# NETHERLANDS - Stadium and Arena Development News



## magicks (May 6, 2005)

i don´t know a dutch stadium which is better than Westfalenstadion,AOL-Arena,Allianz-Arena and Schalke Arena.They are all better than the dutch top 3.


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## carfentanyl (May 14, 2003)

^ That wasn't the issue here, and besides our view on what a great stadium is differs a lot. 

I personally think De Kuip is better than or at least equal to those three, because 

A. It's football history since 1937
B. It's not an arena with a retractable roof
C. The view on the pitch is excellent from any position
D. It has great acoustics
E. It's situated right in the city and not in some lonely suburb
F. It's a real football stadium
G. Even more reasons

Sure Allianz is large and spectacular, but so grey from the inside, and I don't care much for the outside too. It doesn't look like a stadium. Then I do like Bernabeu or San Siro a lot better. Arena auf Schalke is a less spectacular copy of the Amsterdam Arena. Westfalen, still, in my opinion ugly from the inside, plain from the outside. Nothing special, except size. I have to admit that I really do like the AOL Arena. That one comes close, it only misses the history.

The UEFA probably share my opinion in a way, considering De Kuip has hosted the most UEFA finals in history. They had a total of 10. Last one being 2002 in which Feyenoord beat Dortmund!


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## Turbosnail (Dec 8, 2004)

Amsterdam Arena is a top class stadium - it's always the stadium I think of when people mention covered stadia. Rotterdam and Eindhoven look OK although more pics would be good. The rest are probably a bit too small capacity wise to get too excited about - although, I know in England some of the 15,000 - 25,000 stadia generate some madly passionate atmospheres (underdog mentality!!)

Soufian - will you shut up about Morrocco.


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## carfentanyl (May 14, 2003)

^ The Amsterdam Arena was the first in Europe to have a retractable roof like that. personally I don't like retractable roofs, and even a lot of Ajax-supporters seem to dislike their own stadium. Still, the structure itsself is nicely done, I just don't like it as a stadium.



















After Feyenoord's stadium De Kuip, I like the PSV stadium second best in the Netherlands:


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## FrankWhite (Apr 12, 2005)

i really like the architecture of the Amsterdam Arena.

Has de Kuip always looked like it does now; or has it been modernized during the last years?


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## carfentanyl (May 14, 2003)

In '94 they built skyboxes and business seats () Also a roof was built. It became an all-seater and all the existing seats were replaced by new blue plastic ones. They removed a lot of gates and fences. Some fences were replaced by plexiglass ones. They build a concrete moat around the pitch, and they made stands behind the goals underneath the first tier.

From '37 to '94 it looked like this:










Now like this:



















I kinda like the big fences with all the banners attached to 'm. I was 17 when they rebuilt the stadium, but I can still remember well the sound of barking police dogs and the smell of marihuana, urine and sausages. Now the smell of marihuana is only left. Ohhh... sweet nostalgia...


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## Morten M (Apr 17, 2004)

carfentanyl said:


> I kinda like the big fences with all the banners attached to 'm. I was 17 when they rebuilt the stadium, but I can still remember well the sound of barking police dogs and the smell of marihuana, urine and sausages. Now the smell of marihuana is only left. Ohhh... sweet nostalgia...


What happened to the sausages?


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## carfentanyl (May 14, 2003)

^ They replaced all the stands for one big caterer some years ago, the evil Ron Koebrugge! Well, since recently they sell 'Broodje Unox' which brought back the sausage into the stadium. But the stricter regulations didn't make the smell come back.

Such a shame...


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## Nemo (Jul 5, 2004)

*AMSTERDAM ARENA*























































Stpid people.....to compare this stadium with Allianz Arena. This is a very decent stadium!










*De Kuip, Rotterdam*





































*PHILIPS Stadion, Eindhoven*


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## Gerald182 (Oct 4, 2005)

*Holland's Best Future Stadiums*

Update for the newest (soccer)stadiums in Holland. 
*
AZ Alkmaar Stadium*

Will open in the soccer season 2006/2007. Looks a bit like like the stadium of Feijenoord, but then smaller. Cappacity: 13.500 visitors.

(Bron: www.zwarts.jansma.nl)




























Photo of the building rightnow. (Bron: www.azfanpage.nl)










*ADO Den Haag Stadium * 

Capabel of inviting 15.000 visitors.




























*SC Heerenveen Stadium - Abe Lenstra stadium* 

SC Heerenveen is extending their stadium for 14.400 visitors to 26.000 visitors. There will also be a new indoor sports arena and sportschool.

The old situation:










The future situation: (Bron: www.alynia-architecten.nl)



















*FC Groningen Stadium - Euroborg*

New stadium with the capacity of 20.000 visitors. Is finished last week.

The plan:



















The stadium rightnow:


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## Perth4life3 (Nov 14, 2004)

wow there tiny.


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## reyrey (Jul 28, 2005)

a bit like your ****, so your mother says


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## reyrey (Jul 28, 2005)

they build the stadiums to meet the demand, and for their size, i think they are not too bad.


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## Perth4life3 (Nov 14, 2004)

reyrey said:


> a bit like your ****, so your mother says


its not what your mum says


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## Djurbus (Nov 19, 2004)

Nice overview Gerald182! I especially like the new stadium of FC Groningen, it will have a real English flavour with the stands real close to the pitch. Also the future stadium of SC Heerenveen will be impressive, not only because of the looks, but also because of the fact that every match will be sold out, which means 26.000 visitors, and the city of Heerenveen has only 30.000 inhabitants!


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## Gui (Aug 3, 2005)

Wow, dutch stadiums are simply perfect : no megalomania, just the right capacity and always closed arenas which gives the impression that the stadium is bigger than it is actually. I wish french soccer teams (in medium-sized cities like Auxerre or in big second division and third division clubs) had the same venues !....I mean, the AZ Alkmaar Stadium is simply amazing considering the small capacity. Cities like Pau, Clermont-Ferrand, Rouen (which is now in 4th division but which really could tend to 2nd or first div.) and even Le Havre, Auxerre, Bastia, Ajaccio, Le Mans etc. deserve stadiums like these. Some of our L1 clubs have medium sized stadiums with one or two huge stands. It's the case in Metz for example and the result is : windy, cold, boring architecture...


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Not Sochaux, though, or Nancy, they very much remind me of Dutch stadiums.

And don't be too hard on French venues - Nantes, Bordeaux, PSG and Monaco are some of my very favourite grounds and instantly recognisable.


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## PotatoGuy (May 10, 2005)

i like the ceiling of that 1st stadium, red is an awkward choice, but thats good cuz its brave


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## rakesh (Aug 31, 2005)

I love Holland. They are my fav football team. I am so glad Marco Van Basten is coaching the national team


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## Gerald182 (Oct 4, 2005)

Djurbus said:


> Nice overview Gerald182! I especially like the new stadium of FC Groningen, it will have a real English flavour with the stands real close to the pitch. Also the future stadium of SC Heerenveen will be impressive, not only because of the looks, but also because of the fact that every match will be sold out, which means 26.000 visitors, and the city of Heerenveen has only 30.000 inhabitants!


Thank you, Djurbus!
The Euroborg stadium is also one of my favorites, the crowd is almost on the field. More pictures of the stadium of Heerenveen are coming tommorow, because i'm going to take a look there.


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## CborG (Dec 2, 2003)

Thank you for your overview Gerald! Maybe it is also nice to mention here that there are plans to extend the capacity of the 'Kuip', home of Feyenoord, upto 72.000 seats.

Check this link: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=5277971&postcount=3


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## Kampflamm (Dec 28, 2003)

Extend or build a new venue? Judging by the pics, it's going to be the latter.


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## Gerald182 (Oct 4, 2005)

*Update: Holland's Best Future Stadiums*

*Here are some pictures of the Abe Lenstra Stadium in Heerenveen rightnow:*

               

*And the next pictures are from The Galgenwaard in Utrecht. This stadium was improved last year.*

        

*I think the stadium of Utrecht is one of the most beautiful stadiums in Europe, in it's class. 
Does anyone have more pictures of new stadiums of construction pictures in Holland?*

I took al these pictures today.


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## Djurbus (Nov 19, 2004)

Absolutely stunning pictures Gerald182! I've been once in the FC Utrecht stadium when it was not finished, but I have to return real soon because it looks amazing now! Also the SC Heerenveen stadium becomes really impressive, and I think the Dutch clubs are doing well to expand en rebuild their stadiums because it generates more money so the Dutch league will be even more attractive. Gerald182, maybe you can go to the nearly completed FC Groningen stadium soon, or to the AZ Alkmaar stadium which is under construction? Would be nice because these pics are absolutely great!


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

Admit it. Don't you all like the Dutch stadiums because of our realism? We have some kind of philosophy about stadiums, which is really simple. Why build an 70.000 seats stadium if you only sell it out for one game per season? (Juventus)So that's why they're quite small. I'll give you a top ten in size. Enjoy!

*1. Amsterdam Arena, Amsterdam*
51 859 seats



























*2. De Kuip, Rotterdam*
51 137 seats



























*3. Philipsstadion, Eindhoven*
35 119 seats



























*4. DSB-stadion, Alkmaar*
30 000 seats
This one's a little hard to explain. AZ Alkmaar is currently building their new stadium, but it has 17 000 seats. The demand is huge; the new season the stadium's entirely sold out at season tickets. The big boss of AZ said that they would build a second tier (30 000 seats ) if the waiting list contained 3000 people, which was reached today. So at the pics, imagine the second tier, which will be ready a season later, summer 2007. 



















*5. Gelredome, Arnhem*
26 600 seats



























*6. Abe Lenstra Stadion, Heerenveen*
currently 21 600 seats, being expanded from 14 000 to 28 000



























*7. Nieuw Galgenwaard, Utrecht*
24 426 seats


























*8. Euroborg Stadion, Groningen*
20 000 seats


























*9. Parkstad Limburg, Kerkrade*
19 200 seats


























*10. MyCom Stadion, Breda*
17 064 seats


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## Lostboy (Sep 14, 2002)

Realism is nice, but it its better if that reality is rather more impressive than it is in the Netherlands.


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## 2zanzibar (Dec 13, 2005)

WOW! the Ajax stadium looks like a giant casino boat floating down river!

its incredible when you consider just how strong PSV are at the moment with a moderate stadium in a small city. Infact, its remarkable just how strong the Dutch football is, Hats off!


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## th0m (Oct 14, 2004)

Martuh said:


> *4. DSB-stadion, Alkmaar*
> 30 000 seats
> This one's a little hard to explain. AZ Alkmaar is currently building their new stadium, but it has 17 000 seats. The demand is huge; the new season the stadium's entirely sold out at season tickets. The big boss of AZ said that they would build a second tier (30 000 seats ) if the waiting list contained 3000 people, which was reached today. So at the pics, imagine the second tier, which will be ready a season later, summer 2007.


That is great news! Are there any renders as to how it would look with the 2nd tier?


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Realism is nice, but then there's the likes of Twente who've been packed out for ages. Just think of the revenue they've missed out on if they had made it a bit bigger.


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## BobDaBuilder (Jun 7, 2005)

The best stadiums in Europe by far.


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

CorliCorso said:


> Realism is nice, but then there's the likes of Twente who've been packed out for ages. Just think of the revenue they've missed out on if they had made it a bit bigger.


Twente's going to build a second tier in about two years:

Currently: 13 500 seats









Going to be: 27 000 seats











th0m said:


> That is great news! Are there any renders as to how it would look with the 2nd tier?


Nope, not yet.



2zanzibar said:


> WOW! the Ajax stadium looks like a giant casino boat floating down river!
> 
> its incredible when you consider just how strong PSV are at the moment with a moderate stadium in a small city. Infact, its remarkable just how strong the Dutch football is, Hats off!


Yep, but PSV's making huge debts because of their stadium.


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## 2zanzibar (Dec 13, 2005)

BobDaBuilder said:


> The best stadiums in Europe by far.


now steady on ol' chum


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## cianobuckley (Nov 28, 2005)

Surely PSV have the support to fill a third 50 thousand seater? They must be selling out every game at the moment


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## bubomb (Aug 20, 2004)

Dutch stadiums are very, very modern, as is the Netherlands in general. Superb stadiums for a small country. I love Utrechts stadium.


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## bubomb (Aug 20, 2004)

The Amsterdam Arena is massive from the outside as the pitch level is actually above the base level of the stadium. At ground level is a huge car park. I go to Amsterdam twice a year and always take in an Ajax game. Great club. Very modern stadium with amazing facilities. Quite far out from the centre of Amsterdam, but transport is good and you cannot get a better city to relax in during the summer. Everybody, like the Germans, speaks perfect English.


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## Evoluon (Oct 25, 2005)

cianobuckley said:


> Surely PSV have the support to fill a third 50 thousand seater? They must be selling out every game at the moment


We do sell out every game, actually. But as the stadium has been expanded gradually over the last 15 years, this is the biggest capacity we've ever had. 36.000 is just fine at the moment, imo. The club are on a high right now, and while PSV fans have always been very loyal, we'll have to see what happens when results start to worsen.

And besides, PSV are still paying off the current stadium. The current loan turns out to be quite a burden on the club. Perhaps in another 10 to 15 years time, we can start to think again about an expansion, if necessary.


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## Xander (Mar 2, 2005)

De Kuip is starting to look a bit dated really.


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

Xander said:


> De Kuip is starting to look a bit dated really.


It certainly is. There are some starting plans for a 70 000 seater, but it's the question whether they'll fill it or not, With their 50 000 seater they only get 35 000 - 40 000 visitors per game.



Kwakzalver said:


> We do sell out every game, actually. But as the stadium has been expanded gradually over the last 15 years, this is the biggest capacity we've ever had. 36.000 is just fine at the moment, imo. The club are on a high right now, and while PSV fans have always been very loyal, we'll have to see what happens when results start to worsen.
> 
> And besides, PSV are still paying off the current stadium. The current loan turns out to be quite a burden on the club. Perhaps in another 10 to 15 years time, we can start to think again about an expansion, if necessary.


Agreed, but it's very easy for PSV to expand, the upper corners are left empty.










But they already expanded from 30 000 to 35 000 a couple of years ago didn't they?

But since the costs for the stadium are way too high, why not filling up the corners so they can get the extra money?


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Martuh said:


> Twente's going to build a second tier in about two years:
> 
> Currently: 13 500 seats
> 
> ...


I knew they had plans to add a second tier but I didn't know there is a firm timescale now, so thanks for that. Shame it's still not going to be for a couple of years.


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## Evoluon (Oct 25, 2005)

Double Post


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

OOOOOhhhh BETTY said:


> Why oh Why do the Europeans on the forum ALWAYS exaggerate their stadium capacities???
> 
> Alkmaar are NOT building a 30000 stadium, it will be 16000. Here are the true capacities of the Dutch Stadiums -
> 
> ...


*sigh* why is reading so hard? I explained the AZ 17.000->30.000 thing on the first page.

N.E.C. has revealed plans to expand this week in a Dutch football magazine called Voetbal International.

Sorry I was wrong at Heerenveen, it's going to be 27.000.

PSV Stadion is 36.500 = 37.000 wounded up.

Utrecht = 24.000 wounded up.

Enschede = starting to build in the summerstop and next season.

Rotterdam = 51.000 wounded up.

Amsterdam = 52.000 wounded up.

So the only difference is I wind up to 1000-numbers and was 1,000 wrong at Heerenveen. I am right at all the others.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Arnhem is a little bit complicated. When it was finished it had a capacity of 26.600. However, they made sure additional seating could be installed in front of 3 of the 4 stands (they can't install additional seating in front of one end because that's where the pitch enters and leaves the stadium). It can hold almost 30.000 (29.600 to be precise) this way. During Euro 2000 and few years after it the stadium used this configuration.

Because there is no need for a 30.000 seater in Arnhem they have removed some the seating again (well, they covered them under some kind of fabric) . The picture Martuh posted seems to be the 30.000 seater configuration, I guess its current capacity will be around 26.600. Removing the fabric will do to increase its capacity to almost 30.000 again.


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## CityLife (Aug 21, 2002)

What is the Hagues capacity going to be?


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

CityLife said:


> What is the Hagues capacity going to be?


15.050 (apparently easily expandable to 27.000)


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## OOOOOhhhh BETTY (Apr 10, 2006)

Martuh said:


> *sigh* why is reading so hard? I explained the AZ 17.000->30.000 thing on the first page.
> 
> N.E.C. has revealed plans to expand this week in a Dutch football magazine called Voetbal International.
> 
> ...


AZ are building a 16000 stadium. End of story. If they upgrade it to 30000 in the future, then the time to discuss this is in......the future. 

PSV holds 35119

If split in the middle, you wind up or down to the nearest even number, that's the golden rules of maths. So if PSV was 36500, the you would wind down to 36000. If it was 37500, you would wind up to 38000.


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

OOOOOhhhh BETTY said:


> AZ are building a 16000 stadium. End of story. If they upgrade it to 30000 in the future, then the time to discuss this is in......the future.
> 
> PSV holds 35119
> 
> If split in the middle, you wind up or down to the nearest even number, that's the golden rules of maths. So if PSV was 36500, the you would wind down to 36000. If it was 37500, you would wind up to 38000.


If you're really such an idiot then I'll quote myself. 



> This one's a little hard to explain. AZ Alkmaar is currently building their new stadium, but it has 17 000 seats. The demand is huge; the new season the stadium's entirely sold out at season tickets. The big boss of AZ said that they would build a second tier (30 000 seats ) if the waiting list contained 3000 people, which was reached today. So at the pics, imagine the second tier, which will be ready a season later, summer 2007.


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## OOOOOhhhh BETTY (Apr 10, 2006)

AZ Alkmaar are building a 16000 stadium. When and if they start to expand it.....I will let you know!


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

OOOOOhhhh BETTY said:


> Alkmaar may be extended in the future, but that applies to almost any stadium. At the moment, it is being built for 16000 seats.
> 
> Gelredome holds 26600 for soccer matches.
> 
> ...


You should really pay a visit to some Dutch websites where it is all mentioned.



> Capaciteit?
> 
> Veel supporters vragen zich nu af wat de capaciteit van het stadion gaat worden. Immers, er verschijnen allemaal verschillende getallen in de media, van 13.500 tot 26.000. De waarheid ligt zoals altijd in het midden, alhoewel dit niet geheel correct is. Het bestuur en de directie van AZ onderzoeken momenteel de mogelijkheden om een uitbreiding te realiseren *van 13.500 naar* ongeveer *17.500* plaatsen. Hiervoor moeten verscheidene procedures worden doorlopen en die onderzoeken zijn momenteel in volle gang, maar uitsluitsel is er nog geenszins.


www.az.nl



> Voor Euro-2000 was het nodig dat het aantal zitplaatsen werd uitgebreid. Het totale aantal plaatsen is daarvoor tot 30.000 plaatsen verhoogd, inclusief de loges en de seats. Het werkelijke aantal is 27.300 zitplaatsen en met de loges en de seats is het totaal *29.500* plaatsen. Voor invaliden met rolstoelen zijn ook nog eens *100* plaatsen beschikbaar.


www.gelredome.nl


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

By the way Martuh, where have you read that De Goffert will get those 26.000 seats? It doesn't say in last week's VI, does it?


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## OOOOOhhhh BETTY (Apr 10, 2006)

I don't care what some clog wearing Dutchman says!! Alkmaars stadium will NOT be 30000, it will open with roughly a 16000 capacity. It may or may not be expanded in the future, but this is irrelevant, as any stadium may or may not be expanded in the future. 2nd of all, your links show that Gelredrome is NOT 30000. It is way off 30000. It may have been 30000 in the past (Euro 2000), but it no longer is.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

I see Bubomb is back (which is strange cause he still has several nicks which haven't been banned yet)


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## Balleke (Sep 11, 2002)

our pride

Philips stadium - Eindhoven UEFA cup final 2006 will be hosted here


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

OOOOOhhhh BETTY said:


> I don't care what some clog wearing Dutchman says!! Alkmaars stadium will NOT be 30000, it will open with roughly a 16000 capacity. It may or may not be expanded in the future, but this is irrelevant, as any stadium may or may not be expanded in the future. 2nd of all, your links show that Gelredrome is NOT 30000. It is way off 30000. It may have been 30000 in the past (Euro 2000), but it no longer is.


I'm afraid you lost it pal..


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> I'm afraid you lost it pal..


Agreed at this.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Where does it actually say De Goffert shall be expanded to some 26.000 seats. I believe nothing is said about it in the latest VI.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Where does it actually say De Goffert will probably be expanded to some 26.000 seats? I believe nothing is said about it in the latest VI.


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> Where does it actually say De Goffert shall be expanded to some 26.000 seats. I believe nothing is said about it in the latest VI.


Page 4, underneath the photo of Luinge and Blind.


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## CityLife (Aug 21, 2002)

Not mentioned by anybody, but nowadays still the fourth stadium of the Netherlands...the good old Olympic Stadium (Amsterdam). Nowadays a capacity of 30.000 seats, once a capacity for 65.000.


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## Kampflamm (Dec 28, 2003)

AZs stadium looks great. Hopefully they can win the Eredivisie in the future.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

CityLife said:


> Not mentioned by anybody, but nowadays still the fourth stadium of the Netherlands...the good old Olympic Stadium (Amsterdam). Nowadays a capacity of 30.000 seats, once a capacity for 65.000.


It actually has a capacity of 22.500 which probably makes it the sixth biggest stadium in The Netherlands for now. According to World Stadiums, the Fanny Blankers Koen Stadium in Hengelo (only used once a year for an athletics event as far as I know) is the biggest athletics stadium with 25.000 seats although I'm not convinced of this. Once the Abe Lenstra expansion is finished it will drop to seventh place. After the expansions of Twente, NEC and AZ it will drop further.


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## Raddie (Oct 10, 2002)

Like a mini Kuip. De Kuip has been renovated by the same architect who designed the AZ stadium by the way, so it's not really a surprise.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

you're wright check 
http://www.zwarts.jansma.nl/listpublish.php?q_mm=&q_keyword=256


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## Raddie (Oct 10, 2002)

I'd never seen concrete plans of that Sparta/Excelsior combined stadium before, I'm glad they didn't build that... thing uke:










I hope they won't design the new Feijenoord stadium, I don't like those stairs between the stands and the ground they manage to put in each of their new stadium designs. That Lotus stadium is butt ugly too.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

skaP187 said:


> Allright then, that's allready about 4.000 more the originaly. Do you know where those seats were installed? I presume on the long sides, The reality should be different now with the drawings or not? Thanks for the info anyway!


The decided to place the seats closer to each other than originally planned. That way they could create an extra 3500 seats without changing the design.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

poe, nice and cosy then!


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## flares (May 9, 2006)

I guess i should have quoted the thread.....and sorry if it was a bit off topic. 

I was looking for the name of the Dutch stadium that rolls the pitch outside when not in use to get an even sunning and googled my way into this topic. Is it Arnhem? Anyone?


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Gelredome, Arnhem


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Any new news about the extension of the FC Twente stadium?
The last thing I could find is that the townhall is finaly making work about the liscenses and the infrastructure around the stadium (planning then)
2007 it will not be ready. Any new more detailed designs perhaps?
Also about the Sc Heerenveen stadium. I can never find anything detailed about how it is going to look when it is finished. anything?


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

This is one thread to many, to my opinion...
There is allready another one


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## Evoluon (Oct 25, 2005)

Kampflamm said:


> Considering that Philips is behind it, I'd say the club has more than enough money.


Nope, you're some 25 years behind on this one mate. The club, unfortunately, doesn't have any money at the moment as a result of gross mismanegement at the turn of the century (by the same guy that Chelsea trust all of their billions to today :uh: ). So any improvements are not expected until FIFA awards the World Cup of 2018 to NL and Belgium.

The rest of NL, except Gelredome, De Kuip, Philips, Euroborg and De Vijverberg: Same shit, different town (horrible pitchside staircases :down.


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## Kampflamm (Dec 28, 2003)

So I guess they're like Bayer Leverkusen then. There've actually been some rumors that Bayer wants to drop the entire club. VW is still investing a lot of money into their Wolfsburg club though.

But Philips Stadion is still a nice place. The corners look great (much better than the shit in Dortmund) and they just hosted the UEFA-Cup final so the place can't be that bad.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

The place isn't bad at all. specialy when you know where they come from. Eindhoven realy is not a big city or something. And whether you like it or not. PSV is a top club (in Holland) Compared with Utrecht or Den Haag/The Hague. These are cities much bigger but, there fc's or stadiums do not come close to PSV. 
It is a very nice stadium, but it is not a Feyenoord or Ajax. And def. not a Bernabeu or San Siro. But for this club it is perfect. perhaps in time they can grow untill 40.000. but I am only hoping that because I like big (steep) stadiums!
With Belgium in the same competition the Benelux should be able to have a very nice competition, which can knock out rivals like Portugal, Austia/Switserland and a Scandinavian competition easely.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

skaP187 said:


> Any new news about the extension of the FC Twente stadium?
> The last thing I could find is that the townhall is finaly making work about the liscenses and the infrastructure around the stadium (planning then)
> 2007 it will not be ready. Any new more detailed designs perhaps?
> Also about the Sc Heerenveen stadium. I can never find anything detailed about how it is going to look when it is finished. anything?


I don't believe Twente's plans are finalized. I've seen some pictures of the plans for the second tier and they looked pretty cool.

As for Heerenveen, they're currently working on the north stand which will be a copy of the south stand. It should be finished before the start of the new season.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Kampflamm said:


> So I guess they're like Bayer Leverkusen then. There've actually been some rumors that Bayer wants to drop the entire club. VW is still investing a lot of money into their Wolfsburg club though.
> 
> But Philips Stadion is still a nice place. The corners look great (much better than the shit in Dortmund) and they just hosted the UEFA-Cup final so the place can't be that bad.


Didn't Bayer used to own KFC Uerdingen as well?


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## Kampflamm (Dec 28, 2003)

Yeah, and now the team's bankrupt. Quite sad really because they used to have some decent teams back in the 80s.


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## dennol (Sep 11, 2002)

@skaP187

Eindhoven is not that much smaller than Utrecht. The Hague is bigger but not a megacity. Amsterdam and Rotterdam aren't either.

The size of a city doesn't really matter in football. No clubs from London, Paris, Istanbul and Moscow have ever won a Champions League/European Cup. But Nottingham, Eindhoven and Porto have.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Quintana said:


> I don't believe Twente's plans are finalized. I've seen some pictures of the plans for the second tier and they looked pretty cool.
> 
> As for Heerenveen, they're currently working on the north stand which will be a copy of the south stand. It should be finished before the start of the new season.


and then the Abe Lenstra will be finished? as a stadium then, I do not know how the planns are for the area around (sportteachersschool and stuff) but that is of miner interest for me. 
I thought it is so strange that I cannot find a propar presentation of that stadium. The one on the clubsite does not realy show anything about the stadium from the inside. The pictures I have seen so far, make me think that the stadium will not be very beautfull... damn another missed oppertunety and we do not have much in the Netherlands


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

dennol said:


> @skaP187
> 
> Eindhoven is not that much smaller than Utrecht. The Hague is bigger but not a megacity. Amsterdam and Rotterdam aren't either.
> 
> The size of a city doesn't really matter in football. No clubs from London, Paris, Istanbul and Moscow have ever won a Champions League/European Cup. But Nottingham, Eindhoven and Porto have.


You are right. The Netherlands does not have big cities (sorry Amsterdam). Nice note about the big cities. hehe, could against a calimero complex... (they are big and I am small and it is not fare... :bash: )
But are you with me that the Philips stadium is a nice stadium for Eindhoven (I do not know if there are compareble cities with a equal or better stadium then Eindhoven)


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## Dezz (Mar 11, 2005)

skaP187 said:


> You are right. The Netherlands does not have big cities (sorry Amsterdam). Nice note about the big cities. hehe, could against a calimero complex... (they are big and I am small and it is not fare... :bash: )
> But are you with me that the Philips stadium is a nice stadium for Eindhoven (I do not know if there are compareble cities with a equal or better stadium then Eindhoven)


Maybe The Netherlands are gonna have a big city in the future. There are plans to combine Amsterdam and Almere and some other smaller cities to one big city :cheers:


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Amsterdam and Almere together ? I'll have to check the Dutch forum for that I guess?
I imagine The Hague/Rotterdam might be posseble to. This will make rather big cities, but not near London, Paris, Berlin, Istanbul, Moscow, St Petrusburg, Madrid, Roma
which are real big (European cities)
The rest of the city combinations (Arnhem Nijmegen/ and Enschede Hengelo will not be very big. To be hounest I like that the Netherlands does not have big cities like that. We don't have big cities, we have a big mouth!


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

but, but, but eh .....
(I just like them as buildings, I don't care about the spectators!!!!)


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

According to this link, Twente might not be going for 26,000 but for 36,000!

http://www.tctubantia.nl/sport/fctwente/article829233.ece

It basically says - FC Twente's plan to increase the stadium further than originally intended - the original places were for 26,000, but new plans are for 36,000 places and with that the stadium could host internationals.

If all goes to plan, work on the first phase will start in May next year.

Must say I'm a bit surprised at the sheer ambition, Enschede's not that big a place. Mind you, Heerenveen's much smaller and they get almost 26,000 crowds. I imagine it'll be phased like the Abe Lenstra Stadion so they'll only keep increasing if they get the crowds.


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

AZ is going for 38,000 seats. Don't know what AZ's boss is up to, but something inside me says they shouldn't do it, peeking towards Vitesse.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

What's wrong with Vitesse


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

They're shit and you know they are


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## wc eend (Sep 16, 2002)

Dutch clubs sometimes tend to overestimate themselves when it comes to the construction of stadiums. Vitesse (the case of ex-chairman Aalbers), and FC Utrecht for example, were close to bankrupcy, wasn't it?


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Keizer Karel 4 ever!!!! sure thing as I like stadiums


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

wc eend said:


> Dutch clubs sometimes tend to overestimate themselves when it comes to the construction of stadiums. Vitesse (the case of ex-chairman Aalbers), and FC Utrecht for example, were close to bankrupcy, wasn't it?


Not Utrecht. But Vitesse, and that is once in the whole history. Dutch football generally UNDERestimates itself rather then OVERestimate. AZ is a different thing, a bit like Vitesse I guess. There is a Dutch saying, 'be normal, then you're already crazy enough'. Nobody dares to do something big, when Heerenveen expanded from 14.000 to 26.000, everbody said they would never be able to attract 26.000 even once. And look at it now, weekly sold out, huge waiting list and they have serious plans of expanding it to 30.000 soon, and further expanding to 40.000 later. They went to Newcastle to see what they did over there. The town of Heerenveen has a population of 28.000, their current stadium is almost as large as the whole town, but they have the complete province of Friesland (650.000 people) behind them, they have their own official EU-recognized language and there is a political party who wants separation from The Netherlands and independence for Friesland. Before every match they sing the Frisian 'national' anthem. It's pretty deep for them I guess.They would fill 40.000. FC Twente also has a complete area behind them. Farmers always are loyal to the ball and their team. :cheers:

Don't forget, PSV managed to reach the semifinals of CL and current season they easily reached the last 16. Their stadium is still only 37.000 seats. That's is the opposite of overestimation, isn't it? They would surely fill 50.000, Ajax and Feyenoord would fill 60.000. But _we_ are scared to not be normal. Not enough daring around here. But then again, when we peek towards Portugal to see what they did for EURO 2004, we don't want those situations over here.


