive and forget.


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## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

If only the same could be said for this forum...


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## Trelawny (Jan 9, 2010)

Russia should just nuke them and get this over with. Russia 2018 for trelawny. In better stadiums I trust. Qatar 2022.


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

Trelawny said:


> Russia should just nuke them and get this over with. Russia 2018 for trelawny. In better stadiums I trust. Qatar 2022.


So England should be nuked because of a world cup is that right? 
That's fantastic logic there. Why don't you go back into your little bigot cave and hide in there with your lil small minded Doha buddies. I'm sure the rest of the world would love for you to STFU.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

MysteryMike said:


> So England should be nuked because of a world cup is that right?
> That's fantastic logic there. Why don't you go back into your little bigot cave and hide in there with your lil small minded Doha buddies. I'm sure the rest of the world would love for you to STFU.


No need to rise to every bit of banter, surely?

I don't want to make assumptions........but I'm pretty sure that Trelawney wasn't seriously suggesting that Russia nukes England.


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## slipperydog (Jul 19, 2009)

JimB said:


> No need to rise to every bit of banter, surely?
> 
> I don't want to make assumptions........but I'm pretty sure that Trelawney wasn't seriously suggesting that Russia nukes England.


Nevertheless, the trolling gets tiresome when the majority are trying to have a reasonable discussion. It's just old.


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

slipperydog said:


> Nevertheless, the trolling gets tiresome when the majority are trying to have a reasonable discussion. It's just old.


^That^


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

*Russian 2018 World Cup bid chairman apologises for drink and crime slur.*

*• Vitaly Mutko spoke to Geoff Thompson and Andy Anson
• England bid team accept peace offering to end sniping*

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/oct/28/russia-england-2018-world-cup-apology

The chairman of the Russian 2018 World Cup bid has apologised publicly for his country's derogatory remarks about England in an attempt to defuse the bitter row between the two rivals.

Vitaly Mutko, who is also the Russian sports minister and sits on the Fifa executive committee, approached his opposite number on the bid, Geoff Thompson, and England 2018's chief executive, Andy Anson, over breakfast in Zurich to try to draw a line under the dispute.

*"I have great respect for the England bid and we have no desire to say we are better than any other bid,"* said Mutko, ahead of the first Fifa executive committee meeting since corruption allegations rocked the world governing body. *"If there had been any misunderstanding I was ready to apologise for it."*

The row flared after it emerged that England had lodged a formal complaint with Fifa, which was withdrawn last night, after the Russian bid's chief executive, Alexei Sorokin, was quoted as saying that London had a high crime rate and problems with alcoholism. Sorokin has repeatedly claimed that his words had been mistranslated and declined to offer a "formal apology", instead writing a letter of "explanation" to England's bid.

But, even as it was being considered, Vyacheslav Koloskov, honorary president of the Russian Football Union and a former long-standing Fifa executive committee member, labelled the England bid "primitive" and the situation as "comical".

The England bid team has accepted Mutko's attempt to make peace as an end to the affair, believing it vindicates their decision to complain formally to Fifa, despite the furore it has caused.

*Mutko, who went over the head of his chief executive to bring an end to the dispute, said he couldn't be held responsible for everything that was written about the Russian bid but was willing to apologise for anything within his control that had offended his rivals.*

*"I can't control all the reports that are written,"* Mutko said. *"As our classics say, you shouldn't read Bolshevik papers before lunch. I have great respect for the England bid and for Geoff Thompson. We like England and we hope England likes Russia. There are two English Premier League games shown every weekend in Russia."*

Russia is widely acknowledged as the favourite to win the race to host the 2018 tournament, which has been thrown into chaos in the wake of newspaper allegations that led to the provisional suspension of two Fifa executive committee members and four officials. Russia's pitch has centred on its ability to leave a legacy for the game in a country that has never hosted the World Cup, while England has focused on its commercial clout and ability to grow the sport around the world.

*"England could host the World Cup tomorrow,"* Mutko said. *"But we have a vision and Fifa has a philosophy that is about trying to grow in new parts of the world. Football is already very popular in England. We hope that football can be as popular in Russia as it is in England."*

Spain's joint bid with Portugal, rivals to Russia and England for the 2018 World Cup, yesterday moved to distance itself from allegations of vote trading with Qatar, which is battling the USA, Australia, South Korea and Japan to host the 2022 tournament.

"The Candidatura Iberica already told Fifa last Wednesday that it does not have any agreement with any other candidate and that I'm ready to work with Fifa to clear this matter up," said M'guel Angel López, general manager of the Iberian bid.

Fifa's ethics committee is examining the claims, along with bribery allegations concerning two executive committee members, Nigerian Amos Adamu and Oceania representative Reynald Tamerii, and four Fifa officials. It has promised to report by November 17, just two weeks before the vote on December 2.

It is understood that Fifa is expected to decide against postponing the vote for the 2022 World Cup until next year, after today's executive committee meeting. The plan will be discussed tomorrow, the second day of the two-day meeting.

Representatives from the bidders for 2022 felt that postponing the vote would have unfair implications for their budgets and strategies, though others, including some European members, argued it would help remove the fear of collusion between bidders for 2018 and 2022, a subject that will be discussed on the second day of the executive committee.

However, no decisions will be taken that would pre-empt the ethics committee investigation.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Good article:

2018 Bid Is A Race Worth Losing

The vote to decide who will host the 2018 World Cup does not take place until 2 December. For the winners positively, and the losers negatively, the result of the FIFA ballot will set the agenda for the next eight years and more. Normally such votes are a winner-takes-all affair.

I have been to four World Cups in three continents, yet above all have wanted to see one in this country. Shabby defeat in the race to host the 2006 finals was a wrench. The more organised and more compelling 2018 bid raised my hopes and I was furious at those whose pettiness damaged England's chances. Yet this is now a race worth losing, one with a consolation prize worth having: the cleansing of football's high politics, the bringing low of any who would dirty the game.

Sunday newspapers have made two major interventions in the process. First, the Mail on Sunday's non-story assault on Lord Triesman, a Labour politician whose private life should not have been our concern but whose party allegiances made him fair game to a paper archly obsessed with sex when it works in its favour. Second, the Sunday Times's exposure to the cameras and recorders of men who deny wrongdoing but are certainly being scrutinised in a fresh light.

The events that enabled London to win the race to host the 2012 Olympics began years before the final decision, when the corruption at the heart of the International Olympic Committee's bidding process was revealed. Much in the manner that dope-testing is gradually removing the taint from athletics, London was allowed a clean run by the exposure of the bribery by which Salt Lake City won the right to stage the 2002 Winter Olympics.

The British role in exposing corruption within the IOC may have damaged the chances of previous British bids: work such as that of the investigative journalist Andrew Jennings, author of the 1992 Olympic investigation The Lords of the Rings, won the UK few friends in Lausanne. But once scandal broke out into the open and sponsors could no longer ignore it, some reform of the IOC was inevitable, enough as it turned out for London to come through against the odds.

The question now is, what will the gathering storm surrounding FIFA and the World Cup bidding process mean for England 2018?

Allegations against FIFA officials have been around as long as those against the IOC and have often been made by the same people: Jennings followed up The Lord of the Rings with Foul!: The Secret World of FIFA: Bribes, Vote Rigging and Ticket Scandals, which was pleasingly prominent in South African bookshops in the summer. But the charges have not quite stuck - thanks in part to questions of jurisdiction - and have usually come after the event. Invaluable as they have been, Jennings's forensic investigations were into what had happened, often years before. Questions, serious ones, have come up on the eve of votes, for tournaments and for the FIFA presidency. But not with such graphic evidence.

What is different this time, different from the Salt Lake City scandal - Utah still got its Winter Games - is that the Sunday Times's Insight team have got in first, ahead of December's vote for 2018 and 2022. The cosy world of FIFA has been thrown into chaos, with two executive committee members suspended along with four officials. Denials have been issued, but FIFA's ethics committee has had no choice but to launch the most important investigation of its kind football has ever faced.

Should that investigation lead to serious action, then those who want football politics to be open and fair will gain power and confidence. The scandals that have gone on unhindered may yet be brought to an end.

It may of course just be coincidence that so many international sporting bodies are based in Switzerland but, as the Sunday Times pointed out last weekend, the kind of undercover filming that enabled their investigation is illegal in Switzerland. Michael Zen-Ruffinen, the former FIFA general secretary who was shown last Sunday discussing the way to curry favour with this member, or that one, sought to suppress an investigation that was plainly in the public interest and which has been pursued vigorously by the paper. Meanwhile, Lord Triesman had no recourse after the Mail on Sunday used similar techniques to obtain pointless gossip, which the MoS only followed up to the extent that they persecuted Triesman.

The Mail on Sunday's investigation was a pointless distraction. England's problems with Russia this week over the bad-mouthing of bids are another distraction, though less unnecessary. Together they may play a part in England's bid coming up short, costing us friends. And perhaps the Sunday Times's revelations will cost us, too. But if the result is a process we can believe in, a cleaned-up game, and some seriously damaged FIFA delegates and officials, then it will have been worth it even if I have to get out my passport to go to the 2018 finals.

Philip Cornwall

PS: To Murdoch conspiracy theorists: I actually work for another, non-Murdoch Sunday paper, and have been observed doing so for eight years now

Link


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

slipperydog said:


> Nevertheless, the trolling gets tiresome when the majority are trying to have a reasonable discussion. It's just old.


To be fair, Mystery Mike is one of the biggest trolls of the lot. It's just that he's batting for "our" side, so to speak. Certainly, what Trelawney wrote wasn't nearly as trollish as his persistent denigration of both the Russian and Qatar bids and his "retard" comment to waqif.

So he's hardly in any position to get on his high horse about Trelawney's tongue in cheek comment. People in glass houses.....


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

Just watched the FIFA Press conference
Sepp looked extremely uncomfortable.
The following came out of it
-The status quo will remain re Dec 2
-the 2 suspended ExCo's can't be replaced if they aren't reinstated
-it was a mistake to hold both at the same time
-EthCo meets on November 15,16,17 and announces its findings on Nov 17
-Mention of 2 or more bids being investigated re collusion

We just could be set for the biggest sham in FIFAs history


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

> *World Cup votes to be held as scheduled*
> 
> (WFI) FIFA president Sepp Blatter confirms that the vote for both the 2018 and 2022 World Cup hosts will be held on Dec. 2, following speculation that the cash-for-votes scandal that has sent shockwaves through football would lead to a delay.
> 
> ...


http://www.worldfootballinsider.com/Story.aspx?id=33851


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

RobH said:


> This makes me extremely angry. What a complete prat.
> 
> FIRSTLY...
> 
> ...


I'm not too bothered by Lopez, despite the fact that what he said was very wrong. The entire world knew that England would withdraw from the 2022 bid and that the US would withdraw from the 2018 bid. Dein didn't have to possess any inside knowledge to make that prediction. And, as you say, the allegations weren't made by the England bid team. They were made by a British newspaper - a British newspaper, by the way, which would have made a far, far bigger deal of the scandal if the England bid had been implicated. It would have been on the front pages for weeks!

But we can dismiss Lopez just because, outside of CONMEBOL, I really can't see Spain / Portugal winning many votes - unless they really have been involved in vote rigging. This outburst is nothing more than a loser's whinge.

But I'm completely with you in feeling utterly depressed by Blatter's feeble, defensive reaction to the Sunday Times allegations. FIFA appears to be corrupt to its core and, if not actually involved in corruption himself (I don't want to have to use words like "allegedly"), Blatter has to bear a large share of the responsibility. His years of leadership have led to FIFA becoming the self serving, political minefield of an organisation that it now is.

Like you, I too fear that, rather than treat this story as an opportunity to put its house in order, FIFA will retreat behind its walls and put the entire blame for the scandal on the British media that exposed it. And I fear that, as sure as night follows day, they will punish England by making sure that World Cup 2018 goes elsewhere. I can also imagine that England will be voted out first or second.

I even fear that England will never again get the chance to host the World Cup (at least in my potential lifetime). Politics - and the absurd notion that FIFA has to take the World Cup to "new" or undeveloped football countries that will build new stadiums (whether or not they actually need them) - always seems to count against England.

The fact that England would host a superb World Cup with fantastic stadiums (that hadn't just been built for the four weeks of the tournament before becoming white elephants) should be enough to guarantee that England would host some time in the near future.

Alas, that's not the case. If not 2018, then 2030 would be the next possible date. Would England bother to bid again, knowing that corruption or political manoeuvring is more likely to win the vote than the actual merits of the bids? And if England did bid again, isn't it just as likely that FIFA would opt for yet another "undeveloped" football country in Europe? In which case, it could be 2042, 2054 or beyond before the game's mother country gets the chance to host again.

It's all very depressing.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

I've no problem with FIFA spreading the Game around. I wouldn't call that an absurd aim - that's what they're there to do, make the game bigger. Besides which, England lost its last bid to Germany, not a new, underdeveloped footballing nation and really at least part of the reason for that was "our" own doing (hooliganism abroad in recent tournaments). So saying the new froniter factor "always seems to count against England" isn't strictly accurate.

If Russia wins and wins cleanly then best of luck to them, I really do mean that. They're a big enough footballing country to build and sustain the number of new stadiums they're proposing. If Qatar wins I'll perhaps be a lot more scpetical, but Russia is not Qatar.

Perhaps Lopez's words are the whinges of a man who knows his bid is in trouble - I really hope that is the case Jim. But I feel, whether that's true or not, if England had any confidence in the ethics committee there'd be an immediate complaint. Accusing another bid of vote collusion is on a different level altogether to bringing up topics like crime or alcoholism. _I couldn't imagine_ an Olympic bid being accused of something like this and the accused not going to the IOC with a valid complaint and it being dealt with. As I said, it shows how little confidence our bid team now has in the process.

Aside from that there's not much to disagree with there Jim. I'm seriously turned off by the whole thing, and as I said in my last post, wonder whether losing and not having an intimate eight year partnership with FIFA would be a blessing in disguise.

Apologies for my rant as well. Perhaps not the most edifying post I've ever written on this forum, but I stand by every word of it.


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## dacrio (Jan 30, 2009)

update:

in the first round it's official: ned/bel will be eliminated.

in the second round:

russia: 10
spain portugal 7
england: 7

an incredible draw!


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

RobH said:


> I've no problem with FIFA spreading the Game around. I wouldn't call that an absurd aim - that's what they're there to do, make the game bigger. Besides which, England lost its last bid to Germany, not a new, underdeveloped footballing nation and really at least part of the reason for that was "our" own doing (hooliganism abroad in recent tournaments). So saying the new froniter factor "always seems to count against England" isn't strictly accurate.
> 
> If Russia wins and wins cleanly then best of luck to them, I really do mean that. They're a big enough footballing country to build and sustain the number of new stadiums they're proposing. If Qatar wins I'll perhaps be a lot more scpetical, but Russia is not Qatar.
> 
> ...


Totally agreed about Russia. They have a very good bid - even if there are serious doubts about the long term necessity for all those new 45K stadia when average crowds in the top division of the Russian league hover around the 10-15K mark.

But I do fear that the need to take the world cup to undeveloped football countries has now become official FIFA dogma. We're hearing it over and over again. And if, as can easily happen, such dogma becomes sufficiently ingrained, England (which is among the top two or three developed football countries in the world) will always be at a disadvantage when bidding to host the World Cup.

Added to the endemic corruption and political manoeuvring that always seems to work against England, I do fear for our chances of hosting any time soon.


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## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

It seems the English bid is getting so much flak from pretty much all directions. Initially the Russian's talking about the "British media" distorting their bid and all that nonsense, then of course now it's the Spain/Portugal bid going on about how the English bid is in some secret alliance with the U.S., and on top of all of this you have Sepp Blatter basically saying "The English should have kept their noses out, why would they do this?"

Which leads me to ask the Question, what exactly have we done wrong? Seriously have we done ANYTHING wrong?


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

matthemod said:


> It seems the English bid is getting so much flak from pretty much all directions. Initially the Russian's talking about the "British media" distorting their bid and all that nonsense, then of course now it's the Spain/Portugal bid going on about how the English bid is in some secret alliance with the U.S., and on top of all of this you have Sepp Blatter basically saying "The English should have kept their noses out, why would they do this?"
> 
> Which leads me to ask the Question, what exactly have we done wrong? Seriously have we done ANYTHING wrong?


Of course we've done something wrong!

We're England.

That's provocation enough to much of the global football fraternity!


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

matthemod said:


> It seems the English bid is getting so much flak from pretty much all directions. Initially the Russian's talking about the "British media" distorting their bid and all that nonsense, then of course now it's the Spain/Portugal bid going on about how the English bid is in some secret alliance with the U.S., and on top of all of this you have Sepp Blatter basically saying "The English should have kept their noses out, why would they do this?"
> 
> Which leads me to ask the Question, what exactly have we done wrong? Seriously have we done ANYTHING wrong?


The bid has done very little wrong, but has found itself mired in an unedifying process through no fault of its own. There have been no public accusations against other bids from England 2018, no snide remarks, no evidence that England is involved in any way in seriously trying to buy votes or collude with other bids.

England's bid, along with Belgium/Netherlands, the USA, Australia, Japan, Korea and Russia (a few unwise comments aside), has done nothing wrong. Spain/Portugal is under investigation, as is Qatar.

I think some clarification is needed becuase the whole process has been muddied.

