# My trip to England/thoughts on Chicago....



## WesternburbsTony23 (Oct 26, 2006)

Kinda of a weird thread topic, but after reading the post it will make sense.

Anyway my wife and I ventured to England for our first time and had a wonderful time!!! We first stayed up in Northampton, which is a little over an hour north of London. We stayed there for 4 days with my brother in laws parents and had a wonderful time. Northampton is a decent size city with such beautiful urban city centre, all the shops, row homes, etc. Believe it or not, it was our favorite place in all of England.

We also went to Warrick, saw the town, and also went up in the castle. It was amazing.

The next day ventured further north to Birmingham. It was another great city, but I know the urban enthusiast would probably hate the Bull Run Mall. It is waaaaaaaay too Americanized, I felt like I was shopping in Woodfield Mall in Schaumburg. 

Our final 3 days were in London. Such a beautiful city, did all the touristy things, stayed near Bayswater area(Queensway Undergound stop). Diverse area, we had a great time.

Once again, our favorite place was Northampton because of the culture and going to pubs talking to English folks. In London, I don't know if we really talked to those born in England. Large amount from France, India.

Here are my pros of England:
The most beautiful architecture I have ever seen
The underground simply rocks
Great food, yep I know most don't like it, but the food my wife and I had was great
Excercise, we walked everywhere and I loved every bit of it. Hell, lost abut 5 pounds on the trip 
The culture and history, just so amazing, words cannot really explain it

The cons:
Service at restaraunts was horrible. My brother in laws parents warned us, they were right. In some resteraunts it took 20 minutes to get a coke.
TV- I know, I know, your overseas, no time for TV, but late at night I have a horrible habit of falling asleep watching TV, but in Britian TV was brutal. But my wife and I love the Show Keeping up Apperances.
Small hotel rooms, I mean tiny. Shoot our Motel 6's are like spacious luxury compared to our hotel in London.

Thats really it, the pros far outweigh the cons. We will be back to England, probably stay all the time at Northampton, great stores, walkable medium sized city, great markets on Saturday, Love the restaraunts. 
My wife and I are just so glad we went somewhere outside London on our trip.

It would kinda be like someone coming to American and only seeing New York. Really doesnt tell the whole story

Now onto Chicago. After visiting London, been to Paris, New York, etc one really has to appreciate what Chicago has to offer. Being from the area out in the burbs now, Chicago(IMO) can stand up to any city in regards to culture, downtowns, walking, restaraunts, etc. Whatever you want to compare. 

Where London was sooooo much better than any city I have ever been to is the Underground. It just kicks the el, NYCs subway, etc. ass. The underground is the best public transportation system I have ever used.

Now back to Chicago, we really need some type of Square!!! like Liecester, Times, etc. Do not have that yet. The foot traffic on a freakin Tuesday night at Liecester Square just blows away any place in Chicago on any night

IMO, Chicago is still the king for restaraunts and shopping, the Mag Mile is really the best in the World.

Glad to be back home, but England was a hell of a time!!!!!!!!!


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## LLoydGeorge (Jan 14, 2006)

WesternburbsTony23 said:


> ....Now onto Chicago. After visiting London, been to Paris, New York, etc one really has to appreciate what Chicago has to offer. Being from the area out in the burbs now, Chicago(IMO) can stand up to any city in regards to culture, downtowns, walking, restaraunts, etc. Whatever you want to compare....
> IMO, Chicago is still the king for restaraunts and shopping, the Mag Mile is really the best in the World....


England is fabulous.

Chicago is a nice regional/US city, but I doubt that few people would agree with your assesments about it. Nevertheless, it's good to see that you love your home.


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## globill (Dec 4, 2005)

Chicago is a world-class city. Anyone who doesn't see this is rather blind.


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## globill (Dec 4, 2005)

oh and regards to the subway systems, sure London's is more extensive, but one time when I was there I was shocked to discover it wasn't 24 hours. Growing up in Chicago with round-the-clock subways/buses made me think every major city was like like. To my knowledge only NYC and Chicago have 24-hour transit....may be wrong on this though...


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## SE9 (Apr 26, 2005)

London's trains don't run for 24-hours, but the buses do.


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## SE9 (Apr 26, 2005)

Tony, I'm glad you got the chance to visit a smaller UK town. I personally try to do the same in my travels... in every country I've been to (except the UAE), I've sampled the smaller towns and villages, which was a very worthwhile experience.


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Glad you liked London and the UK and had a great trip. I also have a soft spot for that country (will be visiting it twice in November), and I love many of the things you enjoyed as well.

Funny enough, I also find the food great there as well. It's such an old stereotype when people slag it off. Actually, the food there today is really pretty good. The service, well, living in Germany I actually find it better. Waiting 20minutes for a coke is nothing like we can wait here sometimes. 

And I also love the underground. Who cares if it doesn't operate 24/7, the buses do, and they are the best buses in the world. But I still love the underground system, it has so much character.

Thanks for your post. Looking forward to flying in there next week.


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## WesternburbsTony23 (Oct 26, 2006)

Hey Guys, thanks for the responses. My wife and I just really loved it all over the England. Just wish I could have done another week, so much more I could have seen. Justme, Germany is definetly one of our next European stops after Italy. I here German food is the best in Europe from many. Cant wait to find out myself!!!!


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

WesternburbsTony23 said:


> Hey Guys, thanks for the responses. My wife and I just really loved it all over the England. Just wish I could have done another week, so much more I could have seen. Justme, Germany is definetly one of our next European stops after Italy. I here German food is the best in Europe from many. Cant wait to find out myself!!!!