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## RTM84 (Feb 8, 2005)

The Gelredome last Saturday night. Dance event Qlimax. ( I attanded myself and it was realy ammazing) in my oppinion one of the best Dance events with the Harder styles in dance music. And the Gelredome was the host for this ammazing show with a lot of lasers, special effects, fireworks, flameshooters, dancers, moving stages and much more. Respect for the Stadium and Q-dance and of course the DJ's and the 25.000 other party-people!

Here some pictures:









DJ-Stage









More DJ stage









Overvieuw









lasers









the crowds.










And and fore the ones who can bare the music some video samples taken with mobile phones.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3L7rhIeQA3Q 
The Prophet - Scantrax Rootz

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLHmWctcJic  
Intro Showtek


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## legslikeaspider (Nov 9, 2006)

what do dutch fans think of the Ajax Arena? 

The pitch looks like a minefield and from what I saw on the TV of the Holland-England game, the stadium seemed to be lacking in atmosphere, not to mention architechtural merit. Surely a great footballing nation like Holland and a great club like Ajax deserve better facilities than this?


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

All Dutch people outside Amsterdam have the same opinion as you do, no really! The only stadium where Holland should play there games is Rotterdam, de Kuip. Maybe for foreigners not so impressive but for Dutch a stadium with a lot of history and also a lot of atmosphere. A real footballstadium!
Also the pitch is normaly very good in Rotterdam. 
InAmsterdam it is always a problam, every half year or something they have to renew the whole pitch (and normally they know quit alot about grass in Amsterdam no?)
In that way you can say what your want, but is the Gelredome a far better multifunctional stadium, not in cap, but in quality then the Amsterdam ArenaA. Never problems with the pitch because it can role out and for concerts the sound quality is far better too, yep keizer Karel 4-ever baby!!!!


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## legslikeaspider (Nov 9, 2006)

skaP187 said:


> The only stadium where Holland should play there games is Rotterdam, de Kuip. Maybe for foreigners not so impressive but for Dutch a stadium with a lot of history and also a lot of atmosphere. A real footballstadium!


I agree, de Kuip may not look like something from star trek (ancient rome maybe) but from what I've seen it seems to be much more of a real football stadium, inhabited by some scarily barmy fans. I hope they don't pull it down and replace it with something bland and modern in the event of a Netherlands/Belgium world cup bid.


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

skaP187 said:


> All Dutch people outside Amsterdam have the same opinion as you do, no really! The only stadium where Holland should play there games is Rotterdam, de Kuip. Maybe for foreigners not so impressive but for Dutch a stadium with a lot of history and also a lot of atmosphere. A real footballstadium!
> Also the pitch is normaly very good in Rotterdam.
> InAmsterdam it is always a problam, every half year or something they have to renew the whole pitch (and normally they know quit alot about grass in Amsterdam no?)
> In that way you can say what your want, but is the Gelredome a far better multifunctional stadium, not in cap, but in quality then the Amsterdam ArenaA. Never problems with the pitch because it can role out and for concerts the sound quality is far better too, yep keizer Karel 4-ever baby!!!!


Don't think we Amsterdammers love the Arena. Quite the opposite actually.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

You just might be right!


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

skaP187 said:


> You just might be right!


BTW I think AGOVV Apeldoorn's stadium is a beauty, saying this because you're from Apeldoorn.



















The mainstand, made from wood and built in 1925, is a official monument.










as Borat would say: 'Wah-wah wee-wah!'


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

A man, now you make me cry and homesick ! (I live in Alicante nowadays) but it is a classic in the woods that it is, thanks!!!


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## Benjuk (Aug 12, 2006)

Haven't read the entire thread, so forgive me if someone has already mentioned this...

Looking through the pics, the thing that jumped out at me is how much a stadium is effected by how the corners are executed. The stadium with the huge white blocked out corners - ugly. I far prefer filled in corners which complete the sweep of seating right around the ground in one smooth wrap.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Just heard that Feyenoord wants a new stadium within 10 years (God I'll be 39 by then.. more dead then alive deffuantly) I think/hope that it has to do with the story of 75 000 cap stadium which I heard earlier, That should teach the competition in Amsterdam for ones and for all (only the football sucks nowadays in Rotterdam, but who cares about that...?)


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## RR1991 (Dec 24, 2005)

I like this stadium more  http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_pictures/europe/netherlands/rotterdam_hazelaarweg.shtml
or this one:
http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_pictures/europe/netherlands/heerenveen_thialf.shtml


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

the new planns for expanding the FC Twente stadium from current 13.500 to 36000 (imagine the seats red with a white horse on the main stand.) 
Might be that one of the stands behind the goals (side P) is going to be one big a la Borusia Dortmund)


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## LAYZIEDOGG (May 8, 2006)

Here some great aerial views of Philips stadium 
home of PSV .
thanks to FLX


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## Rhjh (Nov 28, 2006)

in tomorows local nieuws papier (dagblad van het noorden) the possible expansion of the euroborg of not 4000 but 20000 making it a 40000 stadium!!!!


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

This morning in the Dutch newspaper, Dagblad van het Noorden,

FC Groningen wil stadion verdubbelen

Gepubliceerd op 16 februari 2007, 22:21 
Laatst bijgewerkt op 16 februari 2007, 22:23 

Groningen - 
Amper een jaar nadat FC Groningen is verhuisd naar de Euroborg, wil de club het stadion al weer fors uitbreiden. De club gaat voor een verdubbeling van de huidige capaciteit, een stadion van 40.000 toeschouwers. Mocht dat om wat voor reden dan ook een onmogelijke zaak zijn, dan zinspeelt de club op termijn op een – noodgedwongen - vertrek uit de Euroborg. 

Algemeen directeur Hans Nijland: ”We zitten nu al aan de grenzen van onze groei. De wachtlijsten voor zowel de gewone toeschouwers als voor sponsors worden al maar langer en langer.”

Eredivisie 

De uitbouw naar een voetbalarena voor 40.000 toeschouwers is volgens Nijland nodig om op lange termijn een voorname rol in de eredivisie te kunnen blijven vervullen. In een Euroborg met de huidige capaciteit is dat volgens hem onmogelijk.

Of een grondige verbouwing er ook daadwerkelijk van komt, is nog maar de vraag. Ben Veenbrink, directeur van de NV Euroborg, is in principe niet afwijzend maar vraagt zich af of het allemaal wel mogelijk is. ”Afgezien van het financiële plaatje, zal onderzocht moeten worden of het technisch wel kan.”

Onderzoek 

Inmiddels heeft FC Groningen al aangedrongen op een haalbaarheidsonderzoek. Nijland: ”Wij gaan voor een onafhankelijk onderzoek zonder mitsen en maren vooraf, dus met een onbevooroordeelde insteek.”

Frank de Vries, wethouder van ruimtelijke ordening in Groningen, reageert gereserveerd op de plannen. ”Het is altijd goed als FC Groningen nadenkt over de toekomst op lange termijn

we zullen zien/ We shall see

Small impression/ joke from another forumer on other forum


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Translation, they are seriously thinking about extanding from 20 to 40 000
but it is only thinking at this moment so no renders and stuff at this moment.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

With all the planns for new stadiums in the Netherlands we would have a nice list of stadiums if they would go on:

Feyenoord Rotterdam 75 000
Ajax Amsterdam 65 000
FC Groningen 40 000
FC Twente Enschede 36 000
AZ Alkmaar 36 000 
SC Heerenveen 30 000
NAC Breda 20 000

+ the allready exsisting
PSV Eindhoven 36 500
Vitesse Arnhem 27 500
FC Utrecht 24 500
Roda JC Kerkrade 19 200




Sorry I see I am repeting myself, that's not my fault, that's because they don't construct fast enough!!!!


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

that render is a joke of someone else lad...
I don't think they can make it. 35.000 would be far more than enough. and would the world cup 2018 come to the Netherland (I doubt that) than it is stil possible to look for 5.000 or 10.000 seats extra. this is crap, farmers aren't that much ambicious I thought. 
it's nice how it is now. 19.000 on a capacity of 20.000 each game. do it in steps. FC Groningen isnt a club that keeps a level for a long time. if the results are falling the supporters arent comming anymore


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## Martuh (Nov 12, 2005)

I guess Groningen is looking towards their big concurrent SC Heerenveen, who also want 40,000. I think it's better when Groningen extends to 24,000 firstly next summer, and later on, when the demand is still huge, to construct a third tier, so they will have about 35,000 seats.


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## th0m (Oct 14, 2004)

How will they expand to 24k? Move the seats closer to eachother? I'm assuming mostly cosmetic improvements, seems like too much of a hassle to compromise the current set-up for a mere 4k increment in capacity.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

th0m said:


> How will they expand to 24k? Move the seats closer to eachother? I'm assuming mostly cosmetic improvements, seems like too much of a hassle to compromise the current set-up for a mere 4k increment in capacity.


They are thinking of extending the stands more towards the field which would create about 4 000 seats more. I think this is a good idea. Closer to the field is more atmosphere!!!


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Red85 said:


> that render is a joke of someone else lad...
> I don't think they can make it. 35.000 would be far more than enough. and would the world cup 2018 come to the Netherland (I doubt that) than it is stil possible to look for 5.000 or 10.000 seats extra. this is crap, *farmers aren't that much ambicious I thought.*
> it's nice how it is now. 19.000 on a capacity of 20.000 each game. do it in steps. FC Groningen isnt a club that keeps a level for a long time. if the results are falling the supporters arent comming anymore


So your not ambicious either, little boy from Purmerend:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: near to Amsterdam...........................................??????????????
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
(wannabe!!!)


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

skaP187 said:


> So your not ambicious either, little boy from Purmerend:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: near to Amsterdam...........................................??????????????
> :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
> (wannabe!!!)


little boy, wait untill I stand in front of you. 1.90m high:lol: 
hey, it is'nt ambicious, apeldoorn is big by the way. that 'near to Amsterdam' is for the internationals over here. I did'nt expect any locals from our country. 
by the way, if I stap in a bus that, drives here every 5 minutes, i'm standing in 25 minutes in the centre of Amsterdam. in many other countrys it is impossible to do that even if you live in the capitol.

(nog ff wat, check je bronnen eerst voordat je wat begint uit te kramen, wannebe first, you look like the press)


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Well, he has a point. Calling people farmers when you yourself live in a haven of provincialism...


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## redbaron_012 (Sep 19, 2004)

scaP187 Doesn't the Ajax stadium already exist ?.....on your list??? I live in Melbourne Australia and visited this stadium in 2000.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

It does but it currently has a capacity of about 52,000.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Quintana said:


> Well, he has a point. Calling people farmers when you yourself live in a haven of provincialism...


:lol: 
actualy i'm from Onderdijk. thats a village above Hoorn. I moved to where i'm now a decade ago. but i've explained it already why I have that 'near to'. avoiding questions, not to be a wannabe following the man from the veluwe...


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Red85 said:


> :lol:
> actualy i'm from Onderdijk. thats a village above Hoorn. I moved to where i'm now a decade ago. but i've explained it already why I have that 'near to'. avoiding questions, not to be a wannabe following the man from the veluwe...


Sorry but calling people from the city of Groningen farmers, while you come yourself from the village of Purmerend (or wurse). t made me laugh, but that is good for my health. Don't worry about, it will happen to me one time too.
me myself, I am from the village of Apeldoorn, which is still twice as big as Purmerend, but who gives a s...! The main thing is that you said that farmers shouldn't be that ambitious, why not, farmers from Eindhoven have been saving pride for the Netherlands for about the last 5 years. 

I like clubs with ambition, big or small, because I like (bigger) stadiums.
So if Ajax want to go to 65 000, I respect that. If Feyenoord wants to go to 75 000, same goes for AZ, Twente and in this case Groningen.
I am in support of a strong as possible Dutch competition.

Any way you explaind it, I understand! (I am from Apeldoorn, near to Arnhem!)

Back to the stadiums!


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## www.sercan.de (Aug 10, 2003)

skaP187 said:


> Isn't it so that in the upper ring in the corners, it is allready diffecult to see the nearest by corner. It is only just possible.
> Don't get me wrong the views in the Arena at this moment are perfect, but if they realy want to put an extra tear on top of it this will mean the tears sloop will be even more steeper.
> MOP the steeper the better, but a lot of people not join my view on this I think.
> Also if you expand with about 10 000 the tear will be rather small.
> ...



maybe this will help you









2nd tier is about 34°
bernabeu 3rd tier is 41°
so a 3rd tier could be possible
But i don't know hao it would work with the roof
it would be the first expansion of a stadium with a Retractable-roof


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## www.sercan.de (Aug 10, 2003)

new Feyenoord stadium proposal
capacity 72,000


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

^^ That is not really a proposal made by Feyenoord but rather by an architect alone. Feyenoord is seriously thinking about a new stadium with a capacity of 70,000 though.

About the Arena, they will investigate if they can somehow lift up the roof to make room for a third tier (or more likely, an extension of the second tier).


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## lpioe (May 6, 2006)

Isn't 72'000 a bit too much for Feyenoord :?
They have an average attendance of about 40'000 this year.
And I guess Amsterdam Arena will remain the 'national stadium'.


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## Judazzz (Jul 7, 2006)

skaP187 said:


> Translation, they are seriously thinking about extanding from 20 to 40 000
> but it is only thinking at this moment so no renders and stuff at this moment.


They showed two renders in a regional newspaper a while ago:


















Looks pretty awesome, but I'm affraid it's a tad over-ambitious for a club like FC Groningen. I am not going to stop them, though...


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

skaP187 said:


>


Looks like this one... Viva Photoshop!!!


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Some new artist impressions wich were presented today by NAC Breda, a southern club in the Netherlands.

They plan to expand their stadium from 16.400 to 20.000 seats. Next tot that they want to make more profit from the surrounding area by building a mega cinema and a supermarket next to the stadium.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Planns for new Agovv stadium in Apeldoorn.
If i understand good, first 6 000 cap later 12 000

























I like it! and not just because it is/was my home town!


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

This one is almost finished now.

the new ADO Den Haag stadium, a shame they´ve gone down a division this year...


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## VelesHomais (Sep 1, 2004)

Very nice stadiums


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## Joep Meloen (Jul 24, 2007)

Mos def almost all the dutchies like the Kuip better than the ArenA, including the harde kern ajax fans! They hate their own stadium prob. the most, for they have to play in it every other weekend! You will always get some of the 2 million 'ajax fans' that prefer the ArenA just for the fact its Ajax's stadium. About hosting national games in the provences; being from Eindhoven you should know that about 70/80% of the stadium is always filled with people from down south and the east/north (Twente region). That 70% is just a wild guess based on the accent of the people I hear the times I've been.
So hosting smaller games away from 'the west' should not be a problem at all!

Here some panorama photos of some stadiums.

Ajax





AZ



Utrecht

Feyenoord




NAC


Twente


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## Joep Meloen (Jul 24, 2007)

NEC

Groningen

PSV


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## lpioe (May 6, 2006)

^^ why do they hate Ajax Arena?


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

lpioe said:


> ^^ why do they hate Ajax Arena?


I can tell you. 

first of all, the ditch between the stands and the pitch. that is so wide you can fill it with a tank (or 2). on the sides of the stadium it go's well. but behind the goals, damn. 15 meters at least between the last rows of seats and the goal. its sow wide that an athletics stadium has a better view at the first rows. its horrible. 
in the urly days Ajax had 'De Meer'. in the end of the match you could almost smell the sweat of the players so close to the pitch it was. the ditch is 4 meters deep. its so ugly and so un personal. a stadium like wembley is pleased with its barriers on the sides. really. 
the ditch, damn, the fellow that designed that, I wish i could hit him. 

2nd, it is to commercial. to get a beer you have to pay 'arena's' those are special catering cards in stand of money. than you have to pay 4 euro's for a beer witch is special dutch 'event beer' (2,5%). or to get a nice snack witch is 2.5 euro for a kroket (dutch piece of fried meat)

3rd. because there is a rooth on it, there is no natural sunlight and no natural wind in the stadium. therefor the pitch is always a piece of shit. we have to change it every 10 games or so. I lost count when the pitch count was on 27 some 4 years ago. 

4. another reason the pitch is fucked, is that there is a parking lot beneath the pitch. we play 8 meters above the ground (24 feet!). so the pitch has no natural soil underneath it. this is a reason that is part of the commercial aspect aswell. 

5. if you have a ticket on the 2nd tier. you have to walk trough 10 stearcases. last year they installed escalators. now the leazy supporters are transported to thier seats. 

6. the seats are red, green, white, yellow and bleu. where is the 'AJAX' sign? or all seats in red n white. its to neutral. 

7. because the 'arena co.' needs an income, not only Ajax is the user. many concerts are planned trough out the year. and when 15.000 people are on the pitch dancing it is nog healthy for the green under these people. 

8. when you have a ticket for the upper rows of the 2nd tier and you have not to good eyes. you need goggles. and that for a 52000 stadium. 

these are the leading reasons why we think its a farce.

the most of us are so jelous about the wembley, la luz, dragao, stadium of light, emirates and the schalkarena.

for the people here. I'm not a 'harde kern' f-side or 410 member. but i'm a fanatic one who goes on a high regular basis to my club. about half of the games I see in real time.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

skaP187 said:


>


This extension has started the first of October!
I think it will take them to 24 500.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

The city council of Alkmaar has given green light for extending the DSB Stadion to a capacity of 40,000 (it currently holds 18,000).


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

That´s good news... 
Very smart move of AZ to go directly for licenses for 40 000.
I don´t think they will expend that far. I think they first will go to 25 000 or something, but if they want to extend further it will save them alot of bureaucratie


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## Shukie (Mar 29, 2007)

I didn't know anyone could make that many spelling mistakes without doing it on purpose, not going to mention any names...Anyway, the Amsterdam Arena is by far the best looking stadium we have, none of the other ones can hold a candle to it:


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Too bad it is so unsuited for the main purpose it was constructed.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Haha! and now Anderlecht wants to make a copy for 60 000 cap of it...
Some countries realy keep up living to their reputation!:lol:


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

Little update:

*AZ Alkmaar*

expansion from 17000 to 40000. No finishing date has been announced yet



















Here you can find the official power point presentation for the expansion:

DSB-stadion.ppt


*NEC Nijmegen*

Expansion from 12500 to 20000. Project should be finished by 2010














































A small indoor hall will be incorporated as well:



















*NAC Breda*

A small expansion from 16500 to 20000 + area redevelopments

Current look:










New look:




























full 55-slides presentation (in dutch) is here:

http://www.nac.nl/nieuwstadion.php


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Thanks for the info. 
I knew about them, just forgot to put the pictures.

About NAC, I thougt it´s not sure how far the upgrade will go. Anything between 20 000 and 25 000. I thought disisions still needed to be made.


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## Joop20 (Jun 29, 2004)

Some more pics of the extension of the AZ stadium from 17k to 40k:


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

^^

Those are "unofficial". They were made by a fan based on the official plans. It must be said that they are a lot nicer than the official ones though.


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## Joop20 (Jun 29, 2004)

mavn said:


> ^^
> 
> Those are "unofficial". They were made by a fan based on the official plans. It must be said that they are a lot nicer than the official ones though.


Yep, that's why i posted them


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## Joop20 (Jun 29, 2004)

_Rotterdam wil nieuw Feyenoord-stadion voor WK 

Datum: 21-nov-2007 17:17

Stadion Feijenoord en de gemeente Rotterdam willen voor het seizoen 2016/2017 een nieuw stadion opleveren. Het nieuwe onderkomen van Feyenoord moet daarmee het paradepaardje van het WK in 2018 worden, als dat in Nederland en België wordt gehouden. Het stadion krijgt een capaciteit van 75.000 toeschouwers.

Het stadsbestuur stuurde woensdag een brief naar de KNVB en de gemeenteraad van Rotterdam waarin de plannen uit de doeken werden gedaan. In de tweede helft van 2008 wordt de locatie bepaald. Het stadion moet in de buurt van De Kuip komen. _


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

Joop20 said:


> _Rotterdam wil nieuw Feyenoord-stadion voor WK
> 
> Datum: 21-nov-2007 17:17
> 
> ...


Something tells me Amsterdam will wait for this to develop a bit further and then come with something bigger. (either a complete amsterdam Arena extension/reconstruction or something new) I'm pretty sure they'll wont lay down that easily in the race with Rotterdam to feature "het paradepaardje" of the event. They lost the 2000 final due to complacency. From what I've understood, they don't intent to make that same mistake twice.

Time will tell I guess.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

mavn said:


> Something tells me Amsterdam will wait for this to develop a bit further and then come with something bigger. (either a complete amsterdam Arena extension/reconstruction or something new) I'm pretty sure they'll wont lay down that easily in the race with Rotterdam to feature "het paradepaardje" of the event. They lost the 2000 final due to complacency. From what I've understood, they don't intent to make that same mistake twice.
> 
> Time will tell I guess.


I think your underbellyfeeling nuts is right.
There´s nothing like a good old Rotterdam - Amsterdam prestige war.


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## LandOfGreenGinger (Apr 30, 2006)

Joop20 said:


> _Rotterdam wil nieuw Feyenoord-stadion voor WK
> 
> Datum: 21-nov-2007 17:17
> 
> ...


Thats a very long time scale. Looks like they will fish for government/KNVB funding before starting. Can they afford it without World Cup/KNVB/Government money?

Hopefully the Arena will be seriously redeveloped. Can't see them moving from that location. The transport infrastructure is ideally suited for a stadium in that spot, especially with the new Bijlmer station. They just need to make a stadium ideally suited to football to go there. Really hope they learn from the mistakes made with the arena.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

They are currently investigating extending the second tier of the Amsterdam Arena which would take the capacity to 65,000. If they fill in those horrible moats around the pitch the final capacity could be somewhere around 75,000 to 80,000 as well.


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

Quintana said:


> They are currently investigating extending the second tier of the Amsterdam Arena which would take the capacity to 65,000. If they fill in those horrible moats around the pitch the final capacity could be somewhere around 75,000 to 80,000 as well.


I've thought about that as well, but the "new" first tier would than be very, very shallow. A bit like the redeveloped first tier at maracana. Even more than that I think. It would destroy the overall look of the stadium in my opinion. 

Currently the pitch in in a sort of 3 meter high "barge" (?, babelfish... ). If you would bring it down to the level of that (horrible) ditch and would just extend the stands, the stands behind the goals would probably end up similar to the pitch as they are at wembley or emirates for instance. On the two sides along the pitch the first row would be practically on the sideline.

Doing that would probably give you 3 to 7k extra seats. The problem would than be however that with the pitch being lower the third tier be have to become even steeper to make sure they can see the whole pitch...

And I'm still not convince about that 65000 mark. That would mean that the new tier would have 13 to 14000 seats. I believe the second tier has something like 28 so that 3rd tier would be very small. But perhaps that is necessary for it fit between the second tier and the current (then raised) roof.

My personal favorite solution would be to build a new multi functional ~80000 seater placed in between Amsterdam and Almere. With athletics track, movable first tier (a la stade de france) with a sort of modular design through which some of the sections could be blinded for smaller events. It could be host to the WC 2018 final and the center piece in a 2028 Olympics bid. Furthermore, it could have a shared status (with the new feyenoord stadium) national stadium for the Dutch team, true neutral ground for Cup finals, big athletic events and could take some concerts pressure from the Arena. Currently, the Arena is being managed as an events stadium and Ajax is only seen as a tenant which is a pretty fragile situation. If Ajax would get the change to leave to a better suited stadium they would probably leave in a heartbeat and no fan would be sad about it... The other option would be for Ajax to buy the stadium but currently they can't due to the management structure of the stadium. If Ajax could buy it, they could make it more of a football stadium (extending seats towards the pitch, changing the seat colors) It would then become a perfect ~60K stadium for them. 

I'm not an architect or constructor, but an Amsterdam Arena extension would probably be very costly. I read some estimates that were bigger then the 140M euro that the whole stadium cost in 1996... and there would be loss of revenue during the construction. Would a new stadium be that much more expensive? The only BIG question mark would be whether the new stadium could be profitable... I seriously doubt it to be honest...


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

A few new renders of the 1st FC Twente extension (already underway and to be finished at start of next season):





This stadium will be great once all 4 sides are done


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

mavn said:


> And I'm still not convince about that 65000 mark. That would mean that the new tier would have 13 to 14000 seats. I believe the second tier has something like 28 so that 3rd tier would be very small. But perhaps that is necessary for it fit between the second tier and the current (then raised) roof.


From what I understand, the plan doesn't involve the construction of a third tier but an extension of the second instead.


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

Quintana said:


> From what I understand, the plan doesn't involve the construction of a third tier but an extension of the second instead.


That would mean a whole a new roof would have to be constructed, not?... I thought they wanted to just raise the roof and put a small steep(!) third tier in between. 

But hey, if it's an extended second tier, the viewing angles would just be alright for the pitch to be lowered. Add the seating to the bottom of the first tier and you would have a 70000 to 75000 stadium that could seriously compete for the world cup final with Rotterdam. 

But the national stadium option is still the best I think. Apart from the fact that I think a world cup final has to be played at the capitol or biggest city of a nation (Amsterdam is both) the thought of Rotterdam becoming the city to bid for the 2028 Olympics is pretty disastrous. Amsterdam might have a small chance. Rotterdam will be fighting a losing battle from day one. Amsterdam will at the very least ring a bell worldwide. Rotterdam is virtually unknown to the general public outside of Europe...


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

And for good reason. What a horrible place it is.


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

Quintana said:


> And for good reason. What a horrible place it is.


Being an Ajax fan living in Rotterdam I'm staying well away from any of those arguments...


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## LandOfGreenGinger (Apr 30, 2006)

Just to ask about the new Rotterdam stadium again. The timescale to open a year before a potential 2018 tournament says to me that they would like a new 75 000 stadium, but they would like any 2018 bid to fund their stadium build. I've seen no other indication how a team that never makes the champions league will be able to afford such ground. I don't trust it.

Also wouldn't the Arena have trouble sinking the pitch as the transferium parking and through road are below it?


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## TC03 (Sep 1, 2005)

^^ Although they make it rarely to the CL, Feyenoord is still one of the most popular clubs in The Netherlands (if not _the_ most popular). Besides that, the city of Rotterdam will also put some money into it. It's not like PSV or Ajax would be able to afford it while Feyenoord wouldn't, the ~€10 million a year due to CL won't be sufficient when you're talking €400 million stadiums.

There _will_ be a new 75,000 seater for Feyenoord, whether they do or don't get the WC.


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## lpioe (May 6, 2006)

Why do they want a new stadium so badly?
De Kuip is a wonderful stadium and its not at capacity (average about 40k, cap more than 50k)


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

lpioe said:


> Why do they want a new stadium so badly?
> De Kuip is a wonderful stadium and its not at capacity (average about 40k, cap more than 50k)


The Kuip is getting old and they'll have to leave due to safety reasons. When it was completely renovated in the mid nineties they knew it would only last a maximum 25 to 30 years. The steel structure is showing fatigue and Feyenoord will be forced to leave it somewhere between 2020 and 2025 at best. 

That capacity is a bit of a fairy tail. Yes, there are ~51000 seats. But about 1600 seats have to be given to the opponent (only Ajax, PSV and perhaps Utrecht and Twente will sell all those tickets) And, more importantly, about 2 to 3K seats have to be left open around the away section for safety reasons. If Feyenoord and the opponent sell all their tickets the attendance will be around 46000. Feyenoord has sold out all their 42000 available season tickets. and have a average attendance of 44 to 45K wich is practically as high as it can get.

The new stadium will be built whatever happends. The world cup will only have an influence on the finishing date. It will be payed for by Feyenoord, Private investors and the local government and (given the importance it will have for he whole country) the Dutch government will take a small load as well. Obviously, due to this construction, Feyenoord will only be a tenant of the stadium. Just like they are now. The whole setup will be probably be very similar to the one that was used for building the Amsterdam Arena.


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

LandOfGreenGinger said:


> Also wouldn't the Arena have trouble sinking the pitch as the transferium parking and through road are below it?


The pitch is in sort of large barge. I assume that the roof of the highest parking deck is the same as the floor of the ditch between the pitch and the field (that barge...). If you would demolish the barge and bring the field down to "ditch" level, than you could extend the first tiers by several rows wich would bring the stands considerably closer to the field. We are not talking about a 20000 extension here, but 5 to 8000 should be possible. As long as Ajax isn't allowed to buy the stadium though (which they want to do very badly) it won't happen. Even tough Ajax is the main tenant and if they would leave the stadium would go bankrupt, the stadium directors treat the place as an events center. They are unwilling to make some minor changes that would have a big impact on the image of the stadium amongst supporters.


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

mavn said:


>


Those pictures don't show, only a hotlink warning - here they are


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

CorliCorso said:


> Those pictures don't show, only a hotlink warning - here they are


Yep, I just found out. I Changed them altough I'll have to check the FAQ to see if the way I did it is allowed.

EDIT: Didn't find anything about it, so I'll leave it as is. If it's not allowed I'll find out soon enough I guess...


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

First U/C pictures. I like the new stadium really much. Next season it will expand untill 43.000 seats!  Thats quite a lot for a city that only counts 154.000 inhabitants.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Is that second fase already certain?


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

Quintana said:


> Is that second fase already certain?


Yes, more or less.

It all depends on funding. The extensions will be pretty much sold out from day one so that will bring the revenue needed to apply for the loan to build the second extension.

Whether they'll start on the second extension right after finishing this one or wait 1 or 2 years is anyones guess. I believe the intention is to start right away.


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

Yes, that is the intention. 

But there is one problem. The road to the stadium is much to small. They first have to expand the road to 2x2. If that will be done, this season, they will directly start the second expantion, after the first one, wich is U/C at the moment.

But guy's, what a beautiful stadium it's going to be! I just simply love it! The red colour will be fantastic! Maybe this is going to be the most beautiful but above all, the most atmospheric stadium in The Netherlands!


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

Skycrap said:


> First U/C pictures. I like the new stadium really much. Next season it will expand untill 43.000 seats!  Thats quite a lot for a city that only counts 154.000 inhabitants.


You wont beat Heerenveen though... A 26.600 stadium in a village of merely 28000. And then to think that they are thinking of building a new one of 40000 because they are running out of much needed extension options on their current stadium... :nuts:


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

mavn said:


> You wont beat Heerenveen though... A 26.600 stadium in a village of merely 28000. And then to think that they are thinking of building a new one of 40000 because they are running out of much needed extension options on their current stadium... :nuts:


Yes, thats correct :lol:
Offcourse, Heerenveen is a great club, with fantastic supporters. It's a bit the same story as with Fc Twente. Both clubs have the most supporters from outside the city. Notice that a lot of German people, who just live over the border, are Fc Twente supporters.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

TC03 said:


> ^^ Although they make it rarely to the CL, Feyenoord is still one of the most popular clubs in The Netherlands *(if not the most popular).* Besides that, the city of Rotterdam will also put some money into it. It's not like PSV or Ajax would be able to afford it while Feyenoord wouldn't, the ~€10 million a year due to CL won't be sufficient when you're talking €400 million stadiums.
> 
> There _will_ be a new 75,000 seater for Feyenoord, whether they do or don't get the WC.


watch your language son :tongue3:
Ajax is the most loved and the most hated in the country. 
congrats with those plans, but as like the history told us, Amsterdam will follow. 

