# The traffic light thread



## TheCat

I have long wanted to start a thread like this, so here goes  It perhaps is not
directly related to highways, but I think the main page of this forum is too
general.

So, post in this thread pictures and everything else related to the traffic lights
in your country, including any interesting rules/facts.

I have some thoughts on traffic lights. In many places around the world, and
in Ontario where I live, I don't like the traffic lights, because they allow drivers
to turn left when oncoming traffic is facing a green light, which I think is
quite dangerous and inconvenient when you have to turn left across multiple
lanes of fast traffic.

Another thing to consider is placement of traffic lights, before/after the
intersection, or both.

I lived in Israel before, and I think the traffic light system there is one of the
best I've seen in the world. This is why I'm going to start with it  I'll do Ontario after.

*Israel*

Interesting features:

Left turns are ALWAYS protected, i.e. you are never allowed to turn left if oncoming traffic faces a green light.
Most traffic lights have arrows above them that indicate which directions they control.
Traffic lights are always placed both before the intersection (at the stop line) AND after the intersection (across it).
If there is no arrow above a traffic light, it actually allows completely protected travel to ALL directions, even though traffic lights without arrows are rare.
Interesting thing that other countries (like Germany, UK) have: traffic light turns from red to red+yellow before turning green .
Green light flashes several times before turning yellow on roads with speed limits above 60km/h.
Right turn on red is not allowed; instead, in most intersections the right turn is separated from the main road by a physical island, and the driver is only required to yield to pedestrians (warned by a flashing yellow light).

Pictures:
Typical left turn:








Directional lights:








Separated right turn, left signal, and 2 sets (before & after the intersection):








The red+yellow phase:


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## TheCat

*Ontario, Canada*

I know that other provinces in Canada have slightly different rules, so I will
just cover Ontario.

Features:

Traffic lights are yellow .
Normally, turning left is allowed when oncoming traffic faces a green light (bad thing in my opinion), but on big intersections, there is a protected left phase for a few seconds before the normal green light appears.
Traffic lights are placed AFTER the intersection only (this is quite unique actually as far as I know).
Blinking green means fully protected signal (same as green light + left turn arrow).
Turning right on a red light is ALLOWED unless a sign says otherwise, but after coming to a complete stop.
Urban expressways that are controlled by traffic lights usually have separate left-turn signals, as also some busy downtown streets (the only exceptions to the rule).

Some pictures:
Normal light; the fourth phase is for the protected left arrow:








Busy street downtown: separate left turn signals, separate streetcar signals:








Same street as above (in Chinatown), only way to turn left is through oncoming traffic, also no right turn on red sign:


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## goschio

For some odd reason, traffic lights in Germany are before the intersection. This makes it very hard to see if you are the first car.


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## Maroon Grown

traffic lights in urban areas of australia are changing to led lights. they are much brighter and clearer to see.

the old incandescnt bulb with coloured face becomes harder to see with age as the cover gets dirtier, plus when the sun is low in the skyline, they are near impossible to see.


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## go_leafs_go02

Ontario traffic lights seem so luxurious compared to many. 

I find this especially in comparison to many states in the USA, where their traffic lights simply hang from two wooden poles and a string across the intersection where the lights hang.

Funny thing is, our temporary Construction lights are built to a higher standard than the permanent American lights in certain cases. (Michigan comes to mind)


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## Alex Von Königsberg

goschio said:


> For some odd reason, traffic lights in Germany are before the intersection. This makes it very hard to see if you are the first car.


I concur. They might be extremely hard to see. I like the Californian traffic lights because they are almost always positioned before and after intersection, and a lot of them are now LED. I wish the green light blinked before turning yellow, and there was a red-yellow phase before turning green, but oh well... It's still pretty good.


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## TheCat

Some lights in the US have a weird blinking white around the red light on
expressways to catch drivers' attention after a long monotonous drive.


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## invincible

Melbourne is apparently very generous with traffic lights.

And by that, I mean having lights on both sides of the road before the intersection, lights on both sides after the intersection, and an overhead one for good measure.

This set of signals is good fun too:








It has aspects for left and right turning traffic, straight ahead traffic, trams and bicycles.


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## Rebasepoiss

If I remember it correctly then all Stockholm's traffic lights are LED lights


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## Jimmy81

Edmonton, AB Canada has similar traffic light rules compared to Ontario. Here are some exceptions.

1) Our traffic lights are aligned horizontal instead of vertical.
2) Edmonton's back plate are black. I like the yellow ones better.
3) Edmonton does NOT have a green blinking light. Just a green blinking left turn arrow for advanced left turn.
4) When turning left, visibility of the traffic light is limited. As for Ontario, the visibility of traffic light vertical position when turning left is good...(ex: the picture with the FRONT ST intersection. That light is on the left hand side. In Edmonton, the ONLY ONE LIGHT light position is short and in the centre, harder for the second or third car to see what the light signal is. (I hope everyone understands this).
5) For traffic above 70 km/h with more than 3 lanes going one way, we do have warning signals, about maybe a hundred metres before the intersection, that the light will turn yellow and then red when approaching the intersection. It's actually quite accurate. Once the yellow light starts to blink, one knows to start breaking the car because the light will turn red when one reaches the intersection.
6) In the last 2 years, the entire city had gone LED on the lights. Now, I can't think of anywhere in the city that still has the old, traditional incandescent bults.

And of note, I do completely agree with The Cat that it's bad to turn left on a green signal. But I think the city allows this to reduce traffic jams. I could be wrong though.

Jimmy


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## go_leafs_go02

The blinking green light to signal advance left turns in Ontario I think is coming obsolete. In London, Ontario they don't exist, and i think the MTO (Provincial Highway) standard is to construct them with a separate turning light (like with four lights, Red, Yellow, Green, Advanced)


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## TheCat

Jimmy81 said:


> 5) For traffic above 70 km/h with more than 3 lanes going one way, we do have warning signals, about maybe a hundred metres before the intersection, that the light will turn yellow and then red when approaching the intersection. It's actually quite accurate. Once the yellow light starts to blink, one knows to start breaking the car because the light will turn red when one reaches the intersection.


That's interesting, do you mean there is a separate warning light about 100m away? If so, it's interesting to see pictures


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## Nozumi 300

remember not all of ontario has the same traffic lights, here in york region we have a set of lights strictly for turning and a seperate one for straightforward traffic, and example in what is found on hwy 7


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## TheCat

^^ I have actually mentioned that in the last point (#6) in my post on Ontario.
Ontario does have unified (i.e., "the same") traffic rules throughout, as these
matters in Canada are a provincial responsibility. The separate left turn signal
is just another feature of Ontario's laws (and yes, on an expressway like
Hwy 7 it makes sense to separate the lights). Regular city streets (including
busy ones) in York region still mostly use non-protected left turns. And by the
way, a lot of Spadina avenue (shown in some of the pictures) also has separate
signals. However, these are the exceptions to the rule.

On the other hand, in some countries (for example, Israel), there is never a
situation where one can turn left when oncoming traffic is facing a green light
(in fact, constructing such a traffic light is illegal, because drivers would assume
they have the right of way, even when turning). Note that this applies only in
the case of traffic lights; in the absence thereof, you must of course yield to
oncoming traffic.


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## TheCat

Heh we are just discussing Canada's traffic lights. Where are posts from other countries?


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## pilotos

For Greece:

1. Left turns are protected, there is always a sign above the traffic light that doesn't allow left turns.
2.Traffic lights that control a left or right direction have arrows instead of just a light.
3.Traffic lights are always placed before the intersection.
4.Traffic lights turn from red to green directly, but they turn to orange before turning red. 
5.On roads with speed limits above 50km/h, there is a warning light around 100 m before the intersection traffic light, if the warning light starts blinking(orange color), then in less than 20 secs the traffic light will turn red.


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## x-type

Croatia:

1. left turning is protected only if there are traffic lights with arrows. it often appears on large and important intersections and intersections with high traffic.
2. arrows are not as Israeli (signs under traffic lights), but lights have a shape of arrow.
3. green is often blinking 2 or 3 times before changing into yellow
4. german system: red -> red/yellow -> green -> blinking green -> yellow -> red
5. often there is a single traffic light which has only green right arrow. if it is turned on, that means that you may turn right, but with care (probably pedestrians have also green so you must let them pass first)
6. on non-protected left turnings there can be single left green arrow. if it is on, that means that oncoming traffic has red, so you may turn left witout danger. this arrow is allways located after intersection, so you can see it when you are waiting in the middle of intersection
7. traffic lights are allways located in front of intersection and a lot of intersections have lights also after it (not all!)


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## Maroon Grown

whats with the blinking light? in oz no light blinks unless the lights are faulty, in that case, the yellows blink.

we have traffic lights on both sides of the intersection plus overhead. its not uncommon to have view of 6-8 traffic lights on the approach to an intersection.


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## Norsko

In Norway traffic lights have been LED for the last three-four years.


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## Billpa

A light in the town of Baie-Saint-Paul, Québec. The province arranges its lights horizontally with the red in the shape of a stop-signish octagon; the amber, a diamond and green, a circle. Also note the provincial route marker and the countdown sign for pedestrians.


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## x-type

here in Croatia we have often horizontal traffic lights (on portals above road). i was quite surprised when some foreign people found it unusual


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## go_leafs_go02

Billpa said:


> A light in the town of Baie-Saint-Paul, Québec. The province arranges its lights horizontally with the red in the shape of a stop-signish octagon; the amber, a diamond and green, a circle. Also note the provincial route marker and the countdown sign for pedestrians.


First time I was in Quebec, I actually was confused and mistook them for railway crossing signals.

You do have vertically aligned lights as well, especially in cities and not so major intersections (Montreal comes to mind)


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## Chicagoago

go_leafs_go02 said:


> Ontario traffic lights seem so luxurious compared to many.
> 
> I find this especially in comparison to many states in the USA, where their traffic lights simply hang from two wooden poles and a string across the intersection where the lights hang.
> 
> Funny thing is, our temporary Construction lights are built to a higher standard than the permanent American lights in certain cases. (Michigan comes to mind)


Where did you see those? I've seen them in construction zones (temp lights), but I don't know if I've ever seen many that are just hanging on a rope. That's pretty cheap. 

The ones I see almost always look like this in the midwest:










Lights are hung above, and usually on either side of the street just above "walking" height. Poles are normally green or yellow/gold.

Left turn is allowed when traffic isn't coming, unless you get a green arrow. Green arrows are only at high traffic intersections, normally with a dedicated turn lane. This is different all around the country, as every city can do whatever they want to for stoplights. This of course creates a VAST variety of stoplights. I definitely notice this from say Florida to California to the Midwest.

In larger cities and more dense urban areas you will find these at many smaller intersections:










No overhead lights, just the two on each side of the road.

One thing I never realized until I moved here was the timing of stoplights in the US.

In Iowa, there is ALWAYS a 1-3 second delay from one light turning red to the next light turning green. This is to clear the intersection of cars waiting to turn left most of the time, and just for general safety.

In Chicago, I quickly found out, stoplights that turn red will signal the opposing traffic to turn green IMMEDIATELY. In Iowa, by the time the light turned green, opposing traffic had always cleared the intersection. In Chicago, your light will turn green, THEN the last car will fly through the intersection at times, and THEN the opposing turning traffic will make their turns and clear the intersection. This sometimes leads to 3 to up to 4-5 seconds of traffic clogging the intersection before you are clear to proceed through the green.

In the end it moves the same amount of traffic, but I was totally caught off guard by this when I moved here. In Iowa, everyone moves through when it's green. In Chicago you have to wait a few seconds after it turns green, but people will turn/pass through yellow and red lights at a greater frequency to make up for the loss of travel at the beginning of the cycle.

I also noticed the tradition of passing on urban 2 lane roads. When the light is about to turn green ( you can tell by looking at the walk signals on the other side of the street ) someone will start accelerating from 3-5 car lengths behind the first car waiting for the signal and pass at a decent amount of speed on the right edge of the road right as the light turns green. This lets people leapfrog over the few cars in front of them at the intersection. It works cause you can accelerate towards the intersection and blow through it as it turns green - whereas the first car in line would need a few seconds to speed up to your speed as you're going through the intersection. Obvioulsy this only works when no one is on the right side of the road waiting to turn right.

Of course this isn't "right" and it really pisses me off, but it gives people who are very impatient or bold a move to get ahead in traffic.

I haven't seen this in Iowa, and the few times I tried it there (just without thinking of where I was ) it REALLY freaked people out. I kinda felt bad. I only did this a few times when I moved here cause it kinda gives you a rush, but then I "grew up" and just waited my turn like most people.



Just looked out the window at the light outside my place  There are 24 different lights controlling the 3 two lane roads that intersect. One on the near side of the intersection to the right, one above the intersection, and then two on each side of the street on the far side. All this, and no turn signals or anything. 4 lights each way that are either all red, yellow or green at once.


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## Chicagoago

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=...208,-91.708916&spn=0.002345,0.007607&t=k&om=1

They also had these in Iowa. There's NO other poles or lights at a 6 lane X 6 lane intersection other than this one large pole going across the intersection at an angle. There are literally a few dozen lights on this one pole, for all 4 directions of traffic and turn lanes.

It's kinda crazy when you first see it, it's like a christmas tree. Works well though, I never heard any complaints...


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## TheCat

> In Chicago, I quickly found out, stoplights that turn red will signal the opposing traffic to turn green IMMEDIATELY.


Haha, I also noticed that on many intersections in Montreal when I visited there.
In Ontario lights also wait a few seconds before changing to allow left-turning
traffic to clear the intersection.

Quebec traffic lights are indeed horizontal (but doesn't seem to be so in
Montreal), and I took some pictures long ago. I'll post them later.


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## Holland

*Ontario province, Canada:*


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## go_leafs_go02

Chicagoago said:


> Where did you see those? I've seen them in construction zones (temp lights), but I don't know if I've ever seen many that are just hanging on a rope. That's pretty cheap.


I've been in Michigan the most, that's where they are most popular. You should check out their streetlighting too (its a small farmstyle lampfixture pointing downward hanging from a wire across the intersection.)


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## Chicagoago

I can't see most of the pictures, but from the 44 states I've seen, most traffic lights are not on strings.


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## Maxx☢Power

Maroon Grown said:


> whats with the blinking light? in oz no light blinks unless the lights are faulty, in that case, the yellows blink.


Blinking yellow lights in Europe (not sure is this is used all over Europe, but I would think so) are used mostly at night when there's not much traffic. Basically, it just means there's no lights and normal rules (yield to traffic coming from the right) apply.


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## Chicagoago

^ They use those in the US in many places as well.

From say 11pm until 6am the busiest road will just have flashing yellow lights, and the less busy road will have flashing red lights. Stop at the red, proceed "with caution" through the yellow.

Of course this is only in areas that aren't too busy at night, not at major intersections.


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## kub86

I think these lights actually look pretty cool.


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## x-type

in France and Spain i've seen traffic lights without green light. they have red, yellow and blinking yellow (instead of green). so when that blinking yellow appears, that means that you can pass, but with much care


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## TheCat

I've always wondered why most tunnels have traffic lights mounted above them,
never quite understood why. Is that in case there is a problem in the tunnel?
And if there is no problem, are they ever red? Because a lot of the time they
are actually on a highway.


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## Nicolás

^^ In Germany lots of traffic lights have just the yellow and the red light (most the time for pedestrians who are waiting and have to press a button on the traffic light). You may continue driving when the traffic light is off.


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## ChrisZwolle

Nicolás said:


> ^^ In Germany lots of traffic lights have just the yellow and the red light (most the time for pedestrians who are waiting and have to press a button on the traffic light). You may continue driving when the traffic light is off.


In Germany, i saw some traffic lights, when you want to turn left, crossing the other direction, the opposite direction gets green too, so although you have the green light, you still have to wait to turn left. 

Those situations in The Netherlands are quite rare.


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## Nicolás

^^ yep, it's very dangerous sometimes when the oncoming traffic is hidden by a car which turns right (into the street I want to turn left into). I was always afraid of situations like that when I was practicing for my driver's license. 
In very dangerous situations or in big cities on large roads the "green/yellow/red arrow light" often is used (like in the Netherlands).

Furthermore for turning right sometimes the green arrow-shield (next to the red light) is used which allows you to turn right on red (like in the US). But it's still very rare.


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## snupix

What is the red cross that can be seen on French roads on the opposite side of the traffic light?

It looks like this: +


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## x-type

TheCat said:


> I've always wondered why most tunnels have traffic lights mounted above them,
> never quite understood why. Is that in case there is a problem in the tunnel?
> And if there is no problem, are they ever red? Because a lot of the time they
> are actually on a highway.


because tunnels are very sensitive places and if a minor accident happens, it can be extremely dangerous. that's why tunnels are full of traffic lights. there is no reason for red if there is no problems in tunnel.


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## Justme

These are interesting. Where are they?


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## Justme

Traffic lights on the canals in Venice. Well... it is their streets...


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## Justme

Complicated intersection in London


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## Chicagoago

^ well it sure took someone long enough to post that pic, haha.

In regards to some posts earlier, most US stoplights are set up so you turn left on a green light against oncoming traffic.

In Chicago the habit is:

When the light turns green and you're turning left, you creep out into the center of the intersection as far as you can while still giving you enough room to complete a left turn. Cars behind you waiting to turn will creep up right behind you as well. You wait for the oncoming traffic to come through an intersection (many times the entire time it's green), and then when the light turns yellow - oncoming cars will stop on the other side of the street, and you and the 1-2 people behind you who managed to creep into the intersection to some degree will quickly turn left. 

If there are normally a lot of people turning left, this can really backup traffic, as you can only get 2-3 cars through the intersection per cycle. In these cases, the city will eventially realize this, and set up a turn lane with a dedicated green arrow.

Many times though, that green arrow only lasts about 3 seconds at the beginning of the cycle. This lets up to 3 cars go at the beginning of the cycle, then more cars will enter the intersection as they wait for oncoming traffic to drive through, and then those 2-3 cars will turn left at the end of the cycle. This lets twice as many cars through, but only needs a green arrow for a few seconds at the beginning of the cycle.


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## TheCat

Nicolás said:


> ^^ yep, it's very dangerous sometimes when the oncoming traffic is hidden by a car which turns right (into the street I want to turn left into). I was always afraid of situations like that when I was practicing for my driver's license.
> In very dangerous situations or in big cities on large roads the "green/yellow/red arrow light" often is used (like in the Netherlands). ...


Yes, this is also one of several things that make me nervous when driving. An even
bigger problem is if the road ahead slopes down and there are cars waiting to
turn left from the opposite direction, especially at night, and it's hard to see.

But the biggest problem is that one also has to yield to pedestrians. It is easy
to forget to look for pedestrians crossing the road on the far left when you
suddenly get the short opportunity to complete your turn across 3-4 lanes
of heavy traffic. That is why I really don't like the system in North America
and most other countries in the world.

I think on major streets left on "normal"
green should never be allowed, or perhaps only at night. During heavy traffic,
I don't see much advantage to this system, because usually cars simply
cannot complete the turn on green, and only do it when the light turns
yellow or red.


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## Alex Von Königsberg

Chicagoago said:


> In regards to some posts earlier, most US stoplights are set up so you turn left on a green light against oncoming traffic.
> 
> When the light turns green and you're turning left, you creep out into the center of the intersection as far as you can while still giving you enough room to complete a left turn. ... You wait for the oncoming traffic to come through an intersection (many times the entire time it's green), and then when the light turns yellow - oncoming cars will stop on the other side of the street, and you and the 1-2 people behind you who managed to creep into the intersection to some degree will quickly turn left.


It works the same on all intersections where you are allowed to turn left against the oncoming traffic. For instance, in San Francisco you will find very few intersections with protected left turn because with heavy traffic they tend to create a congestion. People do exactly what you described. 

In suburbia, on the other hand, almost all intersections have protected left turn. People get spoiled and then cannot adjust to the earlier situation quickly enough. In my city, there is such an intersection on a road that has one lane in each direction. This road has a local importance and bears a fairly large amount of traffic. Usually those who are turning left will pull as much to the middle and to the left of the intersection as possible and wait for the opportunity to turn. However, there are some people who won't know how to deal with such situation, and they will block the entire lane. After receiving a honk from drivers behind, they will usually give up and just drive straight without turning :lol:


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## Chicagoago

^ Chicago is the exact same. Compared to cities you see like LA or Dallas - a great deal of the main roads through neighborhoods in Chicago are two lanes in each direction as well. You have to know to pull into the exact middle of the street to allow others to "pass" you on the right and continue straight down the street. If people stop in the main lane of traffic turning left, people will get quite upset and honk at their ignorance of customs.

I was surprised when I moved to Chicago from smaller cities in the midwest - I assume all the main roads in Chicago would be at least 4 lanes since it was such a huge city. I love the fact that many of them are only 2 though, as it helps out pedestrians a lot, and gives the city a much more charming feeling.

There are many 4 lane roads of course, but they aren't everywhere (in the densest areas of the north side - basically every main road is 2 lanes ), they get larger as you go west and south - as these are the newer areas of the city.


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## Alex Von Königsberg

Chicagoago said:


> I love the fact that many of them are only 2 though, as it helps out pedestrians a lot, and gives the city a much more charming feeling.


^^ Agree. Aesthetically, they are much more pleasant than four-lane streets.


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## Jimmy81

TheCat said:


> That's interesting, do you mean there is a separate warning light about 100m away? If so, it's interesting to see pictures


I did see one of these in Waterloo ON when I lived there, but for some reason, they didn't work as well as they do in Edmonton. Timing doesn't seem that accurate. Here is the link from this website that has the picture.
(Fifth picture down "Approaching 142nd Street"

http://albertaroads.homestead.com/hwy16e/hwy16e3.html

Courtesy of Julian Macdonald who took the pictures.

In the picture, the warning light that you see in the picute will start to blink, and then the traffic light just in the distance will turn red once the car reaches the intersection (if the car travels at the correct speed).

Jimmy


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## x-type

ok, here are traffic lights in Croatia. this is not large intersection and it has T shape, so not many traffic lights, but here you can see the green right arrow which means that you may turn right, but be careful: probablay pedestrians have green, too!


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## -Corey-

Justme said:


> Complicated intersection in London


that's the ugliest thing i ever seen.


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## JKent

Edit


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## JKent

*In Mexico*


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## gugasounds

More mexican tarffic lights:

In Mexico City:


















In Monterrey:


















In Chihuahua:


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## xlchris

In The Netherlands;





































Bike Traffic Light Countdown;





Fasterdam (Includes trafficlights);


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## taiwanesedrummer36

*Portland, Oregon*

































*Taipei, Taiwan*

















*Seattle/Lynnwood, Washington*


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## nazrey

Putrajaya


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## radi6404

Chriszwolle said:


> In Germany, i saw some traffic lights, when you want to turn left, crossing the other direction, the opposite direction gets green too, so although you have the green light, you still have to wait to turn left.
> 
> Those situations in The Netherlands are quite rare.


That´s why a car hit me when I was a child, it was a painfull moment, a broken foot, but luckily nothing more. 

In Bulgaria Trafficlights have secondcaunters in order the people to know how much time they still have, yes, it´s awesome.


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## nazrey

Johor Bahru


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## sasuke41

this one in davao. it looks like the ones from los angeles


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## nazrey

Kuching


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## alvse

Typical traffic light in Perth, Western Australia


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## TheCat

taiwanesedrummer36 said:


> *Portland, Oregon*
> ...
> *Seattle/Lynnwood, Washington*
> ...


That looks quite interesting, because in every one of these pics, there is a dedicated left turn signal, and it seems that you may not turn left unless you have a green dedicated left turn arrow. I really like that.

Is that the case on all streets in these American cities, i.e., are there any traffic light-controlled intersections where you are allowed to turn left while oncoming traffic faces a green light too? Because in Toronto you can, and I really don't like that, and the same goes for other American east-coast cities, like New York.


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## Alex Von Königsberg

TheCat said:


> That looks quite interesting, because in every one of these pics, there is a dedicated left turn signal, and it seems that you may not turn left unless you have a green dedicated left turn arrow. I really like that.
> 
> Is that the case on all streets in these American cities, i.e., are there any traffic light-controlled intersections where you are allowed to turn left while oncoming traffic faces a green light too?


What you refer to is called a _protected left turn_. Most of intersections in west coast suburbs have protected left turn, while most of intersections in big cities (San Frncisco, Seattle, etc) don't have this type of intersection. Where I live now - a university city of 50,000 people - there are approximately 50% of intersections that have protected left turns. I think it is good when a road is wide enough and doesn't have a very heavy traffic, but otherwise it would create additional delay at the intersection. 

One intersection in my city has a traffic light that displays both green arrow and a usual circular light consecutively. When green arrow is on - your turn is protected and when the green circular light comes up, you have to yield to oncoming traffic before turning.


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## goschio

Perhaps its just me but I find traffic lights really exciting. :cheers:


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## Alex Von Königsberg

There is nothing better than a well-designed European roundabout! :lol:


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## ChrisZwolle

Alex Von Königsberg said:


> There is nothing better than a well-designed European roundabout! :lol:


Roundabouts are the safest possible intersections. Because you have to go on a low speed, so accidents turns out less deadly. 

Only, sometimes they overdo in roundabouts, in the new neighborhood Vathorst in the city of Amersfoort, they have like 15 roundabouts in a 4km circular road. hno:


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## TheCat

Alex Von Königsberg said:


> What you refer to is called a _protected left turn_. Most of intersections in west coast suburbs have protected left turn, while most of intersections in big cities (San Frncisco, Seattle, etc) don't have this type of intersection. Where I live now - a university city of 50,000 people - there are approximately 50% of intersections that have protected left turns. I think it is good when a road is wide enough and doesn't have a very heavy traffic, but otherwise it would create additional delay at the intersection.
> 
> One intersection in my city has a traffic light that displays both green arrow and a usual circular light consecutively. When green arrow is on - your turn is protected and when the green circular light comes up, you have to yield to oncoming traffic before turning.


Heh, yes, I am familiar with the term "protected left turn". I just found it interesting that on these pictures, even small intersections had a dedicated left turn signal, which made me wonder if they are mandatory on all intersections.

In Toronto, most suburban (and many urban) intersections have a protected left turn phase, but not separate signal, which is basically the same as the "green arrow and usual circular light" in your post. First, the green arrow comes on for a few seconds together with either green or red, and then the normal green comes on (or the arrow just disappears, if the green was already on). But of course, the lack of an advanced green is not prohibitive, i.e. you can still turn but only after yielding. In Toronto almost no intersections have completely separate left turn signals, but rather they have a left turn phase.

I think on large intersections with many lanes and heavy traffic, only separated left turn signals should be used, and perhaps at night or off-peak hours cars should be allowed to turn left even without an advanced green, but that's just my opinion.


----------



## invincible

Chriszwolle said:


> Roundabouts are the safest possible intersections. Because you have to go on a low speed, so accidents turns out less deadly.
> 
> Only, sometimes they overdo in roundabouts, in the new neighborhood Vathorst in the city of Amersfoort, they have like 15 roundabouts in a 4km circular road. hno:


That's nothing compared to the magic roundabout though. 

Being on an articulated bus while it navigates a roundabout is fun though. They just turn into giant speed humps.


