# POTENTIAL HOSTS OF FUTURE FIFA CLUB WORLD CUPS



## HDI 0.548 (Dec 28, 2015)

The expansion of the FIFA Club World Cup to 24 teams make it an outlet for countries that would not be competitive bidders for a World Cup to host a major FIFA Men's football event. And FIFA will be eager to use it as a way to increase its presence in Club Football. Regions outside Europe will be most interested in getting a share of that pie of Club Football Globalization. 

After China, I think the tournament will go to the USA and then I could see Africa being very interested in hosting it. The Club World Cup requires at least 6 stadiums which is now the Standard for the expanded Africa Cup of Nations. I could see the following bids going by today's readiness (even for a bid in 2025):

SOUTH AFRICA - 8 venues
1. Soccer City 90k
2. Cape Town 55k
3. Moses Mabhida 55k
4. Loftus Versfeld 50k
5. Nelson Mandela Bay 45k
6. Peter Mokaba Stadium 40k
7. Mbombela Stadium 40k
8. Orlando Stadium 40k

MOROCCO - 7 Venues
1. Mohammed V 60k
2. Moulay Abdellah 50k
3. Marrakech 45k
4. Agadir 45k
5. Tangier 45k
6. Fez 45k
7. Tetouan 45k (UC) 

ALGERIA - 8 venues
1. July 5 Algiers 60k
2. May 19 Annaba 50k
3. Tizi Ouzou 50k (UC) 
4. Baraki Algiers 40k (UC) 
5. Oran Stadium 40k (UC) 
6. Constantine 40k
7. Sidi Bel Abbès 40k
8. Blida 35k


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## Ramanaramana (Mar 24, 2021)

You have to love the politics in football. 

French paper Le Monde reporting that FIFA was actively involved in the Super League plans. A summary from Reddit user Esthereum.....



> > A 10-page note, consulted by Le Monde, summarises confidential information on the Super League compiled by several European clubs.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This shouldn't surprise anyone. FIFA supports the Super League if it means the clubs play in their expanded Club World Cup. 

FIFA wants continental leagues that feed into their global tournament. 

UEFA wants to maintain control of the competition that the biggest European clubs play in. The biggest European clubs want to wrest control from UEFA. And FIFA is happy to support either side as long it gets them their expanded club world cup. Something needs to give as the arm wrestle for the control of competitions is becoming tedious.


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## HDI 0.548 (Dec 28, 2015)

Ramanaramana said:


> You have to love the politics in football.
> 
> French paper Le Monde reporting that FIFA was actively involved in the Super League plans. A summary from Reddit user Esthereum.....
> 
> ...


I don't see anything wrong with the Super League. It is pathetic that club football globally exists to serve uncompetitive Filler European Clubs. There is no reason why a club like West Brom should be able to buy a player from Al Ahly other than the fact that they enjoy the unearned privilege of losing to the so called Big Six. West Brom has not contributed in any meaningful way to the global appeal of European football


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## Ramanaramana (Mar 24, 2021)

HDI 0.548 said:


> I don't see anything wrong with the Super League. It is pathetic that club football globally exists to serve uncompetitive Filler European Clubs. There is no reason why a club like West Brom should be able to buy a player from Al Ahly other than the fact that they enjoy the unearned privilege of losing to the so called Big Six. West Brom has not contributed in any meaningful way to the global appeal of European football


I'm with you. 

The Super League proposal was bungled though. It bothers me how stupid the clubs involved were. All they needed to do was say yep we're gonna have promotion and relegation and no permanent members and 95% of the outrage would have been prevented. They needed to play the slow game, but instead tried to do everything at once. 

The first step should've been to set up a European pyramid system under UEFA's control, including as many as many clubs as you want, and to promise FIFA that the biggest clubs would play in their new Club World Cup. 

Once that's set up, you can come back in 10 years' time and start to pull up the drawbridge on the smaller clubs in the same way that the Premier League did with the Football League. It would have kept UEFA and FIFA onside, and gone done much better with fans.


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## HDI 0.548 (Dec 28, 2015)

Ramanaramana said:


> I'm with you.
> 
> The Super League proposal was bungled though. It bothers me how stupid the clubs involved were. All they needed to do was say yep we're gonna have promotion and relegation and no permanent members and 95% of the outrage would have been prevented. They needed to play the slow game, but instead tried to do everything at once.
> 
> ...