*The biggest problems are:*

*#1.* FIFA is corrupt, two of its members have been accused of vote selling, and two bids are implicated in vote collusion. Where that leaves any bid is anyone's guess!

*#2.* Some people both at FIFA and within some of our rivals' bids (not to mention on SSC) are having great difficulty distinguishing between the British Press and the England bid, and are somtimes purposfully confusing the two. They're muddying the waters and accusations against England are being made which are grossly unfair and based on nothing but bitterness.

*And a very distant #3.* Sometimes the British Press _has_ overexaggerated stories. This understandably makes other bids upset. But that has nothing to do with the people at England 2018 and doesn't detract from the fact that the biggest story from a British Paper is TRUE, explosive, and if treated in the right manner gives FIFA the opportunity to clean up the Game.


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

RobH said:


> So, Mr Lopez SHUT THE **** UP if you've nothing useful to say. England should complain to FIFA because this suggestion is DEFINITELY in breach of the bidding rules. How dare he make such accusations with no evidence, when there is a much more obvious and innocent explanation for England's knowledge of the US' withdrawl staring him in the face. It's quite clear to me there's only one bid "launching garbage" against a rival and that's the Iberian one.


Yet again - don't play a victim after being a devil. England started it, so it has to deal with it. Attempts to play on bureaucracy will make the situation even worse. For an absolute majority in Spain or Russia there is no difference between "private" press and officials. They are representing the country, so country has to deal with them, otherwise will get corresponding answer from different sides of society.



RobH said:


> A world cup here would be great, but the process has been a turn off - the opposite of the 2012 Olympic vote in fact, when the prospect of the Games coming to Britain got more not less exciting as time went on, until we reached the crescedo of the final few days.


Feels like inferiority complex. The world does not spinning around UK. When you bidding for something it doesn't automatically mean that you should get it.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

> Yet again - don't play a victim after being a devil. England started it, so it has to deal with it. Attempts to play on bureaucracy will make the situation even worse.


ENGLAND 2018 DID NOT START IT. HOW MANY TIMES DO I NEED TO REPEAT THAT THE ENGLAND BID IS NOT THE ENGLISH PRESS BEFORE YOU GET IT INTO YOUR SKULL?



> Feels like inferiority complex. The world does not spinning around UK. When you bidding for something it doesn't automatically mean that you should get it.


Where did I say it did mean that? Seriously coth, **** right off if you've nothing useful to add to this thread. It was doing fine until you arrived.


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## dacrio (Jan 30, 2009)

RobH said:


> The bid has done very little wrong, but has found itself mired in an unedifying process through no fault of its own. There have been no public accusations against other bids from England 2018, no snide remarks, no evidence that England is involved in any way in seriously trying to buy votes or collude with other bids.
> 
> England's bid, along with Belgium/Netherlands, the USA, Australia, Japan, Korea and Russia (a few unwise comments aside), has done nothing wrong. Spain/Portugal is under investigation, as is Qatar.
> 
> ...


I totally agree with you.

FIFA and UEFA are two corrupt organizations. there is nothing new.

Blatter also had the absurd idea of choosing in the same day who will host the 2 world cup! of course that encourages the free exchange of votes!
it is also true that a minimum of responsibility is of the British press.
too exaggerated!


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Thanks dacrio. I think those points are all fairly obvious to any reasonably objective observer.


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

RobH said:


> ENGLAND 2018 DID NOT START IT. HOW MANY TIMES DO I NEED TO REPEAT THAT THE ENGLAND BID IS NOT THE ENGLISH PRESS BEFORE YOU GET IT INTO YOUR SKULL?
> 
> Where did I say it did mean that? Seriously coth, **** right off if you've nothing useful to add to this thread. It was doing fine until you arrived.


I don't see anything fine in pouring a shit on opponents. 

As I told you - me, either anyone in Russia doesn't care whatever it's British press or British bid - it's British society. "British press" likes to generalize, sticking stamps on countries by a single example, so getting same in return. 

What is still expected is a large apologies from official represents of British sporting policies for a mess caused by British press. Nobody cares of bureaucracy and excuses like it's just the press, not the bid, so we are clear. No you aren't. This shows a simple intolerance.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

> I don't see anything fine in pouring a shit on opponents.
> 
> As I told you - me, either anyone in Russia doesn't care whatever it's British press or British bid - it's British society. "British press" likes to generalize, sticking stamps on countries by a single example, so getting same in return.


So, given that ludicrous stance answer me this:

If a Russian newspaper uncovered evidence that say, Belgium/Nethlands 2018 was involved in some kind of corruption, you'd presumably not complain if Belgium/Netherlands 2018 decided in return to accuse Russia 2018 of the same offence with no evidence to back up their claim?

Don't lie either. You wouldn't like that one bit.


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

This is not only about Spain. This is also about Russia and rest. It's not the first time in the history.

expanded my post for clarification


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Perhaps you could answer my question.


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## MoreOrLess (Feb 17, 2005)

I'd point out that the Sunday Mail's story on Triesman was very much agenst the england bids interest. Whats more very little about that story was in the public interest, some texts sent to a mistress is hardly public comment.

The reality is that certain posters reactions here sadly say alot about press freedom within their own nations.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

^^ Exactly.

As I've said countless times before there is good and bad journalism in the UK. As I've also said countless times before England 2018 and our press our completely seperate entities and one shouldn't have to tow the line of the other, or take flak becuase of what the other says or writes. The Press doesn't have to swallow and reprint what the England 2018 team says, and the England 2018 team doesn't have anything to do with what the press may or may not write about any particular aspect of this process.

Despite being told this more than once, posters like coth will continue to insist otherwise because it suits their own agendas. That's really their problem, not ours, but it's a shame that every time they post the thread goes off kilter.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

coth said:


> Yet again - don't play a victim after being a devil. England started it, so it has to deal with it. Attempts to play on bureaucracy will make the situation even worse. For an absolute majority in Spain or Russia there is no difference between "private" press and officials. They are representing the country, so country has to deal with them, otherwise will get corresponding answer from different sides of society.
> 
> 
> Feels like inferiority complex. The world does not spinning around UK. When you bidding for something it doesn't automatically mean that you should get it.


You're supposed to be a mod. So why don't you act like one instead of behaving like a troll?

How many more times do you need to have it explained to you that, in England, interference with the press is not allowed? I'm sure that the England 2018 bid team would have loved to have been able to gag the Sunday Mail when it published its sting on Lord Triesman. But, under English law, there was nothing they could do. So why should it be any different just because another country's bid is the focus of an English paper's investigation?

Perhaps, in Russia, the press and the government might be one and the same (I neither know nor care). But that's not the case in England. So stop talking crap about things that you don't understand. Okay?


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## Mr Trebus (Oct 18, 2010)

coth said:


> I don't see anything fine in pouring a shit on opponents.
> 
> As I told you - me, either anyone in Russia doesn't care whatever it's British press or British bid - it's British society. "British press" likes to generalize, sticking stamps on countries by a single example, so getting same in return.
> 
> What is still expected is a large apologies from official represents of British sporting policies for a mess caused by British press. Nobody cares of bureaucracy and excuses like it's just the press, not the bid, so we are clear. No you aren't. This shows a simple intolerance.


The sunday times is owned by Rupert Murdoch who is an australian born 'american'..by the way every post that you make reads as the nonsensical ramblings of a buffoon.Russia doesnt derserve the world cup but with an organisation as corrupt and malovolent as FIFA they will propably get it.SHAME.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Russia does deserve the world cup. They're bidding and have a more than credible plan, and are a decent sized footballing nation which have never had it before. But I couldn't agree with you more about coth's nonsensical posts.


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

JimB said:


> You're supposed to be a mod. So why don't you act like one instead of behaving like a troll?


Saying people to be tolerant is now trolling?



JimB said:


> Perhaps, in Russia, the press and the government might be one and the same (I neither know nor care). But that's not the case in England. So stop talking crap about things that you don't understand. Okay?


So that's again what i'm talking about. If you want to excuse your press, then do not overreact on some private words of spanish and russian bid officials. Before complaining to FIFA make a complain to your court against false in your press. Nobody talking about freedom of speech. It's just a matter of moral and judicial responsibility. If somebody throwing a false accusation without court's support then they should response for it.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

I'm failing to even understand these posts now. Nevermind.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

A few pictures of Wembley decked out for NFL:








































From Henry Root on Flickr


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## Rev Stickleback (Jun 23, 2009)

coth said:


> What is still expected is a large apologies from official represents of British sporting policies for a mess caused by British press. Nobody cares of bureaucracy and excuses like it's just the press, not the bid, so we are clear. No you aren't. This shows a simple intolerance.


So the British press should apologize for exposing corruption?


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

coth said:


> Saying people to be tolerant is now trolling?
> 
> 
> So that's again what i'm talking about. If you want to excuse your press, then do not overreact on some private words of spanish and russian bid officials. Before complaining to FIFA make a complain to your court against false in your press. Nobody talking about freedom of speech. It's just a matter of moral and judicial responsibility. If somebody throwing a false accusation without court's support then they should response for it.


Excuse your press? "your" "press".

As a South African we faced some of the worst "make-believe" scare stories before the WC but I still don't think you understand how free press or freedom of speech works. South Africa could not sure those publications, even if we wanted to. We just got back at them by proving them wrong, and hosting a successful event.

With all due respect, this is quite scary coming from a mod. I sincerely hopes its just a case of a poor translation from Russian to English.


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

Coth you made a great point on the English bid over-reacting, but then ruined it by saying the UK Govt should have handled the press.

Legally you cannot, because the freedom of the press is protected in the UK.

What do you suggest then? The Govt send a few thugs to editors homes to make the point about what happens to editors who allow their papers to act against the govt's will?

Or how about they make a few journo's "disappear" to teach the rest a lesson?

I am really curious to hear how you think in a country where press freedom is protected that the govt could have handled the press


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

Mr Trebus said:


> Russia doesnt derserve the world cup but with an organisation as corrupt and malovolent as FIFA they will propably get it. SHAME.


So, you've come up with a justification in advance in case of English defeat. Very well.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

JimB said:


> Of course we've done something wrong!
> 
> We're England.
> 
> That's provocation enough to much of the global football fraternity!


Oooh! Truly speaking, I'm was expecting to hear this words from the Russian fans, not from the Brits.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

coth said:


> Saying people to be tolerant is now trolling?
> 
> 
> So that's again what i'm talking about. If you want to excuse your press, then do not overreact on some private words of spanish and russian bid officials. Before complaining to FIFA make a complain to your court against false in your press. Nobody talking about freedom of speech. It's just a matter of moral and judicial responsibility. If *somebody throwing a false accusation* without court's support then they should response for it.


So you're claiming to have inside information now, are you? You know for a fact that the Sunday Times' allegations are false (despite all the video evidence that they are, in fact, 100% true)? I hope you're able to back up your claims with some evidence..............but I'm not going to hold my breath.

What is it that you don't understand, exactly, about the difference, on the one hand, between the British press writing articles that are critical of the English *, Russian, Spanish or Qatari bids and, on the other, OFFICIAL MEMBERS OF THE RUSSIAN AND SPANISH 2018 BID TEAMS making comments that are critical of the England 2018 bid?

The former is not contrary to FIFA rules, for the simple reason that the British press is not under the control of the England 2018 bid team. The latter is very much against FIFA rules because criticism of a rival bid by another bid team is specifically forbidden under FIFA rules. Russian and Spanish official bid team members have therefore clearly contravened FIFA rules and the England bid team - who have done nothing wrong - are therefore fully within their rights to demand an apology. It really isn't that hard to understand.

Finally - and for what seems like the millionth time - are you and your fellow Russians ever going to stop boring on about the British press? It's really fucking pathetic and tedious. Your country actually has a very good bid. Couldn't you, just for once, talk about that rather than talking about things that you don't understand?

It would make a refreshing change.

* Don't forget that the most damaging article yet to have been written by the British press was at England 2018's expense.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

> * Don't forget that the most damaging article yet to have been written by the British press was at England 2018's expense.


The most direct damage done to a single bid, yes. The most damaging article yet has been at FIFA's expense, and thank God the _Sunday Times _had the foresight to investigate this before the vote. As Phil Cornwall said in his article I posted a few pages back:

_"What is different this time, different from the Salt Lake City scandal - Utah still got its Winter Games - is that the Sunday Times's Insight team have got in first, ahead of December's vote for 2018 and 2022. The cosy world of FIFA has been thrown into chaos, with two executive committee members suspended along with four officials. Denials have been issued, but FIFA's ethics committee has had no choice but to launch the most important investigation of its kind football has ever faced."_

If these allegations and this evidence had come out after the vote people will have muttered "FIFA is corrupt, but tell us something we don't know" and that would be the end of it. The fact that it's come out before the vote does the _Sunday Times'_ investigative team much credit. I don't normally like the Murdoch Press, but this is one occassion where they've really earned their stripes in giving FIFA a real incentive to clean up their act. Whether FIFA decides to act properly now is their choice of course, but I can see the Press being like a dog with a bone if FIFA ignores the opportunity presented to them.


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

Actually the two biggest losers from everything that's happened at this point re collusion anyway-are the USA and Russia


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

Russia denied claims of british newspaper. "Sunday Times" didn't publish the article, because Russia threatened to apply for a court for this slander.

Good job, Russia. These fast and direct actions made the bid even stronger.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

The two World Cup bid candidates under investigation for alleged vote collusion are almost certain to avoid serious punishment.

insideworldfootball has learned that Spain-Portugal and Qatar are likely to be exonerated by FIFA's Ethics Committee with little more than a warning.

It is understood the alleged deal, highlighted by the Sunday Times and claimed to involve up to seven FIFA Executive Commitee members, was not even discussed at thetheir meeting in Zurich on Friday (October 29).

With a lack of any firm evidence to incriminate either party, several Executive Committee members said privately it was now inevitable that Spain and Portugal would be given the green light to carry on lobbying for 2018 and Qatar for 2022 when the ethics committee delivers its verdict on November 17.

"There is no other outcome," said one senior FIFA administrator while another said: "There will have to proof that anything has been done wrong legally."

The Spanish and Portuguese were conspicuous by their absence in Zurich but have fiercely protested their innocence and have bizarrely accused England of doing their own deal with the United States in breach of FIFA regulations. 

http://www.insideworldfootball.biz/...ifa-sanctions-over-vote-collusion-allegations


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

And a good little article on the dark horses, Holland/Belgium

Holland-Belgium bid CEO Harry Been tells INSIDER that FIFA faces an historic choice over the future format of the World Cup on its Dec. 2 bid D-day.

Been says that his bid is a standard-bearer for 180 smaller member associations who would like to host the finals but would ordinarily be overlooked in favour of a great footballing, political or economic power.

He believes his joint bid is a credible alternative to this apparent status quo and that it would give hope to smaller nations. He says that FIFA should be flexible in its approach and take seriously joint bids.

“I think they should chose for the other 180 countries that might want a chance in the future,” Been told INSIDER.

“Of course they should go back to the bigger countries as well, we should sometimes have it in the bigger countries. But we should do two countries as well, two countries that are bordering each other. There are a lot of those in the world.”

.......

http://www.worldfootballinsider.com/Story.aspx?id=33854


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## TheoG (Mar 20, 2010)

WFInsider said:


> Russia denied claims of british newspaper. "Sunday Times" didn't publish the article, because Russia threatened to apply for a court for this slander.
> 
> Good job, Russia. These fast and direct actions made the bid even stronger.


I have absolutely no idea what your on about...


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

The Sunday Times was going to publish an article on Russia 2018 apparently offering incentives to one voter. Russia 2018 threatened them with court action and according to WFInsider they haven't published it. I've no reason to disbelieve him and am not about to sign up to get beyond The Times' paywall to find out.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

*Russia's 2018 World Cup bid attacks new 'bribery' allegations

• Russia linked with suspended Fifa executive Amos Adamu 
• Bid leader 'categorically' rejects implications of bribery*

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/oct/30/russia-2018-world-cup-allegations

Russia's 2018 World Cup bid has responded tonight with anger to allegations that they offered incentives to the suspended Fifa executive Amos Adamu in an attempt to secure his vote.

The claims arose from the Sunday Times's investigation into alleged vote-buying, which led to Adamu's suspension by Fifa on 20 October. According to the paper, Adamu told an undercover reporter during the sting operation that the Russians had offered him "co-operation" with building facilities and training players in Nigeria. The suggestion was that such offers of support would be made in exchange for his vote.

The head of the Russian bid, Alexei Sorokin, tonight attacked the claims, and suggested the newspaper had deliberately targeted Russia in an attempt to damage England's main rival in the bidding process.

Sorokin confirmed that Adamu had visited Moscow in August, but insisted the visit was conducted "in confirmity with Fifa rules", and had not involved the offer of any voting incentives.

"Mr Adamu was indeed visiting Russia in August," Sorokin said. "During his stay in Moscow he was introduced to the key elements of Russia's bid through a series of presentations and venue tours. However, we would like to categorically state that never was he approached with any offers of assistance in pitch construction or players' training or any other partnership. We consider statements by Mr Adamu as speculation and unfounded."

Sorokin added that "all bidders are likely to have made proposals to the various stakeholders" as part of their legacy planning, but that such proposals – including "friendly matches, coaching academies, referees courses and infrastructural support" – did not imply any attempt to buy support.

Sorokin's suggestion that the claims were part of an English media attempt to undermine a rival bid – questioning whether the Sunday Times was taking a "complete, impartial and balanced approach" – echoed suggestions made by Sepp Blatter on Friday.

