# NEW YORK | 250 Water Street | 99m | 324ft | 25 fl | Pro



## Hudson11 (Jun 23, 2011)

SOM’s shorter 250 Water Street tower approved for the South Street Seaport


Earlier today, SOM’s considerably scaled-back mixed-use tower proposed for 250 Water Street won the approval of New York’s Landmark Preservation Commission




www.archpaper.com







> The further revised design presented this morning to the LPC by Scherl and Chris Cooper, design partner at SOM, dropped the total building height by 21 feet to 324 feet while shedding an additional 10,00 square feet.




















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I think it's unlikely this will remain a supertall, if it is even built at all. Nevertheless, we have another legitimate supertall proposal for downtown. 

*Another Tower Plan for the Seaport: 'There's Going to Be Fierce Opposition'*





















> Hughes executives and architects from Skidmore, Owings & Merrill revealed their options for a soaring project at 250 Water Street, buildings that would many times exceed zoning limits in the South Street Seaport Historic District.
> 
> [...]
> 
> ...


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## LivinAWestLife (Aug 24, 2019)

This looks nice, hope it will be built. Also downzoning should NEVER be a thing (in fact it would be better if zoning was as minimal as possible).


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## Eric Offereins (Jan 1, 2004)

^^ I agree. A supertall here doesn't look bad.


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## FelixMadero (Aug 29, 2005)

Nimby's already in position of attack!


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## Hudson11 (Jun 23, 2011)

amateur renderings

990'


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http://instagr.am/p/B-HuR17p9ZM/

880'


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http://instagr.am/p/B9-Wy-QItxU/

Two Tower + 570'


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http://instagr.am/p/B-KKgJ5CCuJ/


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## germantower (May 23, 2006)

The 990 feet version looks like Trump Tower on 5th avenue and the 880 feet version like a mini 270 Park Avenue. Are these renderings to be taken seriously?


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## Hudson11 (Jun 23, 2011)

germantower said:


> The 990 feet version looks like Trump Tower on 5th avenue and the 880 feet version like a mini 270 Park Avenue. Are these renderings to be taken seriously?


these are schemes drawn up by SOM, so yes. Just pay no attention to the facade, that can be inaccurate as these are not official renderings.


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## Hudson11 (Jun 23, 2011)

Renderings Revealed for SOM's Supertall 250 Water Street, in South Street Seaport District - New York YIMBY


Renderings from SOM reveal 250 Water Street, a proposed supertall skyscraper developed by the Howard Hughes Corp. in the South Street Seaport District.



newyorkyimby.com


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## Jay (Oct 7, 2004)

> There has been much speculation about whether the full-block development could reach supertall status with the transfer of 700,000 square feet in air rights, which would make it the tallest structure in Lower Manhattan, after One and Three World Trade Center, with diagrams indicating a *total height just shy of 1,052 feet*


Height bump too 

Title update?


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## Hudson11 (Jun 23, 2011)

Good. The higher they propose it, the taller it will be when friends of the seaport, Margaret Chin, Gale Brewer et al inevitably suggest it be shortened. If it happens at all, that is.


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## MarshallKnight (Feb 24, 2013)

Hudson11 said:


> Renderings Revealed for SOM's Supertall 250 Water Street, in South Street Seaport District - New York YIMBY
> 
> 
> Renderings from SOM reveal 250 Water Street, a proposed supertall skyscraper developed by the Howard Hughes Corp. in the South Street Seaport District.
> ...


Wow, that is really striking. I assumed the brick would be featured heavily at the base as a way to integrate with the Seaport, but I didn't picture brick cladding all the way to the top. It will certainly stand out, but I appreciate the way it becomes less obtrusive as it rises -- the red becomes more muted; the balconies morph from full, to juliet, to nonexistent; and the crown tapers away elegantly -- so the overall effect isn't one giant crimson shaft.

Any idea if the crown tapers on both sides, or just the side facing the water?



Hudson11 said:


> Good. The higher they propose it, the taller it will be when friends of the seaport, Margaret Chin, Gale Brewer et al inevitably suggest it be shortened. If it happens at all, that is.


This project has been contentious from day one, so we should anticipate a battle. But this version seems really contextual at the base, especially compared to the other massings that were being considered, no? And the tower itself is set as far back as can be, and it's to the North so it's not going to cast shadows over the Seaport. SOM clearly took this challenge seriously. I guess the locals could try to argue that adding another 500-700 units will overcrowd the neighborhood -- laughable, given the proximity to eight subway lines and the East River Ferry, and arguably immoral, given the need for more housing -- but they won't have a leg to stand on if they claim this design adversely affects the physical character of the area.