I actually find the food quite disappointing here. Especially at takeaway and lunch level. In fact, at that end, it is one of the worst I have seen (er, tasted) anywhere in the world.

To be fair though, at the restaurant level, the major cities do extremely well. Look at the local guides here when visiting the cities for great restaurant choices and you won't be disappointed. And I mean at all the different cultural tastes from great Asian, French, Spanish etc.

At the home level. Supermarket food is almost bordering on atrocious, especially the pre packaged goods. Products at the Deli counter in supermarkets are usually extremely good though, so stick to that or the street markets where the quality is at the complete other end, superb (though expensive). But that's where the contradictions are in Germany, from sometimes beyond terrible to extremely good.


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## Ted Ward (Apr 16, 2005)

Hello WS Tony,

Good to hear you enjoyed your trip to england, you sound really passionate and excited about it, its a great attitude to have, for some people a small hotel room and bad service in a restaurant would ruin their holiday - I don't understand people like that. 

The public transport in London is fantastic - buy 1 ticket and you can use it all day on the underground and buses, and go anywhere you like. As for the restaurant service, i can only say it differs from one to the other. There are plenty of small pubs in England which provide food - I don't know if thats the norm in chicago as well.


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## WesternburbsTony23 (Oct 26, 2006)

Hey Ted, there are a lot of pubs in Chicago, but none built in the 1600!!!!!!! How cool is that. My wife and I frequently went to pubs in the English country and in London. Like I said in my first post, we really enjoyed the smaller towns more than London. I find it so interesting to speak with others who have lived in the towns there whole life and who are proud to speak of there heritage. It is just so interesting. We will be back to England, it was just too much fun.

As for as the hotel and service, you know what wherever you go will never be perfect and for people to judge an entire country or city on a few things is rediculous. England was just so beautiful, how could anyone not love the country.


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## Blackbelt Jones (Apr 22, 2004)

Glad you liked the UK. I lived there years ago and visit often... it really is an amazing country, and the people are the best in the world. If I get to a point where rampant Republicanism drives me out of the States, I would gladly set up shop in London (though a nice beach in NZ would run a close second!).



LLoydGeorge said:


> Chicago is a nice regional/US city, but I doubt that few people would agree with your assesments about it. Nevertheless, it's good to see that you love your home.


I'd prefer to give you the benifit of the doubt, but did you intend the above to read as so patronizing? I have lived, traveled and done business all over the EU and US, and I have found few serious urbanists that would agree with your assessment of Chicago.


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## Erebus555 (Apr 21, 2006)

WesternburbsTony23 said:


> We also went to Warrick, saw the town, and also went up in the castle. It was amazing.
> 
> The next day ventured further north to Birmingham. It was another great city, but I know the urban enthusiast would probably hate the Bull Run Mall. It is waaaaaaaay too Americanized, I felt like I was shopping in Woodfield Mall in Schaumburg.


Warwick is a great place - I totally agree with you. The castle whiffs a bit in the basement though 

Thanks for your comments on Birmingham. The mall (as the Americans say it) is actually called the Bull Ring Shopping Centre, not the Bull Run and whilst it seems very americanised it is still a very popular destination. I dont know what shopping in Woodfield is like though... I hope you didnt see Birmingham New Street train station... Please say you didn't because you would hate it. You should come back in 5 or so years time when the next shopping centre has been built, another shopping/ resi development is in full swing and the Eastside is in full swing. Not like I'm advertising the city...

Hope you had a great holiday anyway, and its nice to know some people do actually visit Birmingham!


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

^ Is there a thread here regarding the new shopping mall in Birmingham, and will it also be in the central city?


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## cinosanap (Aug 10, 2004)

If you enjoyed England, you'd love Scotland.
Seriously, England is a very nice place to holiday and London is my favourite city after Edinburgh.
You should visit Scotland next time you are in the UK, though. Even if it is only for a day or two in Edinburgh.


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## Erebus555 (Apr 21, 2006)

Justme said:


> ^ Is there a thread here regarding the new shopping mall in Birmingham, and will it also be in the central city?


On the Birmingham forums there is a thread on Martineau Galleries. It will be in the city centre but not in the area that is visited by most people. The Bull Ring sucked the life out of half the city so hopefully Martineau Galleries will bring it all back. And what makes it better is that there will be 110 metre skyscraper there too :banana:


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

I currently live in England. I'm not that crazy about it, no offense. The weather is amazing compared to Georgia and there is a well-painted history that's interesting to learn about but its just so hard to live here (For me). For one, its extremely expensive. 4 adults going out to eat is about 100 Pounds (Close to $200.) BT Internet and telephone is completely unreliable. One small storm (sometimes it happens during light showers!), and its out until the BT workers come and fix it. Forget about A/C in the house I live in and yes it does get into the 80's and 90's once in a while here. In the winter, my house's heat works on and off. I know you are probably going to say I should get better appliances or move into a better home, but many people around me have told me there house's are like that too. People drive awful here and the roads are small. They are often over the line or trying to pass you. I also hate it when people ride their bicycles on the street on busy roads, when there is a side walk right next to them. Parking is a disaster. There is almost no place to park in cities here. They have a few parking garages here and there but that's it mostly it. The parking garage's are hell to get in and out of, especially with a fairly large car for England that I have. Its fun to go shopping around, you can find alot of good stuff. I love to shop at charity shops because they have cheap antiques and bric-a-brac. Food is ok but not the money that its worth. There is very small portions which is a good thing but the food is so bland that even salt will not help it. I also hate it when I see 12-year old's smoking and getting drunk, etc. I see it all the time. I've heard newsagents here and there will occasionally dish out a pack of butts to kids. Its not responsible. Also people light fireworks very early in the morning. Television is boring, mostly all reality shows and news is ANTI-American. You can just see it. Almost all media here is Anti-American and is trying to put us down on every single mistake.