The Fifa president told a press conference: "One can ask whether it is appropriate for newspapers to set traps for people ... Why would an English newspaper do that? We talk about fair play in sport – that must apply to the media too."

The Sunday Times, though, stood by its approach, pointing out they were acting in response to "specific allegations" by Adamu, who "did not discuss receiving specific offers of 'co-operation' from other bidding nations".

The latest dispute adds to an increasingly bitter and chaotic bidding process, and follows last week's formal complaint by the England bid team after Sorokin was quoted as saying London had a high crime rate and alcoholism problem. Sorokin later claimed he had been mistranslated, with England withdrawing their complaint following an apology from Russia's sports minister.

Fifa confirmed on Friday that the final vote will go ahead on 2 December as planned, despite the ongoing inquiry by their ethics committee into the original allegations of vote-trading against Adamu and Reynald Temarii, and claims against four other officials. The committee is due to report on 17 November.

*P. S. Good victory over Ministery of Truth!*


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

The Russia bid of course is protecting its own interests, fair enough. And the Sunday Times is just printing what it has found out from its ongoing investigation, also fair enough.

The Sunday Times has done some great investigative journalism in exposing FIFA though. I don't think anyone can disagree with that.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

*Media blamed as England's hopes for 2018 World Cup bid fade

• Fifa corruption stories have damaged chances, say bid team
• Bid chief holds talks with BBC over Panorama investigation*

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/nov/04/england-world-cup-bid-2018

Senior executives from England's World Cup bid have met the BBC director general, Mark Thompson, over a Panorama investigation into alleged Fifa corruption that some fear could be the "final nail" in their chances of hosting the 2018 tournament.

But it is understood that the 2018 chief executive, Andy Anson, was given short shrift by Thompson, who viewed it as an attempt to influence the BBC's current affairs flagship, whose editorial independence is sacrosanct.

As the fallout continues from a recent Sunday Times investigation into Fifa corruption that led to the suspension of two executive committee members and four officials, senior bid insiders have increasingly felt the newspaper revelations have had a harmful effect on their chances.

One senior bid source said today: *"It is a fact that England's chances have been damaged among Fifa executive committee members. If the Panorama is broadcast that will damage our chances further."*

Russia are increasingly seen as strong favourites for the 2018 tournament but Spain and Portugal's joint bid is also believed to be in a good position thanks to the networking skills of the Spanish federation chief, Angel María Villar Llona.

Initially there were hopes that the magnitude of the revelations – and Fifa's swift action to provisionally suspend Amos Adamu of Nigeria and the Oceania representative Reynald Temarii – would not harm England's chances because the newspaper investigation would rightly be seen as justified.

But as the Guardian reported last week, sources on the Fifa executive committee were increasingly concerned at what they saw the "hostile" and "sometimes aggressive" nature of the British media and a siege mentality has taken hold. The Fifa president, Sepp Blatter, who last week seized the opportunity to try to reassert his control, had earlier promised to drive the "devils" from football but last week turned his fire on the tactics of the Sunday Times. "One can ask whether it is appropriate for newspapers and journalists to set traps for people," he said.

The Qatari Fifa executive committee member Mohamed Bin Hamman echoed that view and had already written on his blog that he considered the investigation "unethical".

"Forging identity, fabricating evidence and setting traps are unethical behaviours in my point of view," he wrote. "One thing about Middle East media, these are rare happenings there."

The presence in Zurich of Andrew Jennings, the author behind the Fifa exposé Foul who is contributing to Panorama, further unnerved the 22 members of the executive committee who will vote on the 2018 and 2022 tournaments on 2 December. England's 2018 team are refusing to throw in the towel.

They are hopeful that by creating some distance between the bid and the British media, as well as pointing out that newspapers have been fair in their coverage of the International Olympic Committee since London secured the Games in 2005, they can repair the damage.

The verdict of the Fifa ethics committee, considering the cases of the two executive committee members and four officials who have been provisionally suspended as well as allegations of vote trading between Spain-Portugal and Qatar, on 17 November will be key.

Bid insiders hope the technical reports to be published midway through this month, expected to score England highly but not likely to be a key factor in the final analysis, will give them fresh momentum that can be capitalised on by during a presentation by the prime minister David Cameron, David Beckham and Prince William.

They are considering writing to every newspaper and media organisation, urging them to back the bid as it enters the final straight. But attempts to influence the Panorama investigation into the race to host the 2018 and 2022 tournaments are believed to be doomed to failure, with BBC insiders angry.Bid insiders insist they simply put the facts as they saw them to the BBC, at no stage asking for the programme to be changed or watered down.

A similar situation emerged in 2004, ahead of the vote for the 2012 Olympics that was ultimately won by London. Then, bid executives appealed unsuccessfully to the BBC to axe the programme but in that case the bid team had a year to neutralise the impact. The 2018 bid team has less than a month.England's rivals have not been slow to stoke the fears of the Fifa voters. At the height of England's row with the Russian bid last week, Russian Football Union's honorary president Vyacheslav Koloskov said last week "their journalists are provoking members of the committee".

Despite the diligent campaign mounted in recent months by bid executives, the delayed impact of the Sunday Times investigation is far from the only problem to hamper the bid, some of them self-inflicted.

No sooner had a line been drawn under the infighting and political fallout that characterised its first year then chairman Lord Triesman was forced to resign in May following a newspaper sting. England's message that its commercial clout could help fund football development around the world has been pitched against Russia's case to take the World Cup into new territories and Villar Llona's networking skills.


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## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

"The Fifa president told a press conference: "One can ask whether it is appropriate for newspapers to set traps for people ... Why would an English newspaper do that? We talk about fair play in sport – that must apply to the media too.""

Pathetic, they've basically been caught out and are playing victim. If he wants fair play, maybe FIFA shouldn't be so damn corrupt in the first place.


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## nomarandlee (Sep 24, 2005)

> The Fifa president, Sepp Blatter, who last week seized the opportunity to try to reassert his control, had earlier promised to drive the "devils" from football but last week turned his fire on the tactics of the Sunday Times. "One can ask whether it is appropriate for newspapers and journalists to set traps for people," he said.


I woulnd't be at all surprised if these investigations do take a hit to England's bids as corrupt organizations and leaders usually don't like others peering in their windows. If England's bid is made to pay that is just a feather in the cap of the UK/England and yet another reason to hold FIFA in contempt (and its peer organizations like the IOC). 

The fact that some from nations where people have no issue with disappearing journalist who look to hard into embarrassingly allegations or who don't allow their own media to write dissenting or critical voices I am not surprised they would reveal if England were made to pay and not those members who with complete dishonor left their bid open for trade or sale. If it comes out that England's was reprimanded for such reasons then the winning bids will always be on the record as tainted.



> The Qatari Fifa executive committee member Mohamed Bin Hamman echoed that view and had already written on his blog that he considered the investigation "unethical".
> 
> "Forging identity, fabricating evidence and setting traps are unethical behaviours in my point of view," he wrote. "One thing about Middle East media, these are rare happenings there."


OMG, no doubt they don't because if they dared to try some real investigative journalism on one your royals or elites they would likely be beheaded you ****!


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

Of course, it was a stupid move. It's impossible to blame someone as "bunch of corruptioners" and require them the right to host WC. The Brits shot themselves. It seems that this becomes a fact.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

It seems we don't know anything yet. We won't until December.

And, as I keep pointing out, the BBC caught an IOC member selling votes in 2004, yet London went on to win 2012. This proves the press can expose corruption in a sporting body and leave their nation's bid unrharmed.

It's up to FIFA how they continue to react. We DO expect FIFA to give our bid the same chance as anyone else's. Retribution on their part would be as good as admitting guilt.


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

AlekseyVT said:


> *Media blamed as England's hopes for 2018 World Cup bid fade*.


Congrats. You've won the "transparent" post of the year.


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## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

AlekseyVT said:


> Of course, it was a stupid move. It's impossible to blame someone as "bunch of corruptioners" and require them the right to host WC. The Brits shot themselves. It seems that this becomes a fact.


WHEN will you get the differentiation between the English bid and the British media through your head?! Honestly, it's getting tiresome.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Matthemod, it doesn't matter if some (Russian) forumers choose not to see the difference, the question is whether FIFA will choose not to see the difference. The noises coming from some of their members certainly are't encouraging, but as I've said already, there is very recent history of a British bid winning after the media uncovered corruption.

FIFA has a choice as to how to react. It is not, as Alexsey implies, inevitable that they'll react against England's bid. The IOC didn't after the BBC's investigation, and FIFA oughtn't after this one.


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## OnceBittenTwiceShy (Mar 14, 2010)

Under the veneer of ebullience, Russia hosting 2018 will be remembered for the wrong reasons. No votes in favor of the best bid but a statement against the English bid.


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

OnceBittenTwiceShy said:


> No votes in favor of the best bid but a statement against the English bid.


When did Russia say anything against English bid?

And maybe you didn't know but England has withdrawn the complaint. So, no more speculations, please.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

matthemod said:


> WHEN will you get the differentiation between the English bid and the British media through your head?! Honestly, it's getting tiresome.


It's more better to tell it FIFA.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

FIFA already knows


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

OnceBittenTwiceShy said:


> Under the veneer of ebullience, Russia hosting 2018 will be remembered for the wrong reasons. No votes in favor of the best bid but a statement against the English bid.


But you have a good explanation. FIFA should give WC2018 to England, because "you are the best". If FIFA will not give WC2018 to England, that FIFA is corrupt, but "you are the best".


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## OnceBittenTwiceShy (Mar 14, 2010)

WFInsider said:


> When did Russia say anything against English bid?


 Irrelevant.



> And maybe you didn't know but England has withdrawn the complaint. So, no more speculations, please.


Damage has been inflicted on the English bid. Russia will go down in history as second choice in the first place, regardless of the outcome.


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## OnceBittenTwiceShy (Mar 14, 2010)

AlekseyVT said:


> But you have a good explanation.


 Of course I have my friend. I aim to please and contribute to transparency in my own undisputed and bohemian style.


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## Trelawny (Jan 9, 2010)

matthemod said:


> WHEN will you get the differentiation between the English bid and the British media through your head?! Honestly, it's getting tiresome.


It's all connected to a certain extent. This is like saying those right wing radio host in america aren't connected to the republican party.


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## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

But it ISN'T connected, that's the point. If FIFA actually denigrate the English bid, because of a completely unrelated attribute, it will just show up FIFA for the superficial and corrupt nature of it's organisation. 

The English bid has done NOTHING wrong, the English stadium's have no problem, the English infrastructure has nothing wrong it, everything related to the English world cup bid is perfectly in order and legitimate.

What do you think we should do? Get some sort of government mandate to shut up and control all of the British media? I genuinely want to hear what you think the English bid, or even the British government could possibly do about such a situation that we are supposedly, and unjustly being punished for.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

matthemod said:


> The English bid has done NOTHING wrong, the English stadium's have no problem, the English infrastructure has nothing wrong it, everything related to the English world cup bid is perfectly in order and legitimate.


You say right thing. You don't find stimulus for further development. When the person or organization doesn't see the reasons for own development it becomes dangerous - competitors are capable to overtake him.


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

AlekseyVT said:


> You say right thing. You don't find stimulus for further development. When the person or organization doesn't see the reasons for own development it becomes dangerous - competitors are capable to overtake him.


Russia's bid is going in the same direction as England's 2006 bid, it's got pretty much the same ingredients, now all it needs is the technical report to come out with England being a superior host and that could be that.


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

> *Temarii confident FIFA ethics probe will clear him*
> 
> Suspended FIFA executive committee member Reynald Temarii has "no doubt" he will be cleared of corruption charges and allowed to vote for the 2018 and 2022 World Cup hosts.
> 
> ...


http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap...5XfC2A?docId=eeb64ef11c6b4444b5b8979c95ad8f17


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

*Prince William and Prime Minister David Cameron will be part of England's delegation for next month's vote for the 2018 World Cup hosts, according to a confidential FIFA list.*

The prince and Cameron are included on a list of top VIPs from all bidding countries due to attend the December 2 vote for the 2018 and 2022 tournaments.

The list, which has been seen by Press Association Sport, so far includes four prime ministers, Prince William, two heads of state, plus former US president Bill Clinton and the Emir of Qatar, Sheikh Hamad bin Kahlifa Al-Thani.

Prince William is president of the Football Association and England 2018 have long had high hopes that he would attend ahead the presentations ahead of the vote by FIFA's 24-man executive committee.

St James' Palace would not confirm on Thursday whether the prince would be going to Zurich. For security reasons, members of the Royal family's movements are not usually confirmed until much closer to the date of travel.

The Prime Minister has become heavily involved in trying to revive England's bid after leaders admitted it was "significantly damaged" by the fall-out from the Sunday Times investigation into FIFA.

England 2018 had submitted a provisional and confidential list to FIFA and this is the first time that the presence of both dignitaries has been confirmed. England can include 30 people in their delegation and bid leaders also hope David Beckham will be going to Zurich to back the bid.

England's 2018 rivals Russia have deputy prime minister Igor Shuvalov named, although it is understood FIFA have also been told that their prime minister Vladimir Putin will be attending.

Holland/Belgium also have political heavyweights in their delegation with Dutch prime minister Mark Rutte and his Belgian counterpart Ives Leterme both included.

The fourth 2018 bidder Spain/Portugal - in some eyes the new favourites - have so far only named their countries' sports ministers in their delegation.

Link


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

*Keenly-awaited reports on the 2018 and 2022 World Cup bids are set to be dispatched to FIFA Executive Committee members tomorrow as the battle to host one of the world's biggest sporting occasions heads for a dramatic denouement.

However, the reports – drawn up by FIFA inspectors who visited the 11 bidding nations in a gruelling odyssey earlier this year – are not expected to be made publicly available until next Wednesday (November 17).

It is therefore likely to distract attention from the deliberations of FIFA's Ethics Committee, which is widely expected to announce its findings on the recent cash-for-votes allegations on the same day.

The reports – prepared by a team led by Harold Mayne-Nicholls, former head of the Chilean national football federation – will be scoured by bidders for material to support their cases ahead of the all-important votes by FIFA ExCo members on December 2.

Four European bids – from Belgium/Holland, England, Russia and Spain/Portugal – are contesting the right to stage the 2018 tournament.*

http://www.insideworldfootball.biz/...-same-day-as-findings-of-cash-for-votes-probe


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

_X_ said:


> Actually,if Spain and Qatar get away with this and are awarded WC's I would expect a full investigation by the European Union and Washington at the very least


If Spain and Qatar will awarded WCs, I would expect big scream from the British Isles. But I doubt that it will be heard outside the island.


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

AlekseyVT said:


> If Spain and Qatar will awarded WCs, I would expect big scream from the British Isles. But I doubt that it will be heard outside the island.


What about Russia? Wouldn't you be disappointed?


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

MysteryMike said:


> What about Russia? Wouldn't you be disappointed?


I doubt that anyone in the Kremlin or in the Russian White House will be worry about it. What about ordinary residents, we respect all European bids and accept our possible defeat with dignity.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

You can lose with dignity, congratulate the victor and yet still be unhappy about the conduct of FIFA and their shambles of a bidding process. They aren't mutually exclusive.


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## Madman (Dec 29, 2003)

^ how come you lot can behave on this thread but not on the respective national threads for the russian and English bids?


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

RobH said:


> You can lose with dignity, congratulate the victor and yet still be unhappy about the conduct of FIFA and their shambles of a bidding process. They aren't mutually exclusive.


Well, I visited Spain and Portugal a month ago. They have all the necessary infrastructure for the organization of football competitions (Portuguese stadiums have been upgraded to Euro 2004). So I understand that their common bid is strong. 

As for Qatar, his election will say a lot (not because I dislike Qatari, but because there are no any football traditions in this state). But it will not be our problem.


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

AlekseyVT said:


> Well, I visited Spain and Portugal a month ago. They have all the necessary infrastructure for the organization of football competitions (Portuguese stadiums have been upgraded to Euro 2004). So I understand that their common bid is strong.
> 
> As for Qatar, his election will say a lot (not because I dislike Qatari, but because there are no any football traditions in this state). But it will not be our problem.


Are you saying that England doesn't have the infrastructure then? Spain hosted the world cup in 1982, England hosted the world cup in 1966, I fail to see how their common bid could be strong. I mean the other nation we are talking about is Portugal, who have a fantastic history of corruption/match fixing within their own league. Which means England's bid is stronger and if you say you are happy to lose to the Spanish/Portugal bid then you should be similarly happy to lose to the English bid  At least England didn't rig the vote with Qatar. 

As for the 2nd point well everyone sees it Qatar's bid is the standout joke out of all the bidders but we will see whether the world cup hosting rights can be bought.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

MysteryMike said:


> Are you saying that England doesn't have the infrastructure then? Spain hosted the world cup in 1982, England hosted the world cup in 1966, I fail to see how their common bid could be strong.


I don't think that history of WC hosting should play a major role in the voiting. Therefore I don't see big difference between 1966 and 1982.

But if you consider that history should be one of the main criteria, that let to see at European bids:

England - WC1966 and Euro1996;
Spain - EC1964 and WC1982;
Belgium - EC1972 and Euro2000;
Netherlands - Euro2000;
Portugal - Euro2004;
Russia - nothing.



