# Skyways, time for a come-back?



## Somnifor (Sep 6, 2005)

Skyways are good for going on long walks when it is -20 outside, other than that I am not a big fan. Minneapolis has an extensive skyway system but people only use it in the winter, when the weather is nice they would rather be outside.

Apparently it is pretty common for banks on the skyway level in Minneapolis to be robbed because the skyways make it easier for robbers to get away quickly.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

I think, at least in moderate climate, that skyways make only sense in very limited fashion, like establishing shortcuts around otherwise rather pedestrian hostile situations around public transportation hubs etc. Also skyways connecting separate buildings of the same cluster makes sense. 

But Skyways should not be an excuse for creating needlessly pedestrian hostile street environments.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

^^ How can a skyway, whose footprint is minimal (shadow etc), create a pedestrian-hostile environment on streets if they are high above ground?


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

The chief reasons assigned by urban planners for skywalk development are:-

(1) Pedestrian safety and convenience

(2) Decrease of traffic congestion

(3) Reduction in vehicular air pollution 

(4) Separation of people from vehicular noise. 


Also, skywalks are an invaluable urban amenity in urban areas characterized by extreme temperatures (cold / heat) or by extreme precipitation (oppressive humidity, snowfall, rainfall).

Skywalks are not meaningful in low-density suburban residential areas.


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## Dimethyltryptamine (Aug 22, 2009)

Suburbanist said:


> ^^ How can a skyway, whose footprint is minimal (shadow etc), create a pedestrian-hostile environment on streets if they are high above ground?


because, it like, totally encourages rape and graffiti and violent crimes in general. yep. they should be illegal. send them out of the city, along with the ethnics.


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## musiccity (Jan 5, 2011)

We don't have any indoor skyways in my city that I know of. I'm sure they would be popular though. I'd rather walk in a skyway than some nasty street where I'm being harrassed by beggars. If my city cleans up then there would be no reason for them as the climate is mild. (With the exception of summer)


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## travelworld123 (Sep 24, 2008)

skyways are awesome in terms of how it creates another dimension of urban movement and creates and even more vibrant city.

Just look at Hong Kong for example: *(watch from 2:40)*






It makes it feel like a real, bustling metropolis


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## Somnifor (Sep 6, 2005)

The Minneapolis skyway system always reminds me of a giant habitrail for office workers.


mplsfeb201126 by afsmps, on Flickr


mplsfeb201132 by afsmps, on Flickr


The Habitrail. by _Yoshi_, on Flickr


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

megacity30 said:


> The chief reasons assigned by urban planners for skyway development are:-
> 
> (1) Pedestrian safety and convenience
> 
> ...


Also, skyways (for pedestrians) are synonymous to freeways (for automobiles) obviating the need to halt at traffic lights / signals.


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

travelworld123 said:


> skyways are awesome in terms of how it creates another dimension of urban movement and creates and even more vibrant city.
> 
> Just look at Hong Kong for example: *(watch from 2:40)*
> 
> It makes it feel like a real, bustling metropolis


Vibrant video and excellent choice indeed, travelworld123!

This video clearly shows the busy skyways in the background with busy pedestrian activity at the street level in the foreground. 

The largest skyway networks in the world today are in *Minneapolis - Saint Paul* (USA) and *Calgary* (Canada). 

I couldn't find any prominent skyways in South & Central America, Mexico, Africa, West & Central Asia, Indonesia, Philippines, mainland China, Japan etc. Does anyone know of any skyways in these regions?

Other prominent skyway networks (including both discontinuous and continuous networks) in the world are in the following urban areas:-

I. North America

USA: *Des Moines, Cedar Rapids, Duluth, Rochester (MN), Rochester (NY), Dallas, Houston, Detroit, Atlanta, Cincinnati, Indianapolis, Fargo, Grand Rapids, Milwaukee, Oklahoma City, Paradise, Pittsburgh, Sioux City, Spokane, Kansas City (Crown Center)*

Canada: *Edmonton, Winnipeg, Toronto*


II. Europe

Belgium: *Vilvoorde* 

UK: *London, Manchester Airport, University of Leeds
*
Switzerland: *Interlaken
*
Germany: *Munich*