----------



## DanielFigFoz

sasuke41 said:


> this one in davao. it looks like the ones from los angeles


That's Davão? For some reason I didn't picture it like that...


----------



## Alex Von Königsberg

Every small detail about this traffic light look American: the pole, the street sign, and even the pedestrian lights. The only thing that confuses me is why the traffic light is on the left side? In Philippines they drive on the right.


----------



## invincible

In Melbourne, it's common practice to install traffic lights on all four corners of an intersection.

Besides, it could just be on a median strip.


----------



## FREKI

A few Copenhagen intersections:


----------



## DanielFigFoz

Alex Von Königsberg said:


> Every small detail about this traffic light look American: the pole, the street sign, and even the pedestrian lights. The only thing that confuses me is why the traffic light is on the left side? In Philippines they drive on the right.



Davão is in India.




Wait a sec i'm think about Damão
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damão

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Davao_City

Yeah i's in the Phillipines. 
Mabye it's a one way road?



Copenhagen is nice!


----------



## gladisimo

^^ spot on

From the same account


----------



## Gareth

Some newer UK signals. They've started to mutate in the last fiver or so years after having the same standard design since 1970. The newer designs tend to be smaller and slicker, often with LEDs.










The previous standard signal.









The new style UK pedestrian signals, which I hate. 










Pre-1970 signal heads, someone is seeing on ebay. They were made out of tin, as opposed to plastic and had the word 'STOP' embossed on the red lense. They also had very distinctive stripy black and white poles, but I can't find any old photos of them.


----------



## rick1016

Weird how in parts of Canada and the US the fixture can be yellow, where as other places in the world it can be black. I've read that a yellow fixture helps grab attention.

What do you guys like better? It's a tough decision, because you can also kind of see the lights better when the fixture is black, then again yellow grabs attention and is more easily seen, especially at night. I guess it depends on the intersection, really.


----------



## Gareth

^^ Black with a sighting board is better. Remember that on of the aspects is yellow. Black gives the colours a better contrast.


----------



## Gareth

Found a photo of a vintage British traffic light. This is an old photo of London, of the St Pancras Street/Euston Road intersection. The signal will be from some time in the 1960s. The photo is probably also from the 1960s or 1970s. Notice the black and white pole and the 'STOP' command lense.


----------



## taiwanesedrummer36

Typical traffic signals from Everett, Washington:




























































































Typical traffic signals in Seattle, Washington:


----------



## Svartmetall

^^ Sheash and I thought New Zealand was over the top with the number of traffic lights at each intersection.

I much prefer black boards with a white stripe around my traffic lights. They're far more clear than the yellow I believe. Black provides a much better contrast to the lights on the traffic light as there is not one colour on there which doesn't show up clearly. The amber on traffic lights I imagine would be rather more difficult to see on a yellow traffic light.


----------



## TheCat

^^ Hehe in Israel they use black boards with white stripes on most lights, which is probably inspired from the UK. In Ontario we have yellow boards, which are fine usually but do make the lights harder to see in some conditions, such as direct sunlight.


----------



## TheCat

taiwanesedrummer36 said:


> Typical traffic signals from Everett, Washington:
> ...
> Typical traffic signals in Seattle, Washington:
> ...


As I commented before, I like the widespread use of dedicated left turn signals in these locales. Washington seems to do a good job.


----------



## Svartmetall

TheCat said:


> As I commented before, I like the widespread use of dedicated left turn signals in these locales. Washington seems to do a good job.


Most countries I've lived in or been to over a length of time seem to have protected turning on traffic lights - Green filter lights are common in the UK on major roads, same with Australia and New Zealand too. Germany I think has arrows on their traffic lights that allow protected turns.


----------



## invincible

In Melbourne, it's a bit 50/50 really.

Some intersections have no traffic light arrows, where right turning traffic _moves into the intersection_ (many drivers seem to not do this) and proceeds when there is no traffic coming the other way. Some will have the right turn arrow, but without the red arrow to allow right turns if there is no traffic in the opposite direction, and busy roads will include the red arrow.

On the other side of the spectrum, there's the crazy set of lights with 14 lamps - red yellow and green for each of left turning traffic, straight ahead traffic, right turning traffic and trams, plus a red and a green signal for cyclists, all mounted on a single fixture on a single pole.

1940's style timer:


----------



## rick1016

Hey is Victoria the only state in Australia that doesn't use the white stripe around the boards?


----------



## TheCat

In Toronto, unfortunately, you can turn left without a green arrow in pretty much all intersections, including very busy/wide ones, and sometimes with very limited visibility. In some cases I think it is just insane, like turning left from Dufferin/Allen Rd. onto Sheppard, while going south (for the locals, of course). That road is basically an expressway with 3 lanes into each direction, a downhill slope (while looking ahead) and a curve, with a speed limit of 70 km/h. It has a left turn arrow, but when it disappears, you can still turn on green after yielding, with almost no visibility.

And on the note of many lamps, I found it strange in NYC, where the left turn green and yellow arrows had separate lamps. In Toronto the same one turns into either colour.


----------



## Alex Von Königsberg

TheCat, unprotected left turns give you additional driving skills :lol: When I was in Vancouver, I noticed that there were indeed very few protected left turns, and, compared to Washington, they were very quick. Too quick for my taste. But hey, you would stop complaining if you saw an unprotected left turn in Russia across 3 lanes of busy traffic. In San Francisco, it can be the case too, but at least they prohibit left turns during rush hours.


----------



## RawLee

Traffic lights we have:


----------



## gugasounds

More mexican traffic lights

Tijuana:


----------



## TheCat

Alex Von Königsberg said:


> TheCat, unprotected left turns give you additional driving skills :lol: When I was in Vancouver, I noticed that there were indeed very few protected left turns, and, compared to Washington, they were very quick. Too quick for my taste. But hey, you would stop complaining if you saw an unprotected left turn in Russia across 3 lanes of busy traffic. In San Francisco, it can be the case too, but at least they prohibit left turns during rush hours.


Hehe, you may be right, I guess it mostly has to do with the overall culture. For example, in Israel, where all turns are protected, the rate of accidents is still higher. I just think that on some intersections, like the one I mentioned in my previous post, there is almost zero visibility and dedicated turn lights should be mandated. After all, we do have roads in Toronto (although not many) where separate dedicated left turn signals are installed. Perhaps I'll try to take some photos when I have the opportunity, but currently I'm busy with studies and don't have much opportunity to take out the car.

In downtown Toronto during rush hour we also have many streets with prohibited left turns, but that's mostly because the streetcars run in the left lane, and there is no space for left turn lanes, so obviously left turning traffic would impede the streetcars, which wouldn't be appreciated by people like me, who take it in the morning  Come to think of it, San Francisco is one of few places where like Toronto, they also have streetcars, so maybe that's the reason they prohibit left turns too.


----------



## go_leafs_go02

since there are alot of Ontarians in this thread. I got one quick question.

Is ontario the only place on earth to have a yellow back faceplate that surrounds the signal. I haven't seen that anywhere else!

And our Traffic signals seem to be built to a very high standard. Heck our temporary construction lights seem better than what is seen in many american states. Is that just me?


----------



## Alex Von Königsberg

TheCat said:


> Come to think of it, San Francisco is one of few places where like Toronto, they also have streetcars, so maybe that's the reason they prohibit left turns too.


Not really. In San Francisco, there are quite a few tram tracks, but normally they are located on rather narrow streets (two tracks, and one auto lane in each direction). I was referring to some wide 3+3 streets where oncoming traffics are separated by the kerb. Although they typically don't have a left turn pocket, you can still turn left but only during non-rush hours. I think the schedule is implemented to prevent hazardous situations associated with turning across three lanes of traffic and also to prevent the clogging of the left lane.

I wanted to show a picture of such intersection, but Google didn't let me. Try this - go to Google maps, type Laguna St & Lombard St, San Francisco, CA and choose Street View. Then look East on Lombard


----------



## TheCat

go_leafs_go02 said:


> since there are alot of Ontarians in this thread. I got one quick question.
> 
> Is ontario the only place on earth to have a yellow back faceplate that surrounds the signal. I haven't seen that anywhere else!
> 
> And our Traffic signals seem to be built to a very high standard. Heck our temporary construction lights seem better than what is seen in many american states. Is that just me?


No, we're not the only ones. I've seen many yellow traffic lights in NYC, and I think (by looking at pictures) in Mexico they have them too, although our faceplate seems to be bigger and wider. Our signals are indeed built to a pretty high standard, and higher than some US locales (but not everywhere, as many of the photos in this thread show, particularly on the west coast). One strange thing I noticed in NYC is that they had 2 lamps for the left turn phase, one for each of the green and yellow arrows. On the other hand, in Ontario we have just one arrow which turns from green to yellow. Also, I think they should replace all of our traffic lights to use LEDs. I've seen many LED lights in Mississauga, but in Toronto they are still mostly lamps.



Alex Von Königsberg said:


> Not really. In San Francisco, there are quite a few tram tracks, but normally they are located on rather narrow streets (two tracks, and one auto lane in each direction). I was referring to some wide 3+3 streets where oncoming traffics are separated by the kerb. Although they typically don't have a left turn pocket, you can still turn left but only during non-rush hours. I think the schedule is implemented to prevent hazardous situations associated with turning across three lanes of traffic and also to prevent the clogging of the left lane.
> 
> I wanted to show a picture of such intersection, but Google didn't let me. Try this - go to Google maps, type Laguna St & Lombard St, San Francisco, CA and choose Street View. Then look East on Lombard


That makes sense, but that's exactly the problem - almost all major streets in Toronto outside of downtown, and in the suburbs, are 3 lanes in each direction, and most have extremely heavy traffic during rush hour. However, you may turn left without a dedicated left turn signal on pretty much all of them. I looked at the intersection that you mentioned in SF, it looks very similar to many intersections in Toronto.

Surprisingly, I was able to find a picture of the exact intersection in Toronto I was talking about earlier, although unfortunately it is somewhat far to see clearly. I don't know if it's very clear, but one can see that the visibility of oncoming traffic there is minimal, because the cars are coming uphill towards you. Especially, it is often not clear if a car is in the left-turn lane, or just coming toward you in the left-most through lane. Overall, including the turn lane, there are 4 lanes there into the oncoming direction. Also, this road is actually a part of a partially-built (but stopped) expressway, with a speed limit of 70 km/h. It is perhaps not that bad, but this is one turn I make relatively often to get to the subway station, and sometimes in heavy traffic it just pisses me off 

Here is the not-so-great picture:


----------



## Czas na Żywiec

Just a quick question, maybe a stupid one, but I'm curious.

I've lived in the States for the majority of my life. And here, when you are waiting on red light, it goes straight to green. They only use the yellow light right before the red one.

But in Poland, the traffic lights go in this sequence. It is green, then goes to yellow for a few seconds, then ends on red to stop. Then after being on red for a while, it goes back to yellow for a few seconds and then eventually to green.

Is this the standard across Europe? I didn't notice this in other countries in Europe (I suppose I should have but I didn't bother to notice, too busy trying to get to my hostel and such ) I was kind of confused at first, wondering why they needed the yellow light before the green one, since here yellow means "yield" while red means "complete stop." Thanks for any info.


----------



## go_leafs_go02

TheCat said:


> No, we're not the only ones. I've seen many yellow traffic lights in NYC, and I think (by looking at pictures) in Mexico they have them too, although our faceplate seems to be bigger and wider. Our signals are indeed built to a pretty high standard, and higher than some US locales (but not everywhere, as many of the photos in this thread show, particularly on the west coast). One strange thing I noticed in NYC is that they had 2 lamps for the left turn phase, one for each of the green and yellow arrows. On the other hand, in Ontario we have just one arrow which turns from green to yellow. Also, I think they should replace all of our traffic lights to use LEDs. I've seen many LED lights in Mississauga, but in Toronto they are still mostly lamps.


The green and yellow arrows depends on what area you are in. There are plenty of 5 light signals (Red, Yellow, Green, Yellow Arrow, Green Arrow) in Ontario. Hamilton uses them in many places, and I know Chatham the same way.

As for the LED conversion. It's happening. London did it about 2 years ago, all within a few months, including all pedestrian signals. They removed the old two light pedestrian signal (Hand over the Walking Person) and replaced them all with a single light where the signals are LED and overlapping.

All new lights are LED that are being installed now, and it is a rather large cost to replace them all at once.


----------



## TheCat

Czas na Żywiec;16512390 said:


> Just a quick question, maybe a stupid one, but I'm curious.
> 
> I've lived in the States for the majority of my life. And here, when you are waiting on red light, it goes straight to green. They only use the yellow light right before the red one.
> 
> But in Poland, the traffic lights go in this sequence. It is green, then goes to yellow for a few seconds, then ends on red to stop. Then after being on red for a while, it goes back to yellow for a few seconds and then eventually to green.
> 
> Is this the standard across Europe? I didn't notice this in other countries in Europe (I suppose I should have but I didn't bother to notice, too busy trying to get to my hostel and such ) I was kind of confused at first, wondering why they needed the yellow light before the green one, since here yellow means "yield" while red means "complete stop." Thanks for any info.


Are you sure that it goes from yellow to green? I think it's supposed to be from red+yellow to green. In any case, it is not a European standard by any means, but some countries like the UK, Germany, the Baltic countries, Croatia, Poland (apparently), and some others use this. Israel is another country that uses this sequence. The reason for this is mostly historical, and apparently is intended to allow drivers to change into the correct gear before the light switches to green. In North America, and I presume any other place where the majority of vehicles use automatic transmission, this would be unnecessary or for aesthetic purposes only.

Whether there is any benefit in this phase is hard to say, although according to some it actually has a disadvantage, since drivers tend to start moving before the green light appears. From what I heard (and I may be wrong), some countries have canceled this phase for this reason.



go_leafs_go02 said:


> The green and yellow arrows depends on what area you are in. There are plenty of 5 light signals (Red, Yellow, Green, Yellow Arrow, Green Arrow) in Ontario. Hamilton uses them in many places, and I know Chatham the same way.
> 
> As for the LED conversion. It's happening. London did it about 2 years ago, all within a few months, including all pedestrian signals. They removed the old two light pedestrian signal (Hand over the Walking Person) and replaced them all with a single light where the signals are LED and overlapping.
> 
> All new lights are LED that are being installed now, and it is a rather large cost to replace them all at once.


That's very interesting, as I've never seen a single 5-phase traffic light in the GTA. Nice to know


----------



## Alex Von Königsberg

Czas na Żywiec;16512390 said:


> But in Poland, the traffic lights go in this sequence. It is green, then goes to yellow for a few seconds, then ends on red to stop. Then after being on red for a while, it goes back to yellow for a few seconds and then eventually to green.
> 
> Is this the standard across Europe? I didn't notice this in other countries in Europe


Like TheCat said, it's supposed to change from Red to Red+Yellow to Green. It is not the standard in Europe, but I know for sure that exUSSR countries, Eastern European countries and Germany have this phase. 

If you noticed, the main traffic lights in Europe are positioned before the intersection, so you can't see the traffic light for the cross traffic. Plus, everyone is driving manual cars. In America, since the traffic lights are after the intersections, you can easily see what light the cross traffic is facing. So if you memorise the light pattern well, you can easily figure out when your light will turn green.


----------



## Gareth

Alex Von Königsberg said:


> Like TheCat said, it's supposed to change from Red to Red+Yellow to Green. It is not the standard in Europe, but I know for sure that exUSSR countries, Eastern European countries and Germany have this phase.


It depends on the state. From the top of my head, the following countries have red&amber: UK, Iceland, Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Germany, Switzerland, Austria, Hungary plus many parts of eastern Europe but I'm not so sure in that region.

Notable exceptions are Ireland, France, Spain, Portugal and Italy.

Red&Amber is also used in Hong Kong, Macau and some provinces of mainland China. Some Australian states used to use it too, such as Victoria, where there are still some examples, but federal standards phased them out.



Alex Von Königsberg said:


> If you noticed, the main traffic lights in Europe are positioned before the intersection, so you can't see the traffic light for the cross traffic. Plus, everyone is driving manual cars. In America, since the traffic lights are after the intersections, you can easily see what light the cross traffic is facing. So if you memorise the light pattern well, you can easily figure out when your light will turn green.


Not in the UK, Ireland nor, I think, the much rest of Northern Europe. Here, you have signals both at and beyond the stopline. 

Another almost uniquely British convention (as I've only actually seen it in the UK, Ireland, Hong Kong & Macau) is that pedestrians are never given a walk phase with traffic going in the same direction. There has to be no vehicle traffic whatsoever being directed over the crosswalk in order for the green man to come on.


----------



## rick1016

I've also noticed in the GTA that newer installations are usually the 12" by 12" by 12" setups, as opposed to the 12" by 8" by 8" setups. Anyone else notice this?

I was told by my driving instructor that back in the day, they would do this because when they used lamps, the lights were harder to see, and a larger red one would be easier to see.

Also, TheCat or anyone else, do you know fo any black panel lights in Ontario?


----------



## go_leafs_go02

rick1016 said:


> I've also noticed in the GTA that newer installations are usually the 12" by 12" by 12" setups, as opposed to the 12" by 8" by 8" setups. Anyone else notice this?
> 
> I was told by my driving instructor that back in the day, they would do this because when they used lamps, the lights were harder to see, and a larger red one would be easier to see.
> 
> Also, TheCat or anyone else, do you know fo any black panel lights in Ontario?


The city of Hamilton uses black panel lights. If you are talking about the actual signal.

They are the exception I believe. Everywhere else lights are completely yellow, (signal and backing) but Hamilton has a black signal and yellow backing.

Looks kinda stupid if you ask me, but whatever.


----------



## Jardoga

*Traffic Light Thread*

Post pics of your town or city/and or other towns or cities traffic lights.

There are so many different kinds !

Ill start

Melbourne.


----------



## Alex Von Königsberg

Gareth said:


> I don't see the point of flashing green to warn of a change to amber. Surely the point of amber is to warn of the change to red. Amber doesn't need its own warning.


When the speed is higher than 60 km/h, flashing green becomes a very useful feature.


----------



## Billpa

When I lived in NJ there was a pretty fast road I used a lot with speeds of 50 mph / 80 kph WITH traffic lights. They use a very long amber. I agree with Gareth. The AMBER is the warning.  What good is a flashing green?


----------



## Rebasepoiss

^^ I'm used to flashing green and I think it's great. Imagine being only 5m from the junction going 60km/h and the light turns amber. It's too late to brake but crossing the junction would be against the law(at least in here). So where's the solution?


----------



## Assemblage23

Billpa said:


> When I lived in NJ there was a pretty fast road I used a lot with speeds of 50 mph / 80 kph WITH traffic lights. They use a very long amber. I agree with Gareth. The AMBER is the warning. What good is a flashing green?


Flashing green will give you a few seconds ahead notice that the red is coming. When a car is traveling at fast speeds, those few seconds will make a difference.


----------



## Billpa

Assemblage23 said:


> Flashing green will give you a few seconds ahead notice that the red is coming. When a car is traveling at fast speeds, those few seconds will make a difference.


I understand, but my point is the amber is the light that's used for the red warning. And again, to the poster above you, the ambers on the higher speed roads in NJ are very long- so it gives those who can, time to stop...those that can't will travel through the amber but not the red- it is not illegal here to travel through amber, only red.


----------



## Jeroen669

Rebasepoiss said:


> I'm used to flashing green and I think it's great. Imagine being only 5m from the junction going 60km/h and the light turns amber. It's too late to brake but crossing the junction would be against the law(at least in here). So where's the solution?


Keeping the amber light long enough, depending on speed limits. Here you are allowed to pass the crossing on amber light, so that gives you the choise whether you can brake safe or not. As far as I know this counts for most of the countries, at least in Western Europe...


----------



## Ron2K

It's the same here - you can travel through the amber.

Unfortunately, the concept of a long amber for high speed roads hasn't hit Durban at all.

Some South African rules:


Flashing red: stop at intersection, then proceed if safe to do so.
Flashing amber: you may proceed, but give way to traffic already in the intersection.
Flashing green arrow: you have right of way if proceeding in the direction of the arrow. (Commonly used on right turns.)


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Yes, the amber lights should have a longer duration with higher speed limits. Driving 70km/h, it takes some distance to stop, without making an emergency stop. But in my city, there are red light camera's installed at some intersections, making people brake like crazy if the amber light pops up. This had led to numerous collisions.


----------



## Billpa

^^Red light cameras I think are a bad idea for that reason alone.
I think if there's a problem intersection, one where people are cruising through red lights all the time, the best solution would be stepped up enforcement from real live humans- not machines with electronic eyes.


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## ChrisZwolle

^^ But that costs more money, than it brings in, you know. Government point of view is: traffic safety must make money, not cost money hno:


----------



## Billpa

Chriszwolle said:


> ^^ But that costs more money, than it brings in, you know. Government point of view is: traffic safety must make money, not cost money hno:


True....everything has a profit motive I suppose.

I recently watched a news report about a guy from one of the Atlanta suburbs who got a red light camera ticket in the mail- but he was out of town when it happened. Turns out it WAS his car that went through the light but it was being driven by a guy who was working on his car- the man who got the ticket was having his vehicle worked on while he was away. Now it's up to HIM to prove that someone else should get the ticket. That's so backwards!


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## ChrisZwolle

In Germany, they have to light the car from ahead, so the drivers face is recognizable. This reduces the amount of sneaky camera's behind signs and trees, which are obviously installed to make money.


----------



## Jardoga

Gareth said:


> Fun crossing tune in Poland.


LOL That sounds like little kids toy tune...

haha :lol:


----------



## traffic-light-man

Hey,

Sorry to dig up an old thread, but this is my first post here, and thought there would be no better place to do it other than in a thread about my main interest!

If you'd like more information, please check out my website.

Thanks, Simon.


----------



## TheCat

Thanks for digging up my thread I guess :lol:, and welcome to the forum! You're welcome to discuss the matter now


----------



## LtBk

Does anybody here has problems with poorly timed traffic lights?


----------



## ChrisZwolle

I noticed that it's really important if there are a lot of traffic lights on a certain through route that they are very good adjusted to eachother, otherwise it becomes a mess. 

I loved the "green wave" they had in the 1980's in the Netherlands, but they turned that into bus priorities so you have to stop all the time to let a (nearly) empty bus pass, sometimes even if the bus and other traffic are heading for the same direction, they stop the traffic to let the bus pass it on a special lane. Really nuts, because only a minute later all that traffic has overtaken the bus again.


----------



## staff

Barcelona;


----------



## Svartmetall

LtBk said:


> Does anybody here has problems with poorly timed traffic lights?


Yes, every single one in New Zealand that I've come across. As soon as one set changes green, the set ahead changes red. It's a huge problem and wastes both fuel and time. There are about five or six bus priority traffic lights alone meaning that there is little benefit for buses over cars. All in all it makes for very frustrating journeys.

</rant>


----------



## LtBk

Its a problem here too in state of Maryland.


----------



## Rebasepoiss

ChrisZwolle said:


> I noticed that it's really important if there are a lot of traffic lights on a certain through route that they are very good adjusted to eachother, otherwise it becomes a mess.
> 
> I loved the "green wave" they had in the 1980's in the Netherlands, but they turned that into bus priorities so you have to stop all the time to let a (nearly) empty bus pass, sometimes even if the bus and other traffic are heading for the same direction, they stop the traffic to let the bus pass it on a special lane. Really nuts, because only a minute later all that traffic has overtaken the bus again.


Green wave makes drivers stick to the speed limit too. In Tallinn we also have a lot of intersection where there is a bus priority, but it works only when a bus is behind schedule, which is reasonable IMO.


----------



## Glodenox

snupix said:


> What is the red cross that can be seen on French roads on the opposite side of the traffic light?
> 
> It looks like this: +


I doubt the person who posted this will read this, but here's the answer nonetheless: it shows you the position of the traffic lights from the opposite direction. Most of the time they only use a green arrow to the left as clearing signal telling you it's safe to turn left.










They use the plus sign seeing it can hardly ever be confused with a normal traffic sign I guess. They're also pretty common in Belgium.

I had never heard or seen any flashing red signals. Seems like a nice way to make even more sure people will be cautious when they are going to cross the intersection when traffic lights are off, but it could also result in people just waiting there not knowing what is going on.

As for tram and bus signals here, they often use the same traffic lights as cars, but very often they have their own set of lights which hardly look like normal traffic signals:

"orange" light:









"red" light:









Allowed to drive through straight forward (in this case, no tram or bus would go left or right):









Allowed to drive to the left only:









Allowed to only drive straight forward:









EDIT: found this handy image on Wikipedia:








It shows the triangle which is a "green" light that allows public transportation to go to any direction they want.
The signalisation above is the one used in The Netherlands and mean the exact same thing.

Sadly enough the traffic lights go directly from green to yellow to red and then back to green without any indication of them going to change. Especially since driving through yellow can be penalised for the same amount as for driving through red now, I would've loved them to give some sort of indication first 

Some more images I got from http://www.vab.be/ :


















What I hadn't seen yet in this topic are traffic lights for bicycles:









Greetings,
Glodenox


----------



## Gareth

Glodenox said:


> They use the plus sign seeing it can hardly ever be confused with a normal traffic sign I guess. They're also pretty common in Belgium.
> 
> I had never heard or seen any flashing red signals. Seems like a nice way to make even more sure people will be cautious when they are going to cross the intersection when traffic lights are off, but it could also result in people just waiting there not knowing what is going on.


You get flashing red lights in Spain. They're the same as the + ones you get in France, just without the +, obvously. It's not at all imediately obvious what they mean for a foreigner though.


----------



## TheCat

Glodenox said:


> I doubt the person who posted this will read this, but here's the answer nonetheless: it shows you the position of the traffic lights from the opposite direction. Most of the time they only use a green arrow to the left as clearing signal telling you it's safe to turn left.
> 
> ...
> 
> Greetings,
> Glodenox


Thanks for this post, it was interesting to read 

Some comments:

- Regarding flashing red, in North America (well, US and Canada, not sure about Mexico) a flashing red signal is equivalent to a stop sign, and usually appears together with the sign. It is used in places where there is a chance that the driver will not notice the stop sign (for example, on a dark road that hasn't had any signs/lights for a while). It usually appears as a single flashing red light, not part of a complete traffic light. The behaviour at such a signal is dependent on whether or not it represents an all-way stop or a regular 2-way stop, which can usually be determined by looking at the accompanying stop sign. More on this here and here.

- Regarding the public transportation signals, it is somewhat interesting, but Ontario also has (a subset of) such signals. I wonder if other locations in North America have them too, but maybe it has to do with the fact that Toronto is one of very few cities in North America that still has a streetcar (tram) system. More on this here.


----------



## Gareth

Hong Kong's tram signals are just like normal signals, but the green is replaced by an amber 'T'.


----------



## Glodenox

TheCat said:


> - Regarding flashing red, in North America (well, US and Canada, not sure about Mexico) a flashing red signal is equivalent to a stop sign, and usually appears together with the sign. It is used in places where there is a chance that the driver will not notice the stop sign (for example, on a dark road that hasn't had any signs/lights for a while). It usually appears as a single flashing red light, not part of a complete traffic light. The behaviour at such a signal is dependent on whether or not it represents an all-way stop or a regular 2-way stop, which can usually be determined by looking at the accompanying stop sign. More on this here and here.