> I mean the other nation we are talking about is Portugal, who have a fantastic history of corruption/match fixing within their own league. Which means England's bid is stronger and if you say you are happy to lose to the Spanish/Portugal bid then you should be similarly happy to lose to the English bid


Actually, in the terms of infrastructure I see English bid such strong as Spain/Portugal. I will not happy to lose to the English bid (like Spanish/Portuguese bid), but I will understand why FIFA did such choise. Although I'm personally like Spain as state more than Britain.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

You could never have guessed from your posts!


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

MysteryMike said:


> However that being said, England has a brilliant final presentation ready and that's how Germany won the final vote in 2006. They too had to go through this rubbish bribery scandal on the day of the vote for the 2006 tournament, who done it? I don't think anyone still knows but Germany pulled it off and so can England.


*Miracle of the House of Brandenburg:*

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_miracle_of_the_House_of_Brandenburg

The Miracle of the House of Brandenburg refers to the sudden death of Russia's Empress Elizabeth (at the age of 52) at the beginning of 1762.

After six years of the Seven Years' War, the Prussian army was greatly weakened and had just lost the vital Baltic Sea port of Kolberg to the Russians. Frederick II of Prussia considered himself lost and was on the verge of suicide. On January 5, Empress Elizabeth died, and her nephew came to the throne as Peter III. Peter was notoriously pro-Prussian; on his accession, he withdrew his troops and ended the war to no Russian advantage.

At the close of World War II, Berlin was again encircled by Russian armies. Recalling the miracle of two centuries earlier, Adolf Hitler hoped Germany would be saved by some unexpected event such as the death of Franklin D. Roosevelt and resultant disagreements between Winston Churchill and Joseph Stalin.

*As we all know, this miracle didn't happened.*


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

*David Cameron went running with Spain's prime minister Jose Luis Zapatero in a jog which became part of the battle for the right to host football's 2018 World Cup.

Spain will be one of England's leading rivals when Fifa announces the name of the 2018 hosts in Zurich on December 2. It has made a joint bid with Portugal.

Mr Cameron did his bit on Friday morning to boost England's chances by wearing a T-shirt adorned with the bid slogan "England United - The World Invited".

Mr Cameron has been lobbying fellow leaders at the G20 summit in Seoul on behalf of the England bid, and has vowed to fly to Zurich to sweet-talk Fifa executive committee members before they cast their votes.

Both England and Spain will keep up their efforts to stage the world's biggest football event, right up to the finishing line on December 2 - when they also face competition from Russia and a joint Belgium/Netherlands bid.

But Downing Street was coy about who reached the finishing line first in Friday morning's sporting event, insisting that the Prime Minister's run - unlike the World Cup bid - was "not a competitive event".*

http://www.google.com/hostednews/uk...FiUx0K0O5vewfkApQ?docId=N0029561289555708172A


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

Hmmm... Good PR-moves! Just interesting: English fans blamed Spanish bid, but their PM makes alliance with Spanish.


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

Meanwhile dodgy pictures have popped up of Spain/Portugal and Qatar discussing some of the terms of their vote rigging.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)




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## Schmeek (Mar 28, 2007)

MysteryMike said:


> Meanwhile dodgy pictures have popped up of Spain/Portugal and Qatar discussing some of the terms of their vote rigging.


Can you elaborate please. Who are these people, where are they, when is it, and what is dodgy about the pictures? Ta.

Or have I missed a gag here?


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## Rev Stickleback (Jun 23, 2009)

Schmeek said:


> Can you elaborate please. Who are these people, where are they, when is it, and what is dodgy about the pictures? Ta.


well, that leather jacket is very dodgy, for starters.


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

Rev Stickleback said:


> well, that leather jacket is very dodgy, for starters.


That's Hassan al-Thawadi their bid's chief or should I say main puppet


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## waqif (Jul 3, 2010)

MysteryMike said:


> Meanwhile dodgy pictures have popped up of Spain/Portugal and Qatar discussing some of the terms of their vote rigging.


Qatar also met Russia & England members this month so who will get Qatar vote !! of course only one of them but what we are sure of that many of these countries will vote for Qatar bid.


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

waqif said:


> Qatar also met Russia & England members this month so who will get Qatar vote !! of course only one of them but what we are sure of that many of these countries will vote for Qatar bid.


:lol:

MBH will only vote Spain,its part of his pact
He will not vote England
Any self respecting ExCo member will go for the clean bids

BTW,Qatar still has to get to the vote yet.
The special meeting of ExCo could finally do what we've all been waiting for and give them the


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## parcdesprinces (Feb 15, 2009)

So, I guess it's the perfect timing to say:

Allez Belgique Allez !! Hup Holland Hup !!

:cheers:


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

A great World Cup that would be:cheers:


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

* Fifa president Sepp Blatter is preparing to call an emergency meeting of his executive committee after receiving an official report on bribery allegations surrounding the 2018 and 2022 World Cup hosting votes.

Two football officials confirmed on Thursday to The Associated Press that Blatter has contacted his executive colleagues about meeting in Zurich next Friday - two days after Fifa's ethics committee is set to rule on allegations that voters Amos Adamu and Reynald Temarii were prepared to sell their support for funding toward football projects.

One who spoke on condition of anonymity said Blatter sent a request for the meeting but did not indicate an agenda.

A second official said the meeting at Fifa headquarters could be confirmed on Friday.

Fifa's executive panel last met October 29, when 22 members - minus the suspended Adamu and Temarii - agreed to choose both World Cup hosts as scheduled on December 2.

Blatter said at a news conference that day the poll would proceed with 22 or 23 voters if the ethics panel ordered sanctions against one or both of his colleagues.

Ethics chairman Claudio Sulser provisionally barred Adamu and Temarii from football duty last month and said his team would meet from November 15-17 to hear their cases. Sulser said he could order interim suspensions of a further 20 days - excluding the pair from voting - if more time was needed to complete the investigation.

Sulser's panel is studying videos and transcripts of interviews conducted by undercover reporters from British newspaper The Sunday Times which appeared to show Adamu and Temarii asking for cash for their votes. Four former Fifa executive committee members are also under suspicion.

It will also examine allegations that the Spain-Portugal team bidding for the 2018 World Cup entered into a vote-trading alliance with 2022 contender Qatar in breach of Fifa rules. *

http://www.supersport.com/football/fifa-internationals/news/101112/Blatter_calls_emergency_meeting


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

*He will be involved in intensive lobbying in the countdown to the vote and will arrive in Zurich two or three days before the ballot.

England's bid team hope that Cameron can repeat the impact former Prime Minister Tony Blair had when his appearance five years ago in Singapore helped London secure the 2012 Olympic Games.

'The vote can all change in the final days and that is certainly what Tony Blair achieved for us,' said a veteran of London's successful bid. 'Not being in the lead at this stage is not necessarily a bad thing.

'The key with Tony Blair was that we got him out there two days before the vote, whereas French President Jacques Chirac just waltzed in the evening before. 

'By then we had done all the work and won people round. I still remember the look of dismay on the faces of the French as [bid leader] Seb Coe walked past the French delegation late one night with a key IOC delegate, who was going in to see Blair.' 

This week will provide England's bid with a boost when FIFA release the technical reports on the prospective candidates, England, Spain-Portugal, Holland-Belgium and Russia.

England will receive a glowing report and be ranked 'low risk', the best possible outcome. However, the reports, which cover aspects such as security, logistics and transport, are expected to rank one of England's major rivals, Russia, as 'medium risk' in certain areas.

Encouraging though the technical reports may be for England, it is Cameron's role that insiders see as crucial.

In the immediate aftermath of London's Olympics victory, Canadian IOC member Dick Pound commented: 'I think the people of Britain should get down on their hands and knees and thank their Prime Minister.'

Blair conceded that he had 'had just about enough of the Olympic movement, its members and its ceremonies' by the end of his lobbying and Cameron, who joked last week at the G20 summit that he felt as though he was doing more work on the 2018 bid than on the economy, may feel the same after 24 hours at the preposterously grand FIFA headquarters in Zurich. 

As Blair observed, the tone required on these occasions is: 'We humbly beg to offer our services to your great movement.'

The same humility will be required from the Prime Minister, as well as from Prince William, the second in line to the throne, and David Beckham, the world's most famous footballer, who will also be on hand to lobby on England's behalf.

If they can pull it off, England may not be finished just yet, despite the fact that Spain and Portugal would be most people's favourites to win the majority vote required of FIFA's executive committee members.

One independent source, who knows the 24 members of the executive committee, insisted last week: 'It's still not impossible that England could win, even though the bid has been badly run at times and riven with rivalries between the Premier League and the FA.

'An awful lot happens in the final 24 hours, when alliances change. However, to win in those final hours, it is essential that you are at least in second place; it is almost impossible to do so if you are in third.'

The odds are against England leading, or indeed winning, following the emergence of what is, at the very least, a close understanding between Spanish FA president Angel Maria Villar Llona and the Qatari president of the Asian Football Confederation, Mohamed Bin Hamman. 

Qatar are bidding to stage the 2022 World Cup and voting for that tournament will take place immediately after the 2018 contest.

FIFA's ethics committee will rule on Wednesday on allegations of collusion between Qatar and Spain as well as the fate of two executive committee members who have been suspended following accusations of corruption.

Nigeria's Amos Adamu allegedly told undercover newspaper reporters that he would accept £500,000, ostensibly for artificial pitches, in return for his vote.

When asked whether the money should be paid to the Nigerian FA or to him directly, he is alleged to have replied: 'Directly, directly.'Adamu denies any wrongdoing.

Reynald Temarii, the president of the Oceania Football Confederation, allegedly told reporters that he was willing to receive £1.5million in funding for sports projects in his region in return for his vote. Temari insists that he will be exonerated on Wednesday.

The nuances of FIFA's judgment on the claims against Spain and Qatar will be studied carefully. Although they expect to be cleared of any offence, the tone of the ruling will, say sources, make some executive members nervous about deals they may themselves have made. *

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...ecuring-World-Cup-2018.html?ito=feeds-newsxml


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

http://news.williamhill.com/a/football/you-bet-england-world-cup-bid-in-freefall/

'We have lengthened England's odds consistently, from 8/11 to Even money in the past three days, but can't take any money for them, while Russia's odds have shortened from 6/4, and their bid is now odds-on favourite at 10/11, and the momentum seems to be with them' said Hill's spokesman Graham Sharpe.

TO HOST 2018 WORLD CUP....10/11 Russia; Evens England; 8/1 Portugal/Spain; 33/1 Belgium/Holland.



Betfair now
Russia 1,9
England 2,4


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

coth said:


> http://news.williamhill.com/a/football/you-bet-england-world-cup-bid-in-freefall/
> 
> 'We have lengthened England's odds consistently, from 8/11 to Even money in the past three days, but can't take any money for them, while Russia's odds have shortened from 6/4, and their bid is now odds-on favourite at 10/11, and the momentum seems to be with them' said Hill's spokesman Graham Sharpe.
> 
> ...


thats the trend - as a betting man you would have to put your money on Russia right now


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

that's british betting agencies. russian can barely bet on them because british agancies support only your payment systems and does not support russian payment systems.

but russian betting agencies betting on russia as well. that's a world trend


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

coth said:


> that's british betting agencies. russian can barely bet on them because british agancies support only your payment systems and does not support russian payment systems.
> 
> but russian betting agencies betting on russia as well. that's a world trend


punters normally care about one thing, the win :lol:

location will influence the general flow, as you get some leaning towards to home team (esp early on).

as it gets closer to the day though, punters start making decisions based upon whats good for their pocket

we have a good example here now, with the Ashes. Australia are favourites with the AU agencies right now, but you speak to any serious cricket fan and most expect us to go down pretty badly. Once we get close to the first test, and the sides are selected, I'd expect a strong move of money towards England.

WC is the same. Word is leaking out on exco delegate peferences, tech reports are being assessed, you are able to better assess a likely outcome.

To be fair, the FIFA backlash against the British press has killed the English bid IMO, and now any half drunk punting moron would have Russia as favourite.

Even without the backlash though, The Spain/Qatar deal was the game changer. It means Spain (if they hold the bloc) are guaranteed to survive to the final round, so its a very different fight.


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

The Spanish-Doha cheating is at the expense of Russia and America,not England and Australia.
Anti cheating sentiment will be strongly against Spain and Doha for all but those 7


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

_X_ said:


> The Spanish-Doha cheating is at the expense of Russia and America,not England and Australia.
> Anti cheating sentiment will be strongly against Spain and Doha for all but those 7


I'm not sold on that - Russia was getting bullish even before the public FIFA backlash

to give them their due, the Russians have run a good bid, and the Sochi preparations are showing that they can walk the walk preparation wise. as such, I don't think they will suffer as much from the spainish deal as some think they will.

Likewise for the USA, the negatives for their bid are minimal at best, and I think some are far too much over-estimating how many UEFA delegates we have on board

As a punter, I have my money on Russia and the USA


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

Good luck with that,you're almost on your own with that line of thought-hence the scrambling by Blazer this week.
At the moment the Americans barely get into the 3rd round
The Americans were only too happy to see fighting for votes between AFC members until they finally realised last week that Qatar and Australia are targeting different markets.
Thats why,if they go down,they will make sure everyone knows who the culprits are:lol:
To suggest England will not make the final two because of some media scrutiny is insane.Russia and Spain are fighting for similar votes-one of them won't make the last two


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## Gondolier (Apr 30, 2010)

_X_ said:


> Good luck with that,you're almost on your own with that line of thought-hence the scrambling by Blazer this week.
> At the moment the Americans barely get into the 3rd round
> The Americans were only too happy to see fighting for votes between AFC members until they finally realised last week that Qatar and Australia are targeting different markets.
> Thats why,if they go down,they will make sure everyone knows who the culprits are:lol:
> To suggest England will not make the final two because of some media scrutiny is insane.Russia and Spain are fighting for similar votes-one of them won't make the last two


Ha ha! The US has at least 9 votes for the first round--in case you didn't see; my office checked. Ha ha!!


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

Gondolier said:


> Ha ha! The US has at least 9 votes for the first round--in case you didn't see; my office checked. Ha ha!!


Why keep the laughter private-from the USA thread



Gondolier said:


> I think it was X who asked..."aside from Blazer, Warner and Thompson, who else can the US bid count on?"
> 
> Our offices just got off the phones. Here's your answer: In addition to the 3 above, Salguero, Hayatou, Leoz, Teixeira, Anouma, Valcke, Beckenbauer, Lefkaratis and Llona will compose the (first-round) U.S. bloc.


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

_X_ said:


> Good luck with that,you're almost on your own with that line of thought-hence the scrambling by Blazer this week.
> At the moment the Americans barely get into the 3rd round
> The Americans were only too happy to see fighting for votes between AFC members until they finally realised last week that Qatar and Australia are targeting different markets.
> Thats why,if they go down,they will make sure everyone knows who the culprits are:lol:
> To suggest England will not make the final two because of some media scrutiny is insane.Russia and Spain are fighting for similar votes-one of them won't make the last two


As I mentioned, I think you guys are pushing way too many UEFA votes the Australian way (I read one poster having zero going to the USA)


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## Gondolier (Apr 30, 2010)

_X_ said:


> Why keep the laughter private-from the USA thread


They already know. They don't have to be told. :smug:


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

T74 said:


> As I mentioned, I think you guys are pushing way too many UEFA votes the Australian way (I read one poster having zero going to the USA)


Not just UEFA, Jack Warner is currently in the process of trying to steal something else, an African world cup place. I doubt the African delegation are going to take to this too kindly.


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

T74 said:


> As I mentioned, I think you guys are pushing way too many UEFA votes the Australian way (I read one poster having zero going to the USA)



Well they did have Spain,but no longer because of Qatar


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Betting odds are an interesting sideshow, but can't be taken that seriously in bid races.

Normally odds do reflect reality and likely outcomes because betting patterns follow known form. You take the odds from any weekend in the Premier League and mostly the teams with the shortest odds will win. But there is little known form when it comes to 20+ FIFA executives and their personal whimsies; same goes for the IOC.

So bookies' odds in bid races - especially tight ones - are a horribly unreliable indicator in reality.

Paris 2012 was, as I always say when bookies' odds are used in a debate like this, _1-2 odds on_ in a five horse race! An utterly ridiculous price given how close everything was, but completely reflecting the fact that everyone (apart from me, haha!) bet on Paris because their bid had been hyped up as the favourite to such an extent.

Similarly, I read that Russian betting offices lost over 10 million rubles when Sochi won 2014. Nobody, not even Russia was expecting Sochi to win that one and the odds reflected the accepted narrative rather than how the votes actually went.

British betting offices stung by London 2012 winning and Russian betting offices stung by Sochi 2014 winning. Quite funny really!


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

*FIFA's ethics court begins a three-day session on Monday to help decide if two voters and at least two candidates should be barred from the 2018 and 2022 World Cup bidding contests for alleged corruption.

The unprecedented meeting in Zurich will shape a tense final stretch of lobbying before FIFA's executive committee chooses the hosts in a secret ballot on Dec. 2. The poll could proceed without Reynald Temarii and Amos Adamu, who are suspended from the 24-man body and will plead their case for reinstatement to the ethics committee.

FIFA president Sepp Blatter has said the ethics probe should "bring back credibility to football."

Awarding a World Cup is FIFA's most important decision, with each tournament required to earn around 95 percent of the governing body's income every four years.