III. South Asia

India: *Mumbai*


IV. South-East Asia

Thailand: *Bangkok*

Malaysia: *Kuala Lumpur (Petronas Twin Towers)*


V. East Asia

China: *Hong Kong*


VI. Oceania

Australia: *Melbourne*


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## kaligraffi (Aug 20, 2011)

musiccity said:


> We don't have any indoor skyways in my city that I know of. I'm sure they would be popular though. I'd rather walk in a skyway than some nasty street where I'm being harrassed by beggars. If my city cleans up then there would be no reason for them as the climate is mild. (With the exception of summer)


I think it would be a superior solution to provide housing and employment for beggars rather than trying to construct one's way away from them.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

kaligraffi said:


> I think it would be a superior solution to provide housing and employment for beggars rather than trying to construct one's way away from them.


You can't just "provide employment", people must have some function to perform.

In any case, most beggars and homeless ppl in developed countries have mental problems and other conditions than merely total inability to get minimal income or welfare support. Not all, but the majority of them.


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## Jonesy55 (Jul 30, 2004)

megacity30 said:


> UK: London, Manchester Airport, University of Leeds


Also, not a network but a single skyway bridge, is this one in Manchester city centre.










Which was built on the same site of this earlier concrete one that was demolished following the 1996 terrorist bomb attack. The truck containing the bomb was parked directly underneath it...










Note the red postbox on the left which survived the bomb unscathed and is pretty much the only unchanged feature on the street now.


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## Slartibartfas (Aug 15, 2006)

Suburbanist said:


> ^^ How can a skyway, whose footprint is minimal (shadow etc), create a pedestrian-hostile environment on streets if they are high above ground?


You misunderstood me. That was not what I said. It would be only pedestrian hostile if the on street infrastructure for pedestrians would be degraded as a response. I did not even say that there is a causal link, which it is not. But some planners like to use skyways as an excuse for doing exactly that and it is what I opposed above. 

I usually prefer on the street movement personally unless the skyway gives some great advantage due to topography etc. (bridging a valley or complicated locations)


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## ssiguy2 (Feb 19, 2005)

Although I do appreciate the concern that people have about skyways talking the life out of pedestrian areas, that argument is irrelevant when it's -20C. When it's that cold people wouldn't go outside regardless. In fact they wouldn't even leave their own building so skyways help to increase pedestrian flow in a comfortable way. 
People only use the skyways when the weather for the day is to cold/rainy/snowy to go outside anyway. 
When the weather is fine people ussually avoid them and get out and enjoy the day. Calgary's system is massive yet right beside the very high office density of it's core is Canada's most successful pedestrian mall which is packed throughout the day with shopping, cafes, restaurants, musicians, and nightlife..........the 8th Ave pedestrian mall.
Contrary to some may think they do NOT cost the cities a cent as they are required to be built as part of the planning approval of the building itself. The construction, upkeep, and heating/cooling costs are born 100% by the private owners of the buildings. The city also sets minimum hours they must be maintained. Most major systems are closed all day Sunday but are ussually open on Saturday for shoppers whether they have a connected mall or not. The owners also cannot just shut their skyway down at 4:30pm if their particular business stops at that time. When you are building application is approved with the skyway part of the agreement is that you must maintain your part of the system for not only your building but for the entire network within reason business hours.


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## poshbakerloo (Jan 16, 2007)

Skyways and tunnels are only good in countries with extreme climates 40c+ in summer -20c and below in the winter. Where its too hot or cold to walk around outside. In any other city with a comfortable climate such as London, Paris, New York etc, there is no use for them. They just cut people off from the outside area and give everywhere at street level an abandoned look. Not nice. The whole 'streets in the sky' thing was all over the UK in the 1960s but by the later 70s people grew to hate them.


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## musiccity (Jan 5, 2011)

kaligraffi said:


> I think it would be a superior solution to provide housing and employment for beggars rather than trying to construct one's way away from them.


:blahblah: Typical overly liberal comment. It's not that simple.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

megacity30 said:


> Other prominent skyway networks (including both discontinuous and continuous networks) in the world are in the following urban areas:-
> 
> I. North America
> 
> ...


Chicago also has underground pedestrian walkways.