I agree on that feyenoord must have a new stadium. de kuip is standing there rotting away. I've bin there a few times in cup finals and when you are jumping there with 15.000 men ar so, you can feel it bounch. it is humoristic and atmosphirical but it isnt doing any good to the steel construction of the stadium. a 3rd tear isnt an option anymore. its to old.


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## ZeTaCy (Jan 14, 2007)

I think the new stadium of Feyenoord will make a big impression on everyone, hopefully it will be in the range of 90.000+ seats.

I Can't wait till the first few renders are coming out


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

De Kuip as a stadium is the most loved for sure in the Netherlands.
Outside is ugly, but the inside is perfect.
The Kuip has been build be a visionair. Let´s hope the designers will take that in mind and build something spectacular/original.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Thumbs up for the Fc Twente stadium. Looks good specialy the red armer on the sides of the stadium make it nice.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

New indoor Arena for Amsterdam. Designed as a concert venue rather than a sports venue but I suppose it could be used as the latter as well:



















Capacity: 15,000 (in concert mode obviously)

Pictures from The Runner


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## Mathijzzz (Jan 30, 2008)

*Omnisportcentrum in Apeldoorn (The Netherlands)*

This new stadium is ready in summer 2008. It will have an Cycling Arena and a atletics arena in the round building. There will also be a big hall for volleybal. This is allready in use by Piet Zoomers Dynamo. 

Complete impression:









At this moment:



















The roof is allready on but I don't have recent pictures. 

Stats about the arena:
Volleybal 1.500m2 1.500 seats. 2.500 with a big event.
Cycling & Athletics 5.000 seats. 11.000 with a big event.

Here is a link to the map off the arena.


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

FCT website dedicated to the developments -
http://www.thuisbijfctwente.nl/

Can't wait 'til it's finished!


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Pretty serious ´rumers´(hate that word...) are that Feyenoord Rotterdam wants to build a new stadium which will be bigger then the extended Camp Nou.
They would be aiming for 110 000...
This year planns should be unfolded, the stadium should be finished in 2016.


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## Vermeer (Apr 23, 2007)

skaP187 said:


> Pretty serious ´rumers´(hate that word...) are that Feyenoord Rotterdam wants to build a new stadium which will be bigger then the extended Camp Nou.
> They would be aiming for 110 000...
> This year planns should be unfolded, the stadium should be finished in 2016.


Let us pray that these plans never get more than rumours. Hardly any club in Europe needs a 110k stadium and for sure not Feyenoord.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

Vermeer said:


> Let us pray that these plans never get more than rumours. Hardly any club in Europe needs a 110k stadium and for sure not Feyenoord.


I agree. Spend the money wisely and secure the quality and atmosphere of the stadium for a long time, rather than overbuilding just for the sake of size. Sure it can be impressive seeing such numbers, but often the furthest seats offer terrible conditions and half empty events would be a true shame. Especially considering how nicely so many of the facilities in the Eredivisie add to the league's intimacy and passion. I love these stadiums for their character and would rather preserve that aspect than simply add a huge box. :cheers:


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

It seems to be more than just a rumour. The leading football magazine of the Netherlands has a video-topic of it. It can be viewed under www.vi.nl

As a big fan of Feyenoord (I never miss a home game, now for the 14th year running) I am happy that the club shows some big ambitions again. It still is a sleeping giant even though on average more than 45.000 people visit the stadium weekly. Basically it is always sold out since for a couple of games (Ajax, Utrecht, etc.) the maximum capacity is lowered to 42.500. But financially they are trailing Ajax Amsterdam and especially PSV Eindhoven big time.

But I am afraid that if the city goes along with this (they want to revitalize the southern part of the city which needs a very big impuls soon, the stadium is this big impulse) the number of more than 106.000 (the to be expanded Camp Nou) is too high. I would be more than happy with about 80.000, which is as large as anything in France, larger than any stadium in Germany, and only beaten by the new Wembley in England.(!)

On the other hand, if the Club and the City have done serious studies about how large the stadium should be, and the club can fill it reasonably well (also concerts are to be held here), then it could be the right move to get back to the top of at least Dutch Football.

Feyenoord has been away from that way and way too long. And hopefully they can play a nice part in european football again too. To win the CL is nowadays not possible for any team from a smaller footbaal country. In my opinion this will remain so in the future, but maybe in the distant future a QF in the CL would already be great!

And the Netherlands (especially the City of Rotterdam) wants to host the WC-2018 final if the organization of the tournament is granted to Belgium and the Netherlands. To me they are outsiders compared to a possible England or Spain bid, but you never know how these decision are taken. Look at Germany 2006 (a terrific tournament) which actually "should" have gone to South-Africa.


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## xlchris (Jun 23, 2006)

When are they going to expand the Amsterdam Arena to +/- 80.000 seats?


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ It is not known yet. The latest studies showed that an expansion to just over 70.000 is feasable, but due to the roof works very, very expensive.

80.000 seats is too much for the ArenA area since on the south side many structures (offices and shops) are build very close (too close) to the stadium.

They need to be demolished in order for the ArenA to be able to grow bigger than just over 70.000 seats. I do not see big chances for that to happen any time soon. The figure of 70.000 seats was the target of the feasablility study since the UEFA changed the minimum capacity rules for hosting a CL final. That requirement is now set at 70.000 seats. And Amsterdam would like to host a CL final in the future again.


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## KaSpEr5 (Oct 28, 2007)

btw, the way i heared the rumour was:
Feyenoord will built an 80k stadium, expandable to +- 110k.
Feyenoord is able to fill a 80000 seater. And maybe there popularity will grow in time...


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Well if any club can build a 110 000 stadium in Holland and get away with it, it is Feyenoord. 
Remember that when they build ´the Kuip´ in the 30´s. Everybody was laughing to, but the man who did it, Leen van Zandvliet, proved himself to be a true visionair by building a 65 000 cap stadium finished in 1937. An immens and truely footballstadium for that time, even by international standards.Even Barca had a smaller stadium at those times. I think only Wembley would have been truely bigger.
I respect the fact that they show the ambition, allthough they might aim a little bit to high, but I am not a vissionair.
The only thing which worries me a little bit, that it seemes that Feyenoord thinks that if they just build a stadium which is massive, the results and they money will come on itself. If this money does not come, then it will be the end of the club. As they are not doing that well financiely and sportive wise at this moment.
They gamble on the fact that if the results will not come, there are so many parties/people involved in it with big money, that they cannot let the club go down.
Conclussion, if any city can do in in the Netherlands, it´s Rotterdam, so go with the banana.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

skaP187 said:


> Well if any club can build a 110 000 stadium in Holland and get away with it, it is Feyenoord.
> 
> The only thing which worries me a little bit, that it seemes that Feyenoord thinks that if they just build a stadium which is massive, the results and they money will come on itself. If this money does not come, then it will be the end of the club. As they are not doing that well financiely and sportive wise at this moment.
> They gamble on the fact that if the results will not come, there are so many parties/people involved in it with big money, that they cannot let the club go down.
> Conclussion, if any city can do in in the Netherlands, it´s Rotterdam, so go with the banana.


I agree with you on this one. But the money will not be that muh of a problem once the stadium is built. The problem now is that the stadium is too small and under-equipped to generate more money for the club. The maximum allowed capacity is now about 47.000. A small expansion of the business facilitities (without taking up the space of normal seats, that is a primary condition set by the club) takes the maximum capacity for the coming years to 48.500 seats. It will generate about 3 to 5 million Euro's per year more, but that is the maximum the old De Kuip can do for the club.

But that expansion will not make the waiting lists for the business facilitites disappear, it will get a bit smaller though. Feyenoord has not done very well lately except for winning the UEFA cup in 2002 and the Dutch national cup in 2008. The last championship was in 1999. Not withstanding this fact there are long waiting lists for these facilities.

Combined with the fact that normal season tickets are sold out at 42.000, (and they are sold out but the club does not run a waiting list, you are either in or out) there is lots of more income to generate with the new stadium. Especially when the club becomes more successful in the league and maybe in Europe again. Then the waiting lists for season tickets and business facilities will grow and grow, putting even more pressure on the new stadium development to get it ready a.s.a.p.

I am pretty sure the new management of the club (which is a big improvement with the way the club was run the last 5-6 years) knows this too and therefore they are aiming high, very high. Maybe a bit too high, but only time can tell.


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## CborG (Dec 2, 2003)

expansion of the FC Twente stadium is going fast!



Apostle said:


> Van Enschede-stad:


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

CborG said:


> expansion of the FC Twente stadium is going fast!


Is this phase1? When it's completed how much is added to the current 13,250 capacity?


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## CborG (Dec 2, 2003)

^^Yes, it's phase 1. The capacity will be 24,500


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

CborG said:


> ^^Yes, it's phase 1. The capacity will be 24,500


That means about 11,000 seats will be added in phase1?


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ A bit more than 11.000 seats. The stadium will grow in phase 1 of the expansion to about 24.500 seats. The next L-shaped expansion (phase 2) will raise the capacity to 36.000 seats. The remaining two second tier corners would be phase 3, making it a 40.000 seats stadium. But I have heard that the sales of the new seats is going pretty well. The club may decide to combine the second and third phase to make it a 40.000 seat stadium rigth away.

Beerbrewer Grolsch of Enschede will be the new stadium sponsor. The official announcement will be made this Friday, May 9th. The stadium will be renamed into Grolsche Veste. A "Veste" comes from the Dutch word "vesting". Free translated it could be understood as "fortress".


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

EPA001 said:


> ^^ A bit more than 11.000 seats. The stadium will grow in phase 1 of the expansion to about 24.500 seats. The next L-shaped expansion (phase 2) will raise the capacity to 36.000 seats. The remaining two second tier corners would be phase 3, making it a 40.000 seats stadium. But I have heard that the sales of the new seats is going pretty well. The club may decide to combine the second and third phase to make it a 40.000 seat stadium rigth away.
> 
> Beerbrewer Grolsch of Enschede will be the new stadium sponsor. The official announcement will be made this Friday, May 9th. The stadium will be renamed into Grolsche Veste. A "Veste" comes from the Dutch word "vesting". Free translated it could be understood as "fortress".


Thank you for your detailed explanations! Dutch stadiums are gorgeous indeed kay:


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

EPA001 said:


> ^^ A bit more than 11.000 seats. The stadium will grow in phase 1 of the expansion to about 24.500 seats. The next L-shaped expansion (phase 2) will raise the capacity to 36.000 seats. The remaining two second tier corners would be phase 3, making it a 40.000 seats stadium. But *I have heard that the sales of the new seats is going pretty well.* The club may decide to combine the second and third phase to make it a 40.000 seat stadium rigth away.
> 
> Beerbrewer Grolsch of Enschede will be the new stadium sponsor. The official announcement will be made this Friday, May 9th. The stadium will be renamed into Grolsche Veste. A "Veste" comes from the Dutch word "vesting". Free translated it could be understood as "fortress".


All the new available season tickets for this expansion have already sold out. 

Part 2 (from what I've understood that incorporated all 3 remaining corners as well...) will not start before all transportation infrastructure surrounding the stadium is updated also. 40000 people would mean more than 3 times the current capacity... That could make for quite a traffic jam...

But once it's finished it will be another fantastic (and wc 2018 ready  ) stadium for our country.


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## Ni3lS (Jun 29, 2007)

The first post has to be updated seriously.. Euroborg capacity = 21.000 Gelredome = 30.000 DSB = 17.000. Not 30.000... Abe Lenstra is going to have 28.000 and Euroborg 24.000 ( Expansions ) The name of the stadium in Breda = Rat Verlegh and not Mycom.. Can someone edit the first post or someone has to make a new thread


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

Congratulations to FC Twente for going to CL qualifiying round. I wish they can make it to group stages of 32. This will promote the growth of the club and the stadium.


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## CborG (Dec 2, 2003)

Some update pics:





































source: http://www.thuisbijfctwente.nl/bouw/fotos/


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Great timing by Twente with the CL coming up. I hope the rumours are true and it's Martin Jol taking over, they really be moving on to better things as a club.


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## KaSpEr5 (Oct 28, 2007)

^^
It can't be Martin Jol taking over, he has signed with HSV. Prime candidates for Twente are: Adrie Koster, Steve Mclaren and Jorgen Klopp. I don't know if I spelled all the names correctly, but these ones are thought to be the ones with the best chance.


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## www.sercan.de (Aug 10, 2003)

how steep is the new 2nd tier?

looks "spanish" btw


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## fidalgo (Mar 10, 2007)

*The Olympic Hyper-Dome*










What would it mean to the Netherlands if we were to organize the Olympic Games in 2028? How do you ensure that the stadiums used for the Games can still have a proper function afterwards? How do you organize the infrastructure and mobility for the Games? Do you combine all the functions in a single building, or do you spread the Games throughout the country?

MVRDV (in collaboration with the Academy of Architecture Rotterdam and the Berlage Institute) investigated the feasibility and the spatial chances of the 2028 Olympic Games in the Netherlands. Themes such as climate change, water management and energy production were connected in various ways with solutions for stadiums, infrastructure and accommodation for athletes.









Image by Lukas Narutis

more in: http://en.nai.nl/exhibitions/all_ex...lery1/_pid/left1/_rp_left1_elementId/1_250086


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## Iain1974 (Jun 16, 2004)

Someone will need to master anti-gravity first.


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## en1044 (May 4, 2008)

i seriously doubt that ever getting built, its looks like the Champions League stadium


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## Big Texan (Jun 4, 2008)

i dont say imposable allot....... (clears throught) IMPOSABLE!


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## masterpaul (Jun 27, 2007)

bet terorists woud love to bomb that thing, one bomb kill everyone and destroy everthing.


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## theespecialone (Jun 3, 2008)

lol


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## Anberlin (Aug 11, 2007)

LOL. I'd personally hate to be in that 'hyper dome'


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## bing222 (Nov 4, 2007)

That is one of the weirdest domes I have ever seen


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## xlchris (Jun 23, 2006)

Lol The logo is quite nice though


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

Although we can expect spectacular buildings if there would be Dutch olympics, a single building is of course unrealistic and seems more to tease people. 

If there would be held olympics held in 2028, it would be in Amsterdam. Most logical location of the new olympic stadium will be on the water (probably on artificial islands) between Amsterdam and Almere. All public transport build can be re-used very good by both cities. Most things that will be build are reusable. Many locations in the Netherlands will be used, but will still be very close to Amsterdam (simply because it is a small country).


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Wuppeltje said:


> Although we can expect spectacular buildings if there would be Dutch olympics, a single building is of course unrealistic and seems more to tease people.
> 
> If there would be held olympics held in 2028, it would be in Amsterdam. Most logical location of the new olympic stadium will be on the water (probably on artificial islands) between Amsterdam and Almere. All public transport build can be re-used very good by both cities. Most things that will be build are reusable. Many locations in the Netherlands will be used, but will still be very close to Amsterdam (simply because it is a small country).


??? Why??? They can´t even build a proper footballstadium...


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Chances of Amsterdam hosting any time soon are slim, those of other Dutch cities non-existent.


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

skaP187 said:


> ??? Why??? They can´t even build a proper footballstadium...


Of course they can. Your opinion is only based on the ArenA which was the first stadium in Europe with a retractable roof. To dutch standards the grass sucks, but there are enough places where important games have to be played on. Virtually all dutch stadiums have very good grass, so it will be easy to make a good venue with perfect grass. 

The olympic stadium is still in use in Amsterdam, while it is 80 years old (I believe the oldest olympic stadium still in use?). The Netherlands have the 16th economy in the world. For Amsterdam it fits good in the idea for the Amsterdam Metropolitan Area (2,2 million inhabitants) and for the Netherlands for their sportive menthality.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Wuppeltje said:


> The olympic stadium is still in use in Amsterdam, while it is 80 years old (I believe the oldest olympic stadium still in use?).


Not quite, the main stadiums used in 1896, 1900, 1904, 1912, 1920 and 1924 still exist in some form and are in use. The gorgeous Stockholm Olympiastadion (1912) is used a lot more than the Amsterdam one and is almost untouched for instance.


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

I didn't had time to check everything, that is why I had a "?" in it. You are right about the 1912, 1920 and 1924 stadiums. I wouldn't call the others that you mentioned real olympic stadiums, because they aren't build for the modern olympics, but used for it. Especially the 1912 stadium is very nice. 

But my main point stands we can build good stadiums here, and even with the idea that the Amsterdam ArenA is certainly not the perfect stadium, it is used a lot as example. Not just for the bad things, but also for the numorous of good things. Remember that contruction of it started 5 years after the first stadium with a retractable roof, which was a complete failure (the Olympic Stadium in Montreal).


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ The Skydome in Toronto broke ground in 1986 and opened in 1989, about 7 years before the Amsterdam ArenA opened up.

Now the roof in Montreal was never a big success, that is true. But the roof of the Skydome in Toronto is for sure a big succes. The roof concept is completely different from the one used in the Amsterdam ArenA. But if they would have build such a roof on the ArenA in Amsterdam, the grass on the pitch would grow a lot better then it does now!


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

The FC Twente stadium is getting there...










:lol:


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Vak P will get to do some big tifos then...! :hilarious


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

About Grolsch Veste (formerly Arke Stadion) expansion, does anyone have a render for 40K? 

Before 1st expansion - 13,250









After 1st expansion - 24,500









After eventual expansion - 40,000
???


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

skaP187 said:


> The FC Twente stadium is getting there...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This photoshopped picture is of course very nicely done. But a third tier is not in the cards for FC Twente Enschede. On the other hand, the expansion from one to two tiers looks great. When finished it will be one of the better stadiums in the Netherlands, possibly top three!

Now at first the L-shaped expansion will be done at the end of this year. Later, probably next year or the year after that, they can start doing the remaining parts of the stadium which should bring the capacity to 40.000 seats. If the choose to have the main stand to be a bit larger than the other stands, maybe they can reach 42.000 - 43.000 or so.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

A minor expansion (from 20,000 to 22,500) of the Euroborg in Groningen is also currently under way:


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

The expanded Twente ground is going to be steep:


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## www.sercan.de (Aug 10, 2003)

DId they lowered the pitch at groningen?


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## Elensar77 (Apr 24, 2008)

www.sercan.de said:


> DId they lowered the pitch at groningen?


I think no...


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

www.sercan.de said:


> DId they lowered the pitch at groningen?


I don't think they did because the stands were about 1 meter above pitch level before this expansion.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

No, for sure they did not lower the pitch. They used this +1 meter elevation of the former first row to put four new rows in. I think the capacity grows from 20.000 to almost 23.000. With this expansion 2.635 seats will be added.

See also here (out of the Groningen part of the Dutch forum):



njoy said:


> De Euroborg wordt uitgebreid met 2.635 zitplaatsen. Deze worden geplaatst in 4 rijen voor de huidige voorste rij. De uitbreiding is groter dan waar eerst vanuit werd gegaan (2.200 plaatsen). De totale capaciteit van de Euroborg komt met deze vergroting op bijna 23.000 zitplaatsen - zo was zojuist te horen op Radio Noord.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Any news about the expension at AZ Alkmaar?



















http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsSCMF0esvk

The last I heard is that they were having troubles with the licenses...


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

No, it has been remarkable quit regarding the expansion of this quite beautiful new stadium.

Even when AZ Alkmaar had a very disappointing last season, at alomst 17.000 seats, it is sold out every week. I know there are waiting lists for seasontickets. I am not sure what is keeping them from starting the expansion.

The president and owner of the club is a very rich man running a highly successful bank in the Netherlands. Maybe they are awaiting what the financial markets will do in the near future before taking any more financial risks?


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Heerenveen is also upgrading their stadium by filling up the two corners of the main stand (I was not aware of this to be honest):


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## berkshire royal (Jun 11, 2008)

^^
how much is this going to increase capacity as far as I know Heerenveen get very strong attendances and they also have a talent of finding and producing top class strikers have to be one of the best in the world in terms of strikers that have played at Heerenveen. Other than FC Twente are there any other clubs that are increasing capacity for the new season?


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

Go Reading FC! I wish they may succeed in staying at EPL and, furthermore, reaching at European competition zone in upcoming 2008/2009 season :cheers:


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

berkshire royal said:


> ^^
> how much is this going to increase capacity as far as I know Heerenveen get very strong attendances and they also have a talent of finding and producing top class strikers have to be one of the best in the world in terms of strikers that have played at Heerenveen.


I just found out that it actually concerns only one corner because the other one was already filled.










This expansion will create an extra 600 seats, 12 business units (suits) and a new player's lounge. They new capacity will be 26,500 from what I understand. Since they have a waiting list of 4,000 further expansions are in the planning stages.



> Other than FC Twente are there any other clubs that are increasing capacity for the new season?


As previously mentioned FC Groningen is increasing capacity with about 2,600.


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

With a bit of luck we can cross the 20000 league match average with the 3 mentioned expansions and relegated Excelsior being replaced by ADO Den Haag. 

That puts us in touch with the averages in France and Italy and far ahead of all other non top-5 leagues. Pretty good for a nation of only 16.000.000.


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

What's the average attendance of ADO DenHaag in last season?


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

Carrerra said:


> What's the average attendance of ADO DenHaag in last season?


relgated were:

Excelsior (average attendance 3108)









VVV Venlo (average attendance 5938)









promoted

FC Volendam (average attendance 2830 should be around 5000 next year)









ADO Den Haag (average attendance 5118 should be around 10000 next year)


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

ADO has always been very poor concerning attendances. In the season 2006/2007 they came in 16th of the league with a 7.001 attendence. (at that moment they were playing at the highest level)
This beeing the third biggest city in the Netherlands and no competion in the city or very near surrounding, Rotterdam is 25 km from centre to centre, is very poor.
Like Mavn said. Probably around 10 000 next season because they do have a new stadium, which normaly has a positive influance. 
Normaly, but ADO Den Haag is not a normal club.


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## berkshire royal (Jun 11, 2008)

Quintana said:


> I just found out that it actually concerns only one corner because the other one was already filled.
> 
> This expansion will create an extra 600 seats, 12 business units (suits) and a new player's lounge. They new capacity will be 26,500 from what I understand. Since they have a waiting list of 4,000 further expansions are in the planning stages.
> 
> As previously mentioned FC Groningen is increasing capacity with about 2,600.


So with these expansions Groningen will increase to roughly 23,000 and Twente is 24,000. I thought Heerenveen already had a capacity of 26,500 wouldn't an expansion take it too 27,000? If so these are some decent sized stadiums hopefully that AZ expansion can happen soon it looks terrific in its renders. This must surely indicate that financially the Eredivisie is becoming stronger hopefully we will see a renaisance within the league and maybe we will see a PSV or Ajax win the Champions League which would be good to see someone from outside the big 3 league and Holland most certainly has the tradition of winning the CL.
Also i read and saw in the pictures that Heerenveen has a safe standing section is this allowed in Holland and if it is why don’t more clubs have standing areas?



Carrerra said:


> Go Reading FC! I wish they may succeed in staying at EPL and, furthermore, reaching at European competition zone in upcoming 2008/2009 season :cheers:


Thanks it’s always nice to hear good comments about Reading. I wish we had stayed up too unfortunately we didn't. Sadly we couldn't keep our performances up and we didn't spend enough. As a Korean I’m guessing you took a special interest in our team last season when we had Seol Ki-Heon in our team, he really was a terrific player but unfortunately his undoubted talent was hampered by laziness and a lack of work ethic but in terms of pure talent he was probably the best player i have ever seen in a Reading shirt. Here's to promotion straight back :cheers: hopefully


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

berkshire royal said:


> Thanks it’s always nice to hear good comments about Reading. I wish we had stayed up too unfortunately we didn't. Sadly we couldn't keep our performances up and we didn't spend enough. As a Korean I’m guessing you took a special interest in our team last season when we had Seol Ki-Heon in our team, he really was a terrific player but unfortunately his undoubted talent was hampered by laziness and a lack of work ethic but in terms of pure talent he was probably the best player i have ever seen in a Reading shirt. Here's to promotion straight back :cheers: hopefully


Sorry. I was just forgetting the fact your club ended up getting relegated last season when I said *'I wish they may succeed in staying at EPL and, furthermore, reaching at European competition zone in upcoming 2008/2009 season'* I wish they could do it next, next season. Of course this is based on the expectation that they will get back to EPL after finishing 2008/2009 season :lol:


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## Sieske (Jul 19, 2008)

Standing areas are allowed in some pilot projects and they must have a very small size. I think it was at most 1000 people standing. So, for many clubs that's not enough and moreover the clubs don't like to add seats for European matches. By the way, in stadiums like the Amsterdam Arena, in which there are clap seats (is that proper English?) it's very comfortable to stand in front of your seat during the match and sit down during the 15 minutes break.

I saw this picture in a Dutch sub-forum. Does anyone know what's going on in the Philips stadium? It looks like they increase the capacity of the business boxes (and decrease ordinary capacity).


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

berkshire royal said:


> Also i read and saw in the pictures that Heerenveen has a safe standing section is this allowed in Holland and if it is why don’t more clubs have standing areas?


It is allowed in the Netherlands.
At the half of last season NAC Breda (my club ) also got 500 standing places.
Now on the other fanatic side, we get 1000 standing places.
You are allowed to have as much standing places as you want, but if you have more than 1000, it should be seperated by for example a fence.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Sieske said:


> I saw this picture in a Dutch sub-forum. Does anyone know what's going on in the Philips stadium? It looks like they increase the capacity of the business boxes (and decrease ordinary capacity).


Those business seats are being renovated. This means that (if I remember correctly) two rows of seating will be removed. I'm not sure whether this lowers the total capacity because the number business seats might grow and thus compensate for this.


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## berkshire royal (Jun 11, 2008)

FlyingDutchman said:


> It is allowed in the Netherlands.
> At the half of last season NAC Breda (my club ) also got 500 standing places.
> Now on the other fanatic side, we get 1000 standing places.
> You are allowed to have as much standing places as you want, but if you have more than 1000, it should be seperated by for example a fence.


Interesting so correct me if I’m wrong basically you are only allowed a maximum of 1,000 standing places in any one section of the ground but if you wish you may put other sections of terracing but in different areas of the ground. This seems a bit complicated and strenuous is safe terracing in a trial period or something at the moment in Holland is it possible that in the future the terracing sections could be allowed to have increased capacities?


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

berkshire royal said:


> Interesting so correct me if I’m wrong basically you are only allowed a maximum of 1,000 standing places in any one section of the ground but if you wish you may put other sections of terracing but in different areas of the ground. This seems a bit complicated and strenuous is safe terracing in a trial period or something at the moment in Holland is it possible that in the future the terracing sections could be allowed to have increased capacities?


Yes, you can put it in any section of the ground except the away stand.
If you wish even more places you can also put it in the same area of the ground (for example the stand behind the goal) but it should be seperated from the other terracing stand.
Hope you understand what I mean.


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## berkshire royal (Jun 11, 2008)

FlyingDutchman said:


> Yes, you can put it in any section of the ground except the away stand.
> If you wish even more places you can also put it in the same area of the ground (for example the stand behind the goal) but it should be seperated from the other terracing stand.
> Hope you understand what I mean.


I'm pretty sure I understand what you mean but it seems a bit complicated and strange rule can you tell me why that rule is made like this? And can you tell me which club has the largest standing area?


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

berkshire royal said:


> I'm pretty sure I understand what you mean but it seems a bit complicated and strange rule can you tell me why that rule is made like this? And can you tell me which club has the largest standing area?


It's for safety issues, so it won't happen that there are too many people on the same place. It could get to busy and people can get stuck and people could die.

Heerenveen has 1000 standing places, and NAC Breda will get a 1000 this summer and has already got 500 but that's at the other end of the stadium. These are the only 2 clubs with standing area's in the Dutch Eredivisie as far as I know.
So they are also the clubs with the largest standing areas 
I'm leaving the spain tomorrow so won't be able to answer more questions, if you have anything more, pm me, because I'll probably only read my pm's.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Update from Groningen:



















Update from Enschede:


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## www.sercan.de (Aug 10, 2003)

This one is also my fav 
http://www.ad.nl/multimedia/archive/00172/kuipstadionpark_172159a.jpg

So those are just "masterplans".
Looks like there is also an arena next to the stadium?


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ That will be the 400 meter speed skating oval. With stands it is also usable for several other things like indoor athletics, small exhibitions, conventions who do not need the large stadium, etc.

Across the street there is already the Topsportcentrum. The largest hall of it can accomodate 2.500-3.000 spectators. It will be expanded soon with a couple of smaller halls and other sport and educational facilities. It will be 7 stories high and this expansion will cost @ 45 million. A picture of it can be found here: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=648163

B.T.W.: the current stadium is a monument. So after the construction of the new stadium is finished it will be redeveloped to accomodate something else. Right now they are thinking about houses and/or, if you extend the current business units all around, also small offices. Also houses could be build on or close to the pitch. But that will happen after 2018. If the WC-2018 will be hosted by Belgium and The Netherlands, Rotterdam will be the city with two stadiums. The current one for smaller first round group games, the new one to host the bigger games including the final.


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

EPA001 said:


> ^^ That will be the 400 meter speed skating oval. With stands it is also usable for several other things like indoor athletics, small exhibitions, conventions who do not need the large stadium, etc.
> 
> Across the street there is already the Topsportcentrum. The largest hall of it can accomodate 2.500-3.000 spectators. It will be expanded soon with a couple of smaller halls and other sport and educational facilities. It will be 7 stories high and this expansion will cost @ 45 million. A picture of it can be found here: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=648163
> 
> B.T.W.: the current stadium is a monument. So after the construction of the new stadium is finished it will be redeveloped to accomodate something else. Right now they are thinking about houses and/or, if you extend the current business units all around, also small offices. Also houses could be build on or close to the pitch. But that will happen after 2018. If the WC-2018 will be hosted by Belgium and The Netherlands, Rotterdam will be the city with two stadiums. The current one for smaller first round group games, the new one to host the bigger games including the final.


I read a lot of "certainties" here...


"Rotterdam will host the final"

Let's just wait and see shall we. Amsterdam will probably have either expanded the Arena, or build a new stadium. This is, however, the most "certain" of all since a new stadium will probably be build for the OG bid and is pehaps not finished before 2018

"The stadium will be for the 2028 OG"

Maybe in their wet dreams... IF Holland gets the OG in 2028 it will be in Amsterdam. If you look at all the research that has been done and official statements that have been made they all point to Amsterdam as host city.

In my personal opinion I also think that Rotterdam wouldn't stand a chance. Amsterdam is a long shot as well, but has at least a fighting chance.

"De Kuip will be the second 2018 WC venue for Rotterdam"

Won't happen. There are already 6 cities fighting to be one of the 5 possible host cities. Amsterdam, Rotterdam and probably Eindhoven are certainties. Alkmaar, Heerenveen en Enschede will fight for the other 2 places. And then we haven't even considered the 3rd and 4th largest cities in the Netherlands The Hague and Utrecht. 

Only in the event that Belgium screws up completely and we would get 6 or 7 the Kuip is in with a chance. It also wouldn't be logical. For the OG bid everybody is talking about spreading it over as large an area as possible. I can't imagine that for the WC they would do the complete opposite... The close proximity of both stadiums won't help either. And the 50000 capacity alone won't be big enough to "overpower" a 44000 stadium in another city. Local governments in Heerenveen, Enschede and perhaps other places will invest in stadiums also to become a host city. They won't be left in the cold over a second stadium somewhere else


I do think that the propositions are wonderful for Rotterdam, the area and Feyenoord. My personal favorite would be the "stadionpark" proposition.