I have been following this issue closely for 5 years. The Super League had one big challenge - the success of the Premier League. The incentive for Premier League teams just isn't there considering the reputational risk. And you remember that the Premier League rebranded, removed the title sponsor to become like NFL, Champions League, etc. Premier League also has the card of Celtics and Rangers to play. They are also open to new investors in other clubs besides the big 6 and can reduce number of teams to concentrate talent. 

Easing it through only benefits the Premier League. The Continental European Leagues are on their way to irrelevance. They needed to do this abruptly. What they messed up is not bringing in a sustained media campaign prior in order to split fan support when they eventually promoted it.


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## Ramanaramana (Mar 24, 2021)

HDI 0.548 said:


> I have been following this issue closely for 5 years. The Super League had one big challenge - the success of the Premier League. The incentive for Premier League teams just isn't there considering the reputational risk. And you remember that the Premier League rebranded, removed the title sponsor to become like NFL, Champions League, etc. Premier League also has the card of Celtics and Rangers to play. They are also open to new investors in other clubs besides the big 6 and can reduce number of teams to concentrate talent.
> 
> Easing it through only benefits the Premier League. The Continental European Leagues are on their way to irrelevance. They needed to do this abruptly. What they messed up is not bringing in a sustained media campaign prior in order to split fan support when they eventually promoted it.


I think it's no surprise that Project Big Picture and this Super League have reared their head now. People will say it's because of the pandemic blah blah but in truth it's because the broadcast revenue is stalling. The Premier League's last rights deal went for a bit less than the previous one in Britain. Where once the Premier League clubs couldn't care less about the Super League because their broadcast revenues were rising and destroying their peers in Europe, now that growth has stalled they're seeking new ways to grow broadcast revenues themselves.

That the big English clubs were involved prominently supports the argument that they no longer see the success of the PL over the others as enough.

There is no way that I can see that the big clubs can ever get what they want without UEFA and FIFA's initial support. I understand that UEFA needs the big clubs more than the clubs need them, but they still need their backing. UEFA would love a Super League under their control, but they can't just tell the rest of Europe's clubs to get nicked, so some kind of open system has to be in play.

That's why I reckon Perez and company will come back with another proposal that includes no permanent status and relegation. There's no threat to the biggest clubs getting relegated in a 20 team league anyway. That's the only way they're getting UEFA's backing. UEFA has to control the competition, and it has to be an open system to an extent. Anything else is wasting time.

Having said all that, if the English clubs had waited more than 2 bloody days before pulling out, the anger would've died down. They reacted on emotion. Most of the threats they were receiving were horseshit, and would never amount to anything. They bottled it and set the project back god knows how long. Some fans would've given up on them, the 'football is dead' brigade would've been out in force, but the minute the Super League started playing things would begin to turn in their favour.


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## pesto (Jun 29, 2009)

Wow. Most impressive discussion I've read outside of investor services.

In brief, everyone (UEFA, FIFA, the EPL, 1000 investor groups, etc.) knows what changes are coming. The main issue is how to maximize your benefits in the new world.


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## Ramanaramana (Mar 24, 2021)

pesto said:


> Wow. Most impressive discussion I've read outside of investor services.
> 
> In brief, everyone (UEFA, FIFA, the EPL, 1000 investor groups, etc.) knows what changes are coming. The main issue is how to maximize your benefits in the new world.


I think they will come to an agreement eventually, as the writing has been on the wall for some time. My only fear is that it’ll be a half-baked compromise. Now is the time to blow up everything and start again. 

In the leaked proposal, it’s been revealed that clubs wanted to get rid of international windows during the season. It was a root and branch proposal to reshape the entire calendar effectively. Exactly what’s needed. 

England needs to join the rest of Europe in having one only domestic cup competition. France just got rid of their league cup. Time to follow suit. Would free up 5 matchdays.

No more Uefa Super Cups and Community Shields as season curtain raisers, freeing up 2 matchdays.

The big leagues should all have 18 teams, and maybe even 16, which would free up 4 or 8 matchdays respectively. This wouldn’t affect broadcast deals as much as some think because most big leagues have 5 or 6 broadcast timeslots in any given week anyway, not 10. 

Internationals shouldnt disrupt leagues. Push them to end of season, and play matches in a 4-8 week block.

European world cup and Euros qualification needs an overhaul. Introduce pre qualifiers to weed out absolute trash so that Germany doesnt have to play San Marino ever again. No more than 8 matches to qualify for either world cup or euros.

You can them have a continental Champions League/Super League that has 23 matches for the winner.

All up that’s 62 club matches for a club that wins all 3 competitions, plus 8 international matches, which is in line with what the best players manage to get through today. 