Well I just explained some cons.

Here are the PRO'S

-Elderly people get around here. 
-Its extremely diverse here (especially in Birmingham, Leeds, and London.)
You can feel like you are in Pakistan or India literally in places. 
-The history is amazing. 
-The only thing you can get here that's cheaper in the US is antiques. You can buy Victorian era furniture for low prices. 
-Architecture...Cambridge, Oxford, London, Bath, York. Humongous, what we Americans would call downtown's. (Note that almost everything in a city here is downtown. Its the other way around in the US most of the time's. 
-Its a free country!
-People are very fashionable, only if they brushed there teeth. LOL j/m. 
-Infrastructure is well equiped for the workforce. Catch a train ride almost anywhere and you can find a public bus in the most rural area's. 

-Stonehenge, Westminster Abby, St Paul's Cathedral, York Minster, Buckingham Palace, Sandringham Retreat, King's College, Big Ben and Parliament, Hadrian's Wall, and Brighton Beaches and night scene.


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

cinosanap said:


> If you enjoyed England, you'd love Scotland.
> Seriously, England is a very nice place to holiday and London is my favourite city after Edinburgh.
> You should visit Scotland next time you are in the UK, though. Even if it is only for a day or two in Edinburgh.


Falite!
Wow! I loved Edinburgh. I've been there twice already and shot up to Inverness and Loch Nessie. Its so beautiful up there. I like the landscape there better than England because there are some huge hills and mountains. My heritage goes back up to the northernmest part of Scotland where the Ross clan once roamed. Camera Obscura, Holyrood House, and the Castle were highlights of my trip. I stayed at the Marriot in Corstophine which was nice. You can take the park and ride from there to the city centre. I love the blackened buildings in Edinburgh, its looks spooky at night. I never made it to Glasgow. Is it worth going to??? If I ever make it up there again I'll visit it. How about Ireland? Still haven't been there. I want to kiss the blarney stone. Dublin seems nice..... What's you opinion?


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## Liam-Manchester (Dec 29, 2004)

macon4ever said:


> I currently live in England. I'm not that crazy about it, no offense. The weather is amazing compared to Georgia and there is a well-painted history that's interesting to learn about but its just so hard to live here (For me). For one, its extremely expensive. 4 adults going out to eat is about 100 Pounds (Close to $200.) BT Internet and telephone is completely unreliable. One small storm (sometimes it happens during light showers!), and its out until the BT workers come and fix it. Forget about A/C in the house I live in and yes it does get into the 80's and 90's once in a while here. In the winter, my house's heat works on and off. I know you are probably going to say I should get better appliances or move into a better home, but many people around me have told me there house's are like that too. People drive awful here and the roads are small. They are often over the line or trying to pass you. I also hate it when people ride their bicycles on the street on busy roads, when there is a side walk right next to them. Parking is a disaster. There is almost no place to park in cities here. They have a few parking garages here and there but that's it mostly it. The parking garage's are hell to get in and out of, especially with a fairly large car for England that I have. Its fun to go shopping around, you can find alot of good stuff. I love to shop at charity shops because they have cheap antiques and bric-a-brac. Food is ok but not the money that its worth. There is very small portions which is a good thing but the food is so bland that even salt will not help it. I also hate it when I see 12-year old's smoking and getting drunk, etc. I see it all the time. I've heard newsagents here and there will occasionally dish out a pack of butts to kids. Its not responsible. Also people light fireworks very early in the morning. Television is boring, mostly all reality shows and news is ANTI-American. You can just see it. Almost all media here is Anti-American and is trying to put us down on every single mistake.


I really am struggling to believe this, particularly your comment about drivers. I've been in the US for almost 3 months and I can tell you that British drivers are 100 times better than American drivers. There is a good reason for this, and it's called a driving test. I haven't heard of a single person failing an American driving test and they are ridiculously easy to pass, and if you apply for a licence after the age of 18 you don't even need a test. I was in a girl's car the other day who had never taken a driving test but was driving to the shopping mall. And it DOES show, believe me, they are all bloody awful drivers. They are reckless, cut corners, cant stay within lines on the roads, change lanes without signalling, constantly cut people off and seem to gain a false sense of security from the wide roads and automatic cars, cruise control etc and it seems girls here just can't drive without talking on the phone. I was cringing all the way when I was being driven to Miami a couple of months back- the girl who was driving me was literally 5 feet from the car in front on the interstate, and she was driving at 80mph. That would not be acceptable in the UK. Our driving test is so stringent that you simply have to be ready to drive before you pass, and you have to be able to perform parallel parking which the vast majority of people in the US wouldn't have a hope of being able to do.

Expensive? Eating out is expensive in comparison to the US, yes. But grocery shopping is actually cheaper in the UK. I've been spending a lot more at the grocery store/supermarket since I've been here on not very much at all. Too much of the food in the US is processed, fresh food such as fruit, vegetables and meat is very poor here in comparison to the UK. At least for students, food is far better in the UK. The difference is Americans eat out more, a lot more. And I do prefer the restaurant experience in the US, as you always get good, efficient service, it's value for money and you get refills on drinks which I think is excellent. Supermarkets in the US though are poor- I really don't trust the food and what they put into it.