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## Perth4life (Mar 30, 2003)

i like that last proposal.


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## Kuvvaci (Jan 1, 2005)

I think they are not final design.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

mavn said:


> I read a lot of "certainties" here...
> 
> 
> "Rotterdam will host the final"
> ...


I am not so sure that Amsterdam will build anonther football stadium. They have done serious studies about expanding the Amsterdam ArenA. An expansion up to just over 70.000 seats is expensive, but feasable. The Arena is only 12 years old, the Kuip is now 72 years old. That is a big difference!

So with the current proposed capacity, if the WC-2018 comes to Belgium and The Netherlands, Rotterdam will most likely hold the final! It is also a "neutral" city positioned just between the capitals of Belgium (Brussels) and The Netherlands (Amsterdam). 

I agree with you on the Olympic Games chances for Rotterdam, they are very slim in my opinion, but they take the possibility into the design process. That will not hurt the stadium plan at all. If the Olympics ever make it to The Netherlands again, I am quite convinced that the event will be hosted mainly in the Amsterdam Area.

The present Kuip being a possible second venue for the WC-2018 has been publicly stated by the KNVB (Dutch FA). It is not something I made up. Remember that the WC-2014 or WC-2018 will possibly see 32 countries participating. Therefore, more stadiums are needed if FIFA decides to go ahead with that plan. However, no decision has been taken yet on this topic as far as I know.


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

for those who are interested, a picture of the construction of standing places in the Breda stadium.


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## Kuvvaci (Jan 1, 2005)

^^ are there standing only area at the stadiums in Netherlands?


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ No, SC Heerenveen also has some terraces in her stadium. But usually the stadiums in The Netherlands are all seaters.


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## trmather (Feb 7, 2008)

FlyingDutchman said:


> for those who are interested, a picture of the construction of standing places in the Breda stadium.


Now you see, that'll just make the stadium look messy.


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

trmather said:


> Now you see, that'll just make the stadium look messy.


The picture was taken while it was under construction, so it will probably look a little bit better now. (the last yellow seats will be replaced with blue onces I think.)
Next year their will be a renovation and expansion of the stadium, and they might change all the seats in yellow/black onces, so it will look a little bit better.

Finally, when the game is going on, you won't see the concrete and seats, because the stadium is almost sold out with season tickets. Their are only 99 tickets for sale, but those are on the other stands. I think it's more important how it looks(or sounds  ) when there is a match than when it isn't used!


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## SirOJ (Sep 2, 2008)

Latest pic from Grolsch Veste


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

EPA001 said:


> I am not so sure that Amsterdam will build anonther football stadium. They have done serious studies about expanding the Amsterdam ArenA. An expansion up to just over 70.000 seats is expensive, but feasable. The Arena is only 12 years old, the Kuip is now 72 years old. That is a big difference!
> 
> So with the current proposed capacity, if the WC-2018 comes to Belgium and The Netherlands, Rotterdam will most likely hold the final! It is also a "neutral" city positioned just between the capitals of Belgium (Brussels) and The Netherlands (Amsterdam).


It's definitely the most likely, and it's the front runner, but 2018 is still a long way ahead. Let's just wait and see.



EPA001 said:


> I agree with you on the Olympic Games chances for Rotterdam, they are very slim in my opinion, but they take the possibility into the design process. That will not hurt the stadium plan at all. If the Olympics ever make it to The Netherlands again, I am quite convinced that the event will be hosted mainly in the Amsterdam Area.


The Arena won't be the main stadium. They would have to completely rebuild it to fit an Athletics track. The area is also developed way too much to act as an Olympic complex. My guess would be that it would serve as ether a football or (field) hockey venue in an OG bid. Or perhaps a baketball/gymnastics one like the Geogia Dome was used in 1996.



EPA001 said:


> The present Kuip being a possible second venue for the WC-2018 has been publicly stated by the KNVB (Dutch FA). It is not something I made up. Remember that the WC-2014 or WC-2018 will possibly see 32 countries participating. Therefore, more stadiums are needed if FIFA decides to go ahead with that plan. However, no decision has been taken yet on this topic as far as I know.


You're confused with the EURO championships where the amount of teams may be increased from 16 to 24. The WC has had 32 teams since 1998. I' m pretty confident FIFA won't increase the amount of teams to 40 or 48.

The bid would consist of 10 to 12 venues. All official statements have indicated 10. Since Belgium will deliver 5 (at best...), Holland will have to provide 5 as well. I don't know when the statements were made, but Heerenveen, Enschede, Eindhoven and Alkmaar will almost certainly have a WC ready stadium in 2018. Perhaps it was mentioned as a possibility at the time. A year ago, No real plans existed in those 4 cities. I can imagine that the kuip was seen as a likely candidate at the time. Unless there aren't enough stadiums in the rest of the country I can't see it happening that the kuip will get a spot.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

mavn said:


> The Arena won't be the main stadium. They would have to completely rebuild it to fit an Athletics track. The area is also developed way too much to act as an Olympic complex. My guess would be that it would serve as ether a football or (field) hockey venue in an OG bid. Or perhaps a baketball/gymnastics one like the Geogia Dome was used in 1996.


In this respect I was writing about the new Feyenoord stadium in Rotterdam and not about the ArenA in Amsterdam. The Arena will never host an athletics track, the construction is unsuitable for that. About that you are right!



mavn said:


> You're confused with the EURO championships where the amount of teams may be increased from 16 to 24. The WC has had 32 teams since 1998. I' m pretty confident FIFA won't increase the amount of teams to 40 or 48.


Oops, you got me there. I indeed confused the two tournements. My bad and I stand corrected!


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

EPA001 said:


> In this respect I was writing about the new Feyenoord stadium in Rotterdam and not about the ArenA in Amsterdam. The Arena will never host an athletics track, the construction is unsuitable for that. About that you are right!


I just realize I read "area" as "arena"... That's why...


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## Kuvvaci (Jan 1, 2005)

SirOJ said:


> Latest pic from Grolsch Veste


how old is this stadium?


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

Kuvvaci said:


> how old is this stadium?


It was constructed in 1998.


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## berkshire royal (Jun 11, 2008)

SirOJ said:


> Latest pic from Grolsch Veste


Looks like work is nearly finished and it's looking good, who is the face in the stand? And when will the stadium work be completed?


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## SirOJ (Sep 2, 2008)

berkshire royal said:


> Looks like work is nearly finished and it's looking good, who is the face in the stand? And when will the stadium work be completed?


I believe it's club icon Epi Drost, who played for Twente in - I believe - the 70's.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

Yes, that is about correct. He played there from 1966 to 1980!

BTW: Saturday will be the first game of FC Twente in the expanded stadium which now is called the Grolsch Veste! The next expansions are set for 2009 and probably 2010-2011. Then they will be able to seat 44.000 fans!


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

EPA001 said:


> Yes, that is about correct. He played there from 1966 to 1980!
> 
> BTW: Saturday will be the first game of FC Twente in the expanded stadium which now is called the Grolsch Veste! The next expansions are set for 2009 and probably 2010-2011. Then they will be able to seat 44.000 fans!


Nothing official has been released about that. At the press meeting at the start of the season they talked about it (dutch). There is also an interview somewhere in which he talked about the 4th and final stand. I can't seem to find it...

Expanding on that side will be a lot harder btw then the other 3 because the stand already has a attached structure, and a railway nearby:










First they will fill the open spaces on the outside of the stadium behind the goal (the one that says "vak-p") with commercial outlets. After that, the second tier will be formed into a "U" shape by extending it to the other side behind the goal. This would give the stadium a capacity somewhere in the region of 30000. Nothing official has been said about a second tier on the remaining stand. Partly because Twente will want to wait for an official WC bid. If that happens a lot of extra government funds will probably come available. They'll definitely wait for that. I just found this when I was looking for the video I talked about. "Enschede has officially stated to be a candidate host city and although the expansion to 44000 is the full responsibility of the club, they will assist them as much as they can"


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

From the Dutch topic about this stadium:



Skycrap said:


> http://player.nos.nl/index.php/media/play/tcmid/tcm:5-417734/category/sport/
> 
> Super mooi filmpje van de nos, zo te zien, gister opgenomen!
> Het beste is hij te bekijken op groot formaat, zie knopje naast de tijdbalk.


In this TV-report the chairman of FC Twente, Joop Munsterman, confirms that they are planning the second expansion (the other short stand behind the goal) to start after this season 2008-2009 will be finished. Then they have a capacity of about 34.000 seats. The final expansion (the present main stand) will bring the capacity up to about 43.000-44.000 seats. No envisioned start date has been reported yet. Also I have not seen any renders for this last expansion. When finished the stadium is ready for the WC-2018 if it is going to be hosted by Belgium and The Netherlands in 2018.


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## www.sercan.de (Aug 10, 2003)

And you still can add a 3rd tier


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

Yes you could. But I seriously doubt if FC Twente will need a third tier. That (a full version of it) would bring them to more then 70.000 seats. It is unlikely that they will attract that many spectators. 44.000 is already almost unbelievable for FC Twente if you keep in mind where they come from (first the old Diekman stadion and now the Arke stadion that has been renamed Grolsch Veste). But Feyenoord Rotterdam and Ajax Amsterdam will have more then 70.000 seats in the foreseeable future for sure!


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

EPA001 said:


> Yes you could. But I seriously doubt if TC Twente will need a third tier. That (a full version of it) would bring them to more then 70.000 seats. It is unlikely that they will attract that many spectators. 44.000 is already almost unbelievable for FC Twente if you keep in mind where they come from (first the old Diekman stadion and now the Arke stadion that has been renamed Grolsch Veste). But Feyenoord Rotterdam and Ajax Amsterdam will have more then 70.000 seats in the foreseeable future for sure!


When teams like VVV and Heracles are seriously talking about stadiums of 20000, 70000 for Twente doesn't even sound that ridiculous anymore... :nuts:

Seriously though, 44000 is huge for a non top 3 team. Not long ago it was unthinkable. Right now it's actually viable. If you look at the attendences of 15 years ago the growth has been immense and it's still rising... 

92/93 season (8.676 average)

1 PSV 25.368 
2 Feyenoord 23.192
3 Ajax 21.429
4 FC Groningen 14.427	
5 FC Twente 7.276
6 MVV 7.166
7 Cambuur Leeuwarden 7.103
8 Vitesse 6.859
9 FC Utrecht 6.776	
10 Willem II 6.450
11 Go Ahead Eagles 6.435	
12 Sparta 4.547
13 FC Volendam 3.850
14 Fortuna Sittard 3.612 
15 Roda JC 3.482 
16 FC Den Bosch 3.324
17 RKC Waalwijk 2.674 
18 Dordrecht '90 2.199 

07/08 (average 18.732)

1 Ajax 49.125
2 Feyenoord 44.618
3 PSV 33.512
4 SC Heerenveen 25.224
5 FC Utrecht 20.360
6 Vitesse 19.844
7 FC Groningen 19.336
8 AZ Alkmaar 16.431
9 NAC Breda 15.699
10 Roda JC 14.911
11 FC Twente 13.179
12 Willem II 13.022
13 NEC 12.156
14 De Graafschap 12.129
15 Sparta Rotterdam 10.186
16 Heracles Almelo 8.398
17 VVV Venlo 5.938
18 Excelsior 3.108

pretty amazing. And I wouldn't be surprised if that average number would be near 28000 in 15 years time if you look at stadium plans...

Ajax to 70000+
Feyenoord 80000+
PSV 47500
Twente 44000
Heerenveen 44000
AZ ~40000
Groningen 35000
NAC Breda 20000+
NEC Nijmegen 20000
Sparta ~20000
Heracles~20000
VVV ~20000
De Graafschap ~15000


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ You could very well be proven right at that time. Absolutely amazing numbers which have also exceed my imaginations for Dutch football.

Two points about your list:

1. If NEC Nijmegen will double the size of the stands (capacity is now 12.500), would they not grow to a maximum capacity of about 26.000 seats? (Here I am taking the bigger corner stands already into account). Or are the plans only for an increase to about 20.000 seats?

2. The plans for FC Utrecht for an all new 50.000 seater are maybe in refridgerator, but with the latest take-over of the club by an investor who has ties to building companies in the Netherlands, and with a possible WC-2018 underway, maybe that plan is still a possibility. Althoug I am expecting them only to go forward with that plan if the WC-2018 is really awarded to Belgium and The Netherlands. A large economic centre like Utrecht is than probably very eager to play a hosting role during such an event?


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

EPA001 said:


> ^^ You could very well be proven right at that time. Absolutely amazing numbers which have also exceed my imaginations for Dutch football.
> 
> About your list: if NEC Nijmegen will double the size of the stands (capacity is now 12.500), would they not grow to a maximum capacity of about 26.000 seats? (Here I am taking the bigger corner stands already into account). Or are the plans only for an increase to about 20.000 seats?


You can find their official plans here (dutch). They were presented late last year. I believe that the timeline has already been shifted by 2 or 3 years though... I think the plans look lovely and are a welcome change from all the "10 to 15 thousand box stadiums" that we have (and their current stadium belongs to...).


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

Thanks mavn for the link to the NEC Nijmegen plans to upgrade the Nieuw Goffert stadium. I am sorry you replied earlier then before my edited post was accepted by the forum. But I had a very, very long response time on the forum before my edited post was finally accepted. (I thought the connection was going to crash). Again, sorry about that.


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

EPA001 said:


> Thanks mavn for the link to the NEC Nijmegen plans to upgrade the Nieuw Goffert stadium. I am sorry you replied earlier then before my edited post was accepted by the forum. But I had a very, very long response time on the forum before my edited post was finally accepted. (I thought the connection was going to crash). Again, sorry about that.


I've had the same problem here (a server 500 something error...)


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

www.sercan.de said:


> And you still can add a 3rd tier


Freak!!!


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

mavn said:


> You can find their official plans here (dutch). They were presented late last year. I believe that the timeline has already been shifted by 2 or 3 years though... I think the plans look lovely and are a welcome change from all the "10 to 15 thousand box stadiums" that we have (and their current stadium belongs to...).


Even beeing a fan of Vitesse I have to say that these planns look nice. I knew them ofcourse a long time ago. Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer...angel


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

EPA001 said:


> 2. The plans for FC Utrecht for an all new 50.000 seater are maybe in refridgerator, but with the latest take-over of the club by an *investor who has ties to building companies* in the Netherlands, and with a possible WC-2018 underway, maybe that plan is still a possibility. Althoug I am expecting them only to go forward with that plan if the WC-2018 is really awarded to Belgium and The Netherlands. A large economic centre like Utrecht is than probably very eager to play a hosting role during such an event?


Not realy building companies. He used to own or still owns Smit Tak (or something), the company that for example got that Russian submarine boat out of the depths of the sea. 
He made it very clear that he´s a businessman who intends to earn money and not spend, atleast not like crazy. 
Allthough I am with you on the fact that Utrect has the potential. I think they first need to get their team going a little bit. As the stadium at this moment is big enough and not sold out during ´normall´ games.


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## Hersenschors (May 25, 2008)




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## NickRivers (Sep 12, 2007)

^^
The extension of the stadium has stayed very well... kay:


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## trmather (Feb 7, 2008)

Hersenschors said:


>


This reminds me of a smaller Old Trafford almost.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

The Grolsch Veste saw its first game yesterday:


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

A quote from the Dutch forum:



kevinluttje said:


> Eerst willen ze inderdaad de andere korte zijde uitbreiden. Daar willen ze na dit seizoen mee beginnen, dus ik vermoed dat dat over 2 jaar klaar is!
> 
> Foto's van gisteren! Oh oh oh wat was het gaaf!


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## Oh?! (Jan 28, 2008)

1.









2.


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

Atmosphere:


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Why do Twente fans always imitate Liverpool?


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Quintana said:


> Why do Twente fans always imitate Liverpool?


That song is used my many clubs in Europe. It used to be used by lots of clubs' fans in England, too - there's a clip on Youtube somewhere of Man Utd fans singing it at a cup final in the 70s (or maybe 80s). But then Liverpool stuck the words on their crest and claimed it as their own, and so no-one else sings it anymore.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Wasn't Gerry of Gerry & the Pacemakers actually an Everton fan?


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## canarywondergod (Apr 24, 2006)

CorliCorso said:


> That song is used my many clubs in Europe. It used to be used by lots of clubs' fans in England, too - there's a clip on Youtube somewhere of Man Utd fans singing it at a cup final in the 70s (or maybe 80s). But then Liverpool stuck the words on their crest and claimed it as their own, and so no-one else sings it anymore.


celtic still use it regularly


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## NickRivers (Sep 12, 2007)

Oh?! said:


>



:drool:


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

NickRivers said:


> :drool:


I think Fc Twente fans are one of the best in the world. Otherwise, ask the Arsenal supporters what they think of Fc Twente fans. The fanatics are called VAK-P. Search for it on youtube. 

Now with the new stadium, they wil become even better. There is more room for bigger stunts, like the one on the photo. 

Ow.. besides that, the next summer this stadium will be expand again, then untill 34.000 seats. When i come across with some renders, I will post them or make a new thread. 

Turn your sound off


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Skycrap said:


> I think Fc Twente fans are one of the best in the world. Otherwise, ask the Arsenal supporters what they think of Fc Twente fans. The fanatics are called VAK-P. Search for it on youtube.
> 
> Now with the new stadium, they wil become even better. There is more room for bigger stunts, like the one on the photo.
> 
> ...


I second that!!!!! accidentally I didnt turned it of.. j***s f**k thats bad music...

Whats going on in Enschede is good for the whole of dutch football. What AZ was chasing 5 years ago, Twente builds. Keep it going. Club, supporters, players, all they are ready for it. As long as it is responsibly done. Financial troubles are a shame for this club...


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

The last one


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Good photo, good stadium, good club.


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## Oh?! (Jan 28, 2008)

The new extension, planned for april 2009:


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## Vilak (Mar 31, 2006)

Oh?! said:


> The new extension, planned for april 2009:


It look like Old trafford wichi is great as OT is one of the best stadium in the world.


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## Hersenschors (May 25, 2008)

http://www.vimeo.com/1763998

Film from the second tire above vak-p...


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

It seemes pretty much sure that FC Groningen will extend their new stadium to 35 000. Tomorow there will be a presentation of the planns.
It will be done at their current stadium, so building a new stadium seemes to be off.


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## Hersenschors (May 25, 2008)

Atmosphere at FC Twente-Stade Rennais

http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=sfz1Nypv2X4


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

skaP187 said:


> It seemes pretty much sure that FC Groningen will extend their new stadium to 35 000. Tomorow there will be a presentation of the planns.
> It will be done at their current stadium, so building a new stadium seemes to be off.


Did the presentation occur?


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Carrerra said:


> Did the presentation occur?


The townhall blocked it more or less... They do not want to invest in one or another way in a expansion. Cheered to early...
The townhall of Groningen is owner of the stadium and the club renting. It is going to be a pollitical game which is a shame because the need is there.
I think FC Groningen will pressure the townhall by ´looking´over the cityborders and build a new stadium. Not that they will realy do that, but there loosing a lot of money at this moment.

This is sooooo f..... Dutch!!!


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## Joop20 (Jun 29, 2004)

skaP187 said:


> The townhall blocked it more or less... They do not want to invest in one or another way in a expansion. Cheered to early...
> The townhall of Groningen is owner of the stadium and the club renting. It is going to be a pollitical game which is a shame because the need is there.
> I think FC Groningen will pressure the townhall by ´looking´over the cityborders and build a new stadium. Not that they will realy do that, but there loosing a lot of money at this moment.
> 
> This is sooooo f..... Dutch!!!


Nothing Dutch about it. New stadiums or expansions get delayed by local or national governments all the time all around the world. Just look at Club Brugge's new stadium, Anderlecht's new stadium, Perth's new stadium, Auckland's new stadium, etc etc. 
Besides, I don't think the townhall should be investing any money in this. FC Groningen has one of the best stadiums in the country, if they wish to expand it, they should pay for it themselves IMO.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

The problem is that the stadium is owned by the city and the club is just the tenant afaik.


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

Quintana said:


> The problem is that the stadium is owned by the city and the club is just the tenant afaik.


The same applies to nearly every football club all over the world, except very few happy ones which have their own stadiums. Basically football stadium is too expensive for private clubs to own...


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## Mathijzzz (Jan 30, 2008)

The new sports arena in Apeldoorn is finished. The omnisportcentrum is the only A-certificate holder for organising WC and EC indoor athletics and indoor cycling in The Netherlands. In the youtube movie you can see an overview from the new Omnisportcentrum.


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## Patrickje (Dec 21, 2007)

The capacity of clubs in The Netherlands, that play in the "eredivisie" 2008/2009 :cheers:



1 Ajax - 51638
2 Feyenoord - 51137


3 PSV - 35000


4 Vitesse - 26600
5 Sc. Heerenveen - 26100
6 Fc Utrecht - 24500
7 Fc Twente - 24244
8 Fc Groningen - 22329


9 Roda. JC - 19979
10 Nac - 17078
11 AZ - 17023
12 Ado Den Haag - 15000
13 Willem II - 14700
14 De Graafschap - 12600
15 Nec - 12500
16 Sparta - 11026


17 Heracles Almelo - 8500
18 Fc. Volendam - 6200


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

The future capacity of clubs in The Netherlands, that will (probably/possibly) play in the "eredivisie" 2016/2017 

1 Ajax - 70,000+ (now 51.638, expansion of the Amsterdam ArenA)
2 Feyenoord - 80.000+ (now 51.137, a totally new Feyenoord Stadium in Rotterdam)

3 PSV - 47.000 maximum (now 35.000, another expansion of the Philips Stadium in Eindhoven)

4 Vitesse - 26.600
5 Sc. Heerenveen - 44.000 (now 26.100, another expansion of the Abe Lenstra Stadium)
6 Fc Utrecht - 24.500
7 Fc Twente - 44.000 (now 24.244, another expansion of the Grolsch Veste in Enschede)
8 Fc Groningen - 35.000 (now 22.329, another expansion of the Euroborg stadium)
9 Roda. JC - 30.000? (now 19.979, expansion of the Parkstad Limburg stadium in Kerkrade)
10 Nac - 25.000+? (now 17.078, expansion of the Rat Verlegh stadium in Breda, first stage of the expansion to start within two years?)
11 AZ - 30.000 (now 17.023, expansion of the DSB stadium in Alkmaar)
12 Ado Den Haag - 15000
13 Willem II - 14700 (they are thinking about a new stadium for Tilburg, nothing solid yet)
14 De Graafschap - 18.000 (now 12.600, a new totally new stadium will be built in Doetinchem)
15 Nec - 26.000 (now 12.500, the Goffert stadium in Nijmegen will get a full second tier)
16 Sparta - 20.000 (now 11.026, a totally new Kasteel stadium in Rotterdam is in the plans)
17 Heracles Almelo - 15.000 (now 8.500, the Polman stadium will be expanded)


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## likasz (Sep 4, 2008)

1 Ajax - 70,000+ (now 51.638, expansion of the Amsterdam ArenA)
2 Feyenoord - 80.000+ (now 51.137, a totally new Feyenoord Stadium in Rotterdam)
It's not too be for 15mln people in the NL?


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

EPA001 said:


> The future capacity of clubs in The Netherlands, that will (probably/possibly) play in the "eredivisie" 2016/2017
> 
> *1 Ajax - 70,000+ (now 51.638, expansion of the Amsterdam ArenA)*
> 2 Feyenoord - 80.000+ (now 51.137, a totally new Feyenoord Stadium in Rotterdam)
> ...


All the stadiums which i made ´vet´ are not to be taken serious at this moment. Drawings everybody can make.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ FC Twente will increase the stadium to 33.000 starting summer of 2009. That is already a certainty.

Also FC Groningen will seriously start construction in 2009/2010, that is also certain.

Also the Graafschap is very serious about a new stadium, they are planning everything right now, and hope to be starting construction in 2010.

PSV is waiting for a possible WC-2018 decision, that could have an effect on the size of their expansion, but architectural drawings have already been made, though not yet published.


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## Saentown (Nov 7, 2002)

skaP187 said:


> All the stadiums which i made ´vet´ are not to be taken serious at this moment. Drawings everybody can make.


Ajax 70.000
Nec 22.500
Nac 20.000
Sparta 18.000 

Are sure very serious.. They all 4 already have the green light from the local community.

Volendam is building a new south stand and the corners wild be build. They will increase the stadium till 12.000


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

12,000 for Volendam :rofl: 

They'll be lucky if they fill half of it...


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

EPA001 said:


> ^^ FC Twente will increase the stadium to 33.000 starting summer of 2009. That is already a certainty.
> 
> Also FC Groningen will seriously start construction in 2009/2010, that is also certain.
> 
> ...


FC Groningen plann has just been shot down by the townhall a couple of weeks ago. They have big financing problems at this moment, because the townhall, which is owner, do not want to invest at this moemen.

PSV is nothing sure, only that it´s technicaly possible (what is not?, financualy is something else and they do not know yet.


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

According to the plans, NAC Breda wil expend this summer to 20 000, more information in November (not sure could also be december)


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

skaP187 said:


> FC Groningen plann has just been shot down by the townhall a couple of weeks ago. They have big financing problems at this moment, because the townhall, which is owner, do not want to invest at this moment.


The plans have *not been shot down*. The City will *not* contribute to the financing of the expansion. That is something completely different as the plans being shot down.

That is not the case, FC Groningen, at the moment the number 1 club in the Dutch league, will go ahead with this plan due to the waiting lists for season ticket holders and the waiting list in the business area. These will finance the expansion, not the city.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

EPA001 said:


> The plans have *not been shot down*. The City will *not* contribute to the financing of the expansion. That is something completely different as the plans being shot down.
> 
> That is not the case, FC Groningen, at the moment the number 1 club in the Dutch league, will go ahead with this plan due to the waiting lists for season ticket holders and the waiting list in the business area. These will finance the expansion, not the city.


If the townhall owns the stadium and they don´t want to invest in an expansion. To me it seems pretty shot down, at the moment at least.
I do not see FC Groningen pay for it by it selve.
Eventualy they may will, but I think it is just to speak of a major delay at least... To say that they start construction in 2009/2010 is based on nothing.


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## Dzwonsson (Feb 9, 2008)

Seantown said:


> Ajax 70.000


What? Ajax's gonna build new stadium? Or maybe they wanna increase ArenA? I've never heard about plans like these ones, so your information made me truly shocked.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ It is going to be an expansion of the Amsterdam ArenA. Since the minimum capacity to host a CL-Final is raised by UEFA to 70.000 seats, Ajax and the city of Amsterdam want the 70.000+ to be able to be hosting a CL-final again.

It will be a complicated expansion where they have to raise the roof, etc. But it is feasible, studies done by Arcadis and the Amsterdam Arena have shown this. When the time is right this expansion will be done. It is most likely also not related to the WC-2018 which could be hosted by Belgium and the Netherlands (I know, it is a long shot!).

Since the new Feyenoord Stadium in Rotterdam (80.000+) should be ready in 2016 at the latest (also not WC-2018 related), I expect the expansion of the Amsterdam ArenA to be done also around that time!


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## Hersenschors (May 25, 2008)

Take a look inside in the beautiful rebuild Grolsch Veste!

http://periview.nl/095_fc_twente/grolsch_veste/


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## Bobby3 (Jun 26, 2007)

Will Ajax get rid of that moat thing to expand the capacity?


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## Patrickje (Dec 21, 2007)

Render's for the new Volendam stadion, they will replace the jaap jonktribune, then the height off all 4 stands will be the same.
And they will fill up 2 off the 4 corners in the stadion, I like the plans, But I guess it will stay the smallest stadion in the "eredivisie".


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## www.sercan.de (Aug 10, 2003)

Pillars?

Looks more like a Fan project made at sketchup


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## Patrickje (Dec 21, 2007)

www.sercan.de said:


> Pillars?
> 
> Looks more like a Fan project made at sketchup



sorry I missed that one, it's from the official site, 
http://www.fcvolendam.nl/index2.htm

page 2 in the middle 
date: 23-10-08


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Horrible... There is no need for pillars these days... The fact that the other three stands have them doesn't mean you have to use them for the fourth stand as well.


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## Zeno2 (Jan 22, 2006)

A stadium with more pillars than spectators... :nuts:


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

Zeno2 said:


> A stadium with more pillars than spectators... :nuts:


I don't blame the fans for not going. Why pay to stare at an I-beam?


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## likasz (Sep 4, 2008)

Could tell us something about Amsterdam Dome?


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## Details (Nov 20, 2006)

*Amsterdam Arena*









*Philips Stadium*









*Gelredome*









*Euroborg Stadium*









*DSB Stadium*









*Parkstadt Limburg Stadium*









http://www.flickr.com/photos/cinevideogroup/sets/72157604588059795/with/2878722981/


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## renco (Dec 5, 2005)

great shots,I love Netherlands stadiums :applause:


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

Fantastic photos! Thanks, Details


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## willem s (Nov 7, 2007)

100.000+ when belgium netherlands are organise the worls cup for the new feyenoord stadium


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## xlchris (Jun 23, 2006)

^And maby 80.000+ for the Amsterdam Arena then


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## Dzwonsson (Feb 9, 2008)

WTF?! 100k or more? Don't you think you crossed judicious border of your own imagination?  I know, everyone wants to get quite big stadium in own country, however if Feyenoord will get as arena as you wrote, then perhaps it shall be empty through the most of games played there. :nuts:


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

xlchrisij said:


> ^And maby 80.000+ for the Amsterdam Arena then


More info please. I haven´t heared anything serious about this like it´s the case with the new Kuip.


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## Andre_idol (Aug 6, 2008)

Gelredome is awesome


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## skytrax (Nov 12, 2006)

:cheers:


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

xlchrisij said:


> ^And maby 80.000+ for the Amsterdam Arena then


Studies done by Arcadis (a Dutch engineering agency) showed that the Amsterdam Arena could be expanded to 60.000 seats. Those studies are a couple of years old. Then UEFA changed the rules for stadiums hosting a Champions League final. These stadiums should now have at least 70.000 seats. So the study was done over again with this new fact in focus and the study showed that a much more expensive expansion, to just over 70.000 seats, is the maximum capacity to which the Amsterdam ArenA can grow. To make it bigger then 70.000 seats surrounding buldings will need to be demolished and that is not going to happen. Also that total make-over of the stadium and the direct surrounding area will become more and more expensive, and more and more not realistic.

80.000+ seats is just not on the cards for the Amsterdam Arena. Chances are you will see a totally new stadium sooner then an ArenA which holds 80.000+ seats!

The plans for the new Feyenoord Stadium in Rotterdam call for at least 80.000+ seats with a possibility to be able to expand the stadium to 100.000+ seats if the WC-2018 would make it to Belgium and The Netherlands!


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Omnisport Apeldoorn has been finished for a while now.

The cycling track (inside the track temporary stands were erected for the Davis Cup tie with South Korea last September):









During the last week of construction:









The outside:


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

Andre_idol said:


> Gelredome is awesome


It's a horrible stadium. No atmosphere, ugly corners and so on.... 
The only time, when there was atmosphere was at the champions league game: Fc Twente - Arsenal:






And here a photo of the new Twente stadium:


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## Demetrius (Aug 23, 2005)

Sorry Twente fans in here, but to my eyes "new Twente stadium"="Old Trafford spawned"!.I'm sure the atmosphere in there is great, but what an odd expansion!At least new Twente stadium had also the corners expanded from the beginning altogether!!!