However, the process has been rocked by allegations made by the British Sunday Times last month. The newspaper published secretly filmed interviews with current and former FIFA officials which suggested voters could be bribed, and that bidders were flouting the rules by striking vote-trading pacts.

Those being investigated have stressed their innocence and expressed confidence that the ethics panel will find no conclusive evidence of corruption.

"I have no doubt that I will vote on Dec. 2," Temarii, the suspended FIFA vice president, told The Associated Press last week. He said the ethics hearing would let him show that "grossly manipulated" interviews were edited to make him appear corrupt.

Temarii, the Tahitian president of Oceania's confederation, and Amos Adamu of Nigeria were filmed in an undercover sting appearing to offer their votes for sale to fund football projects at home.

Asian confederation president Mohamed Bin Hammam also has defended his native Qatar, a 2022 candidate, against allegations of colluding with 2018 contender Spain-Portugal.

"I can bet you (that) you will never see any proof," Bin Hammam told a Swiss television channel in a recent interview posted on his personal website.

FIFA has not identified which of the nine bidders it is investigating. The European contest for 2018 is between England, Russia and the joint bids of Belgium-Netherlands and Spain-Portugal. The 2022 race involves the United States, Australia, Japan, South Korea and Qatar.

An Oct. 20 meeting of the ethics committee already was set to examine bidders' behavior when the Sunday Times published its first allegations about Temarii and Adamu. A second round of revelations came the next weekend.

Blatter's former right-hand man at FIFA, Michel Zen-Ruffinen, was shown telling reporters posing as lobbyists that Qatar and Spain-Portugal had arranged to secure seven of the 24 votes. A simple majority is needed to win.

"This is not just a rumor, that's fact," said Zen-Ruffinen, who succeeded his boss Blatter to serve as FIFA's general secretary from 1998-2002 and was offering to work as a consultant.

Talk about a Qatari-Iberian plot deepened when it emerged that during an Oct. 29 meeting of FIFA's executive committee, Spain's bid leader Angel Maria Villar passed a note to Bin Hammam which translated as "Congratulations, we're going to win." Villar's intended meaning is unclear, but witnesses said it happened after Blatter acknowledged no hard evidence of collusion had been found.

Blatter is likely to play a big role if the ethics committee offers up advise rather than binding verdicts on Wednesday.

Led by lawyer and former Switzerland player Claudio Sulser, the independent panel gets its authority from the executive committee chaired by Blatter. FIFA statutes also allow ethics decisions to be challenged at its appeal committee and then the Court of Arbitration for Sport.

The FIFA president has called his executive group into emergency session in Zurich on Friday to address the ethics decisions.

The ethics committee also will consider cases against four former FIFA executive committee members who, like Temarii and Adamu, are serving provisional suspensions from football duty.

Tunisian lawyer Slim Aloulou, Amadou Diakite of Mali, Botswana's Ismail Bhamjee and Ahongalu Fusimalohi from Tonga all reportedly advised undercover reporters how to bribe FIFA voters and how much to pay. *

http://football.thestar.com.my/stor...all_latest/20101114215625&sec=football_latest


----------



## Qatar Son 333 (May 10, 2006)

I think the tags are pushing it a bit too far...


----------



## TheoG (Mar 20, 2010)

^^
 lol


----------



## nomarandlee (Sep 24, 2005)

RobH said:


> Betting odds are an interesting sideshow, but can't be taken that seriously in bid races.
> 
> !


Betting odds are meaningless as any indicator given the fact they aren't a reflection of what the industry line setters think who will win a given event or game but what those experts figure the general public is most likely to vote in a given event or game. 

They want equal dollars spent on both sides of a better as much as possible they don't reflect the chances of those who in the know actually think will win.


----------



## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

nomarandlee said:


> Betting odds are meaningless as any indicator given the fact they aren't a reflection of what the industry line setters think who will win a given event or game but what those experts figure the general public is most likely to vote in a given event or game.
> 
> They want equal dollars spent on both sides of a better as much as possible they don't reflect the chances of those who in the know actually think will win.


The betting agencies also try and con people obviously, which is why you make up your own decision, not follow what they tell you. It's always some bogus line, that's planned to screw you.


----------



## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)




----------



## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

From the BBC http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/9188757.stm

"Leaders of England's 2018 World Cup bid have written to Fifa distancing themselves from corruption allegations made against football's world governing body by the British media.

England officials have also pleaded with Fifa's executive committee to base its decision on the merits of their bid.

The letter, signed by chairman Geoff Thompson and international president David Dein, is the latest attempt to put England's campaign back on track ahead of the vote on 2 December.

England are facing defeat after a backlash from Fifa members in response to an investigation by the Sunday Times into alleged corruption in the bidding process.

Two executive committee members, Amos Adamu of Nigeria and Reynald Temarii of Tahiti, face a Fifa ethics committee hearing this week into the newspaper's claims that they were willing to offer their support in return for money for football projects.

Both men have denied any wrongdoing and will fight the allegations during the three-day hearing.

England 2018 also fear they could be damaged by an upcoming BBC Panorama investigation into Fifa, due to be screened on 29 November - only three days before the vote.

Thompson and Dein wrote: "In recent weeks, the role of the British media and its relationship with both Fifa as an organisation and the individual members of the Fifa Executive Committee has come under the spotlight and there has been significant speculation as to the effect that this might have on our bid.

"It has been a difficult time for Fifa and as a member of the football family we naturally feel solidarity with you and your colleagues.

"It is now public knowledge that we have made representations to the BBC regarding a forthcoming documentary they are planning. We are alerting you to fact that the programme appears in part to be raking over allegations some of which are up to 10-years-old and have already been formally dealt with by Fifa and the Swiss courts.

"We hope England's bid will not be judged negatively due to the activities of individual media organisations, regardless of one's view of their conduct. We hope you appreciate that we have no control over the British media."

We hope England's bid will not be judged negatively due to the activities of individual media organisations

Geoff Thompson and David Dein

In writing the letter, England 2018 hope to have countered any suggestions that they may have somehow colluded with the Sunday Times or BBC investigations. They also hope to have demonstrated to the Fifa members that they are part of the football family.

While some may have questioned the sympathy shown to the Fifa members by Thompson and Dein, they have been careful not to overtly criticise the British media. The bid leaders have also made it clear that they have no control over the media.

This is the crucial point they have sought to get across. They believe it would be extremely unfair to judge England's bid on the basis of the way the country's media operates.

It is a sign of how badly the bid team believe they have been damaged by events of the last month that a letter like this has been sent to Fifa.

It is understood Dein was encouraged to do it following a meeting with the Fifa president Sepp Blatter in Zurich last week.

England face coming third behind Russia and a joint bid from Spain and Portugal unless they can mount a dramatic fightback.

This week promises to be a critical with the ethics committee due to publish its findings on Amadu and Temarii on Wednesday. The committee will also rule on claims that Spain and Portugal have agreed a voting alliance with Qatar, who are bidding for the 2022 World Cup finals.

Unusually, Fifa has called an emergency executive committee meeting for Friday to discuss the findings.

Fifa's inspection report on each of the bids has also been sent out and will be published this week with England expected to be given a low risk rating.

If Fifa's ethics committee gives weight to the Sunday Times claims by getting tough with the two members currently suspended and there is a good response to the letter and the inspection report, then England may feel they can still get back into the race."

Seems as if it's clutching at straws personally.


----------



## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

FIFA are self-serving cowards who live in their own little ivory tower in a country where investigative journalism is all but illegal. They've been caught out and they don't like it. Well, diddums doo.

This sentence made particularly horrible reading:
*
It is understood Dein was encouraged to do it following a meeting with the Fifa president Sepp Blatter in Zurich last week.*

Did the IOC ask London to write an embarrassingly sycophantic letter pleading for forgiveness after the BBC exposed one of their members accepting a bribe? No. They dealt with the situation and didn't let it harm our bid. The IOC knew it was one of _their_ members in the wrong and didn't seek retribution or try to humiliate our bid.

The FIFA Execs are all intelligent people. They KNOW our bid has no influence over the media. They don't need a letter from England 2018 to tell them that. Yet Blatter encouraged our bid to grovel to FIFA, when really FIFA should be apologising to ALL the bidding nations for running a shambles of a bid race with zero transparency and constant moving of the goalposts. It's fucking disgusting to be frank and shows FIFA's complete inability to accept any blame.

If the prize wasn't so great I'd be all for our bid withdrawing now and having nothing to do with FIFA. Our country isn't wet-behind-the-ears; it doesn't need the FIFA seal of approval to continuing being one of the biggest footballing nations in the world. We can do very well without Blatter, Warner and the rest.


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

This England 2018 team don't seem to be near as slick as the London 2012 team, big budget or no big budget.

The FIFA process is of course a bit of a farce, but its all a bit of a joke. I suppose FIFA's half the reason its becoming one.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

FIFA is the entire reason it's become one.


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## OnceBittenTwiceShy (Mar 14, 2010)

RobH said:


> *It is understood Dein was encouraged to do it following a meeting with the Fifa president Sepp Blatter in Zurich last week.*


Win-win situation. The FIFA being cleared and at the same time paving the path for England.


----------



## okulaja (Oct 7, 2010)




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## rus (Nov 20, 2009)

*Avianova promised to open flights to all cities of Russia, where the planned World Cup 2018*
http://www.euromag.ru/great_britain/5039.html
"Transport accessibility are major factors in the performance of such big events like the FIFA World Cup, especially when it comes to such a large country like Russia. I am ready to personally assure the FIFA president Sepp Blatter that Avianova provide Russian residents and visitors of the World Cup and accessible by regular air services. Already today we offer tickets at the rate of 5.90 euro, which corresponds to the pricing policies of the leading European discounter - company Ryanair, and our rate of regularity meets the highest international standards. I - an Englishman, but in these days of soul root for Russia ", - said managing director Avianova Andrew Pyne.


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## waqif (Jul 3, 2010)

okulaja said:


>


the most Funny is what done by team Ranked 21 and qualified to worldcup 2010 lol


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

Guys, this is WC 2018 thread, not WC 2022.


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## waqif (Jul 3, 2010)

coth said:


> Guys, this is WC 2018 thread, not WC 2022.


australian guys maybe thinking Qatar bid is part of 2018 as Australia bid was part of 2018


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## Gondolier (Apr 30, 2010)

coth said:


> Guys, this is WC 2018 thread, not WC 2022.


NOPE. *Look at title: FIFA World Cup 2018/2022*. Plus the fact that they've closed the other thread anyway...so this doubles as the open thread for BOTH!!


----------



## Trelawny (Jan 9, 2010)

Gondolier said:


> NOPE. *Look at title: FIFA World Cup 2018/2022*. Plus the fact that they've closed the other thread anyway...so this doubles as the open thread for BOTH!!


Are you ESL??

European bids only, only 2018. Stupid.


----------



## Gondolier (Apr 30, 2010)

Trelawny said:


> Are you ESL??
> 
> European bids only, only 2018. Stupid.


Well, duh. THere are NO European bids in the 2022 category -- but it still says *2022*!! So if you want to narrow your options, then that's problem, IDIOT!! 

The other 2018/2022 thread is closed...so one can disregard half of that title as one chooses -- MORON!!


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## antriksh_sfo (Jan 10, 2009)

*Africa's ...... Australia's red mist*

http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/statistics/news/newsid=1251262/index.html

*6 *red cards have been shown in the last four FIFA World Cup matches involving Australia. Harry Kewell became the third Australian player to receive his marching orders in that span with the tally made up of one Italian (Marco Materazzi) and two Croatians (Dario Simic and Josip Simunic). Kewell's red card, following a handling offence in the game with Ghana in Rustenburg, was also the 150th sending-off at FIFA World Cups.


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## Walbanger (Jan 10, 2006)

^^ Though not related to the thread at all I think Australia will likely always attract more red cards than other teams. It's in the way we attack sport, our style is far more physical that other nations. No doubt a product of the sporting landscape in that many children play multible sports that they would adopt some of the aggression from Aussie Rules and Rugby, we run in straight lines.


----------



## OnceBittenTwiceShy (Mar 14, 2010)

...


----------



## Will737 (Jun 12, 2010)

Run Forest, run!


----------



## OnceBittenTwiceShy (Mar 14, 2010)

Will737 said:


> Run Forest, run!


From the Qatar thread, closed for unlocking further embarrassment:



> 2 International friendly clashes that prove Qatar's ability to organise a successful World Cup


I think this pretty much sums up the unprecedented naivity displayed by Qatari who have no clue whatsoever.


----------



## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

> *FIFA Executive Summary: Russia*
> 
> 
> 
> ...





> *FIFA Executive Summary: England*
> 
> 
> 
> ...





> *FIFA Executive Summary: Spain and Portugal*
> 
> 
> 
> ...





> *FIFA Executive Summary: Holland and Belgium*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


http://www.mrsportsbook.com/


----------



## eagle in sky (Feb 9, 2010)

i guess that is Iberia will win.


----------



## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

What part of _European_ do you fail to understand waqif?


----------



## waqif (Jul 3, 2010)

RobH said:


> What part of _European_ do you fail to understand waqif?


that part



OnceBittenTwiceShy said:


> From the Qatar thread, closed for unlocking further embarrassment:
> 
> 
> 
> I think this pretty much sums up the unprecedented naivity displayed by Qatari who have no clue whatsoever.


----------



## ReiAyanami (May 14, 2008)

Can a mod please lock these 2022 threads? I propose a 4-5 year future projects maximum.......


----------



## parcdesprinces (Feb 15, 2009)

eagle in sky said:


> i guess that is Iberia will win.


:nono: !


Although I voted for England in the poll.. I'd also like to see Belgium-Holland to win !

So, again :

Allez Belgique Allez !! Hup Holland Hup !!


:cheers:


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## Mr.Underground (Jan 15, 2007)

Have you put the evaluation report on this thread?

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/tournament/competition/01/33/59/45/bid_evaluation_report_1911.pdf


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## Mr.Underground (Jan 15, 2007)

Go to see the risks for every bids (Page 9).


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

parcdesprinces said:


> :nono: !
> 
> 
> Although I voted for England in the poll.. I'd also like to see Belgium-Holland to win !
> ...


Look at the amount of risks for Holland/Belgium though Stadium construction, Stadium operations, Team facilities, Accommodation, Government Guarantees, Host City Agreements, Stadium Agreements, Training Site Agreements and overall legal risk are all medium, only Qatar which is a ridiculous bid all together has a worse bid rating.


----------



## eagle in sky (Feb 9, 2010)

parcdesprinces said:


> :nono: !
> 
> 
> Although I voted for England in the poll.. I'd also like to see Belgium-Holland to win !
> ...


FIFA's president isn't Platini.i would remind to you.


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## dacrio (Jan 30, 2009)

eagle in sky said:


> FIFA's president isn't Platini.i would remind to you.


the report is useless to decide who will host the tournament, because the worst bids (that have the highest level of risk) will be chosen on 2dec. (russia for 2018 and qatar for 2022.):lol:

what a waste of money and time! and paper!


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## borza (Dec 11, 2007)

dacrio said:


> the report is useless to decide who will host the tournament, because the worst bids (that have the highest level of risk) will be chosen on 2dec. (russia for 2018 and qatar for 2022.):lol:
> 
> what a waste of money and time! and paper!


Russia is low risk and has a better report than England regarding hotel rooms, training venues, ... So I don't see how you derive Russia as a worst bid


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## dacrio (Jan 30, 2009)

borza said:


> Russia is low risk and has a better report than England regarding hotel rooms, training venues, ... So I don't see how you derive Russia as a worst bid



overall project:

england LOW risk
sp/po LOW
benelux LOW
RUSSIA MEDIUM

I remind you that I voted for Russia.


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## OnceBittenTwiceShy (Mar 14, 2010)

borza said:


> Russia is low risk and has a better report than England regarding hotel rooms, training venues.


Minor details. 

The USSR however would score high risk on the scale of hooliganism. Excused by FIFA.


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## parcdesprinces (Feb 15, 2009)

eagle in sky said:


> FIFA's president isn't Platini.i would remind to you.


???????? :|


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

OnceBittenTwiceShy said:


> Minor details.
> 
> The USSR however would score high risk on the scale of hooliganism. Excused by FIFA.


But Britain isn't really any lower on that scale


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## parcdesprinces (Feb 15, 2009)

MysteryMike said:


> Look at the amount of risks for Holland/Belgium...........


Please hno: !! 
IMHO you should better to look after your tiny (and overpopulated) island  !


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## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

Yes it is...hooliganism in this country is absolutely unrecognisable of the hooliganism of our past. Yes of course there will be occasional moments, as in all countries (I'm sure someone (probably Aleksey) will bring up the Millwall vs West Ham occasion as a sweeping generalisation), but throughout the entire football pyramid, English football is clean of hooliganism. When taking into account how well behaved English fans have been at the two previous World Cups how you can come to that conclusion is beyond me.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10358426


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## borza (Dec 11, 2007)

matthemod said:


> Yes it is...hooliganism in this country is absolutely unrecognisable of the hooliganism of our past. Yes of course there will be occasional moments, as in all countries (I'm sure someone (probably Aleksey) will bring up the Millwall vs West Ham occasion as a sweeping generalisation), but throughout the entire football pyramid, English football is clean of hooliganism. When taking into account how well behaved English fans have been at the two previous World Cups how you can come to that conclusion is beyond me.
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10358426


The same you can say about Russians. I can remember some example of English hooligans on WC or EC, but none of Russians


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Excellent work, thanks WFInsider. I like how the St Petersburg stadium is full of England flags


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

RobH said:


> Nobody condoned these things, claimed everything is perfect in this country, or claimed there weren't idiots in the UK. There clearly are and we are embarrassed by them.
> 
> The leader of Russia 2018, on the other hand, came out and said the banner wasn't racist! He wasn't embarrassed by it, or by the people who did it.