There are advantages and disadvantages of both countries. There is no way I would be able to get a 14" takeout pizza in the UK for $5.30. Eating out is cheaper in the US but you can still find cheap places in the UK. The UK countryside wins hands down, it's always pretty and interesting whereas Florida is rather boring in that regard. I don't thinl you could actually drive anywhere particularly interesting within 2 hours. At home I can be in spectacular scenery in 20 minutes. American tv is awful- you can flick through channels for 5 minutes and find nothing but commercials and I still haven't found anything worth watching apart from the occasional Champions League football/soccer games on ESPN 2. The weather here though is superb compared to the UK, as I'm a warm weather fan.


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## Erebus555 (Apr 21, 2006)

^^I agree about the TV. We either had to watch some seriously low-budget poor-acted dramas which aparently attracted millions of viewers per episode (god forbid) or the news which had about 200 tickers running on the screen at the same time with the same synthesiser music played throughout and an image of an American flag in the corner all the time (which is actually good because it shows Americans are a hell of a lot more patriotic than the Brits).

As you said, both countries have their good and bad points and it is always down to opinion. 

I am a cold weather fan by the way so the UK suits me just fine


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## Erebus555 (Apr 21, 2006)

Oh and lets not turn this into an America/ UK battle over who is best because it always gets down to who has the better supermarket checkout staff.


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## NothingBetterToDo (Sep 11, 2002)

macon4ever said:


> Falite!
> How about Ireland? Still haven't been there. I want to kiss the blarney stone. Dublin seems nice..... What's you opinion?


Ireland is a beautiful country, and really is worth a visit if you get the chance, if you like the countryside in England and Scotland, then you will love Ireland (it has the rolling hills and plains of England, and the Mountains of Scotland). 

Dublin itself is gorgeous, rather similar in appearance to a British city, with its Georgian squares and terraces, but its more unspoilt than many British cities (it wasn't bombed during the war, and didn't have the money to let the planners of the 60's/70's run free) 

Check out my pics of recent visit... kay:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=386217

Glad you liked England BTW....did you manage to check out Oxford or Cambridge?? Now they will Blow you away.


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

Interesting thoughts macon4ever, however, I can't agree with you on the TV front. I enjoy British TV so much, I get it over here in Germany. The BBC is great, no ads and at least in my opinion, many quality shows. (there are of cause crap ones as well, nothings perfect), and there are plenty on the other channels as well. 

There are also plenty of cable and satellite channels that show American stuff, and to be honest, most of them I can't bear to watch. There are a few American shows I enjoy (Family Guy, Southpark, etc) but 99% I watch are British made - and I ain't from Britain, or even live there.

You are correct that the cost of eating out is more expensive in the UK. But as Liam-Manchester pointed out the Supermarket prices are low and the quality exceptionally high. I wish German supermarkets were as good as the UK ones.

By the way. I watch UK TV and I don't see the ANTI-American stance you somehow see. I do see them criticize or joke about the US at times. But that isn't being anti-American. Being anti-American is saying things like "We should kill Americans" etc. That is being anti-American. What we do find these days, is that some Americans don't like being criticised, and when they are, they seem to think it is Anti-them. Chill out and take the knocks. The British are JUST AS QUICK to knock themselves as they are the Americans. Next time you pick up a paper than you think a headline reads something anti-American, read right through it and you'll see how many times they also knock their own government and country.

Anyway, I'm glad you like somethings there. But you should find a better house. I have many friends and family living in the UK, and you are right, they don't have air conditioning (crazy sometimes) but their heating works fine along with their telephone lines. Seems like it's your place that has the problem. Where do you live by the way?


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

^^ Suffolk. 60 miles north of London. Yes I love BBC documentaries. Well I guess its not anti-American, but they do down the US alot. The headline of the Guardian one day was What if George Bush died?? They were very serious about it. It is not nice to talk like that. But they DID talk bad about Blair too. LOL. The food in Supermarkets are bland too for American tastes. It must be perfect for European's. We love greasy, salty, sweet sweet foods. Haha. Some of the items there are ok. I love Baxter's French Onion Soup. I buy it at Waitrose often.


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

NothingBetterToDo said:


> Ireland is a beautiful country, and really is worth a visit if you get the chance, if you like the countryside in England and Scotland, then you will love Ireland (it has the rolling hills and plains of England, and the Mountains of Scotland).
> 
> Dublin itself is gorgeous, rather similar in appearance to a British city, with its Georgian squares and terraces, but its more unspoilt than many British cities (it wasn't bombed during the war, and didn't have the money to let the planners of the 60's/70's run free)
> 
> ...



Thanks for the info. I'll check out your pic thread. I love Cambridge and Oxford. In fact I live 20 minutes from Camby. I ADORE the Fitzwilliam Museum and the Zoology Museum. The best thing is that they're all free and run by Univ. Of Cambridge. I love to just roam around the Museum's all day and then head out to a restaurant. Oxford is beautiful too.


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

Liam-Manchester said:


> I really am struggling to believe this, particularly your comment about drivers. I've been in the US for almost 3 months and I can tell you that British drivers are 100 times better than American drivers. There is a good reason for this, and it's called a driving test. I haven't heard of a single person failing an American driving test and they are ridiculously easy to pass, and if you apply for a licence after the age of 18 you don't even need a test. I was in a girl's car the other day who had never taken a driving test but was driving to the shopping mall. And it DOES show, believe me, they are all bloody awful drivers. They are reckless, cut corners, cant stay within lines on the roads, change lanes without signalling, constantly cut people off and seem to gain a false sense of security from the wide roads and automatic cars, cruise control etc and it seems girls here just can't drive without talking on the phone. I was cringing all the way when I was being driven to Miami a couple of months back- the girl who was driving me was literally 5 feet from the car in front on the interstate, and she was driving at 80mph. That would not be acceptable in the UK. Our driving test is so stringent that you simply have to be ready to drive before you pass, and you have to be able to perform parallel parking which the vast majority of people in the US wouldn't have a hope of being able to do.