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Demetrius said:


> Sorry Twente fans in here, but to my eyes "new Twente stadium"="Old Trafford spawned"!.I'm sure the atmosphere in there is great, but what an odd expansion!At least new Twente stadium had also the corners expanded from the beginning altogether!!!


If you're comparing it to English stadiums then it's much closer to a mini St James' Park than OT.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Skycrap said:


> It's a horrible stadium. No atmosphere, ugly corners and so on....
> The only time, when there was atmosphere was at the champions league game: Fc Twente - Arsenal:


Nonsense, the only stupid thing what they should not do is play with the roof closed. That´s not why you have a roof which you can open and close.
For the rest it is a perfect stadium for a club like Vitesse.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

It is a fine stadium, 90% of the clubs in Europe would love to have something of the same quality.


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## trmather (Feb 7, 2008)

CorliCorso said:


> If you're comparing it to English stadiums then it's much closer to a mini St James' Park than OT.


Well if you actually look at the stands, its like a smaller OT.

The only way of comparing it to SJP is the fact it has two larger stands and two smaller ones. Otherwise its nothing like it.


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## Illegal_Alien (Mar 31, 2007)

More about the "Nieuwe Kuip";

80.000+
Placed half in the Maas
New trainstation
New Metro (circular) line.

They made the decission where, now we only need to wait for designs.


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## Joop20 (Jun 29, 2004)

Illegal_Alien said:


> More about the "Nieuwe Kuip";
> 
> 80.000+
> Placed half in the Maas
> ...


Source???


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## Liwwadden (Nov 12, 2005)

It will look great when totally completed! The thing I dislike, the space between the stands and the pitch.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Skycrap said:


> The stadium expanded this summer from 14.000 people to 24.500 people. In the spring of 2010, just a year ahead, the stadium will be further expanded till 35.000 seats. In 2014 the stadium will be expanded again, till 44.000. Thats also because of the WC 2018/2022 bids. The tiers are the steepest in The Netherlands.
> 
> Right now the stadium got a half second tier. The upgrade to 35.000 in spring 2010 will contain that the tier will be build 3/4 around the stadium. The last upgrade in 2014 will contain that they will finish the second tier fully around the stadium:


That doesn't make sense to me. The last extension included one of the sideline stand, one end stand and one corner and added about 10,000 seats. This means that the other sideline stand, the other end stand and the remaining three corners still need to be upgraded with a second tier. It seems very unlikely to me that this will add 20,000 seats in total (about 12,000 sounds more realistic) unless these stands will get a second tier almost twice the size.



lpioe said:


> My favourite stadium in the netherlands.
> Looking forward to seeing it with full 2nd tier.
> It will look quite similar to Old Trafford when the next phase is complete in 2010.
> 
> Who is the guy pictured in the stand behind the goal?


Epi Drost, a legendary FC Twente player and former Dutch international of the 70's who died of heart failure in the nineties.



Liwwadden said:


> It will look great when totally completed! The thing I dislike, the space between the stands and the pitch.


The stands are actually not that far from the pitch. However, that horrible moat is really letting the stadium down (as it does in many modern Dutch stadiums).


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## Timon91 (Feb 9, 2008)

Liwwadden said:


> It will look great when totally completed! The thing I dislike, the space between the stands and the pitch.


Yeah, it's a beautiful stadium. 

About the space between the crowds and the pitch: in Breda they are going to solve this by expanding the stand downwards to the pitch. In that case, they still have the 'ditch' around the pitch where everybody can enter the stadium and buy their beer, but the stand just hangs over it. A perfect solution IMO.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ I have heared that FC Twente will do the same in the Grolsch Veste. As Quintana already points out, they most likely will not reach the 44.000 mark with expanding the stands of the Groslch Veste alone.


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## www.sercan.de (Aug 10, 2003)

maybe 1 stand will have 3 tiers?

Otherwise it not possible to add 20,000 by just 2 corners 1 sideline and 1 goal stand.


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## railcity (Apr 4, 2007)

www.sercan.de said:


> maybe 1 stand will have 3 tiers?
> 
> Otherwise it not possible to add 20,000 by just 2 corners 1 sideline and 1 goal stand.


...unless the sideline 2nd tier is really huge...


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## www.sercan.de (Aug 10, 2003)

railcity said:


> ...unless the sideline 2nd tier is really huge...


Which is nearly the same as a 3rd tier 

But your are right.
Maybe instead of a 3 tier they could just made it like at Mestalla 2nd tier. Just more rows at one stand
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/70/154830161_9ec71b94ae_b.jpg


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Between the pitch and the stands there is some space to. When they lower the pitch and ad seats in the gap the capacity will rais with aprox 3.000. But I can't really follow the math to 35.000.

the capacity was 13.250 and is now 24.500. Thats an increase of 11.250. Roughly the half is on the long side of the pitch and another half is behind the goal and in the corner. Thats 5.625 seats. 

Now, 24.500+5.625= 30.125 + 3000max = 33.125 at a real maximum. 

And 44.000 is a real mistery for me 'cause how big must the grandstand be? Minimum 11.000 inclusive both corners. Thats the same as what is build last summer. Its not realistic I guess.


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## PaulFCB (Apr 21, 2008)

The 1st tier on De Kuip is made out of provisional stands added on a atheltics track?
Looks from a picture from the helicopter like it is.

About the new stadium, is Feyenoord in economical problems ( not minding the economical crisis, they lack performance in the last years ) since they already announced the new stadium but can't finish it till 2016-2017? 
And btw, is going to be a Olympic stadium? Cause on Wikipedia it seems like it:

The projected capacity will be around 80.000. The new stadium must be completed in 2016, right in time for the 2018 World Cup, and could possibly also be *Rotterdam's main weapon in a bid for the 2028 Summer Olympics.*


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## Hersenschors (May 25, 2008)

Red85 said:


> Between the pitch and the stands there is some space to. When they lower the pitch and ad seats in the gap the capacity will rais with aprox 3.000. But I can't really follow the math to 35.000.
> 
> the capacity was 13.250 and is now 24.500. Thats an increase of 11.250. Roughly the half is on the long side of the pitch and another half is behind the goal and in the corner. Thats 5.625 seats.
> 
> ...




One corner finished, Three corners left...


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Paul the Gunner said:


> The 1st tier on De Kuip is made out of provisional stands added on a atheltics track?
> Looks from a picture from the helicopter like it is.


No, De Kuip never had an athletics track. Actually, when it was finished it looked more or less the same as it does today (not withstanding terracing and the roof of course). During the 80's those stands (which I would describe as semi-temporary, I think they can quite easily be removed but I think I only have seen this once) were removed, probably due to safety reasons (hooliganism was a huge problem here in the 80's as well), but after the last major renovation in the mid-nineties they were brought back. Even without those stands you could not fit an athletics track in there.



> About the new stadium, is Feyenoord in economical problems ( not minding the economical crisis, they lack performance in the last years ) since they already announced the new stadium but can't finish it till 2016-2017?
> And btw, is going to be a Olympic stadium? Cause on Wikipedia it seems like it:
> 
> The projected capacity will be around 80.000. The new stadium must be completed in 2016, right in time for the 2018 World Cup, and could possibly also be *Rotterdam's main weapon in a bid for the 2028 Summer Olympics.*


Feyenoord has financial problems as long as I can remember, the new stadium will be payed for by the city of Rotterdam who will rent it to Feyenoord. The reason it can't be finished for 2016-2017 will mainly be caused by the fact that it can take years before you have acquired all permits that you need before you can start with the construction.

From what I understand, it will definitely not be an athletics stadium unless they want something similar as Valencia.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ Actually in the first years athletics and speedway events were held in De Kuip. But the track never was an official 400 meters track for official athletics games because of lacking space. The speedway events were held until 1955.

The stands close to the field are not provisional, but can be removed fairly easy. Especially for pop concerts the stands on the short ends of the field are removed to make more room for the stage of the band/artist playing in the stadium.

BTW: The city will not pay for the new stadium, though they most likely will contribute to the financing. But more parties will be involved in the financing of the new Feyenoord stadium in Rotterdam. Most likely a financing model which was used in Amsterdam for the ArenA will be used in Rotterdam as well.


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## peezet (Sep 17, 2008)

the stadium started with 13.500 seats

----------3000-------
3000-------------3000
----------4500-------

the expansion made it 24500

----------5500---------1800
----------3000
3000-------------3000--3700
----------4500

the next expansion will include 3000 seats (like Groningen did) towards the field to 33000 places

1800-------------5500-----------1800
-----------------3000
3700-----3000---3000-----3000--3700
-----------------4500

and the final stage gives about 44000 seats like this (because the stands of the former hoofdtribune are bigger)

1800-------------5500-----------1800
------------------3000
3700-----3000----3000----3000--3700
------------------4500
1800-------------7500-----------1800


I think its possible


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## mavn (Nov 17, 2007)

I'm pretty sure 40000+ can be done.

The expansion created roughly 11000 seats. If you mirror that expansion to the other side it would go from 24000 to about 34500 with two corners left. (the former "main stand" was a bit higher due to the boxes. Hence the 10500 increase instead of 11000)

The amount of seats that would go into the 2 remaining corners would be about 4 to 5000 I think. Let's say 4500. Add 3000 by expanding the stands over the ditch and you come to a total of about 42000. Which would be Roughly WC standard.


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Red85 said:


> the capacity was 13.250 and is now 24.500. Thats an increase of 11.250. Roughly the half is on the long side of the pitch and another half is behind the goal and in the corner. Thats 5.625 seats.
> 
> Now, 24.500+5.625= 30.125 + 3000max = 33.125 at a real maximum.


A second tier on the long side plus a corner would be about 8,000. That, with 3,000 for lowering the front seats gives you the 35,000 figure. 

I'm pretty sure FCT will have figured these things out, you know. They're not plucking numbers out of the air.


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## Wolds Mariner (Dec 31, 2008)

Martuh said:


> *8. Euroborg Stadion, Groningen*
> 20 000 seats


Looks very similar to what Plymouth's Home Park would do if that ground is completed in the future.


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## Wolds Mariner (Dec 31, 2008)

So the Dutch have plans for five or six stadiums for 2018, do they? What about Belgium?


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## Timon91 (Feb 9, 2008)

I think five, and that Belgium has the other five, but I'm not sure.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Ziggo Dome (15,600) in Amsterdam is planned to open in 2011:





































It will primarily function as a concert hall since indoor sports are not very popular here. However, it should be able to host sporting events as well (although probably with a smaller capacity). The building will have a façade of red, green and blue LED light fittings, which will allow images to be displayed on the entire building.


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

Rectangular dome! That's quite sensational


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

The City of Amsterdam made mutiple contributions in realising the Amsterdam ArenA as is it is today. Now they are facing huge cost overruns in building the new North-South Subway (metro). Out of the revenue of the proposed sale of the Amsterdam share in Energy Company NUON to Vattenfall from Sweden, € 800.000.000,- should go to paying for the subway line. No wonder that they are reluctant to spend any money into the Stadium now. And if it is always sold out, they should be able to finance the expansion on their own?

Of course the maximum expansion to 72.000 seats should be done. But the WC-2018 decision is the thing they are waiting for. Just as they are waiting for this decision in Rotterdam (new Feyenoord stadium) and Eindhoven (further expansion of the PSV stadium). Because then the government will also contribute to the stadium improvement plans or to the stadium development plans.


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## Patrickje (Dec 21, 2007)

> Willem II wil snel beginnen met uitbouw stadion
> 
> 
> Willem II wil als de wiedeweerga terug richting de subtop van de Eredivisie. De club diende onlangs de toekomstplannen in bij de gemeente Tilburg, waarna het maandag via wethouder Jan Hamming van Sport te kreeg dat het college van Burgemeesters en Wethouders positief tegenover de voorgestelde investeringen staat.
> ...


From: http://www.fcgforum.nl/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2348&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=250


It says: that Willem II also want to expand their stadium:nuts:
I think nearly every dutch club want to expand now


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Patrickje said:


> From: http://www.fcgforum.nl/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2348&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=250
> 
> 
> It says: that Willem II also want to expand their stadium:nuts:
> I think nearly every dutch club want to expand now


How many self concidered subtopclubs are there now? 


AZ
Heerenveen
FC Twente
FC Groningen
FC Utrecht
NAC
NEC
Vitesse
Willem II
Roda JC

thats more than the half of the competition...


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

^^

I think AZ calls itself a topclub now.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Wuppeltje said:


> ^^
> 
> I think AZ calls itself a topclub now.


Nope, they are to shy to call themselfs that. Really..


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

Are you sure Vitesse and Roda JC have plans to expand to stadium? I don't see the reason why they want to do that, is never sold out.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

FlyingDutchman said:


> Are you sure Vitesse and Roda JC have plans to expand to stadium? I don't see the reason why they want to do that, is never sold out.


Have I said that?


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## hugenholz (Feb 15, 2009)

Scheringa (chairman of AZ) is looking for financial support from the local government to finance the new expansion of the DSB-stadium. The capacity will increase to 30.000.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

I think the following clubs are serious about expansion.

FC Twente, again and sure
SC Heerenveen, again and sure (no date yet I thought)
AZ Alkmaar, but are strugling with licenses and infrastructure, like Twente is with strugling with the infrastructure too.
NAC Breda, I though they have a planning allready.

These to me are the clubs who realy need an expansion mop.
FC Groningen also belongs in that row, but they seem to have serious problems in the structure of there still pretty new stadium for expansion. The classic fault with building a new stadium. Not keeping in mind an possible expansion.


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

Red85 said:


> Have I said that?


I'm sorry, I thought you were talking about subtopclubs who had plans to expand their stadium, my fault sorry.

skaP187, NAC is sure, read my post a few posts back.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

skaP187 said:


> I think the following clubs are serious about expansion.
> 
> FC Twente, again and sure
> SC Heerenveen, again and sure (no date yet I thought)
> ...


The Euroborg Stadium can be expanded to 35.000 seats. A study has revealed this. More than that number is impossible without tearing down some of the new structures around in the stadium complex.

FC Twente will expand again, probably starting this year, from 24.000 to 33.000 seats. I do not see any struggles there and the infrastructure will need a serious boost if the final plan to expand to 44.000 seats is executed. AZ Alkmaar is preparing for an expansion to 30.000 seats (from close to 17.000 seats).

Other clubs which need an expansion are PSV Eindhoven (from 35.700 to about 44.000 or so) and of course Feyenoord. Even in the worst season in 20 years the average number of spectators is around 43.000 where 47.000 is the limit of the current stadium. Feyenoord will get an expansion by moving to a brand new stadium in 2016/2017 with a capacity of at least 80.000 seats. Finally also Ajax is thinking about expanding the Amsterdam ArenA to a maximum capacity of 72.000 seats.

A possible WC-2018 decision could accelarate some of the stadium plans in the Netherlands (and Belgium) of course.


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## bigbossman (Jun 25, 2007)

^^ respect to holland, them along with germany are showing that it's competition and new fan friendly stadiums that makes a good league, and when the football bubble bursts, they'll be the leagues laughing. Although i do think holland should merge with belgium!


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

Fc Twente will expand to 33.000 in may 2010. The work most be finished in August 2010.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Whatever happened with these nice planns of this horrible club. (sorry I support Vitesse...)
NEC Nijmegen Stadion De Goffert, current cap 12 500 
expansion to +/- 20 000


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ These plans are still alive but with the current financial crisis they are not moving ahead with a rapid pace. At NEC Nijmegen they are carefull in these turbulent times.

Meanwhile a third proposal has arisen for the expansion Amsterdam ArenA. That proposal plans a seating capacity of 85.000 seats for the Amsterdam ArenA with a full third tier and a new roof. That will be very expansive and will make "the race" with De Nieuwe Kuip, the new Feyenoord Stadium in Rotterdam, very very tight indeed. The Rotterdam plans call for a totally new stadium with at least 80.000 seats (with a maximum of 106.000 seats spreaded over 4 tiers if the WC-2018 goes to Belgium and The Netherlands).

Appearantly the FIFA demands for a WC-final stadium are now uplifted again and are calling for 80.000 seats in WC-mode (which corresponds to 85.000 seats in normal mode). So both stadiums will be built with (Rotterdam) or expanded (Amsterdam) to a capacity of at least 85.000 seats in normal mode! That is phenomenal and will bring them in the upper class of stadiums in Europe.

If the WC-2018 will be hosted by another country then Belgium and The Netherlands, there are two other plans for the Amsterdam Arena. One plans calls for a small expansion to 55.000 seats and the other for a small enlargement of the second tier to 65.000 seats. Although the maximum capacity plan could (but less likely) still go ahead even without the WC-2018.

See here: http://www.nu.nl/sport/1949467/amsterdam-wil-arena-flink-uitbreiden.html (Sorry, only in Dutch).


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## berkshire royal (Jun 11, 2008)

^^
That would be awesome, with stadiums that size both Feyenoord and Ajax could compete with the big boys in Europe again provided they can fill 80,000 which I am not so sure about. What are the chances of AZ expanding their stadium I remember I saw a very nice fan proposal on here.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ They are in the permit phase of an expansion to 30.000 seats (up 13.500 or so from the current capacity).

Can Ajax and Feyenoord fill such a big stadium. Well Ajax has practically sold out all the season tickets, however many ticketholders do not show up for the smaller games. So according to the sold tiockets stats there could be 51.000 tickets sold (as last sunday), but you can still see more then 10.000 seats empty.

Feyenoord is going through the worst season in 20 years. At the mioment they are in 10th place. But last sunday they played against even lower placed Heracles Almelo and there were a little over 45.000 visitors where the maximum allowed number of visitors is 47.000. Most empty seats were in the business area. And the week before this home game they lost the away game to Volendam, the number last in league. So the Feyenoord fans are much more loyal to the club then the Ajax fans and therefore Feyenoord has a much better chance of filling the new large stadium.

But Ajax and Feyenoord will not compete with the big boys in Europe anymore. The difference in TV, Sponsor and CL money for clubs out of small countries compared to clubs out of large countries is simply way too big. Example: Bayern München is now out of the CL, but they will cash in form UEFA € 45 million alone for the CL. The annual budget of Feyenoord as a club (TV and sponsors included) is € 43 million in total. With such differences it is sadly enough impossible to close the gap to the top teams in Europe.


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## A340-500 (Sep 25, 2007)

Impression of a third tier (PS by member hugenholz), quite impressive:












EPA001 said:


> But Ajax and Feyenoord will not compete with the big boys in Europe anymore.


Never say never....look at what Ajax achieved in the 90's, it was a dream team.

And not so long ago Feyenoord won the UEFA Cup (2002). The main reason is that our best players are being sold to clubs in Spain, Italy and England. We've got enough talent over here, thats not the point.

Maybe the solution is bigger stadiums > more revenue > more money.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Always nice to see the ratrace between Amsterdam and Rotterdam!
I think if the planns in Amsterdam turn out to be serious Rotterdam will go directly to 106 000. That´s the way it goes.
I hope Amsterdam will put on a complete third ring, because just behind the goals is not nice to my opinion. Ofcourse I do not have to pay for it.

Edit, nice impresion, a quicky, but you get the idea, 
The roof would be a bowl then I understood somewhere.


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## hugenholz (Feb 15, 2009)

Enough talking, start building! A'dam & R'dam...


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ Impressive expansion. Too bad that they will not qualify for the possible WC-2018 minimum capacity of 44.000 seats. Still very good news for Groningen and the local FC. kay:


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## Qaabus (Aug 4, 2006)

Just something made by a supporter.


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## metros11 (Jan 21, 2009)

A340-500 said:


> They have quite some very nice stadiums indeed :nuts:. But FIFA should particularly look at the history & popularity of football in a bidding country. And unfortunately that's below freezing point in both the US and Australia.


Never been to the United States, have you.


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## Qaabus (Aug 4, 2006)

Never been to a real football country, have you.


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## metros11 (Jan 21, 2009)

Qaabus said:


> Never been to a real football country, have you.


Is Ukraine a real football country? Poland? What about Germany? In 2006 I was there for some small sporting event...

Netherlands has a great football tradition, I'd love to see a World Cup there. Please though, don't talk about the United States as if everyone totally ignores the sport. That's just not the case.


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## A340-500 (Sep 25, 2007)

metros11 said:


> Never been to the United States, have you.


Actually, I've just returned from FL just a few months ago.

And I've never seen anything that looks like football (soccer) as we know it over here in Europe....


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## Alemanniafan (Dec 15, 2008)

I've lived in the US and in Europe for several years. 
And soccer is far more popular in the US than most europeans assume. 
But more on the amateur, hobby level than on the professional league basis.
It's kinda like Volleyball here, hardly anyone really notices or follows the league, but nearly everyone has played it in school more or less intensively.


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## xlchris (Jun 23, 2006)

It's official. The Amsterdam Arena is going to expand, but it is still unkown when to start and how big it's going to be.


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## Joop20 (Jun 29, 2004)

xlchris said:


> It's official. The Amsterdam Arena is going to expand, but it is still unkown when to start and how big it's going to be.


Source: http://www.ajax.nl/Nieuws/Nieuwsarchief/Nieuws-artikel/De-Arena-groei-versus-realisme.htm


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## Qaabus (Aug 4, 2006)

> *SC Heerenveen wil Abe Lenstra Stadion opnieuw uitbreiden*
> 14-mei-2009 12:41
> 
> SC Heerenveen wil het Abe Lenstra stadion opnieuw uitbreiden. De Friezen willen de westtribune met ongeveer 6000 plaatsen uitbreiden. De uitbouw van de thuishaven is noodzakelijk. Heerenveen heeft 4000 fans in de wachtrij voor een seizoenskaart en de ondernemerssociëteit van de club blijft groeien.
> ...





> *Heerenveen wil opnieuw uitbreiden*
> 
> Als het aan sc Heerenveen ligt wordt het Abe Lenstra-stadion uitgebreid met zo'n zesduizend nieuwe zitplaatsen. De club heeft plannen ontwikkeld om de capaciteit van het onderkomen opnieuw te vergroten, meldt Voetbal International.
> 
> ...


Heerenveen plans to expand their west stand. This will increase the capacity of the Abe Lenstra stadion by roughly 6000 seats to around 33000. 

The bill is expected to be in the region of €25m. Works are to take place between seasons, 2011 at the latest.


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## bigbossman (Jun 25, 2007)

^^ great news!!


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## Carrerra (Mar 13, 2008)

Good


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## flavze (May 13, 2009)

A340-500 said:


> Hear Hear
> 
> Take that Australia & USA


if a WC was ever played in Aus there would only be two non football specific stadiums and one of them has moveable seating to make it more rectangular than oval. 
The other has a pitch size were the corners of a football pitch virtually touch the fence.
Hardly anything to fuss about.


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## flavze (May 13, 2009)

A340-500 said:


> They have quite some very nice stadiums indeed :nuts:. But FIFA should particularly look at the history & popularity of football in a bidding country. And unfortunately that's below freezing point in both the US and Australia.


dude there is a massive history of football in both Aus and the US and football is crowing in popularity with crowds and leagues increasing.
Part of the idea of the WC is to grow football in the countries it is played and leave a lasting football legacy in them.


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## bigbossman (Jun 25, 2007)

^^ who says?


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## bthj (Jan 2, 2008)

flavze said:


> dude there is a massive history of football in both Aus and the US and football is crowing in popularity with crowds and leagues increasing.
> Part of the idea of the WC is to grow football in the countries it is played and leave a lasting football legacy in them.


Quit off topicm but then agian.., I thought it was to find out who has the best team.

In my view the WC should go back to basics with only top flight countries, say the best 16 and, then tournements for the B and C countires with a promotion and a relegation system. just as in Rugby, Cricket, Hockey etc,...


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## patroeski (Jul 8, 2005)

Does anyone have a good interior picture of the Abe Lenstra Stadium?


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## Qaabus (Aug 4, 2006)

Good enough?










Pano


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## patroeski (Jul 8, 2005)

^^ thanks, very good , always liked this stadium. 

So they will expand the stand at the right of the pano picture?


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## Zeno2 (Jan 22, 2006)

patroeski said:


> ^^ thanks, very good , always liked this stadium.
> 
> So they will expand the stand at the right of the pano picture?


No, the main stand is on the left side of the pano. 
The stand on the right side is already expanded.


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## hugenholz (Feb 15, 2009)

New stadium development news from Urecht:

The municipality of Utrecht does an investigation to the feasibility of a possible new stadium of FC Utrecht. This is mentioned on the website of "Binnenlands Bestuur". The club from the Domstad wants a brand-new football temple, with a capacity of 44,000 spectators. That suits within the ambitions of FC Utrecht according to club owner Frans van Seumeren. 

The new stadium should arise in the neighbourhood of the highway A2 and A12, at the south west side of the city. The new venue will be a candidate for the World Championship bid of Holland and Belgium in 2018/2022


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## berkshire royal (Jun 11, 2008)

^^
Why on earth would they want a new stadium they only built their current one like a decade ago and it is decent standard too. That would be a complete waste of money.


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## hugenholz (Feb 15, 2009)

berkshire royal said:


> ^^
> Why on earth would they want a new stadium they only built their current one like a decade ago and it is decent standard too. That would be a complete waste of money.


Ambition of the club owner Frans van Seumeren the man who lifted the nuclear submarine "Kursk". 

Infrastructural problems of the Galgenwaard is also a importanted issue with a higher capacity things will get worse. Another place should solve that


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Still, it seems like a waste of money since FC Utrecht (cramped in between Ajax, ADO, Feyenoord and Vitesse) wouldn't fill a 44,000 seater in a million years.


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## hugenholz (Feb 15, 2009)

Quintana said:


> Still, it seems like a waste of money since FC Utrecht (cramped in between Ajax, ADO, Feyenoord and Vitesse) wouldn't fill a 44,000 seater in a million years.


I think you underestimate Utrecht and other Dutch clubs who are nearby the traditional top 3 clubs (Ajax, Feyenoord, PSV). The increase of spectators for the last 10 years in the Dutch Premier League is spectacular. Especially with clubs who build or expanded their stadiums. All those clubs have sold all their season tickets and are sold out so there are waiting lists

Here you have the future expansion plans:

Ajax/Amsterdam Arena: current capacity: 51.000 - stadium expansion: 85000 *

Feyenoord/De Kuip: current capacity 50.000 - new stadium: 80.000/100.000 *

PSV/Philips Stadion: current capacity 35.000 - stadium expansion: 50.000 *

Heerenveen/Abe Lenstra Stadion: current capacity 26.000 - stadium expansion: 44.000 *

FC Twente/Grolsch Veste: current capacity 24.000 - stadium expansion: 44.000 *

FC Groningen/Euro Borg: current capacity 22.500 - stadium expansion/new stadium: 44.000

FC Utrecht/Nieuw Galgewaard: current capacity: 23.000- new stadium: 44.000

AZ Alkmaar/DSB Stadion: current capacity: 17.000- stadium expansion: 44.000

*= confirmed and official, stadium bids for World Championships 2018/2022


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

hugenholz said:


> I think you underestimate Utrecht and other Dutch clubs who are nearby the traditional top 3 clubs (Ajax, Feyenoord, PSV). The increase of spectators for the last 10 years in the Dutch Premier League is spectacular. Especially with clubs who build or expanded their stadiums. All those clubs have sold all their season tickets and are sold out so there are waiting lists


Fact is that Utrecht cannot even sell out their modern 24,000 seater stadium (they average around 20,000 and have sold out their stadium just once or twice since they enlarged it a few years ago). It seems to me that the Galgenwaard is exactly the right size for Utrecht.

Heerenveen, Twente and possibly Groningen and AZ can enlarge their stadium over 30,000 and regularly fill it. The other clubs cannot (as proven by Vitesse for instance).


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## hugenholz (Feb 15, 2009)

Quintana said:


> Fact is that Utrecht cannot even sell out their modern 24,000 seater stadium (they average around 20,000 and have sold out their stadium just once or twice since they enlarged it a few years ago). It seems to me that the Galgenwaard is exactly the right size for Utrecht.
> 
> Heerenveen, Twente and possibly Groningen and AZ can enlarge their stadium over 30,000 and regularly fill it. The other clubs cannot (as proven by Vitesse for instance).


10 years ago I would agree with you. But now it's really amazing to see how the figures change. The attendance in Utrecht almost doubled in 10 years:

1997-1998 11.971
2008-2009 20.612

Some research of the KNVB and a marketing-company (Wall Bake) predicts that the increase of spectators will continue for the coming years (2,5-5 precent every year). The World Championship 2018 will boost this increase.

For Utrecht it all depends on the results in the field how fast this increase of spectators will develop. A new stadium with a capacity of 44.000 within a few years may be too early but for let's say within 10 years this capacity is a realistic number if the increase continues as predicted.


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## SASH (Apr 15, 2005)

hugenholz said:


> 10 years ago I would agree with you. But now it's really amazing to see how the figures change. The attendance in Utrecht almost doubled in 10 years:
> 
> 1997-1998 11.971
> 2008-2009 20.612
> ...


The results are good now for Utrecht. They stadium capacity is 24.500, but last Sunday it was filled with 18.000 people. I think they will never fill a 44.000 stadium.
Feyenoord will never fill a 85.000 and ajax will never fill such stadium either.
A 30.000 stadium would be the limit for Utrecht and a 65.000 would be the best for Feyenoord and ajax.


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

^^

Although I agree it would be a risk, I wouldn't say that Ajax and Feyenoord wouldn't be able to fill such stadiums. Many couldn't believe that Ajax would sell out most of its matches in the ArenA. Ajax used a stadium of 19.000 in the past, and jumped to a stadium of 50.000. Ajax has a pretty big waiting list and many supporters all over the coutry.


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## SASH (Apr 15, 2005)

Wuppeltje said:


> ^^
> 
> Although I agree it would be a risk, I wouldn't say that Ajax and Feyenoord wouldn't be able to fill such stadiums. Many couldn't believe that Ajax would sell out most of its matches in the ArenA. Ajax used a stadium of 19.000 in the past, and jumped to a stadium of 50.000. Ajax has a pretty big waiting list and many supporters all over the coutry.


In the time Ajax jumped into the stadium it was easy, because they already filled the Olympisch Stadion with more than 30.000 and they won the CL in '96. With all the respect, but now a days they aren't the big club from that time anymore and it will be difficult the be one again.


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## bthj (Jan 2, 2008)

and your point would be?


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## SASH (Apr 15, 2005)

bthj said:


> and your point would be?



I help you for once. I meant that ajax and Feyenoord will never fill their new stadiums with 80.000 and I gave an explanation to it why.
hno: What am I doing?
The point is that it would be better, if you read the older replies first. If you don't get it than, it's your problem.


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## bthj (Jan 2, 2008)

Assumption is the mother of all **** up's, of course I read all the replies. Your reply is rather rousing. There is a difference between being a succesfull club and being a big one. Ajax is today, as well as Feyenoord, a crowd magnet. They can easily fill a biger stadium.


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## SASH (Apr 15, 2005)

bthj said:


> Assumption is the mother of all **** up's, of course I read all the replies. Your reply is rather rousing. There is a difference between being a succesfull club and being a big one. Ajax is today, as well as Feyenoord, a crowd magnet. They can easily fill a biger stadium.


