# MISC | Most efficient and economic way to travel Europe trip



## Roy_Batty (Dec 15, 2009)

Hello to everyone,
I did not find a thread to cover Q&A, sorry if I'm posting this in the incorrect place. I did look in the Thread Finder post, but didn't find anything.

We are planning vacations in December of this year to Italy, Austria, Chechia and Germany, would like to know what is the most efficient and economic way to travel through train between the following cities:

- Will be arriving at Rome, spent 4 nights there.
- Rome to Florence, 2 nights in Florence.
- Florence to Venice, 2 nights in Venice.
- Venice to Viena, 3 nights in Viena.
- Viena to Praga, 2 nights in Praga.
- Praga to Berlin, 4 nights in Berlin.
- Will take off from Berlin.

I have heard of some kind of package that offers a discount, but I honestly do not have any idea. Will appreciate very much your support, if this is not the place please tell me where I can open this question.

Thanks


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## davide84 (Jun 8, 2008)

From Rome to Florence and Venice I strongly recommend high-speed trains, with very good prices if booked in advance (like planes). You have trains every hour or even every half an hour, therefore no extra constraints on your planning.
December is when the new timetable is published, entering into force probably on Dec 15th. You can book now for beginning of December, you will be able to book in September for travels happening end of December.

Your starting point is www.trenitalia.com where you can start exploring travel times and prices right now.

From Venice to Vienna you can also travel by train with a daily direct connection, but can be a bit slow, you almost lose one day. I would consider the night train (see www.oebb.at) or a flight, e.g. with Austrian Airlines (check on Lufthansa.com).

Extra tips: try to book hotels close to metro lines (in Rome) or tram/streetcar lines (in Florence). You have a tight schedule and you don't want to lose one morning just to transfer from the hotel to the main station.
For Venice you can check out the hotels here:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/M...0ffd3403e40cf42!8m2!3d45.4934881!4d12.2463181
the address is "via Ca' Marcello". They are all newly built, 1' from Mestre train station; you save yourself the hussle of walking with luggages in Venice centre, you spend less and you are just 8' of train away from Venice with trains every 5' (plus buses, trams).


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## da_scotty (Nov 4, 2008)

Also look into Interrail (non-eu citizins name is EUrail?) cards. Especially if you are younger the savings can be great.

HS travel is not included though.


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## wbrm (Sep 9, 2008)

If you are happy with cheap advance fares with no flexibility (only valid on the specific train you book, no refunds, no changes to travel plans) separate tickets can be the cheapest option. If you want more flexibility an Interrail/EUrail pass is an option and can be the cheapest sometimes (for Interrail as EUrail is more expensive). Depending on where you live you need to buy an Interrail pass or an EUrail pass (more information on the brilliant seat61 website: https://www.seat61.com/Railpass-and-Eurail-pass-guide.htm)

*Rome > Florence > Venice
Competing operators Trenitalia and Italo both operating several trains each day (on loco2.com you get both in one search). 

Only Trenitalia accepts Interrail/EUrail passes and on the high speed trains (Frecciarossa/Frecciargento/Frecciabianca) reservation is compulsory (passholders pay 10€/seat). 

*Venice > Vienna
ÖBB (Austrian Railways) Railjet twice daily + ÖBB Nightjet nighttrain
oebb.at

Reservation is compulsory for passholders

*Vienna > Prague
Competing operators ÖBB/CD and Regiojet both operating several daytime trains each day.
Railjet operated by ÖBB and CD (Czech Railways) book via cd.cz
Regiojet (don't confuse these :nuts:, Regiojets are yellow) regiojet.com

For passholders reservation is optional on Railjet (you can sit on an empty seat or pay 3€/seat if you want to be sure to have one). For Regiojet reservation is compulsory.

Prague > Berlin
Several Eurocity's (EC) each day operated by CD and DB (German Railways)
book via cd.cz

Reservation for passholders is optional (just like the Railjet Vienna > Prague).


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## Roy_Batty (Dec 15, 2009)

Thanks for the reply, I have make some flights and hotel bookings, only missing trains. I plan to buy a 5 day EUrail ticket for two adults (28+), total cost 562 EUR, considering the following:

1) Wednesday December 18th train travel from Rome to Florence. I would use EUrail through Treinitalia.

