# DENVER | LRT



## hkskyline (Sep 13, 2002)

*Transit Strike in Denver Strands Thousands *
By KIM NGUYEN 
3 April 2006

DENVER (AP) - Thousands of commuters scrambled to find rides to work Monday after transportation workers in the Denver area went on strike for the first time in 24 years, shutting down rail service and more than half the region's bus routes. 

Striking Regional Transportation District workers were on the picket lines early Monday, some holding signs that read: "RTD put us on the street, but we'd rather be serving you." 

"Our members have been working seven days a week without a day off and have worked for three years without a wage increase," said Amalgamated Transit Union Local 1001 President Yvette Salazar. "We want to apologize to our riders, but the workers are extremely tired. This is the last straw." 

In Boulder, the University of Colorado made preparations for the estimated 10,000 students, faculty and staff who use the transit system, urging them to carpool and walk or bike to campus. 

The shutdown was also expected to cause headaches for fans headed to Coors Field for the Colorado Rockies' opening game. 

Overall, the system averages about 275,000 rides per weekday. 

Union leadership had recommended approval of RTD's latest labor proposal, but 55 percent of workers rejected the offer, which included a wage hike of $1.80 an hour over three years, with 15-cent raises in hourly pay every quarter. No new talks were immediately scheduled. 

"It's very disappointing," said transit spokesman Scott Reed. "We had the largest wage rate increase offer in RTD's history on the table, and we agreed to do exactly what the union requested, which was split possible future health care cost increases." 

RTD officials said they would keep 45 percent of the system's bus routes opearting, but rail service, regional service and transit centers would be shut down. 

Carol Erven-Robinson, 25, said she would have to find another mode of transportation from a halfway house where she is staying to a downtown restaurant where she works. 

"There are 160 women here and all of us rely on the bus system to get to work, to get to appointments, to get anywhere," Erven-Robinson said. "We're all trying to figure out how do we get to work." 

Fifty-five percent of the 1,750 Amalgamated Transit Union Local 1001 members voted Sunday to reject the Regional Transportation District's latest contract offer, union officials said. 

"I kind of felt like this was going to happen. I feel kind of numb," said bus operator Deb Sena. "But do they want the best people for the job? Or do they just want any person off the street?"


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## hkskyline (Sep 13, 2002)

*Denver transit workers vote on strike-ending contract offer *
7 April 2006

DENVER (AP) - Train operators and mechanics were voting on a proposed contract Friday as their five-day-old strike left tens of thousands of commuters in the Denver area without their usual transportation. 

Terms of the contract offer have been closely guarded by Regional Transportation District officials and the leadership of Amalgamated Transit Union Local 1001, which represents 1,750 RTD workers. 

The agreement was reached Wednesday during a meeting with a federal mediator. 

Cal Marsella, general manager of the transit agency, told the Rocky Mountain News the proposed contract does not exceed $15.3 million -- the amount the agency was willing to spend in its last offer, which union members rejected. 

The walkout is the first transit strike in metropolitan Denver in 24 years. The transit agency averages about 275,000 rides per day on bus and light rail routes in the area. 

------ 

On the Net: 

Regional Transportation District: http://www.rtd-denver.com 

Amalgamated Transit Union Local 1001: http://www.atu1001.org 

American Public Transportation Association: http://www.apta.com


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## hkskyline (Sep 13, 2002)

*Strike over, transit workers get buses, trains ready to go Monday *
By DAN ELLIOTT 
8 April 2006

DENVER (AP) - Mechanic Todd Platten is glad he's going back to work to get Denver's buses up and running after a weeklong strike, even though a new labor agreement that won final approval on Saturday is less than he hoped for. 

All the Regional Transportation District's bus routes and train lines were expected to be operating during the Monday morning rush after the RTD board unanimously approved the deal. 

The union representing 1,750 mechanics, drivers and train operators had accepted it by an 82 percent majority the day before. 

"I guess I still feel that the contract isn't the greatest, but we can live with it," Platten said. 

Although the latest deal was worth the same as previous offers -- $15.3 million -- it was restructured so that workers will get more of it in the first part of the three-year contract, the union and transit agency said. 

The Amalgamated Transit Union Local 1001 walked out Monday over wages and benefits, forcing thousands of commuters to find other ways to get to work. More than half of RTD's bus routes and all its light rail trains were idled. 

Under state law, about 45 percent of RTD's regular routes are operated by private contractors, and they kept running during the strike. 

The law requires RTD to award half its bus routes to private companies. About 10 percent of the contracted routes are dedicated to special services such as those for the disabled; the rest are regular routes. 

The revised contract was drawn up Wednesday with the help of federal mediators. It includes a wage increase of $1.80 an hour over three years, starting with a 50-cent-an-hour raise retroactive to March 1. 

The remainder will come in smaller increments every quarter through December 1, 2008. 

The deal also calls for RTD to increase its contribution to health insurance by $20 a month retroactive to April 1 and pay more into a health-and-welfare trust fund. 

Union members were angry that some RTD executives got raises of 38 percent to 48 percent while their pay was frozen under the previous contract. 

"We went three years with a freeze, and during that freeze gas went up, my health (costs) went up, groceries went up," Platten said. "Actually it was a loss." 

RTD runs bus and light-rail systems in Denver and all or parts of seven surrounding counties, a service area with about 2.5 million residents. It averages about 275,000 rides per weekday. 


On the Net: 
Regional Transportation District: http://www.rtd-denver.com 
Amalgamated Transit Union Local 1001: http://www.atu1001.org


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## UrbanSky (Sep 29, 2005)

*Denver Loves Light Rail*

Denver's FasTracks makes gains in popularity
By Kevin Flynn, Rocky Mountain News 
December 4, 2007

A poll commissioned by RTD on its $6.1 billion, 12-year rapid transit expansion program, buffeted by an unprecedented hike in construction costs in three years, has more people approving of it now than favored it at the polls three years ago.

FasTracks won support from 79 percent of the people who answered yes to the following question: "Regardless of how you voted in 2004, do you believe approval of FasTracks was a good decision or a bad decision?"

Only 9 percent said no.

FasTracks' 0.4-percentage point increase in the metro sales tax passed in November 2004 by a 58 percent to 42 percent vote.

More people approve of the RTD program and the agency's handling of it even after a year filled with budget increases and a financing gap that RTD still isn't completely sure it has covered.

The poll is based on 771 interviews within the eight-county RTD region. The sample was balanced by each county for population, gender and party affiliation. It was done by the Kenney Group, which did polling in the FasTracks campaign, and reports a margin of error of 3.53 percent.

The poll was done Oct. 30 through Nov. 4.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

The following are some photos taken in downtown Denver last summer:


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## UrbanSky (Sep 29, 2005)

Cool shots, thanks!


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## ADCS (Oct 30, 2006)

Heck, with that kind of support, it might be worthwhile for Denver to see if it can get any heavy rail options, be it commuter rail to the Front Range as far north as Ft. Collins, or even a full subway system in the city. I'm sure there would be no problem getting federal funding, and it would be interesting to see what would happen.


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## BoulderGrad (Jun 29, 2005)

Thought I should post this. This is the map of all the Fastracks projects that were approved in '04 (which I'm proud to say I voted for


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## milwaukee-københavn (Jun 21, 2006)

Fast Tracks is a really ambitious plan, its great that it passed. When all of this is finished, Denver will have one of the larger rail systems in the United States, all of it built in the span of about 20 years or so.


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## xote (Jun 7, 2007)

Those are some fugly cars though.


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## phattonez (Sep 14, 2006)

Are those southern routes in the median of freeways?


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## UrbanSky (Sep 29, 2005)

the southern route runs along the west side of Interstate-25. A spur runs for several miles in the median of Interstate-225 (this route is being extended). Further additions to the system will run along surface streets in neighborhoods..and along freeways. An amazing amount of TOD is currently taking place throughout Denver.


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## Tcmetro (Jun 9, 2007)

When will the construction start/end?


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## Electrify (Mar 19, 2007)

I thought Denver's LRT didn't run with mixed traffic?


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## UrbanSky (Sep 29, 2005)

It does currently run with mixed traffic through downtown and the Curtis Park neighborhood. It will also run through mixed traffic in part of the west suburbs expansion.

The southwest and downtown lines have been up and running for several years. The southeast line was completed a year ago...the west line is being prepped for work to begin in '08. Subsequent lines are also being prepped, however startup will likely begin in '10 for the northern route..and other routes are to follow. I'm hearing 2016 as the completion date for the entire system.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

I've read through the FasTracks website < http://www.rtd-denver.com/ > and the news reports to try to gain an understanding of what is being built. I have seen a December 2004 document that described the projects as follows:

- Central Corridor: 0.8-mile light rail extension from the northeastern end of the existing light rail system.

- East Corridor: 23.6-mile rail line connecting downtown to Denver International Airport. The preferred mode is commuter rail using Diesel Multiple Units (DMUs).

- Gold Line Corridor: 11.2-mile light rail line heading north then west from downtown.

- I-225 Corridor: 10.5-mile light rail line mostly in the median of I-225.

- North Corridor: 18-mile rail line due north from downtown. The preferred mode is commuter rail using Diesel Multiple Units (DMUs).

- Northwest Corridor: 38.1-mile rail line extending from Denver to Longmont via Boulder. The preferred mode is commuter rail using Diesel Multiple Units (DMUs).

- Southeast Corridor: 2.3-mile light rail extension to Lone Tree from the existing light rail terminus at Lincoln.

- Southwest Corridor: 2.5-mile light rail extension to Lucent Blvd. in Highlands Ranch from the existing light rail terminus at Mineral Avenue in Littleton.

- US-36 Corridor: 18-mile bus rapid transit corridor from downtown to Boulder.

- West Corridor: 12.1-mile light rail line from downtown to Auraria Campus.

The totals by mode are:
Light Rail: 39.4 miles
Commuter Rail: 79.7 miles
Bus Rapid Transit: 18 miles

More recent information that I have seen during the past year describes the projects as follows:

- Central Corridor: 0.8-mile light rail extension from the northeastern end of the existing light rail system.

- East Corridor: 23.6-mile rail line connecting downtown to Denver International Airport. The preferred mode is commuter rail using Electric Multiple Units (EMUs).