Ooh, I see. As a separate light, I can understand it wouldn't confuse anybody who doesn't really know what it means 

Greetings,
Glodenox


----------



## traffic-light-man

Gareth said:


> Hong Kong's tram signals are just like normal signals, but the green is replaced by an amber 'T'.


In thier Philips/Serco heads, adapeted to the British Stnadards!

Here are some more UK piccies from my private collection of pictures:

Cycle and Pedestrian signals. Cycle heads are just vehicular heads with Cycle masks over the Amber and Green aspect. They are not normally mounted next to each other either. This pic is two pictures, joined together so you can see the R,A and G lit all at once.









This one shows the difference between Fibre Optic (right) arrow, and Standard (left) arrow.









And the Techmiracle/MOTUS AluStar. This is the Swarco AnuStar, modified for use on british roads; it has a larger gap between lenses, is all black, and has a retro-reflective border. This design is now around 2-3 years old only.




































I've got looaaaads of pictures of signals in the UK, but to be honest, after the differences in designs, there is only so far you can go with configuration combinations too, as the UK law is strict on these things.

All TSEU MSH heads in this pic. Here on the left, you see the pre-2003 Symbolic aspect. All symbols had to be 300mm. The right is the post-2003 200mm Symbolic aspect, after this date all arrows and pedestrian heads had to be 200mm. Direct replacement parts and temorary signals, however, can still carry 300mm symbols, so in theory, this could have been replaced with a 300mm arrow. For uniformitary, this signal has actually been replaced, as I say, with a 300mm arrow!!!









Yes, Gareth, Old Swan TESCO exit secondaries.:laugh:


----------



## WalkTheWorld

just another pedestrian/bicycle sign from my hometown...


----------



## Glodenox

It's weird to see a green light being bigger than the rest. I'm not sure in which country it was, but I recall seeing red lights being bigger than the other lights quite a lot somewhere...

Another nice example of "more isn't always better" (Germany):









EDIT: now I remember: it was Italy.

Greetings,
Glodenox


----------



## TheCat

Glodenox said:


> I'm not sure in which country it was, but I recall seeing red lights being bigger than the other lights quite a lot somewhere...


In Toronto it's often (though not always) the case too:


----------



## WalkTheWorld

^^
Before the LED age it was perfectly normal to have a 300mm red on top of 200mm orange and green And now I see Toronto is a lot like the US, it was so funny the first time I went to NYC..."ok, let's gross the street...it's white!"


----------



## Timon91

That part of Toronto looks like Asia 
Bigger red lights is better, at least it is a bit more visible, thus safer.


----------



## Rebasepoiss

Some pedestrian traffic lights in Tallinn have double red...*(Pic by Ch1le)
*









And some have a countdown display . Pic from flickr:


----------



## Timon91

I like the countdown display. And what is the use of the double red? I've seen it in Germany before.


----------



## Rebasepoiss

^^ I don't know. Maybe to be more notable to pedestrians.


----------



## Glodenox

The same seems to be done in the traffic lights for public transportation... Could it be it first shows the middle red light and then both red lights? Sort of the same as an orange or amber light, but just in red? (or perhaps the opposite happens: from two reds to one and then to green?)

Greetings,
Glodenox


----------



## go_leafs_go02

Timon91 said:


> That part of Toronto looks like Asia
> Bigger red lights is better, at least it is a bit more visible, thus safer.


you'll never see 200mm or 8" signals in ontario, or anywhere I believe in North America on their own. And I believe outside of BC..we're the only ones to have the 12" Red and 8" amber and green signals. 

However, depends on the municipality...alot of places in ontario do use the 12" (300mm) signals across the board (red, amber, and green) London doesn't. Toronto doesn't. Hamilton doesn't, but Burlington, Mississauga do.


----------



## I-275westcoastfl

LtBk said:


> Does anybody here has problems with poorly timed traffic lights?


Like you wouldn't believe!!


----------



## TheCat

go_leafs_go02 said:


> you'll never see 200mm or 8" signals in ontario, or anywhere I believe in North America on their own. And I believe outside of BC..we're the only ones to have the 12" Red and 8" amber and green signals.
> 
> However, depends on the municipality...alot of places in ontario do use the 12" (300mm) signals across the board (red, amber, and green) London doesn't. Toronto doesn't. Hamilton doesn't, but Burlington, Mississauga do.


Yeah you're right, although it seems to me that newer lights usually don't have the larger red light (for example, most lights uptown seem to be the same size throughout). At some intersections I noticed that one light (typically the right one) has the larger red light, whereas the second light (usually the centre one) doesn't.

With regards to size, I noticed that NYC generally has very small traffic lights. This possibly has something to do with their move to LED lights.

Luckily we also seem to be moving to LED lights slowly. I noticed something strange though - many intersections that have two lights (i.e. one on the right side and one in the centre) often have one light that is LED and the other isn't. Is that a way of the city to experiment with the lights?

Also, almost all the pedestrian lights in Toronto now have countdown timers (these have been installed very recently in many parts of the city). That's a good thing.


----------



## WalkTheWorld

I-275westcoastfl said:


> Like you wouldn't believe!!


Like in amber, one, two, three, red, flash, picture taken, fine?


----------



## Timon91

About the German ones: Cute 

The Dutch ones unfortunately look like the Australian one. Boring hno:


----------



## JonAxDrayda

Timon91 said:


> About the German ones: Cute
> 
> The Dutch ones unfortunately look like the Australian one. Boring hno:


The Belgian lights have an interesting cycle; but you really have to see them to give an opinion. (There is no such thing as a "Dutch light"; Belgium and the Netherlands (Holland) have completely different cycles(, where the Netherlands' ones are completely annoying).)

Belgium traffic lights have many cycles. But I'd have to tape one in action for real understandability.

Anyway, see ya!


----------



## tjkb230

Take a look at this
Japanese traffic light!
But who can explain why the traffic lights behave like this?


----------



## Timon91

@JonAxDrayda: I was actually talking about the pedestrian traffic lights, sorry for not being clear.


----------



## JonAxDrayda

Timon91 said:


> @JonAxDrayda: I was actually talking about the pedestrian traffic lights, sorry for not being clear.


Oops, sorry. My bad. :? The pedestrian lights from Germany are indeed cute. ^_^ And the Dutch ones (in this case, the "Dutch ones" is correct) are indeed plain the same everywhere. 

Oh, well. We're used to them, so we gotta live with it here. XD



tjkb230 said:


> Take a look at this
> Japanese traffic light!
> But who can explain why the traffic lights behave like this?


I think the arrows go on first to indicate a protected phase: the drivers to whom the lights are dedicated to can turn safely in the direction of the arrows. It's actually visible by looking at the cars coming from the other side. They remain stationair until the main green signal is active. And I think the amber and red phase between the green arrows and the main green signal is to indicate that the protected phase is about to end, because the drivers (nearly) keep on driving through this phase.

A bit weird, though, but they work like that, so I won't complain. (I'm a HUGE traffic-fan, BTW! I simply love everything, anything about traffic! That's why I won't complain with other countries' signal sequences.)



Svartmetall said:


> ^^ They also have the ampelfrau in places as well! These little missies can be found in Dresden.


I thought I saw earlier in this thread similar lights in France, but appear slightly different. I'll search for it and edit this post as soon as I found them.


----------



## DELCROID

These are traffic lights in Venezuela. There are both types - vertical and horizontal. The colours are just the standard red, amber and green and then some have green directional arrows:

































































































































































































(more venezuelan traffic lights: #277, p.14)

.


----------



## JonAxDrayda

DELCROID said:


> These are traffic lights in Venezuela. There are both types - vertical and horizontal. The colours are just the standard red, amber and green and then some have green directional arrows:
> 
> ...


Wow, this will become one LONG page...


----------



## Nexis

*Whats that Light with an Red X in it? Does it change to a green Arrow?*


----------



## JonAxDrayda

Nexis said:


> *Whats that Light with an Red X in it? Does it change to a green Arrow?*


Those are the Lane Control signals.








































The green arrow (always points down) simply means that you can use this lane.
The yellow arrow(s) (always pointing to the left and/or right) mean(s) that the lane is closing up ahead, and that you need to go to the lane(s) next to it.
The red cross simply means that you can not drive on this lane.

Site with more info on Lane Control Lights can be found here.


----------



## Natomasken

JonAxDrayda said:


> Those are the Lane Control signals.
> 
> The green arrow (always points down) simply means that you can use this lane.
> The yellow arrow(s) (always pointing to the left and/or right) mean(s) that the lane is closing up ahead, and that you need to go to the lane(s) next to it.
> The red cross simply means that you can not drive on this lane.
> 
> Site with more info on Lane Control Lights can be found here.


I wonder if that's the case here. It seems odd that you'd have vehicles sitting waiting for the lane to open up. From the streetlights, it also looks like it's on a divided road. Maybe the poster can explain.


----------



## JonAxDrayda

Natomasken said:


> I wonder if that's the case here. It seems odd that you'd have vehicles sitting waiting for the lane to open up. From the streetlights, it also looks like it's on a divided road. Maybe the poster can explain.


Oh, I didn't notice that there were 2 countdown timers on the traffic light pole. That indeed makes it regular traffic lights. Although I wonder where these appear...

I've never seen such lights, unless they were the Lane Control Signals I talked about earlier. Sorry, can't help you much here.


----------



## davsot

Maroon Grown said:


> traffic lights in urban areas of australia are changing to led lights. they are much brighter and clearer to see.
> 
> the old incandescnt bulb with coloured face becomes harder to see with age as the cover gets dirtier, plus when the sun is low in the skyline, they are near impossible to see.



I agree with your description of the sun thing. Good thing they're changing to LED here in Puerto Rico, too! kay:


----------



## TheCat

JonAxDrayda said:


> - - There is the green arrow light, placed on the left side across the junction, pointing only to the left: this light is also called an "Evacuation Arrow", or "Ontruimingspijl" in Dutch. After the normal flow of traffic (usually, when you cross the junction here as a driver, the other side also has green), the other side gets an earlier red. 1 second after it does, this arrow light will start to burn until 2 seconds in the all-red. When this arrow light burns, the driver(s) that want to turn left and are standing still on the junction are ordered to evacuate and clear the junction. (NOT something like a protected left turn!)


Welcome to the forum, and thanks for reviving my old thread  I find the quoted part of your post especially interesting. I always wondered how traffic turning left knows when the lights turn to amber/red while waiting inside the intersection for the turn, in countries where the traffic lights are placed before the intersection. This "evacuation arrow" seems like an interesting idea. Does it exist at all intersections that are not exclusively controlled by arrows, or is it only a "convenience feature" that is found on some intersections?

I still wonder though, how this is done in countries where this "evacuation arrow" does not exist. I presume that one just waits for all traffic to stop and then completes the turn, though knowing when the light actually changes is useful I think. In Canada we don't have this problem because the lights are always placed after the intersection, so you just complete the turn when the light changes to amber/red and all oncoming traffic stops.


----------



## JonAxDrayda

TheCat said:


> Welcome to the forum, and thanks for reviving my old thread  I find the quoted part of your post especially interesting. I always wondered how traffic turning left knows when the lights turn to amber/red while waiting inside the intersection for the turn, in countries where the traffic lights are placed before the intersection. This "evacuation arrow" seems like an interesting idea. Does it exist at all intersections that are not exclusively controlled by arrows, or is it only a "convenience feature" that is found on some intersections?
> 
> I still wonder though, how this is done in countries where this "evacuation arrow" does not exist. I presume that one just waits for all traffic to stop and then completes the turn, though knowing when the light actually changes is useful I think. In Canada we don't have this problem because the lights are always placed after the intersection, so you just complete the turn when the light changes to amber/red and all oncoming traffic stops.


The "Evacuation Arrow" is mainly found on intersections controlled by mainly circled lights, where traffic is quite heavy to really heavy. 

If you'd see one on the opposite side of the intersection you're at, then it can also be that there is a green right arrow on the left street from your P.O.V., for earlier right turns, since it becomes slightly protected.

When the arrow below is active, it is a Free Turn: pedestrians are not allowed to cross the street with that light when the arrow is active. They still have to give way to U-turning cars that might come from the right, since those drivers still have green and do not break the law with making one.







(These lights sometimes appear at a junction with an evacuation arrow, but only when that street has a separate right turn lane. Since they don't get cars from the left anymore, they can turn safely...)

Countries where the "Evacuation Arrow" is absent or no-existent, they either wait for the red light to appear (many countries repeat the light on the other side on the left (right hand traffic) or right (left hand traffic)) or have separate (protected) turns.

Thanks for the welcoming, BTW: It was a pleasure to join! ^_^

P.S.: A fun fact... In Belgium you DON'T HAVE TO drive on when you have green, in the Netherlands you HAVE TO drive on at green. Weird, but that's what both laws state. (You can't block traffic, since that still is forbidden by law.)


----------



## Natomasken

JonAxDrayda said:


> The "Evacuation Arrow" is mainly found on intersections controlled by mainly circled lights, where traffic is quite heavy to really heavy.
> 
> If you'd see one on the opposite side of the intersection you're at, then it can also be that there is a green right arrow on the left street from your P.O.V., for earlier right turns, since it becomes slightly protected.
> 
> When the arrow below is active, it is a Free Turn: pedestrians are not allowed to cross the street with that light when the arrow is active. They still have to give way to U-turning cars that might come from the right, since those drivers still have green and do not break the law with making one.
> (These lights sometimes appear at a junction with an evacuation arrow, but only when that street has a separate right turn lane. Since they don't get cars from the left anymore, they can turn safely...)
> 
> Countries where the "Evacuation Arrow" is absent or no-existent, they either wait for the red light to appear (many countries repeat the light on the other side on the left (right hand traffic) or right (left hand traffic)) or have separate (protected) turns.


Here's a similar signal in Germany (Rothenburg).


----------



## EricIsHim

go_leafs_go02 said:


> you'll never see 200mm or 8" signals in ontario, or anywhere I believe in North America on their own. And I believe outside of BC..we're the only ones to have the 12" Red and 8" amber and green signals.
> 
> However, depends on the municipality...alot of places in ontario do use the 12" (300mm) signals across the board (red, amber, and green) London doesn't. Toronto doesn't. Hamilton doesn't, but Burlington, Mississauga do.


Interesting thread the first time I come across. 

Regarding on the signal head size that was discussed in a few months back, it is preferably to use 12" or 300mm signal head in the North America (I can't speak for rest of the world, but at least in the NA) industry these days, simply because they are physically bigger and more visible from distance providing longer reaction time for drivers to stop. For all arrow heads, they must be in 12" as required. 8" or 200mm ball is still allowed, but not preferred in normal situation.

But 8" head is still being used when the signal shouldn't be emphasized. For example, if there are two or more contagious intersections within a short distance, only the first signal on the approach should all be in 12" head to emphasize the signal and 8" for the next few so drivers aren't looking ahead and being confused. Worse case the driver is just going to confused by the red and stops before the intersection, and not running into crossing traffic. In this situation, many times the red remains as 12" and only yellow and green to be 8", so the red is always emphasized. It is allowed to use 8" green+yellow with a 12" red, but not vice versa.

If anyone in the US (or possibly Canada) is interested in traffic signal design or general design guideline, the US FHWA Manual on Uniform Traffic Control Devices (aka MUTCD) is a good reference. This is the national design manual for engineers and it can get pretty dry. The manual is available at http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/htm/2003r1r2/part4/part4-toc.htm


----------



## EricIsHim

tjkb230 said:


> Take a look at this
> Japanese traffic light!
> But who can explain why the traffic lights behave like this?





JonAxDrayda said:


> I think the arrows go on first to indicate a protected phase: the drivers to whom the lights are dedicated to can turn safely in the direction of the arrows. It's actually visible by looking at the cars coming from the other side. They remain stationair until the main green signal is active. And I think the amber and red phase between the green arrows and the main green signal is to indicate that the protected phase is about to end, because the drivers (nearly) keep on driving through this phase.
> 
> A bit weird, though, but they work like that, so I won't complain. (I'm a HUGE traffic-fan, BTW! I simply love everything, anything about traffic! That's why I won't complain with other countries' signal sequences.)


I concur with this statement as well towards the Japanese signal operation.
But it is just weird to see all the arrows turn off, then the yellow comes on, followed by the red, and back to green ball again. If I were driving, I would have stopped for the red in between. Usually, the green ball will just come on when the arrows go away. I wonder does this cause many rear-ended collision.


----------



## EricIsHim

Timon91 said:


> I like the countdown display. And what is the use of the double red? I've seen it in Germany before.


Maybe just in case red light doesn't work, there is still a back-up.
In Maryland, there are signals where two red lights for one signal head are used for simply this purpose.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

In the Netherlands, in case of a traffic light failure, all lights automatically are going to blink orange. (like they do at night when there's nearly no traffic). Regular road laws take over then. All traffic light intersections in the Netherlands also have traffic markings on the roadway, so traffic can still continue when the lights are out of operation.


----------



## EricIsHim

A bunch of traffic lights in Hong Kong:


----------



## traffic-light-man

2 second red and amber, and 3 second amber. Fixed times by law, no variations. We can however, vary the Inter-green and Inter-stage timings, although inter-green isn't usually more than 7 seconds, inter-stage isn't usually more than 2 seconds.


----------



## traffic-light-man

Some overhead mast arms in the UK. These aren't all that common here, and we also make use of a lot of double-stacked signal heads, as also seen in bottom pictures:


----------



## pijanec

Chicagoago said:


> Where did you see those? I've seen them in construction zones (temp lights), but I don't know if I've ever seen many that are just hanging on a rope. That's pretty cheap.


Those are common in areas where there are strong winds or frequently hit by hurricanes. This is the best solution in such regions I believe.


----------



## deranged

Interesting stuff. I guess most amber phases would resemble the ones in the countries mentioned so far.

Nice pictures, traffic-light-man.



JonAxDrayda said:


> In Belgium, ... depending on the length of the green...
> Longer than 3 minutes: (non-)busy road = 4 seconds.


A green phase of longer than 3 minutes!? :runaway:
Wow, I had no idea! I've never known of a green phase of longer than 90 seconds in any of the countries I've visited (although I haven't visited Europe). And since you wrote "(non-)busy", I'm wondering why such a phase would be necessary on a non-busy road?


----------



## JonAxDrayda

deranged said:


> Interesting stuff. I guess most amber phases would resemble the ones in the countries mentioned so far.
> 
> Nice pictures, traffic-light-man.
> 
> (Here was a Quote of JonAxDrayda's previous post(s))
> 
> A green phase of longer than 3 minutes!? :runaway:
> Wow, I had no idea! I've never known of a green phase of longer than 90 seconds in any of the places I've visited. And since you wrote "(non-)busy", I'm wondering why such a phase would be necessary on a non-busy road?


This is not common, so it's only natural if you didn't encounter it.
And the "3 minutes +"-phase is also on non-busy roads, but in that case it's regulated by only the system controller, and no vehicle detector beneath the asphalt surface can be found.

90 seconds green are usually just enough for some roads, but that's very rare. Usually, there's a 2 minutes green phase, other lengths are rare.

If you can find that I am wrong, then that means my mind-timer's not correct. But I'm fairly sure I'm correct.


----------



## deranged

JonAxDrayda said:


> This is not common, so it's only natural if you didn't encounter it.
> ...
> If you can find that I am wrong, then that means my mind-timer's not correct. But I'm fairly sure I'm correct.


Sorry, I didn't clarify properly what I meant. I wasn't doubting you, and I haven't yet visited Europe. Having not seen a green phase over 90 seconds in any of the countries that I have visited, I was surprised to hear that such a length existed anywhere in the world. I've corrected the post. :cheers:


----------



## ChrisZwolle

2 minutes for one green phase is extremely long.

In the Netherlands, they try to make the entire cyclus of one traffic controlled intersection 2 minutes max.


----------



## deranged

ChrisZwolle said:


> In the Netherlands, they try to make the entire cyclus of one traffic controlled intersection 2 minutes max.


Same goes for urban areas in Australia.

Unfortunately, at a few locations in Brisbane, they use sensor-controlled lights in parts of the day at intersections where traffic on the side road is regular but not continuous in nature. Sensors activate a change in phase almost immediately. As such, once the heavy traffic on the main road gets a green, a couple of vehicles will invariably approach from the side road within a few seconds, causing the lights to change again. So the continuous main-road traffic frequently has to stop for the non-continuous but regular side-road traffic. At its worst, I've seen the main road stay green for 3-5 seconds before turning amber and red again. :wallbash:

It's not a widespread problem, but it's highly inefficient.


----------



## Robosteve

deranged said:


> Same goes for urban areas in Australia.
> 
> Unfortunately, at a few locations in Brisbane, they use sensor-controlled lights in parts of the day at intersections where traffic on the side road is regular but not continuous in nature. Sensors activate a change in phase almost immediately. As such, once the heavy traffic on the main road gets a green, a couple of vehicles will invariably approach from the side road within a few seconds, causing the lights to change again. So the continuous main-road traffic frequently has to stop for the non-continuous but regular side-road traffic. At its worst, I've seen the main road stay green for 3-5 seconds before turning amber and red again. :wallbash:
> 
> It's not a widespread problem, but it's highly inefficient.


We get exactly the same thing in Sydney sometimes. Particularly after rain, which seems to make the sensors malfunction, the green light for the main thoroughfare will last for five seconds or so, before a twenty or thirty second green light for the intersecting minor road with no cars on it.


----------



## ChrisZwolle

Robosteve said:


> We get exactly the same thing in Sydney sometimes. Particularly after rain, which seems to make the sensors malfunction, the green light for the main thoroughfare will last for five seconds or so, before a twenty or thirty second green light for the intersecting minor road with no cars on it.


Because of rain? I asked a traffic count expert about these sensors, he said they can even measure traffic if they're under 2 inches of asphalt or bricks. He said even a steel nose in your shoe can activate it.


----------



## Majestic

These sensor-controlled traffic lights usually cause more chaos than regular ones. Not to mention their horrendous costs. This is blatantly evident in Poznań for instance. :bash:


----------



## Robosteve

Majestic said:


> These sensor-controlled traffic lights usually cause more chaos than regular ones. Not to mention their horrendous costs. This is blatantly evident in Poznań for instance. :bash:


There are some situations in which they are a good idea. When they work properly, they can be very effective where a busy road crosses a quiet street, such as the traffic lights at the end of my street where it meets the main road. For busy intersections, however, between more than one busy road, it's probably better to go without sensors.


----------



## traffic-light-man

Our Cycle times are usually around 72.75 seconds.

Green can be ever-lasting depending on VD state.

Our VAD (Vehicle Actuation Detection) Loops are installed at nearly every intersection. They simply tell the controller what amount of cars is where, and then the controler switches to whatever stage in a set program pattern, which is saved in the EPROM of the controler.

MOVA - Microsprosessor Optimised Vehicle Actuation - works out where vehicles are and how long they have been there, and then optimises the cycles to suit. This therefore only usues the VA (above) system if MOVA fails.

Our traffic loops (VAD) loops are square, chevron or diamond in shape, and usually take up around 0.5-1 meter of carriageway overall, and therefore a steel toe-cap boot would not activate one :lol:


----------



## deranged

Robosteve said:


> There are some situations in which they are a good idea. When they work properly, they can be very effective where a busy road crosses a quiet street, such as the traffic lights at the end of my street where it meets the main road. For busy intersections, however, between more than one busy road, it's probably better to go without sensors.


Absolutely agree.

In the intermediate case of arterial roads meeting collector roads, the latter of which is only busy at peak times, sensors could be used in quiet periods, while peak periods would benefit from either fixed cycles or a variation in the effect of the sensors - such as guaranteeing the main road a certain minimum length of green phase.

In the case of traffic lights between two often quiet roads - generally, school zones, tourist zones and the like - I've rarely seen fixed cycles, luckily.


----------



## traffic-light-man

I dissagree.

Fixed time control cycles only work when there is an unprecidented amount of vehicles using the junction, and they do not cooporate with traffic flows at that present time.

IMO, a good, well thought out VA system, or a system which works out everything that needs to be taken into considderation will cope very well.

Attaching a set of signals to SCOOT or a SCATS type system in a large signals network will help, however in my experience, the SCATS system in Dublin does not work as people, or certainly I, would expect.

As a pedestrian, I would never expect to wait 3 minuites for a green pedestrian signal, which may just be because I am aclimatised to the sensibility (IMO) of UK timings.


----------



## deranged

I won't doubt your expertise. Perhaps I'm being too cynical, but I don't see "a good, well thought out VA system, or a system which works out everything" arriving where I live within the next 300 years, and was only thinking of what could be done with the systems that we currently have. There's no doubt that such a system would be optimal.


----------



## DELCROID

Venezuelan traffic lights - II (I: #206, p.11):


----------



## DELCROID

Venezuela:


----------



## traffic-light-man

deranged said:


> I won't doubt your expertise. Perhaps I'm being too cynical, but I don't see "a good, well thought out VA system, or a system which works out everything" arriving where I live within the next 300 years, and was only thinking of what could be done with the systems that we currently have. There's no doubt that such a system would be optimal.


Oh yeah, I'm not saying that there isn't a bad system, because I can't say, having never been to Brisbane. 

I am, however, saying that I think there are good VA systems out there already, you just need to look for them. 

Is Brisbane not on a area wide network?

DELCROID,

Brilliant pictures there from Venezuela, thanks.

It's interesting to note that they use US signals in Venezuela, although I believe other makes from elsewhere in the world can be found.

The backing boards do make them look quite interesting, to say the least. They are setup with backing boards in the same way (yellow head, black backing board, white border) in lots of Spain, however knowing these are US heads, it's different :laugh:


----------



## DELCROID

Thanks,. 




Perhaps some of the traffic light companies try to come up with some ideas of their own thus making these original hybrids but I don´t know the reason behind the making of such models. 

I have a question: It seems yellow colour works better in areas where there is greenery (trees, mountain backgrounds) and black painted ones in areas where there is more light reflection (bulidings, open or cloudy sky) ??????. Perhaps a traffic light signal using a combination of both black and yellow could be ok in some places where greenery and light reflection are both present; I don´t know. Yellow has been the most widely used colour for many years but now black colour is becoming more widely used in some urban areas. 


I think there are at least 3 or so local traffic light manufacturers with some products of their own (controllers, software, posts, etc). Some of them are:




Grupo Invicta





























Semavenca:


















Grupo Sisstro














Semaforos Los Llanos (?¿)


----------



## traffic-light-man

Ah..

Do you think these companies might buy thier signal heads from other manufacturers and then simply distribute them?

I know this has been common place in different places (and still is) where a companies main aproach is to provide controllers.


----------



## TheCat

traffic-light-man said:


> Some overhead mast arms in the UK. These aren't all that common here, and we also make use of a lot of double-stacked signal heads, as also seen in bottom pictures:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Heh these British lights look almost identical to the ones in Israel, except for the lack of an arrow above:










I'm pretty sure the Israeli lights are inspired by British ones (as is the red+yellow combination phase), which is not surprising given the British mandate in the area until 1948. But I wonder who manufactures them.