NOW I GET IT!!!! I live near Norfolk in Northern Suffolk. I was talking to a British friend and he told me this part of England is infamous for its reckless driver's and horrible for driving. Don't you guys joke about that or is it just a regional saying? Well its true. Roads are so tiny here, its ridiculous. Yes, teen drivers in the US are reckless at times. I've rarely had problems though with teen driver's even though I've heard of it. Its still better for everyday driver's like me. Road's are wide. There isn't an extra lane in road's here if somebody has car problem's. (Only on highway's). There is bushes and trees right next to the road!!!!!!! 

Also, I spend way more on supermarkets here than in the States. Maybe it's the choice of what we buy??!!. Well if you are getting the American wage there I can see why you think its expensive. But I get the American wage here and the Cost of Living Allowance isn't much help. I guess we are both comfortable with our countries and can't really judge. You really need to get back down to England. Rural restaurants are just as expensive!!!! Pubs make the worst food at the highest prices. I hate pubs, I only go there for the atmosphere once in a while or to just drink a few.


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

Please, Don't take this seriously. I would love to here of your dislikes of the US. It wouldn't bother me at all.


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

macon4ever said:


> Pubs make the worst food at the highest prices. I hate pubs, I only go there for the atmosphere once in a while or to just drink a few.


I can certainly recommend some great pubs with fantastic food at good prices. Sure, there are pubs that sell very average food, but there are others that do a great job.



macon4ever said:


> The food in Supermarkets are bland too for American tastes. It must be perfect for European's. We love greasy, salty, sweet sweet foods. Haha. Some of the items there are ok. I love Baxter's French Onion Soup. I buy it at Waitrose often


Yes, it must come down to different tastes. I'm personally not so much into sweet foods, but more into savory. I love the cheeses in Europe, something the US simply cannot compare on. But on the other hand, the quality of steaks is better in the US (due to the larger area's to farm), so there is better and worse in both countries. From what I have found, the UK supermarkets also make the best preprepared foods I have found anywhere, but again, they maybe down to tastes.

How long are you in the UK for? If you miss some US foods, maybe you could find a US expat supermarket in London.

By the way, glad you see what I meant by anti-American. Knocking George Bush isn't anti-American, it's knocking a single person which is a totally different thing.

By the way, don't watch anything by Jeremy Clarkson. Hell of a funny guy, especially on Top Gear, but he loves to rub jokes about Americans. Doesn't mean he hates Americans, he just loves to wind them up. He does the same about Germans, always knocking them etc, but in other episodes he will say how much he loves Germany. Same thing, but if you watch it, be prepared for a joke taking the piss out of Americans - tongue in cheek


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## Liam-Manchester (Dec 29, 2004)

macon4ever said:


> NOW I GET IT!!!! I live near Norfolk in Northern Suffolk. I was talking to a British friend and he told me this part of England is infamous for its reckless driver's and horrible for driving. Don't you guys joke about that or is it just a regional saying? Well its true. Roads are so tiny here, its ridiculous. Yes, teen drivers in the US are reckless at times. I've rarely had problems though with teen driver's even though I've heard of it. Its still better for everyday driver's like me. Road's are wide. There isn't an extra lane in road's here if somebody has car problem's. (Only on highway's). There is bushes and trees right next to the road!!!!!!!
> 
> Also, I spend way more on supermarkets here than in the States. Maybe it's the choice of what we buy??!!. Well if you are getting the American wage there I can see why you think its expensive. But I get the American wage here and the Cost of Living Allowance isn't much help. I guess we are both comfortable with our countries and can't really judge. You really need to get back down to England. Rural restaurants are just as expensive!!!! Pubs make the worst food at the highest prices. I hate pubs, I only go there for the atmosphere once in a while or to just drink a few.


I can see why the smaller roads would be hard to get used to, there is a massive difference in that regard. I suppose it makes sense to have a harder driving test in the UK because of the smaller roads, less room to manouevre etc, it really does test your driving skills more. I guess the roads in the US are easier to drive on because of their width, plenty of lanes etc. It sounds like you live in a rural/semi rural area too, which probably means roads are narrower than they are in the urban areas. The standard of driving could be a regional thing, definitely, as it is in the US too. The drivers in Miami were the worst I've ever seen, and I've travelled all over Europe including Paris, all over France, Spain, Portugal. Some of the things I saw the drivers do in Miami were simply beyond belief, unbelievably dangerous. The drivers here in northern Florida, while not as reckless, are too laid back, aggressive, can't park to save their lives and talk on their phones too much. They find it impossible to perform simple manoevres that would be routine to someone in the UK.

The supermarket thing could be down to choice. Although I'm from Manchester which is obviously in the North which means we benefit from relatively cheap prices, compared to the South East and probably East Anglia too. I know that my average bill is higher here than in the UK, but maybe this is due to the fact that I go less often in the US than I would at home in the UK. I don't have a job in the US, I'm only here as a student at the University of Florida but I would imagine on the lower wages over here people would struggle more to afford the supermarket prices.


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## the spliff fairy (Oct 21, 2002)

btw, Brit cyclist aren't allowed to ride on the sidewalk unless they want a heavy fine. In London theyre thinking of upping it to £1000. They can actually choose to watch a safety video in a tent the police have set up round the corner of their 'trap' - or pay the fine. Strangely enough alot of people choose the former .