- Gold Line Corridor: 11.2-mile rail line heading north then west from downtown. The preferred mode is commuter rail using Electric Multiple Units (EMUs).

- I-225 Corridor: 10.5-mile light rail line mostly in the median of I-225.

- North Corridor: 18-mile rail line due north from downtown. The preferred mode is commuter rail using Diesel Multiple Units (DMUs).

- Northwest Corridor: 38.1-mile rail line extending from Denver to Longmont via Boulder. The preferred mode is commuter rail using Diesel Multiple Units (DMUs).

- Southeast Corridor: 2.3-mile light rail extension to Lone Tree from the existing light rail terminus at Lincoln.

- Southwest Corridor: 2.5-mile light rail extension to Lucent Blvd. in Highlands Ranch from the existing light rail terminus at Mineral Avenue in Littleton.

- US-36 Corridor: 18-mile bus rapid transit corridor from downtown to Boulder.

- West Corridor: 12.1-mile light rail line from downtown to Auraria Campus. A single-track configuration has been proposed to save costs.

The totals by mode are:
Light Rail: 28.2 miles (Total includes 12.1 miles single-track.)
Commuter Rail: 90.9 miles (Total includes 34.8 miles electrified.)
Bus Rapid Transit: 18 miles

The major change is the switch of the Gold Line from light rail to commuter rail and the use of EMUs instead of DMUs on some of the commuter rail lines.

The following is a link to a website describing the various projects:
http://www.rtd-fastracks.com/main_1


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## BoulderGrad (Jun 29, 2005)

What is the timeline for these projects?


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

^^ There is a timeline on the FasTracks website < http://www.rtd-fastracks.com/main_31 >:










A table below the timeline states the following completion dates:

2012
Union Station
West Corridor Light Rail

2014
US 36 Corridor Rail
East Corridor Rail
Central Corridor Light Rail Extension

2015
North Metro Corridor Rail
I-225 Corridor Rail
Gold Line Rail

2016
Southwest Corridor Light Rail Extension
US 36 Corridor Bus Rapid Transit
Southeast Corridor Light Rail Extension

Elsewhere on the website, it states that the first corridor to be completed will be the West Corridor light rail line in 2013, so the schedules may already have slipped a bit.


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## ssiguy2 (Feb 19, 2005)

Looks like things are going great for Denver BUT that pic of the LRT entrance had stairs on it.
Please don't tell me that the trains aren't wheelchair accessible.


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## BoulderGrad (Jun 29, 2005)

ssiguy2 said:


> Looks like things are going great for Denver BUT that pic of the LRT entrance had stairs on it.
> Please don't tell me that the trains aren't wheelchair accessible.


They have platforms that fold down over top of the stairs, and wheelchair bound passengers board from a taller platform.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

^^ Each station has a ramp for wheelchair passengers similar to the one in the following photo:


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## Jayayess1190 (Feb 6, 2005)

Nice system! Lucky to have a transit system that expands services rather than take services away.


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## renanfsouza (Feb 28, 2007)

Very nice system !

I really would like to see some light rails on Rio downtown.


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## Nexis (Aug 7, 2007)

*DENVER | Public Transport*

*Current Light Rail Map
*









*Current Facts

System size: 39mi
Usage >
Light Rail : 63,100
Bus : 212,100
Stations : 36*


*2025 Map
*










*Planned Union Station Expansion
*


















*2020 Projections
*
*System size >
Light Rail : 77mi
Commuter Rail : 82mi
BRT : 18mi*

*Usage >
Light Rail : 142,000
Commuter Rail : 58,000
BRT & Bus : 300,800
*
*Stations

Light Rail : 56
Commuter Rail : 21
BRT : 7*


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## Professor L Gee (Aug 10, 2009)

I never understood why agencies would decide to build BRT as an extension of an existing LRT line, but whatever.

Nexis, do you think you can do Chicago next? There hasn't been a thread for their system that has stuck, which I think is a shame.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

West Line Corridor under construction









RTD simulation showing what the East Corridor electric powered commuter train would look like near DIA.


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## JustinB (Aug 12, 2008)

Nice thread!

Electric Commuter Rail to the Airport. Here in Toronto, we are building a freaking *diesel* commuter line usind refurbished RDC's. What a joke.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Rendering of Union Station









Littleton-Mineral









F Train at University of Denver









H Train in median of I-225 departing Dayton









Orchard Station


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Denver International Airport Terminal Expansion Rendering with Train Station underneath.


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## IrishMan2010 (Aug 16, 2010)

The union station expansion look very impressive, the trams remind me of Calgary's C-Trains.


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## goldbough (Jun 19, 2007)

I hope the airport link is the first part to be completed so you can get downtown.


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## FDW (Mar 9, 2010)

IrishMan2010 said:


> The union station expansion look very impressive, the trams remind me of Calgary's C-Trains.


Yeah, right on the nail there. Denver's LRV fleet consists of Siemens SD-100 and SD 160 LRV's (Identical body, different types of motor.), while Calgary also operates the SD-160 as well.


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## TheKorean (Apr 11, 2010)

How realistic is the CR plan? The Union Station renovation? I dont see it as being too likely.


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## Nexis (Aug 7, 2007)

TheKorean said:


> How realistic is the CR plan? The Union Station renovation? I dont see it as being too likely.


Union Station is UC and the East and North CR are too , along with 2 LRT corridors.


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## FDW (Mar 9, 2010)

TheKorean said:


> How realistic is the CR plan? The Union Station renovation? I dont see it as being too likely.


It's already (partly) funded, with certain parts of the plan (West LRT) already under construction.


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## BoulderGrad (Jun 29, 2005)

diablo234 said:


> RTD simulation showing what the East Corridor electric powered commuter train would look like near DIA.


Have they settled on rail stock yet? Would be awesome if they could use something resembling the Hong Kong Railway's trainsets:


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## TheKorean (Apr 11, 2010)

Are they seriously trying to build a CR thats electrified? Awesome. hopefully Amtrak can take advantage of that somehow, maybe high speed rail between Denver..and somewhere?


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

TheKorean said:


> Are they seriously trying to build a CR thats electrified? Awesome. hopefully Amtrak can take advantage of that somehow, maybe high speed rail between Denver..and somewhere?


According to RTD's website they have indicated that the commuter rail is to be going to be electrified.

As for high speed rail well given Denver's location (with Salt Lake City being 533 miles away) inner city high speed rail does not seem to be a realistic possibility due to Denver's isolation.



TheKorean said:


> How realistic is the CR plan? The Union Station renovation? I dont see it as being too likely.


Like FDW already said FasTracks is already funded with voter support with federal appropriations, private contributions, and a region-wide sales tax increase that went into place in 2005. That being said they did go over budget so the entire completion of the project may be delayed and full buildout may not take place until 2042 unless voters increase the current sales tax.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Southmoor (E/F/H)









Convention Center/Performing Arts (D/F/H) 









Englewood (C/D)









Louisiana/Pearl (E/F/H) 









University of Denver (E/F/H)









Orchard (E/F/G) 

Photos courtesy of http://world.nycsubway.org/perl/show?91165


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)




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## desertpunk (Oct 12, 2009)

*DenverUrbanism*



> Light Rail Closures
> 
> Posted by Ryan Mulligan on July 19, 2011
> 
> ...


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## Benn (Jan 10, 2007)

LtBk said:


> Could it be the FRA regulations that prohibit RTD from buying seeker looking trains like those in Europe and East Asia?


Maybe no one is currently making a model that would meet some FRA bs regulation, but on a large order for new vehicles doing a sleeker nose would not have made much difference in price, but would have made all the difference in the world in terms of appearance. At least they look a little better than the new EMUs in Philly, even if its still worlds behind Europe, Asia and most of the LRVs in this country.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

*Some progress on the West Line:*


















































































Photos courtesy of RTD.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)




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## desertpunk (Oct 12, 2009)




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## desertpunk (Oct 12, 2009)

*Union Station progress*


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## aquaticko (Mar 15, 2011)

I was so excited to read about the FasTracks development before, and it seems like it's progressing well. I never really think of Denver as being a very dense and urbanized city, and I know that they have issues with slow development of the downtown core, but it's encouraging to see that they're trying to make the metro area a little less car-dependant. The line connecting Union Station with the airport seems like a particularly smart move.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

aquaticko said:


> I was so excited to read about the FasTracks development before, and it seems like it's progressing well. I never really think of Denver as being a very dense and urbanized city, and *I know that they have issues with slow development of the downtown core*, but it's encouraging to see that they're trying to make the metro area a little less car-dependant. The line connecting Union Station with the airport seems like a particularly smart move.


Actually Denver's downtown is pretty thriving with the LoDo district being a popular nightlife spot, in addition to new residential lofts/condos being built.


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## krnboy1009 (Aug 9, 2011)

Is there a light rail option to Avalanche game or Rockies game? From Denver airport?


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## aquaticko (Mar 15, 2011)

diablo234 said:


> Actually Denver's downtown is pretty thriving with the LoDo district being a popular nightlife spot, in addition to new residential lofts/condos being built.


I meant more the fact that there are numerous lots that are used for parking because the owners of them keep looking for a big project to invest in them instead of taking a more realistic approach so that there doesn't end up being a sort of checkerboard of skyscrapers and parking lots. I am aware that they've had a couple of new buildings go up the past decade or so, and that a few more are on the drawing board, and that's great.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

krnboy1009 said:


> Is there a light rail option to Avalanche game or Rockies game? From Denver airport?


The C and E Lines serves both the Pepsi Center (where the Denver Nuggets and the Avalanche play) from Pepsi Center/Elitch Gardens and Coors Field from Union Station.

Now regarding service to the airport currently they are building a commuter line from the airport to Union Station as part of Fastracks which is scheduled to open in 2016. For now there is a dedicated bus service known as SkyRide which connects the airport with Downtown, Boulder, and a few other places.

Sky Ride


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## corredor06 (Oct 13, 2008)

Good updates


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

aquaticko said:


> a couple of new buildings go up the past decade or so


which Denver are you talking about?


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Woonsocket54 said:


> which Denver are you talking about?


Which Denver are you talking about?