----------



## traffic-light-man

Yeah, you are probably right.

Look at Hong Kong for example: they use Philips (internationally found) and Futurit EU heads (amongst others) conforming to British Standards, but not British legislation, which bans thier use over here.

If you manage to find a close up picture, it should be prettey easy to determine manufacturer, although I'm prettey sure it will be Futurit or VRX.


----------



## DELCROID

traffic-light-man said:


> Ah..
> 
> Do you think these companies might buy thier signal heads from other manufacturers and then simply distribute them?
> 
> I know this has been common place in different places (and still is) where a companies main aproach is to provide controllers.


There are some companies who only buy traffic light equipment (importers and such) and then installing such systems but I think at least Semavenca do design and manufacture their own and also have them as export items. It is a small company with about 70 employees and from what I could gather the company follows NEMA standards (National Electrical Manufacturing Association for Traffic Control Systems). However, there are many other companies in the country who could manufacture traffic light components with no problem whatsoever (metal posts, electrical and electronic equipment, lights, metal cases, traffic control software, led signals, etc.).

Semavenca:










For example, Grupo Invicta (Invicta Electronica) manufactures 8" and 12" head lamps using ITE norms (Institute of Traffic Engineers) and also fully designed and built this traffic controller -"Controlador de Trafico CTC-1000" and developed sofware programs:









And Grupo Sisstro manufactures some traffic control equipment through its branch Industria Electrónica Andina: the GIT-4200 series (such as the GIT-4200N using NEMA TS1 norms) and the GIT-8300C following Covenin Norm 2753:1999: .


The GIT-4200 Series: http://www.sisstro.com/textos/GIT-4200N.pdf
The GIT-8300C: http://www.sisstro.com/textos/GIT-8300C.pdf





It seems like they also have the capacity to manufacture head lamps, commuters, etc...


Setecca is another company manufacturing head lamps, 8" and 12" led signals and traffic controllers such as the TMC-400 and the TMC-800 using Covenin Norm 2753: http://www.setecca.com/setecca web/PAGINAS/Semaforos SETECCA.pdf & http://www.setecca.com/setecca web/PAGINAS/setecca TMC_800.pdf



Metalurgica Lugeda - another small company, designed and manufactures this portable traffic light:






















Semaforos Yaracuy on the other hand is an installation and maintenance company:





































There could be other companies....I´ll try to find out.


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## traffic-light-man

Thanks very much, that's awsome.

We have Siemens, PEEK, TSEU Tellent and MOTUS opperating in UK. I'll stick some pics of thier equiptment together shortly.


----------



## DELCROID

I think Siemens has a sales office in Caracas. There are also some asian and mexican imports too. I don´t know about any other european or american brands in the country; probably there are some sales representatives.



Here are some more from Venezuela:


----------



## DELCROID




----------



## traffic-light-man

Brilliant pictures again there, thanks! 

It seems that the authorities can't make thier mind up between red hand/white walk and red wait/green walk, is this because each area uses different lanterns or whatever?


----------



## nils16

Chiang Mai, Thailand









HQ+GPS: http://www.panoramio.com/photo/20794373









http://www.panoramio.com/photo/20794403









http://www.panoramio.com/photo/20793805


I really liked the Countdown displays!


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## minneapolis-uptown

The wierdest ones i've seen are the ones in Havana which are just colored LED numbers that count down the seconds until the light changes. can't find any pictures though


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## paulc74

I don't have any pictures but I'll try and describe the lights in Vancouver, Canada and its suburbs


Ok first rule is a right turn is allowed on a red (unless posted) but you must come to a complete stop before proceeding. 

No U-turns are allowed. Although some interesections used to have signs allowing them. 

first basic light

RED
YELLOW
GREEN

In this case to turn left you pull forward and wait for a gap or wait until the yellow red sequence

RED
YELLOW
GREEN
FLASHING GREEN

Same as above, except now the left turn lane gets a limited time left turn. The amount of time the left turn arrow flashes does depend and is not set to a preset time. I'll explain later.

Once the Flashing Green stops the light riverts to the first light. In that case you then pull forward and wait for a gap or wait until the next yellow to red sequence.

Some left turn lanes have their own dedicated light of

Red
Yellow
green Arrow (flashing or not)

You can only turn left when you see the green arrow. Otherwise you are not allow to pull forward and wait. 

Most intersection will have a light on the left side of the road for people turning left. On the right hand side of the road for people turning left and using the curb lane. And Generally there is at least 1 and possibly 2 lights directly over the through lanes. 

Some lights that sit on the right side of the road will have a right hand turn arrow depending on how much traffic goes right at that intersectio. Example

Red
Yellow
Green
Right Flashing Green arrow.

What this means on a right turn if you see the green arrow, you can go and not have to worry about anybody or anything as no pedestrian or other vehicle should be crossing your path.

All roads in BC with a speed limit greater than 60KM/H. Have an advanced warning board of two yellow flashing lights about 100M before the traffic light. They are timed so that if you are doing the speed limit and the lights on the board start flashing just as you are about to go under it you will make it through the light. But someone who is two cars back will not make it if they are doing the speed limit. 

Now for the length of time of the advanced green arrow on a traffic light like this one

Red
Yellow
Green
Flashing Green Arrow

On most newly designed intersections the left turn bay will have 2 sensors. One sensor is at the very front of the lane and the next sensor is 2 cars back.

So if one car is sitting on the front sensor with no cars behind it the flashing arrow will not light up and the front car just pulls forward and waits.

But both sensors are covered than the flashing green arrow will come on. It is one of the secrets to driving late at night. If someone is in front don't pull right up behind them. But stop on the 2nd sensor and because both sensors are covered you will force the arrow to come on. 

The timing of the arrow is based on how much traffic is passing over those sensors. Once it sees a gap it will stop the flashing arrow. So to keep it flashing you need to keep up with the car in front of you. But there is a set limit to how long the light will keep flashing. 

There is one light in the city of Coquitlam (suburb of Vancouver) That has a light with a slightly different sequence than most lights in Vancouver. Basically all Northbound traffic gets a full green (left, straight and right turn). Then they get a full red. At which point all southbound traffic gets the full green, then then get the full red. It then switches to all westbound and then all eastbound and finally back to all north bound. At no point does any two directions get a green at the same time.

As for sensors one thing they do in Vancouver is during the day the lights are preset for time and sequence (other than the left turn bay and tripping the green arrow). But at night if your light is red and you come up to the light and the other direction has no traffic. You will trip the light to go green. And the same works the other way as well. So at night the light right by my house can change from green to red to green within 30 seconds and sometimes less. Depending on traffic. If a light is green going east and west it will stay green. Until someone going north or south comes along. At which point it will change. 

I'll try and get some pictures some day for examples

Otherwise we use the basic yellow back board and vertical lights.


----------



## TheCat

^^ Interesting report. Very good to know that Vancouver makes use of sensors with its traffic lights. In Toronto and its suburbs, aside from some left turn arrows, where you also have (sometimes) a pair of sensors, as far as I know, no sensors are ever used for main traffic. This is EXTREMELY frustrating while driving at night. Whenever I drive at night I have to sit at red lights on major streets (intersecting minor, sometimes completely insignificant streets) without any reason (absolutely zero traffic anywhere).

I think that late at night lights should either have sensors, or be completely turned off like what is done in some European countries. At these times I never find more than, literally 2-3 cars around me at any time. This is perhaps not so true of main downtown streets, where there is always some traffic (especially on some days), but almost complete absence of traffic is always the case anywhere uptown and in the suburbs.


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## paulc74

Not all intersections have sensors on all lanes. Only the newly redesigned ones do. I've been stuck at a few lights late at night with a long light in the other direction. I remember being stuck at one last winter in a snow storm. I didn't know where the sensor was. So after awhile I said screw it and made a left turn on a red light. 

I know some intersections are set so that if one direction lets say N-S is the major road and E-W is the none major road. The light will stay green for the N-S route. Someone coming E-W will trip it and get a green. Then the signal will go back to the N-S automatically. 

I wouldn't support turning off lights in Vancouver. Too many people would just drive really fast through the intersection. There is still at least 1-2 cars every 10 seconds late at night at the intersection by my house. And that is coming from all directions. 

A better idea I think would be to have it flashing red in all directions. Therefore becoming a 4-way stop.


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## TheCat

^^ Well, yes, this would work better in North America. In many European countries traffic lights also have signs that tell you what to do in the absence of traffic lights, which blink yellow usually (one road typically has a "priority" sign, and the other would have a "yield" sign).

As for being stuck at red lights on a left turn (or going straight), one way to do it "legally" is to make a right turn on red (which is allowed) and then, if the road allows, do a U-turn shortly after. I've done that a few times at night


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## paulc74

There are only two roads in the City of Vancouver that allows U-turns. I'm not sure about the suburbs. The only reason they allow u-turns is because they have a large grass meridean in the middle. Which allows you to essentially do 2 left turns, hence forth a u-turn. 

It is quicker to just wait the light out in Vancouver, rather than trying to go around a different route.


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## tollfreak

I'm not sure if somebody mentioned this yet, but traffic lights in Singapore seem similar to those found in Japanese cities


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## juansebastian71

*Traffic Lights in Villavicenio (Colombia, South America)*

In my city, traffic lights are manufactured with the European standard, which is a white pole, lamps with LED technology and a poster with a white line around.









By juan_sebastian71, shot with DSC-W55 at 2009-10-11









By juan_sebastian71, shot with DSC-W55 at 2009-07-23


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## Marco925

*Unorthodox light in Niagara Falls*

A weird one that used to be found in Niagara falls (2560x1920 warning)



Basically it consisted of the two left lights which were 12-12-12-12-12, The standard Red yellow and green, with the bottom two being a Protected Forward Arrow and a Protected Left arrow, the one on the right carries only a forward arrow on the bottom. The two left ones were replaced with the standard 4 phase lights with just the green and left arrow, the right one remains the same.


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## Aan

Thailand, Krabi  (with red/green counter)


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## Richie D.

Costa Rica has standard American-type three-light traffic lights (most of them are LED lights nowadays), with the red light being bigger than the rest on most traffic lights. Some are on special posts, but most of them are suspended from wires. They're very difficult to see because on many, the stop line is drawn very close to the actual traffic lights, plus there are only overhead lights. Here's a picture I found on Google:










The sequence is: Red, Green, Flashing Green, Yellow, Red (No Red-Yellow sequence like in Europe).

Traffic lights for pedestrian traffic are very rare. Most of them are in the city centre (in the rest of the regions, you have to really take a chance to cross the street, because neither knows how to cross them and drivers often don't respect a red light) and there are different systems. Some are just two-light systems with red and green lights (plus a sound that is made during the green phase for visually impaired pedestrians), others even have a countdown system (plus the sound). A picture I took when I went to the city last week of such lights:










Sequence on standard pedestrian lights: Red, Green, Flashing Green, Red
Sequence on pedestrian lights with coundown display (the equivalent standard lights are under parenthesis): Standing Figure (Red), Walking Figure with Forward Count (Green), Running Figure with Forward Count (Flashing Green), Standing Figure (Red)


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## Di-brazil

traffic light in Brazil


----------



## mubd

Typical Australian traffic lights:


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## Gareth

Here's how the Japanese do protected right turns...






Wierd, huh?


----------



## Richie D.

Gareth said:


> Here's how the Japanese do protected right turns...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wierd, huh?


The logic is similar to the one for protected left turns in some traffic lights Costa Rica. In that case, what happens most of the time is that one direction gets green for all directions, while all other traffic (including oncoming traffic) gets red. This applies for non-priority roads that end with a traffic light, while priority roads get green for going straight and for right turns. Then for protected left turns, it approximately goes this way, e.g. on an East-West road with a traffic light: For protected turns, the West lane gets green while the East lane gets red, then the West lane gets red and the East lane gets green, while the non-priority roads get green in the sequence I already outlined above.

BTW, Costa Rica uses US type diamond signage, but I've always been an advocate of dumping the current description based signs with pictographic signs like in Europe (including the introduction of the Priority Road sign, and increased use of Give Way signs, as most simple roads don't even need a Stop sign).


----------



## I(L)WTC

In Buenos Aires, Argentina


----------



## Glodenox

Richie D. said:


> The logic is similar to the one for protected left turns in some traffic lights Costa Rica. In that case, what happens most of the time is that one direction gets green for all directions, while all other traffic (including oncoming traffic) gets red. This applies for non-priority roads that end with a traffic light, while priority roads get green for going straight and for right turns. Then for protected left turns, it approximately goes this way, e.g. on an East-West road with a traffic light: For protected turns, the West lane gets green while the East lane gets red, then the West lane gets red and the East lane gets green, while the non-priority roads get green in the sequence I already outlined above.
> 
> BTW, Costa Rica uses US type diamond signage, but I've always been an advocate of dumping the current description based signs with pictographic signs like in Europe (including the introduction of the Priority Road sign, and increased use of Give Way signs, as most simple roads don't even need a Stop sign).


I'm pretty sure that the thing he found weird about those lights is that all directions are allowed and afterwards *the light switches to red and very shortly afterwards back to green*. In this case it would've been more logical to just have a green light (the arrow lights aren't exactly needed in this situation). 

There's nothing wrong with having the arrow lights mounted on the post and not using them, that's what sometimes happens here in Belgium when they apply a different light sequence due to traffic streams that have changed over time which require a different approach for an optimal solution (whether it actually results in a more optimal situation is usually another discussion).

Greetings,
Glodenox


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## TheCat

^^ Hehe yeah, all that would be needed at such an intersection is a single right-pointing arrow, like it is commonly done here in Toronto (only it is pointing left in our case).

I guess the way they do it allows them to use a single yellow light. In Toronto, for example, the arrow appears green, then changes its colour to yellow, and then just disappears. If it appears with green, it means all directions are protected (well, not precisely, because when turning right pedestrians could also be facing a green). If it appears with red, then only the left turn is protected.

In some other locations in the province of Ontario there are two arrow lights - one green, and one yellow, that achieve the same thing. In Toronto I haven't seen those though, all lights have a single arrow that goes from green to yellow.

By the way, in the case of a protected left only (i.e. green left arrow with a red light), the effect here is similar to the Japanese one - when the arrow disappears, there is a pause before the main red light switches to green, in which case one technically should briefly stop (though some people just continue to enter the intersection if turning left).


----------



## zsimi80

HUNGARY










Source: http://varos.blogter.hu/308111/kozlekedesi_park_az_orczy-kertben


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## Marco925

A Traffic light setup in St Catharines, Ontario, It connects Highway 406 to Welland Avenue, and 4th Avenue, the actual lights themselves were since replaced with updated 3M traffic signals that resemble the other Ontarian ones.

I'll get more pics later of this funny intersection.


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## Trafictec

Traffic lights and traffic controllers 

www.trafictec.com


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## Vashon118

A few from Seattle...


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## TheCat

^^ Interesting. The various flashing yellow phases mean "yield to oncoming traffic"?
By the way, that left arrow in the last video is insanely long .


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## Vashon118

TheCat said:


> ^^ Interesting. The various flashing yellow phases mean "yield to oncoming traffic"?
> By the way, that left arrow in the last video is insanely long .


Yes. It's not very common now, but a few states/cities are starting to adopt or experiment with flashing yellow arrows in place of green balls for permissive turns (i.e., ok to turn left or right after yielding to oncoming traffic).

Seattle has been using the flashing yellow ball for about 30 - 40 years now, but they are slowing phasing them out in favor of a flashing yellow arrow. Mountlake Terrace (just north of the King/Snohomish County line) also uses flashing yellow balls, but with 2 differences: A sign indicating traffic to yield on the flashing yellow and the turn signal is set up so that through traffic can't really see it.


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## Spikespiegel

In Denmark, our traffic lights differ a bit from the rest of the world.

First off, our traffic lights have four states:









At large intersections, you may find "turning signals".
These exists ALMOST exclusively in left-turn versions. They are red until the opposing traffic gets a red light, then it will turn green, and allow people to turn left (usually from both sides at the same time). It also exist in a "green light only" version. Green turning signal means that ALL other crossing traffic has a red light, be this oncoming traffic, crossing traffic, pedestrians or bicycles.

Like in Amsterdam, we have special signals for bicycles. These signals are much smaller than the normal signals, and they have a bicycle painted above them.
These also exist in turning signal-versions.
In most intersections, the bicycle light is a few seconds ahead of the normal traffic light, to give bicycles a headstart into the intersection, and to clear the intersection in time for when the red signal appears.

Our pedestrian signals only have green and red lights. In intersections with a lot of pedestrians, or where jaywalking may occur regularly, countdown signals have been placed:









Finally, we have "reversed" signals, which may be placed in intersections where left-turn is usually difficult. These signals feature only red and yellow lights. In this case, "red" means go, not "stop", as it shows what the signal the oncoming traffic has. Usually, this signal is paired with a "left turn" green signal.


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## Fuzzy Llama

Spikespiegel said:


> In Denmark, our traffic lights differ a bit from the rest of the world.
> 
> First off, our traffic lights have four states:


...like in most of the Europe (I think that the Netherlands are the only European country without "red+yellow" phase).

When I stayed in Denmark I was really annoyed with Danish 2-phase pedestrian lights (i.e. without 'blinking green / yellow / be careful, red signal in a second' phase). You see a green signal, approach the curb and a second before stepping on the asphalt WHAM - you get red light, without any warning. Annoying


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## LMB

Fuzzy Llama said:


> ...like in most of the Europe (I think that the Netherlands are the only European country without "red+yellow" phase).


I noticed a similar attempt last I was in Poland: red+yellow not removed, but shortened to minimum (like 500ms). 

And I stand by the Dutch, I think they are right, we don't need red+yellow anymore, and I guess lack thereof keeps people more alert.


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## Fuzzy Llama

^^ We do need them. You need this extra second to engage the first gear and it speeds up whole 'starting from intersection' process, especially when a less-experienced driver is in front of the queue.


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## ChrisZwolle

I also think we need them, especially in hilly areas, where you can release the clutch earlier to increase the throughput of a traffic light. A delay of 1 - 2 seconds can significantly reduce the efficiency of a traffic light.


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## TheCat

Spikespiegel said:


> Finally, we have "reversed" signals, which may be placed in intersections where left-turn is usually difficult. These signals feature only red and yellow lights. In this case, "red" means go, not "stop", as it shows what the signal the oncoming traffic has. Usually, this signal is paired with a "left turn" green signal.


Heh that's kind of interesting (and possibly confusing to tourists). We have no need for such signals here in Canada because traffic lights are placed after the intersection, so you always see when the light changes to yellow/green and thus, what light oncoming traffic faces (this of course may not be the case if the oncoming traffic faces a different light, but that's rare and would not happen when you're waiting to turn left on a green light).



Fuzzy Llama said:


> ...like in most of the Europe (I think that the Netherlands are the only European country without "red+yellow" phase).


I believe France also does not have the "red+yellow" phase.


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## Cicerón

Fuzzy Llama said:


> ...like in most of the Europe (I think that the Netherlands are the only European country without "red+yellow" phase).





TheCat said:


> I believe France also does not have the "red+yellow" phase.


In Spain we don't either.


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## Muttie

Morocco:


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## LMB

ChrisZwolle said:


> A delay of 1 - 2 seconds can significantly reduce the efficiency of a traffic light.


Exactly, and that's why we don't need them (red+yellow). You could be doing the clutch+gear operation on green light. One is a beginner for a short period, so I personally don't see this as a valid argument, and each second lost on red+yellow translates to actual concrete financial losses, which as we all know, are not that tiny. 

If getting rid of red+yellow can improve efficiency by a mere 1%, then it's the cheapest was to achieve improvement. It costs next to nothing.


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## Fuzzy Llama

^^
But the red+yellow phase do not influence length of the green phase! If we assume that the light changes to green in "t=0" then you will have the red+yellow from about t=-3 to 0. The only difference is that with 4-phase system you get more information, all the timing constrains remain the same.


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## LMB

Fuzzy Llama said:


> ^^
> But the red+yellow phase do not influence length of the green phase!


OK, to phrase it exactly, adding red+yellow decreases the length of green in the proportion of the entire cycle. If the cycle takes 60 seconds, and red+green is 1 second, that's 1.7%, or not so little.


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## Suburbanist

Fuzzy Llama said:


> ...like in most of the Europe (I think that the Netherlands are the only European country without "red+yellow" phase).


Italy doesn't have them too.


----------



## Fuzzy Llama

^^
I could swear they have, at least in Trentino.


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## niterider

Ireland doesn't have the red+yellow phase either.

It does have flashing amber lights (usually in less busy times such as evenings) to permit turns subject to yielding to traffic on the road you're joining


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## rick1016

Perhaps TheCat could shed some light on this for me, but does anyone in Canada (Ontario, specifically...) notice that when there's a left turn signal, the green signal is an arrow, but the yellow and red ones are solid? Seems it would make more sense to follow in the footsteps of other places in the world!


----------



## scotdaliney

LMB said:


> Exactly, and that's why we don't need them (red+yellow). You could be doing the clutch+gear operation on green light. One is a beginner for a short period, so I personally don't see this as a valid argument, and each second lost on red+yellow translates to actual concrete financial losses, which as we all know, are not that tiny.
> 
> If getting rid of red+yellow can improve efficiency by a mere 1%, then it's the cheapest was to achieve improvement. It costs next to nothing.


 We don't have the Red+yellow phase in Australia, and it shits me to tears.
For some reason the light sequence here is very stretched out so you can easily sit at a set of lights for 3 to 4 minutes before getting a green light. Then the idiots at the front of the line are not ready for the green and it takes them a good 5 seconds on average to start moving. Often if your at the end of the line you will miss the lights by that exact amounts, making you wish you could smack the slow guy at the start around the ears a little. If we had an orange+red phase maybe people would be more ready for the green. At least when I lived in the UK people seemed to move the second the green appeared.


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## ea1969

There is no red+yellow phase in Greece either.

I have seen in films that in the early 60's the sequence was "green - yellow - red - yellow - green", but it was re-arranged into "green - yellow - red - green".


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## TheCat

rick1016 said:


> Perhaps TheCat could shed some light on this for me, but does anyone in Canada (Ontario, specifically...) notice that when there's a left turn signal, the green signal is an arrow, but the yellow and red ones are solid? Seems it would make more sense to follow in the footsteps of other places in the world!


Well, you're probably referring to the dedicated left turn signals, in which case, you're right - the "left turn signal" sign could probably be made unnecessary by making the red and yellow lights also be shaped like an arrow.

However, those lights are quite rare (especially in the GTA). Most lights only have a permissive green arrow that changes its colour to yellow (older lights in some places in Ontario have a separate yellow arrow, though I've never seen those around Toronto), and there is no need for a red one because it simply disappears, in which case traffic follows the regular solid lights (e.g. yielding to oncoming traffic on green).

Most other places in the world that do have those yellow and red arrows are usually places where dedicated left turn signals are common (like in the west coast of the US, where there is often a light above each lane, and most large intersections have a separate left turn signal).

In Israel, for example, left turn signals are mandatory (i.e., you never have to yield to oncoming traffic on green), the signals are similar to Ontario's dedicated ones (i.e., green arrow and yellow/red solid), but there are fixed arrows above each traffic light, indicating the directions to which the light applies.


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## rick1016

I think it makes more sense to have the red/yellow/green arrow phase the same at the solid phase because if it's all uniform, it could be less confusing to colour blind people (I think I read somewhere that's the chief reason the red/yellow/green phase is pretty universal in terms of placement).


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## TheCat

^^ Yep, you're correct about that as well, the red is almost universally placed at the top for the reasons you mentioned.

As for your suggestion, the problem with having all 3 left-turn phases (i.e. including the red arrow) with permissive lights is that in that case, if you see a solid green and a red arrow, you will think that you are not allowed to turn left at all (not even after yielding), which is the case with dedicated lights that either permit protected left turns, or prohibit them completely when they are red. This is precisely the reason why permissive lights only have the green and yellow arrow phases, after which the arrow disappears. The arrow gives you a brief period to turn left when all conflicting traffic faces a red light.

In the west coast of the US, as I mentioned, it's common to have dedicated left turn lights (placed in front of the left lane), in which case a red arrow prohibits left turns. Because of that, in some cases, they have a special indication when one is allowed to turn after yielding, such as a blinking yellow (as shown earlier in this very thread, in Seattle) or a blinking arrow.

In Israel, as I also mentioned, this is not a problem because if you get the (rare) signal that has a general solid green without any arrows, you may actually turn left without yielding because in this case the light applies to all directions. Otherwise, there will be a clear arrow placed above the light. As I said, unprotected left turns do not exist there.


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## rick1016

Same in Australia. Rarely do you have an intersection without protected right turns. (As we all know, driving is on the left in Australia!)


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## Troubleshooter

TheCat said:


> I've always wondered why most tunnels have traffic lights mounted above them,
> never quite understood why. Is that in case there is a problem in the tunnel?
> And if there is no problem, are they ever red? Because a lot of the time they
> are actually on a highway.


If a crash or blockage occurs in a tunnel, it keeps traffic behind from crashing into it.


----------



## Troubleshooter

snupix said:


> What is the red cross that can be seen on French roads on the opposite side of the traffic light?
> 
> It looks like this: +


It tells police the traffic light is red. If a car runs the signal, the cop knows he broke the law.

In California, they are small blue dots.


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## Troubleshooter

TheCat said:


> That looks quite interesting, because in every one of these pics, there is a dedicated left turn signal, and it seems that you may not turn left unless you have a green dedicated left turn arrow. I really like that.
> 
> Is that the case on all streets in these American cities, i.e., are there any traffic light-controlled intersections where you are allowed to turn left while oncoming traffic faces a green light too? Because in Toronto you can, and I really don't like that, and the same goes for other American east-coast cities, like New York.


There are several different types of signals. Engineering is done to determine which kind is used at each signal:

- Exclusively permissive: There are circular signals, but no arrows. Left turns obey the thru signals, filtering through gaps in oncoming traffic.

- Protected/permissive (doghouse): The left turn signal is shared with the thru signal. It has 5 lenses: red ball, yellow ball, green ball, green arrow, yellow arrow. Left turns are protected from other traffic when the green arrow is shown. A yellow arrow ends the protected turn. Left turns are permissive when the green ball is shown alone. They must be made through gaps in oncoming traffic.

- Protected/permissive (flashing yellow arrows): The left turn signal is exclusive to the left turn. The signal has 4 lenses: red arrow, steady yellow arrow, flashing yellow arrow, green arrow. The left turn is protected with a green arrow. Left turns filter through gaps in opposing traffic on the flashing yellow arrow. The steady yellow arrow clears either of the above.

- Exclusively protected: The left turn signal protects all left turns with a green arrow. The red arrow stops all left turns.

Variations:

- The 3-arrow exclusively protected signal can be modified with a flashing red arrow. Each left turning vehicle must stop for the flashing red arrow before turning. Michigan used to use a flashing red ball for this.

- The flashing yellow arrow face can change between the three modes (exclusively protected, protected/permissive, and exclusively permissive) according to time of day or traffic volume present.

- Seattle used to use a flashing yellow ball for permissive left turns.