* Friday December 20th train travel from Florence to Pisa and back to Florence. I would buy individual tickets and not use EUrail for this trip.

2) Saturday December 21st train travel from Florence to Venice. I would use EUrail through Trenitalia.

3) Sunday December 22nd train travel from Venice to Viena. This is the tricky one I guess, I want to take the night train in order to sleep in the train and not lose an entire day. Does ÖBB Nightjet accepts EUrail? Does ÖBB Nightjet operates Sunday?

4) Thursday December 26th train travel from Viena to Prague. I would use EUrail through either ÖBB or CD, I guess both operators accept EUrail?

5) Saturday December 28th train travel from Prague to Berlin. I would use EUrail through DB.


Appreciate your support and comments!


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## wbrm (Sep 9, 2008)

Roy_Batty said:


> 3) Sunday December 22nd train travel from Venice to Viena. This is the tricky one I guess, I want to take the night train in order to sleep in the train and not lose an entire day. Does ÖBB Nightjet accepts EUrail? Does ÖBB Nightjet operates Sunday?


This ÖBB Nightjet runs every day (maybe not during exceptional engineering work on the tracks). ÖBB accept EUrail. For Nightjets reservations are compulsory. More information here on the reservation procedure and prices for Nightjets: https://www.nightjet.com/en/angebote/interrail-eurail-paesse.html 



Roy_Batty said:


> 4) Thursday December 26th train travel from Viena to Prague. I would use EUrail through either ÖBB or CD, I guess both operators accept EUrail?


Yes both accept EUrail. If you want an optional reservation you can book via either operator's website. The price will be 3€/seat anyway but CD will charge in Czech koruna, ÖBB in euros.



Roy_Batty said:


> 5) Saturday December 28th train travel from Prague to Berlin. I would use EUrail through DB.


If you want an optional seat reservation I advise to book via CD (3€/seat) as a reservation with DB costs 4,5€/journey. For the journey from Prague to Berlin you would normally use only 1 train therefore you would only book 1 seat. This makes CD cheaper than the DB system for exactly the same seat on exactly the same train for this journey.


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## Sixhaven (Jan 20, 2016)

da_scotty said:


> Also look into Interrail (non-eu citizins name is EUrail?) cards. Especially if you are younger the savings can be great.
> 
> *HS travel is not included though.*


It is though!


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## Sixhaven (Jan 20, 2016)

Roy_Batty said:


> Thanks for the reply, I have make some flights and hotel bookings, only missing trains. I plan to buy a 5 day EUrail ticket for two adults (28+), total cost 562 EUR, considering the following:
> 
> 1) Wednesday December 18th train travel from Rome to Florence. I would use EUrail through Treinitalia.
> 
> ...


Sounds good, but often it's actually cheaper to buy all the tickets individually for saver fares, rather than travel with Eurail. Eurail is the more convenient option though, as you don't have to buy individual tickets and are not bound to a certain train.

You can book both Vienna to Prague on 26 December and Prague to Berlin on 28 December on cd.cz for 368 CZK (= 15 EUR), I wouldn't waste my Eurail on either of those trips.


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## Roy_Batty (Dec 15, 2009)

Thanks for the quick reply!

Nice to know EUrail could do the job for all Treintialia, ÖBB (including Nightjet), CD and DB, yet it seems the most economic option would be buying tickets directly from the operators.

Is there any advantage in using EUrail? You mentioned flexibility, though I do not get it completely. In any case I have to do reservations.


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## Stuu (Feb 7, 2007)

Roy_Batty said:


> Thanks for the quick reply!
> 
> Nice to know EUrail could do the job for all Treintialia, ÖBB (including Nightjet), CD and DB, yet it seems the most economic option would be buying tickets directly from the operators.
> 
> Is there any advantage in using EUrail? You mentioned flexibility, though I do not get it completely. In any case I have to do reservations.


I don't see any advantage in EUrail, especially if you know now the dates you will be travelling. Those dates will be very busy so you will need reservations, so it would make more sense to book those as soon as you can. The advance tickets should go on sale in a week or two, it's usually 12 weeks ahead. Right now advance tickets for Rome-Florence are €20 or so each with italo, and Florence-Venice is the same. 