Even with the recession there are still construction projects being built in downtown including Two Tabor Center and 1501 Tremont Place. This does not even include the Four Seasons hotel which was just recently completed last year.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

^^ I was under the assumption that the poster was downplaying the amount of development in downtown Denver over recent years. I guess the meaning of my comment was lost or ambiguous. Denver downtown has way more going on than other cities in the Rockies, such as Phoenix or Albuquerque.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Woonsocket54 said:


> ^^ I was under the assumption that the poster was downplaying the amount of development in downtown Denver over recent years. I guess the meaning of my comment was lost or ambiguous. Denver downtown has way more going on than other cities in the Rockies, such as Phoenix or Albuquerque.


Disregard my previous comment then. :cheers:


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## Octavian5280 (Jun 14, 2009)

In answer to some questions, the train to the airport will be a Hyundai-Rotem EMU, a new design just going into service now in Philadelphia (Silverliner V). The reason it looks like a dog is because Federal regulations from the 1940s stipulate that US railcars must be built like tanks. RTD chose this model over a competing proposal from Siemens in part because the Siemens train had not yet been designed and Denver did not want the design risk. Its more complicated than that but that was part of it. 

The airport line will have 15 minute headways from 04:00 to 00:00 and then 30 minute headways from 0001-0200. It will take 30 minutes from the terminal to Denver Union Station. The Airport station is being designed by Santiago Calatrava and a new airport hotel is also part of that project (scheduled for completion by 2014).

Denver Union Station is about 45% complete, the new Light Rail station opens tomorrow, 8/15/11.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Some construction photos of the west line.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

> *Glitches put RTD "smart" farecard system nine months off schedule*
> By Jeffrey Leib
> The Denver Post
> http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_18920523
> ...


..


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

> *Feds announce funding for Denver rail lines*
> By CATHERINE TSAI Associated Press
> Posted: 08/31/2011 06:46:20 AM MDT
> Updated: 08/31/2011 09:57:19 PM MDT
> ...


..


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

^^ Anyway, Denver has quite a network of light rail for its population, and has a consistent plan to expand it. Interestingly, the other "mountain metro" of US, Salt Lake City, has also an expanding network of light rail.

There are some drawbacks though, such as one-track segments that will be a bottleneck on any expansion of services (such as allowing no more than 8 trains per hour to Denver International Airport, as the Pena Boulevard will have a long 1-track segment). I also don't understand why are they using crap busway as a solution to connect Boulder instead of using some rail-based solution


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## ssiguy2 (Feb 19, 2005)

LtBk said:


> It's pretty cool that RTD is building new electrified commuter rail lines instead of using diesel locomotives on freight lines.


You mean like Toronto? 

Toronto is actually building a new diesel line for it's airport express if you can believe it. Many US cities like Denver are catching up on some of the older and more established large transit centres of Eastern NA.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

Catch the Train, Round 3 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

'W-Rail'
Jurky Jurkovich
March 24, 2013 @ 10:00am
Jefferson Courthouse


Catch the Train, Round 3 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

'Tunnel'
Jurky Jurkovich
March 24, 2013 @ 10:30am
Jefferson Courthouse


Catch the Train, Round 3 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Round 3 Winner
'Indiana Bridge'
Jurky Jurkovich
March 11, 2013 @ 8:30am
Indiana Bridge


Catch the Train, Round 3 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Rob Winzurk
Here is a photo of an eastbound test train traveling thru The Lakewood Dry Gulch Park near Wolf and 11th. Taken around 3PM on March 19th.


Catch the Train, Round 3 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Rob Winzurk
Here is an eastbound train approaching the Sheridan Station on March 19th at 2:15PM. Taken from the Sheridan Blvd. Bridge


Catch the Train, Round 3 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Chip Sherman
Car 264 (cool ad wrap!) eastbound approaching Sheridan Station with snow covered foothills in distance.
March 11, 2013 10:00 AM
Photo was taken at Sheridan Station from public sidewalk.


Catch the Train, Round 3 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Chip Sherman
Car 264 climbed Joint Line Flyover during West Line testing March 11, 2013 with Denver skyline at upper left.
9:30 AM; I-25 and Colfax southwest of Denver.


Catch the Train, Round 3 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

John Schmidt 
Photo was taken of an eastbound train between Indiana Ave. and Simms/Union Ave. on 3/11/2013 at 8:15 am.


Catch the Train, Round 3 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

John Schmidt
Photo was taken of an eastbound train between Indiana Ave. and Simms/Union Ave. on 3/10/2013 at 9:14 am


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

Nouvellecosse said:


> Terms like large, midsize, and small etc. do not have specific definitions and are based on subjective perceptions of relative size/status. In a US context, I classify metro areas over 5-6 million as the big cities, and everything below that but no smaller than say, Portland or Sacramento as midsized. Below that I'd call them small. In a global context, I'd even call Chicago a midsized city, given how many megacity metro areas there are now with millions more.
> 
> But if you want to call a describe a metro area that size as large, you're more than welcome to.


Its not the relative size which matters, its the absolut size. Everything beyond 1 Mio inhabitants can even support a full metro if the city layout is not messed up too much by car centric low density city planning. A 5 mio city can support a massive metro network, together with a dense suburban rail, tram etc network. 

It might be surprising that a NA city of Denver's size can support a halfway decent light rail / commuter rail network, given their urban (or rather suburban) layout, but how big other cities are plays absolutely no role for that conclusion.


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## Nouvellecosse (Jun 4, 2005)

My comment has nothing to do with which city can support it. It's surprising that the city has chosen to do it (speaking specifically about creating an EMU commuter line) since few cities in NA have gone that route. In fact no US city smaller than greater DC and Philadelphia (that I know of) have electric commuter services with most seeming to prefer the option of making cheap-as-possible diesel locomotive services due to the political or cultural climate. There are a few like Portland, Austin, and San Diego with DMU service, but they're also rare.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

Photo of Peña Boulevard Bridge Girder Placement, March 18, 2013 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr



Photo of pier construction for Utah Junction commuter rail bridge, March 14, 2013 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

Nouvellecosse said:


> My comment has nothing to do with which city can support it. It's surprising that the city has chosen to do it (speaking specifically about creating an EMU commuter line) since few cities in NA have gone that route. In fact no US city smaller than greater DC and Philadelphia (that I know of) have electric commuter services with most seeming to prefer the option of making cheap-as-possible diesel locomotive services due to the political or cultural climate. There are a few like Portland, Austin, and San Diego with DMU service, but they're also rare.


Electric commuter rail might be more expensive indeed for such low capacities that these corridors are planned for but it has some tremendous advantages, the main station downtown will not smell like an oil power plant during rush hour for example. And of course, if you plan on creating a substantial PT network, you'll reach the point eventually where electrified systems would be a clear gain, so if you expect that, it might be clever to get the real deal right away. 

But the US is not really known for big PT budgets indeed. That makes Denver's achievements even the more impressive. I am really looking forward to seeing the further development especially around the station. Also the airport connection, is great. Taking the train from the airport to downtown is such a hassle free thing to do, compared to all the alternatives.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

Catch the Train, Round 4 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Robert Winzurk, Here, receiving a friendly wave from the operator, a westbound test train at 13th and Allison St. Taken April 3rd, 2013 at 3pm


Catch the Train, Round 4 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Rob Winzurk; Here is a photo of a westbound test train west of the Kipling Bridge. Photo taken March 30th at 6:30pm.


Catch the Train, Round 4 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Rob Winzurk; Here is a westbound test train approaching the Perry Station on March 25, 2013 at 2:10pm.


Catch the Train, Round 4 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

John Schmidt; This photo was taken on 4/5/2013 at 12:28 pm of a westbound train that has just passed under Union Blvd. Next stop, Red Rocks College.


Catch the Train, Round 4 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

John Schmidt; Photo was taken on 3/29/2013 at 5:45 pm. Looking north at the Simms/Union, 6th Ave. bridge, an east and westbound train pass each other.


Catch the Train, Round 4 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Richard Keyes; Arriving at the Lamar Station (Sunday, April 7, 2013, 7:19 am)


Catch the Train, Round 4 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Richard Keyes; Arriving at the Federal Center Station (Sunday, April 7, 2013, 7:58 am).


Catch the Train, Round 4 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Jack Gagliardi; 3/27/13 2:47p; From Bldg 67 11th floor, Denver Federal Center


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## aquaticko (Mar 15, 2011)

I'm really excited to see the effects that this new rail network has on development in and around Denver over the coming decades. I'm biased, but I'd tend to think it'll be very positive; thanks for reposting the pics, Woonsocket54.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

*DENVER | Commuter Rail*

Korea-made commuter rail cars


Entry Area by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

The entry foyer of the commuter rail car.


RTD FasTracks First Commuter Rail Car by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

The center seating section has an aisle wide enough for wheelchair users to go from one set of doors to another.


Interior of Commuter Rail Vehicle by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

The center seating section of the RTD commuter rail car has two-by-two seating.


LED Display Board by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

LED display boards will show passenger information such as the upcoming station stops.


Bicycle Racks by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Each commuter rail car will have two bicycle areas, with two types of securement. The area can also be used for oversized luggage, golf or ski bags.


Widened Wheelchair Access by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

The fellow in the green jacket is standing in the wheelchair space. Notice the windscreen he is leaning against; it is not as wide as the other side. The reason is to provide more space for wheelchairs and scooters to maneuver from the door to the wheelchair area.


Car on Test track by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Tilt Test by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

The commuter rail car is put through a roll-angle test at the Hyundai Rotem plant in Changwon, South Korea.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

^^ Nice train. They shouldn't allow bicycles inside it here though.


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## city_thing (May 25, 2006)

^^ It really annoys me when people take their bikes on peak hour trains. It happens all the time here in Melbourne.

Regarding the Denver airport rail line, does anyone have a map of the route it will take? Will it connect the Airport direct to Denver's Union station or will there be stops in between?


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

city_thing said:


> ^^ It really annoys me when people take their bikes on peak hour trains. It happens all the time here in Melbourne.
> 
> Regarding the Denver airport rail line, does anyone have a map of the route it will take? Will it connect the Airport direct to Denver's Union station or will there be stops in between?