The use of a left turn phase requires at least one warrant to be met:

- Anything that requires a protected phase (below)
- High left turn vs oncoming volumes
- Left turn accidents
- Poor line of sight
- Excessive left turn delay

The choice of an exclusively protected phase usually requires one of the following to be present:

- High speeds (over 45 mph)
- High traffic volume
- 3 or more oncoming lanes
- Double lane left turns
- Odd intersection geometry
- Poor line of sight
- Prevention of yellow trap (lead-lag signal)
- Left turn accidents
- Heavy pedestrian volumes


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## Troubleshooter

*More on left turn signals*

More on left turn signals

Several different phase patterns are used for left turn signals:

- Single lead: There is a left turn signal facing in one direction. The protected left turn is placed just before the oncoming traffic gets its green.

- Single lag: There is a left turn signal facing in one direction. The protected left turn is placed just after the oncoming traffic gets its green. This is usually limited to places where the cross street is one way, or is the stem of a T intersection, to prevent yellow trap.*

- Dual lead: Opposite approaches receive left turn arrows at the same time. These occur before the thru traffic on the same street is released.

- Dual lag: Opposite approaches receive left turn arrows at the same time. These occur after the thru traffic in the same street is stopped.

- Unsplit Lead-lag (also called split phased): Each leg of the street has its own green with an arrow, at different times. This is usually used with offset intersection legs or small diamond interchanges. Must be used if a lane shares left turn and thru movements and left turn signals are needed.

- Dual split lead: Opposite approaches receive left turn arrows at the same time. But each left turn can end at a different time, when it runs out of traffic. Each thru phase begins after the conflicting left turn ends.

- Dual split lag: Opposite approaches start with thru phases at the same time. But each thru green can end at a different time, when it runs out of traffic. Each left turn phase begins after the conflicting thru phase ends. This must be used with exclusively-protected left turns or flashing yellow arrows to prevent yellow trap.*

- Dual split lead-lag: One approach starts with thru and left phases at the same time. The left turn phase ends when it runs out of traffic or time, and the opposite thru phase begins. When the initial thru phase runs out of traffic or time, it ends, and the remaining left turn begins. Lead-lag is quite useful for two-way signal progression (green wave) where the blocks are short or have unequal length. This must be used with exclusively-protected left turns or flashing yellow arrows to prevent yellow trap.*

These can be assembled with left turn phases on the other street to produce several "quad" left turn signals:

- Quad split lead: Both streets have dual split lead. This is the most common left turn signal in use.

- Dual split lead & dual unsplit lead-lag: The major road is so wide that the cross street left turns can't pass to the left of each other. So each cross street leg gets a separate phase.

- Quad unsplit lead-lag: Each street leg has a separate phase. Usually used with unusual intersection geometry or shared left and thru lanes.

- Quad clockwise: This is similar to quad unsplit lead-lag, except that the order of the legs is different. The legs receive their green lights in a clockwise order (as seen from above). This is an efficient way to move traffic on a small diamond or volleyball interchange with little storage area between the ramps.

Other variations are also used.

* Yellow trap is a dangerous sequence that can cause a crash or trap a left turning driver in the intersection with a red light and flowing oncoming traffic. It happens when both directions on the street have circular greens that allow left turns to filter through gaps in oncoming traffic, and one of the direction's lights turns yellow, but the other direction still has a green.

Preventing yellow trap:
- Use only leading left turns (but watch for phase skip)
- Use only protected phases (lower capacity)
- Use some permissive indication other than circular green (flashing yellow arrow or flashing red arrow). This can be extended beyond the time the circular green can be displayed, allowing permissive turns until the opposing traffic gets its yellow.


----------



## Troubleshooter

There are two reasons we do not have the red+yellow before the green in the US:

- Too many drivers started moving when they saw it. Since it was displayed at the same time as the yellow on the other street, it caused crashes.

- Massachusetts used (and still uses, in violation of federal standards) red+yellow to indicate a pedestrian scramble (all vehicles stop for pedestrians in all directions).

The US Manual of Uniform Traffic Control Devices (MUTCD) has prohibited this display since 1961.

Early signals in the US had very different sequences:

- The first signals had no yellow. They went directly from green on one street to green on the other street. Only two circuits and two bulbs were needed, with the red lights of one street being the greens of the other. One street had the green on top, so it could use the same bulb. A driver on one street would see this sequence:

red
green
red

- The next group had three bulbs, one in each section, with lenses in all 4 directions. One street had green on top, the other had green on the bottom. A driver saw:

red
red+yellow
green
green+yellow
red

- New York City used this sequence, rather than change their signal heads to add yellow. Some of these signals still exist:

red
red+green
green
red+green
red

- When each lens got its own bulb, the following sequence was used in New York:

red
green
green+red
red

- When each lens got its own bulb on three lamp signals, the following sequence was used in some states:

red
red+yellow
green
yellow
red

Since all of the yellows came on together, it saved one signal circuit.

Because of the troubles mentioned above, the federal standards required that only one circular color could be displayed at any time (excluding left turn signals). This produced the cdurrent display:

red
green
yellow
red


----------



## Troubleshooter

I might add that it is illegal in most US states to leave the transmission in neutral while in traffic. Too many drivers coasted in neutral, and then could not recover control of their cars, or rolled back into the car behind while trying to get the transmission out of neutral when the light changed.


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## Fuzzy Llama

^^ Wait, WHAT? This is so stupid I cannot believe it. Do you have any source?


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## RipleyLV

Fuzzy Llama said:


> This is so stupid I cannot believe it. Do you have any source?


Do you really need a source to that?! :lol: Why is it stupid?


----------



## Fuzzy Llama

^^ The law that tells you how to operate your gearbox? Only because some retards cannot do uphill starts?
And, in case of a manual gearbox, waiting for green signal with your gear engaged isn't exactly clutch-friendly. And environment-friendly as well.


----------



## RipleyLV

Fuzzy Llama said:


> ^^ The law that tells you how to operate your gearbox? Only because some retards cannot do uphill starts?
> And, in case of a manual gearbox, waiting for green signal with your gear engaged isn't exactly clutch-friendly. And environment-friendly as well.


So they have this kinnda a law, we don't, why is it stupid? :dunno: For Americans manual gear box is a problem, if the statistics are sad, why not introduce this law.


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## Fuzzy Llama

> So they have this kinnda a law, we don't, why is it stupid?


Because it causes clutches to wear.
And, in case you didn't notice, the law that prohibits the use if neutral do not help the uphill start in ANY way.


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## niterider

Fuzzy Llama said:


> ^^ The law that tells you how to operate your gearbox? Only because some retards cannot do uphill starts?
> And, in case of a manual gearbox, waiting for green signal with your gear engaged isn't exactly clutch-friendly. And environment-friendly as well.


It is fine if you have the clutch fully pressed in, with the brake engaged. 

It is also safer in the case of an accident - you have control of the car vs neutral, and if shunted from behind the car will stall if your foot slips, which is much safer than being ploughed into oncoming traffic/pedestrians etc whilst in neutral with no control.


----------



## RipleyLV

Fuzzy Llama said:


> Because it causes clutches to wear.


Yeah right! So what's the difference? If you start driving with 1st gear or you're in neutral and put into 1st gear, in both cases you use the clutch to drive.


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## Fuzzy Llama

niterider said:


> It is fine if you have the clutch fully pressed in, with the brake engaged.


Only in the perfect world  The mechanism that seperate the discs of the clutch (no idea about correct English name) ages pretty badly, so in older cars there still can be some friction even with the pedal fully deperssed. In addition you do not always press the clutch to full extent (especially when you are tired or in somebody's else's car).

And, what is most important, having to step on two pedals instead of one on every intersection is inconvenient. 



> It is also safer in the case of an accident - you have control of the car vs neutral, and if shunted from behind the car will stall if your foot slips, which is much safer than being ploughed into oncoming traffic/pedestrians etc whilst in neutral with no control.


Firstly, if smashed from behind you'll gain some velocity prior to any foot slipping, and if the force was big enough to move your car with brakes on, the gear won't matter.

Secondly, slipping feet occur more often without any unpropable accidents. And when it happen (consider women in high heels) you'll bump the car in front of you.

Thirdly, you won't pass your driving exam here if you wait for signal with a gear engaged.


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## niterider

Women driving in high heels ....now THAT is dangerous! lol


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## Nexis

Some New Jersey Traffic Lights

Mast Arm Style used on Regional Highways & Major Roads
































































New Ironbound : Newark Traffic Lights



















Common Truss Arm Traffic Lights



















I call these the odd ball lights



















Common Urban Horizontal Traffic Lights


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## Dr.Mabuse

typical german lights - nothjing special, but i like them 








http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/14/M1A1_in_Frankfurt.jpg









http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...erampel_in_Duesseldorf-Hassels,_von_Osten.jpg









http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6f/Lünen_Zusatzampel_Motor_Aus.jpg









http://aikilab.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/ampel.jpg









http://www.pregocard.de/bilder/ampel_big.jpg









http://www.spd-badhomburg.de/g7-Ampel.jpg









http://www.st-poelten.gv.at/Content.Node/presse/Ampel_StGeorgen.jpg









http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d3/Semaforopedonale.jpg









http://www.hamburg.de/image/1159540...59640/bild-rad-ampel.jpg?width=146&height=197


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## Alqaszar

As one of the the few dozen  automatic transmission drivers in Europe, I keep the car in neutral during red light stops, but keeping the foot on the brake anyway. When "red-yellow" apperas after "red", I put on D and release the brake only after that.


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## TheCat

^^ I used to do that for a while, but after doing some research, I realized there is absolutely no benefit in doing it (the savings in gas are negligible), and in fact, there are some disadvantages (like putting unnecessary wear on the transmission). Of course, I still do it sometimes if my foot is really tired, in which case I put the handbrake and release the brake pedal after shifting to neutral


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## Di-brazil




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## Snowguy716

Minneapolis.. nothing too special


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## Snowguy716

In my city the traffic lights are pretty simple. Smaller intersections have only the 3-light signals with no protected left, while others might have it but only on the busier of the two intersecting roads.

One intersection also has a protected right because the approach of the street on the one side is much busier than the same street on the other side, so that stays red longer and allows for two lanes of traffic to make a right hand turn. 

Most stop lights run in a sequences of 

1: Protected Lefts from Road A
2: Straight ahead/right turn from road A
3: Red on all Road A, protected left on road B
4. Straight ahead on road B.

Some lights have switched now to a different sequence of

1: Green in all directions from "south" approach of road A.
2: Protected left turns red on south approach to road A.
3: Straight ahead traffic on "north" approach of road A turns green.
4: Straight ahead traffic on "south" approach of road A turns red.
5: Protected left of "north" approach on road A turns green.
6: Red in all directions for both directions of road A.

Repeat for road B.

I don't know if this allows for better flow of traffic... but they seem to be doing this on the busier intersections now... I don't really see how it would improve traffic flow.


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## Zohan94

Di-brazil said:


> ^^ brazil has some odd lights. whats with the double red


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## Di-brazil

brazil


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## architect77

1) North Carolina State University- Raleigh
2) Wade Ave. Raleigh, NC


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## Stuck in Bama

Birmingham, Alabama


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## myosh_tino

Troubleshooter said:


> It tells police the traffic light is red. If a car runs the signal, the cop knows he broke the law.
> 
> In California, they are small blue dots.


Newer ones are red and are commonly referred to as "Rat Boxes". They are becoming very popular for law enforcement because red-light running has become a chronic problem. hno:


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## ChrisZwolle

I spotted a traffic signal solely for horses on a country road near Hoevelaken, the Netherlands. Apparently, these horses cross the road a few times per day, so they installed a traffic signal.


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## Gareth

^^ Umn, why is both the red & amber showing? As far as I'm aware, you don't have that in the Netherlands.


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## philimonas

They are two amber lights, probably flashing.


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## Glodenox

I think the top light is actually a red light, but that the picture was taking at the exact moment that the orange and red light were changing their state. I don't understand why the light would go to red (because it seems they're closing those gates) or why the orange light would be on at that moment because after red, there's normally green in the Netherlands...

I think it's a good solution to prevent accidents. Haven't seen that kind of situation before yet though.

Greetings,
Glodenox


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## philimonas

I still think it's flashing :righton:

In the first picture, all lights are off. On the second one, two amber lights are on. So two amber lights blinking -> yield to all traffic (= horses:lol.

Chris, tell us the truth!


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## brewerfan386

*Need more American stop lights..........*:banana:
all are from Wikipedia (and taken in the state of Wisconsin)


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## julieCEO

Lights are good to control traffic. In USA their is lots of traffic. So it is very important to control them.


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## Gareth

I hate horizontally-alligned arrangements. Vertical is much better. It's even worse when a state or country uses a mixture of both.


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## Fargo Wolf

Alex Von Königsberg said:


> TheCat, unprotected left turns give you additional driving skills :lol: When I was in Vancouver, I noticed that there were indeed very few protected left turns, and, compared to Washington, they were very quick.


What you do in that case, is wait till the light turns yellow, then go. That's what I did when I lived in North Vancouver and ventured in to Vancouver before realizing riding a bicycle is the best option.


LtBk said:


> Does anybody here has problems with poorly timed traffic lights?


There's the odd one around here. The big annoyance being that the yellow phase is far too short.


thoju75 said:


> I like this one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And, this one is really funny too.........but hopefully it's just a sculpture in London, simply called "traffic lights tree"


Yup. That's just a decoration. I can just see the chaos THAT would cause, were it an actual traffic light.:lol::nuts:


TheCat said:


> ^^ Synchronized lights are an improvement, but not the best way. The best way is careful timing so that when you get a green light, the chances that you will encounter a red are minimized. Instead of changing at the same time, they should be changing one after the other in sequence but with a small delay. However, most lights in Toronto are not timed at all, so synchronization does help.


That's the function of synchronized lights.


JonAxDrayda said:


> Those are the Lane Control signals.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The green arrow (always points down) simply means that you can use this lane.
> The yellow arrow(s) (always pointing to the left and/or right) mean(s) that the lane is closing up ahead, and that you need to go to the lane(s) next to it.
> The red cross simply means that you can not drive on this lane.
> 
> Site with more info on Lane Control Lights can be found here.


I've never seen the one that indicates drivers to move into two different lanes at the same time (three lane road, middle lane closed), but the rest are familliar, if not universal.
Canada (I'll go with the ones used in British Columbia):
Red X: Lane closed to traffic. Oncoming traffic is using this lane.
White Arrow pointing to an adjacent lane: Move into lane indicated. This lane is closed ahead.
White X (Usually flashing): Congestion ahead. Reduce speed and be prepared to stop.
Green arrow/X (Green X is extinct so far as I know): Drive in this lane.


niterider said:


> Women driving in high heels ....now THAT is dangerous! lol


The TV show "Canada's Worst Drivers" comes to mind...:nuts:


philimonas said:


> They are two amber lights, probably flashing.


I had a look and that what it is.


Gareth said:


> I hate horizontally-alligned arrangements. Vertical is much better. It's even worse when a state or country uses a mixture of both.


I like them. They don't blow about in strong winds. They are less likely to be damaged by over sized loads.


----------



## TheCat

Fargo Wolf said:


> That's the function of synchronized lights.


Not exactly. If we're being very technical, synchronized lights are ones that change at the same time, whereas coordinated lights are ones that change "intelligently", usually one after the other (along a street) taking into account the speed limit.

Synchronized lights are generally used by older systems, and do a decent job along dense downtown streets that have many lights within a short distance. In general, however, they are inferior to properly coordinated lights. I think the lights on many Manhattan streets are synchronized (they seemed like that to me).

Either way though, referring back to my original comment - in Toronto, according to this, most lights are controlled by a central computer, and so I assume some form of coordination is used, although in general it is not very good. That page also mentions a system (SCOOT) that dynamically responds to traffic volumes, which sounds like something that would work well, but currently only 15% of the signals are using it.

By the way, if you want to see an example of very bad traffic light coordination in Markham (a suburb of Toronto), please take a look at a video I made about 1.5 years ago (the link forwards the video to the relevant spot):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iv0kxyjrmc4#t=3m45s


----------



## desertpunk

Albuquerque traffic lights with Red Light Camera:


----------



## traffic-light-man

philimonas said:


> I still think it's flashing :righton:
> 
> In the first picture, all lights are off. On the second one, two amber lights are on. So two amber lights blinking -> yield to all traffic (= horses:lol.
> 
> Chris, tell us the truth!


It'll be the exposure of the camera as the lantern went from amber to red.
OR.
As it drops from red into flashing amber, before switching off altogether, unless it rests in flashing amber and the other picture just caught it when in the 'off' part of the flash.

--

Wisconsin signals are the best IMO, probably because they are most like UK ones in terms of ground level signals.

--

I was told that the red + on the rear of French signals were to allow drivers in the junction to see that the signals have changed, and that they could exit the junction safely. Like a cheap-fix green arrow, but not requiring any cycle time as its merely information (mirroring that of the opposite direction's red aspect), not an actual part of the cycle.


----------



## rick1016

desertpunk said:


> Albuquerque traffic lights with Red Light Camera:
> ...


I see those lights in the series 'Breaking Bad' all the time. I wanna go to New Mexico now!


----------



## bogdymol

Useless traffic light in Arad, Romania:


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## Gareth

Looks like the red should just be a normal non-arrow light, but due to the kink in the road ahead, some daft get decided that a right arrow was necessary, despite the confusion this obviously causes with the real right turn signal.


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## Paddington

Horizontal traffic lights are stupid. Vertical lights are better because as a fail safe, you register information from two sources: the color and the position of the light.


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## Fuzzy Llama

^^
Nah, they are good if you place them right. I like what Switzerland and Liechtenstein does with them - they put the lights under the directional signs, so it's very clear which light stands for which direction:


----------



## TheCat

^^ I think Paddington was referring to the position of each individual colour in the sequence of the lights, since the red light is usually at the top. However, the same thing generally applies in places where horizontal lights are used, though I presume it might be a bit more difficult to decide what side the red light should be on (the left makes sense in this case, since in many languages reading is done left to right).

And by the way, that's a really cool thing in Switzerland! Do most lights have an accompanying direction sign?


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## Fuzzy Llama

TheCat said:


> I think Paddington was referring to the position of each individual colour in the sequence of the lights, since the red light is usually at the top.


Yeah, I know. I might have oversimplified my answer a bit - What I meant was "Vertical lights are better in general, but there are some cases where horizontal layout has some advantages"  



TheCat said:


> And by the way, that's a really cool thing in Switzerland! Do most lights have an accompanying direction sign?


No, such lights are only a 'bonus' to an overhead gantry with directional signaling. And I've visited Switzerland only for few days so I don't know much about it, but I wouldn't say that the Swiss use them more frequent than other Wester European countries.


----------



## WalkTheWorld

Fuzzy Llama said:


> ^^
> Nah, they are good if you place them right. I like what Switzerland and Liechtenstein does with them - they put the lights under the directional signs, so it's very clear which light stands for which direction:


Same here. Standard lights, vertical, lights on direction panels: horizontal.

Like this


----------



## Suburbanist

desertpunk said:


> Albuquerque traffic lights with Red Light Camera:


What are those two extra lights on the median traffic light and that sign "Left turn YIELD on green?".


----------



## Penn's Woods

Suburbanist said:


> What are those two extra lights on the median traffic light and that sign "Left turn YIELD on green?".


"Left turn yield on green" means that if you want to turn left and you have a full green rather than an arrow, you can do so, but you need to yield to oncoming traffic. I'd guess that the two extra lights are a green left arrow and a yellow left arrow. Since what usually follows a yellow is a red, that sign has the effect of telling people "even though we just went through the yellow phase, you can still turn. Just yield first."

First time I encountered such an assembly the "Left turn yield on green" sign really was informative to me for just the reason I described.


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## Dr.Scope

Some observations: 

1. In Israel all left turns are protected. This is simply fantastic and I miss them allot. In Washington USA some are not (added left turn yield on green sign). It can sometimes be difficult to cross and since you are not allowed to stop on a pedestrian crossing you are sometime caught IN THE MIDDLE of the interaction until ongoing traffic has passed and even if the light turns red you must still turn left.. talk about upside down... Thankfully this is only the case on local roads anything with 2/3+ lanes or sees heavy traffic usually has a protected left turn light. The protected lights are in the shape of a left arrow and obviously there is no yield on green sign.

WA yield on left:









WA protected left:









2. In Israel most of W Europe and here in the US on many roads where crossing traffic has off hours (industrial areas, schools, offices etc) the light stays green all the time for the main road unless a car arrives at the intersection. This is fantastic for speeding up many intersections on the weekends or for preventing you from stopping at red lights on empty roads.

3. Here in the US there are no blinking green lights and you can easily look at a mirror for a split second and look up to see the light on yellow..

4. Most lights are placed at the end of the intersection, with an added side light for the right turn lane.

5. On large highways/freeways here in WA before you enter it you may have a "ramp meter" a light in order to slow down traffic joining the freeway. It is only turned on when there is congestion. The HOV lane (buses, taxis, cars with 2+ passengers) can bypass the light.










6. The body of most lights in WA are black Some lights that do not have direct sunlight have a yellow boarder around them to make them stand out other lights that get sunlight have no boarder or a black one.

Sorry for the lack of pics ill take some over the next few days


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## Dr.Scope

Penn's Woods said:


> "Left turn yield on green" means that if you want to turn left and you have a full green rather than an arrow, you can do so, but you need to yield to oncoming traffic. I'd guess that the two extra lights are a green left arrow and a yellow left arrow. Since what usually follows a yellow is a red, that sign has the effect of telling people "even though we just went through the yellow phase, you can still turn. Just yield first."
> 
> First time I encountered such an assembly the "Left turn yield on green" sign really was informative to me for just the reason I described.


Correct me if I am wrong (we don't have such lights in WA)
During 1 light cycle there may be 2 times when you can turn left. On a very congested road like the one in the picture you might first have a PROTECTED left turn (green arrow) and then have a "Left turn yield on green" when the light has the second green light (rounded green light). 
In WA an arrow shaped green/yellow light always means that the turn is Protected.
There may also be a red arrow shaped light that means that there is NO right on red in the direction of the arrow.

Not sure if it is the same down in NM.


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## urbanlover

^^

Yes those turn left turns when you have to yield to traffic are called permissive. The highway admin officially introduced a new style of light last year to fix two problems. One was accidents when using this style the light changes from the yellow ball to red. The biggest problem really was phasing in some places the change from the yellow to red would happen while the opposing traffic light would stay green. People assumed the opposing traffic is getting a yellow and continue to turn leading to "yellow trap". There is also the issue of standardization States vary in way they handled permissive lefts Michigan uses a flashing red ball other some variations of flashing red/yellow ball/arrows. 

States had been allowed to experiment with for the last few years with a four light flashing yellow signal now it officially part of the highway standards. The "yellow trap" phasing has been banned the green ball lights are still permitted for use if the left and through shared lane the light. But states discouraged from using them.


----------



## TheCat

Dr.Scope said:


> Some observations:
> 
> 1. In Israel all left turns are protected. This is simply fantastic and I miss them allot. In Washington USA some are not (added left turn yield on green sign). It can sometimes be difficult to cross and since you are not allowed to stop on a pedestrian crossing you are sometime caught IN THE MIDDLE of the interaction until ongoing traffic has passed and even if the light turns red you must still turn left.. talk about upside down... Thankfully this is only the case on local roads anything with 2/3+ lanes or sees heavy traffic usually has a protected left turn light. The protected lights are in the shape of a left arrow and obviously there is no yield on green sign.
> 
> WA yield on left:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WA protected left:


Heh yeah, in Israel all left turns are protected indeed (see the very first post in this thread ), which is a nice feature, although apparently not very efficient.

The non-protected behaviour is actually standard in almost all countries around the world, so I don't understand why the "Left Turn Yield On Green" sign exists. Unless you have a protected light (clearly distinguished by being an arrow), you have to yield. This is not the case in only a handful of countries, Israel being one of them.

By the way - you are lucky in WA then, since it seems that protected lights are still very common, especially on bigger roads. In Toronto almost all left turns are not protected (many lights do have a protected phase, but virtually all lights also have a permissive one). It doesn't matter if a road has 1 lane or 4 lanes (to the same direction) - it most likely has an unprotected left turn.



urbanlover said:


> ^^
> 
> Yes those turn left turns when you have to yield to traffic are called permissive. The highway admin officially introduced a new style of light last year to fix two problems. *One was accidents when using this style the light changes from the yellow ball to red. The biggest problem really was phasing in some places the change from the yellow to red would happen while the opposing traffic light would stay green. People assumed the opposing traffic is getting a yellow and continue to turn leading to "yellow trap".* There is also the issue of standardization States vary in way they handled permissive lefts Michigan uses a flashing red ball other some variations of flashing red/yellow ball/arrows.


Wow, that's murderous! How can such an intersection be allowed? A permissive left turn where the signals for the oncoming traffic are not synchronized with the signals for through traffic make no sense to me. As I said, in Ontario most left turns are unprotected, but you always complete your turn on yellow/red if you don't get a chance to do it earlier. Though, mind you, people still have to make sure that the oncoming traffic has actually stopped, since many cars pass on yellow (so in practice the turn is almost always completed on red). That's the standard and correct way to perform such a turn here. In theory, in some countries in Europe one cannot see the lights once in the intersection, so it's necessary to ensure that traffic has actually come to a complete stop, but in that case you cannot see the lights at all (sometimes a green arrow appears during the red trap phase, such as in Germany and some other countries).

As for completely protected left turns at all times, like it is done in Israel, I have always been an advocate of them, but after further research into the matter, it seems that those aren't always ideal. In theory, permissive (i.e. yield-on-green) left turns combined with a time-limited protected phase keep traffic flowing more efficiently. Also, at off-peak times it is often possible to make a permissive turn quickly without a protected phase (especially at night). In Israel, most lights require at least 4 separate phases to allow everyone to go straight/turn right and turn left in a protected manner. This reduces the green time per phase, and makes people wait longer for a green light.

The safety argument is also somewhat debatable, since I read somewhere that the completely-protected traffic light design in Israel actually increases accidents at some intersections, because it makes people less mindful of other traffic and encourages jumping yellow/red lights, especially left turn lights. I don't know to what extent it is true. My only complaint is that there are many unprotected lights here in Toronto that should be exclusively protected, due to various combinations of many lanes, high speed limit, and limited visibility (or a combination of all 3, as at a particular intersection around here that I complained about several times on this forum ).


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## Penn's Woods

TheCat said:


> The non-protected behaviour is actually standard in almost all countries around the world, so I don't understand why the "Left Turn Yield On Green" sign exists. Unless you have a protected light (clearly distinguished by being an arrow), you have to yield.


Because what immediately preceded the solid green was a _yellow_ arrow. You wouldn't know this if you came upon the intersection while it's in the solid-green phase, but if you were in the left-turn lane waiting to turn (because there were people ahead of you) you'd have seen that yellow, and your expectation - if this sort of assembly is new to you - is that red will be next, so your instinct after the yellow turns off is to stop. So the yellow arrow disappears, but no red arrow appears and you're thinking, now what? The "Left Turn Yield on Green" tells you it's okay to go, as long as you yield to oncoming trafic. I really did find this helpful the first time I came upon this sort of assembly - I swear I did!