Yes, banana now is symbol of racism! I will never eat the bananas! 










Really, I see only 40 people near the banner. 40 people at the 28.000 stadium!



RobH said:


> Furthermore, the Russian banner was inside a stadium, so is directly related to the world cup bid and is the direct responsibility of the Russian FA. Student riots and a protest by Liverpool fans away from the stadium are not under the control of our FA, on the other hand and therefore have very little to do with the English world cup bid.


I agree that this is omission of Police guards! Now they ban any "suspicious" banners.



RobH said:


> I said several times in this forum had the banner led to a comprehensive "Kick it out" campaign of the sort we have in England, it wouldn've _boosted_ Russia's world cup bid. *I also said I hoped that would happen. A few morons shouldn't derail national hopes. It'd be grossly unfair.*
> 
> But the reaction from the authorities was to deny the obvious implications of the banner and go on the offensive. A massive PR own goal in other words.


----------



## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

RobH said:


> Excellent work, thanks WFInsider. I like how the St Petersburg stadium is full of England flags


English flags? Where do you see it?


----------



## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

> Yes, banana now is symbol of racism! I will never eat the bananas!


Act naive if you want, it only makes you look stupid.



> Really, I see only 40 people near the banner. 40 people at the 28.000 stadium!


Exactly!! Had the Russian FA come out, said it was unacceptable, and said they'd deal with it, it would have gnoe away as a news story quite quickly, because it was only a few dozen people. They didn't do this however, they made the situation worse by denying it was a problem. This whole situation has been grossly execcerbated by the bad decisions of the Russian FA and the words of Sorokin. They have allowed a minority to get their point across much better than they would have done otherwise.

I've gone over this 1000 times with you but you're still acting dumb. Trouble is, I'm not even sure it's an act anymore.


----------



## parcdesprinces (Feb 15, 2009)

RobH said:


> St Petersburg stadium is full of England flags


Nope, there are Georgian flags :baeh3: !!!!


opcorn:


----------



## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

RobH said:


> Act naive if you want, it only makes you look stupid.


I find this silly criticism of a player for his bad game in the last matches.


----------



## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

RobH said:


> I don't pretend to know a lot about modern Russia, but if the Russians on this forum are at all reflective of it, it's not somewhere I'd like to go. I have a lot less sympathy for a Russian world cup than I did a year ago after having read the contributions of various Russians to this forum. So congrats to all of them for doing such a good job of promoting their country!





RobH said:


> I've gone over this 1000 times with you but you're still acting dumb. Trouble is, I'm not even sure it's an act anymore.


Listen, guy, I have the same opinion about the British fans! In this forum, I haven't read so many insults in a single thread from any nation - neither from Italians nor from Frenchmen nor from Germans nor from Spaniards nor from Americans and even nor from Poles! 

Indeed, I can be misinformed, I could be wrong in the dispute, but I do not allow myself to turn discussion on personal and national insults.


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## rus (Nov 20, 2009)

Stop bananas.:bash: 
It is better to watch a movie on how to support the Soviet Union, when you have on the country running Chelsea Hedhanters, West Ham ICF and other hooligans.
The film "Stadion" about the emotions Zenit fans at the games against Dinamo Moscow, Dinamo Minsk and Spartak Moscow(Soviet Top League, season 1984).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-amMOw3Yuk&feature=player_embedded
This is old Kirov Stadium(on this place building new Zenit Arena)
http://football.hiblogger.net/authors/stadiums/996079.html
Movie "Our name - Zenit" about the first fans (ultras) in Leningrad (now St. Petersburg) since 1980.
http://vimeo.com/15439751


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

rus said:


> Stop bananas.:bash:
> It is better to watch a movie on how to support the Soviet Union, when you have on the country running Chelsea Hedhanters, West Ham ICF and other hooligans.
> The film "Stadion" about the emotions Zenit fans at the games against Dinamo Moscow, Dinamo Minsk and Spartak Moscow(Soviet Top League, season 1984).
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-amMOw3Yuk&feature=player_embedded
> ...


^^


----------



## parcdesprinces (Feb 15, 2009)

I think you forgot this: :cheers2:





(especially from 2:15)..And I love this song ! (Стадион моей мечты-Stadium of my dream)


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## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

God this forum is depressing.


----------



## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

parcdesprinces said:


> I think you forgot this: :cheers2:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes. By the way, it was Moscow 1980 where first time in the Olympic history were performed show programmes at the opening and closing ceremony, not only official parade of athletes.

But I more like it (esecially from 1:40) - Goodbye, Misha!


----------



## TheoG (Mar 20, 2010)

Is it actually possible for one of AlekseyVT, rus, coth or WFInsider to have a normal, sophisticated, mature, un-nationalist conversation? You blame RobH for getting the Russia thread closed, yet you don't give him a chance to say anything worth reading, because he's always having to respond to your idiotic, narrow-minded, hypocritical, nationalist comments about hooliganism, propaganda and racism. As said, this forum is depressing, fact of life. Sure, you're allowed to discuss the respective bids, but flaming and slandering other people simply due to their nationality and mindlessly insulting other countries because they're competing against you is just wrong. I'll say the same to MysteryMike. I've been to Russia myself, I went to St Petersburg for a week, it's a lovely place, the people are great, very friendly, the buildings are beautiful, and the atmosphere of the place is elegant and sophisticated. Shame that my experience of Russians on this forum differs greatly from this. I'm sure a country of god knows how many million should be allowed to have one redeeming member on here, but my hopes of finding one are rapidly deteriorating day by day.


----------



## antriksh_sfo (Jan 10, 2009)

*ENGLAND BID SUFFERS DUE TO UNYIELDING CLASH WITH SPORTING EVENTS*

*Shadow over World Cup bids *

GENEVA: England and Australia's bids to host football's World Cup in 2018 and 2022 may suffer from clashes with local sports events, including tennis at Wimbledon and Australian rugby league, FIFA indicated.

“It is a FIFA requirement that no other major sporting event is hosted in a Host City during the period and the fact that the Wimbledon tennis championships take place in London during late June/early July could have an impact on the public attention given to the FIFA World Cup,” the evaluation report said.

FIFA's evaluation of Australia signalled a clash with the National Rugby League season and Australian rules football from March to September, affecting both public attention and available resources, as well as a potential third impact.


Future dates for football's month-long showpiece event have not been set but they have typically straddled June into July when it has been hosted by European countries. — AFP


----------



## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

TheoG said:


> Is it actually possible for one of AlekseyVT, rus, coth or WFInsider to have a normal, sophisticated, mature, un-nationalist conversation? You blame RobH for getting the Russia thread closed, yet you don't give him a chance to say anything worth reading, because he's always having to respond to your idiotic, narrow-minded, hypocritical, nationalist comments about hooliganism, propaganda and racism. As said, this forum is depressing, fact of life. Sure, you're allowed to discuss the respective bids, but flaming and slandering other people simply due to their nationality and mindlessly insulting other countries because they're competing against you is just wrong. I'll say the same to MysteryMike. I've been to Russia myself, I went to St Petersburg for a week, it's a lovely place, the people are great, very friendly, the buildings are beautiful, and the atmosphere of the place is elegant and sophisticated. Shame that my experience of Russians on this forum differs greatly from this. I'm sure a country of god knows how many million should be allowed to have one redeeming member on here, but my hopes of finding one are rapidly deteriorating day by day.


As I wrote, I was been in the UK and found it a good place (although, being Muscovite, I feel himself extremely boring at all sites except London and Edinburgh).

Like I said, I have own opinion about the British mass-media (I read it almost every day) or hooliganism (you can't say that you are proud of own country after the student protests or the actions of the Liverpool's fans).

However, criticizing the some negative aspects of English life, I never allowed myself to insult the person or nation. If you disagree, then try to find the posts where I insulted you personally, in spite of all British posts like this:



Mr Trebus said:


> i think he (RobH) was sleeping with your mum:lol:


If you consider themselves a civilized people, then try at least to correspond this image. Even the political disputes with Brits and Yankees on Guardian's forum are much more correctly.


----------



## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

antriksh_sfo said:


> *Shadow over World Cup bids *
> 
> GENEVA: England and Australia's bids to host football's World Cup in 2018 and 2022 may suffer from clashes with local sports events, including tennis at Wimbledon and Australian rugby league, FIFA indicated.
> 
> ...


The dates of these sportive events were determined long time ago. So I find it very strange that this problem was been discovered only now.


----------



## Gondolier (Apr 30, 2010)

Australia and the UK's bids are doomed to fail.

It's going to be Russia 2018 and USA 2022! That is being decided at the NATO meet in Lisbon this week!!


----------



## dacrio (Jan 30, 2009)

Gondolier said:


> Australia and the UK's bids are doomed to fail.
> 
> It's going to be Russia 2018 and USA 2022! That is being decided at the NATO meet in Lisbon this week!!


:cheers:

your opinion should not be discarded


----------



## Mr.Underground (Jan 15, 2007)

I think England 2018 and Australia 2022, but I hope Russia 2018 and Qatar 2022. :cheers:


----------



## Gondolier (Apr 30, 2010)

AlekseyVT said:


> Yes. By the way, it was Moscow 1980 where first time in the Olympic history were performed show programmes at the opening and closing ceremony, not only official parade of athletes.


Baloney, Aleksey. Artistic programmes in BOTH Opening and CLosing ceremonies have been performed since Berlin 1936 (at least insofar as complete visual records). And even as late as Montreal 1976, they had the artistic portions in BOTH O and C!! So Moscow 1980 is NO exception. The only thing Moscow 1980 can boast of is that it had the most WHITE (Olympic flags) for like 2 dozen nations!!


----------



## TheoG (Mar 20, 2010)

RobH said:


> Well look who it is. Have you filled the holes in in your athletics track yet?


Hehe, I remember the classic times in about June when antrishk spent his entire time making bitter and thoroughly meaningless comments criticising the preparations of other country's big events, for example London 2012, and just generally acting like a nasty person, without ever thinking to comment about his own country. And he was bitten in the face for it, thanks to Dehli 2010. As much as I didn't want it to fail, I gained a lot of satisfaction from seeing the irony in it.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

I've been told on three occassions by a couple of mods that he's a hair's breadth away from a ban on this forum. He can continue to post articles like the one he posted on the previous page if he likes...up to him I guess.


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## Mr.Underground (Jan 15, 2007)

WFInsider said:


> ^^ Fake. Podolsk is not in the bid.


And the opening match will be at Luzniki stadium.

After athletic world chamionship in Moscow 2013, Sochi 2014, this the time for RUSSIA 2018.

C'm on russian friend. :cheers:


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## labytnangi (Feb 6, 2010)

WFInsider said:


> ^^ Fake. Podolsk is not in the bid.


Podolsk it is suburb of Moscow like Twickenham in London


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## labytnangi (Feb 6, 2010)

USP said:


> labytnangi, you are wrong. Volgograd is 100% to host WC.


I doubt it. I think more preferred Samara...


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

labytnangi said:


> Podolsk it is suburb of Moscow like Twickenham in London


There is 40km between center of Moscow and center of Podolsk. Of course it's a nearest suburb of Moscow, but when when it comes to british/qatar scale - that's pretty much a lot. It's like between Liverpool and Manchester, or between Leeds and Manchester, or between Birmingham and Nottingham, or Manchester and Sheffield.

There are 6 stadiums within 100km radius from Manchester. So why bashing (not you, but most of british and australian bid supporters here) Moscow and Qatar on this?


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

labytnangi said:


> Podolsk it is suburb of Moscow like Twickenham in London


I know, but Podolsk came out from the bid. 4th stadium in Moscow region (3 in Moscow) will be near MKAD on the south.


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## labytnangi (Feb 6, 2010)

coth said:


> There is 40km between center of Moscow and center of Podolsk. Of course it's a nearest suburb of Moscow, but when when it comes to british/qatar scale - that's pretty much a lot. It's like between Liverpool and Manchester, or between Leeds and Manchester, or between Birmingham and Nottingham, or Manchester and Sheffield.
> 
> There are 6 stadiums within 100km radius from Manchester. So why bashing (not you, but most of british and australian bid supporters here) Moscow and Qatar on this?


What can we do? Russia such a big country! In this aspect England has the advantage. But from the center of Moscow to Podolsk ride on the express train 26 minutes. it's fast enough ...


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

coth said:


> There is 40km between center of Moscow and center of Podolsk. Of course it's a nearest suburb of Moscow, but when when it comes to british/qatar scale - that's pretty much a lot. It's like between Liverpool and Manchester, or between Leeds and Manchester, or between Birmingham and Nottingham, or Manchester and Sheffield.
> 
> There are 6 stadiums within 100km radius from Manchester. So why bashing (not you, but most of british and australian bid supporters here) Moscow and Qatar on this?


Nobody has bashed Moscow as far as I'm aware. 

But whilst England is a small country it is proposing multiple cities each with their own transport hubs, logistical operations, venues etc. Each hosts tens of thousands of fans every week, proven Premier League grounds with no question marks over capability

Qatar's bid is on another scale of compactness altogether, to the point where it becomes detrminental, and becuase few of the stadiums exist, there is an element of the unknown.

And that's not "bashing"; FIFA themselves in their technical report have raised question marks over the logistics of Qatar's ultra-compact bid. Dependence on a single airport, simply not enough training facilities in the city and those planned are criticised ("teams should be provided with more than one pitch"), transport not in place at this time, "playing up to four matches within a 30km radius in one day could present operational risks", segregation and ticketing would be under immense pressure, more than half of the accommodation is yet to be built etc

The comparison simply doesn't hold true.


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

I found an important info.


> 1. Подписание данного Меморандума всеми заинтересованными сторонами, включая лиги, клубы и объединения болельщиков, и создание рабочей группы по разработке Программы с их участием (ноябрь-декабрь 2010 г.)
> 
> 2. Разработка коммуникационной стратегии (ноябрь-декабрь 2010 г.)
> 
> ...


This is a *"Memorandum against racism"*, which was signed by Russian Football Union at 21 October.

1. The signing of Memorandum by all leagues, clubs and fan clubs, and creation of a working group to develop a program with their participation (November-December 2010)
2. Development of strategy (November-December 2010)
3. Realisation of information campaign (2011-2015)
4. Project to improve respect for the national cultures on the territory of Russia, through a Russian football (December 2010 - November 2011).
5. Developing and implementing of regulations (January-March 2011)
6. Development of "Guide of anti-discrimination" (April 2011)
7. Starting a Web portal "Racism in offside" (June 2011)

So strategy will be completed in December. I think it will be a part of Bid presentation in Zurich.


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## labytnangi (Feb 6, 2010)

WFInsider said:


> I know, but Podolsk came out from the bid. 4th stadium in Moscow region (3 in Moscow) will be near MKAD on the south.


According to the rules of FIFA in the same city can't be more than two stadiums. Therefore, only two stadiums in Moscow and one arena in Podolsk.


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

labytnangi said:


> According to the rules of FIFA in the same city can't be more than two stadiums. Therefore, only two stadiums in Moscow and one arena in Podolsk.


Read again, please. Podolsk stadium was replaced by stadium near MKAD (on the outside). And yes, this is 4th stadium in Moscow region, no problem with it.

The schedule has Podolsk inside. Probably because it's a fake schedule, or if it's true it just was written before Podolsk stadium was replaced.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Bear in mind labytnangi that the stadiums proposed at this stage are like a 'shortlist'. London is putting forward 3 or 4 possible stadiums, but if England wins it's likely FIFA and the organising committee will choose two. The bid books essentially lay out the options for FIFA, rather than necessarily providing a blueprint for exactly which stadiums the tournament will be played in.


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

coth said:


> There is 40km between center of Moscow and center of Podolsk. Of course it's a nearest suburb of Moscow, but when when it comes to british/qatar scale - that's pretty much a lot. It's like between Liverpool and Manchester, or between Leeds and Manchester, or between Birmingham and Nottingham, or Manchester and Sheffield.
> 
> There are 6 stadiums within 100km radius from Manchester. So why bashing (not you, but most of british and australian bid supporters here) Moscow *and Qatar* on this?


Qatar has 10 venues within 30km. Using suburbs declared to be host cities.

Very different to Podolsk or Mancester.


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## waqif (Jul 3, 2010)

coth said:


> There is 40km between center of Moscow and center of Podolsk. Of course it's a nearest suburb of Moscow, but when when it comes to british/qatar scale - that's pretty much a lot. It's like between Liverpool and Manchester, or between Leeds and Manchester, or between Birmingham and Nottingham, or Manchester and Sheffield.
> 
> There are 6 stadiums within 100km radius from Manchester. So why bashing (not you, but most of british and australian bid supporters here) Moscow and Qatar on this?


it is maneuvers of media and newspapers and cant effect any bid we saw last weeks there many attacks from newspapers against attempts such as Spain, Qatar & Russia it is not about reports or ability they just to distortion their rivals which failed completely.