You can read about it here http://www.rtd-fastracks.com/ec_1

Or here: http://goo.gl/maps/Uf048 (extensive google maps lay-over) 

They also have maps for the other lines/projects in Denver.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

If peak hour transport of bikes is a problem because of carriage overload, one can limit bikes to non-peak hours. Space for bikes in trains is not wasted in any case as it allows additional standing or luggage room if no bikes are present. So why not enabling bike transport on commuter rail?


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

Slartibartfas said:


> If peak hour transport of bikes is a problem because of carriage overload, one can limit bikes to non-peak hours. Space for bikes in trains is not wasted in any case as it allows additional standing or luggage room if no bikes are present. So why not enabling bike transport on commuter rail?


It takes away seating capacity and usually bike carrying supplement fares are not nearly high enough to cover the cost of the space taken from seats (like a person + bike not costing even 2x person-fare).


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## k.k.jetcar (Jul 17, 2008)

^^
I think non-peak services allowing bicycles is a good practice- if it attracts passengers that otherwise may not use the service, better than running empty off peak trains, especially given that most American suburban commute services are very peaky. Of course, if bicycle space takes away valuable seat revenue space in peak hour services, it's not good. Another option is to make those bike spaces also usable for standing passengers, with appropriate handholds, straps etc. But the American commuter culture seems allergic to standing and there is a belief that everyone needs a seat.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

Suburbanist said:


> It takes away seating capacity and usually bike carrying supplement fares are not nearly high enough to cover the cost of the space taken from seats (like a person + bike not costing even 2x person-fare).


If you allow them only if there is proper space, eg outside of peak hours, there is no space that is taken away from anyone as there is sufficient space and the weight of bikes certainly don't matter anyway. That is also my very experience from the Viennese subway where off-peak bike transport is allowed and no problem at all, nor a reducing the subway's capacity where needed.


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## Nouvellecosse (Jun 4, 2005)

Why not just have cyclists pay extra to bring their bikes during rush hour? Certainly worth the premium for the extra convenience they offer.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

^^ It inconvenience other passengers too much, and US commuter train system need seating capacity (if passengers have to stand, many will just drive).


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## Sopomon (Oct 2, 2010)

No FRA waiver to have lighter and more efficient trains than those?


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

Suburbanist said:


> ^^ It inconvenience other passengers too much, and US commuter train system need seating capacity (if passengers have to stand, many will just drive).


One bike corner reduces seat capacity maybe by one seat as optional side seats can be still available. Given, that this same corner could also accommodate baggies, luggage or wheel chairs it seems a reasonable thing to offer at least one of them. I doubt the main problem of commuter trains in the US is to accommodate an exploding number of people but rather to make the system as attractive as possible for as many as possible.


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## Jonesy55 (Jul 30, 2004)

I sometimes take my bike on the train to work in peak hours, and there are often several others doing the same. It can be a pain when the trains are really busy, both for the cyclist and the other passengers but generally it doesn't seem to be a major problem.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Well they could always add a separate rail car for bike storage since that is how Copenhagen's S-Tog commuter rail system solved the problem of accommodating bike riders.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

The West Line finally opened to the public Friday, with regular service beginning this Sunday.

http://www.rtd-fastracks.com/wc_202


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)




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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

http://denverurbanism.com/2013/04/all-aboard-rtds-west-line-opens.html


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## Minato ku (Aug 9, 2005)

There is some long sections with only one track as I see in the video.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Minato ku said:


> There is some long sections with only one track as I see in the video.


Yeah, to save money RTD decided to make many sections single track between Federal Center and Jeffco Government Center with reduced frequency.


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## aquaticko (Mar 15, 2011)

Do we know if there's enough ROW along the various for double tracking in the future if necessary?


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## Minato ku (Aug 9, 2005)

diablo234 said:


> Yeah, to save money RTD decided to make many sections single track between Federal Center and Jeffco Government Center with reduced frequency.


What is the peak frequency ?


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

Minato ku said:


> What is the peak frequency ?


4 trains per hour between Jefferson County Gov. and Federal Center (2 stations)

8 trans per hours the rest of the line

Full schedule: http://www3.rtd-denver.com/schedule...=W&lineName=W&direction=E-Bound&serviceType=3


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

I see that they gave up on the G trains connecting the ends of the I-25 and I-225 lines. Can't say I'm surprised at that. too bad they spent all that money on a grade-separated light rail interchange at the I-25-I-225 junction. hno:

From the first page of the thread:









I suppose they'll try it again once the I-225 line is extended.

I'm also unpleasantly surprised at how poorly the West line connects with the rest of the system-- getting from the west line to the high-rise core requires two transfers, one of them about a mile out of the way and in a dicey-looking part of town. Perhaps at some point full three-way wyes could be added along with a transfer station at Curtis and 5th Streets. Admittedly, working around or rebuilding the Colfax Avenue Viaduct would be a challenge... 

To me it seems odd that RTD would provide elaborately for a rather marginal-looking suburb-to-suburb connection but not for what ought to be a major axis through the city's core. WTF?

EDIT: I'll say something positive now: Peak service is 18 trains per hour! Here's I-25/Broadway northbound in the morning:

F 8:01
D 8:04
E 8:07
H 8:10
D 8:13

F 8:16
D 8:19
C 8:22
H 8:25
F 8:31

D 8:34
E 8:37
H 8:40
D 8:43
F 8:46

D 8:49
C 8:52
H 8:55

I wish MARTA did that!


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Tom 958 said:


> I'm also unpleasantly surprised at how poorly the West line connects with the rest of the system-- getting from the west line to the high-rise core requires two transfers, one of them about a mile out of the way and in a dicey-looking part of town. Perhaps at some point full three-way wyes could be added along with a transfer station at Curtis and 5th Streets. Admittedly, working around or rebuilding the Colfax Avenue Viaduct would be a challenge...


Why would anyone traveling on the W Line need to make three transfers when they could just get off at Union Station and take the 16th Street Shuttle?


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## Minato ku (Aug 9, 2005)

Suburbanist said:


> 4 trains per hour between Jefferson County Gov. and Federal Center (2 stations)
> 
> 8 trans per hours the rest of the line
> 
> Full schedule: http://www3.rtd-denver.com/schedule...=W&lineName=W&direction=E-Bound&serviceType=3


It is better than what I expected.


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

diablo234 said:


> Why would anyone traveling on the W Line need to make three transfers when they could just get off at Union Station and take the 16th Street Shuttle?


I didn't say three transfers-- I said two. I admit, though- I was being too pessimistic. In fact, the 16th Street Shuttle would allow that trip to be made with only one transfer, and it serves some high-rise areas that aren't on the California/Stout loop. Getting to the Weldon Street line or the Denver CC area would require two, though. With the wyes I mentioned, none would be required, at least for some trips.

EDIT: Somewhere on the internet there's a raucous debate about the situation, but this is all I've found so far: http://denverurbanism.com/2011/07/a...tion-area-infrastructure-reconfiguration.html . FWIW, of the several commenters who mention the situation, none defend the current configuration, though one says that the downtown Stout/California loop is already at capacity and couldn't accept West line trains even if there were an efficient way of routing them there.

There's a map (click to view-- it's really big) showing how the connections are today, too, made before construction began. Note that the eastern wye was there, and there was space for the western one, too, but the line was moved after its initial construction in order to place the Auraria West Campus station where it is.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

Well that was one of the reasons why they rerouted the W Line away from California/Stout because of capacity issues. Anyways given that the East Corridor, Gold Line, and North Lines are expected to serve Union Station it makes sense to reroute the line there (however Denver would probably be better off if they built the downtown segment underground ala Edmonton or Pittsburgh to resolve any capacity issues but cest la vie).


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

diablo234 said:


> Well that was one of the reasons why they rerouted the W Line away from California/Stout because of capacity issues.


That and the near-certainty that with 18 trains per hour on the Central Line, operations at two adjacent at-grade wyes would be a fustercluck.



> Anyways given that the East Corridor, Gold Line, and North Lines are expected to serve Union Station it makes sense to reroute the line there (however Denver would probably be better off if they built the downtown segment underground ala Edmonton or Pittsburgh to resolve any capacity issues but cest la vie).


Which brings me to item 2: Why don't they extend the LRT all the way to Union Station instead of stopping it three blocks away? It'd be unfortunate but understandable if buildings had been in the way, but the entire area has been cleared for redevelopment. Throw in a turnaround for the all-important 16th Street Shuttle, too: As it stands, it looks as though shuttle riders will need to cross 16th street to board it.

In Denver I read the usual blather about "a seamless intermodal transit system," but this seam is three blocks wide, and right at one of the system's most critical junctions. WTF? :bash:


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## BoulderGrad (Jun 29, 2005)

Tom 958 said:


> That and the near-certainty that with 18 trains per hour on the Central Line, operations at two adjacent at-grade wyes would be a fustercluck.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The light rail stop used to be right where they are building the new train canopy. They moved it to avoid the jog the trains used to have to make to get to the main line and to make room for the new 3 block long underground bus depot. The white canopy you see right next to the station is the entrance to the bus depot. And the entrance to the 16th street mall shuttle is right at the station as well.


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

BoulderGrad said:


> The light rail stop used to be right where they are building the new train canopy. They moved it to avoid the jog the trains used to have to make to get to the main line and to make room for the new 3 block long underground bus depot. The white canopy you see right next to the station is the entrance to the bus depot. And the entrance to the 16th street mall shuttle is right at the station as well.


That's interesting-- I didn't know about the station being moved.

I also received this informative reply at http://denverurbanism.com/ :

_Hi Tom. Thanks for your comment!

The Union Station Transit District is comprised of three elements, the Light Rail Station, the underground Regional Bus Facility, and the Commuter Rail/Amtrak Station. The distance between the Light Rail platforms and the Commuter Rail platforms is 800 feet–not three blocks. That distance, 150-feet shorter than one-half the length of the A/B/C/D/E concourses at Atlanta Hartsfield International Airport, can be traversed one of three ways: 1.) Walk at street level through the 17th Street Gardens, 2.) Take the Mall Shuttle from the Light Rail Station to the next stop at the end of the Commuter Rail station (roughly 16th and Wewatta), or 3.) Go into the Chestnut Pavilion at the Light Rail Station and walk underground through the Pedestrian Concourse inside the Bus Facility, emerging up into the Wewatta Pavilion directly next to the Commuter Rail Station or up into the Union Station Pavilion right at the door to the historic station. The underground bus facility stretches the entire length of the transit district–it’s below both the Light Rail and Commuter Rail stations. Based on the average adult walking speed of 3 MPH, the time to walk from Light Rail to Commuter Rail is approximately 3-4 minutes.