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## ChrisZwolle

non-protected left turns are dangerous, but require less traffic light phases, thus a higher throughput.

The most dangerous feature is that someone wants to make a left turn, but oversees someone going straight ahead at high speed = big collision.


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## ChrisZwolle

edit double


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## ChrisZwolle

edit double


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## Gareth

I don't see how they're dangerous by default. I mean, there are tons of situations where you have to yield to oncoming traffic anyway. Protected cross-turns should only be used when deemed necessary, as they are less efficient than the conventional arrangement when traffic doesn't justify them.


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## ChrisZwolle

It's especially dangerous when you have to cross 2 or 3 lanes from the other direction.


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## nerdly_dood

ChrisZwolle said:


> It's especially dangerous when you have to cross 2 or 3 lanes from the other direction.


...And yet it's the standard method of turning left on Columbia Pike in Arlington. Most other roads have protected left-turn lanes, but this road has o left turn lanes, which is kinda frustrating since I have to turn left on that road both to go to work and to come home. I know of an alternative route that involves bypassing the normal left turn, and making a right-hand loop to turn left instead, but I've never taken that route.


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## Penn's Woods

ChrisZwolle said:


> It's especially dangerous when you have to cross 2 or 3 lanes from the other direction.


...at high speed, around a curve, in a wooded area....

(US 1/Md. 24 southbound at the point where they separate, on the outskirts of Bel Air, Maryland. Traffic wanting to go south on 24 needs to cross 1 northbound. That's the first place I remember seeing this left-turn-yield-on-solid-green thing.)


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## TheCat

Penn's Woods said:


> Because what immediately preceded the solid green was a _yellow_ arrow. You wouldn't know this if you came upon the intersection while it's in the solid-green phase, but if you were in the left-turn lane waiting to turn (because there were people ahead of you) you'd have seen that yellow, and your expectation - if this sort of assembly is new to you - is that red will be next, so your instinct after the yellow turns off is to stop. So the yellow arrow disappears, but no red arrow appears and you're thinking, now what? The "Left Turn Yield on Green" tells you it's okay to go, as long as you yield to oncoming trafic. I really did find this helpful the first time I came upon this sort of assembly - I swear I did!


Heh, fair enough, although the way it works in Toronto, is that first you have a green left arrow together with either a red ball (simultaneous protected left turns) or a green ball (go straight/right + protected left turn). Then after a while, the same arrow turns yellow (so there is no separate yellow arrow - it simply changes colour), after which it disappears.

If the arrow appeared together with a red ball, then after it disappears the red ball remains for a while, and then turns into a green ball, after which one may turn left after yielding. If it appeared together with a green ball, then the arrow simply disappears, after which the protected phase ends and one must now yield. In some places in Ontario there is still a separate yellow arrow (haven't seen those at all in Toronto - I think they're being phased out in the rest of the province, but not sure), but in either case I think it is quite clear what to do without a sign, since the arrow never appears by itself without a red or green solid ball, unless it is an exclusive left turn signal.

I think the reason this confusion exists in the States is because in many jurisdictions there is a separate light above each lane, so you need to have a way to distinguish between a permissive and protected left turn that occurs specifically above the left-turn lane. It's not necessary, but I can see where it can cause confusion.



nerdly_dood said:


> ...And yet it's the standard method of turning left on Columbia Pike in Arlington. Most other roads have protected left-turn lanes, but this road has o left turn lanes, which is kinda frustrating since I have to turn left on that road both to go to work and to come home.


In the Toronto area there are countless intersections like that. Almost all major streets (that have 2-3, and sometimes 4 lanes in each direction) allow unprotected left turns.


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## Penn's Woods

nerdly_dood said:


> ...And yet it's the standard method of turning left on Columbia Pike in Arlington. Most other roads have protected left-turn lanes, but this road has o left turn lanes, which is kinda frustrating since I have to turn left on that road both to go to work and to come home. I know of an alternative route that involves bypassing the normal left turn, and making a right-hand loop to turn left instead, but I've never taken that route.


Jersey jughandles would solve that.


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## nerdly_dood

Penn's Woods said:


> Jersey jughandles would solve that.


There's no room, there are businesses on both sides of the road, plus lots of 4-way intersections. It would be much easier to just add a protected left turn lane.

This is one of two intersections where I have to turn left off Columbia Pike. (It's best to turn labels on there) and this is the other place where I could turn left, although it's substantially farther away.


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## nerdly_dood

And about horizontal traffic lights - in my driver's ed class I was taught that horizontal traffic lights always have red on the left. I haven't actually seen any myself but I've seen pictures of them, and this does seem to be the case.


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## urbanlover

TheCat said:


> Wow, that's murderous! How can such an intersection be allowed? A permissive left turn where the signals for the oncoming traffic are not synchronized with the signals for through traffic make no sense to me. As I said, in Ontario most left turns are unprotected, but you always complete your turn on yellow/red if you don't get a chance to do it earlier. Though, mind you, people still have to make sure that the oncoming traffic has actually stopped, since many cars pass on yellow (so in practice the turn is almost always completed on red). That's the standard and correct way to perform such a turn here. In theory, in some countries in Europe one cannot see the lights once in the intersection, so it's necessary to ensure that traffic has actually come to a complete stop, but in that case you cannot see the lights at all (sometimes a green arrow appears during the red trap phase, such as in Germany and some other countries).
> .


 My understanding is that supposed to be more efficient in terms coordinating signals

http://midimagic.sgc-hosting.com/progreso.htm


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## bogdymol

^^ At least in my country, colorblind people are banned from driving.


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## Fargo Wolf

bogdymol said:


> Look what I found on a website:


That's certainly different.



Tego said:


> Neat!
> 
> Probably wouldn't work for colorblind people though.


No, probably not. I do know someone who IS color blind. He can only see in shades of grey (like you or me watching a B/W TV). Too bad I don't have his E-Mail, or I'd send the pic to him.

That's why the POSITION of the three light setup is so important. Even a color blind person KNOWS that the red light goes on top, or to the left, if the lights are in a horizontal position.



bogdymol said:


> ^^ At least in my country, colorblind people are banned from driving.


And the reason for said ban is?

As mentioned above, I know someone who is color blind, and he even holds an upgraded driver's license (BC, Class 3. Vehicles that have more than two axles, and is permitted to tow air brake equipped trailers to a maximum laden weight of 4600kg).:nocrook:kay:


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## bogdymol

Fargo Wolf said:


> And the reason for said ban is?
> 
> As mentioned above, I know someone who is color blind, and he even holds an upgraded driver's license (BC, Class 3. Vehicles that have more than two axles, and is permitted to tow air brake equipped trailers to a maximum laden weight of 4600kg).:nocrook:kay:


I belive that the ban is exactly because of the traffic light colors. When I made my medical test before taking the drivers licence exam I had to have a test that showed that I can distinguish colors.


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## Fuzzy Llama

^^
Well, when I was making my driver's licence they made me take the colourblindness test too, but the colourblind are allowed to have the A and B-class licence here. So the test was completely unnecessary.


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## Fargo Wolf

bogdymol said:


> I belive that the ban is exactly because of the traffic light colors. When I made my medical test before taking the drivers licence exam I had to have a test that showed that I can distinguish colors.


To me, it's a poor reason to bar a color blind person from driving to be honest. hno: That's why the position of the lights are pretty much universal. Even a color blind person knows that the red light goes at the top, yellow in the middle and green on the bottom and below that, the turn arrow.


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## dizee

Well this is ...interesting.








This road is quite a notorious accident spot though, downhill and on a very sharp bend over a bridge that can barely fit a car. It'd be bad enough for some old country road but it's actually the N2, the "main route" from Dublin to Derry.

Anyway I've never seen a traffic light like this before. 

Street view


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## Marco925

Funny pedestrian traffic light found in the Bronx


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## Nexis

Marco925 said:


> Funny pedestrian traffic light found in the Bronx


Thats actually in Montana....


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## niterider

dizee said:


> Well this is ...interesting.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This road is quite a notorious accident spot though, downhill and on a very sharp bend over a bridge that can barely fit a car. It'd be bad enough for some old country road but it's actually the N2, the "main route" from Dublin to Derry.
> 
> Anyway I've never seen a traffic light like this before.
> 
> Street view


The light is just a standardised one housed within a gantry, they're used elsewhere eg in tunnels or tolled bridges.


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## dizee

Actually I meant the separate traffic light for trucks to use the same stretch of road. That might be common too but I haven't seen it before.


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## Wimpie

Another few pictures of Belgian lights:

This is an intersection with new LED-lights, they no longer use the "circular back-shield" which is a shame to my opionion




























Older lights with contrast shields. In Belgium we always use this type of of overhead holders. Poles and contrasters are collored yellow-black in the state of Flanders and red-white in the state of Wallonia.




























On larger intersections gantry's like these are used





































When gantry's are used, all possible directions are summarized on the right









And atlast, the versions of our Wallonian compadres (also found in Brussels in the non renovated area's)


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## engenx4

^^ WOW :cheers:


Traffic light in my small city in Brazil

LED-Lights


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## Gareth

Wimpie said:


> Another few pictures of Belgian lights:
> 
> This is an intersection with new LED-lights, they no longer use the "circular back-shield" which is a shame to my opionion


When did they discontinue the sightboards and why? Belgian traffic signals seem identical to Dutch traffic signals, except the Dutch ones are painted black & white.

So the colour scheme is regional then? I always thought the red & white ones were older and they changed to the yellow & black scheme. So Flanders is black & yellow, Wallonia is red & white, whilst Brussels used to be red & white but is changing it black & yellow?


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## Spookvlieger

^^ Yes the colour scheme is regional. In Brussels you can find them both indeed. But the suburbs in east, west and north have the Black/yellow ones because they are in Flanders...Only the suburbs in the south have red and white because they are in Wallonia.


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## MareCar

http://www.yankodesign.com/images/design_news/2010/11/17/sandglass_signal2.jpg

Stupid. I am not even going to go into the reasons.


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## Wimpie

^^
No, Brussels is not Flemish, nor Wallonian.
The Flemish and French speaking community do have power in Brussels but thats only when it comes to education, personal and cultural matters.
In Flanders the community and state have been reformed into a single entity which functions like a country and has a goverment with a president.
Wallonia is a state of Belgium as well but houses two community's; a French and a german one.

For all the rest Brussels is just as much of a federal state of Belgium as Flanders and Wallonia are. This means that state-borders are in every way national borders when it comes to infrastructure.
They have their own policy when it comes to traffic lights and that is replacing the old red & white Belgian ones (from the days when belgium was still a unitary nation) by these traffic lights, which seem to be rather dull and rather invisible to me.

Old ones



















New ones


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## DanielFigFoz

Fargo Wolf said:


> To me, it's a poor reason to bar a color blind person from driving to be honest. hno: That's why the position of the lights are pretty much universal. Even a color blind person knows that the red light goes at the top, yellow in the middle and green on the bottom and below that, the turn arrow.


My uncle can't tell red from green and he drives a jeep with a caravan attatched:lol:.

Colourblind people are allowed to drive in both the UK and in Portugal.


Theres that traffic light in Tipperary Hill, Syracuse, NY that would prove a problem for colour blind people.


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## Gareth

Wimpie said:


>


So this is the new standard for Brussels now? Seem like Euro-standard Swarco signals. Very smart, but they have less character than the traditional Benelux design (actually, I don't know what Luxembourgs traffic signals look like).

But, I assume, after federalization, Wallonia kept the original Beligian standards, whilst Flanders changed it to the black & yellow standard and this is how it remains? Or are these plainer signals entering other parts of Belgium as well?


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## Fargo Wolf

DanielFigFoz said:


>


They mounted the damn light upside down...


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## Metro One

You very seldom see traffic lights hanging by wires in BC, Canada, nearly all of them are mounted on posts. In fact I find it odd when I see a traffic light hanging by a wire, seems so unfinished.


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## Metro One

And to follow up on my last posts here are a few pics of mine showing what traffic lights / intersections look like in British COlumbia, Canada:

Here is an intersection in the resort town of Osoyoos in the dry interior of BC











Here is looking down Kingsway in Burnaby (a suburb of Vancouver)











And one a little more close up, same area



















Pics are my own, cheers!


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## Suburbanist

In regard of Belgium, there is something that worries me: signs that are opened to you in 2-way avenues or large streets without any indication about whether are you going to face incoming traffic when turning left or making a U-turn.


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## Wimpie

Gareth said:


> So this is the new standard for Brussels now? Seem like Euro-standard Swarco signals. Very smart, but they have less character than the traditional Benelux design (actually, I don't know what Luxembourgs traffic signals look like).
> 
> But, I assume, after federalization, Wallonia kept the original Beligian standards, whilst Flanders changed it to the black & yellow standard and this is how it remains? Or are these plainer signals entering other parts of Belgium as well?



That is indeed how the situation is at the moment. Altough Wallonia developped a new standerd like Flanders in which white and red are switched. Red is now the base colour and white the contraster whereas in the past it was more of a pattern. Considering the plainer signals, they're not spreading across Belgium as far as I know, the only city that uses them is Antwerp and that is only on the renewed main avenue. Al the other Flemish signals in Antwerp have been painted gray though but the original shape remains.
About traffic signals in Luxemburg, they're the same as the old Belgian ones.

Vintage picture










Old belgian ones, painted in the Flemish color scheme


















Newer Flemish ones (with shields)



























Newest Flemish lights























































Special ones in Antwerp


















(Repainted)








Traffic lights in Luxemburg














































Pedistrean buttons
Wallonia









Flanders


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## Danielk2

Most places in Denmark has those buttons as a standard, they're very rarely signed.


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## Wimpie

They're standard here as wel, together with a sound for people with a visual handicap. They're signed so people know that they're for cyclists or pedistreans.


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## DanielFigFoz

Fargo Wolf said:


> They mounted the damn light upside down...


The locals don't like the English red on top of the Irish green:lol:

-------------------

Anyway, this is in Figueira da Foz, Portugal. Figueira has a huge lack of traffic lights, other than for traffic calming on the N109 and the N111 outside of the city and for pedestrians along the sea front.

But, there are only about 4 actual junctions in the town with traffic lights, with a lot of roundabouts desperately in need of them.

Anyway, the newer lights for traffic calming and for the newest traffic light junctions have green poles. Most of them have traffic lights above the roadway, but this photo is the ony one I had, which doesn't have the higher pole, but they look like that just higher up.










Edit:

I found a pic of an older traffic light (sorry for quality, I as aiming at the taxi):










(The roundabout at the far back in this photo, is pretty big and could really do with traffic lights.


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## Gareth

Although not the same as the Benelux signal family, UK signals used to also be striped, although the stripes were much thicker.

On very earliest signals, the stripe scheme was a bit crazy; the stripes went all the way up the pole, including the signal head, where the amber aspect would be painted white. 



















In the sixties, the scheme was calmed down somewhat, with only the bottom half of the pole being striped. Personally, I like this scheme the best....

(note the 'STOP' command lense that British signals had during the stripey era)




























Sadly, in anticipation of the arrival of new design UK signal, the scheme was changed to plain grey (black in London for some reason). This standard changed little between 1970-2000...











Since then, design rules have relaxed somewhat and different styles of signal heads are allowed (albeit to still comparatively strict UK regulations). Also, making the pole grey is not such a fundamental rule anymore and local authorities often pick their own schemes. Wolverhampton had the first set of traffic signals in the UK and to commemerate this, they replaced older grey signals with modern signals where the pole was striped (in the revised scheme). I think it looks really good and wish it was still standard...


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## Wimpie

Cool pics, I always love historical footage. When it comes to Belgium, our traffic signals have had the same design all the way back to their introduction.
Not even the the high masts have changed since they're introduced.
The thing now with abandoning the use of shields, is the first big change in their history.
They claim its for durability for the old shields caught to much wind and put to much stress on the construction.


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## Gareth

This is hilarious. Just found this article on Belgian unionists painting over the Flemish traffic lights...



The Economist said:


> Belgian traffic lights sending political signals
> 
> Mar 2nd 2008, 19:08 by Charlemagne
> 
> *
> *
> 
> BELGIAN traffic lights have long sent political signals, as well as commands to stop and start. In Brussels and the French-speaking south, the posts of traffic lights are painted with red and white bands, but as soon as you cross into Dutch-speaking Flanders, they suddenly turn yellow and black striped, like bumble bees. This is because the flag of Flanders is a black lion on a yellow ground, and a few years ago changing the paintwork of traffic signs seemed to Flemish politicians like a good wheeze for conveying Flemish national pride to passing drivers.
> 
> Recently, however, cheeky pro-Belgium scamps have taken to amending the paint scheme, in a small protest related to the political crisis that began with last summer's national parliamentary elections (a temporary government is currently on course to become a permanent government at the end of this month, after a mere ten months of wrangling). In the Flemish suburbs closest to Brussels, they have been quietly adding a red stripe to the posts, so that they are now bear stripes of black, yellow and red: the national colours of the Kingdom of Belgium, and of the country's national tricolour flag. Your reporter first heard about this the other day when taking part in a rather bruising political debate with the Belgian EU commissioner, Louis Michel (who called this reporter "perfide" for wondering whether Belgium was in fact a functioning democracy, It is a word you do not hear often, whether you are from Albion or not). A member of the audience alleged that some of those caught painting turning Flemish traffic lights into Belgian traffic lights had been accused of vandalism, and suggested this raised interesting legal questions as to whether patriotism could be equated to vandalism. I have also heard that Flemish nationalists have been fighting back with black paint, working to erase red stripes as quickly as possible.
> 
> Tonight, driving through Tervuren, on the edge of Brussels, your reporter saw his first Belgified traffic lights. Alas, the red stripe was a bit wobbly, and the paint had dripped over the next stripes down. But the message was clear enough. The logical next step could be for Belgian's small rattachiste movement, who want the French speaking parts of the country to be voluntarily absorbed into France, to take blue paint to those red and white striped traffic lights in Brussels and Wallonia, and Frenchify them into feux tricouleurs.


http://www.economist.com/blogs/certainideasofeurope/2008/03/belgian_traffic_lights_sending


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## Spookvlieger

^^:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## Wimpie

Yeah, I've heard about it a few years ago. Altough the Flemish government never claimed that they repainted the traffic lights after the state reform because of Flemish pride. They did it according to them because white and black are more eye catching colours than the old Belgian Red & White.
The Walloons often see those colours as the ultimate example of daily nationalism but we Flemish people never really thought about it. Ofcourse, now after all those claims and accusations, we do. Talking about a boomerang effect...

Nevertheless, I've gotten used to the striped contrast system. So used that I sometimes overlook traffic lights in country's (Germany...) where they use a very minimalistic set-up.


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## Tchek

Wimpie said:


> The Walloons often see those colours as the ultimate example of daily nationalism but we Flemish people never really thought about it.


"them Walloons think that way and we Flemish think this way"

How do you know what groups made of millions people think?

This way of thinking bugs me, like if there was one single brain for millions of people. (well sometimes it seems like it, but still...)


----------



## g.spinoza

Tchek said:


> "them Walloons think that way and we Flemish think this way"
> 
> How do you know what groups made of millions people think?


Just by looking at their politics. Belgium is barely a single country because of what millions of people think


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## Tchek

g.spinoza said:


> Just by looking at their politics. Belgium is barely a single country because of what millions of people think


The reason Belgium is barely a single country is due to the divided political system; so the country was condamned in the first place. I am sure not every Flemish is a NVA member, OR that the politics of the NVA is agreed by every single Flemish, because I don't think that the "Flemish" consistute one collective body of single thought, the same way that I doubt that every Wallonian lost sleep over the black/yellow stripes of the traffic lights in Flanders.


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## Gareth

^^ It wasn't condemned in the first place. A blend of Francophone domination in the old days, followed by surely the most disasterous example of federalism the world has ever seen, is what's boloxed Belgium. It's amazing it hasn't imploded already.

Regardless, the traffic light thing is an example of how dumb nationalism is. I wonder if the SNP in Scotland will start paining Scottish traffic lights tarten, because at the moment, they're identical to English traffic lights and that won't do.


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## Rail Claimore

Wimpie said:


> Another few pictures of Belgian lights:
> 
> This is an intersection with new LED-lights, they no longer use the "circular back-shield" which is a shame to my opionion


How common are overhead mast arms in Europe? They seem very rare in the UK, but are relatively common in the suburban areas of French cities, based on what I've seen on streetview?


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## Gareth

They're a lot more common in most European countries compared to the UK. They're not as rare here as they once were, but they're still not that common.


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## Wimpie

I can only speak for the Benelux but they're very common here. You will rarely encounter a trafficlight without a mast. The Belgian ones were actually modelled after American mast lights in the first place. Belgium and the US were on a similar line when it came to road construction and the economical climate and political ideoligies until about 1980.












Gareth said:


> ^^ It wasn't condemned in the first place. A blend of Francophone domination in the old days, followed by surely the most disasterous example of federalism the world has ever seen, is what's boloxed Belgium. It's amazing it hasn't imploded already.


It wasn't just that, the Flemish were considered to be untermenschen by Walloons until the 1930's, after that we still were second hand citizens until the 1960's when the federalisation process began. To me it was the best thing that could happen to Flanders because without the Walloons would have halted the growth of the Flemish economy for years in favour of their collapsing industrial empire.
Don't get me wrong, without that industrial empire we would have been the great country we were in the day but all of that was established on the backs of the working cattle that the Walloons called "les Flamands".
Today the situation is the oposite of what it was. Flanders is now multiple times richer, the incomes are higher with 17 %, the unemployement rate is about 8 % compared to 21% in Walloni, the population is bigger, people are healthier and live longer (81 years <> 78 in Wallonia). All these numbers are found on the website of the NIS (national institute for Statistics).


----------



## Spookvlieger

N3 In Sint-Truiden, viewed twoards Tiennen, Belgium
Overhanging lampposts on both sides.


----------



## Spookvlieger

Complete overhead on the N80 in Sint-Truiden. You can find them on almost all 4x4 roads in Belgium that are not highways. Mostly expressways have lights like this.


----------



## Spookvlieger

The intersection in the picture of the N3 wich is now a roundabout used to look just like this...


----------



## Wimpie

Nice pics. About the roundabout, alot of intersections that were turned into roundabouts, are being reverted back into their original state in the comming years. So we'll get to see more traffic lights in the future


----------



## Spookvlieger

^^ Are you sure? I don't think this will be the case though...It was a 5 road intersection with a lot of crashes each year...Now almost none...Btw the intersection(s) of the N80 I showed - there are 3 more like this near the city center of Sint-Truiden on the same road- will all get an underpass and roundabout on top...


----------



## harryj79

Here's a question for a traffic light expert from the UK (or just anyone who knows). Why is it that in the UK almost all traffic lights have a white border around them, but in London they seem to be simply black with no white border? Is it something to do with Transport for London maintaining the roads in London and the Highways Agency maintaining roads outside London?


----------



## Wimpie

joshsam said:


> ^^ Are you sure? I don't think this will be the case though...It was a 5 road intersection with a lot of crashes each year...Now almost none...Btw the intersection(s) of the N80 I showed - there are 3 more like this near the city center of Sint-Truiden on the same road- will all get an underpass and roundabout on top...


Ofcourse like in the example you mentioned, safety improved because of the roundabout. In other cases where roadsafety didn't improve or even got worse because of the rounabout. They'll get reevaluated and like the about 3 out of 5 roundabouts on the Geel Ringroad, they'll be removed or be equiped with underpasses.


----------



## Gareth

harryj79 said:


> Here's a question for a traffic light expert from the UK (or just anyone who knows). Why is it that in the UK almost all traffic lights have a white border around them, but in London they seem to be simply black with no white border? Is it something to do with Transport for London maintaining the roads in London and the Highways Agency maintaining roads outside London?


It's a pretty well-asked question and no one has a definate answer. Apparently, in the UK, sightboards are not mandatory on roads that aren't classed as trunk roads or have a speed limit over 30mph. The old mellor signals (and the design before them) had sightboards which were a maintenence pain, though more modern one's are more reliable, so in a place with so many signals, the cons were probably seen as higher than the pros. Ones with sightboards are becoming more common in certain boroughs these days though. Peterborough was another place that had mellors standard without signtboards, but all their signals seem to have been replaced with modern ones, all with sightboards. Glasgow is a place where they still have 'naked' mellor signals in the central area.

Also, during the mellor age, the poles were mostly black in London but grey virtually everywhere else. It may be that the London Transport authority had more say over these things than the rest of the country. That's certainly the case today.


----------



## DanielFigFoz

Rail Claimore said:


> How common are overhead mast arms in Europe? They seem very rare in the UK, but are relatively common in the suburban areas of French cities, based on what I've seen on streetview?





Gareth said:


> They're a lot more common in most European countries compared to the UK. They're not as rare here as they once were, but they're still not that common.


I can think of quite a few in suburban London


----------



## harryj79

> It's a pretty well-asked question and no one has a definate answer. Apparently, in the UK, sightboards are not mandatory on roads that aren't classed as trunk roads or have a speed limit over 30mph. The old mellor signals (and the design before them) had sightboards which were a maintenence pain, though more modern one's are more reliable, so in a place with so many signals, the cons were probably seen as higher than the pros. Ones with sightboards are becoming more common in certain boroughs these days though. Peterborough was another place that had mellors standard without signtboards, but all their signals seem to have been replaced with modern ones, all with sightboards. Glasgow is a place where they still have 'naked' mellor signals in the central area.
> 
> Also, during the mellor age, the poles were mostly black in London but grey virtually everywhere else. It may be that the London Transport authority had more say over these things than the rest of the country. That's certainly the case today.


Thanks for that.


----------



## Wimpie

When it comes to the London situation, it's the same case with Antwerp in Belgium as well. Bigger cities allows allow themselves more free room for diversion in cases like this. In Antwerp traffic lights look different as well.


----------



## Fargo Wolf

Gareth said:


> The old mellor signals


I had to Google that, to find out what a Mellor Signal was.

Linky:
http://www.freewebs.com/trafficlightsignals/mellorsignals.htm


----------



## Gareth

^^ Sorry about that. Yes, mellors are the signals that were designed by David Mellor. They came out in Autumn 1970 and are still just about in production, although most localities now prefer the newer designs that have appeared in the last ten years or so.


----------



## diablo234

I figured I will post this video since it is entertaining and traffic light related as well. :lol:


----------



## Gag Halfrunt

I'm not a traffic light geek so forgive me if it's obvious, but does anyone recognise these new traffic lights seen in North Korea? Based on what's known about North Korean industry, it probably cannot design or built modern LED lights without foreign assistance.


New traffic lights in Pyongyang by Kernbeisser, on Flickr


----------



## Wimpie

Yeah, they look alot like those new ones in Brussels.


----------



## Gareth

Is that really Pyongyang? I've seen those exact signals & poles in Finland.


----------



## IRELAND

Lights in Dublin:


----------



## Spookvlieger

Gareth said:


> Is that really Pyongyang? I've seen those exact signals & poles in Finland.


Probably not, look a the smooth paving of the road, electricity cabins, seperated sewer lines for sewage water and rain!!!! That is not NK!!