RobH said:


> Nobody has bashed Moscow as far as I'm aware.
> 
> But whilst England is a small country it is proposing multiple cities each with their own transport hubs, logistical operations, venues etc. Each hosts tens of thousands of fans every week, proven Premier League grounds with no question marks over capability
> 
> ...


there no need for additional airports since Qatar now building large new airport will be opened in next 18 december 2011 and it is capacity 50 millions if was there any need for more capacity than 50 millions Qatar will going keep the current airport. 

plus Qatar is now building causeway linking between Qatar & Bahrain and it is the longest world causeway 45km with fast train in middle so people can travel from Bahrain or Bahrain Internation Airport to Doha in only 30 minutes.



















Also Qatar will build Metro & Railways system linking Qatar cities and Qatar with it is Gulf countries neighbors.






















Mo Rush said:


> Qatar has 10 venues within 30km. Using suburbs declared to be host cities.
> 
> Very different to Podolsk or Mancester.


Right very different and unique it is a compact world cup with infrastructure worth more than 100 billion dollar that why their logo expect amazing becouse what they doing is realy unique and we never saw in any worldcup bid before.


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## Mr.Underground (Jan 15, 2007)

Mo Rush said:


> Qatar has 10 venues within 30km. Using suburbs declared to be host cities.
> 
> Very different to Podolsk or Mancester.


60 km.


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## Rev Stickleback (Jun 23, 2009)

waqif said:


> Also Qatar will build Metro & Railways system linking Qatar cities and Qatar with it is Gulf countries neighbors..


Unless they avoid Saudi Arabia, they'll be useless to non-muslims.


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## TheoG (Mar 20, 2010)

Mr.Underground said:


> 60 km.


Still, it's not really something to be proud of, it's like hosting a world cup in Kent, it just won't work, even if you include London.


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## Qatar Son 333 (May 10, 2006)

Rev Stickleback said:


> Unless they avoid Saudi Arabia, they'll be useless to non-muslims.


This is so naive , I bet it was posted to make some problems :nono:

First of all we are soon to have the region in a similar state to the EU, YES THE EU ! We will have:
1) common GCC Tourist visa.
2) common currency.

This means everything for fans became much easier, you can land in any airport in the region (Dubai X2, Abudhabi, Doha, Manama, Dammam) with one of them being the world's largest airport (Dubai World Central AKA Al-Maktoum Global Airport), then simply take a train to Doha, in the end take a metro to your destination (Stadium, hotel etc). 

Such moves makes it much easier for travelling fans to have flexible choices, not to mention the availability of buses, taxis and rented cars.

Second, The building of the worlds longest causeway, linking Qatar to the Kingdom of Bahrain (Road & Rail) also offers fans more choices, if by any chance the accommodation is insufficient or inadequate (although it surpasses FIFA requirements). SO Bahrain is a great alternative when it comes to accommodation, it is also an alternative to entertainment and such, you could go have fun and come back the same day without any stress.


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## waqif (Jul 3, 2010)

Qatar Son 333 said:


> Second, The building of the worlds longest causeway, linking Qatar to the Kingdom of Bahrain (Road & Rail) also offers fans more choices, if by any chance the accommodation is insufficient or inadequate (although it surpasses FIFA requirements). SO Bahrain is a great alternative when it comes to accommodation, it is also an alternative to entertainment and such, you could go have fun and come back the same day without any stress.


well even Bahrain been mentioned in Qatar bid Book as another gate but it is still clear to everyone Qatar is offering a compact world cup and they not offering joint bid.


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## thicken (Jan 29, 2009)

im cheering for portugal and spain! =)


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## _X_ (Oct 24, 2009)

Mr.Underground said:


> 60 km.


No-its 25-30kms as originally posted.
The 11th and 12th venues make it 60kms.
Once the hosting decision is made and if Qatar were successful we could/probably would see these other 2 towns dropped from the bid leaving all 10 stadiums in Doha and its suburbs

I commend Qatar for its ambition but they can't possibly meet the critical requirements for such a massive event that demands far more space and diversity.They have taken the bid as physically far as the imagination will stretch and still its a stretch.
I know its very hard for these people because they are in such a hurry to do things but the world will make them wait for a further Asian edition in a joint bid,where it will actually abate many of the existing concerns


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

22.11.10. During "Soccerex" in Rio.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

*Russia rests 2018 World Cup bid on belief that big and bold is best*

*Incorporating 16 stadiums in 13 cities, Russia's plans for the next but one World Cup are nothing if not ambitious*

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2010/nov/24/world-cup-2018-russia-bid

Russia has spent the past 22 months selling Fifa an audacious vision that is appropriately expansive for a World Cup bid that stretches over 1,500 miles from Kaliningrad on the Polish border in the west to Yekaterinburg beyond the Urals in the east. It is one its supporters claim will open vast new markets, hugely grow the popularity of football in Russia and beyond and leave a lasting legacy of gleaming new stadiums, a new transport network and upgraded infrastructure.

Comparing Russia's bid for the 2018 World Cup with England's is an exercise in contrasts. England highlights its compact nature, its existing iconic stadiums, the huge popularity of its football at home and abroad, the potential to deliver record profits for Fifa and its pitch to deliver a legacy for football around the world. Russia's bid is all about jaw-dropping scale, the potential for growth and talk of what the World Cup could do to showcase "the new Russia", as well as increasingly vocal reminders that it has never hosted the competition.

Its bid proposes 16 stadiums, 14 of them newly built or significantly refurbished, in 13 host cities that are grouped into four clusters and linked by free overland travel. The Russians are promising to spend $6bn (£3.8bn) on football infrastructure alone and many times that on upgrading transport networks, accommodation and city centres, all underwritten by government guarantees. The bid's chief executive, Alexei Sorokin, has been keen to highlight the private investment as well as the public, and oligarchs including Roman Abramovich have been pressed into service.

At every turn Russia has sought to emphasise the potential prize rather than the current practicalities in an attempt to push Fifa's buttons. "England could host the World Cup tomorrow. But we have a vision and Fifa has a philosophy that is about trying to grow in new parts of the world. Football is already very popular in England. We hope that football can be as popular in Russia as it is in England," Vitaly Mutko, the bid chairman and Russian sports minister, told the Guardian this month. "We have a vision and Fifa has a philosophy that is about trying to grow in new parts of the world," Vitaly Mutko, the bid's chairman and Russia's sports minister, told the Guardian. Russian domestic matches are often played in front of half-empty stands but its bid leaders claim that, too, as a positive rather than a negative – arguing that it shows there is room for growth.

Vladimir Putin, who was credited with playing a key role in delivering the 2014 Winter Olympics for Sochi, is likely to spearhead the final few days of lobbying. Indeed the presence of Russia's prime minister will be a reliable barometer as to his country's chances – the former president is unlikely to travel if he does not feel the bid will win.

The technical reports published last week by Fifa highlighted logistical concerns, particularly around transport, where its air travel plans were labelled "high risk". "The country's vastness and geographic location, coupled with the fact that the high-speed railway network is limited and would only link six candidate host cities by 2018, imply a dependence on air travel, potentially causing domestic and international transfer challenges in view of the lack of alternative means of long-distance transport," it said. But Russia believes it can allay those concerns, highlighting the billions being poured into upgrading airports and transport networks. It has also tried to turn its vast size into a positive, talking of its 18 neighbouring countries, its ability to link east and west and the possibility of opening up the Asian market.

The phoney war that raged for months between England and Russia masked a serious purpose as each sought to undermine the other. Dark rumours that Russia was somehow involved with the sting that led to the resignation of Lord Triesman in May as chairman of the England bid were furiously denied by Sorokin, who at the same time accused his rivals of stoking up an unfair furore around racism and hooliganism in Russian football.

Allegations of racism, which came to be symbolised by a banner directed at the striker Peter Odemwingie, now at West Bromwich Albion, by fans of his former club Lokomotiv Moscow, and sporadic outbreaks of violent hooliganism have left the Russian bid sensitive to criticism. Here, too, they claim Russia is misunderstood and that the World Cup could help break down barriers. "We are diverse, yet inclusive. We are multicultural, yet unified," declares its bid literature.

The war of words burst into real acrimony when England complained to Fifa last month over Sorokin's reported comments on London's problems with crime and alcohol, but the episode will have little effect on voting intentions.

Like its rivals, Russia has assiduously courted the members of the executive committee. The resources behind the bid have led to the usual whispers of impropriety, all vigorously denied. Russia appears to have beaten England to the three votes on offer from Africa. Other influential supporters include Franz Beckenbauer and Sepp Blatter himself, which could prove crucial in the latter rounds of voting - for all that the president's influence over his fellow executive committee members is sometimes overstated.

The Fifa president, motivated by the twin concerns of his re-election drive and his place in history, strongly hinted earlier this year that, having taken the World Cup to Africa for the first time, he liked the idea of delivering the first major football tournament in Russia.

"The easiest way to organise the World Cup is to go to England. Everything is there: fans, stadiums, infrastructure – it's easy. But you cannot deny Russia if they bid for something," he said. "They are more than a country, they are a big continent, a big power."

Throughout the course of the year there has been a growing confidence among Russia's bid team as they imperceptibly assumed the mantle of favourites. If the abiding memory of the bidding expo in Cape Town this time last year was Sorokin glowering as he was ignored while delegates thronged around David Beckham and Luís Figo, by the time of the Fifa executive commitee meetings in Zurich last month he was all smiles.

But for all Russia's confidence, rivals believe there are signs they are beatable. Some question whether the billions being pledged to underwrite the World Cup bid would not be better invested in frontline services for Russia's population, where 15% still live below the poverty line. Others might ponder the contradictions inherent in the fact that the same country that promises a huge Fifa Fan Fest in Red Square is under fire from human rights organisations for clamping down on the right to free protest; and that, while England's media have had a negative impact on its chances, the fact that Russia remains one of the most dangerous countries in which to work as a journalist is overlooked.

Those questions are unlikely to detain the 22 individuals with a vote. Fifa maintains a strict line between the sporting and the political and refuses to make value judgments. As long as the host agrees to its demands around visas, tax exemption and so on, it is happy.

The stakes for those leading the Russian bid are high. Mutko came under severe pressure in the wake of a disappointing showing by Russia at the Winter Olympics in Vancouver earlier this year in a range of sports where pre-eminence was once taken for granted. Then he was hammered by an audit commission report that memorably alleged he had claimed for 97 breakfasts during his 20-day stay in Canada and spent $1,499 a night on his hotel room.

Mutko denied the allegations and all would be forgotten if he delivered the World Cup. Sorokin, a former diplomat in Washington who oversaw preparations for the 2008 Champions League final in Moscow, is also under pressure. That was a night that highlighted the fine margins between winning and losing. All the indications are that next week's vote will be just as close.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

*Exclusive: Putin set to complete full set of Prime Ministers for World Cup vote:*

http://www.insideworldfootball.biz/...ull-set-of-prime-ministers-for-world-cup-vote

November 23 - Russia's Government are making final plans for Prime Minister Vladimir Putin to travel to Zurich next week to support the country's bid to host the 2018 World Cup - putting an end to doubts over whether he would make the trip. 

Russian 2018 officials have confirmed to insideworldfootball that Putin will fly to Switzerland in his private jet to lobby FIFA Executive Committee members and convince them to award the tournament to Russia for the first time in its history.

"He has been a big supporter of the bid since it was launched," a source close to the bid told insideworldfootball here at Soccerex, where several countries are undertaking last month campaigning.

"He has worked hard speaking to ExCo members and believes that he should be there at the end to support the bid."

Russia are considered the favourites to be awarded the tournament but claims by Spain and Portugal that they have already secured up to eight votes demonstrates that there still remains work to be done before they can relax.

Russia will be hoping that Putin can reprise his performance in Guatemala City three years ago when he swept in and, against the odds, persuaded the International Olympic Committee (IOC) to award Sochi the 2014 Winter Olympics and Paralympics.

On that occasion he surprised many by delivering his speech in English and may well repeat that tactic in Zurich.

It was Tony Blair who demonstrated the power that country's leaders have in helping win major bids when he travelled to Singapore in 2005 to back London's successful campaign to host the 2012 Olympics and Paralympics.

Blair's predecessor as Prime Minister, David Cameron, has already committed to travelling to Zurich.

He and Putin will also be joined by the Prime Ministers of the four countries involved in joint bids, Belgium and Holland and Spain and Portugal.

*SORRY, BRITS, BUT cameron IS NOT CONCURENT FOR PUTIN!*


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

Please, open *RUSSIA - FIFA World Cup 2018 / 2022 bid* thread!


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## Ik_heet_tim (Nov 18, 2010)

I would prefer England for 2018. I don't want the criminals of the FIFA in the Netherlands. And England has the best football culture.


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## DAVID_E (Sep 23, 2010)

It feels like Russia-2018 and Australia-2022.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

WFInsider said:


> Please, open *RUSSIA - FIFA World Cup 2018 / 2022 bid* thread!


I'm sured that this thread planned to be opened only after final voting.


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## MoreOrLess (Feb 17, 2005)

VS










I do believe were over matched.


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## rus (Nov 20, 2009)

AlekseyVT said:


> I'm sured that this thread planned to be opened only after final voting.


I think I need to do a separate branch for every host city of Russia 2018. For example:
*Russia 2018*
-_Krasnodar_
-Stadium
-Infrastructure
-Tourism
similar in all the cities


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## borza (Dec 11, 2007)

rus said:


> I think I need to do a separate branch for every host city of Russia 2018. For example:
> *Russia 2018*
> -_Krasnodar_
> -Stadium
> ...


Don't cheer to soon


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## hottentotspur (Nov 24, 2010)

2018 will be for England and 2022 for Australia. Perfect if you ask me, although Russia should also be good.


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## CaliforniaJones (Apr 9, 2009)

2018: England
2022: USA


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## Levant (Nov 24, 2010)

Ik_heet_tim said:


> I would prefer England for 2018. I don't want the criminals of the FIFA in the Netherlands. And England has the best football culture.


Same here, I'd like a World Cup in the Netherlands but not under the preposterous terms set by the FIFA, here is to having some self-respect and not get taken up from behind by Blatter and friends. I'm praying that the Spain & Portugal Bid doesn't win because that simply means that the Netherlands will still end up paying the bill for the World Cup.

England has the best football culture indeed, it's a stable first-world country without the dubious governments that some other bidding nations have. Same thing counts for Australia and the United States. Qatar is a joke, let's face it if it gets selected it would destroy any credibility FIFA has. Football is commercialized enough as it is, I'd rather not have the World Cup become the celebration of some despotic Oil Sheik.


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## borza (Dec 11, 2007)

CaliforniaJones said:


> 2018: England
> 2022: USA


seems not realistic to me: two Anglo-Saxon countries


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Well, we've already had world cups in Gaul and Bohemia. I don't think we should discriminate against the Angles or the Jutes.


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## Gondolier (Apr 30, 2010)

borza said:


> seems not realistic to me: two Anglo-Saxon countries


It's about time!! :lol:

Except the US has a heavier Latino flavor to it than the UK.


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## shvonder (Jun 4, 2010)

Only England, or Belgique and Nederland, España or Portugal
Especially for me - England or Belgique and Nederland

No Russia


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Why don't you like the idea of a Russian world cup?


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## shvonder (Jun 4, 2010)

RobH said:


> Why don't you like the idea of a Russian world cup?


Our country spending so much money for Sochi - 2014 - first reason
infrastructure in England and B&N more better then in Russia (road, train, airport, hotel etc.) - second reason
and football in this countries on a high level, then here - third reason

that's all


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

shvonder said:


> Our country spent so much money for Sochi - 2014 - first reason
> infrastructure in England and B&N more better then in Russia (road, train, airport, hotel etc.) - second reason
> and football in this countries on a high level, then here - third reason
> 
> that's all


No one normal reason.

The cost of WC events are 600-700 mln. Everything else - airports, railways, roads, stadiums, etc. - will be built, but with WC it will be faster and better.

You are just one of those who don't think widely.


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

RobH said:


> Why don't you like the idea of a Russian world cup?


nevermind him, he is just our national troll. that's a long story.


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## borza (Dec 11, 2007)

WFInsider said:


> No one normal reason.
> 
> The cost of WC events are 600-700 mln. Everything else - airports, railways, roads, stadiums, etc. - will be built, but with WC it will be faster and better.
> 
> You are just one of those who don't think widely.


I totally agree


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## borza (Dec 11, 2007)

Gondolier said:


> It's about time!! :lol:
> 
> Except the US has a heavier Latino flavor to it than the UK.


There's just not that much difference in culture, relatively of course.
Russia 2018
USA 2022 
is ok for me


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## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

borza said:


> There's just not that much difference in culture, relatively of course.


As a person who is British, but has studied and travelled around the United States...you are talking out of your arse.

It appears as if you're being outright racist against English speaking nations.
Edit: To give you credit, there are some areas of the U.S. that are kind of English-y, the New England region (obviously). But don't forget the most populace ethnic background in the United States is German, Irish, African, Latino and Eastern European.


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## Walbanger (Jan 10, 2006)

Said it multible times, I'll say it again.

'78 Argentina
'82 Spain
'86 Mexico

But god forbid the World Cup going to 2 English speaking nationshno:


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## borza (Dec 11, 2007)

matthemod said:


> As a person who is British, but has studied and travelled around the United States...you are talking out of your arse.
> 
> It appears as if you're being outright racist against English speaking nations.
> Edit: To give you credit, there are some areas of the U.S. that are kind of English-y, the New England region (obviously). But don't forget the most populace ethnic background in the United States is German, Irish, African, Latino and Eastern European.