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

diablo234 said:


> Chicago also has underground pedestrian walkways.


 Chicago has skyways too; nice!!


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## bayviews (Mar 3, 2006)

poshbakerloo said:


> Skyways and tunnels are only good in countries with extreme climates 40c+ in summer -20c and below in the winter. Where its too hot or cold to walk around outside. In any other city with a comfortable climate such as London, Paris, New York etc, there is no use for them. They just cut people off from the outside area and give everywhere at street level an abandoned look. Not nice. The whole 'streets in the sky' thing was all over the UK in the 1960s but by the later 70s people grew to hate them.


I know that many trendy planner types deride them....But 

Pedestrian skyways & tunnels have proven very successful in cold weather winter cities like the Minnesota Twins, Toronto, etc & hot weather summer cities like Houston & Dallas, etc. 

Consider what happened to one cold weather "winter city" without any comprehensive skyway/tunnel system: 

Buffalo: Very little pedestrian traffic downtown, particularly not in winter


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## ssiguy2 (Feb 19, 2005)

I prefer skyways to underground tunnels as they are brighter and you don't feel as isolated from the street.


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## kaligraffi (Aug 20, 2011)

Suburbanist said:


> You can't just "provide employment", people must have some function to perform.
> 
> In any case, most beggars and homeless ppl in developed countries have mental problems and other conditions than merely total inability to get minimal income or welfare support. Not all, but the majority of them.


Of course you can provide employment, homeless people are _not only_ capable of working a job, a lot of them are actually _working jobs while they're homeless_. But don't let that get in the way of your ignorant, childish nonsense...no other facts ever have. :lol:

As for "mental problems and other conditions", I note with little surprise your idea that the mentally ill should be thrown out onto the street without so much as a blanket and a cup of soup. That you have nothing to support your claims is just the icing on the cake (you know, what people without bread are supposed to eat :lol. But moving on, the root cause is poverty and the unemployment or underemployment which feeds it. It shows quite well that, as usual, you know absolutely nothing about the issue and are just here to waive your misanthropic rubbish around in other, more rational people's faces.


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## Nexis (Aug 7, 2007)

Suburbanist said:


> Manhattan of all places for instance! Canary Wharf and the City in London as well. Streets are too crowded over there.
> 
> I think major CBDs like La Defense could all do better with skyways.
> 
> Many Arab cities could well do with them.


Manhattan doesn't need skyways , we need more sidewalk space which is being done as we speak. We have underground passageways to connect the various subway stations....


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## intensivecarebear (Feb 2, 2006)

musiccity said:


> :blahblah: Typical overly liberal comment. It's not that simple.


Surely it's better than ignoring a problem and hoping it will go away. 

Anyway skyways are indeed useful in extreme climates.

But I suspect suburbanist's intent with bringing up this issue is simply due to a desire tp keep out what he considers to be "undesirables", i.e the poor, ethnic minorities, people who don't speak English, and the homeless.


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## musiccity (Jan 5, 2011)

They can take the sidewalk :troll:


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## city_thing (May 25, 2006)

megacity30 said:


> Vibrant video and excellent choice indeed, travelworld123!
> 
> This video clearly shows the busy skyways in the background with busy pedestrian activity at the street level in the foreground.
> 
> ...


Melbourne has a 'skyway'? Since when? I've lived here for years and haven't noticed it.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

I noticed that megacity30 left out Montreal as well. Supposedly it is the second largest system in existance after Toronto's.





































*Underground City, Montreal*


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## Dimethyltryptamine (Aug 22, 2009)

city_thing said:


> Melbourne has a 'skyway'? Since when? I've lived here for years and haven't noticed it.


I can only think of three, anyway. The Myer one over Little Bourke (which has been removed?), the one over Lonsdale St and the other over Little Lonsdale connecting Melbourne Central. Some network, eh!

They suck so I'm glad Melbourne doesn't have many!


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## Xusein (Sep 27, 2005)

One upside to skyways/tunnels is that they connect the indoors of many skyscrapers.


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## bayviews (Mar 3, 2006)

Xusein said:


> One upside to skyways/tunnels is that they connect the indoors of many skyscrapers.