As I alluded to above, there will be a 16th Street Mall Shuttle stop directly at the end of the Commuter Rail Station (roughly 16th and Wewatta), 175 feet from the end of the Commuter Rail platforms, so boarding the Mall Shuttle from the Commuter Rail trains will be a snap.

As to why everything isn’t all stacked on top of each other right behind the historic station… not only did that plan alternative have an approximate $1 billion price tag that the project couldn’t afford, but it ultimately had engineering issues that the federal government nixed due to safety issues. There’s no room for the Light Rail, which crosses over 15th Street and Cherry Creek just one block south of the Light Rail Station, to do a sharp turn and get closer to the Commuter Rail Station without some major restructuring of the whole street grid just for a few hundred feet. Also, RTD has determined that a fraction (less than 10%) of travelers will actually be making the Light Rail-to-Commuter Rail mode transfer. Most people will be arriving/departing via one mode or the other to or from Downtown as a pedestrian or via the Mall Shuttle.

The Union Station Transit District plan also includes a new 16th Street Mall Shuttle-like service called the Downtown Circulator, a major bicycle facility, space for taxis and pedicabs, and three major public plazas. I hope that explanation helps._

I still think that 800 feet is too long, but the underground connection helps. And the Downtown Circulator will parttly address the too-many-transfers issue I brought up in post 112.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

*DENVER | East Rail Line*


Photo of the Jersey Cutoff Bridge by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of Union Pacific freight train moving between support piers for the Interstate 70 commuter rail flyover bridge by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of girders being placed on the Utah Junction commuter rail bridge by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of construction on the Peoria Station passenger platform by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of Commuter Rail Pilot Car at assembly plant by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Rendering of 0th and Colorado Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## zaphod (Dec 8, 2005)

I should mention that the old G line that necessitated the expensive grade-separated junction will be reinstated when they extend the tracks north to meet the East Line at Peoria station.

Also probably made sense to build those flyovers while the rest of the freeway was under construction back in the early 2000s


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

*DENVER | East Rail Line*

RT&S
http://www.rtands.com/index.php/pas...along-denvers-east-rail-line.html?channel=281



> Wednesday, July 17, 2013
> *First track installed along Denver's East Rail Line*
> 
> The Denver Regional Transportation District's (RTD) contractor for the East Rail Line, Denver Transit Partners (DTP), installed the first track toward Denver International Airport (DIA) along Peña Boulevard on July 17.
> ...



RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


RTD Track Construction to DIA by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

There is nothing like handling glowing metal under the glowing summer sun I guess ...


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

*East Rail Line*


Artistic rendering of Central Park Station passenger platform area by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

*Gold Line*


Artistic rendering of Arvada Ridge Station passenger platform area by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

*East Rail Line*


Perspective photo of tracks laid along the East Rail Line by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of installation of track on East Rail Line by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## billfranklin (Jan 28, 2007)

Tom 958 said:


> That's interesting-- I didn't know about the station being moved.
> 
> I also received this informative reply at http://denverurbanism.com/ :
> 
> ...


The explanation you received was made after a huge property play forced the Denver Union Station to evolve the way it has. Many of us here regard this as a tragedy, and, if, and when the system really gets busy, the station will be the weakest link in the system. The best discussions about Denver architecture, planning, and, transportation are on Skyscraperpage.com. They have very heated yet intelligent discussions.


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

Thanks, Bill.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

Photo of track installation and welding near 64th Avenue on the East Rail Line by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## desertpunk (Oct 12, 2009)

*New train station at Denver International Airport:*

*DIA Train Station progress:*


DIA Train Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


DSCN0802 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


South Terminal Project Overview by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


DSCN0791 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Passenger Platform by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## desertpunk (Oct 12, 2009)

*New commuter rail cars arriving:*


Photo of first rail car shipment to Philadelphia Sept. 22, 2013 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of the first commuter rail vehicle arriving at the Hyundai-Rotem plant in Philadelphia, Sept. 24, 2013 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of interior of the commuter rail car by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of Commuter Rail Car on Test Track by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## desertpunk (Oct 12, 2009)

*Track construction:*


Photo of construction on the Utah Junction Bridge Sept. 25, 2013 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of track construction approaching Peña Bridge, Sept. 5, 2013 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of construction of concrete platform for track installation on July 14, 2013 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of girders being placed on Wadsworth Bypass Bridge in Arvada August 11, 2013 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Photo of Interstate 70 Bridge pier construction on July 14, 2013 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## desertpunk (Oct 12, 2009)

*New maintenance facility:*


Commuter Rail Maintenance Facility by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Commuter Rail Maintenance Facility by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Commuter Rail Maintenance Facility by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Commuter Rail Maintenance Facility by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


Commuter Rail Maintenance Facility by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

^^ Will that airport link have single track sectors???


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## Falubaz (Nov 20, 2004)

This will be a new line. With new trains. So why do they look like trains from the 70s? What's wrong with tarnsportation boards in States? Why do they order such old style looking trains?


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## desertpunk (Oct 12, 2009)

Suburbanist said:


> ^^ Will that airport link have single track sectors???


I believe so.



Falubaz said:


> This will be a new line. With new trains. So why do they look like trains from the 70s? What's wrong with tarnsportation boards in States? Why do they order such old style looking trains?


These are being manufactured in South Korea and have that classic NYC subway styling. If you want sleek and modern, go to Houston, or Phoenix, or Atlanta (streetcar, not MARTA), or Charlotte....


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

^^ Why I don't understand is why so small windows for a system that is entirely above-ground (except some short covered section). Small windows + standing passengers = bad.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

^^ Probably those trains are rather designed for little to no standing passangers in regular service. The lack of holding grips along the aisles suggests that. 

I also don't know if the design is so apropriate for a new system but I can understand if they want to make the system look more "classic" than it actually is. 

Anyway, I am congratulating Denver for what they are doing with Fastracks, especialliy in regards to the airport connection. This rail link will put Denver in some spheres of efficient attractive airport links that many, or even most, US cities can only dream of.


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## zaphod (Dec 8, 2005)

Or rather classic Philadelphia

these are the same as the SEPTA Silverliner V, which as its name suggests is the 5th generation of an old design. 

I guess RTD piggybacked on the order.

Not all new trains going into service in the USA are so fusty. Sonoma-Marin Area Rapid Transit(SMART) is buying trains from Nippon Sharyo that have a modern japanese look. In another example of doubling on the same order these are the trains Toronto is going to get for the their Airport rail link.


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## ssiguy2 (Feb 19, 2005)

Looks like a nice line. Some Denver planners should go to Toronto and teach them how to build a line instead of the expensive polluting diesel line they are building.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

^^ Looks to me like they'll miss the weather protection.


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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

On the 5th March, FTA announced list of 32 favorable transit projects for funding for 2015. Region's favored matched in red:


image by dimlys46, on Flickr


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## zaphod (Dec 8, 2005)

> I am sure the site problem started long before you worked with RTD. The problem was the layout of the properties after being divided up by the biggest stockholder of the railroad then later sold to multiple entities, years prior to those plans made by the two final competing development consortiums that you saw.


I never worked with RTD? lol. I don't live anywhere Denver either.

FWIW, The entire process and reports from meetings of the DUS people was the subject of a very long thread on Skyscraperpage. The blog DenverInfill also covered it. If you dug on this site you might find some discussion as well.

At some point it made national news.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

A video of the first Amtrak train arriving/departing from Union Station.


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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

From Railway Gazette:



> http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/...denver-breaks-ground-on-north-metro-line.html
> 
> *Denver breaks ground on North Metro Line*
> 21 Mar 2014
> ...


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

*Free downtown buses*

Denver will soon have two free downtown circulators, running the same end-to-end route parallel to each other two to three blocks apart.










http://www.rtd-fastracks.com/ddc_1


source: RTD flickr account (http://www.flickr.com/photos/rtd-denver/12975391955/)


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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

March photo of new light rail viaduct between Belleview (E, F lines) and Dayton (H line) stops, which will be opened as new G Line in 2017, from RTD's Facebook page. Track works on this viaduct would begin in May:


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## Falubaz (Nov 20, 2004)

OMG! 2017? Really? Why so slow! It's not gonna be an underground line to take that long period of time!


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## billfranklin (Jan 28, 2007)

Falubaz said:


> OMG! 2017? Really? Why so slow! It's not gonna be an underground line to take that long period of time!


Public works projects in the 21st Century US are very politicized and tend to be built across multiple city boundaries. Governments at the city, county, state, and, federal levels all interact with private interests- whether as concerned voters or as property brokers. On top of these complications, the US has become a morass of regulations. Often, projects take 10 years of 'study' before the first shovel of dirt is turned over. 

Combine that with state and federal governments that survive on the election monies given by a select few, and, public works are under financed in the current billionaire driven political reality.

By US standards in the 21st Century, the Fastracks buildout in Denver is both rapid, and, huge in size.

We tend not to do such things very well anymore as we have become a nation of talkers, rather than doers.


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

dimlys1994 said:


> March photo of new light rail viaduct between Belleview (E, F lines) and Dayton (H line) stops, which will be opened as new G Line in 2017, from RTD's Facebook page. Track works on this viaduct would begin in May:


I must be smoking crack-- Google maps clearly shows the trackways completed in that area, and the G train was shown as operational on the map in the OP of this thread c. 2010, though it was suspended (presumably) due to low ridership:









Surely that photo is from elsewhere on the I-225 line.


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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

Tom 958 said:


> I must be smoking crack-- Google maps clearly shows the trackways completed in that area, and the G train was shown as operational on the map in the OP of this thread c. 2010, though it was suspended (presumably) due to low ridership:
> 
> Surely that photo is from elsewhere on the I-225 line.


No, I think you're right, it's in Aurora. Here is description of photo:



> The median bridge on the I-225 Rail Line is a remarkable structure. It will carry light rail trains over the northbound lanes of I-225 just north of Parker Road.