Making the 5 subs rule permanent would also help smooth things out. 

As for fifas club world cup, that would add 6 matches every four years to schedule, though this can be compensated for by having fewer internationals during that year, in he same way there are fewer internationals during a world cup year. 

That’s just one solution, and there are many others. The good news is that it seems all parties understand there is need for an overhaul. The politicking is tedious as hell, but it’s obvious the calendar will look very different soon enough, whatever shape it takes.


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## HDI 0.548 (Dec 28, 2015)

pesto said:


> Wow. Most impressive discussion I've read outside of investor services.
> 
> In brief, everyone (UEFA, FIFA, the EPL, 1000 investor groups, etc.) knows what changes are coming. The main issue is how to maximize your benefits in the new world.


The continental European leagues just sat on their bums when Premier League was opening up to the world. Their league feels cosmopolitan and inviting to the whole world. La Liga had the biggest persnlonalities in terms of players (Messi, Ronaldo) and coaches (Mourinho and Guardiola) yet they didn't take advantage of it. The complacency was surreal. Now they see the future and get scared. With status quo it will be similar to basketball, where if you want to watch Basketball you watch NBA. Premier League will take this position. Not even the reformed Champions League can compete with because it is a weekday competition.


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## Ramanaramana (Mar 24, 2021)

La Liga did take some advantage as Real and Barca became far and away the biggest clubs in the world on the back of Messi and Ron. 

The PL can never be the NBA because massive clubs exist in other leagues. That won't change. The Champions League/Super League is the only way that happens.


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## HDI 0.548 (Dec 28, 2015)

Ramanaramana said:


> La Liga did take some advantage as Real and Barca became far and away the biggest clubs in the world on the back of Messi and Ron.
> 
> The PL can never be the NBA because massive clubs exist in other leagues. That won't change. The Champions League/Super League is the only way that happens.


Real Madrid and Barca are not far and away the biggest. Man Utd has always been in that top 3 of clubs. In fact Premier League has 5 clubs following this order that are bigger than the 3rd most important team in Spain. 

The Premier League is already bigger than the Champions League in broadcast appeal And following. La Liga cannot attain relevance of the early 2010s anymore while Premier League gets bigger with the stature of clubs like Everton, Leicester and West Jan increasing. They will be able to buy all good players outside the other 6-8 Super League level teams.


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## pesto (Jun 29, 2009)

HDI 0.548 said:


> Real Madrid and Barca are not far and away the biggest. Man Utd has always been in that top 3 of clubs. In fact Premier League has 5 clubs following this order that are bigger than the 3rd most important team in Spain.
> 
> The Premier League is already bigger than the Champions League in broadcast appeal And following. La Liga cannot attain relevance of the early 2010s anymore while Premier League gets bigger with the stature of clubs like Everton, Leicester and West Jan increasing. They will be able to buy all good players outside the other 6-8 Super League level teams.


I think that is right, but what happened is that 10 years ago Man U was regularly larger than RM and Barca, but those two have now caught up and surpassed it. Each of them is well ahead of the next largest club (Bayern) and several EPL members.

But for sure investors are looking at the smaller EPL clubs in hopes of showing they belong in whatever version of top-tier league eventually emerges.


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## Temporarily Exiled (Sep 12, 2018)

Can we please, for once, talk about _stadiums_?


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## Ramanaramana (Mar 24, 2021)

HDI 0.548 said:


> Real Madrid and Barca are not far and away the biggest. Man Utd has always been in that top 3 of clubs. In fact Premier League has 5 clubs following this order that are bigger than the 3rd most important team in Spain.
> 
> The Premier League is already bigger than the Champions League in broadcast appeal And following. La Liga cannot attain relevance of the early 2010s anymore while Premier League gets bigger with the stature of clubs like Everton, Leicester and West Jan increasing. They will be able to buy all good players outside the other 6-8 Super League level teams.


Check out social media figures across the big platforms. Real and Barca squash United, which is 3rd biggest. They are so far ahead of everyone it's mental.

Comparing CL and PL is unfair as one plays every week, and has the lucrative weekend timeslots. Whenever CL plays, globally interest for that week easily beats any domestic league.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

*Mod Note:* Guys, we're getting a run on complaints about Super League chatter. If you want to get into discussion about that, or a measuring contest about club vs club, you have to take that to its own thread. 

And, yes, I know there isn't much to talk about in select threads but that's not justification for derailing them. From now on, Super League banter goes into its own thread, of which there are several across the board.


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