Nearly all the "Winter Cities" I've seen that boast vibrant downtowns have either underground concourses like Montreal & Toronto; skyways like Minneapoplis & St. Paul; or subways with connecting underground corriders like Boston, Chicago, & Philly, and the larger Canadian cities. 

The vitality of Winter Cities without weather protection? 

Well, consider downtown Buffalo, Cleveland, Toledo, & Detroit, etc.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

bayviews said:


> Nearly all the "Winter Cities" I've seen that boast vibrant downtowns have either underground concourses like Montreal & Toronto; skyways like Minneapoplis & St. Paul; or subways with connecting underground corriders like Boston, Chicago, & Philly, and the larger Canadian cities.
> 
> The vitality of Winter Cities without weather protection?
> 
> Well, consider downtown Buffalo, Cleveland, Toledo, & Detroit, etc.


Boston and Philadelphia don't have underground/aboveground pedestrian walkways (and no the tunnels connecting the subway stations don't count).


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## earthJoker (Dec 15, 2004)

megacity30 said:


> Other prominent skyway networks (including both discontinuous and continuous networks) in the world are in the following urban areas:-
> 
> Switzerland: *Interlaken*


There is no skyway network in Interlaken. There might be a skyway between two buildings of a hotel, that's all.


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## Xusein (Sep 27, 2005)

bayviews said:


> Nearly all the "Winter Cities" I've seen that boast vibrant downtowns have either underground concourses like Montreal & Toronto; skyways like Minneapoplis & St. Paul; or subways with connecting underground corriders like Boston, Chicago, & Philly, and the larger Canadian cities.
> 
> The vitality of Winter Cities without weather protection?
> 
> Well, consider downtown Buffalo, Cleveland, Toledo, & Detroit, etc.



I don't see the correlation.

I don't even think the skyways/tunnels really add or take anything from a downtown. They are used as simple corridors really.


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## city_thing (May 25, 2006)

Dimethyltryptamine said:


> I can only think of three, anyway. The Myer one over Little Bourke (which has been removed?), the one over Lonsdale St and the other over Little Lonsdale connecting Melbourne Central. Some network, eh!
> 
> They suck so I'm glad Melbourne doesn't have many!


I can see how they're on benefit in cities with extreme climates like Dubai or Toronto - but Australian cities are mild in comparison and therefore don't need them.


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## Suburbanist (Dec 25, 2009)

Xusein said:


> I don't see the correlation.
> 
> I don't even think the skyways/tunnels really add or take anything from a downtown. They are used as simple corridors really.


They benefit downtown areas by attracting people who can move, undisturbed be harsh weather, through a vast number of buildings (which is where the majority of people going to an area during harsh weather goes: rarely people will just "go out to check the streets and sit a bench under a tree" when the temperatures are below zero, the air is hot and humid, or there is plenty of rain around.

In that way, skyways enable downtown areas to reap benefits normally associated with shopping malls: the ability to move around a relatively large area protected from outside weather.


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

city_thing said:


> Melbourne has a 'skyway'? Since when? I've lived here for years and haven't noticed it.


That's ok; Melbourne is a large urban area and it seems unlikely to have seen _everything_ in it.

For example, there's the pedestrian skyway (also called skybridge) linking the tennis facilities of the Melbourne Park with the Melbourne Cricket Ground (MCG). Here's a picture of this skyway:










source: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/06/Skybridge_btwn_Melbourne_Park_and_MCG.jpg


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

^^
Then there's the Myer Skybridge that spans Lonsdale Street to provide pedestrian access between Myer Melbourne and the Melbourne Central Shopping Centre. I didn't know it was torn down; can someone confirm that on a first-hand-basis?
Anyway, here are some pictures:-










source: http://farm1.static.flickr.com/202/517730931_73fbcd3376.jpg











source: http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2174/2227574699_8b438b607e.jpg


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

^^
Then there's also the Park Royal skybridge connecting the hotel district via Park Royal Hotel to the Melbourne Airport. Here are a few pictures-










source: http://web.travel.rakuten.co.jp/HOTEL/130762/130762.jpg











source: http://www.spicenews.com.au/image/PRMLA%20Hotel%20Exterior%20300.jpg

A few articles: http://melbourneairport.com.au/Flight-Passenger-Info/aiport-facilities/airport-hotels/parkroyal-melbourne-airport.html

http://hiltonhotelmelbourneairport.street-directory.com.au/


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## OtAkAw (Aug 5, 2004)

In Manila, there's an skyway system in use at the Central Business District of Makati, it's super effective I dunno why stupid politicians aren't planning to replicate its success in other business areas.