I haven't looked at the other sectors but I would be surprised if there is any advantage to the EUrail ticket when you know the dates and the trains will be very busy


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## kokomo (Sep 29, 2009)

Hi!

I made my first backpacker trip to Europe more than 20 years ago, when Schengen was just starting and in almost three months I squeezed the juice out of my unlimited YouthPass. In those days you did not have Apps nor Internet on your phone to check timetables and availability and you relied on getting to the train station and hopping on (or, if it was a highly demanded line making a booking before). With that scheme I traveled from Madrid to Helsinki and then to Athens. It was the trip of my life

However, several years later (now with family) I decided to do something similar and bought a Saver Pass and I ended up paying a lot more because High Speed Services required a compulsory reservation and after the trip I found out that these extra costs made a loss vs buying individual tickets. Yes, you lose flexibility but you save money. 

So now, every time I go to Europe (last trip was in July) I buy in advance long distance legs of my journey (which allow me to get fares as low as €19 Rome-Florence) and the rest I buy them while there. 

Therefore, my suggestion is TODAY rail passes are not that useful as they were before


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## vitacit (Feb 8, 2008)

once you will be in vienna for those days, you can spare one day on the visit of bratislava, capital of slovak republic. they are just 65 kms apart and there are two trains every hour (take one heading to bratislava hlst - main railways station. no the one to bratislava - petrzalka). there are very nice christmas market in december in bratislava, our capital has some nice small and compact center. yes, vienna is great, full of history etc etc but bratislava is sort of like smaller vienna (similar architecture, culture, food) but with the charm of the small town next to its bigger danube sibling))) and xmas market is (in my opinion) more familiar and with the better spirit than those ones in vienna oriented mostly on tourist.


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## eu01 (Oct 14, 2005)

kokomo said:


> Therefore, my suggestion is TODAY rail passes are not that useful as they were before


True. Nowadays it pays to have a good knowledge of local offers in countries you intend to visit, including international tickets offered by their railways and sold in advance on internet. Try to combine a few of them, don't hesitate to reserve seats where appropriate, you will most probably end up spending less.


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## Baron Hirsch (Jan 31, 2009)

Funny. While I never did Interrail in the age when one is expected to use it, first hitchhiking and later buying cheap local tickets while traveling mainly through Eastern Europe, I have recently begun using Interrail.
There where several reasons: 
with the Romanian state railways dropping out of the BalkanFlexipass, this dirt cheap way of traveling through Southeast Europe was no longer an option, as you no longer have the one reliable transit country between Central Europe and SEE. 
More and more countries are dropping out of the Europewide reservation system, so booking for Bulgaria or Greece from a foreign train station is no longer possible, while international trains in the region are as a rule not bookable online either.
By comparison, Interrail is much more flexible now, offering different number of traveling days, regional and country passes.
Most important though, while separately booked tickets are fine if you take only direct trains, They become a problem when you have to change. Should your connection not work out, you will most often get shrugs from the rail staff concerned and be forced to buy a completely new ticket, which you will possibly be reimbursed for if complaining to higher regulatory agencies. With an Interrail ticket, the maximum you could lose is your reservation fee. 
I see Interrail as an important correcting factor to beat the rigidity of the international rail booking options nowadays. 
However, all these are beside the point for the enquiry here. Prebooked separate tickets seem to be the best solutions in this case.


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## Roy_Batty (Dec 15, 2009)

I tried to make reservations for trenitalia, but it seems second half of December is still not available. Does anyone know when I can make reservations for treinitalia or italotreno?


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## davide84 (Jun 8, 2008)

The middle Sunday of December is the European day for enforcing new timetables. Trenitalia and the infrastructure operator RFI usually finalize the new timetable in Fall, then the trains are loaded into the system and published, usually in batches and the process takes a few days.
Your trains could appear anytime between now and November, while regional trains usually appear in December.
Italotreno is not Trenitalia but still they must wait for the track operator to close the negotiations, so expect similar waiting times.

As far as I know there is no way to subscribe to get notifications, so your best chance is monitor their website. Sorry, it's a PITA for everybody including locals... and it's so 1800... :-(

PS: assuming you can get prompt notification, that would be a good change to find some good offer, but be aware that discount tickets are not refundable and bound to a specific train, so you must really trust your planning!


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