# Above ground vs. below ground public transportation



## trainrover (May 6, 2006)

You gotta admit: There must be something not all that right with a place if you find yourself having to turf yourself just to get somewhere, no?


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## Svartmetall (Aug 5, 2007)

NihonKitty said:


> Then what do you call this scene from Tokyo I filmed* today*?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ahhh, Hachikō crossing! I loved being there and just sitting back watching people milling around. It was ALWAYS busy whenever I went there, I don't think I ever saw it quiet!


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## ukiyo (Aug 5, 2008)

Lol it was actually alot busier during the day time. It just looks nicer at night 

I love shibuya, I am sort of a gyaru (but not really) 

BTW svartmetall since you've been to Tokyo and I am sure you've been to London (another wonderful city) what is your take on city life being a myth?


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## Svartmetall (Aug 5, 2007)

NihonKitty said:


> Lol it was actually alot busier during the day time. It just looks nicer at night
> 
> I love shibuya, I am sort of a gyaru (but not really)
> 
> BTW svartmetall since you've been to Tokyo and I am sure you've been to London (another wonderful city) what is your take on city life being a myth?


Haha, I lived most of my life an hours train ride just north of London so I spent a lot of time there indeed.  I've also recently been to your home town too and again found it very busy and full of pedestrian life - heck even Kyoto was very, very busy! I also bet I saw lots of "your type" of people when I had a quick browse around places like 109 when I was there. 

I pretty much disagree with every single statement that comes from the keyboard of Suburbanist. I've never seen such mindless drivel in my entire life. I love the buzz and the vibrancy attached to being in a throng of people. When a city lacks street activity you don't see unique things like the Harajuku girls, the buskers, the street performers or indeed have a chance to just people-watch, which, when in a city, is a surprisingly fun way to pass time. Holing people up in metal boxes on a highway is the quickest way to make people selfish, insular, less community minded and, quite frankly, dull.


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## ukiyo (Aug 5, 2008)

I think suburbanist really needs to spend time in Tokyo, Osaka, Nagoya, Seoul, Singapore, London, NYC, Paris etc. If city life doesnt exist then what are these cities doing??!?!?

BTW my "type" is the sexiest and doesn't exist in the suburbs 
(before someone replies to this seriously it's a joke..)


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## earthJoker (Dec 15, 2004)

NihonKitty said:


> I think suburbanist really needs to spend time in Tokyo, Osaka, Nagoya, Seoul, Singapore, London, NYC, Paris etc. If city life doesnt exist then what are these cities doing??!?!?


Do you really think that would change his mind? He prefers a car based society, and his posts are always based on this opinion.


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## goonsta (Sep 11, 2002)

Well, the irony of that is that every suburb, or groups of suburbs in America has a mall as a meeting place, which is a bustling imitation of a city. Matter of fact, if any pattern of development is forcing you to meet somewhere in a common area, its a mall, whereas cities have crossings and plazas that grow naturally.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

goonsta said:


> Well, the irony of that is that every suburb, or groups of suburbs in America has a mall as a meeting place, which is a bustling imitation of a city. Matter of fact, if any pattern of development is forcing you to meet somewhere in a common area, its a mall, whereas cities have crossings and plazas that grow naturally.


Even if that could be the case, a mall is a far more sterile and safe environment than a curbside. You don't have random people begging you for money, if some artist is performing, it is likely that safety regulations and proper assessment of family-fitness of the performance have been assessed by the mall admin. The most annoying it can get is teens roaming around and speaking loudly. But you don't have junkies, homeless beggars, depressive people trying to squeeze money playing an instrument, and so on.

A mall is a social space, but a sort of reduced-nuisances one. If you want more edge interaction, you can go to a pub or a club. If you want leisure, you go to a resort. If you want a glimpse of glamour, you go to a green play golf. In any of these cases, you can pretty much avoid encountering, interacting and facing situations, people-types and interactions you don't want. You have more control over your own life, and you can far more easily avoid what you want to avoid than if you had all this activities concentrated in public spaces where people mix with each other just because they are crossing each other's path.

What could be more invasive of your personal space than, while going from your workplace to your girlfriend's home, having to share a cramped subway with people you don't care, maybe you don't want around, and that keep invading your personal space because of the design of mass transit, for instance?

It's the same parallel I make between the advantages of rural or quasi-rural university campuses over ones that are spread in a city without any specific and distinct identity from the jurisdiction (city) where they happen to be placed.


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## gonzo (Jul 30, 2006)

^You're more likely to encounter negative things in street scenes but you're also more like to see new and interesting things aswell.

The elements of surprise, spontaneity and variety usually appeal to most humans.

I also like experiencing the raw unfiltered nature of the street as opposed to the calculated facade of mall.

If I ever felt usafe somewhere at a certain time of day, then yes, I wouldn't enjoy it.

In short, the street can present unsavoury situations but the good outweighs the bad..that's how my brain is wired anyway.


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## ukiyo (Aug 5, 2008)

I believe you are on the wrong website. First of all what is stopping you, even in the world's largest city (Tokyo) from driving your car from your workplace to your girlfriends place? What is forcing you, even in Tokyo to walk on the street with thousands of people instead of going to a mall? Even Tokyo has malls, cars, parks etc. The entire point about city living is *options* and convenience. If you don't like cities so much then stay in the suburbs, no one is forcing you to live in a city.


Suburbanist said:


> Even if that could be the case, a mall is a far more sterile and safe environment than a curbside. You don't have random people begging you for money, if some artist is performing, it is likely that safety regulations and proper assessment of family-fitness of the performance have been assessed by the mall admin. The most annoying it can get is teens roaming around and speaking loudly. But you don't have junkies, homeless beggars, depressive people trying to squeeze money playing an instrument, and so on.
> 
> A mall is a social space, but a sort of reduced-nuisances one. If you want more edge interaction, you can go to a pub or a club. If you want leisure, you go to a resort. If you want a glimpse of glamour, you go to a green play golf. In any of these cases, you can pretty much avoid encountering, interacting and facing situations, people-types and interactions you don't want. You have more control over your own life, and you can far more easily avoid what you want to avoid than if you had all this activities concentrated in public spaces where people mix with each other just because they are crossing each other's path.
> 
> ...


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

NihonKitty said:


> If you don't like cities so much then stay in the suburbs, no one is forcing you to live in a city.


I don't like that much this dichotomy. Car-based suburbs are just the evolution of city design like electricity-based road lights are an evolution of gas-based and whale-oil based lamplighters, and just as optic fibers are an evolution of analogical copper-cable based voice transmission on landlines, just as LCDs are an evolution from cathodic-based tube television sets


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## RawLee (Jul 9, 2007)

Dinosaurs were more advanced than single-cell micro-organisms,yet its mammals that rule the planet.


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## gonzo (Jul 30, 2006)

heh..and we have the technology to create solar-powered flashlights too, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea.


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## thecarlost (Nov 6, 2005)

Suburbanist said:


> I don't like that much this dichotomy. Car-based suburbs are just the evolution of city design [...]


I see more car-based suburbs as the implantation of an economical model. Either wrong or correct, this model is just setting you a range of option for consuption, the goods/the services, on the sterile environment created for its own. The evolutionary state of a lab rat circuit but trapped in cars.

And this pattern of life is what you call, "city life".


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## Kreicherisch (Sep 13, 2010)

jefferson2 said:


> another thing is that, on many below grade trains you dont get any wireless signal
> 
> while above ground you can operate mobile devices


Well that's not always true. You can access cell phone signal while riding a subway in Bangkok, Thailand.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

^^Technology is around to set up wireless signal in tunnels of any kind/depth/length.


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