Makati's Elevated walkway by valiant300, on Flickr




















Walkway by Artu Nepomuceno | Open-Art Photography, on Flickr


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

earthJoker said:


> There is no skyway network in Interlaken. There might be a skyway between two buildings of a hotel, that's all.


Yes, you're correct there is no skyway network; however, Interlaken does have a skyway / skybridge as you can see below:-










source: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5b/SkyBridgeInterlaken.jpg


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## bayviews (Mar 3, 2006)

Xusein said:


> I don't see the correlation.
> 
> I don't even think the skyways/tunnels really add or take anything from a downtown. They are used as simple corridors really.


You don't think that Buffalo's subway would be more comfortable & better used had there been underground or weather protected stations downtown? 

I do. They've certainly made things a lot more comfortable for winter-weather pedestrian circulation, & transit access, in places like Toronto & the Twin Cities.


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## diablo234 (Aug 18, 2008)

bayviews said:


> You don't think that Buffalo's subway would be more comfortable & better used had there been underground or weather protected stations downtown?
> 
> I do. They've certainly made things a lot more comfortable for winter-weather pedestrian circulation, & transit access, in places like Toronto & the Twin Cities.


The problem with Buffalo's light rail/subway is because it does not really go anywhere, plus the metro area has been in an ecomonic/population decline for a few decades now.

Other cold weather cities such as Salt Lake City, Denver, Boston, Philadelphia, etc don't have skyways/underground walkways and still have thriving downtown areas, so you can't say there is a correlation between the two.


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## bayviews (Mar 3, 2006)

diablo234 said:


> The problem with Buffalo's light rail/subway is because it does not really go anywhere, plus the metro area has been in an ecomonic/population decline for a few decades now.
> 
> Other cold weather cities such as Salt Lake City, Denver, Boston, Philadelphia, etc don't have skyways/underground walkways and still have thriving downtown areas, so you can't say there is a correlation between the two.


True, around Buffalo many complain that it’s the line from nowhere to nowhere. But in truth it goes right up Main St from downtown right up to the city line, & carries decent patronage. If that’s nowhere it’s not owing to any shortcomings of the light rail itself. 

It’s just that Buffalo didn’t know how to promote transit-oriented development, & obviously didn’t follow-up on the taking the right cues from nearby cities, least of all nearby Toronto. 

The amazing thing is that Buffalo light rail runs on the surface in the small downtown portion. Where it would have made sense to have a short subway, with the busiest stations connecting into climate controlled concourses. Yet it goes down into subway for the rest of the way, where it might’ve had more impact being on the surface. 

No, Boston & Philly don’t have dedicated pedestrian skywalks or walkways. But like Chicago, Toronto, & San Francisco, etc. they have extensive underground concourses that provide climate controlled connections into & between downtown subway lines, office building, & shopping malls, etc. Notso Buffalo, where the needs for weather protection are even moreso. 

Very true, Buffalo has been in a largely self-created decline for several decades. But similar declines haven’t kept Pittsburgh & St. Louis from building relatively successful light rail, with subways in downtown.


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## Kensingtonian (Nov 8, 2008)

They add layers to a city. Definitely a good thing!


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## World 2 World (Nov 3, 2006)

*Skyways in Kuala Lumpur*



nazrey said:


> [email protected], Mutiara Damansar
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## isaidso (Mar 21, 2007)

Skyways and underground paths obviously do siphon traffic off the sidewalk so only dense busy areas can support them without a detrimental effect on the vibrancy at street level. In winter time, the downtown streets in Toronto and Montreal aren't bustling with people because 80% of the traffic is underground or inside. 

These underground cities also lure lots of retail that would otherwise by at street level. It's a trade off, but Montreal and Toronto 'get away' with it because their downtowns are ram packed with people. Even with 80% of winter traffic sucked off the street, the streets manage to look somewhat busy. 