Okay, than it is a big but not success full club anymore.
Think both clubs can fill such 85.000 stadiums only once a year, when they play each other in the League and probably in European Matches, but in games as ajax-heracles or feyenoord-VVV not.
The best for both clubs would be a 65.000-70.000 stadium.


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## bthj (Jan 2, 2008)

when one considers that feyenoord on average over the years pulls more then 4 times a crowd than twente, I would say their ambition is quite spot on. grosso mode the same goes for ajax.


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## Slagathor (Jul 29, 2007)

Wuppeltje said:


> ^^
> 
> Although I agree it would be a risk, I wouldn't say that Ajax and Feyenoord wouldn't be able to fill such stadiums. Many couldn't believe that Ajax would sell out most of its matches in the ArenA. Ajax used a stadium of 19.000 in the past, and jumped to a stadium of 50.000. Ajax has a pretty big waiting list and *many supporters all over the coutry*.


So? There's no way Ajax fans from Zeeland, Limburg or Groningen are traveling down to the Arena every 2 weeks. Having a lot of fans all over the country is good news for television revenues, not stadium attendances.


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## bthj (Jan 2, 2008)

you could not have missed the Magrathen-banner in the Arena every two weeks, have you? It's more an issue that there are too many fans from outside Amsterdam, then that there is a shortage thereof.


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## Slagathor (Jul 29, 2007)

So you've got a small group of hardcore Limburgers who go to Amsterdam every two weeks. That doesn't change the reality I grew up with. I grew up in Zeeland, where you'll find a good amount of Ajax fans, but they didn't have the time or money to go to Amsterdam for every home game.

Instead, they spent money on TV subscriptions so they wouldn't have to miss a single match.

Overall, having lots of fans in outer lying provinces generally means you'll be making more money from those fans through merchandise and TV deals than stadium tickets. 

You're not telling me that of the 50.000 people in the Arena, 20.000 are from Groningen, Drenthe, Overijssel, Limburg and Zeeland. Come on, I don't believe that for a second. Most of those supporters are wearing their Ajax jerseys in their home towns gathering in front of televisions in bars and restaurants.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Slagathor said:


> So you've got a small group of hardcore Limburgers who go to Amsterdam every two weeks. That doesn't change the reality I grew up with. I grew up in Zeeland, where you'll find a good amount of Ajax fans, but they didn't have the time or money to go to Amsterdam for every home game.
> 
> Instead, they spent money on TV subscriptions so they wouldn't have to miss a single match.
> 
> ...


20.000 maybe to much, but wuppeltje and bthj are right. 
Every year Ajax has the most supporters from the whole country in the totall eredivisie. They come from all of the country and even a small group of Belgian supporters is traveling allmost every home match. If your in, the famous Amsterdam accent isnt by far the only one, by far.


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## Slagathor (Jul 29, 2007)

Be that as it may, I really don't think you can count on all the 'Provincials' to fill a stadium with a capacity of 85.000. The vast majority of fans will have to come from the Amsterdam metro area.

I don't know how Ajax calculate these things, but it's a very complicated and dangerous calculation. 

Let's say that in the current Arena, some 25% of fans are from outerlying provinces (nearby provinces like Utrecht and Gelderland don't count). That's ~ 12.500 people.

I think Ajax would be making a very big mistake if they think the same percentage would apply to a bigger stadium. 25% of 85.000 = 21.250 people. You'll never get that many visitors from border regions. Especially if the new stadium will be expensive to build, because that means the ticket prices would rise. Bear in mind the people from outerlying provinces also have to spend a serious amount of money on transportation. 

Maybe if you offer people from far away postcodes a discount on the match ticket (to compensate them for their travel costs), you could get some more people coming in. But even then, I doubt it. Most Ajax fans from Zeeland just aren't willing to travel 3 or 4 hours one way every two weeks. That's six to eight hours in total for a game that lasts 1.5 hours. They'd rather spend their money on a good TV deal.


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## AFCAMIKE (Mar 27, 2009)

I think against my club, Ajax, the stadium will be full but against other teams i have my doubts. It's not going well with the finances but, even as an Ajax supporter, i hope the stadium will be beautiful


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## Qaabus (Aug 4, 2006)

Carrerra said:


> This has nothing to do with stadiums but personally I like Dutch football very much, so, I'm a bit sorry Eredivisie is getting weaker and weaker these days and they ended up having only one team qualified for group stage, along with Belgium, Greece, Scotland, Hungary etc in this year's Champions League. Their national team is still strong but their club teams are getting weaker and weaker. What do you think the reason is?


Ajax, PSV and Feyenoord arguably are. The rest are getting stronger all the time.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

cjav said:


> It is budgetted well above the 400 million if I am not mistaken. This indeed is a big deal, Feyenoord is not a rich club, sponsors etc.


That´s an understatement, apparently Feyenoord cannot even pay the salaries at the moment.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ Which also shows the necessity for a stadium with more commercial poosibilities then De Kuip at present has. Of course the bad policy of the former club board has brought the club in this postition where the debt is now about € 20 million (it has been over € 40 million).

The payments on the debts (interest and pay-back) are causing the present situation. But all the normal salaries are being payed, except for the 4 top earners who will get a part of their salary after their contract with the club has expired. These for Dutch standards excessive salaries are for players who are mostly in the last stages of their carreer and who's contract runs until June 2010 or 2011. So after this years season and next years season another cut-down in salary payments (and a quite massive one) will be achieved.

Of course € 20 million debt is quite small compared to the massive debts other clubs in for example England or Spain have. But the licensing system which is a very healthy everyday praxis in first Germany and now also The Netherlands (and I believe Belgium) should be around in every European country to create a much more level playing field in European football. In the mentioned countries a debt of € 20 million is a big issue, where in other countries a debt of several hundreds of millions in Euro's is just everyday business. With these debts they buy-out the best players from the smaller leagues, no wonder these are getting weaker. But the tension in the leagues is still there and the numbers of spectators look very healthy. In some of the high-salary countries that is certainly not always the case. 

When it comes to that issue the several Leagues in the USA have much and much better arrangements securing a much better and healthy situation for the sport by securing this level playing field with a salary cap and the first transfer rights on free-agents for the teams that ended at the bottom of the league!


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## hardcore grunn (Sep 29, 2008)

I saw this image of the FC Groningen Stadium 'Euroborg', I think they'll build 4 extra rows on the seconde tier.
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/6294/10092009396.jpg


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## Luke80 (Jul 1, 2009)

Little additions like that can improve a stadium no end.


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## HendrX (Oct 26, 2008)

^^ What do you mean?

and how seats will they gain??


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## Luke80 (Jul 1, 2009)

Improve the capacity without changing the design. Better atmosphere, increases revenue - everyone's a winner.

At a guess a thousand or 2 perhaps.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

HendrX said:


> ^^ What do you mean?
> 
> and how seats will they gain??


It will give them another 2.100 seats or so. The earlier expansion model planned for 35.000 seats or so. I am not sure if this lowering of the second tier was part of the original plans. If not this could bring the capacity of the stadium to over 37.000 if the big expansion plans will be executed as they were originally designed.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Very good idea though. Like said it will create more atmosfere. edit the link is gone by the way. Somebody has got the picture saved?


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

> *OB: Onderzoek naar nieuwe locatie PSV-stadion*
> 
> *24 september 2009* Verzorgd door Omroep Brabant - radio, televisie en internet
> 
> ...


A quick translation:

PSV is looking to expand their capacity for a while now and if the 2018 or 2022 world cup will be co-hosted by The Netherlands the capacity should at least be 45,000 if they want to host. The Philips Stadium could be expanded but the club wants to investigate whether a new stadium is also a viable option.

Personal note: the club seem to have changed their mind because less than a year ago they announced that they would almost definitely stay where they are. Seeing how every research by the club regarding the stadium capacity takes at least 2 years and no one ever hears anything of it again I don't expect much of this investigation either.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ Today PSV announced that it is almost certain that they will expand to about 45.000 seats. But they will investigate the option of a new stadion on a location outside the city. But it is not their favorite option unless they can make lots more money on that new sight which has not even been selected. Also the neighbours, the stadium is located in a housing area, have announced that they would regret if PSV were to leave the present site were they have played since 1913.

Since the current stadium already has very good commercial opportunities, I do not expect that they can generate much more money on another location. Especially since they will also increase the commercial opportunities if they expand the present stadium. And the direct railway connection they now enjoy would be very hard to find in any new location around Eindhoven.

Also FC Utrecht are now very serious in occupying a sight to build another New Galgenwaard. Probably near the intersection of the A12 and A2 highways they can build the stadium. Initial plans call for 35.000 seats (they now have 24.000 seats) but with a possible WC-2018 or WC-2022 I can see them building for 45.000 seats as well.


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

> *Olympic Stadium gets face-lift for 2018 World Cup* _Stadium capacity can be increased to 45,000 spectators _
> 
> The HollandBelgium Bid aims to give Amsterdam’s Olympic Stadium an interim renovation that will enable it to host World Cup football matches in 2018 (or 2022). A unique concept by the sponsor BAM will allow for the capacity of this classic football arena, built in 1928, to be increased to 45,000 spectators. “The plan is still in its early stages but we aim to make it a reality. After all, this is one of the jewels in our crown”, says Harry Been, the director of the Foundation that is organising the Belgian/Dutch candidature.
> 
> This would give Amsterdam two stadiums that are ‘World Cup-proof’. Been stresses that the construction or expansion of stadiums must also bring (lasting) commercial benefits for the clubs involved. FIFA is not happy that some stadiums which were built during the 2002 World Cup are now no longer in use. “The same problem will be seen in South Africa in the coming year”, says Been. “There’s a superb new stadium in Cape Town, but the local football team has its own venue on the other side of town. They simply don’t want to play football in such a modern location. In our case the construction and renovation of stadiums will be highly functional.” (Wegener Nieuwsmedia)


Source: Thebid.org

This seems to be the first time that the Olympic Stadium in Amsterdam has been suggested as a venue outside Amsterdam. 

The website from the HollandBelgium bid also has been updated with a 3 minutes trailer including the prime ministers from both countries.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ Interesting news, but the Belgium-Netherlands bid also aims to use the present De Kuip - Feyenoord Stadium and the new Feyenoord Stadium (almost right beside it) in the bid. FIFA regulations now state that only one city in a bid might use two venues if these venues qualify.

So in order to have two stadiums in Rotterdam and Amsterdam in the bid would require a change in the FIFA regulations if Belgium and The Netherlands win either the WC-2018 or WC-2022 bid. But I am interested in seeing what they would do with the historic but beautiful Olympic Stadium in Amsterdam.


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## Wuppeltje (Jan 23, 2008)

The suggestion of the Olympic Stadium is pretty new, but could be very interesting both political and more practical. 

*Political*
Brussels the opening game, Rotterdam the final, Amsterdam 2 stadiums. Every city will be really happy. 

*Practical*
The old and new Kuip are very close to each other. 4 groups of supporters on the same location are hard to divide. You can use different dates to use the stadiums, but this makes the use of them less flexible. Another point is that Rotterdam is able to accommodate less people in the city (especially in the hotels).


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## Sjoerd (Dec 27, 2008)

*AMSTERDAM - Olympic Stadium - 40,000*

For the wc holland-belgium bid they are probably going to expand the olympic stadium in amsterdam. So there will be 2 stadia for the wc in amsterdam. 
Here are some renders. it is not an official render.


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## xlchris (Jun 23, 2006)

They can (temporary) expand it and there are 2 ways to do that. 

The first is to expand it with a total ring wich gives it approx. 55.000/65.000 seats.
The second way is to expand it with a few parts wich gives it approx. 45.000 seats.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Mad ugly, both.


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## Axelferis (Jan 18, 2008)

a waste of time


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## herb21 (Aug 12, 2008)

The first might be passable with a bit of work the second is beyond rediculous.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Red85 said:


> How many self concidered subtopclubs are there now?
> 
> 
> AZ
> ...


What´s left after selection
More or less sure candidates for expansion in near future
Heerenveen
FC Twente
NAC

Groningen has problems with the current design to expand. (they can say what they want but it will be expensive)
FC Groningen


FC Utrecht, but would have to be a new stadium I believe. for so 5 - 10 years.

And the biggest project, the new Kuip, well let´s see. Question of a lot of money which is not there. (yet?)


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## Oh?! (Jan 28, 2008)

Future expansion of Grolsch-veste, FC Twente (Enschede):




























Today's situation:


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## likasz (Sep 4, 2008)

40,000 seats for city with population of 150.000 people?Madness!


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## Oh?! (Jan 28, 2008)

^^ In the area of Twente live appr. 600.000 inhabitants.

ps: If the stadium will be used for the World Championships (2018), it needs appr. 44.000 seats.


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

likasz said:


> 40,000 seats for city with population of 150.000 people?Madness!


Heerenveen has a stadium of 27,000 for a town of 40,000 - it's not about the immediate local population, it's about catchment area


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## metros11 (Jan 21, 2009)

Oh?! said:


>


A stadium by the sewer/water treatment plant. I can only imagine the smell.


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## gavstar00 (Apr 26, 2009)

metros11 said:


> A stadium by the sewer/water treatment plant. I can only imagine the smell.


Hahaha brilliant!


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Oh?! said:


> Future expansion of Grolsch-veste, FC Twente (Enschede):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for the info, are these ´official´ planns? The quality is a bit doubtfull.
Any one has planns from the next expansion which I believe is planned at the end of this year or something? The extra stand on the other goal end?


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

skaP187 said:


> Thanks for the info, are these ´official´ planns? The quality is a bit doubtfull.
> Any one has planns from the next expansion which I believe is planned at the end of this year or something? The extra stand on the other goal end?


Yes its official. Its from the same architect that designed the first expansion. In August they start with the second expansion, till 32.000 seats, which will contain the other short half going up. This renders contain the last expansion up till 44.000 seats. That will be build in 2014 if the world cup will go to the Netherlands. But, there is a change they will build it anyway, if FC Twente is doing well and there is demand for 44.000 seats.


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

metros11 said:


> A stadium by the sewer/water treatment plant. I can only imagine the smell.


You don't smell anything, but yes... its a bit strange. :lol:


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## Alemanniafan (Dec 15, 2008)

Skycrap said:


> You don't smell anything, but yes... its a bit strange. :lol:


After the first visit???
I could surely immagine one can't smell anything anymore after being in there for more than 90 minutes. :lol:


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## Liwwadden (Nov 12, 2005)

Oh?! said:


> Future expansion of Grolsch-veste, FC Twente (Enschede):


It's a bit DSB-stadium 2.0 right? Although that's not really a bad thing since I quite like the DSB-stadium.


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## FCZZ (Feb 5, 2008)

CorliCorso said:


> Heerenveen has a stadium of 27,000 for a town of 40,000 - it's not about the immediate local population, it's about catchment area


The town Heerenveen has 28.500 inhabitants :nuts: The municipality has 42.000 inhabitants.


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## Bobby3 (Jun 26, 2007)

RC Lens in France has more seats than the town does people.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Skycrap said:


> Yes its official. Its from the same architect that designed the first expansion. In August they start with the second expansion, till 32.000 seats, which will contain the other short half going up. This renders contain the last expansion up till 44.000 seats. That will be build in 2014 if the world cup will go to the Netherlands. But, there is a change they will build it anyway, if FC Twente is doing well and there is demand for 44.000 seats.


I like the idea that there will be one stand bigger then the rest. A bit classical.
I do not like (yet) the way it´s done. I´s rather see it done rectangular then round. Allthough it looks allright from the outside. It fits more with the rest of the stadium.
Also expanding like that would leave open further expansion in the future.
I´ll show later what I mean.


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## bigbossman (Jun 25, 2007)

it's not about town population though is, it's about catchment area, which for both Lens and Heerenveen is far far higher!


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## klmurphy (Sep 24, 2008)

a new study of the possible new location of the Thialf Stadium in Heerenveen:


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Any news on the start date for extending the Grolsch Veste? 

After today's (fantastic) achievement, it's a great time to build on the success, but it'd be a real shame to have to play Champions League home games in another city again.


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## hugenholz (Feb 15, 2009)

CorliCorso said:


> Any news on the start date for extending the Grolsch Veste?
> 
> After today's (fantastic) achievement, it's a great time to build on the success, but it'd be a real shame to have to play Champions League home games in another city again.


In september Twente starts with the expansion (from 24.000 to 32.000). Most of the games of the first part of the season 2010/2011 will be played outside. I don't know how they will arrange the CL matches at home (maybe in the Gelredome in Arnhem)


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## dark noire (Oct 6, 2009)

The bid book is coming up. But it's awfully quiet in this thread, specially if you look at the Belgium thread. Shouldn't there be renders by now for the new stadiums in Rotterdam & Amsterdam?


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

No


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## DH070 (Jul 23, 2010)

they are going to expand the fc groningen' euroborg to 27,000


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## Patrickje (Dec 21, 2007)

The way they wanna expand the euroborg to 27.000

Screenshots:










From: http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/590/eurotijdelijkcopy.jpg

And Heracles Almelo is going to build a new stadion for 15.000

Screenshots:


































































From: http://www.hartvoorheracles.nl/home/nieuws/232


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## Carlo5 (Oct 23, 2010)

*The new stadium of FC Dordrecht. The club plays in the Dutch second division, the Jupiler League.*
The capacity of the stadium is 6000 seats, the stadium is still in planning.

http://www.zwarts.jansma.nl/image/636-500-334.jpg

http://www.zwarts.jansma.nl/image/1090-500-341.jpg

http://www.zwarts.jansma.nl/image/791-500-334.jpg


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## Carlo5 (Oct 23, 2010)

*The new stadium of sc Cambuur called ''WTC stadion''. The club plays in the Dutch second division, the Jupiler League.*
The capacity of the stadium is 12.000 seats, the stadium is still in planning but it must be put into use in 2013.

http://www.stadionsineuropa.nl/nieuwbouw/cambuur09/cl02.JPG

http://www.stadionsineuropa.nl/nieuwbouw/cambuur09/cl03.JPG

http://www.stadionsineuropa.nl/nieuwbouw/cambuur09/cl04.JPG


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

http://www.sc-heerenveen.nl/pageid=502/Home.html

Stadium enlargement to 32.000 for SC Heerenveen is postponed. A loss of 15mln euro was made over the last year. The board thinks the time is not ready for these kind of investments. 

Nothing irealistic about that thought. Why invest 25mln when the risk is to high? On the other hand, even without a WC the stadium is expanded before 2020 I think. Just wait 4 or 5 years when the crisis is over and the waitinglists are growing again.


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## gigito_13 (Nov 9, 2010)

Very nice that stadium of heracles


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

The renovation of Sportpaleis Ahoy in Rotterdam was completed recently:


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Any news on the Grolsch Veste expansion to 36,000?

I know the WC bid failure was a set back for many developments, but with Twente going like they are right now it's a great time to increase their support.


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## klmurphy (Sep 24, 2008)

Thialf naast het Abe Lenstrastadion is weer een stap dichterbij!
http://nos.nl/artikel/224318-heerenv...uw-thialf.html

Hier een brochure: http://content1b.omroep.nl/6058a5d1a...ure_thialf.pdf


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## Qaabus (Aug 4, 2006)

CorliCorso said:


> Any news on the Grolsch Veste expansion to 36,000?
> 
> I know the WC bid failure was a set back for many developments, but with Twente going like they are right now it's a great time to increase their support.


Expansion from the current 24k to 30k is underway. Will be finished for the 11/12 season start in August.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

Nice to hear. The Eredivisie can only grow stronger as more clubs besides Ajax and PSV attain improved income and larger fan bases. I'd love to see this league surpass Serie A in average attendance and provide more of a challenge to the power leagues in UEFA competitions. The Dutch fans are that good. 

And I say this as a Premiership devotee.


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## bigbossman (Jun 25, 2007)

^^ What, it's not about average attendance it's about TV and Sponsorship revenue, they will never catch Italy unless they annex Belgium or encourage mass immigration to triple the population. And averages I doubt they'll surpass them especially if Italian stadiums get better.

When are Twente going to lower the stands? The moat around the pitch is ugly!


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

^^ If I'm correct lowering the stands is part of this expension


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## Qaabus (Aug 4, 2006)

Lowering the stands and closing the moat is the next step in the expansion. It will take capacity from 30k to 32k.
Nothing clear on a starting date yet.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

bigbossman said:


> ^^ What, it's not about average attendance it's about TV and Sponsorship revenue, they will never catch Italy unless they annex Belgium or encourage mass immigration to triple the population. And averages I doubt they'll surpass them especially if Italian stadiums get better.


I've no delusions about Eredivisie truly supplanting the top 4-5 leagues, especially due to the revenue disparity that comes with TV & sponsorships. Even if Dutch league was drawing 26k per they'd be ever behind the bigger leagues unless, as you suggested, the nation's populace magically tripled+. Frankly, MLS here in the States has a better shot at surpassing the Eredivisie in average draw than the Eredivisie has of catching Serie A.

I simply enjoy seeing the mystique of Serie A taking a blow by featuring such paltry crowds for this once proud league. They've let their facilities deteriorate, mismanaged crowd control and failed at luring more fans in general. So I say more power to those leagues that have invested in the future of the game, especially the smaller nations like the Netherlands that have such passion for the sport. 

Utrecht vs. Herenveen is more appealing to me than 90% of Serie A matches. But I don't confuse my wishful thinking with actual expectation.

Cheers. :cheers:


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

^^ In potential the MLS might even be closer to surpassing the Serie A then the Eredivisie is, but we shouldn't even try to compare ourselves with England, Germany, Spain and Italy. We should try to be the 5th competition in Europe, but their are a lot of competitors. 

First thing UEFA should do is make the game (financially) fair, and we can really see what we are capable of.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

FlyingDutchman said:


> ^^ In potential the MLS might even be closer to surpassing the Serie A then the Eredivisie is, but we shouldn't even try to compare ourselves with England, Germany, Spain and Italy. We should try to be the 5th competition in Europe, but their are a lot of competitors.
> 
> First thing UEFA should do is make the game (financially) fair, and we can really see what we are capable of.


What we're capable of? How about all the silverware all the clubs won in the total history of clubfootball

Combined:
6x EC1 (Ajax 4, Feyenoord 1, Psv 1)
1x EC2 (Ajax)
4x EC3 (feyenoord 2, Ajax 1, Psv 1)
3x eufa supercup (Ajax)
3x World Cup clubs (Ajax 2, Feyenoord 1)
and numbers of lost finals in all competitions. 

We even have a member of the uefa club hall of fame (Ajax) 

Look at all the players who play abroad, if only we could hold half of them in our own competition....


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## bigbossman (Jun 25, 2007)

Qaabus said:


> Lowering the stands and closing the moat is the next step in the expansion. It will take capacity from 30k to 32k.
> Nothing clear on a starting date yet.


Should've been first in my opinion it looks bad.



FlyingDutchman said:


> ^^ In potential the MLS might even be closer to surpassing the Serie A then the Eredivisie is, but we shouldn't even try to compare ourselves with England, Germany, Spain and Italy. We should try to be the 5th competition in Europe, but their are a lot of competitors.


Don't see it tbf 



> First thing UEFA should do is make the game (financially) fair, and we can really see what we are capable of.


Yeah but financial fair play won't actually make the game fair it will fix the game the way it is now.

What UEFA/Platini mean by fair is what is "fair" to the big clubs.



Red85 said:


> What we're capable of? How about all the silverware all the clubs won in the total history of clubfootball
> 
> Combined:
> 6x EC1 (Ajax 4, Feyenoord 1, Psv 1)
> ...


The problem is other than FC Twente in 1975 and AZ in 1981 no one else has done much. What would you rather a competitive league (like you seemingly have now) or to have your big three win the league all the time and do well in Europe?



GunnerJacket said:


> I've no delusions about Eredivisie truly supplanting the top 4-5 leagues, especially due to the revenue disparity that comes with TV & sponsorships. Even if Dutch league was drawing 26k per they'd be ever behind the bigger leagues unless, as you suggested, the nation's populace magically tripled+. Frankly, MLS here in the States has a better shot at surpassing the Eredivisie in average draw than the Eredivisie has of catching Serie A.
> 
> I simply enjoy seeing the mystique of Serie A taking a blow by featuring such paltry crowds for this once proud league. They've let their facilities deteriorate, mismanaged crowd control and failed at luring more fans in general. So I say more power to those leagues that have invested in the future of the game, especially the smaller nations like the Netherlands that have such passion for the sport.
> 
> ...


A lot of prejudice and ignorance in this post, but this is not the place to be discussing Italian football...


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## FlyingDutchman (Sep 6, 2006)

Red85 said:


> What we're capable of? How about all the silverware all the clubs won in the total history of clubfootball
> 
> Combined:
> 6x EC1 (Ajax 4, Feyenoord 1, Psv 1)
> ...


You're first line says it all: 'history'. Back then we didn't knew the monster called 'Modern Football' yet. We should still figure out what we're capable of now when money is more important then goals.




bigbossman said:


> Yeah but financial fair play won't actually make the game fair it will fix the game the way it is now.
> 
> What UEFA/Platini mean by fair is what is "fair" to the big clubs.


I know, but I'm not talking about UEFA's fair play, I'm talking about real fair play. Ban all the clubs from European competitions which still have debts in 5 years.


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## bigbossman (Jun 25, 2007)

FlyingDutchman said:


> You're first line says it all: 'history'. Back then we didn't knew the monster called 'Modern Football' yet. We should still figure out what we're capable of now when money is more important then goals.


No offence but those "against modern football". I want to know what specifically they are against because there are many aspects of modern football which are brilliant to be fair. I have problems with aspects of it, but I am not gonna dismiss it completely because the old football was far from perfect.



> I know, but I'm not talking about UEFA's fair play, I'm talking about real fair play. Ban all the clubs from European competitions which still have debts in 5 years.


That's even more unfair, no offence but the financial punishment rules that you have in the netherlands (and countries like Germany and Italy) are stupid and counterproductive. 

The problem has and always will be the way the revenue is distributed only if that is sorted out must cntrols on spending, debt and contracts be implemented. Football is too reactive it should be proactive then the problems wouldn't arise in the first place.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

The only thing Uefa should do is make sure that the financial rules for all clubs playing under Uefa flag are the same. I don´t care how those rules will be, just make sure that it´s the same for every one.

I see nothing wrong with Madrid or Barca having a debts of 500 milion or so, as long as they can pay the costs of having those debts and paying the bills on time. But when Barca can then it is very strange that Ajax can´t.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

bigbossman said:


> A lot of prejudice and ignorance in this post, but this is not the place to be discussing Italian football...


I'll agree to end this tangent, and going forward I'll make note to not have opinions or preferences in things like style and atmosphere. :|


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## Carlo5 (Oct 23, 2010)

*FC Volendam has built a new stand. The club plays in the Jupiler League (2nd division) The stand was opening in August 2010.*

See 2 pics of the new stand on this link:
http://www.fcvolendam.nl/nieuws/item/jaap-jonktribune-nadert-voltooiing/


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## Lupin III (Mar 2, 2011)

Carlo5 said:


> *FC Volendam has built a new stand. The club plays in the Jupiler League (2nd division) The stand was opening in August 2010.*
> 
> See 2 pics of the new stand on this link:
> http://www.fcvolendam.nl/nieuws/item/jaap-jonktribune-nadert-voltooiing/


Just to be 100% sure Carlo but the new stand at Volendam you are talking about are from august 2010 right?


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Totally outdated design. There is no reason for a new stand to have pillars today. It's nice that Volendam now has four more or less identical stands but the oldest of those must be over 15 years old now.


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## Dyl070_DH (Apr 2, 2011)

Can someone post pictures of the expansion of the Grolsh Veste
there are a few pictures on the website of fc twente


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## hugenholz (Feb 15, 2009)

Dyl070_DH said:


> Can someone post pictures of the expansion of the Grolsh Veste
> there are a few pictures on the website of fc twente


http://www.mijnalbum.nl/Album=MAZLURBY


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## peezet (Sep 17, 2008)

The expansion of the Grolsch Veste to 30.000 is going very fast as you can see at the website of the dutch champion FC Twente 

http://www.fctwente.nl/nieuws/fotos-uitbreiding-de-grolsch-veste-5/









source: www.fctwente.nl


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## Lupin III (Mar 2, 2011)

peezet said:


> The expansion of the Grolsch Veste to 30.000 is going very fast as you can see at the website of the dutch champion FC Twente
> 
> http://www.fctwente.nl/nieuws/fotos-uitbreiding-de-grolsch-veste-5/
> 
> ...


They arent champions yet mate  Although I hope they win or draws against Ajax in this weekend :cheers:

Anyways great progress.


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## peezet (Sep 17, 2008)

Lupin III said:


> They arent champions yet mate  Although I hope they win or draws against Ajax in this weekend :cheers:
> 
> Anyways great progress.


They are still champions (2010) 
and yes they will be 2011 :cheers:


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

peezet said:


> They are still champions (2010)
> and yes they will be 2011 :cheers:


Unfortuantly there not champions anymore... 
Meanwhile there neighbour Heracles Almelo has more or less presented plans for their new stadium. Their aiming for a cap of 15 000, easely extandable to 20.000. 
http://www.heracles.nl/nieuws?newsId=5069 and the webpage of the architects
http://www.pr8.nl/ just click on ´projects´ and then ´stadion heracles almelo´
looks allright I mop.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Under construction.....



skaP187 said:


> Fortuantly there not champions anymore...
> Meanwhile there neighbour Heracles Almelo has more or less presented plans for their new stadium. Their aiming for a cap of 15 000, easely extandable to 20.000.
> http://www.heracles.nl/nieuws?newsId=5069 and the webpage of the architects
> http://www.pr8.nl/ just click on ´projects´ and then ´stadion heracles almelo´
> looks allright I mop.


... Fixed
***

Ontopic. Looks nice though. I hope the ditches inbetween stand and pitch are gone very soon aswell. Then its a venue suitable for a club like Twente. Something they deserve.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

skaP187 said:


> Meanwhile there neighbour Heracles Almelo has more or less presented plans for their new stadium. Their aiming for a cap of 15 000, easely extandable to 20.000.
> http://www.heracles.nl/nieuws?newsId=5069 and the webpage of the architects
> http://www.pr8.nl/ just click on ´projects´ and then ´stadion heracles almelo´
> looks allright I mop.


Looks very nice save for the partially obstructed views created by the columns intruding into the upper reaches of the seating bowl. I'd rather they shaved capacity then offer those, myself, but perhaps at a discount they'll still draw revenue for the club.

Otherwise a nice take on that size venue. Good to see the Netherlands continue to build up the infrastructure for so many clubs.


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

Grolsch Veste:


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## Dyl070_DH (Apr 2, 2011)

when will they start the construction on the gap between the stands and the pitch?


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

^^ Is that even necessary? At some point the stands become too close, impairing the views of those up close (hampering side views to the corners) and those up high (unable to see action at the near touchline). Plus if they want to keep any space for people to walk in front of the stands as shown now, they won't want to direct that use closer to the field, as well. So I don't know if any such plans are on the table, but I certainly don't see the need for it.


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## Rev Stickleback (Jun 23, 2009)

GunnerJacket said:


> ^^ Is that even necessary? At some point the stands become too close, impairing the views of those up close (hampering side views to the corners) and those up high (unable to see action at the near touchline). Plus if they want to keep any space for people to walk in front of the stands as shown now, they won't want to direct that use closer to the field, as well. So I don't know if any such plans are on the table, but I certainly don't see the need for it.