----------



## Gag Halfrunt

^^ Kernbeisser works (I think) for a German NGO operating in North Korea, and he has posted hundreds of photos from North Korea, including rural areas and lesser-known towns that foreigners do not normally see.

Next year will be the centenary of Kim Il Sung's birth, and the North Korean régime is spending a serious amount of money on sprucing up Pyongyang as part of a propaganda drive to build a "strong and prosperous nation" by 2012. Recent visitors report that the famous "traffic girls" (the female traffic police who control junctions) are being replaced by traffic lights. In any case, the capital is a showpiece city designed to impress foreign visitors and maintained to a higher standard than the rest of the country.


----------



## Spookvlieger

^^ I see, and I understand why it looks so clean now...


----------



## xzmattzx

I've been noticing some new traffic light styles in the US recently. I've seen one traffic light group on US 202 in Pennsylvania that has blinking white lights inside the red light. So, on top of having bright LED lights, you notice this blinking white row of lights. It's annoying but I guess it works (although I'd prefer regular red lights).

There's a HAWK light in Newark here at a pedestrian crossing over South Chapel Street near UD's farms. The light remains off for all colors unless a pedestrian wishing to cross presses the button, and then it goes from yellow to two reds. There's no green. The lights form an upside-down pyramid, with the reds obviously on the top.


----------



## Glodenox

joshsam said:


> ^^There are also these lights with a vertical strip, horizontal strip and dot on them. Indicating wich way the traffic comes. can't really find any pic about them.
> 
> They are used for trams if I am not mistaken. But in Hasselt there are no trams and there is one still working on crossing???
> 
> Edit: found pic: [cut out img]


Those lights work exactly like the regular "red, amber, green" from top to bottom, but they use symbols instead. Regular traffic should just ignore them, but they're placed there for ALL types of public transport. A bus can also use this traffic light to know whether it can drive.

For public transport, these lights phase from "red" to "red-amber" to "green" instead of directly from "red" to "green". Mainly for trams, this saves time for acceleration.

And instead of having an arrow pointing in the direction that has the green light in public transportation, the "green" light may differ in shape:
a | as seen in the picture means it is green to drive straight on,
a \ or / respectively for left or right,
and an upside down triangle to indicate that all allowed directions are green.
The Netherlands has a similar system, but the symbols are displayed with dots instead of in full shape. This has the advantage that they can modify the dots to adjust the shape when more than one allowed direction is possible.

As for the + signal: yup, they just indicate the traffic light shown to the opposite direction, but they are being phased out. It's a small miracle that one got replaced with a new one since it's no longer part of the driving education as far as I'm aware.

EDIT: just checked: no longer part of driving education, but the lights for public transport are part of the theory because you may end up in a public transport lane due to road works or evading an accident.

Greetings,
Glodenox


----------



## Gareth

Just one more thing about giving way to pedestrians when turning; what happens at T-junctions, or where the traffic has to otherwise turn left. Do pedestrians still get a green in this situation?


----------



## Spookvlieger

^^Allways whenever a pedestrian crossing is indecated when there are no traffic lights.
When doing driving exam, any pedestrian that makes an attempt to cross on a zebra has priority when there are no traffic lights.
In theory if you hit a pedestrian who wasn't crossing on a pedestrian crossing, it's their fault. But that would be overruled by the fact that the pedestrian is a vulnerable road user.


----------



## Wimpie

Gareth said:


> Just one more
> thing about giving way to pedestrians when turning; what happens at T-junctions, or where the traffic has to otherwise turn left. Do pedestrians still get a green in this situation?


When it comes to pedestrian crossings, the UK is one of the most developped countries in the world. In Belgium pedestrians usually get green together with the traffic on their side of the intersection.
On most intersections however, pedestrians do are able to "call" for their green light but again, cars on their side of the intersection will get green at the same time (just earlier).

Crossing in the Netherlands


























Crossing in Wallonia (yes, their cycling lanes are green)










Crossing in Flanders


----------



## DanielFigFoz

In the UK, unless pedestrians are already on a crossing, and there are no lights, they have no priority. Also, there is no such thing a jaywalking here, and pedestrians can go wherever they please, except for motorways.


----------



## Fargo Wolf

And even then, you can find them on the motorway...


----------



## Minato ku

Flickr


----------



## Wimpie

DanielFigFoz said:


> In the UK, unless pedestrians are already on a crossing, and there are no lights, they have no priority. Also, there is no such thing a jaywalking here, and pedestrians can go wherever they please, except for motorways.


Pedestrians here have no priority whatsoever unless they are at a zebracrossing (we have no other crossings) and non verbally communicate that they want to cross. Crossing roadways just like that, without using indicated crossings, is at your responsebility. If you're hit by a car, it is your own fault.


----------



## bogdymol

Bucharest, Romania:









via criserb.ro


----------



## dsanto

In my country, Lithuania, till 1st May 2012 we had old traffic lights installation standard which was based on formally soviet standards. Major facts of old standard:
For turning traffic it was basically installed a traffic lights with additional arrows. But the bad was that when the arrow is off, no matter which signal has a basic traffic light (green or red), the turn into the arrow direction, is prohibited. For example, in this case only straight and right turning traffic is allowed – left turn is prohibited:











Sometimes it can be dangerous because the turning traffic has no red light an when it’s bad weather or just night time the driver could think that there is no arrow at all at it is allowed to drive in all directions. Almost “unseen” left turn arrow at night in Vilnius:











The second bad thing of our old standard was that in many cases it was not allowed to install a two color pedestrian traffic lights, so, especially in Vilnius, pedestrians have three color traffic lights which sometimes could be mistaken by drivers because they look like vehicle traffic lights, only smaller:











The old Lithuanian traffic lights standard had one special thing which was not seen in Russian standards – a white plate with green arrow which allows turning right on red:











The bad thing was that these plates were installed in almost all intersections, and in some cases it is dangerous.

In the old standard there were two possible signal sequences: 1. red – red and yellow – green – yellow – red; 2. red – green – yellow – red (like in USA). Green signal could flash before going to yellow. 


Since 1st May 2012 we have new rules for installation of traffic lights based on West Europe’s technical documentation. Now the turning traffic has its own traffic lights:











Pedestrian have their own traffic lights:











And in many cases it is not allowed to install the plates with green arrow by new rules.

In Lithuanian now we have this signal sequence on new installed traffic lights: red – red and yellow – green – yellow – red. Green signal can flash before going to yellow. Red – yellow lasts 1-2 s, yellow lasts 3 s (50 km/h), 4 s (60 km/h), 5 s (70 km/h).
New traffic lights rules are used only for new installed traffic lights. So the old traffic lights will not be changed until reconstruction of intersections. 

That’s all for beginning about Lithuanian traffic lights.


----------



## diablo234

Here is a video of the Hawk Signal which are being implemented at various crosswalks all over the US.


----------



## Northern Pyro

Traffic lights near where I live:
https://maps.google.com/?ll=64.8345...=yIx-2EG2BvS7Ys7P_658bg&cbp=12,10.92,,0,53.46
As you can see, the lights are placed on the opposite side, and they do go overboard, but for good reason, so that wherever you are waiting you can see a light.
BTW, this signal in particular works on a 4 phases. Traffic from the south goes, then from the east, then from the north, when from the west. This is because there is a combined turn/straight lane in each direction.


----------



## Chicagoago

Traffic light in a suburb of Iowa City, Iowa.

directs 5 northbound lanes, 5 southbound lanes, 4 eastbound and 3 westbound


----------



## Chicagoago

One thing I like here in Chicago is that the pedestrian signals have a white "walk" signal, and then a red countdown for how many seconds until the light changes. It's very handy when driving, as you can see a block away exactly how long until the light changes. It helps keep people from making split second decisions when the light "suddenly changes".


----------



## riiga

Chicagoago said:


> It helps keep people from making split second decisions when the light "suddenly changes".


It also works in reverse...


----------



## Rail Claimore

Chicagoago said:


> One thing I like here in Chicago is that the pedestrian signals have a white "walk" signal, and then a red countdown for how many seconds until the light changes. It's very handy when driving, as you can see a block away exactly how long until the light changes. It helps keep people from making split second decisions when the light "suddenly changes".


I found myself subconsciously doing this when I lived there.


----------



## shree711

Just a couple of examples from Hong Kong taken from google street view (I am sure that my fellow Hong Kongers can provide some more):


----------



## Blackraven

Some kind of weird traffic light in Japan










Here are some related videos to illustrate this confusion:













So what the hell should we do: Stop or continue going straight? 

:lol::nuts:


----------



## Rail Claimore

Blackraven said:


> Some kind of weird traffic light in Japan
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So what the hell should we do: Stop or continue going straight?
> 
> :lol::nuts:


I dunno what the yellow arrow signals are for, but the two signal heads at 2:44 mean "left" (左) and "right" (右). I'm betting the "left" and "right" are something like ramp meters we have in the US that let one or two cars go per green from a freeway ramp onto a freeway.


----------



## x-type

yellow signals might be for trams/trains which use the intersection. it reminds me on European tram signals, and in background one could hear the sound of rail vehicles.


----------



## Gareth

Sorry, I wasn't aware that I was talking about the same person to the same person.

Yes, arrows are good. I wish the UK had them on all colours. Only the green light can be an arrow here.


----------



## dsanto

Gareth said:


> Yes, arrows are good. I wish the UK had them on all colours. Only the green light can be an arrow here.


I didn't know that... It's better when all colors are with arrows.


----------



## Gareth

I agree.

Our pedestrian signals work quite differently too. For a start, the common convention of allowing a green man to be lit whilst traffic going in the same direction has a green is not allowed; even though it is present in almost every other country in the world (only other UK-influenced countries such as the Irish Republic and Hong Kong are the same). A green man can only be lit if there's no vehicle traffic whatsoever which conflict with the crossing. There's also this relatively new convention of putting the pedestrian signal low down on the nearby pole rather than high up on the pole opposite like it was in the past, as well as what it is still like in every other country in the world. I don't like it, but they seem to be sticking to it...


----------



## Owl.

Gareth said:


> Sorry, I wasn't aware that I was talking to about the same person to the same person.
> 
> Yes, arrows are good. I wish the UK had them on all colours. Only the green light can be an arrow here.


The Department of Transport in the UK was experimenting with the introduction of amber arrows quite a while ago. This was from a document published by the Highways Agency in association with the Department of Transport in December 2003. Judging from their lack of introduction within the last decade I assume they didn't continue with the experiment; 




























(The document these images were taken from is here.)


----------



## DanielFigFoz

I had forgotten about these photos, I saw these in the City a couple of weeks ago:


----------



## Gareth

Yes, there's a Transport For London trial going on regarding counting down the clearance interval. Unlike much of the UK, London's been trying its best not to install those annoying nearside pedestrian poles. It's also retaining the blackout period, whereas in many parts of the country now, the green man just changes instantly to red man. Although I like the idea of a clearance signal, I don't really like blackout. I'd rather the green man just flashed, or even the red man like in Australia.

Hong Kong also trialled countdown idicators for the clearance period, about ten years ago. When the green man started to flash, it would come on and when it reached zero, the red man would appear, not too disimilar to the ones in London. I don't think the trial was successful though, as I was there in 2008 and didn't see any still in place.


----------



## Chilio

What about the number of lanes and number of traffic lights in your countries? Do you have a traffic light above every lane? We used to have them some 15-20 years ago, but then for I dunno what reason (some kind of economy?) they removed many of them and left generally one for each direction, no matter if there is one, two or three or more lanes bellow it, and usually doubled with one on the right side. Here's a pic to illustrate, you can easily see where there were more lights above before:


----------



## g.spinoza

In Italy there's usually one traffic light on the right and another one on a gantry above the road, no matter the number of lanes.


----------



## verreme

^^ Same in Spain.


----------



## x-type

no rules here.
sometimes each lane has its own light.
sometimes there is just one light on the portal signaling for all lanes.
https://maps.google.hr/?ll=45.79115...=CgpTfWBlkbbELaPjcnvp_g&cbp=12,327.62,,0,9.77


----------



## italystf

g.spinoza said:


> In Italy there's usually one traffic light on the right and another one on a gantry above the road, no matter the number of lanes.


Sometimes also on the left side.


----------



## g.spinoza

italystf said:


> Sometimes also on the left side.


Only in separate carriageways or one-way streets.


----------



## dsanto

Till the 1st May 2012 Lithuania had old soviet-based standard for traffic lights. There were two ways foreseen in this standard for installing traffic lights in case of different green time for some lanes. First and most used method where to install traffic lights with additional sections - in this case when additional section is off, turning traffic is forbidden, no matter what the main traffic light shows. This method didn't require to install traffic lights above the lanes. 










The second method was to use traffic lights with arrows above each lane. This method was almost unused because of requirement to install traffic lights above each lane and that all traffic lights must have arrows what means that all turning traffic (left and right) must be protected. While the first method allowed to have one protected turning traffic (e.g. Left), and one non-protected. 










Since May 2012 we have german-based traffic lights install method. Each separately directed traffic has minimum two traffic lights: one on the side and one above lanes. Protected turning traffic has arrows, non-protected has no arrows.


----------



## dsanto

Have you in your country a sign like this, that allows to turn right on red:










This photo is from Lithuania. Turning on red we must check if any pedestrian is crossing before turning and must give way to possible vehicle coming from another way.

Have you such signs in your country or other signals that allow to turn right (left) on red?


----------



## MattiG

dsanto said:


> Have you in your country a sign like this, that allows to turn right on red:
> 
> Have you such signs in your country or other signals that allow to turn right (left) on red?


Such a setup is not allowed in Finland. Instead, the free right turn traffic flow must be separated by an island:










The base rule is simple: If there are traffic lights at the intersection, they must control all the traffic directions available. The island-separated right turn is an exception to the basic rule.


----------



## bogdymol

In Romania we have a tiny green flashing arrow where you are allowed to make a right turn on red light:


----------



## dsanto

bogdymol said:


> In Romania we have a tiny green flashing arrow where you are allowed to make a right turn on red light.


A question - does an arrow still flash when the main traffic light becomes green?


----------



## bogdymol

dsanto said:


> A question - does an arrow still flash when the main traffic light becomes green?


Usually it' turned off during normal green.


----------



## JB1981

dsanto said:


> Have you in your country a sign like this, that allows to turn right on red:
> 
> [..]
> This photo is from Lithuania. Turning on red we must check if any pedestrian is crossing before turning and must give way to possible vehicle coming from another way.
> 
> Have you such signs in your country or other signals that allow to turn right (left) on red?


In The Netherlands we do not have them... for cars.
For bicycles, we do have this sign:


----------



## pccvspw999

dsanto said:


> Have you in your country a sign like this, that allows to turn right on red:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This photo is from Lithuania. Turning on red we must check if any pedestrian is crossing before turning and must give way to possible vehicle coming from another way.
> 
> Have you such signs in your country or other signals that allow to turn right (left) on red?


In Germany it's also possible to have these fixed "green arrows". It was introduced to traffic code after re-union with GDR. It's one of the few traffic rules which were taken from the former east german traffic code.
In Italy, like in Finland, "continuous free right turns" are separated by an island. It's also allowed to have alighting "turn right arrows" (like shown in the romanian picture, but not flashing). In this case pedestian cannot cross the road, they have "red light".


----------



## BenjiMan

^^ 
That's incorrect. You can't say what countries use which design. There are more designs to be seen in one country. For example the Netherlands. As far as I know there are at least 7 types of Traffic lights (Vialis Classic, Vialis Vialina, Groenpol, Siemens, Alustar, Futurit, Futura).

The only thing you can state is that each country uses it's own system. For example, using a black background shield or not (and which sort?), the type of arrows or pedestrian symbols, using the colour scheme of green-yellow-red-green or with red/yellow and then green, et cetera  

Besides, in your scheme you say Belgium. That's not correct. That one is the new Dutch design by Vialis: the Vialina  



xrtn2 said:


> ^^
> 
> Spanish:colgate:


Looks more like the Dutch ones  











Zagor666 said:


> some old traffic lights from eastern germany,today still in use :cheers:


That's actually not true. What you see here is a brand new LED traffic light from Berlin. Since the eastern Berlin's 'ampelmann' has become iconic for the city of Berlin, they decided to make it Berlin's standard symbol for pedestrian lights. So it's not necessarily old


----------



## dsanto

BenjiMan said:


> ^^
> That's incorrect. You can't say what countries use which design. There are more designs to be seen in one country. For example the Netherlands. As far as I know there are at least 7 types of Traffic lights (Vialis Classic, Vialis Vialina, Groenpol, Siemens, Alustar, Futurit, Futura).
> 
> The only thing you can state is that each country uses it's own system. For example, using a black background shield or not (and which sort?), the type of arrows or pedestrian symbols, using the colour scheme of green-yellow-red-green or with red/yellow and then green, et cetera


Of course I mean symbols, not the manufacturer of traffic lights.



BenjiMan said:


> Besides, in your scheme you say Belgium. That's not correct. That one is the new Dutch design by Vialis: the Vialina
> 
> Looks more like the Dutch ones


My parents did this photo in Belgium:










So they are similar to Dutch.


----------



## BenjiMan

That's correct. The Belgians use/used the same sort of design, but different traffic light-models. They use Futurit and the Dutch hardly never do. Nowadays the Belgians start to let go of the black background shields so there goes another bit of Dutch resemblence  

And the picture you used for Belgium in your scheme was just incorrect. Just stating


----------



## dsanto

BenjiMan said:


> And the picture you used for Belgium in your scheme was just incorrect. Just stating


Thank you, my mistake


----------



## dsanto

Some traffic disturbing in Lithuania, by turning red with a table with green arrows:


----------



## Nexis

some from Newark,NJ

Downtown Newark,New Jersey by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr

Downtown Newark,New Jersey by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr

Military Park - Downtown Newark,New Jersey by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr

Downtown Newark,New Jersey by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr

The Ironbound - Newark,New Jersey by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


----------



## dsanto

How is it in your country - where are the traffic lights installed: before intersection, after intersection, above lanes?

In Lithuanian old intersections (till 2012) we had traffic lights before and after intersection (rarely above lanes):










In new intersections (since 2012) there are only traffic lights before intersection (in many cases both - on the side and above lanes):


----------



## Edil Arda

usually before, side and above.

http://harita.yandex.com.tr/?ll=29....7696~spn:72.79291456229655,30.052980881611486

http://harita.yandex.com.tr/?ll=29....1301~spn:92.04817290047563,40.059357879598586


----------



## queclasetipo123

*Some of the different types of traffic lights in Caracas, Venezuela*


----------



## dsanto

queclasetipo123 said:


> *Some of the different types of traffic lights in Caracas, Venezuela*


No dubbing after intersection?


----------



## queclasetipo123

^^Yes, there are dubbing in all the intersections


----------



## xrtn2

Brazil


----------



## MattiG

dsanto said:


> How is it in your country - where are the traffic lights installed: before intersection, after intersection, above lanes?


Finland: Before yes, after usually, above sometimes.

https://maps.google.fi/?ll=60.15257...IOyqi8RqSaAHKRPpON2lPw&cbp=13,170.93,,1,-4.16

This is the most typical setup at smaller intersections:

https://maps.google.fi/?ll=60.19719...UjVnrdKF2hYZg_rsxh64AQ&cbp=13,337.71,,0,-5.05

The first light is always the primary one. The remaining ones are repeaters for visibility. Small light are sometimes used instead of repeaters behind the intersection:

https://maps.google.fi/?ll=60.18144...Osm8zlPA9__XCEkynZOUig&cbp=13,174.65,,0,-0.91

In the rural areas, white collars are often in use to improve visibility:

https://maps.google.fi/?ll=60.37281...id=_QY9JAErhu05_sbrA5fKTA&cbp=13,35.8,,1,1.12

In a few spots in Helsinki, special traffic light for buses are in use. They are similar to the ones used at the railroad crossings, but they are turned only when a bus is approaching. In this place, there is a street reserved to the prioritized bus route 550:

https://maps.google.fi/?ll=60.22598...=c9OWsiVvWA_nMNUUANbEjA&cbp=13,205.84,,0,5.83


----------



## Autobahn-mann

In Italy, the traffic lights are placed before the intersection, and often above the lanes.

In the old highway code (1959-1992) was prescribed that the traffic lights were repeated after the intersections but it was very infrequent (I've seen this only in Rome and some other city)


----------



## KIWIKAAS

xrtn2 said:


> Brazil


Those are shockingly small.
Can you even see the arrows from more than 25m?

Otherwise pretty funky War of the Worldsish traffic lights


----------



## dsanto

Autobahn-mann said:


> In Italy, the traffic lights are placed before the intersection, and often above the lanes.
> 
> In the old highway code (1959-1992) was prescribed that the traffic lights were repeated after the intersections but it was very infrequent (I've seen this only in Rome and some other city)


What about these Italian intersections - are these traffic lights installed by old highway code?


----------



## pccvspw999

Dubbed/repeated traffic lights are not forbidden, nor compulsory.
The lights shown in the movie are simply old, according to the old traffic code. 20 years weren't enough to change them to the new rules. That's Italy!


----------



## dsanto

pccvspw999 said:


> Dubbed/repeated traffic lights are not forbidden, nor compulsory.
> The lights shown in the movie are simply old, according to the old traffic code. 20 years weren't enough to change them to the new rules. That's Italy!


 Ok... And one question about video: 0:10 and 1:30 is it allowed to turn left?? Must the drivers not wait until the left arrow goes on?


----------



## Edil Arda

regular traffic lights in İstanbul,




































http://www.isbak.com.tr/tr

And vision design: http://www.artlebedev.ru/everything/svetoforus/2/


----------



## pccvspw999

dsanto said:


> Ok... And one question about video: 0:10 and 1:30 is it allowed to turn left?? Must the drivers not wait until the left arrow goes on?


 They shouldn't turn left. I cannot see,the green arrow "left", but the alighted red light has sense only if one of the possible directions, in this case to the left, is interdicted. And also the special "turning left" lane, has sense if the maneuver is a separated phase. The right comfiguration of the signals requires two different lanterns: the first with the "straight and right" arrows, and one with the "left" arrow, having each separeted "red" lights. This would also allow the "flashing yellow" light, with meaning:"you may turn left, but giving way", if the situation allows it in case of low traffic. For instance: the lights You show on the posted picture (in Turin near "Porta Nuova" station) are also wrong, having for the different directions always the "full red" light ((shall be "red with arrows" like the third picture here above in Istanbult). But it' is not such a mess as there is no misunderstandment possible: "red" is always off, when "green arrows" are alighted.


----------



## Nexis

Yesterday in Manhattan


50th & Rockefeller Plaza by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


European Traffic Lights in Manhattan? by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


----------



## Nexis

Some more from Urban Jersey


Warren & 2nd Streets in Harrison,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Outbound Morris&Essex Train in Harrison,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Guyon Drive in Harrison,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Van Buren & Lafayette Street in The Ironbound,New Jersey by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Oliver & Adams Street in The Ironbound - Newark,New Jersey by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Walnut & Mc Whorter Streets in Newark,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Union Street in The Ironbound by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Mc Can & 3M Signals in Jersey City,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


----------



## dsanto

Some new traffic lights in Kaunas, Lithuania.











Special for the russian users:


----------



## dsanto

Some new traffic lights in Vilnius, Lithuania.


----------



## Nexis

Montclair


Bloomfield Ave in Downtown Montclair,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr

Glen Ridge 

Glen Ridge Ave


Glen Ridge Ave - Glen Ridge,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Glen Ridge Ave - Glen Ridge,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr

Glen Ridge & Ridgewood


Glen Ridge & Ridgewood Ave - Glen Ridge,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr

Bloomfield

Belleville & State Street


Belleville & State Street in Bloomfield,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr

Lackawanna Plaza and Glenwood ave


Old Traffic Light at Lackawanna Plaza and Glenwood avein Downtown Bloomfield,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Downtown Bloomfield,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


----------



## xrtn2

^^ I never have seen this kind of traffic light here 

brazil


----------



## Nexis

You mean hanging by wires? Those are rare in New Jersey , except for Beach towns and Construction sites.


----------



## Kanadzie

I love the "flashing beacon ahead" sign... as if the flashing lamp was not enough, there is a sign to alert you there is one, but what is a flashing beacon mean? nobody knows :lol:


----------



## Mirror's Edge

N.J. said:


> Overhead traffic signals are rare in Sweden though. I never seen them anywhere in Stockholmslän.


Not in Skåne, many old style still around and Malmö and some other towns are replacing theirs with CPH looking overhead across the intersection lights.
They are nice and silver too if my memory is correct, might shot some pics yall.


----------



## Nexis

a few more...

Bridge control


Delanco - Riverside Swing Bridge over Rancocas Creek by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr

Riverside,NJ


Watchcase Building in Riverside,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Scott Street in Riverside,NJ by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


----------



## Wimpie25

Recently, the plans to massively make the switch-over to LED-technology for traffic lights in the State of Flanders, has been switched from "actively" to "passively". Meaning that there will still be a switch-over but the traffic lights will be replaced only if they are part of a larger project (roadworks) an accident or some kind of malfunction.


----------



## Nexis

A few older traffic lights on Long Island


Fire Island Ave in Babylon,New York by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


Downtown Patchogue,New York by Nexis4Jersey09, on Flickr


----------



## dsanto

The are some new traffic rules in Russia from April 2015. Additional traffic light arrow that forbids to drive in direction, when arrow is off, even if the main light is green, now will have a red ring. This ring is also used in Belarussia and helps to notice that traffic light has an additional arrow:










Still I think the best way to inform the driver about driving direction are full traffic lights with three arows. Such traffic lights are used all over the world:


----------



## pccvspw999

To merge two different messages within the same frame is mostly controverse: it's not only the aspect but also the position which is giving the message. And this message must be easy to comprehend for someone moving quite fast.
I would have preferred a red light in the upper position which alights when the tram signal is open. Of course the three-light-signal is better.


----------



## Nexis

Long Island seems to like big Traffic Lights aswell..


Mineola Boulevard in Mineola,NY by Corey Best, on Flickr


Mineola Boulevard in Mineola,NY by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Pink Jazz

One thing that I find interesting is why the United States and most of Canada use orange and white pedestrian signals. The Federal Highway Administration claims that the choice of colors (rather than the seemingly more intuitive choice of red and green) is for they don't get confused with vehicular traffic signals (particularly for people with impaired vision).

If this is really the case, how come pretty much the rest of the world uses red and green pedestrian signals without any issue? Red and green seems to be much more intuitive.


----------



## MattiG

Nexis said:


> Long Island seems to like big Traffic Lights aswell..
> 
> 
> Mineola Boulevard in Mineola,NY by Corey Best, on Flickr


What do those two "extra" lamps stand for?


----------



## Nexis

MattiG said:


> What do those two "extra" lamps stand for?


There turning arrowing lamps....green arrow & yellow arrow..


----------



## earthJoker

Pink Jazz said:


> If this is really the case, how come pretty much the rest of the world uses red and green pedestrian signals without any issue? Red and green seems to be much more intuitive.


Well, at least in Europe we don't have traffic lights for cars on the opposite side of the junction. Therefore it is impossible to confuse the traffic lights for cars (on your side) with the traffic light for pedestrians (on the opposite side).