In the summer, it's the streets that are packed like sardines while the underground city is less full than in winter time. Skyways and underground paths help alleviate congestion year round. Toronto is rapidly reaching a point where they'd be pedestrian gridlock if the skyways and underground city did not exist. In a way, the city is stacking traffic one on top of the other.

On many occasions I've avoided the underground city in winter when I wanted to get somewhere quickly. I knew the streets would be less packed so I surfaced. I can see a point where I'll venture underground in summer to avoid above ground congestion.


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

World 2 World, thank you for those beautiful pictures of Kuala Lumpur's skyway networks. :cheers:


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## megacity30 (Oct 8, 2011)

isaidso said:


> Skyways and underground paths obviously do siphon traffic off the sidewalk so only dense busy areas can support them without a detrimental effect on the vibrancy at street level. In winter time, the downtown streets in Toronto and Montreal aren't bustling with people because 80% of the traffic is underground or inside.
> 
> These underground cities also lure lots of retail that would otherwise by at street level. It's a trade off, but Montreal and Toronto 'get away' with it because their downtowns are ram packed with people. Even with 80% of winter traffic sucked off the street, the streets manage to look somewhat busy.
> 
> ...


Very well said, isaidso!

I completely agree. Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver and Calgary have downtowns with densely packed pedestrian traffic. Their skyway networks do justice to the pedestrian density.

There are many cities where you don't see the densely-packed shoulder-to-shoulder pedestrian traffic to justify costs of skyway creation and maintenance in their downtowns. 

Therefore, both weather as well as pedestrian density have to be taken into account.


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## Codename B (Feb 20, 2011)

*Bangkok Skywalks*

Bangkok has many skywalks and overpasses all over the city. They are very convenient and are connected to malls, hotels and mass transit stations. 
Here are some of the skywalks. 






--------------------------------------------------

*Siam Skywalk*


DSC_2998 by usiruk December 27, 2010









Photo by Palm-Bangkok

*Ratchaphrasong Skywalk*


Skywalk by tonykerr February 6, 2012


泰國 | Thailand by Teddy Leung September 23, 2011

*Victory Monument Skywalk*


Bangkok - Thailand by kleiner hobbit December 9, 2011

*Silom Skywalk*









http://www.bangkokresidents.com/silom.htm


Bangkok Night by KMPhotoSeattle January 6, 2012

*Sathorn Skywalk*


Bangkok by JulioGonzalez1 July 18, 2011 in Sathorn

*Asoke Skywalk*









www.panoramio.com/map/









http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1384890&page=70 by Chengo


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## Mieszko_Gdynia (Jan 30, 2010)

Suburbanist said:


> Skyways are open for all people who can legally be in a street. The benefit of more indirect control and surveillance is to passively harass and hopefully discourage people who shouldn't be there like petty criminals (taggers included), illegal immigrants (who should leave the city/country), junkies (who need rehab), illegal street vendors (who should get a legitimate stand/store or do something else).


I disagree with these reasons. I'm afraid that petty criminals won't stop even if you put cameras everywhere (and this may be also economically unviable). Imigration should not be illegal. Illegal street vendors will sell things somewhere else.



> On my ideal scenario, we'd have a network of "streets in the sky" instead of mere stores crossed by people.


Despite your reasons it would be nice.



city_thing said:


> This is the last remaining one. It hardly makes an extensive 'skyway' network.


Quite cheesy design...



isaidso said:


> Skyways and underground paths obviously do siphon traffic off the sidewalk so only dense busy areas can support them without a detrimental effect on the vibrancy at street level.


You won't make streets vibrant if people don't want to do so. In the thread on Polish subforum (here - you'll need to translate it) we were discussing about 'dead city centers'. Here are some findings:
1. Cultural issues. People in Poland rarely eat out or go clubbing all night except weekends.
2. If people aren't interested in city life, we can't do anything.
3. There are problems if there are people living nearby or even over a club.