Building down to field level wouldn't cause the problems you are describing.

It's a problem in some US stadiums because they were designed for the much narrower american football field, but the sightlines there will have all been designed with a soccer field in mind.

I remember for the world cup in Germany, many American fans were disappointed to be allocated tickets for corner seats, as they believed that meant they'd not be able to see all the field.


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## Oh?! (Jan 28, 2008)

GunnerJacket said:


> So I don't know if any such plans are on the table, but I certainly don't see the need for it.


There are such plans to increase the capacity with apr. 2000 seats. When these plans wil be reality is unknown yet.

-edit-
Unknown picture to me. This probably wil be the final expansion:


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## Lupin III (Mar 2, 2011)

Oh?! said:


> There are such plans to increase the capacity with apr. 2000 seats. When these plans wil be reality is unknown yet.
> 
> -edit-
> Unknown picture to me. This probably wil be the final expansion:


I believe that plan was for the World Cup Bid. I doubt that Twente will choose this plan now. They will probably go after a smaller capacity with a fully rebuild main stand.


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## gavstar00 (Apr 26, 2009)

> Part of a Dutch football stadium under renovation in the city of Enschede has collapsed, trapping an unknown number of people under the rubble.
> 
> "Part of the roof has collapsed. There are people under the rubble. We don't know how many," a Dutch police spokesman said after the incident at the Dutch top flight club.
> 
> ...


http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/07072011/58/world-football-fc-twente-stadium-collapses.html


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## Oh?! (Jan 28, 2008)

Twitterpic's


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## Woembah (Jul 10, 2009)

That's just terrible 

I hope there are no casualties.


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

People died....
My club, my city. Why is this happining?


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## Alex_Riccio (Jun 22, 2011)

R.I.P.


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

1 dead, 13 injured according to BBC

Another disaster in Enschede 


Edit - now 2 dead apparently. Just been on the phone to family over there, it seem a crane hit a girder


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## dotcomma (Apr 20, 2011)

What a tragedy


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## Andre_idol (Aug 6, 2008)

Just read the news ...wow


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## Oh?! (Jan 28, 2008)

red: collapsed roof
purple: extension second stand
grey: existing stand


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## Laurence2011 (Mar 4, 2011)

rest in peace poor people xx


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## Steel City Suburb (Jun 13, 2007)

BBC still says one. 

RIP to the person(s) who were killed. 



> *Casualties in Dutch FC Twente stadium roof collapse.*
> 
> FC Twente was expanding the stadium before the start of next season
> Part of a stadium roof has collapsed in the Dutch city of Enschede, killing one person and injuring more than a dozen.
> ...


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14063640


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## Axelferis (Jan 18, 2008)

sadness...


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## CorliCorso (May 4, 2005)

Steel City Suburb said:


> BBC still says one.


Sorry, it said 2 on News 24's ticker at one point


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## Skycrap (May 31, 2006)

Second dead is confirmed. A 24 year old constructionworker leaves a wive and 2 kids behind.


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## bd popeye (May 29, 2010)

_Some photos of the unfortunate accident_
















































> A view of the collapsed stadium in Enschede, Netherlands, Thursday, July 7, 2011. A section of a Dutch football stadium collapsed during off-season construction work Thursday, trapping people underneath, police said. No match was being played at the FC Twente stadium at the time of the collapse and those trapped were believed to be workers. Local newspaper De Twentsche Courant, citing unnamed workers at the stadium, reported on its website that 12 people were injured in the accident.


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## flavze (May 13, 2009)

very sad event.


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## MS20 (Apr 12, 2009)

Sad news indeed. 

May not be appropriate to ask considering the circumstances, but what happens now in regards to the stadium? Is there going to be a halt in proceedings? With the season just around the corner, have they already revised their targets?


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## flavze (May 13, 2009)

MS20 said:


> Sad news indeed.
> 
> May not be appropriate to ask considering the circumstances, but what happens now in regards to the stadium? Is there going to be a halt in proceedings? With the season just around the corner, have they already revised their targets?


Schalke have offered Twente their stadium to use until it's fixed.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

As far as I know, UEFA does not allow teams to play their European home games in another member country. That's why Alemannia Aachen (DE) played in Cologne (DE) and not in nearby Kerkrade (NL) and Twente (NL) in Arnhem (NL) and not in Gelsenkirchen (DE) in recent years. Arnhem and Gelsenkirch are both about the same distance away from Enschede by the way.

I can imagine the Eredivisie games to be played in Gelsenkirchen but Champions League qualifiers in Arnhem. VVV (NL) tried to move their league games against Ajax and PSV to Mönchengladbach (DE) a few years ago. The Dutch FA had no problems with this, nor did Ajax and PSV, but the German authorities eliminated the plan because they were afraid of riots between Dutch and German hooligans.


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## hugenholz (Feb 15, 2009)

Quintana said:


> As far as I know, UEFA does not allow teams to play their European home games in another member country. That's why Alemannia Aachen (DE) played in Cologne (DE) and not in nearby Kerkrade (NL) and Twente (NL) in Arnhem (NL) and not in Gelsenkirchen (DE) in recent years. Arnhem and Gelsenkirch are both about the same distance away from Enschede by the way.


Incorrect, Ajax played their UEFA-cup home-matches in 1991/1992 in Düsseldorf


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> Last January ADO Den Haag's new owner stated his intentions to expand the Kyocera Stadium from 15,000 to 20,000 seats. Only last summer he wanted to expand to 30,000, but luckily someone managed talked some sense into him. At the moment the average attendance is less than 12k.


A shame that a club in a city of half a million inhabitants, cant fill a stadium of 15.000. It's the third city in NL.. 
hno:
You would say that there is potentially a bigger market for that club.


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## SteveCourty (Mar 14, 2013)

It's a nice little ground as well. Have some friends that live nearby if I ever move to Holland it'll be my team to watch


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## alexandru.mircea (May 18, 2011)

Red85 said:


> A shame that a club in a city of half a million inhabitants, cant fill a stadium of 15.000. It's the third city in NL..
> hno:
> You would say that there is potentially a bigger market for that club.


Over one million in the metro area! Always wondered why this key city has never built any decent football tradition, especially in such a thriving footballing country.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

The Hague has a rich footballing tradition but its successes date back to the early days of the game. 
Between 1889 and 1943 a total of 16 national championships were won by 4 different teams from The Hague (with 9 championship in a row won by teams from the city between 1900 and 1908). HVV is still number 4 on the list national champions (10 titles) and the only club outside of the traditional top 3 that is allowed to adorn their shirt with a golden star.

No championships have been won by clubs from the city since 1943 and football sort of went into hibernation there after the arrival of professional football in The Netherlands in 1954. Partly because most of the bigger clubs (HVV, HBS, Quick) were against professional football and refused to join the new professional leagues (they still exist as small amateur clubs to this day), partly because the clubs that did (ADO, Holland Sport) never really had enough funds to challenge for the silver ware. The Hague as a governmental city lacks industry which probably didn't help either I guess.

The last time a team from The Hague manage to play for the title was ADO in the early 70's with a lot of homegrown players. Unfortunately for them this was also the era of Johan Cruijff's Ajax and Wim van Hanegem's Feyenoord, in any other era this team would probably have won one or more championships. 

The city of The Hague than pretty much forced ADO to merge with Holland Sport (the only other remaining professional team in the city) into FC Den Haag in 1971 figuring that creating one big club in the city would surely mean success. This never reallly happened because the supporters of Holland Sport (who were mostly from the district of Scheveningen) refused to go to the new club that played in ADO's former stadium in the Zuiderpark area at the other side of the city. This effectively meant that one of the city's clubs got eliminated without the other one being able to profit from it. 

Hooliganism in the 80's turned FC Den Haag in the most notorious club in the country up to the point were people from the city distanced itself either from the sport completely or started to support more successful clubs like Ajax and Feyenoord. As a result The Hague was without top flight football for most of the 80's and 90's (formative decades for today's fans). 
During the 90's FC Den Haag was rebranded to ADO Den Haag hoping to shed off it's bad reputation. They have somewhat been successful in this aspect but mismanagement, lack of funds and a city filled with people that distrust the club mean they have still not been able to create a stable club.


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## alexandru.mircea (May 18, 2011)

^cheers


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Quintana said:


> The Hague has a rich footballing tradition but its successes date back to the early days of the game.
> Between 1889 and 1943 a total of 16 national championships were won by 4 different teams from The Hague (with 9 championship in a row won by teams from the city between 1900 and 1908). HVV is still number 4 on the list national champions (10 titles) and the only club outside of the traditional top 3 that is allowed to adorn their shirt with a golden star.
> 
> No championships have been won by clubs from the city since 1943 and football sort of went into hibernation there after the arrival of professional football in The Netherlands in 1954. Partly because most of the bigger clubs (HVV, HBS, Quick) were against professional football and refused to join the new professional leagues (they still exist as small amateur clubs to this day), partly because the clubs that did (ADO, Holland Sport) never really had enough funds to challenge for the silver ware. The Hague as a governmental city lacks industry which probably didn't help either I guess.
> ...


Nothing to add to that.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

The Leeuwarden municipality has agreed on the site of the new SC Cambuur stadium. A lot of permits and plans need to be arranged so development is not expected to start before 2017 and should be finished in 2018 when Leeuwarden will the European Capital of Culture. Capacity is expected to be around 15.000.

Cambuur has the following picture on its website but since construction won't start for another two years I'm not sure whether this is how the final design will look like:


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

In Almelo the second tier is almost completely put in to place. Pics are available on the clubs website. Im not able to post pics because I just registered.

I think I am going to like that little stadium.


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

Polman Stadion, May 14:










https://www.flickr.com/photos/wansanson/17782780771/in/photolist-t6ppbt-sZKpcs-rahR6T-s2mncG-s4jDMr-rBzZLV-rx53d7-rEiH4a-rWCrDm-qTJJtZ-qTJJtt-rxWVis-rxY4vE-rNeT9s-rwd258-qTx3mh-rQrYNT-rNeT6m-rQq2kG-qTJJiZ-ry5sfe-ry5scP-qTJJfn-rQwV1X-rxY4kQ-rwd1Qa-rNeSUj-rxY47d-rQrYo4-qTJJ1V-qTx2WQ-ry5rWD-rwd1BK-qTx2Pq-rxWUGN-rQrYcx-rQwUxH-rQrY7H-rQrY6v-rQrY3V-ry5rHc-rQrY22-qTx2B1-rQrXZt-ry5rBk-rFvf7b-r13XG7-r67tAR-rxRx3Y-rQ3hpH


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

More of Polman Stadion. June 11:





































http://www.heracles.nl/nieuwstadion/details?newsId=9458

----
June 19





































http://www.heracles.nl/nieuwstadion/details?newsId=9483


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Quite nice if you ask me.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

An overview of current plans and ideas for stadium expansion in Dutch professional football:

*In progress*:
Heracles Almelo 8,500 --> 12,400 (second tier)
Go Ahead Eagles Deventer 8,000 --> 10,000 (total reconstruction)

*Planned*:
PEC 12,500 --> 14,500 (closing the moat)
Ajax 53,300 --> 53,500 (closing the moat)

*Discussed*:
NEC Nijmegen 12,500-->17,500 (closing the moats + extra businesseats)
Cambuur Leeuwarden 10,000 --> 15,000 (new stadium)
PEC Zwolle -->+/- 16,000 (closing of the moats)
Ajax --> 54,000 (closing the moat)
Excelsior Rotterdam 3,800 --> 5,800 (filling of the corners)
ADO The Hague 15,000 --> 20,000 (?)
PSV 35,000 --> +50,000 (new stadium)
Feyenoord 51,200 --> 63/70,000 (new stadium?)


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

News from Rotterdam: famous Rotterdam-born architect Rem Koolhaas, his Office of Metropolitan Architecture and urban planning cosultant Arup are said to be willing to built not only a a new stadium, but also to totally redevelop the neigbouring area.

Koolhaas, OMA and Arup have been involved in iconic projects like the Olympic Stadium ('Birdsnest') in Beijing and the office building of China's CCTV.

The project would enjoy great support with the local political parties and would allow Feyenoord to increase their budget from some 50 to 100 million euros.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> An overview of current plans and ideas for stadium expansion in Dutch professional football:
> 
> *In progress*:
> *Heracles Almelo 8,500 --> 12,400*


13,500
http://www.heracles.nl/nieuws?newsId=8348


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## dinamo_zagreb (Dec 23, 2011)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> *Discussed*:
> Ajax --> 54,000


What is being discussed there?


----------



## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

dinamo_zagreb said:


> What is being discussed there?


The Arena CEO has stated that the stadium will be expanded to 54,000 seats at maximum.


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

Polman Stadion, June 26




























more at http://www.heracles.nl/nieuws?newsId=9495


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

Meanwhile in Deventer the Leo Halle Stand is taking shape. This is also why European contenders (and relegated side lol) Go Ahead Eagles will play their European match against Ferencvaros of Hungary in the stadium in Emmen this thursday.



















http://www.destentor.nl/regio/deven...verrijst-in-stadion-go-ahead-eagles-1.5027952


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

usernametaken said:


> Meanwhile in Deventer the Leo Halle Stand is taking shape. This is also why European contenders (and relegated side lol) Go Ahead Eagles will play their European match against Ferencvaros of Hungary in the stadium in Emmen this thursday.
> 
> PICS


http://www.bouwwebcam.nl/adelaarshorst/

A live cam. Only in daylight. Grandstand renovation included. 
LOL.


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

Here is a cool timelapse of the Polman stadion too. Its from the 22nd of June but still worth checking.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=806Q-2GL_2k&feature=youtu.be


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

*Discussed*
Willem II 14,500 --> 14,900
- Expansion of the 'KingSide' with some 400 extra seats by placing an extra stand in the moat


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

Polman Stadion, 3-7



















More: http://www.heracles.nl/nieuws?newsId=9516


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

more: http://www.heracles.nl/nieuws?newsId=9531


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

An update of the Adelaarshorst in Deventer:


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

Polman, 17-7




























http://www.heracles.nl/nieuws?newsId=9556


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

Nice to see the Adelaarshorst keep its character but one would expect them to build a roof without the need or supports in 2015.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

^^ One would expect that, but such roofs are always more expensive. I guess the budget dictated this cheaper solution for the roof.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Quintana said:


> Nice to see the Adelaarshorst keep its character but one would expect them to build a roof without the need or supports in 2015.


But still this solution adds to the character of the stadium of an small English style venue. It's thin, black, made from steel and doesn't disturb to much. Like the ugly's in Volendam for example.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

An impression of the seating pattern on one of the new stands at the Adelaarshorst stadium in Deventer


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## Briez71 (Jul 12, 2015)

Mooi, dat stadsgezicht op stoeltjes!


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

Looks good, except those ugly poles to block te view.

The club failed to get subsidy to preserve the famous brick stadium wall at the Vetkampstraat. Hopefully they will find another way to finance the preservation because it's one of the only old characteristical stadiums in the Netherlands.

The Polman Stadium is such an improvement:














































http://www.heracles.nl/nieuws?newsId=9562


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)




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## Dordt (Jul 7, 2010)

Does anyone know the (detailed) project costs of the projects in Almelo and Deventer?


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## poguemahone (Apr 4, 2012)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> An impression of the seating pattern on one of the new stands at the Adelaarshorst stadium in Deventer


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

poguemahone said:


>


Still slightly different.

No, this is really awesome.


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

Seems the old images have changed URL? Here are all the pics previously posted http://www.heracles.nl/nieuwstadion


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)




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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

Tomorrow the first match in the renovated stadium for Heracles against NEC.

Pic from 3 days ago.


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

And in Deventer they are ready for the new season too.


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## master_klon (Jul 20, 2011)

Looks like the above photos went missing. Here they are again, taken from the club's facebook page:


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## master_klon (Jul 20, 2011)

Some before and afters:


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## usernametaken (Jun 22, 2015)

And some pics of the opening in Almelo:



















And a pic of the new 'Eagles nest' in Deventer:










https://twitter.com/GAE_Business/status/632893718761226240

Here is a drone video of the renewed Eagles stadium:

https://youtu.be/PlqxL0jrgeM


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

Really like how they handled the changes in Almelo. Graceful and conducive to the atmosphere of the arena. Well done!


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Both are handled in maximum respect in terms of supporters, atmosphere and history of the clubs. 

Heracles has even room to easely expand in the future. At the grandstand 2 rows of seating can be added, where those have been left empty. Concrete is allready dried. And at one end of the goals (right for TV), the walkway has been left empty, while all the other parts are close to the pitch now.


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

Stadion Galgewaard, Utrecht:

July 25, 2013











December 6, 2013





https://www.flickr.com/photos/camera_alex/albums/72157634798557542


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

AFAS Stadion, Alkmaar:

April 9, 2008


http://nlvoetbalpool.nl/tournament/stadiums/

July 19, 2013


http://www.hartvannederland.nl/nederland/noord-holland/2013/brand-in-stadion-az/#864796


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## Spomasz (Feb 28, 2013)

Vitesse Arnhem stadium- Gelredome- is going to be reduced in capacity. The maximum crowd right now is 25k, and tthis number will be lowered to 20k. 
Anyone knows it is a permanent change ?


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Spomasz said:


> Vitesse Arnhem stadium- Gelredome- is going to be reduced in capacity. The maximum crowd right now is 25k, and tthis number will be lowered to 20k.
> Anyone knows it is a permanent change ?


No, it isn't permanent. They will cover the seats in the upper part of the stands with banners.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Not that I'm a fan of this sport, but this is quite 'big' in The Netherlands. The yearly Korfbal final. For the first time this year, the Ziggo Dome in Amsterdam was converted to fit this sport. 

12,500 people attended the final, which was won by TOP from Sassenheim.


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## mckeenan (Apr 17, 2013)

Stadion Galgewaard looks pretty good.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

*Stadium development in the Netherlands between 2016 - 2020*

De Eredivisie

In many aspects, Dutch Eredivisie is #6-7 League in Europe. Strongest asset is Dutch stadium infrastructure. Eredivisie is blessed with football-specific stadiums (without running tracks) and only few stadiums have fences and trenches. Eredivisie attendency rate is averaging at a steady 19.000. This is not far behind Serie A, Ligue 1 and La Liga, which are hoovering between 21.000 and 26.000. With a constant 85+% attendency rate, Eredivisie atmosphere is great. 

The Netherlands is a really football-minded country. When you look at visitors per population you can say The Netherlands is the only country to keep up with Scotland in terms of visiting matches in first league per capita. That's the real asset of Dutch football. It also a fact that Eredivisie has great goal-per-match statistics and clubs are giving youngsters a change; i.e. average age in Eredivisie is 24.2 and Serie A is 27.5. Most stadiums offer climate neutral field heating (32km of pipes) and other durability/sustainability/green investments. Another interesting fact is that The Netherlands, among Germany and Switzerland, is leader in using stadiums as solar power plants.


Dutch Eredivisie offers a great fan experience. Most matches are sold out in a modern stadium with 10.000+ fans and up-to-date business facilities. Thanks to this stadium infrastructure, Dutch competition (€450 million turnover) is among the healthiest in Europe, after Germany and also privately owned Premier league. By healthy, I mean operating profits based on matchday revenue, fueled by a large and loyal fanbase. i.e. Feyenoord, Ajax and PSV have a combined equity of €160 million.



Dutch Club Football Crisis, 2010-2015, due to FFP, has been mostly overwon in 2015; our top 3 is (w)healthy again. However, we will soon be ranked #14 on UEFA Country Ranking. Since our €1 billion TV-deal (€60 million/2012 and ending (2024) at €100 million) with Fox, stadiums are to best way to grow turnover and to recover a top 10 position on UEFA Country Ranking. Main ambition is to become UEFA member League #7 to have access to 2 direct CL spots.

Most Dutch stadiums have been build between 1996-2005 and already being modernized at least once keeping them UEFA Cat. 4(-ready). Latest investment mostly "fixed" our 1990s trenches with seating all the way to the pitch. Some stadiums (and clubs) still drag some history of debts but slowly most clubs at least moved to a break-even business model which is self sustaining including cost of ownership (or usage) for stadiums and training facilities. A process which took more than 15 years, from realization to implementation along with fine-tuning. I call this "de-politification" of football.

WC2018 or WC2022 isn't coming to the Netherlands but Amsterdam will be a host city for EC2020. We are also hosting Women EC2017 (16 july - 6 august) with stadiums in Enschede, Utrecht, Breda, Tilburg, Rotterdam (Het kasteel), Doetinchem, Deventer. This tournament will be sold out every match, avg. around 17.000 fans. Despite those tournaments, clubs are on their own to finance most investments related to stadium development. Local governments are heavily involved, whether they like it or not.

*Actual plans, Work in Progress:*

 Ajax is host for EC2020 and announced a €50 million investment in the Amsterdam Arena. Being build in 1996, this stadium was one of the first modern multi-functional 50.000+ stadium. Every summer until 2020, a corner of the stadium will be rebuild creating lot's of extra square meter (more €€) with better looking styling and acoustics. LED lightning and standing places will also add to the experience. This update can also be the base for a future roof lift and update to 60-70.000. Besides, last few years Ajax already invested sensible money to modernize all over the place with extra seats, closing the moats, new locker rooms, better commercial rooms, WIFI/4G, climate neutral heating and cooling, reuse of rainwater, solar panels, etc. Result will be a steady €100 million budget with an UEFA EL prize money budget and without player transfers.









 PSV is the only club that can keep up with Ajax. This is thanks to PSV fully owning it's stadium and it's fruit. In 2015, PSV upgraded it's stadium experience with interior LED lights. Expect a wave of lightning coming to European stadiums. They also modernized their tunnel to enter the pitch and are planning to upgrade exterior lightning. 

















In 2016, €2 million modernization has been realized. All those upgrades will add to player and fan experience but won't bring in big money. 
- dug-outs are integrated in lower stands, surrounding the player tunnel. 
- 3.000 new Vario-seats with 1:1 conversion, 125 capacity upgrade (next year another 800 making 1:1.8 conversion and adding more Vario seats) 

Due to hosting summer concerts, PSV lost it longtime considered best field in Eredivisie to Feyenoord. PSV is also doing it's yearly field renewal. In 2014 it costed €800.000 and in 2015 it was done again. This summer, a complete renewal from soil, including drainage and field irrigation and heating and ofc a new field. This years new field is another shot to regain best field in Eredivisie. 

3 other novelties in Philips Stadium:
- Hawk-eye for goal-line tech at CL matches (payed by UEFA);
- Video ref (cup matches pilot with KNVB).
- Virtual Reality

Philips is cutting ties with PSV, next year shirtsponship is terminated after 30+ years. After having major financial problems between 2009-2014, this 2nd season with CL prize money is very welcome for PSV to re-invent themselves. More importantly, strong business partners injected €30 million into PSV balance sheets which instantly boosts budget with €2 million. Most money is meant to improve stadium and trainings facilities. Training's facility "De Herdgang" also receives a major upgrade. This will create room to expand summer concerts in Philips stadium from 4 to 9, which also will be good for PSV turnover. Current CL success will pull future developments forward.

In 2017, PSV can probably aim for 37.000 fans in domestic matches. PSV needs a finalized plan for a final upgrade of it's city center-based stadium, probably in 2 phases. Phase 1 will be the short sides (east and west) to 41.000 and phase 2 will complete the North stand to 45.000. The last phase is complicated and expensive as it will be build over the road. If they expand, their homeground will be held from 1913 untill atleast 2050, right in the city centre Eindhoven!








The already great atmosphere in Philips Stadium will continue to improve. City government is also planning to connect Strijp S with city-centre, via PSV stadium. This will also improve pre and post-match experience in city-center based stadium. Renewing exterior and including a video wall seems logic once the final upgrade is planned.

 Re-introducing standing is an easy growth path for most clubs. Go Ahead Eagles (2.100), De Graafschap, NEC (650 in 2 zones), AZ (converted 600 seat to 1.000 standing places), Heerenveen (extended from 1.200 to 2.000), Zwolle (2.000), Heracles, Excelsior and NAC already having standing fans since it's re-introduction in 2015. This season, PSV (3.000 Vario-seats) and Ajax will reintroduce standing. Feyenoord, Twente and Cambuur (untill their new 2017-2018 stadium only visitors can stand), are considering to replace some seats with standing places for die-hard fans. For lower ranked clubs, a 1:2 conversion is common while top7 clubs choose 1:1 conversions with Vario seating. Other countries with safe standing: Germany, Poland, Hungary, Scotland.
















Away fans have mandatory reserved places. Creating more flexibility (i.e. splitting in half) could optimize if away fans aren't there. This rule change would instantly benefit clubs like Zwolle, Groningen, Cambuur, Sparta and NAC.
 Namechanges for stadiums in Groningen (Euroborg in Noordlease) en Zwolle (Ijsseldelta in MAC3PARK) adds a bit more cash for them.

*Just finished:*
*2015-2016*

 Heracles started this 2015-2016 season with a newly added second ring, now 13.500 (from 8.500). Costs €30 million, bumping average to 11.342. Heracles skipped opportunity to wrap their stadium in black and white, like some beautiful others posted on this forum. The stadium name lease is expected to deliver €250.000. There is plenty of room for a future upgrade to 20.000.
















While this stadium is still one of the smallest in Eredivisie, it received many credits for it's atmosphere.

 By far smallest Eredivisie club Excelsior has a new 2015 main building. In summer 2016, 2 corners will be closed bringing fans from 3.750 to 4.500. Later on, the other corners can be closed as well, to 5.500 which still is to small for Eredivisie.









 Go Ahead Eagles just finished first €7 million (€6 payed by local government) part of their renewed stadium from 8.000 to 10.000. Besides 2 new stands also better business facilities including 10 skyboxes. This season they promoted, they plan on renewing the remaining 2 stands for another €4.8 million, bringing fans to 12.000. This includes vario seating in it's B-side stands. It might be done in winter 2016 and/or early summer 2017 (before hosting Women WC2017) since the money and building permit is available. Closing the corners will finalize their plans with a 15.000 capacity.









*2016-2017*

 FC Zwolle (from 12.500 to 13.600 in 2016/17) is upgrading their always sold out stadium, by bringing it's north stand (Martin Eibrinktribune) closer to the pitch and creating standing zones behind the goal. Also 4 large LED screens will be installed. Total costs phase 1: €500.000.
Phase 2 will bring capacity to 15.000 and will be done once the money is available, probably in the 2017-2018 season. Finally, a new roof would complete this stadium.

















 FC Utrecht stadium finally has a new owner, after a €20 million local government write-off. This is good news for the club and stadium. Last year they renewed their soundsystem, this year they renewed their field; now stadium is cat. 4 UEFA stadium again. They also achieved highest youth academy status. Closing moats is an easy opgrade.

 Vitesse is even lowering their capacity from 25.500 to 21.248. This is their second decrease of capacity, from 28.278. This will bring Eredivisie's attendency rate well above 90% again. Fans are disconnecting from it's Russian owner.


*2017-2018*
If Excelsior relegates, 2017-2018 season will probably be first in recent history where all 18 Eredivisie teams have 10.000+ fans. In a perfect scenario, Excelsior and ADO replaced with NAC and Cambuur, avg. attendency will probably reach close to 21.000.

 Cambuur's new €22 million stadium will be build in 2017 (and ready in 2018) with 15.000, coming from yearly sold-out 10.000. The larger project, a boulevard, costs another €23 million. Budget might raise from €7 million to €14 million.









*Not before 2020*

 Feyenoord will be redefined with a new stadium and a completely new training's facility (project name: Feyenoord City). Political yes is available and budget and final plans are being made. The new stadium needs to replace iconic De Kuip. Located at the Maas bank, this stadium could give an amazing city skyline view across the river. Estimated capacity is 63.000 with 3 stands and no complete roof. Start building in 2018 and will be ready in summer 2022. Result will be a steady €100 million budget without UEFA prize money and without player transfers. More final plans will be presented this year. If Feyenoord manage to retain it current great atmosphere, this stadium will outperform Ajax Amsterdam Arena (even after it's €50 million upgrade).









 Groningen, former Luiz Saurez and Arjen Robben club, made some great steps this year. New training's facility with strong and strategic partners. Having a sold-out stadium every 2 weeks since it's opening in 2006, it's time for an update. Currently, standing is added and the stadium will have a name change from Euroborg to Noordlease. Adding an 3rd tier should be possible with a grant walk/stands, lot's of business seats and skyboxes but would be really expensive. Lowering pitch could add 3 more rows extending with 5.000 extra fans. Re-wrapping exterior could even make this a great stadium since current indoor experience already is great. Besides, to improve experience further, "The Green Hell" needs some green LED's to start hosting music events. 









 Roda JC has the stadium and needs a better team to draw more fans. Now they have a new owner and he made sure relegation is no option. Stadium is owned by government and leaks money. However, since around 2005, Roda JC is finally set to restore some of it's former glory. 

 Willem II has the fans but are still struggling financially. Willem2 has zero assets but also no debts. City government owns stadium and Willem II can't even afford a youth academy. Above all, they play in an outdated stadium. Prognoses for Willem2 is that they will soon present a plan, in cooperation with city government. This club should easily be fixed to it's former €15 million budget. Stands can be brought closer to the pitch, starting with the short Kingside, adding 400 seats. Extra business seats should up the budget. Hosting non-football events is also the way forward.









 NEC also needs an upgraded stadium but process is slow due to retracting public money. In july 2016, NEC upped their bid on stadium from €6 million to €7.6 million. Local government asks €8.2 million (already came down from €10). For now, a €1.5 million maintenance upgrade is needed: new field + new complex heating installation + new field trainingscomplex + new field lightning. And good investors would instantly close the moats with 3 rows of seating, adding 2.500 fans.









More extended plans will add another €20 million for a completely transformed stadium, interior and exterior, with newly added 2nd ring (+8.000), bring spectators closer to the pitch (+2.500), greatly improved business facilities and improved media facilities. Hosting 8-10 non-football events can make this project succeed. This club and this city also have lot's of potential to transform into a campus. A fully developed Goffert park, with campus, could even transform NEC towards €20 million.
















In 2014, Goffert park station opened:









 AZ and Vitesse should draw more fans again. However, stadiums and trainings facilities are state of the art and they both have cash and well performing squads. 

 Twente can complete it's U-stadium to be a full O-stadium (+10.000) but they can also bring spectators closer to the pitch (+4.000). Total capacity can grow to 44.000.









 Heerenveen can close it's moat. For WC2018-bid, it was planned to enlarge to 40.000, but there is no need for such expansion. A modernization is needed: all rooms and audio- and video installations and a better pitch quality. But first it needs to lower their annual €3.3 million rent payment to €2 million.

 ADO is a sleeping giant (Den Haag is Dutch 3rd largest city) but the club is (and always have been) a difficult club, sort of similar to Feyenoord. Chinese investor Wang payed only €8 million for the club. This purchase didn't include the stadium, trainingsground, clublogo, clubcolors and he is not allowed to move the club out of the city. Besides, one seat in the club's Board is reserved for city government. Probably Chinese guys didn't fully understand all those provision when he bought ADO...

Club owner Wang and management are not on the same line. Wang still lives in China. He started with big announcements: Stadium upgrade, being champion, extra money, etc. But non of this happened. Al his payments are late and ADO even has more financial difficulties than before; currently all invoices higher than €35.000 are under supervision by the KNVB. So they start this season with their 3rd new director in 3 years. 