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## guppyflyer (Jul 16, 2011)

dimlys1994 said:


> No, I think you're right, it's in Aurora. Here is description of photo:


The current end of line station, Nine Mile, is visible in the photo. This bridge is just beyond that station and will take trains from the highway median to the East side of the highway on their way to the Iliff station.









Source:RTD


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## zaphod (Dec 8, 2005)

I think the G line will be reinstated once that extension is completed.

This is an interesting line though, it entirely a suburb-suburb belt line which is rare in an American city. I guess the Denver tech corridor on one end and the Fitzsimmons hospital complex on the other are sufficient enough destinations?


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## billfranklin (Jan 28, 2007)

*The Aurora line*



zaphod said:


> I think the G line will be reinstated once that extension is completed.
> 
> This is an interesting line though, it entirely a suburb-suburb belt line which is rare in an American city. I guess the Denver tech corridor on one end and the Fitzsimmons hospital complex on the other are sufficient enough destinations?


Denver has it's own unique metro-characteristics. 

One major characteristic is that Denver is a twin-city with Aurora, which borders most of the east side of the city of Denver. The city of Denver is almost exactly twice as populated as Aurora, but, at 325,000 Aurora is not small.

This twin cities arrangement has resulted in major conflicts between the two cities, as Denver, being it's own county, the capitol of the State, as well as a city, has always had the most political muscle. This Denver centricity between the two cities can be shown by how Denver city has an isthmus like connection that dog legs for many kilometers between Denver International Airport and the rest of Denver city.

However, as the 3rd largest city in Colorado, and, as a large city itself, Aurora has had a few cards to play when dealing with Denver over DIA, the Tech Center, and the Anschutz Medical Center. Essentially, from a commuter's standpoint, the center Aurora, as the crow flies, is far closer to these major employment centers than is downtown Denver. In addition, in the entire metro RTD package, the I-225 light rail is the only line that lies primarily in Aurora, which is the political payoff for Aurora's tax contributions to RTD.

Of course, the I-225 light rail build out has complicating factors, among which are how the route swerves to the east to serve the "new" Aurora town center, the street running around Anschutz Medical center, and interconnections with the DIA 79mpg EMU line. These issues will slow down the average speed on the line, and, make time of travel an issue.

While the ring formed by the Corridor, the Southeast, and the I-225 light rail lines and the DIA commuter line is a great positive, the time required to make the loop from DIA station through the system back to DIA will be over 2 hours. Consequently, the loop will not produce the public transportation synergies that a shorter, quicker traveled loop might. Regardless, this is a great positive.


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## ramakrishna1984 (Jun 21, 2013)

Aeriel view of the construction site at the *Denver Union Station redevelopment.*










Complete Project Info : http://www.railway-technology.com/projects/denverunionstation/denverunionstation1.html


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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

^^I'm sorry, but is that an out-of-date photo?


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## NickABQ (Jun 6, 2007)

dimlys1994 said:


> ^^I'm sorry, but is that an out-of-date photo?


Quite old!:bash:


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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

From Rail Journal:



> http://www.railjournal.com/index.ph...-denver-light-rail-extension.html?channel=542
> 
> *Go-ahead for Denver light rail extension*
> Wednesday, July 23, 2014
> ...


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## Nexis (Aug 7, 2007)

Courtesy of Ryan Dravitz

*Denver Union Station​*

IMG_0599 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


IMG_0609 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


IMG_7160 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


Under the Canopy by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


IMG_7486 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


IMG_7475 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


IMG_7314 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


IMG_7317 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


IMG_7318 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr

*Underground Bus Terminal​*

IMG_6092 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


IMG_6095 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


IMG_6102 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

What's the airport doing in this thread? ::lol:


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

Tom 958 said:


> What's the airport doing in this thread? ::lol:


It shows the constructions work of the DIA rail station that is part of the public transport expansion plan. Whats so weird about that?


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## jam5 (May 30, 2007)

Nexis said:


> IMG_7314 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr
> 
> 
> IMG_7317 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr
> ...


That is one beautiful station -the interior may not be as ornate as Seattle's King Street station (as far as the historic bits are concerned), but still, I like what they have done with it.


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## CNB30 (Jun 4, 2012)

I got to visit Denver a few weeks ago, and Union Station was one of my favorite parts! They have done an amazing Job!, Especially with the new ring covering shed thing in the back.


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

Slartibartfas said:


> It shows the constructions work of the DIA rail station that is part of the public transport expansion plan. Whats so weird about that?


It was another way of saying, "The Underground Bus Terminal looks like it belongs at an airport." 

*sigh*


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

*How Denver Is Becoming the Most Advanced Transit City in the West*



> By 2018, when all but one of the ten FasTracks lines should be completed, a metropolitan area with a projected population of 3 million, spread out over 2,340 square miles, will be served by nine rail lines, 18 miles of bus rapid transit, and 95 stations. Many argue it will turn Denver into the west's most advanced transit city, vaulting it beyond better-known peers Portland, Los Angeles, and Vancouver, British Columbia...
> 
> It's a beautiful vision, if one undermined by an uncomfortable truth. *Denver's mode share for transit* — the proportion of people who use buses or light rail to commute — *is only about 6 percent.* Contrast this with the Canadian city of Calgary, where a similarly sized bus and light-rail fleet operating in a similarly dispersed landscape draws in a mode share of nearly 17 percent. Even epically sprawled Atlanta and automobile-mad Los Angeles manage to achieve almost twice Denver's per capita transit ridership.


This has been in the back of my mind for a while: I fervently hope to be proven wrong by history, but I fear that Denver is building too much rail too fast, and will find itself in the dread death spiral of increasing fares, service cutbacks, and declining ridership.

Please discuss.


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## nr23Derek (May 13, 2009)

Then charge more for car parking in the city. Simples.

Derek


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

You can't have a lot of ridership without having a robust system in place first.

They should develop more TOD as well.

I also think the line to the airport will be a huge success. At the same time, the dreadful BRT to Boulder will fail, it should not be built, and funds instead diverted to build actual rail service there.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

^^ Before the Orange Line BRT opened in Los Angeles, light rail advocates were predicting that it wouldn't attract much ridership and would be a failure. After it opened and proved a success, light rail advocates started arguing that it should be converted to light rail because the ridership was too high for BRT.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

Buses are hideous by nature, no new BRT projects should be allowed federal funding in US, only fixed-guidance systems (rail, monorail etc) should be given funds for their technological superiority.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

^^ The cold hard reality is that rail transit systems typically rely on feeder networks of bus routes.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

The following graphic is from the Transport Politic website < http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2014/01/05/openings-and-construction-starts-planned-for-2014/ >.










The impressive thing is how many projects and how many route miles of Bus Rapid Transit will be built using how little money compared to Light Rail and Heavy Rail.

Bus Rapid Transit
Total Construction Cost: ~$2.5 Billion
Total Projects: 32
Total Route Miles: 257

Commuter Rail
Total Construction Cost: ~$13 Billion
Total Projects: 13
Total Route Miles: 220

Heavy Rail
Total Construction Cost: ~$28 Billion
Total Projects: 11
Total Route Miles: 81

Light Rail
Total Construction Cost: ~$27 Billion
Total Projects: 25
Total Route Miles: 144

Streetcar
Total Construction Cost: ~$2 Billion
Total Projects: 16
Total Route Miles: 41


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

greg_christine said:


> ^^ The cold hard reality is that rail transit systems typically rely on feeder networks of bus routes.


Indeed. And if there's not enough operations funding to run at least minimal rail service and an adequate bus network, it's the buses that'll be cut.

I wish that Jarrett Walker would write about Denver, though his latest effort is almost eerily appropriate to the topic at hand. This article about his proposal for reconfiguring Houston's bus network is the kind of thing I'm talking about. It promises a large increase in ridership and general utility for little or no extra cost because it would be done mainly by arranging existing bus service more efficiently. A similar effort in Denver might produce even better results as expanding rail service and efficient bus service combine to feed a virtuous cycle of increasing ridership. But if the bus service doesn't do its part, the opposite could happen.


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## ssiguy2 (Feb 19, 2005)

BRT also offers route flexibility that fixed rail systems cannot match. 

BRT also can do one thing that no rail service can do........get rid of the dreaded "last mile". Even most suburbanites don't mind tacking rapid transit but it's waiting for the bus from the station to their home that they don't like and is often time consuming hence the popularity of park-n-rides. People can take the main transit from those stations without worrying about connections. 

BRT in it's best form such as Ottawa's Transitway is a bus-only system where you fly down the corridors {I use to live in Ottawa and the Transitway is VERY fast} and then the buses disembark at different stations to different neighborhoods ...............rail comfort and speed without the transfers. 

High quality BRT and especially those with totally segregated bus-ways offer the high frequency, speed, and convenience that people want and in many cases no rail system can provide.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

Are those Stats above comparing apples with apples? I am skeptical.

When comparing costs only comparing full costs to full costs can give a somewhat appropriate picture. And even then you miss out on the indirect benefits.

BRT at high capacities needs considerably more space than rail systems and lead to very complex systems because of the multitude of lines heading through the centre. But I think most importantly, bigger "flexibility" in a PT system is not a feature but a bug. It is the much more "frozen" nature of rails systems, that give urban development around it the kind of long term guarantees it needs. Of course, if central heavy BRT systems are built on huge and expensive structures they can reach a similar advantageous "inflexibility" but than they loose of course the cost benefit.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

Slartibartfas said:


> Are those Stats above comparing apples with apples? I am skeptical.
> ...


Please read the source article < http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2014/01/05/openings-and-construction-starts-planned-for-2014/ >. The Transport Politic is very pro-transit regardless of transit mode (bus or rail). The article includes a table with the data for all the individual projects.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

ssiguy2 said:


> ...
> 
> BRT also can do one thing that no rail service can do........get rid of the dreaded "last mile". Even most suburbanites don't mind tacking rapid transit but it's waiting for the bus from the station to their home that they don't like and is often time consuming hence the popularity of park-n-rides. People can take the main transit from those stations without worrying about connections.
> 
> ...