And the last thing - why some people want to make streets vibrant despite people's preferences? :bash:


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## kaligraffi (Aug 20, 2011)

diablo234 said:


> Cities such as Toronto and Montreal still have vibrant streetlife despite the presence of underground pedestrian walkways. Besides the skyways/underground cities only tend to be heavily used during office hours, so if it does have a negative impact on pedestrian activity, that means the downtown area already has problems (such as being more of a workplace enviroment rather than a mixed use enviroment which tends to attract people throughout the day rather than just during business hours).


The key word being "despite", in my estimation. Underground pedestrian walkways can make sense at times but IMO they work because they're used sparingly and when most necessary. Munich, for instance, allows pedestrians to use the underpasses of the subway system and it really helps people move around because they don't have to wait for the light to change to cross the street (although, to be honest, in a city like NYC no one really cares about green or red lights so it doesn't apply everywhere I guess). If you ask me, anything in great excess of half-a-minute's walk and I feel you risk reducing the connection with the street and with it the city.

Fair point about work-time use and mixed-use downtowns.



Suburbanist said:


> Skyways are open for all people who can legally be in a street. The benefit of more indirect control and surveillance is to passively harass and hopefully discourage people who shouldn't be there like petty criminals (taggers included), illegal immigrants (who should leave the city/country), junkies (who need rehab), illegal street vendors (who should get a legitimate stand/store or do something else).


Except it's not a street, it's more often than not a glass box, which renders your underlying assumption incorrect. If you are so incapable of considering the consequences of your proposed policy it shows how little you understand the issue.



> On my ideal scenario, we'd have a network of "streets in the sky" instead of mere stores crossed by people.


The Brutalists tried your ideal scenario, and no one liked it.


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## World 2 World (Nov 3, 2006)

megacity30 said:


> World 2 World, thank you for those beautiful pictures of Kuala Lumpur's skyway networks. :cheers:


pleasure


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## CNB30 (Jun 4, 2012)

Skyways would make more sence, but cut off street life.


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## CNB30 (Jun 4, 2012)

CNB30 said:


> Skyways would make more sence, but cut off street life.


monerails would be a cool idea though


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## castermaild55 (Sep 8, 2005)

megacity30 said:


> Vibrant video and excellent choice indeed, travelworld123!
> 
> This video clearly shows the busy skyways in the background with busy pedestrian activity at the street level in the foreground.
> 
> ...


in tokyo, there are many in undergraound

































http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/laybrick/imgs/9/7/977f4a55.jpg


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## Highcliff (May 4, 2006)

curitiba has a shopping mall with footbridge linking with a parking lot buiding
muller shopping mall








http://jornale.com.br/mirian/?p=2121

west plaza shopping mall in são paulo consists of three blocs linked by two footbridges
below one of the two footbridges...








http://www.alphalazer.com.br/2012/06/west-plaza-promove-ferias-com-turma-do.html


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## xfogus (Mar 26, 2006)

Here's Toronto's PATH network. It's 28 km long according to wikipedia, and right now goes from almost the waterfront up to Dundas. There's a plan to expand it even more.










Picture from here.


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## Ocean Railroader (Jun 18, 2011)

I like Sky ways in that if you have to go to a high crime area at night where a lot of thugs and creeps hang out on the streets down below. You can bypass them by walking though the sky ways that go from building to build and not have to worry about running into them. In that the creeps are not allowed into the buildings. Also I like them in that I don't have to wait at stoplights to cross or get run over.


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## philvia (Jun 22, 2006)

some of the comments here are bizarre :nuts:

but IMO Bangkok has the best skyways... go big or not at all! most of these other examples of glass and metal boxes are completely mundane.
i think an extensive system of skyways would be great as long as they're open to the atmosphere, lined with shops/restaurants, and open to the public.


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## koolio (Jan 5, 2008)

This is the only skyway example I know of in Toronto:









http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1442733&page=8









http://www.shutterstock.com/pic-2085008/stock-photo-skywalk-toronto-on.html

Aside from the Skywalk, we don't really have a skyway "network". PATH is underground. Calgary definitely has an extensive network (maybe the biggest in the world). Edmonton and Winnipeg might have a network too. I think Montreal would be similar to Toronto. Vancouver has "Skytrain" (rapid transit) which is mostly in the "sky" aside from one underground line but I don't think they have any pedestrian walkway networks.


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