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## JDRS (Feb 8, 2004)

the spliff fairy said:


> btw, Brit cyclist aren't allowed to ride on the sidewalk unless they want a heavy fine. In London theyre thinking of upping it to £1000. They can actually choose to watch a safety video in a tent the police have set up round the corner of their 'trap' - or pay the fine. Strangely enough alot of people choose the former .


Although it is illegal the rules vary by different councils slightly and many people (especially young people) still bike on the pavements and no will care. I bike on the pavements around here as you can just slow down if someone is walking, and loads of other people do. In London I can imagine them being stricter due to the larger volume of people on pavements.


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

the spliff fairy said:


> btw, Brit cyclist aren't allowed to ride on the sidewalk unless they want a heavy fine. In London theyre thinking of upping it to £1000. They can actually choose to watch a safety video in a tent the police have set up round the corner of their 'trap' - or pay the fine. Strangely enough alot of people choose the former .


Really! Whenever I go on bike ride's, I always drive on sidewalks to get to my destination. Never had any trouble. But I mean a 2-lane road with people driving on both sides! Cyclists can atleast ride on the sidewalk where there is no pedestrians out and about. It can cause accidents, you know. Also, I see it every so often, a big curb in the road that says it will help you slow down. That can cause accidents at night and it waste's money. If you turn your head for a split second (which happen's often, its human) you could get into quite a fender-bender. 

Don't get me started on roundabouts. There is a 5-way near my town that takes forever to get out of. People are so timid to get into the cycle. I mean, traffic can get backed up for miles, if people are too scared to "go". Roundabouts are very confusing and dangerous. If you are trying to go one way, and there is a car in next to you blocking your way, You will either have to take the chance, or go around the bout until you get a clear. 

Also, drivers around here are very impatient. They will double pass you even if there is a car coming on the other lane. They make sharp swerves to insure they don't get hit which affects me. Isn't it against the road law to do that? Speed Camera's will catch you.

We also have a tractor problem here. I understand they have no where else to travel around but it causes so much traffic around here. It can get horrible. I don't want to get a ticket and have to go to the Magistrate's Court to tell what I did. Strict road rules, and many people fail to follow them.


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## MoreOrLess (Feb 17, 2005)

macon4ever said:


> Rural restaurants are just as expensive!!!! Pubs make the worst food at the highest prices. I hate pubs, I only go there for the atmosphere once in a while or to just drink a few.


Can't say thats been my expereince in the last few years, I'm sure there are still a fair few boozers that server scampi in an oil slick but most pubs seem to be either devoted to drinking or to eating these days. Almost all the best places to eat in my area(the cotswolds) when it comes to food/value for money are country pubs and I'v found the same on the south east coast area aswell. The only places I'd avoid are those chain "family" pubs that mostly serve microwaved frozen rubbish.


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## svs (Dec 5, 2005)

Having driven in many cities all over the World, I have to say there are few cities, I would want to drive in less than London, Crowded, narrow streets and almost total stasis during the days. Plus driving on theopposite side of the street is like driving in a mirror. Only places like Naples or Mexico City fill me with more apprehension whle driving. The only good news about London driving is that traffic is so slow its hard to get hurt in the inevitable accident.


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## Justme (Sep 11, 2002)

MoreOrLess said:


> Can't say thats been my expereince in the last few years, I'm sure there are still a fair few boozers that server scampi in an oil slick but most pubs seem to be either devoted to drinking or to eating these days. Almost all the best places to eat in my area(the cotswolds) when it comes to food/value for money are country pubs and I'v found the same on the south east coast area aswell. The only places I'd avoid are those chain "family" pubs that mostly serve microwaved frozen rubbish.


I'd agree with this. I was in London twice this month, and had a few Pub lunches and the odd dinner. Absolutely some great ones. The Fishery Inn in Hemel Hempstead makes amazing hamburgers (Lovely old pub on the canal) and the Ye Olde Fighting Cocks in St. Albans (which is around 500years old) had the best pub fish & chips I have yet tasted - the chips were amazing.


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## Jonesy55 (Jul 30, 2004)

macon4ever said:


> Roundabouts are very confusing and dangerous. If you are trying to go one way, and there is a car in next to you blocking your way, You will either have to take the chance, or go around the bout until you get a clear.


That shouldn't happen if you're in the correct lane and signal in good time, i've never found roundabouts to be a problem and at least if there's no traffic you don't have to sit there twiddling your thumbs until the lights change.


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## Jonesy55 (Jul 30, 2004)

Justme said:


> I'd agree with this. I was in London twice this month, and had a few Pub lunches and the odd dinner. Absolutely some great ones. The Fishery Inn in Hemel Hempstead makes amazing hamburgers (Lovely old pub on the canal) and the Ye Olde Fighting Cocks in St. Albans (which is around 500years old) had the best pub fish & chips I have yet tasted - the chips were amazing.


You can get great pubs and you can get terrible pubs, the ones that have a good reputation locally almost always do good food at reasonable prices though. In most decent towns there are also restaurants where you can eat 3 courses of very good quality food with wine for £30 per head, not as cheap as a bangkok street vendor but it doesn't break the bank.

This is my favourite in Shrewsbury :eat:

http://www.goldencrosshotel.co.uk/contents/menu.html


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## Zim Flyer (Sep 2, 2004)

Hello WesternburbsTony23,

thank you for creating a really interesting thread and thank you for your positive comments about England. I think it's great you have seen other parts of England and not just London.

I would add when you next come, pay a visit to Cornwall and St Michael's Mount, from what you have said I think you will love it:


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## sjwmoore (Feb 17, 2005)

macon4ever said:


> NOW I GET IT!!!! I live near Norfolk in Northern Suffolk. .