----------



## riiga

earthJoker said:


> Well, at least in Europe we don't have traffic lights for cars on the opposite side of the junction. Therefore it is impossible to confuse the traffic lights for cars (on your side) with the traffic light for pedestrians (on the opposite side).


The Nordic countries at least has traffic lights both near and far.

Still, pedestrian signals are almost always perpendicular to the traffic lights for vehicles, and they also lack the yellow light. So far I've never seen anyone mistake such lights for the regular ones.


----------



## pccvspw999

^^ Also in Italy the traffic light is repeated on the other side of the junction, not everywhere but commonly.
Of course if You place a TL You have to deal with the fact that it shall not be misunderstood. Accurancy in placing the lamps is compulsory. Therefore different screenshapes for pedestrians, trams, aso. have been developed, and maybe more are needed.


----------



## 54°26′S 3°24′E

pccvspw999 said:


> To merge two different messages within the same frame is mostly controverse: it's not only the aspect but also the position which is giving the message. And this message must be easy to comprehend for someone moving quite fast.
> I would have preferred a red light in the upper position which alights when the tram signal is open. Of course the three-light-signal is better.


Especially for the color blind.


----------



## MattiG

earthJoker said:


> Well, at least in Europe we don't have traffic lights for cars on the opposite side of the junction.


I would be very careful in posting statements like "we Europeans". There are several ways to setup the traffic lights, and putting repeater lights behind the intersection is not uncommon. As said, it is the default setup in the Nordic countries, for instance.


----------



## dsanto

earthJoker said:


> Well, at least in Europe we don't have traffic lights for cars on the opposite side of the junction. Therefore it is impossible to confuse the traffic lights for cars (on your side) with the traffic light for pedestrians (on the opposite side).


That's not true. Most of Western European countries don't have traffic lights for cars on the opposite side of the junction. But Nothern countries like Norway, Finland, Sweden (with some exceptions), Estonia (with some exceptions) have them. Most of ex-sowjet countries have traffic lights on the opposite side of the junction. 2012 Lithuania has changed laws and now there are no traffic lights on the opposite side in new junctions.

Before reconstruction:










After reconstruction:












riiga said:


> Still, pedestrian signals are almost always perpendicular to the traffic lights for vehicles, and they also lack the yellow light. So far I've never seen anyone mistake such lights for the regular ones.


Some countries, like Ireland, Italy have yellow light for pedestrians. In Lithuania because of old dumb law (1995-2012) some cities have installed three color traffic lights for pedestrians. My best photo from Vilnius:










Then these traffic lights were changed - black pedestrian silhouettes were installed.



















Since 2012 only two-color pedestrian traffic lights are installed:


----------



## dsanto

Some new traffic lights in Vilnius, Molėtų pl. - Skersinės g. intersection:


----------



## Svartmetall

Weird traffic lights in Tianjin (China) that I saw. They "count down" in the colour before changing to the next colour. Not sure how practical they are, and they completely HATE anyone who is colourblind, but they were "interesting" anyway.


----------



## Edil Arda

reminds me the vision designs for İstanbul: http://www.artlebedev.com/everything/isiklarius/


----------



## Nexis

Wire lights seem very common on Long Island..


Seacliff & Glen Cove Avenue in Seacliff,NY by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Pink Jazz

Nexis said:


> Wire lights seem very common on Long Island..
> 
> 
> Seacliff & Glen Cove Avenue in Seacliff,NY by Corey Best, on Flickr


They are quite common in the East Coast. Out west, they are typically only used for temporary installations.


----------



## DanielFigFoz

I really like the blue-arrow signs on top of lanes in Eastern Europe, they would come in handy here.


----------



## diablo234

Pink Jazz said:


> They are quite common in the East Coast. Out west, they are typically only used for temporary installations.


Using span guy wires and cables to hang traffic lights is also very common in the Southern US and some Midwestern states such as Ohio and Michigan.


----------



## Kanadzie

That "one lane, one traffic light" thing is a thing too in some places in US.

In the Greater Toronto Area I've seen the even stranger, two "left turn signal" traffic lights for a single left turn lane (weird as ****)


----------



## Gil

Kanadzie said:


> That "one lane, one traffic light" thing is a thing too in some places in US.
> 
> In the Greater Toronto Area I've seen the even stranger, two "left turn signal" traffic lights for a single left turn lane (weird as ****)


In that case isn't one together with the other lights and the other at the left side of the intersection mounted onto a pole at the corner? There doesn't seem to be any standardization as to the positioning of the left turn signal, hence placing it twice.


----------



## dsanto

New traffic lights in Kaunas, Lithuania. Are the constructions american style?


----------



## PovilD

dsanto said:


> New traffic lights in Kaunas, Lithuania. Are the constructions american style?


This I would call American style 










Klaipėda, Lithuania


----------



## Nexis

New Flashing No Turn on Red signs are being added to Traffic Lights in Downtown Stamford


Street Scenes in Downtown Stamford,CT by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Edil Arda

many traffic lights in this thread seems too old,
why don't they use LEDs?


----------



## Nexis

Edil Arda said:


> many traffic lights in this thread seems too old,
> why don't they use LEDs?


Some of them use different lens or filters over the LEDS


----------



## Kanadzie

flashing red lights on no turn on red sign?
The flashing red would imply a STOP condition so we could turn :lol:

LED traffic lights aren't very good... in Canada they have had problems as they accumulate snow, but don't make enough waste heat to melt it. The cost to send someone to clean the light is many times more than the energy savings...


----------



## MattiG

Kanadzie said:


> LED traffic lights aren't very good... in Canada they have had problems as they accumulate snow, but don't make enough waste heat to melt it. The cost to send someone to clean the light is many times more than the energy savings...


Just lack of innovation.

LED traffic lights do outperform the traditional ones in several dimensions: lifecycle, brightness, energy saving, and easiness to focus. In arctic conditions, a heating resistor grid can be put in front of the LED array for the winter, and the energy saving still is substantial.


----------



## pccvspw999

Please look at this four snapshots from Google SW, do You see something weird, something completely foolish?
First
Secondo
Third
Fourth

Look at the vehicles coming from the right.


----------



## MattiG

pccvspw999 said:


> Please look at this four snapshots from Google SW, do You see something weird, something completely foolish?
> First
> Secondo
> Third
> Fourth
> 
> Look at the vehicles coming from the right.


Italian drivers are following traffic rules and obeying traffic lights, and not making a chaos? Please tell us!


----------



## pccvspw999

^^ No, that's not the point. The point is what they are told to do: look at the van and the motorist in the first snapshot and were they are in the second. And then observe the dark Fiat "Panda" in the third, and were it is in the fourth.

Follow the direction taken by the google-car and look back.


----------



## MattiG

pccvspw999 said:


> ^^ No, that's not the point. The point is what they are told to do: look at the van and the motorist in the first snapshot and were they are in the second. And then observe the dark Fiat "Panda" in the third, and were it is in the fourth.
> 
> Follow the direction taken by the google-car and look back.


The Google Streetview imaginery is a composition of zillion images, and it is not always sorted in a chronological order. Especially in complex junctions, the camera car must make several passes in various directions, and the adjacent scenes at the crossing areas may be results from different passes.


----------



## pccvspw999

Not in this case, it's clearly the sequence of pictures the google car took going left.
The concern is this:
in the first frame you can see the google car waiting for "green" on the "turning left" lane. The motorist coming from the right is clearly standing still (foot on the floor). Through the door of "Farmacia Monticelli" in the corner, You may also recognize a white van.
In the second frame the google car is moving having his own light showing "green", but the motorist of the first frame is just over the intersection and the white van is even still in it. That means: a couple of seconds before their light was also "green", a "green" phase of just a couple of seconds and now "red" again? No!
The third frame, turning the view towards the road on the right, You can see a dark Panda approaching the holding line. Looking back You can see the Smart following the google car.
Now, in the fourth frame, You can see both cars, the Panda and the Smart, passing on the intersection.
The whole sequence is a matter of seconds away from the moment the motorist and the van were allowed to proceed, and the Panda also. In the meantime also the google car and the Smart got the same allowance. And this is the point: all vehicles were allowed with "green light" to cross the section, cars turning left and cars coming from the right going straight, with a clear risk of collision.
And it's not a malfunctioning traffic light, is an interpretation (misguided IMHO) of our road codex which apparently allows this situation: cars turning shall "give way" to those coming from the right even if they have a clear sing of "free way".
And it's not a single situation, not in Genoa, according to witnesses.
I never though this could be real! It's foolish, even criminal, but real.


----------



## Nexis

I don't think this legal , having a companies name instead of the Street name...


This can't be legal... by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Tachi

pccvspw999 said:


> Not in this case, it's clearly the sequence of pictures the google car took going left.
> The concern is this:
> in the first frame you can see the google car waiting for "green" on the "turning left" lane. The motorist coming from the right is clearly standing still (foot on the floor). Through the door of "Farmacia Monticelli" in the corner, You may also recognize a white van.
> In the second frame the google car is moving having his own light showing "green", but the motorist of the first frame is just over the intersection and the white van is even still in it. That means: a couple of seconds before their light was also "green", a "green" phase of just a couple of seconds and now "red" again? No!
> The third frame, turning the view towards the road on the right, You can see a dark Panda approaching the holding line. Looking back You can see the Smart following the google car.
> Now, in the fourth frame, You can see both cars, the Panda and the Smart, passing on the intersection.
> The whole sequence is a matter of seconds away from the moment the motorist and the van were allowed to proceed, and the Panda also. In the meantime also the google car and the Smart got the same allowance. And this is the point: all vehicles were allowed with "green light" to cross the section, cars turning left and cars coming from the right going straight, with a clear risk of collision.
> And it's not a malfunctioning traffic light, is an interpretation (misguided IMHO) of our road codex which apparently allows this situation: cars turning shall "give way" to those coming from the right even if they have a clear sing of "free way".
> And it's not a single situation, not in Genoa, according to witnesses.
> I never though this could be real! It's foolish, even criminal, but real.


And how do you know that one of them is not running through a red light?


----------



## pccvspw999

Tachi said:


> And how do you know that one of them is not running through a red light?


Eye witness ensured to me that it is so. And going through red light is not a common habit at this latitudes. I was also disconcerted, but observing the sequence many times, it's quite plausible that what has been told is real.


----------



## Nexis




----------



## Nexis

A ped crossing in Central Park..


A stroll through Uptown - Manhattan on the last day of 2015! by Corey Best, on Flickr


A stroll through Uptown - Manhattan on the last day of 2015! by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## buenosaireseze

Buenos Aires


----------



## Nexis




----------



## Nexis

Seems rather energy wasteful to use LED median signs like posted above in Bueno aires. Whats the reasoning behind it?


----------



## Nexis

Taken Yesterday 1.14.16 at the Lincoln Tunnel approach 


Midtown Manhattan on a Chilly Day in January by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## xrtn2

Brazil


----------



## Nexis

New & Broad Streets in Downtown Newark,NJ


New Street in Newark by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Nexis

Taken Yesterday in New Jersey 


This Traffic Light has seen better days.. by Corey Best, on Flickr


3M traffic light in Lincoln Harbor by Corey Best, on Flickr


Walking around Downtown Jersey City on a Cold Windy Afternoon by Corey Best, on Flickr


Broken Traffic Light... by Corey Best, on Flickr

In NYC..


A Mid Morning walk around the Booming neighborhood of Long Island City by Corey Best, on Flickr


Looking uptown from Chinatown by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Nexis

Flashing Yellow Arrow setup in Battery Park city


A early evening walk from Midtown to Downtown Manhattan by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## pccvspw999

^^ What does it mean? "Attention, pedestrian have right-of-way"?


----------



## Nexis

pccvspw999 said:


> ^^ What does it mean? "Attention, pedestrian have right-of-way"?


I believe so , although I think its abit much to have in Manhattan...


----------



## Nexis

Typical Suburban Traffic light


Chestnut Ridge Road & Tice Boulevard in Montvale,NJ by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Zagor666




----------



## Nexis




----------



## brewerfan386

Nexis said:


> I believe so , although I think its abit much to have in Manhattan...


It might allow right turns without stopping but forces cars to yield to cross traffic. Since right-on-red is illegal in NYC, 99% of the time.


----------



## Nexis

In Stamford,CT


Walking around the South End neighborhood of Stamford,Connecticut by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Nexis

Taken Yesterday - 3/9/16


An Early Morning Walk around Harrison,NJ by Corey Best, on Flickr


An Early Morning Walk around Downtown Newark - Halsey & William Streets by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Zagor666




----------



## Nexis

Some lights I took yesterday


An Early Evening stroll around Midtown Manhattan by Corey Best, on Flickr


Walking around Greenpoint - Brooklyn in the Mid Afternoon by Corey Best, on Flickr


Midtown Skyline taken from Greenpoint Ave by Corey Best, on Flickr


Greenpoint Avenue in Sunnyside by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Nexis

Taken on Wednesday - 4/6/16


Walking around Downtown Bloomfield in the Morning by Corey Best, on Flickr


Liberty Street in Bloomfield,NJ by Corey Best, on Flickr


Red arrow in Bloomfield,NJ by Corey Best, on Flickr


Walking around The Ironbound in the Early Evening Hours - Gotthart and New York Street by Corey Best, on Flickr


Walking around The Ironbound in the Early Evening Hours - Merchant , Ferry Wilson Street by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## piotr71

*[D][NL] Brüggen/Swalmen*

del


----------



## Nexis

*Full Interview: 'Red Light Robin Hood'*


----------



## Nexis

Taken Yesterday - 4/20/16

Various towns & cities in South Jersey


Mc can Signals on Thomas & South Broad Street by Corey Best, on Flickr


Lights & Tracks in Camden,NJ by Corey Best, on Flickr


A Noon Hour walk around Downtown Camden,New Jersey by Corey Best, on Flickr


Cambell's Soup HQ in Camden,New Jersey by Corey Best, on Flickr


An Early Evening Stroll around Downtown Burlington,NJ - High Street by Corey Best, on Flickr


An Early Evening Stroll around Burlington,NJ - East Broad Street by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## dsanto




----------



## Nexis

Standard Traffic light & Railroad Crossing here in NJ


Crossing & Lights by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Nexis

Some recent Traffic Light photos I took...


Walking around Downtown Jersey City in the Early Evening Hours by Corey Best, on Flickr


Walking around Downtown Jersey City in the Early Evening Hours by Corey Best, on Flickr


Walking around Downtown Jersey City in the Early Evening Hours by Corey Best, on Flickr


A weekend Walk around Lower Manhattan,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


Taking an afternoon Stroll around Tribeca in Lower Manhattan,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


A weekend Walk around Lower Manhattan,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


A weekend Walk around Lower Manhattan,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


A weekend Walk around Lower Manhattan,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


Taking an afternoon Stroll around Greenwich Village in Lower Manhattan,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## GrahamClayton

The traffic lights at the intersection of Liverpool Road (the Hume Highway), Woodville Road and Henry Lawson Drive at Lansdowne in Sydney has been known for many years as the "Meccano Set":


----------



## Nexis

Some Traffic lights I took on Long Island on Monday


Hybrid lights by Corey Best, on Flickr


Taking an Afternoon Walk around Downtown Rockville Centre,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


A Mid Morning Walk around Downtown Lynbrook,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## dsanto

Nexis said:


> Some Traffic lights I took on Long Island on Monday
> 
> https://flic.kr/p/GBTAQQ
> Hybrid lights by Corey Best, on Flickr
> 
> https://flic.kr/p/G7Cxce
> Taking an Afternoon Walk around Downtown Rockville Centre,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr
> 
> https://flic.kr/p/G7CxCz
> A Mid Morning Walk around Downtown Lynbrook,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


 Your pictures are great! Could you also make videos with traffic lights working? Especially traffic lights with arrows, also yellow flashing arrows, pedestrian traffic lights and so on.


----------



## [atomic]

Nexis said:


> Some Traffic lights I took on Long Island on Monday
> 
> 
> A Mid Morning Walk around Downtown Lynbrook,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


Interesting to see that the green light is the big one, usually if one light is larger it is the red. What could be the reason for that?


----------



## Nexis

dsanto said:


> Your pictures are great! Could you also make videos with traffic lights working? Especially traffic lights with arrows, also yellow flashing arrows, pedestrian traffic lights and so on.


I'll try to make some videos of that later this summer...


----------



## Nexis

[atomic] said:


> Interesting to see that the green light is the big one, usually if one light is larger it is the red. What could be the reason for that?



Increased visibility , usually with bigger lense setups like this have a bigger red light then a green light...


----------



## Nexis

Recent Update from wtby4000 over on City Data 



> New HAWK Pedestrian crossing on Washington Boulevard across from Mill River Park in Downtown Stamford


----------



## Nexis

Central Park Pedestrian light


A Morning Stroll around Upper Manhattan,New York by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Nexis

*Arrow trafic light(tokyo japan)*


----------



## Blackraven

Nexis said:


> *Arrow trafic light(tokyo japan)*


Question:
There is an "Upper Left" and a "Lower Left"?

Or do both of these just mean = "Left Turn is Green"

Any Japanese people care to explain because I'm a bit confused....


----------



## Nexis

Court Street Bridge Control light


Court Street Bridge traffic light by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## Nexis

Some photos of lights ive taken recently 


33rd & Lincoln Tunnel approach by Corey Best, on Flickr


Station Pl & Washington Boulevard - Stamford by Corey Best, on Flickr


Walking around Downtown New Haven in the Afternoon... by Corey Best, on Flickr


3M lights... by Corey Best, on Flickr


Left or Right? by Corey Best, on Flickr


----------



## dsanto

On 1st November Lithuania became the first former USSR state that has refused the Road Traffic Rule, which prohibited to turn in the direction of additional arrow when it is off, even if the main traffic light is green. 

It is now allowed to turn right when the main traffic light is green (no arrows) and the additional section is off, giving the way to pedestrians and cyclists. 






In old in intersections old traffic lights will still have black arrows. So if the main green (with arrows) is on and additional arrow off, you must still wait for additional green arrow to turn in the direction of this arrow.






Of course these old intersections will be reconstructed in the future and get three colors traffic lights for turning:


----------



## Kpc21

So was it previously forbidden to turn right on green when the green arrow (an additional one, not being a part of a separate set of lights together with red and amber arrows) was off, with just a normal, full general green light? Very weird.

I think in most countries in Europe that use this extra "right turn on red allowed" signal, it is never used with the green light (unless it's a permanent plate and not a separate signal as e.g. in Germany), the green light (without any arrows on it) in general permits to drive in any direction.

In the US, the approach is opposite – in many states, in general it's allowed to turn right on red, and if it isn't, there is an additional plate that says that. But still, if there is no such plate, you can turn right on both green and red.

If the designer wants the main signal not to allow to turn right, then he must use directional lights, like the S-3 one here:









http://www.januszs-prawojazdy.pl/public/userfiles/image/rodzajesygnalizatorw.jpg

Not the one in the middle or on the left. And to allow to turn right in some circumstances, another S-3 signal must be used, with a right arrow.


Although to me, those green additional arrows seem confusing. Not for me (as I was seeing them almost since I was born, so I know their meaning well) – but for e.g. people from other countries where they aren't used. The logic suggests that when you have a green light, you can simply drive, according to the arrow on the signal, maybe only giving way to pedestrians on the road from which you are turning. And in this case it's not true – you are still obliged to give way to pedestrians and cars on the road into which you are turning. In Poland you are even still obliged to stop the car before the intersection (like with the STOP sign), although absolutely nobody actually follows this law.

They should be yellow blinking. Then it would have logic.


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## dsanto

Before the 1 st of November the traffic lights with additional arrows in Lithuania should have the black arrows in the main green section. And also the traffic rules forbidded to turn, if the additional arrow was off.

I know, that it is not safe to turn right in Poland when the main light is red and the arrow is green (I was in Poland several times  ). In Lithuania when arrow is on, the pedestrians and cyclists have red. You must only give the way for U-turners from the right (see in the end):






In Lithuania we also use a combination "main green + green arrow" if no pedestrians are on the right, as you see in the video above.


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## Kpc21

So the meaning of the additional green arrow in Lithuania is as if it was a full set of right-turn signals (red+amber+green), isn't it?

And you don't have the usual conditional "right turn on red" rule (like in Poland and Germany when there is a green arrow or in some US states when there is no sign prohibiting it), right?

What if you had a general (not arrow-shaped) green and a green arrow next to it? Such a combination just didn't/doesn't exist in Lithuania?


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## dsanto

Until 2012 additional green arrows were used instead of three color traffic lights. When green is off, that means red in that direction, even if the main light is green (but with black arrows). We have those traffic lights still, but they are step by step reconstructed.






Since 2012 three colors traffic lights with arrows are used.






And since this November we use additional green arrow like you in Poland. When arrow is off and main green is on, you can go in all directions:






Only the meaning of green arrow is different from polish. Main green + green arrow means 100 % safety:






Main red + green arrow in Poland means that you must give way to all road users. In Lithuania it means that pedestrians and cyclists have red. Only you must give way to u-turners from the right:


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## dsanto

We have also a plate with green arrow. But because of danger to other road users they will be eliminated until 1st January 2020. Some unsafe situations:


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## Kpc21

Your old Lithuanian solution was perfectly logical and I believe you changed it just because of a totally illogical solution that we have in Poland (and some other countries have it too)... 

In my opinion it SHOULD be so that a green arrow means, as you wrote, 100% safety.

Someone should think of that and unify the traffic lights across all Europe (of course, to the extent to which it's necessary to avoid such confusions), same as it is with the road signs.

For me, those plates with green arrow aren't dangerous, it's just drivers who don't know how to use them... At least from what I see in your video.

For me it's obvious that (with the Polish green light arrow, which means the same as your plate) firstly, I give way to the pedestrians crossing my road, then I give way to the cars on the road into which I want to turn, and only after that, I make a turn.

Maybe those plates aren't so popular in Lithuania and this is why your drivers have problems with them. It's the same as with the "equal priority intersections":










Of course, the same rules as with this sign apply if there are no signs at the intersection.

It often happens that the drivers on the road that looks more important feel that they have priority and others should give way to them.

And when there are trials of actually introducing this type of intersections on local, residential streets, where previously there were "give way" signs, to calm down the traffic, it often leads to total confusion. Just because they are so rare that the drivers are not used to them.


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## dsanto

You are right. Plates are not dangerous. But who drive? Plates don't drive. Drivers drive. So in generally these plates are unsafe. We have these plates since 1995. Some years ago they were almost in all intersections. And still today some drivers cause danger for other road users, especially for pedestrians. 

From the 1st January 2020 we will have only additional green light arrows or three color traffic lights with arrows in Lithuania. These arrows are safe. When they are on, it is safe to turn.


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## Kanadzie

^^ but now you waste time and pollution since you can't always turn right 
That the plate caused danger is unusual since elsewhere (e.g. USA example) it is really rather safe. Maybe some kind of education could apply, or just a ban of this turn at certain problematic intersections?


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## dsanto

It is another problem that the plates were installed almost in all inertsections. Road / street owners used plates instead of another solutions. And only now when the countdown goes, road / street owners begin to use other ways to increase turning right capacity. Triangle islands, three colors traffic lights, additional green light arrows are used.

I think if these plates were not used in big intersections and only used in some smaller quieter intersections, there were no such big problems as we now have.


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## Kpc21

But three-color traffic lights decrease the capacity even more as they require additional phases in the program. Actually, the only-right-turn three-color traffic light (in the right-hand traffic) does absolutely nothing, in comparison with just generic traffic lights without any arrow. Maybe except for increasing the safety of the pedestrians (if no generic traffic lights are used at all but all other directions also have directional traffic lights), but then they have to wait for green ridiculously long and they become likely to break the law and enter the intersection on red. So it's not so obvious if they really become safer.

A situation when it might seem to be useful if there is heavy pedestrian traffic on the zebra one has to cross while turning right, but then the solution is just making the light for the pedestrian red for a part of the green phase for cars.

Triangle islands also don't improve anything because on the right-turn lane they separate out you are still required to install traffic lights, same as on all other entries of the intersection. And they can't be used in narrow downtown streets just because of the lack of space.


The green plates instead of lights might be dangerous in one case. When the drivers form the opposite have a directional left-turn (three-color) signal. Then they know they are guaranteed that all the directions of traffic they cross will have red, which interferes with the green plate. In such cases, the plate just has to be replaced with a light, which in those phases goes off. In Poland we don't have plates but lights – and indeed in those phases they are always off.


You should just educate the drivers instead of removing the plates.


By the way... to people from countries where there are right-turn-on-red plates, lights (not like those in Lithuania but like those in Poland, so that you are allowed to turn right but on condition that you give way to the drivers and pedestrians on the road across) or where it's always allowed by the local law unless there are signs that forbid that... Are you also, like in Poland, formally obliged to stop before the intersection (and only then start driving – like with the STOP sign), even if there are no pedestrians and cars at all, and you can easily verify that even while driving?

In Poland we have such a rule, but absolutely nobody follows this law, maybe except for the driving school learners and those just taking the driving license exam.


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## Penn's Woods

Kpc21 said:


> But three-color traffic lights decrease the capacity even more as they require additional phases in the program. Actually, the only-right-turn three-color traffic light (in the right-hand traffic) does absolutely nothing, in comparison with just generic traffic lights without any arrow. Maybe except for increasing the safety of the pedestrians (if no generic traffic lights are used at all but all other directions also have directional traffic lights), but then they have to wait for green ridiculously long and they become likely to break the law and enter the intersection on red. So it's not so obvious if they really become safer.
> 
> A situation when it might seem to be useful if there is heavy pedestrian traffic on the zebra one has to cross while turning right, but then the solution is just making the light for the pedestrian red for a part of the green phase for cars.
> 
> Triangle islands also don't improve anything because on the right-turn lane they separate out you are still required to install traffic lights, same as on all other entries of the intersection. And they can't be used in narrow downtown streets just because of the lack of space.
> 
> 
> The green plates instead of lights might be dangerous in one case. When the drivers form the opposite have a directional left-turn (three-color) signal. Then they know they are guaranteed that all the directions of traffic they cross will have red, which interferes with the green plate. In such cases, the plate just has to be replaced with a light, which in those phases goes off. In Poland we don't have plates but lights – and indeed in those phases they are always off.
> 
> 
> You should just educate the drivers instead of removing the plates.
> 
> 
> By the way... to people from countries where there are right-turn-on-red plates, lights (not like those in Lithuania but like those in Poland, so that you are allowed to turn right but on condition that you give way to the drivers and pedestrians on the road across) or where it's always allowed by the local law unless there are signs that forbid that... Are you also, like in Poland, formally obliged to stop before the intersection (and only then start driving – like with the STOP sign), even if there are no pedestrians and cars at all, and you can easily verify that even while driving?
> 
> In Poland we have such a rule, but absolutely nobody follows this law, maybe except for the driving school learners and those just taking the driving license exam.




A right on red in the U.S. is legal after you’ve come to a complete stop. Whereas a green arrow traffic light means go ahead (but yield to any pedestrians). By the way, some U.S. jurisdictions permit LEFT on red when the streets involved are one-ways.


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## Kpc21

In Poland we also have green left arrow light analogous to the right arrow mentioned in the previous posts – but it's used very rarely (and... not only at intersections of one-way streets).


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