That's an excellent point that is often missed. Environmental impact studies for new transit lines typically compare transit modes by making the assumption that BRT and LRT would operate in exactly the same manner. That is, they would follow the same route and have the same station locations. The critical assumption is that people would get on a regular bus in their neighborhood and would then transfer to LRT or BRT to get downtown. Las Vegas did their study differently. Las Vegas assumed that buses would operate on their normal routes in outlying areas and would then merge onto a dedicated busway to get downtown. This eliminated a transfer and resulted in faster journey times for the BRT option. The following slide tells the story.










I fully agree with critics of BRT that LRT is more fun to ride. When visiting a city that is new to me, I'll go out of my way to ride a rail line, but never a bus line. There is also the snob factor associated with LRT. Having an LRT or streetcar line has become as important to second-tier cities as having an airline is to third-world countries.


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## phoenixboi08 (Dec 6, 2009)

greg_christine said:


> I fully agree with critics of BRT that LRT is more fun to ride. When visiting a city that is new to me, I'll go out of my way to ride a rail line, but never a bus line. There is also the snob factor associated with LRT. Having an LRT or streetcar line has become as important to second-tier cities as having an airline is to third-world countries.


It's just a good tool for development. No matter which way you cut it, BRT isn't going to help appreciate land values the way LRT can, and that's what many cities are after these days.


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## Falubaz (Nov 20, 2004)

My impressions of Denver public transport:

Arriving from the airport with the bus (soon it will be railway) to the city center bus terminal, which is underground.

















LRT


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## Falubaz (Nov 20, 2004)




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## Falubaz (Nov 20, 2004)

Free shuttle


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## MrAronymous (Aug 7, 2011)

webeagle12 said:


> yup 'merica!!!!
> 
> ..where we still design trains to look like 1960 POS in 2014!!





diablo234 said:


> You can blame the Federal Railroad Administrations for the design.





Tower Dude said:


> doesn't matter FRA rules haven't changed in 103 year.





Falubaz said:


> ^^It really looks like Philadelphia regional rail trains... so ugly


Good news everyone.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

^^ The trains will be in service for at least thirty years, perhaps even longer. It doesn't matter how modern they look today. They will look dated long before they leave service.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

The initial batch of trains has arrived at Denver's beautiful Union Station, completing their journey from Philadelphia.

Here they are approaching the capital from the northeast, pictured here between Brighton and Commerce City, CO

On the Tracks by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Waiting for the Trains by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Into the Last Switch by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

approaching Union Station platform area

Through the "Throat" by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Checking the Clearance by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Looks Just Right by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Backing In by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Delivery Done! by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Union Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Uncoupling by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Separation by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

It feels like the train design in the US hasn't changed in the last 50 years, at all. Is there any special reason for that?


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

Slartibartfas said:


> It feels like the train design in the US hasn't changed in the last 50 years, at all.


How did you decide on 50 years?


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## Falubaz (Nov 20, 2004)

The trains are there, the line to the airport seems to be almost ready, too. Why does it take more than another year to start the service?


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

Falubaz said:


> The trains are there, the line to the airport seems to be almost ready, too. Why does it take more than another year to start the service?


Can they serve Denver International Airport without a finished airport railway station? Denver is not Minsk.


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## CNB30 (Jun 4, 2012)

Woonsocket54 said:


> How did you decide on 50 years?


Because he's pretty much right. Except for maybe the Acela, trains here usually look at least 50 years old (to me at least).


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## LtBk (Jul 27, 2004)

Slartibartfas said:


> It feels like the train design in the US hasn't changed in the last 50 years, at all. Is there any special reason for that?


Good question. I'm guess the retro looks is still popular and FRA regulations.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

The 50 years were just a guess but the point is that they look very retro like, from a European perspective at least. The US is not the only country with metal look trains but in most countries new train sets look quite different from those that you find commonly in the US. In fact the difference is very eye jumping. Even 20 year old train sets often look almost futuristic compared to up to date US train sets. There must be some cultural difference at work here I think. Or the regulations that force the trains into tank like features forbids any playful design of train ends. I don't know. 



Woonsocket54 said:


> Can they serve Denver International Airport without a finished airport railway station? Denver is not Minsk.


Apart from that, extensive track testing takes it time, doesn't it? After all, you'd rather not want to find out some technical difficulties after opening if you can do so already before and fix them upfront.


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## greg_christine (Jan 25, 2004)

^^ If a design is sufficiently out of date, it begins to look stylish again.


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## MrAronymous (Aug 7, 2011)

Yeah that's what they cal 'historical/classic'. But when your trains haven't changed in 40 years because of regulations or stinginess I'd just call that out of date an old fashioned. In a bad way.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

The pointless "change for the sake of change" obsession just never caught on in US transit circles, it seems.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

I don't think anything is wrong with that old style train design, if US Americans prefer it that way. To change merely for the sake of changing is the wrong way to go for sure. 

Personally, I do like the modern cars more than the older ones however. The "classic" designs are increasingly disappearing across Europe and the modern look, is the new standard. Those US designs start to look increasingly exotic. It is even more extreme when you look at the light rail vehicles. Even 10-20 year old European vehicles usually look futuristic compared to most brand new ones in the US. I am not being judgemental, I just wanted to mention that once as it is the first thing one reckognizes when looking across the great pond. 

Just as example: 
Standard commuter rail trains of Stockholm: http://www.infrastrukturnyheter.se/...ry/2012/dec/66543_pendeltag-2012-christer.jpg

Another thing is that partial low floor vehicles seem to be pretty much standard among new commuter trains. That is because old trains used to have some steps inside and that is something companies and authorities to get rid with. Is this an issue in the US as well? What is the solution there? Are platform levels simply much higher so that trains don't need to be low floor but still barrier free? I guess if you have to rebuild sytems from scratch you can take care of such things quite easily.


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## CNB30 (Jun 4, 2012)

I happen to find modern LRT systems very modern looking, compared with other forms of rail though. 

Norfolk









Seattle









Minneapolis









Updated green line cars in Boston (coming 2017)


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## Nexarc (Jan 23, 2013)

Slartibartfas said:


> Another thing is that partial low floor vehicles seem to be pretty much standard among new commuter trains. That is because old trains used to have some steps inside and that is something companies and authorities to get rid with. Is this an issue in the US as well? What is the solution there? Are platform levels simply much higher so that trains don't need to be low floor but still barrier free? I guess if you have to rebuild sytems from scratch you can take care of such things quite easily.


All (completely) new rail lines are required by federal law [Americans with Disabilities Act 1990] to have level boarding for the elderly/disabled. However, many systems in the US are using legacy track-age and/or historical rolling stock so tend to have wildly different standards. So you can see different platform vs floor heights from region to region. Combined with relatively poor funding and politico-cultural mayhem leads to only a handful of new compliant lines or retrofitting of older ones.


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## BoulderGrad (Jun 29, 2005)

Visited Denver just this past weekend. Strange/interesting but kind cool thing about the new Union Station: I got a quick tour on a Saturday night and the place was absolutely packed. BUT I'd say that 99% of the people in there weren't there because they were waiting for the train. The Terminal Bar had a line out the door, and most people sitting in the waiting area had drinks and food. Only saw 1 person there with a suitcase, and there was an Amtrak train in the station.

Is that a good thing or not? It'll be even cooler when the airport line and all the other commuter lines are finished.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

^^ I think its a good sign, according to you the station is full of life, already now. Without high speed rail there are not a lot of big potential rail destination within reach and high speed rail is not going to be a reality anytime soon if ever. Because of Denver's location the airport ist the door to the world and as you said, with the connection to the airport also the trolley guys will finally arrive at Union Station. 

@Nexarc
Sounds complicated. But systematic level boarding isn't a reality in much of Europe either so far. 

@CNB30
Yes, those new light rail systems look nice and modern. But I was having the Denver light rail in mind which looks very conservative.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

In NYC, outside of rush hours, a good half of the folks in Grand Central are not there to catch a train. The same cannot be said of Penn Station, where close to 100% of visitors are there for transport-related purposes.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

I don't think stations should be "destinations" other than tranportation facilities and some ancillary services. It creates unnecessary crowds and safety hazards to have a lot of drunk people near a place active platforms!

---------------

Does RTA have a FTA waiver regarding current light rail operations?


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## prageethSL (May 5, 2013)

Union Station 













































http://www.latimes.com/travel/la-tr-d-denver-main-20151213-story.html


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## Nexis (Aug 7, 2007)

*3rd Quarter 2015 Ridership numbers for Denver*

*Light Rail*
Denver / RTD LRT - 83,000 (2015) : 0.24% +

*Bus Ridership*
Denver / RTD Bus - 252,200 (2015) : 1.89%


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## prageethSL (May 5, 2013)




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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

Hi, guys! This thread is now renamed into *DENVER | LRT*, so we would like to post articles and photos of LRT only. For Denver commuter rail and buses, see and post on these threads please. Thanks for your attention


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## Nexis (Aug 7, 2007)

*4th Quarter 2015 Ridership numbers for Denver*

*Light Rail*
Denver / RTD LRT - 76,600 (2015) : -10.88%


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

^^ Oh my god. Thats a rock slide change, in the wrong direction.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

Construction has begun on southeast rail extension (2.3 miles, 3 stations, set to open in 2019)

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_29873168/work-begins-rtds-southeast-light-rail-line-extension

http://www.rtd-fastracks.com/se_1


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## ramakrishna1984 (Jun 21, 2013)

The project will add to Colorado's growing transit system by expanding light-rail service south of Denver.


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## Nexis (Aug 7, 2007)

*1st Quarter 2016 LRT Ridership numbers for Denver*

*Light Rail*
Denver / RTD LRT - 79,600 (2016) : 4.65%


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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

From Railway Gazette:



> http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/news/n-america/single-view/view/denver-r-line-testing-begins.html
> 
> *Denver R Line testing begins*
> 21 Jul 2016
> ...


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## Tågälskaren (May 9, 2005)

*A Denver Suburb Bets Big on Free Lyft Rides to Light Rail *

Dial-a-ride services have long been one of the most common answers to transit’s “first-and-last-mile” problem, especially in low-density areas underserved by buses and trains[...]