Mmmm. Mildenhall or Lakenheath? My parents live up that way, my dads last posting was Marham, then he workked for MOD very close to you at Honington. Thetford is a dismal town, that could be so much better. You ever been to that so called "country club" opposite the gates at Lakenheath?


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## Pobbie (Jul 16, 2005)

BTW, Norfolk is not Northern Suffolk - it's an entirely different county bordering Suffolk to the north. Both are part of a larger region called East Anglia however. It's a relatively rural part of the country, which perhaps explains the perceived problem with narrow roads. Prices also tend to be higher the closer you live to London.


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## Tubeman (Sep 12, 2002)

Zim Flyer said:


> Hello WesternburbsTony23,
> 
> thank you for creating a really interesting thread and thank you for your positive comments about England. I think it's great you have seen other parts of England and not just London.
> 
> I would add when you next come, pay a visit to Cornwall and St Michael's Mount, from what you have said I think you will love it:


Also, if you're in that neck of the woods, visit the beautiful town of St Ives (some of mine):


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

Pobbie Rarr said:


> BTW, Norfolk is not Northern Suffolk - it's an entirely different county bordering Suffolk to the north. Both are part of a larger region called East Anglia however. It's a relatively rural part of the country, which perhaps explains the perceived problem with narrow roads. Prices also tend to be higher the closer you live to London.


LOL, I know that! I said I live in near Norfolk, in Northern Suffolk. 
I live in Northern area of Suffolk which is near Norfolk. I thought English people are more familiar with Norfolk so that is why I elaborated it.


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

sjwmoore said:


> Mmmm. Mildenhall or Lakenheath? My parents live up that way, my dads last posting was Marham, then he workked for MOD very close to you at Honington. Thetford is a dismal town, that could be so much better. You ever been to that so called "country club" opposite the gates at Lakenheath?


Mildenhall. I actually live in a town across from the base called Beck Row. Thetford, is a lovely town althought it does have a type of slum. Mainly poor migrants from Morroco, Portugal, Eastern Europe. Not to say those countries are poor. Its just the one's in Thetford are. There are lots of gangs there, and my friend decided to move from Thetford to the town of Ely after his house got broken into twice! I love walking around the town center. Lovely. Ely is my favorite town in the area. You should visit. Ely Cathedral is huge and beautiful! 

Yes, I've heard of the ****-ry Club! I believe it is a strip joint now! 

Nice towns in this area, but the land is too flat for me! 
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

Cornwall looks beautiful!!!!! I really want to visit.

BTW, I live in Beck Row, Mildenhall, Suffolk in England. 

*So far in England, I have been to;*

London x6 (Amazing city. Love seeing the landmarks I've seen in picures!)
Newcastle Upon Tyne
Ipswich x2
Norwich x3
York (York Minster is huge! Like the town center)
King's Lynn
Peterborough
Nottingham
Leeds (I stayed in the ancient village of Tong while in that area)
Birmingham x2
Oxford x3
Cambridge x40+ I live within 20 minutes of the city! Love the museums.
Leicester
Great Yarmouth
Bath
Warwickshire: Stratford-Upon-Avon (Amazing town love the old tudor houses!), Leamington Spa, Warwick.
Stoke-On-Trent (My least favorite city in the UK)
-Also numerous towns around the area I live in like Lavenham, a Medieval wool town. 
-Hadrian's Wall, althought not much is left of it.

*-In Scotland (x2)*
Edinburgh x2
Loch Ness Lake area (Drumnadrochit) Went to Urquhart
Inverness

*-Wales*
Swansea
Cardiff visited Cardiff Castle and walked around town. Very barren! Where is all the people??? Maybe it was because the night before was a Wales World Cup qualifying match????
-Drove around the area mostly 

*On my list:*
Sheffield
Coventry
Liverpool
Cornwall 
Southampton
Plymouth
Blackpool
Brighton
Manchester
Boston & Lincoln

What are some attractions in these cities??


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## neil (Jan 20, 2005)

Do you not fancy Manchester then^^


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## NothingBetterToDo (Sep 11, 2002)

^^ good gosh Macon4ever you have been to more places in the UK than me...and i've lived here all my life.


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## sjwmoore (Feb 17, 2005)

You have to see Lincoln and Boston, not that far away. I agree, Ely is a lovely place, though the landscape around is a bit featureless. Kings Lynn is improving.

Southampton isnt too amazing for the visitor, unless your into ships, great views from Town Quay. The old town is pleasant.

http://skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=388349


Likewise with Plymouth, substantially rebuilt post war, good if you like naval vessels. A better bet is Portsmouth, very historic with a good naval museum, and a big tower with viewing platform.

Liverpools maritime museum is excellent and free, fantastic buildings all round the city. You might as well tie it in with Manchester.


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## MoreOrLess (Feb 17, 2005)

I'd recommend the Scottish coastal area north of Ullapool, best landscape in the UK IMHO.


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## Jonesy55 (Jul 30, 2004)

I'd recommend Snowdonia in North Wales, some great scenery there too.


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

Jonesy55 said:


> I'd recommend Snowdonia in North Wales, some great scenery there too.


There are American community tours to Snowdonia to go hiking and to look at the castles there, I believe. I wouldn't mind to go.


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

sjwmoore said:


> You have to see Lincoln and Boston, not that far away. I agree, Ely is a lovely place, though the landscape around is a bit featureless. Kings Lynn is improving.
> 
> Southampton isnt too amazing for the visitor, unless your into ships, great views from Town Quay. The old town is pleasant.
> 
> ...



Nice thread on Southampton. I want to go on a trip around the Southern coastline of England. Anything on the Isle of Wight to see?? Do they have ferry rides from the main land?? 