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## phoenixboi08 (Dec 6, 2009)

MarshallKnight said:


> ....but I didn't picture brick cladding all the way to the top.


Ah, it is? I was confused and wondering if that was the CLT they're allegedly using (not sure if that's just a part of SOM's vision for the project or a intentional decision on the part of the developer)?


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## MarshallKnight (Feb 24, 2013)

The YIMBY article has been updated with these statements from Hughes and SOM:



> Statement from a Howard Hughes spokesperson:
> 
> “These renderings pulled from internal conceptual studies were leaked by a former SOM employee, *are outdated and do not depict designs under consideration* for 250 Water Street. As we recently outlined during our community stakeholder planning process, we are considering several configurations for a mixed-income project at 250 Water Street, and* no designs have been finalized*. As part of this transparent workshop process, we showed a range of several massing scenarios including a single point tower that would use all available air rights within the Seaport district. We continue to work with local elected officials and stakeholders as we explore configurations for this potential project and craft a comprehensive planning framework for the broader Seaport area.”
> 
> ...


So this may well not be the design they have in mind (alternatively, they could be covering their asses to avoid a backlash before they're prepared to deal with it.)


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## KillerZavatar (Jun 22, 2010)

> we showed a range of several massing scenarios including a single point tower that would use all available air rights within the Seaport district.


I feel like this is the most important sentence, as this points out that this tower is basically the best case scenario, more likely than not the air rights will be distributed more and we end up with 2 or 3 or a bunch of smaller towers. I doubt we will see anything over 250m in the end.


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## Troopchina (Oct 7, 2005)

I'd be fine with the taller one around 200 meters, fits better in the skyline and doesn't obstruct the 1WTC. 
Anyhow, I just hope it gets built in any form.


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## SMCYB (Sep 7, 2013)

I'm all for it. I'm just sayin'... Miami.













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## Eric Offereins (Jan 1, 2004)

indeed, but I would prefer the New York version because of its colour and and the facade.


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## Hudson11 (Jun 23, 2011)

this seemed obvious from the get-go. I have no doubt it will continue to shrink and possibly cease to exist in the face of local NIMBY opposition.









Texas builder pitches $1.4B development near South Street Seaport


The Howard Hughes Corp. is proposing a $1.4 billion development in the South Street Seaport District, the latest attempt to transform a lot that has been mired in controversy for decades. The Texas-based real estate developer, whose chairman is hedge fund manager Bill Ackman, wants to turn a…




www.crainsnewyork.com







> The Texas-based real estate developer, whose chairman is hedge fund manager Bill Ackman, wants to turn a parking lot at 250 Water Street into two 470-foot towers with a mix of affordable rentals, offices and condo units, according to a statement Thursday.
> [...]
> Numerous plans for the Water Street lot have failed over the years, long before it was purchased by Howard Hughes. The current zoning allows for a roughly 12-story tower. The larger proposed buildings, at about 38 stories, require city approval.
> To sweeten the deal, the company will enhance public spaces in the area and is offering to invest $50 million into the South Street Seaport Museum, which has taken a hit during the pandemic.
> The project includes more than 100 affordable rentals, part of a city requirement to get approval for the proposed zoning change.


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## Jay (Oct 7, 2004)

What absolute morons. It's not even a skyscraper anymore. 

I suppose it's better than an empty lot though. I really hope it doesn't continue to shrink considering 470' is okay for the neighborhood.


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## hkskyline (Sep 13, 2002)

* Developer’s $1.4 Billion Plan for Towers in New York’s Historic Seaport District Sparks Controversy *
Wall Street Journal _Excerpt_
Dec 30, 2020

The South Street Seaport, one of New York City’s oldest neighborhoods, is no stranger to fights over protecting its historic buildings. And one of its longstanding preservation battlegrounds is a parking lot.

Over the past decades, several developments have been proposed for the block-long lot, which sits at the edge of the historic district in lower Manhattan. But many have been scuttled over the height and style of the proposed buildings.

The Howard Hughes Corp., a Texas-based developer, is now pitching a proposal for the lot at 250 Water St. that includes neighborhood incentives to sweeten the deal. Its project calls for a $1.4 billion mixed-use development featuring two 470-foot towers, even though the height is 350 feet taller than what the district’s zoning allows.

Saul Scherl, president of the New York tri-state region for Howard Hughes, said the proposal also includes community space and $50 million to help endow the South Street Seaport Museum. The museum, which many consider the anchor of the district, has long struggled financially. Mr. Scherl said the money is contingent on the development earning the required city approvals to move forward.

More : Developer’s $1.4 Billion Plan for Towers in New York’s Historic Seaport District Sparks Controversy


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