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## Tågälskaren (May 9, 2005)

*‘R’ is for almost ready to roll light rail in Aurora*

AURORA | Residents are starting to see the train roll down the tracks before the Aurora “R” line opens this winter[...]


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

An R Line light rail train (left) and University of Colorado A Line commuter train sit next to each other at Peoria Station

http://www3.rtd-denver.com/elbert/news/index.cfm?id=8867


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

*RTD says the G line to Arvada, Wheat Ridge is on hold until A line issues are fixed
*



> . . .
> Despite the ongoing challenges, RTD still promises an on-time rollout of the G line.
> 
> "We are still targeting a fall of 2016 opening date," said Genova.
> . . .


http://www.thedenverchannel.com/new...line-is-on-hold-until-a-line-issues-are-fixed


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

2nd Avenue & Abilene station on the "R" line in Aurora, Colorado, USA - opening later this year.

IMG_1452 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

IMG_1410 by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

"R" line stations opening this upcoming winter

Fitzsimmons Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Fitzsimmons Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Fitzsimmons Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

2nd and Abilene Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

2nd and Abilene Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

2nd and Abilene Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

2nd and Abilene Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

2nd and Abilene Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

2nd and Abilene Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

13th Avenue Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

13th Avenue Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

13th Avenue Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

13th Avenue Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

13th Avenue Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Colfax Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Nine Mile Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Nine Mile Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Nine Mile Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Nine Mile Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Nine Mile Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Nine Mile Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr

Nine Mile Station by Regional Transportation District, on Flickr


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## Folls (Jul 15, 2012)

Quite curious that the elaborate structure built over the platform doesn't protect the passengers from weather.


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## CCs77 (Jul 30, 2008)

Folls said:


> Quite curious that the elaborate structure built over the platform doesn't protect the passengers from weather.


Yeah, indeed. It is kind of a waste to make such an elaborate structure that provides so little protection for the passengers, I don't think it would cost so much more to provide a more decent shelter for the passengers. Maybe even the same if they'd choose to make a less elaborate, but more functional structure, that could have looked great too. And pretty much, most of the stations seem to provide little shelter, I don't know why they do that.

Anyway, The APTA ridership report for the second quarter has been released, with the new commuter system of Denver making its debut on the report. Since line A was opened during the second quarter (april 22nd) making the count incomplete, I take the total ridership for june, that is 501400 passengers. That puts the system just in the top ten, behind of Baltimore, on the 9th place with 845300, and ahead of Salt Lake and Seattle, that are prectically tied on the 11th place at around 370000 (some months SLC is ahead and others is Seattle, although Seattle reports a higher weekday ridership and a much greater growth)


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## dwdwone (May 7, 2004)

Since Denver is just east of the Great Divide, I was wondering how many hilly sections the light rail has to contend with.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

"*Opening of RTD’s R Line through Aurora pushed back to January at earliest*"

http://www.aurorasentinel.com/news/...gh-aurora-pushed-back-to-january-at-earliest/


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## etooley1985 (Aug 7, 2016)

Denver is actually very flat. It's surrounded by mountains, and at a very high altitude.


dwdwone said:


> Since Denver is just east of the Great Divide, I was wondering how many hilly sections the light rail has to contend with.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

dwdwone said:


> Since Denver is just east of the Great Divide, I was wondering how many hilly sections the light rail has to contend with.


All areas served by light rail, present of future, are the the flat bottoms of the Front Range. Denver is for all geographic purposes a Great Plains metro area like Kansas City or St Louis, only that one of its sides (west) has a massive and gigantic mountain range.


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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

Official from RTD

http://www3.rtd-denver.com/elbert/news/index.cfm?id=9326

*NEW LIGHT RAIL SERVICE ON THE R LINE OPENS FEBRUARY 24TH*
Posted on 01.30.17










The R Line will open for service on Friday, Feb. 24, 2017, bringing light rail through the heart of Aurora.

The new light rail R Line (formerly known as the Aurora Line/I-225 Rail during construction) extends service from the existing Nine Mile Station north 10.5-miles to Peoria Station connecting to the University of Colorado A Line to Denver International Airport. The full R Line service will travel 22 miles from the Lincoln Station to Peoria Station. This project also extends RTD’s current H Line from Nine Mile to the new Florida Station. It will be the fourth transit line RTD will open within the last fourteen months

...


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## dimlys1994 (Dec 19, 2010)

From Denver Post

http://www.denverpost.com/2017/02/23/rtd-r-line-begins-aurora-denver-lone-tree-free/

*RTD R-Line begins service Friday to Aurora, Denver and Lone Tree — and you can ride for free*
February 23, 2017 at 6:14 pm










The Regional Transportation District’s R-Line will begin train service Friday morning to Aurora, Denver and Lone Tree.

Patrons can ride the line for free between 11 a.m. and 9 p.m.

A ribbon cutting will be 10 a.m. and 11 a.m. at the Iliff Station on Blackhawk Street at Iliff Avenue

...


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

A proposed rejiggering of the network would see the D train turn back in downtown Denver instead of heading to the Curtis Park/Five Points area northeast of Downtown. A new service, the L train, would run between this area and downtown using the current D train tracks.

The C train will become the main service for the Littleton division and will run to Union Station at all times.

This may happen as soon as August if the necessary signals are in place by then.




























https://www.denverite.com/rtds-planned-new-light-rail-line-could-save-3-million-year-36659/

http://rtd.iqm2.com/Citizens/FileOpen.aspx?Type=1&ID=2563&Inline=True


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

^^ The rejiggering has been deferred for now.

http://www.rtd-denver.com/servicechanges-august2017.shtml


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## Tom 958 (Apr 24, 2007)

$4.7 billion is a lot of money.

*Denver Built Up Its Public Transit, but Where Are All the Riders?
Thirteen years after a vote that poured resources into transportation, most residents haven’t changed their habits.

ANDREW SMALL NOV 4, 2017*

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/11/denver-transit-riders/544820/

Denver punches above its weight when it comes to mass transit: It has the eighth-largest rail system in the United States, radiating out of what’s only the 19th most populous American city.

That’s because of a program called FasTracks. In 2004, in an attempt to cool congestion and prepare for growth, Denver and communities in seven surrounding counties voted to expand public transit to the tune of $4.7 billion, adding 122 miles of commuter, light-rail, and bus-rapid-transit lines across the region by 2018.

Since then, the Regional Transportation District (RTD) has undergone a transformation: Where once only a few rail lines served a handful of suburbs, train tracks and bus rapid-transit corridors now extend in all directions, from Boulder (28 miles northwest of Denver’s downtown) to Aurora (11 miles east) to Jefferson County (26 miles west), with downtown Denver’s Union Station serving as the central hub. Seven projects are complete, and five are still on the way.

But the expansion plan, which led CityLab to once call Denver “the most advanced transit city in the west,” has yet to translate into greater transit ridership, or even reduced use of cars. In 2006, John Hickenlooper, then the mayor of Denver, described a hope that the city would reach 20 percent ridership by 2020. But in 2016, only 6 percent of people in Denver used public transit as part of their commute to work.

The Great Recession’s impact on sales-tax revenue for FasTracks did delay construction. But even the existing lines have seen a decline recently, even as the economy rebounds. From 2010 to 2015, the system’s per-capita boardings were down 4 percent. (Impressively, though, vehicle miles traveled went up 12 percent.)

So where did the grand plan fall short? We asked three people: a transportation advocate, an RTD spokesperson, and a public-transit consultant. Here’s what they said.

The trends in Denver fit with the national picture: From 2014 to 2016, transit ridership declined 4.5 percent across the U.S., while vehicle miles traveled have increased steadily in recent years, thanks mainly to cheap gas prices and the economy’s uptick.


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## phoenixboi08 (Dec 6, 2009)

Tom 958 said:


> $4.7 billion is a lot of money.


It's ~$40/mi. I don't really know that it's necessarily all that much money, comparatively.


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

Newly redesigned Denver LRT and commuter rail map, now showing the "L" train as a separate service (beginning this Sunday) as well as express bus service to Boulder, known as Flatiron Flyer.










bigger image available here: http://www.rtd-denver.com/img/map/rail-fare-map.pdf


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## ssiguy2 (Feb 19, 2005)

Small wonder the LRT hasn't been drawing in the crowds they were hoping for, those frequencies are horrible.


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## DeaconG (Mar 4, 2014)

ssiguy2 said:


> Small wonder the LRT hasn't been drawing in the crowds they were hoping for, those frequencies are horrible.


10 minute frequencies peak/20 minute frequencies off-peak would probably work better, but I don't think they thought that far ahead.

When I grew up in Philly, peak times for buses and rail was 6-8 minutes, off-peak was approximately 12-15 minutes, so catching the bus or subway wasn't a total inconvenience (plus 80 percent of the routes ran 24/7).

Then I spent time in DC and the bus frequencies were 20 minutes peak and up to 60 minutes off-peak-WHAT? And they wondered why no one would use the damn buses?

I'll bet their off-peaks are at least 30-60 minutes, which will insure people on off-shifts take their vehicles. They have to do better than that.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

Forgive my ignorance. it was probably mentioned somewhere before but I can't find it. 

What is the frequency of the Denver LRT and Commuter rail network? Peak and off peak as well as night and weekend?


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

Construction of RidgeGate Parkway station in Lone Tree, Colorado - southeast extension of light rail.





































Source: Denver Post (https://www.denverpost.com/2018/08/23/lone-tree-affordable-housing-and-light-rail/)


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## kLumpel (Aug 24, 2018)

^^Looks like there is nothing around the station...


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

^^ update on this upcoming stretch of LRT track:

"*Denver RTD to begin testing Southeast light-rail extension*"

https://www.progressiverailroading....testing-Southeast-light-rail-extension--56025


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## Woonsocket54 (May 7, 2005)

^^ Southeast LRT extension opens 2019.05.19










http://www.rtd-denver.com/e-f-line-extension.shtml


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## NickABQ (Jun 6, 2007)

kLumpel said:


> ^^Looks like there is nothing around the station...


This is an extension into mostly newer greenfield development areas which will serve mostly park and ride commuters. 

There is a large medical center complex, regional big-box retail, and quite a bit of housing. Unfortunately, it is not in a very walkable area at all. hno:


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## hkskyline (Sep 13, 2002)

RT Denver 293 by Michael Taylor, on Flickr


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