BTW, Where is Warrington?

Thank you for the information!


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

NothingBetterToDo said:


> ^^ good gosh Macon4ever you have been to more places in the UK than me...and i've lived here all my life.


Really?? Wow, I feel great! Well, you do not have to travel very far, you got all you need in London; all the history, shopping, attractions, nightlife, you name it right at your finger tips. Well, England is small compared to the States. A 200 mile drive is not that far for me. Some of my English friends think of that (on scale to the American land size) as a trip from New York to Memphis, Tennessee, over 800 mile drive. I am trying to do as much as I can while I am here. I won't get many opportunities to come back to England whenever I am back in the States. 
It is also easy to go around to many places as I am in a relatively centralized place of England. 

Cheers!


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## Audiomuse (Dec 20, 2005)

neil said:


> Do you not fancy Manchester then^^


Fixed just for you! Of course I want to visit Manch! I just forgot to put it on the list. No worries! :cheers:


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## sjwmoore (Feb 17, 2005)

The Isle of Wight is pretty. It has multi colored cliffs at Alum Bay. a must see is Osborne House, where Queen Victoria used to live. Amazing house with gorgeous gardens. Carisbrooke Castle is impressive too. The ferry from Southampton or Portsmouth is shockingly expensive for a short trip. Worth a vist though.

Where is Warrington? You mean youve never heard of it??? 



ill no doubt be in East Anglia at some point over Xmas time- let me know if you fancy a pint!


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## Kiss the Rain (Apr 2, 2006)

^^ holy crap, it looks like Liverpool and Manchester will soon join and become one big megalopolis.


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## Pobbie (Jul 16, 2005)

^^believe me, that's not going to happen any time soon. We hate each other too much.


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## Tubeman (Sep 12, 2002)

Pobbie Rarr said:


> ^^believe me, that's not going to happen any time soon. We hate each other too much.


I can see a wall like what the Israelis have built around the Palestinians going up if they get too close!


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## neil (Jan 20, 2005)

Manchester and Liverpool love each other. 2 years ago Manchester City Council brought Liverpool City Council a valentine card. Ever since then it just been love.....


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## Pobbie (Jul 16, 2005)

Oh yeah, I forgot about that. We'll have to return the complement next year.


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## nothingman (Jul 3, 2005)

Liam-Manchester said:


> I really am struggling to believe this, particularly your comment about drivers. I've been in the US for almost 3 months and I can tell you that British drivers are 100 times better than American drivers. There is a good reason for this, and it's called a driving test. I haven't heard of a single person failing an American driving test and they are ridiculously easy to pass, and if you apply for a licence after the age of 18 you don't even need a test. I was in a girl's car the other day who had never taken a driving test but was driving to the shopping mall. And it DOES show, believe me, they are all bloody awful drivers. They are reckless, cut corners, cant stay within lines on the roads, change lanes without signalling, constantly cut people off and seem to gain a false sense of security from the wide roads and automatic cars, cruise control etc and it seems girls here just can't drive without talking on the phone. I was cringing all the way when I was being driven to Miami a couple of months back- the girl who was driving me was literally 5 feet from the car in front on the interstate, and she was driving at 80mph. That would not be acceptable in the UK. Our driving test is so stringent that you simply have to be ready to drive before you pass, and you have to be able to perform parallel parking which the vast majority of people in the US wouldn't have a hope of being able to do.
> 
> Expensive? Eating out is expensive in comparison to the US, yes. But grocery shopping is actually cheaper in the UK. I've been spending a lot more at the grocery store/supermarket since I've been here on not very much at all. Too much of the food in the US is processed, fresh food such as fruit, vegetables and meat is very poor here in comparison to the UK. At least for students, food is far better in the UK. The difference is Americans eat out more, a lot more. And I do prefer the restaurant experience in the US, as you always get good, efficient service, it's value for money and you get refills on drinks which I think is excellent. Supermarkets in the US though are poor- I really don't trust the food and what they put into it.
> 
> There are advantages and disadvantages of both countries. There is no way I would be able to get a 14" takeout pizza in the UK for $5.30. Eating out is cheaper in the US but you can still find cheap places in the UK. The UK countryside wins hands down, it's always pretty and interesting whereas Florida is rather boring in that regard. I don't thinl you could actually drive anywhere particularly interesting within 2 hours. At home I can be in spectacular scenery in 20 minutes. American tv is awful- you can flick through channels for 5 minutes and find nothing but commercials and I still haven't found anything worth watching apart from the occasional Champions League football/soccer games on ESPN 2. The weather here though is superb compared to the UK, as I'm a warm weather fan.


Liam, don't knock ALL American drivers....most are fine. You happened to be near Miami...the home of the worst drivers on earth. Drivers here are either morons in pickup trucks listening to reggaeton, 'chavs' driving Honda Civics, senile old people from somewhere cold in the northeast or valley girls with cell phones attached to their ears while driving.

You're right....Florida is boring though. You drive out of Miami and it's just flat, for hundreds of miles. The Everglades are cool, but it gets boring after a while....like "oh look, there's an alligator". Only once you get north of Orlando do you see anyhing resembling a hill.

American TV sucks....I watch BBC America and Fox Soccer Channel (which is similar to Sky Sports). It's like there's 500 channels, but you can never find anything to watch.

The weather here is great for 6 months of the year (from December to May), then it gets too hot and humid, then you enter hurricane season, where if a hurricane (or so much as weak piss-ass tropical storm) hits, you face being without power for up to 2 months (worst case scenario).

Gotta love it though...bitches are hot, beaches are good and Cuban food rules!


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