I wouldn't like Spain/Portugal either, after Brazil. Of course there is difference in cultures, but much less than between other countries. Just my point of view and we don't have to discuss. What's racist about that? Have you travelled around Russia or China as well? I assume that these countries are more different to England than USA, isn't it?


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## matthemod (Apr 8, 2008)

That's the point, you assume. You can't make sweeping generalisations about an entire countries culture based upon what language they speak. I would say American culture is as diverse and different to English culture as Russian is, we just speak the same language (kind of). Fair enough let's just agree to disagree.


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

*Spain's 2018 World Cup Stadium Plans May Struggle With Host Cities' Debts*

Spanish cities proposing to spend $1.2 billion on 2018 World Cup stadiums face trouble getting loans to finance the work, analysts said.

Malaga, Zaragoza and Santander are among public administrations that would be stymied by a central government push to cut Spain’s deficit, said Angel Laborda, chief economist at Spanish savings bank foundation Funcas.

A Spain/Portugal bid is vying with England, Russia and a Netherlands/Belgium alliance in a Dec. 2 vote by soccer ruling body FIFA. Spain and Portugal are tightening budgets to try to stem a surge in borrowing costs after Ireland’s planned 85 billion-euro ($114 billion) bailout by the European Union and International Monetary Fund.

“If building these stadiums means taking on more debt, I fear that they won’t happen,” Laborda said in an interview. “The government won’t let” the cities do so, Laborda added.

The Spain/Portugal bid is third-favorite at 7-2 with bookmaker William Hill Plc behind Russia and England at 4-5 and 13-8, respectively. The Netherlands/Belgium bid is the 50-1 outsider. A successful $1 bet on Spain/Portugal would yield $3.50 plus the original stake. Spain hosted the event in 1982 while Portugal has never done so.

The U.S., Australia, Japan, South Korea and Qatar are competing to stage the 2022 World Cup, whose host will also be announced Dec. 2 in Zurich.

Eleven Spanish cities, some backed by regional authorities, plan to help bankroll work on 21 proposed stadiums in the Iberian bid between 2011 and 2017, according to a report by Zurich-based FIFA published on Nov. 18.

Officials from Malaga, Zaragoza and Santander, slated to spend $286 million, said by telephone they don’t expect to be able to borrow for investments in 2011 under government legislation announced this year because their debt-to-revenue ratios will exceed 75 percent in the current year.

A Malaga city official said its stadium plans are on hold pending the Dec. 2 vote. Zaragoza is seeking funding for an arena and could get around the city’s ban on credit by partnering with private investors, Miguel Garcia, a town hall spokesman, said by telephone. Santander city officials didn’t reply to e-mailed questions about their plans.

The central government has pledged to cut the overall deficit to 6 percent of gross domestic product next year from 11.1 percent in 2009. It’s reducing infrastructure spending, freezing pensions next year and raising levies including a 2 percentage-point increase in value-added tax to 18 percent.

Local authorities would need to make extra cuts to meet the costs of the stadiums, said Giada Giani, an economist at Citigroup Global Markets Ltd. in London.

“The pressure on the budget will stay high” for several years, Giani said. “We don’t expect the sovereign debt situation to go away anytime soon.”

Bid chief executive Miguel Angel Lopez said the organizers would need to cut nine of the 21 proposed stadiums if it is picked as host to meet FIFA’s maximum of 12, and could drop those with funding difficulties.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-...lans-may-struggle-with-host-cities-debts.html


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

Russia 2018 & Australia 2022 for me.


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## hngcm (Sep 17, 2002)

matthemod said:


> That's the point, you assume. You can't make sweeping generalisations about an entire countries culture based upon what language they speak. I would say American culture is as diverse and different to English culture as Russian is, we just speak the same language (kind of). Fair enough let's just agree to disagree.


Seriously.

"Two countries divided by a common language."

I think British culture is strange. 

British "humour" is pretty boring to me. (The Office USA >>>> The Office UK). 

And don't get me started on those British accents! :bash:


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## Walbanger (Jan 10, 2006)

hngcm said:


> Seriously.
> 
> "Two countries divided by a common language."
> 
> ...


But they are so varied, some mustn't bother you that much.


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## Wezza (Jan 22, 2004)

hngcm said:


> Seriously.
> 
> "Two countries divided by a common language."
> 
> ...


British humour >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> American humour

Easily. :cheers:


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## 863552 (Jan 27, 2010)

Agreed, Americans can't laugh at themselves.


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## Rev Stickleback (Jun 23, 2009)

hngcm said:


> British "humour" is pretty boring to me. (The Office USA >>>> The Office UK).


The fact that someone can even think that highlights a pretty big cultural difference.

And he's from wild and crazy San Diego too.


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## WFInsider (Oct 27, 2010)

Arshavin will also be in Zurich on presentation of Russia-2018 bid.


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## Golan Trevize (Dec 3, 2005)

As expected


> South America to back Spain-Portugal 2018 World Cup bid
> 
> Spain and Portugal's 2018 World Cup hopes have received a boost after South America's Conmebol federation came out in support of the joint Iberian bid.
> 
> ...


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Yep, and bears are Catholic and the Pope shits in the woods.


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## Schmeek (Mar 28, 2007)

hngcm said:


> British "humour" is pretty boring to me. (The Office USA >>>> The Office UK).


Oh dear. Taxi for that man.


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## Ecological (Mar 19, 2009)

Putin said he would only go if he was 100% confident of a Russian win ... could Spain bribe thier way to the World Cup.

We wont get it now on the basic principle. FIFA are pissed off with our truthful press.


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## Egor (May 18, 2010)

AlekseyVT said:


> Because now the English and Spanish teams of support looks much more impressive than the Russian (politicans, sport stars, media persons). The majority in our team are unknown football officials.


 I agree!

Putin isn’t going to associate his name with defeat…

And maybe our reaction is so nervous… because our dream to host World Cup is extremely huge, and every negative news create such emotions...


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

JimB said:


> As London's successful bid for the 2012 Olympics proved, last minute campaigning can make all the difference.


Right. Tony Blair has done everything possible to help London (maybe it was only well thing that he has done for Britain). While Putin has supported the Moscow bid with help of TV-broadcast. As a result, London has won in the final round, and Moscow has lost in the first round.


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## JimB (Apr 7, 2005)

AlekseyVT said:


> Right. Tony Blair has done everything possible to help London (maybe it was only well thing that he has done for Britain). While Putin has supported the Moscow bid with help of TV-broadcast. As a result, London has won in the final round, and Moscow has lost in the first round.


I wouldn't despair just yet, if I was you.

Russia is still well in the game.


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## coth (Oct 16, 2003)

Moscow was an independent bid for 2012. It was run by Luzhkov, so wasn't supported by federal government.


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## Ecological (Mar 19, 2009)

> What would it tell us about fifa if england didnt even get passed round 1, and all this talk about legacy, italia 90 ? france 98 germany 2006 ? what legacy was left. And why is englands bid seen as being weaker than the russian bid because we can hold a world cup tommorrow ! should it not be the other way around ? and how many african fans are going to turn up and be welcome in russia ! And it wasnt so long ago that black england players were geting monkey chants from the great spanish public ! But all the efforts of new stadiums the fight aganist hooligans and kick racists out of football that england has been doing for the last 20 years , counts for nothing in the eyes of fifa


Quite true this quote. 

English football has led the way on changing the game across the world to be safer, fairer and more accessible to all. Should be rewarded in kind.


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## Mo Rush (Nov 13, 2004)

AlekseyVT said:


> Right. Tony Blair has done everything possible to help London (maybe it was only well thing that he has done for Britain). While Putin has supported the Moscow bid with help of TV-broadcast. As a result, London has won in the final round, and Moscow has lost in the first round.


No disrespect but the Moscow bid was pretty much out of the running before the vote. If you consider the chaos of the NYC bid, just before the vote, the Moscow bid, while admirable in Round 1, were far from being a favourite.

Obama showed up for Chicago and it still failed in Round 1.

It has to do with "first votes", and in a field of NYC, Paris, London etc. Moscow was always going to find it tough, compounded by the evaluation commission report.


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## AlekseyVT (Dec 21, 2009)

JimB said:


> I wouldn't despair just yet, if I was you.
> 
> Russia is still well in the game.


The problem is that our bid is based on large-scale innovative project, on the future prospects. In this case, the Head of Goverment is simply obliged to personally convince the voters in the feasibility of this project.


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## parcdesprinces (Feb 15, 2009)

Again:

Allez Belgique Allez !! Hup Holland Hup !!


:cheer: :cheer: :cheer:


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## Walbanger (Jan 10, 2006)

Ecological said:


> Quite true this quote.
> 
> English football has led the way on changing the game across the world to be safer, fairer and more accessible to all. Should be rewarded in kind.


Except in places where it was never a problem.


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## DenilsonUK (Jun 3, 2010)

Re. the Panorama show last night.

It was fairly damning and will not sit well with FIFA at all - not that it was ever going to in the first place :lol:. Obviously alot of it was following up old leads that we've known about for a few years, but this time with much stronger evidence that pretty much confirmed what has been going on.

The most damning and disgraceful for me part concerned the couple of Norwegian journalists. They had extremely strong evidence that Jack Warner had hundreds of thousands of pounds worth of tickets he had demanded and was selling on to touts - no surprise there! When they raised the issue in a press conference fronted by Blatter, he replied "_if we receive allegations of this kind through official channels, we will look at it_". Following this, the journalists then went to FIFA secretaries at the HQ and asked how to go about submitting claims through these so called "official channels". Of course, none of the secretaries had any idea what constituted an "offical channel" and nothing could be done.

It's clear they don't care about the corruption. They don't want to tackle it because they're all on the take.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

Those who keep Blatter in his job are. I get the feeling that the other half of the ExCo don't much like being tainted with this brush but keep quiet out of fear of losing their positions for speaking up. 

Scotland's John McBeth had the balls to tell the truth and he lost his job on the ExCo for doing so three years ago.


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## bestbud (Jul 31, 2008)

RobH said:


> Scotland's John McBeth had the balls to tell the truth and he lost his job on the ExCo for doing so three years ago.


I think he actually told the truth and lost his job *BEFORE* even taking up office. Such are the workings of FIFA.



> According to Mihir Bose, an expert in sports administration, Fifa president Sepp Blatter "sees Fifa as the Vatican of sport and himself as a head of state". One close observer says that the professional staff in Zurich are competent and trustworthy, "but it's the committee members that are the problem. They are treated like gods. They fly everywhere first class, stay in five-star hotels, receive $150,000 retainers just for attending meetings and $500 a day expenses. They live in another universe."
> 
> But three years ago one official broke the committee's code of silence. John McBeth, the Scottish Football Association president, was about to be made Britain's Fifa vice-president in 2007 when he suddenly announced his intention to expose corruption. McBeth called Blatter a "tricky customer" and noted: "I know two or three [at Fifa] whom I'd want to count my fingers after shaking hands with them."
> 
> Unfortunately he indelicately identified the regions prone to corruption as Africa and the Caribbean. McBeth was then accused of racism by the president of Concacaf (the football confederation that includes the Caribbean), the Fifa vice-president and Trinidad businessman and politician Jack Warner, who is alleged to have made about $1m from reselling World Cup tickets in breach of Fifa regulations. Warner was ordered to repay the money. McBeth later claimed that Warner had once asked for takings from a match between Scotland and Trinidad and Tobago to be paid to his personal account. McBeth was duly ousted, with Blatter explaining that his declarations were "discriminatory". Fifa is dedicated to anti-racism, and any form of discrimination on grounds of ethnic origin, gender, religion or nationhood is "strictly prohibited and punishable by suspension or expulsion".


Guardian


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

*Gullit, Cruijff, Pfaff, Hiddink, Van Himst, Leterme and Rutte in The HollandBelgium Bid delegation*

_Eindhoven, 26 November 2010_ – Johan Cruyff, Jean-Marie Pfaff, Guus Hiddink, Paul van Himst and both prime ministers Yves Leterme and Mark Rutte are just a few of the members of the delegation who under the direction of Ruud Gullit, President of The HollandBelgium Bid, will bolster Belgium and the Netherlands’ Bid for the 2018 FIFA World Cup™ at the Final Presentation to FIFA in Zürich on Thursday 2 December.

The HollandBelgium Bid announced this today. “We have put together a very strong team in which footballers and world renowned coaches take the lead and have the support of the highest government officials and football association directors. This is the only right formation for a FIFA World Cup™ candidate,” according to Harry Been, CEO of The Holland Belgium Bid.

The HollandBelgium Bid team will be the first country to make its 2018 FIFA World Cup™ bid presentation on Thursday 2 December at 09.00. The thirty minute presentation will be made to the members of the FIFA Executive Committee. The HollandBelgium Bid is followed by England, Spain/Portugal and Russia. A day earlier, on Wednesday 1 December, it is the turn of the five candidates for the 2022 FIFA World Cup™.

The HollandBelgium Bid delegation comprises forty people and is a mix of top footballers, coaches, government officials, football association directors and Bid partners. Apart from Gullit, Cruijff, Pfaff, Hiddink and Van Himst ex-internationals Aron Winter, Gilles de Bilde, Pierre van Hooijdonk and Christian Karembeu are also on the team, as well as national coaches Georges Leekens and Bert van Marwijk.

In addition to Prime minister Leterme, the Belgian government is represented by Vice Prime minister Didier Reynders, Minister of Sport André Antoine and the Prime minister of the French Community Rudy Demotte. Prime Minister Rutte will have Minister of Sport Edith Schippers on his side.

The HollandBelgium Bid board is also represented of course, under the direction of Co-Chairmen François de Keersmaecker (KBVB) and Michael van Praag (KNVB) and Harry Been, CEO of The HollandBelgium Bid.

The official partners of The HollandBelgium Bid are represented by their board members.

Source: Thebid.org

They seem to be very optimistic at the HollandBelgium bid. Especially when they are able to survive the first round. CEO of the HollandBelgium Bid: We are going to win. Watch, we have to celebrate something on Thursday.


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

have to agree with the Brits, I don't think Putin not going is a sign things are over.

that being said, all the Russian posters seem very firm on this view, so it may be a very Russian kind of thing going on.

for what its worth, we are hearing down here that the 2018 bid is all but done, with all delegates locked in their positions (but 2022 is more open)


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

It's second preferences which will determine it though, are they really all decided on those as well for 2018?


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## T74 (Jun 17, 2010)

RobH said:


> It's second preferences which will determine it though, are they really all decided on those as well for 2018?


no idea - as I mentioned, its just media reports.

With it being a three horse race though, all you need is your preferred and "the other guy", so it is possible


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## dacrio (Jan 30, 2009)

can you remember the order of the presentations, the time , and where we can see them?


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## MysteryMike (Sep 16, 2010)

dacrio said:


> can you remember the order of the presentations, the time , and where we can see them?


On 1 December, Australia will give their presentation at 14.00 CET, Korea Republic at 15.00, Qatar at 16.00, the USA at 17.00 and Japan at 18.00. 

On 2 December, Belgium/Netherlands will give their presentation at 09.00, Spain/Portugal at 10.00, England at 11.00 and Russia at 12.00. Each presentation will be made at the Home of FIFA in Zurich and last 30 minutes. 

These are obviously CET times and they will vary according to where you are in the world.


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## OnceBittenTwiceShy (Mar 14, 2010)

MysteryMike said:


> On 1 December, Australia will give their presentation at 14.00 CET, Korea Republic at 15.00, Qatar at 16.00, the USA at 17.00 and Japan at 18.00.


Coincidentally, the lunch break is scheduled for 16.00 so the Qatari lot will be addressing cooled thin air at the time. Empty bid. Empty space. Empty ground.


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## aCidMinD81 (Sep 11, 2002)

Ecological said:


> > What would it tell us about fifa if england didnt even get passed round 1, and all this talk about legacy, italia 90 ? france 98 germany 2006 ? what legacy was left. And why is englands bid seen as being weaker than the russian bid because we can hold a world cup tommorrow ! should it not be the other way around ? and how many african fans are going to turn up and be welcome in russia ! And it wasnt so long ago that black england players were geting monkey chants from the great spanish public ! But all the efforts of new stadiums the fight aganist hooligans and kick racists out of football that england has been doing for the last 20 years , counts for nothing in the eyes of fifa
> 
> 
> Quite true this quote.
> ...


*Violence hits Birmingham City’s Carling Cup win over Aston Villa at St Andrew's as 14 people taken to hospital*

*Violence following Birmingham City’s Carling Cup quarter-final victory over Aston Villa, which broke out when supporters invaded the St Andrew’s pitch, left 14 people - including four officers of the West Midlands Police - requiring hospital treatment last night.*

[...]Two police dogs were also injured after being struck by missiles, and as hostilities between the two sets of supporters spilled out of the stadium and into the nearby area one pub, as well as a number of parked cars close to St Andrew’s sustained considerable damage.[...]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/birmingham-city/8175525/Violence-hits-Birmingham-Citys-Carling-Cup-win-over-Aston-Villa-at-St-Andrews-as-14-people-taken-to-hospital.html


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## aCidMinD81 (Sep 11, 2002)

As you can see... this sort of things (chants, violence...) could happen anywhere or happens everywhere.

People are people wherever you go.


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## RobH (Mar 9, 2007)

It's such a rare occurence it made the news.


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## aCidMinD81 (Sep 11, 2002)

Same for chants in Spain.


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