Maybe once management, city government and owner are aligned, something good can come out of this. Otherwise, this club will soon have another owner. For now, they lost their coach, who managed to keep the team stable while the club is surrounded by uncertainty.

Another fundamental problem is that Den Haag is within the same metropolitan as Rotterdam and thus Feyenoord. With Feyenoord, Sparta, ADO Den Haag, Excelsior and Dordrecht, this 2.5 million metropolitan area is over-crowded with clubs. Their stadium is easily expanded if needed: +5.000 (for €4-5 million) or even +15.000.

*Retrospective:*.
Ajax and Feyenoord will greatly improve by 2020 and 2022. PSV is updating it's trainings facility while Twente survived this years crisis with a €28 million budget. Rest of the sub-top teams, AZ, Heerenveen en Vitesse, are challenged by increasingly solid Utrecht and a healthy and growing Groningen. Finally, all subtoppers fixed their operating results to become less transfer dependent.

Steady growth towards sub-top is in the lower part of the League. Ranked #10-18 is a very competitive playground, all in danger for the financial "relegation"-gap. Eredivisie is up to a point where minimal capacity is 10.000 fans, translating in a €10 million budget. Heracles, Go Ahaed Eagles and Zwolle are rapidly growing towards 13.500, 12.000 and 15.000 fans. Roda JC is on it's way back with a new local owner and already have 14.500 fans. NAC (broke average fan record in Jupiler League with 14.000 and also broke match record against GAE with 17.800) and Cambuur just need a promotion for a €19 and €15 million budget. Zero debt/zero assets clubs like Willem2, De Graafschap and NEC (€3.5 million debt) need to fix damage from the past but a future update seems not that complex once the money is available. They have the fans and need to find ways to improve facilities, capacity and many other aspects of their government-owned stadium and club. All 3 clubs are big enough for a €15 million budget in the near future but they need to expand their foundation, stadium and youth Academy, first. A thriving sponsor community is needed for this. And fresh management and coaching.

Final step for those lower ranked clubs is to transform stadiums to better host non-football events. Music and dance events in summer season continues to grow so investing in stadiums seems sensible. For this, stadiums need better architecture and acoustics, LED lightning systems (monitors, interior, exterior, commercial and pitch lightning) and a roof-upgrade to offer rain-protection. Specifically for FC Groningen, FC Zwolle, Roda JC, Willem II and NEC. Mostly, government owns stadium and club being most important tenant. So another combined €50 million investments are on the horizon.
Other sensible investment are ofc more business seats to grow commercially (upfront skybox lease for access to capital), leasing it's stadium name, pitch sponsoring and better quality food&drinks, solar panels (crowd sourcing) and even the reuse of rainwater. 

Eredivisie is set for 6 years of investing and growing. The winners of the future, will be the ones benefiting most from the fruits of their stadium; instead of just paying rent and receiving matchday revenue. Changes listed above will bring our average attendency to around 22.000 in 2020 and 23.000 in 2022. 

Competing leagues
Let's see how troubled countries and clubs handle football crisis; A sustainable future without debts and overinvesting will only be true once attitude and policies change. Competitions need to step down to a point that fit's it's size and real turnover with less UEFA prize money, transfer money and debt reduction. I see either much smaller clubs connected to its fans or oligarch toys disconnected to it's fans.

Looking at League final 2015-2016 standings in Russia, Turkey and Ukrain. 
Anzhi, Kuban Krasnodor, Rubin Kazan, Dynamo Moskou, Trabsonspor, Bursaspor, Galatasaray, Fenerbache, Dnipro (probably bankrupt before 2016-2107 starts), Metalist and Shaktar all had a terrible season. This season won't be any better for those clubs in decline. Russia, Ukraine and Turkey are giants where infrastructure is only one problem solved. First they need their GDP rising and political stability to draw more fans to their new stadiums; tax regime remains interesting for players.

TPO impact on Iberian clubs like Porto, Sevilla, Benfica and Valencia, remains to be seen. And Italy needs huge stadium and ownership investments to improve Serie A. Besides, wages and transfers losses need to be reduced. 

2nd tier big 4 leagues clubs (Sevilla, Valencia, Fiorentina, Wolfsburg, Leverkussen) are in advantage due to market pool. Their shared part is bigger than ours unshared part. Current rule changes made it at least possible to outperform them but rules should change more in favor of domestic champions like Ajax, Olympiakos, Celtic, Glasgow, Anderlecht.

I understand it's impossible to keep all investors out of football but ending with an owner who bankrupt 100 years old football institutes is crazy. Like it was also crazy that clubs are loosing so much money: in transfer-system to shady off-shore companies and due to mis-management and overspending; this has nothing to do with spending in government-owned stadiums. Hence all regulation since community was and is still paying for mis-management from those clubs, accumulating to billions of debts in Mediterranean countries.

While TPO is used all over the world, together with accumulation debts, it's the main driver of current Iberian success. If TPO helps 10%, FFP brings another 10% and prize money changes another 5%, football is making big steps forward again and healthy leagues will benefit most. New UEFA draw rules also favors national champs over big league subtop, which is great for all smaller leagues. 

Dutch Eredivisie is not challenged by leagues below them. Belgium is the closest and they are greatly upgrading their infrastructure. But they won't get close to Eredivisie anytime soon. Switzerland, Greece, Portugal and any Eastern & Nordic competitions we continue to outperform on revenue thanks to stadium infrastructure. Besides, they have bigger problems then Eredivisie. Maybe a Nordic or a Slav eague might challenge Dutch position inUEFA football. Expect Greece, Portugal, Italy and Spain to privatize clubs due to refinancing stadiums (retracting public money) as part of de-politification of football. Some recent examples are Valencia, Atletico, Inter and AC. Next in line are Sociedad and/or Espanyol.

As for UEFA football, Eredivisie clubs PSV, Ajax, Feyenoord and AZ are well positioned. My idea is that Dutch Club Football Crisis is over. Eredivisie currently is a great League to kickstart a career towards Bundesliga, Premier League and La Liga. Stable clubs with great facilities to mature as person and as football player. In the meanwhile surpassed by Chinese CLS, US MLS, UK Championship, 2e. Bundesliga and India is inline.

*Conclusion:*
With €130 million investment (in the 2013-2019 time frame) in trainings facilities and Youth Academy's, Eredivisie is set to even more profile itself as the perfect league to start a football career. Add €150 million investments in Eredivisie stadiums (Ajax, Heracles, Zwolle, PSV, Cambuur, GAE) to have a total infrastructure investment of €280 million in a 2013-2020 time frame. Once Feyenoord realizes it's stadium and sport city project before 2022, at least another €250-350 million can be added.

Still, there is even more room to invest another €30 million within that time frame: 
- 2 more Regional trainingsfacility in South, updating Heerenveen, Sparta and Twente.
- Stadiums Twente, Groningen, Utrecht, Heerenveen, Willem2, NEC, De Graafschap can easily be improved/upgraded/finished.

All above should grow turnover with €90 million while increasing it's flow of talents. Adding it's progressive TV-deal, this would triple the Leagues growth rate of last five years. Since new 2016-2017 UEFA prize money distribution also shifted a little towards smaller countries, future is alot brighter then before. Specifically once you realize that EU football still has an operational deficit of €486 million (2014). Besides, UEFA is considering to implement debt reduction as part of FFP/Licensing. Current EU net debts is €6.6 billion (against €4.9 billion assets).

Some other interesting reads:
- I also made a trainings facilities topic with most significant campus, Academy's and trainingsfacilities in The Netherlands. Lot's of exiting developments in this area as well.
- KNVB Eredivisie Fan research 2015-2016: https://www.google.nl/url?sa=t&rct=...KXZpcobCNrQmIudsfyB4zQ&bvm=bv.123664746,d.d2s 
- Eredivisie Ticketpricing 2015-2016: http://www.knvbexpertise.nl/sites/k...ertise Analyse ticketprijzen oktober 2015.pdf


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

moved info 1 post up.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

Today's announcement:
In December 2016, Amsterdam Arena will be upgraded with LED-lightning. Similar to PSV and Chelsea, Ajax will add a new in-stadium experience, with extended possibilities and reduced costs (vs old-skool HID lightning).

Opening Glow-festival 2013:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhfJtqmD2Mc

LED Eredivisie debut @PSV Eindhoven 2015:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cByy1okURkE

PSV - Atletico, last season 1/8 CL finales 2016:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4j1ffuNVBo





Chelsea also is using those lights:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G74L2qi6C_M

Since those LED-lights, PSV is nearly unbeatable at home matches ;-)

_note: Updated 2 posts above with better info._


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

And today's news is about Groningen changing it stadium name from Euroborg into Noordlease stadium for at least 6 years to come. In return, Noordlease offers a Museum. Probably also some more cash.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

Great summary of the Eredivisie venues, duketown. I've always enjoyed watching games from that league and would be thrilled to see more of those clubs averaging near/over 15k. Love how well they respond to fan desires and ambition!

Question, however: What's the gist of this graphic? It appears to show the joint value of the Eredivisie and Belgium's Jupiler League. Has there been talk of a merger?



NL-duketown said:


>


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## Chimaera (Mar 14, 2007)

^^ Jupiler League is the Dutch second division, not to be confused with the Jupiler Pro League, which is the Belgian first division.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

GunnerJacket said:


> Great summary of the Eredivisie venues, duketown. I've always enjoyed watching games from that league and would be thrilled to see more of those clubs averaging near/over 15k. Love how well they respond to fan desires and ambition!
> 
> Question, however: What's the gist of this graphic? It appears to show the joint value of the Eredivisie and Belgium's Jupiler League. Has there been talk of a merger?


Thnx. It's about combined turnover of all 18 Eredivisie clubs is nearing €0.5 billion and all 18 teams making profit but transfers are needed. Jupiler League indeed also sponsors Dutch 2nd level Division. 
Both KNVB and KBVB are drastically transforming their subtop division. Belgium Tweede Klasse will only be 8 teams and Dutch Jupiler League added a relegation to connect amateur and professional, with a semi-professional third League. 

A merger between Dutch and Belgium 2 top leagues seems way to complex. However, merging Dutch Jupiler League with Belgium Tweede Klasse makes sense. This could create a 20 club League with 4.000-10.000 fans per match. This Division could be a entry League for talent 20-22 and would both fix Dutch and Belgium 2nd level Divisions with a newly created "Academy League" (or LowLands League). This league than can compete Nordic and Eastern League but most of all it could be a league for 20 clubs wich aren't part of 34 first League teams. Could solve problems for both 2nd levels in Netherlands and Belgium.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

The average attendance in the Eredivisie will drop significantly with FC Twente (25k) now opting for bankruptcy.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

Chimaera said:


> ^^ Jupiler League is the Dutch second division, not to be confused with the Jupiler Pro League, which is the Belgian first division.


Ah. I did not know this, so that explains a lot. 

Danke!


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> The average attendance in the Eredivisie will drop significantly with FC Twente (25k) now opting for bankruptcy.


Luckily for Dutch football, this isn't gonna happen. Court decided today that De Graafschap will relegate and FC Twente will stay in Eredivisie.


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## Ajatolah (Apr 12, 2015)

@NL-duketown
Thanks for a great update. What sort of "problems" are there with ADO's Chinese owner? Being such a large city, it's a pity Den Haag doesn't have a strong club.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

*ADO Den Haag*



Ajatolah said:


> @NL-duketown
> Thanks for a great update. What sort of "problems" are there with ADO's Chinese owner? Being such a large city, it's a pity Den Haag doesn't have a strong club.


Thnx man. 
ADO is a sleeping giant but the club is (and always have been) a difficult club, sort of similar to Feyenoord. Chinese investor Wang payed only €8 million for the club. This purchase didn't include the stadium, trainingsground, clublogo, clubcolors and he is not allowed to move the club out of the city. Besides, one seat in the club's Board is reserved for city government. Probably Chinese guys didn't fully understand all those provision when he bought ADO...

Club owner Wang and management are not on the same line. Wang still lives in China. He started with big announcements: Stadium upgrade, being champion, extra money, etc. But non of this happened. Al his payments are late and ADO even has more financial difficulties than before; currently all invoices higher than €35.000 are under supervision by the KNVB. So they start this season with their 3rd new director in 3 years. 

Maybe once management, city government and owner are aligned, something good can come out of this. Otherwise, this club will soon have another owner. For now, they are pretty steady with a €14 million budget but in this half of the League, an extra €3 million budget could really make a difference so there is potential.

Another fundamental problem is that Den Haag is within the same metropolitan as Rotterdam and thus Feyenoord. With Feyenoord, Sparta, ADO Den Haag, Excelsior and Dordrecht, this 2.5 million metropolitan area is over-crowded with clubs. Besides, when the club build a new stadium, they left "Zuiderpark" for an industrial area, which never was (and still isn't) really accepted by supporters.

In the early days of dutch football, 1900-1920,	HVV Den Haag was unbeatable. In the early days of ADO, 1940s, 2 titles were won. After that, ADO was known for it's hooligans. And currently, it's an anonymous club.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

*PSV prepares for 2016-2017 season*

PSV is doing a €500.000 finetuning to their East stand:
- 3.000 new Vario-seats with 1:1 conversion
- 125 capacity upgrade (next year another 800)
- White seating with reference to "Oost" (East, most die-hard fans)
- seat rearrangement to accommodate standing and to avoid yearly UEFA fines for illegeal standing.









Next year, another round of transforming and probably make all standing a 1:1.8 conversion, bringing capacity over 36.000 for domestic matches. This might even be done in winter.









Due to hosting summer concerts, PSV lost it longtime considered best field in Eredivisie to Feyenoord. PSV is also doing it's yearly field renewal. In 2014 it costed €800.000 and in 2015 it was done again. This summer, a complete renewal from soil, including drainage and field heating and ofc a new field. This years new field is another shot to regain best field in Eredivisie. 









Finally, current below field dug-outs are integrated in lower stands, surrounding the player tunnel, BPL-style. All those upgrades will add to player and fan experience, specifically with those extra standing places in domestic matches. In 2017, PSV can probably aim for 37.000 fans in domestic matches. Training's facility "De Herdgang" also receives a major upgrade. This will create room to expand summer concerts in Philips stadium from 4 to 9, which also will be good for PSV turnover.

For a atmospheric impression, PSV - Atletico, last season 1/8 CL finales 2016:





2 other novelties in Philips Stadium:
- Hawk-eye for goal-line tech at CL matches (payed by UEFA);
- Video ref (cup matches pilot with KNVB).

Philips is cutting ties with PSV, next year shirtsponship is terminated after 30+ years. After having major financial problems between 2009-2014, this 2nd season with CL prize money is very welcome for PSV to re-invent themselves.

The already great atmosphere in Philips Stadium will be improved once again. City government is also planning to connect Strijp S with city-centre, via PSV stadium. A fan square might arise close to the stadium. This will also improve pre and post-match experience in city-center based stadium.

All this is UEFA CL money well spent.:applause:


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

NL-duketown said:


> PSV is doing a €500.000 finetuning to their East stand:
> - New Vario-seats
> - 125 capacity upgrade (next year another 800)


What's your source on the 800 seats expansion for next year?


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> What's your source on the 800 seats expansion for next year?


PSV support. It's not happening this year due to Guus Meeuwis contract.


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## Chimaera (Mar 14, 2007)

NL-duketown said:


> Philips is cutting ties with PSV, next year shirtsponship is terminated after 30+ years. After having major financial problems between 2009-2014, this 2nd season with CL prize money is very welcome for PSV to re-invent themselves.


PSV without Philips still doesn't make sense to me. It's what the P in PSV is for after all. Philips was a big employer in my home town for nearly 60 years (one of the biggest TV factories in the world and an important R&D center) until it closed a couple of years ago. It had several sport clubs (football, badminton...) for its employees, they were called PSV as well.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

Chimaera said:


> PSV without Philips still doesn't make sense to me. It's what the P in PSV is for after all. Philips was a big employer in my home town for nearly 60 years (one of the biggest TV factories in the world and an important R&D center) until it closed a couple of years ago. It had several sport clubs (football, badminton...) for its employees, they were called PSV as well.


Yes, psv is reinventing themselves. Philips have been and remains a great sponsor; just not as prominent. All things end but 5 new partners injecting €30 million into the balance sheet, improving budget, trainings facility and stadium isn't that bad. Besides, the new shirt sponsors pays better than Philips did than when they had exclusive kit sponsoring; now there's room for 2 or 3 sponsors. Above all, Philips mostly left Eindhoven and main office nowadays is in Amsterdam anyway. It's time to disconnect those ties between Philips and PSV. That project has been worked on for years and now it's comming in final stages.

And what about Feyenoord. First trainingsday welcomed 9.000 fans! Have you ever seen this? For Feyenoord, it's normal.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

NL-duketown said:


> And what about Feyenoord. First trainingsday welcomed 9.000 fans! Have you ever seen this? For Feyenoord, it's normal.


Yes, for us that is what we are used to.  The pitch is bad now due to an event and on July 2nd Monstertrucks will give a show here. After that the pitch will be replaced.

1.

Feyenoord Rotterdam - first training session 2016-2017-1 by Erwin Pakasi, on Flickr

2.

Feyenoord Rotterdam - first training session 2016-2017-2 by Erwin Pakasi, on Flickr


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## Guest (Jun 27, 2016)

Flares at training, brilliant. Other teams gets strong turnout for training sessions. It's certainly not unheard of. 

What is impressive about Feyenoord is its support base considering how unsuccessful the team has been in living memory.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

5portsF4n said:


> Flares at training, brilliant. Other teams gets strong turnout for training sessions. It's certainly not unheard of.
> 
> What is impressive about Feyenoord is its support base considering how unsuccessful the team has been in living memory.


Yes, Feyenoord fans say this is the only time a year they can truly cheer for their team ;-)

Which clubs do you refer to?


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## Guest (Jun 27, 2016)

NL-duketown said:


> Yes, Feyenoord fans say this is the only time a year they can truly cheer for their team ;-)
> 
> Which clubs do you refer to?


Actually I could be wrong. I was thinking of when big clubs hold training sessions on their overseas tours and they get thousands of people turn up. 

Not sure how often big Euro clubs do this at their stadiums, as all of them seem to have a training complex somewhere.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

5portsF4n said:


> Actually I could be wrong. I was thinking of when big clubs hold training sessions on their overseas tours and they get thousands of people turn up.
> 
> Not sure how often big Euro clubs do this at their stadiums, as all of them seem to have a training complex somewhere.


As far as I know, Feyenoord, Borussia Dortmund and Liverpool share this status. I would love to know which clubs can challenge this status. I really think Feyenoord has among the best supporters (attendency numbers, loyalty, atmosphere) in Europe. However, UEFA might disagree ;-)

Feyenoord is punished by UEFA for the "banana"-incident with a final warning for a future ban.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

*NEC - Goffert Park*

today, NEC upped their bid on stadium from €6 million to €7.6 million. Local government asks €8.2 million (already came down from €10). So maybe, soon this club starts moving again.... :banana:



NL-duketown said:


> [*] NEC also needs an upgraded stadium but process is slow due to retracting public money. Stadium purchase price is around €8 million. For now, a €1.5 million maintenance upgrade is needed: new field + new complex heating installation + new field trainingscomplex + new field lightning.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Willem2 and NEC probably offer the most out-dated stadium in the Eredivisie. Since this season, Go Ahaed Eagles and Excelsior aren't outdated anymore. Prognoses for Willem2 is that they will soon present a plan, in cooperation with city government. Willem2 has zero assets but also no debts. This club should easily be fixed to it's former €15 million budget. A fully developed Goffert park, with campus, could even transform NEC towards €20 million.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

This season, 2 healthy clubs promoted: Sparta en Go Ahead Eagles. 
Both club will draw same average attendency at 11.000, similar to relegated Cambuur and De Graafschap. However, both clubs have 2 great city-based stadiums holding ground since early 1900s, are in better financial health and offer better facilities to fans. Having around €9 million budget, they both should outperform Excelsior and can challenge Willem 2.

*Sparta:*
Sparta is on a tight budget but they are well-known in delivering talents from the Rotterdam metropolitan. A partnership with PSV is on the rise.









*Go Ahead Eagles:*
Go Ahead Eagles just finished first €7 million (€6 payed by local government) part of their renewed stadium from 8.000 to 10.000. Besides 2 new stands also better business facilities for minimum 230 sponsors including 10 skyboxes. This season they promoted, they plan on renewing the remaining 2 stands for another €4.8 million, bringing fans to 12.000. It might be done in winter 2016 and/or early summer 2017 (before hosting Women WC2017).









Steady growth towards sub-top is in the lower part of the League. Ranked #10-18 is a very competitive playground, all in danger for the financial "relegation"-gap. Eredivisie is up to a point where minimal capacity is 10.000 fans, translating in a ~€10 million budget. However, soon a €15 million budget is needed..

Heracles, Go Ahaed Eagles and Zwolle are rapidly growing towards 13.500, 12.000 and 15.000 fans. 
NAC (broke average fan record in Jupiler League with 14.000 and also broke match record against GAE with 17.800) and Cambuur just need a promotion for a €18 and €13 million budget. 

Zero debt/zero assets clubs are big enough for a €15 million budget in the near future. A thriving sponsor community and city government cooperation to convert stadium problems into assets, are essential. 
 Roda JC is on it's way back with a new local owner and already have 14.500 fans. It's important that football in Limburg will be repaired.
 NEC is on it's way to clear out €3.5 million debt ánd fixing their stadium problems.
 Willem2 and De Graafschap already cleared out debt and are tinkering their stadium problems. 

NEC and Willem2 even needs to close their moats but both clubs are expected to start moving forward again this season. Other sensible investment are ofc more business seats to grow commercially (upfront skybox lease for access to capital), leasing it's stadium name, pitch sponsoring and better quality food&drinks, solar panels (crowd sourcing) and even the reuse of rainwater.

Final step for those lower ranked clubs is to transform stadiums to better host non-football events. Mostly, government owns stadium and club being most important tenant. Music and dance events in summer season continues to grow so investing in stadiums seems sensible. For this, stadiums need better architecture and acoustics, LED lightning systems (monitors, interior, exterior, commercial and pitch lightning) and a roof-upgrade to offer rain-protection. Specifically for FC Groningen, FC Zwolle, Roda JC, Willem II and NEC. So another combined €50-100 million investments in transforming those football specific stadiums into multi-event hosting arena's, are on the horizon.

Eredivisie is set for 6 years of investing and growing. Ongoing investments will bring our average attendency to around 22.000 in 2020 and 23.000 in 2022. The winners of the future, will be the ones benefiting most from the fruits of their stadium; instead of just paying rent and receiving matchday revenue. The real winners are those who sell there media rights to billions of fans.


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## JYDA (Jul 14, 2008)

I notice a lot of stadiums in Holland have moats. Are pitch invasions that big of a problem?


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

Small PSV update as well:
New BPL-style dug-outs:








New standing on East:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CmoUtPdWgAAFJgt.jpg

















Also, next year another €1 million investment to replace all seating with new ones. Maybe even in winter, if CL knockout will be reached:









The good thing about those investments is that PSV is committed to it's city-centre based stadium and fans. Currently, €50 million cash reserve is available and invested wisely. Once the the 2nd stadium is finished, main stadium can offer 4 more summer events while lower operating costs. Growth scenario to 45.000 seems to be next. A Basel-like expansion seems sensible but with an added exterior video wall.

But it's gonna be expensive so Eindhoven should apply by UEFA for city hosting. This plan needs to mature this year and combined with Sport Campus Eindhoven.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

JYDA said:


> I notice a lot of stadiums in Holland have moats. Are pitch invasions that big of a problem?


Due to 90s hooliganism (on XTC), moats have been mandatory. Hooliganism isn't a problem nowadays. Now most moats are already reverted; just a few stadiums to go.


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## bajanssen (Feb 20, 2009)

Major problem for Willem II is that local government as owner of the stadium usses it to make money. For the club there is little support when it comes to help with renovating/ updating/ expanding the stadium. 
Best case the club buys back the stadium and is again king in his own castle. Sadly due to mis-management and near bankruptcy the needed to sell and hire the stadium at very bad terms and conditions.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

bajanssen said:


> Major problem for Willem II is that local government as owner of the stadium usses it to make money. For the club there is little support when it comes to help with renovating/ updating/ expanding the stadium.
> Best case the club buys back the stadium and is again king in his own castle. Sadly due to mis-management and near bankruptcy the needed to sell and hire the stadium at very bad terms and conditions.


Yes, to fix Willem2 lot's needs to be done. They have a great fanbase and history. This year they cleared out their debts and coming year the future need to be set. Regain Academy license is prio 1 and stadium plan is prio 2. To get this ball rolling, some (local) business men need to step up and lease the fruit of the stadium for 30 years, for €1 millionrent a year. Followed with a €20 million investment to modernize current stadium this club can easily restore it's €15 million budget.

For now, nothing changed and they will have a tough year ahead. Maybe the new coach can do excellent work.

For longterm succes, local government, UvT, Fonthys, hospital and Willem2 should work towards Tilburg Sport Campus and it's stadium should be used to host 5-8 non-football events.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

- Funny you mention Willem 2: today the Tilburg city council will approve a bill for the stadium to be renovated. Willem 2 have already stated that closing the moats with additional seats is one of the priorities.

- In addition: Go Ahead Eagles today expressed their intention to increase their stadium's capacity to about 15,000.


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## Axelferis (Jan 18, 2008)

i didn't realize that psv & rotterdam stadium look so outdated.
New stadiums are needed


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

Axelferis said:


> i didn't realize that psv & rotterdam stadium look so outdated.
> New stadiums are needed


Yes both stadium are oldskool but don't fool yourself: Both stadiums and clubs offer better fan experience and atmosphere than ANY club in Ligue 1 has to offer. Even Lyon and St. Ettienne can't compete Feyenoord and PSV in terms of fan experience and/or atmosphere. But yes, both clubs could easily add another €100 million turnover to the Eredivisie, just by having a better stadium.

If you wan't atmospheric impressions, go check youtube, or read what Seville players had to say about Feyenoord atmospere after winning the EL in 2014 ;-)
You can also read what Simeone and Atletico had to say over PSV before and after last seasons 1/8 CL finale. Those Spanish teams didn't know what happened to them. They had a total different experience to what they where used to.

Let's see what happens to France new stadiums and the involved costs for clubs. If clubs can't break current apathetic French supporters attitude, those new stadiums will only add to Ligue 1 less entertaining league with even more half-empty stadiums. Better be careful what you wish for; if PSV and Feyenoord would have had a better stadium, the Eredivisie would have surpassed Ligue 1 on average fans. 

Since both club are sold out year by year, Feyenoord will get a spectacular new stadium in 2022 and PSV is always updating it's city-centre based stadium. Next year they will have new seats and this great stadium will have the looks and facilities similar to a new stadium. Above all, PSV owns their stadium.

Note:
Eredivisie surpassed Turkey, Greece, Italy in terms of atmosphere. Only Bundesliga and Premier League have better atmosphere and fan experience. And the best thing is that lot's of development already is planned.


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## werner10 (Sep 11, 2002)

@nl-duketown

It is a sign of maturity of you're able to listen to critique. So just listen - and don't feel threathened. Since it is an illusion to think that your identity has anything to do with being a Dutchmen or, for that matter, a stadium in a city somewhere on this planet. 

Wake up, dude!


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## Damon Jay Wimborne (Dec 12, 2015)

*PEC Zwolle*

PEC Zwolle, playing at top flight level, are erecting a concrete lower tier in front of the elevated Marten Eibrink Stand to secure a marginal increase by a few hundred seats at their current 12,500 plus capacity Mac3Park.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

Damon Jay Wimborne said:


> PEC Zwolle, playing at top flight level, are erecting a concrete lower tier in front of the elevated Marten Eibrink Stand to secure a marginal increase by a few hundred seats at their current 12,500 plus capacity Mac3Park.


_"a marginal few hundred"_? 
My data says they will go to 13.600, which is an 1.100 (or ~10%) increase. Remember, this team is and will be sold out every match and they can use any $eat. Closing most of the moats is great. It's a tough fight, being ranked #10-18 in Eredivisie. Thanks to this increase and more TV money income, Zwolle increased their budget from €11.2 to €12.5 million in 2016-2017. ASAP, Zwolle will extend to 15.000, probably before 2017/2018 season, once the money is available.

And great pics! Respect for the work done! Did you also notice the new LED screens in the lightning masts? And 2.000 newly created standing zones? Those are nice additions as well for the Zwolle fans. And starting in 2016-2017 season, all teams need to accommodate 12 players on the bench.


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## Damon Jay Wimborne (Dec 12, 2015)

werner10 said:


> @nl-duketown
> 
> It is a sign of maturity of you're able to listen to critique. So just listen - and don't feel threathened. Since it is an illusion to think that your identity has anything to do with being a Dutchmen or, for that matter, a stadium in a city somewhere on this planet.
> 
> Wake up, dude!


Intriguing of note his pathetic, and competitive, defensive reflex. Some comments do not necessarily exhibit a high level of consciousness.


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## Damon Jay Wimborne (Dec 12, 2015)

NL-duketown said:


> _"a few hundred"_?
> My data says they will go to 13.600, which is an 1.100 (or ~10%) increase.


Thank you for acknowledging and confirming we're talking a few hundred.





NL-duketown said:


> Closing most of the moats is great. It's a tough fight, being ranked #10-18 in Eredivisie.


???


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

Damon Jay Wimborne said:


> Intriguing of note his pathetic, and competitive, defensive reflex. Some comments do not necessarily exhibit a high level of consciousness.


If you like insults: your judgement is broken.



Damon Jay Wimborne said:


> Thank you for acknowledging and confirming we're talking a few hundred.


I'm from the metric system; 1100 is not a _marginal few hunderd_ (on a 12,500 stadium). It's ~10%.



Damon Jay Wimborne said:


> ???


Are you trollling? This is a great update for Zwolle. They are in an upward spiral for years, growing and investing, all paid for by themselves, with sensible management. Besides, this is just a phase in an upgrade towards 15.000.


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## Damon Jay Wimborne (Dec 12, 2015)

NL-duketown said:


> I'm from the metric system; 1100 is not a few hunderd (on a 12,500 stadium). It's ~10%.



Whatever rocks your 'hunderd' in a boat, boy. 




Nl-duketown said:


> Are you trollling?


No need to disqualify yourself, boy.

Just asking to elaborate on your qoute :It's a tough fight, being ranked #10-18 in Eredivisie.

Didn't realise you'd take seats as serious as ebola.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

Damon Jay Wimborne said:


> Whatever rocks your 'hunderd' in a boat, boy.


Great, you seem to be responsive after all.



Damon Jay Wimborne said:


> Just asking to elaborate on your qoute :It's a tough fight, being ranked #10-18 in Eredivisie.


I missed your intention (due to marginal few hundred increase) but in that case, I quote myself:


Me said:


> Steady growth towards sub-top is in the lower part of the League. Ranked #10-18 is a very competitive playground, all in danger for the financial "relegation"-gap. Eredivisie is up to a point where minimal capacity is 10.000 fans, translating in a €10 million budget. Heracles, Go Ahaed Eagles and Zwolle are rapidly growing towards 13.500, 12.000 and 15.000 fans. Roda JC is on it's way back with a new local owner and already have 14.500 fans. NAC (broke average fan record in Jupiler League with 14.000 and also broke match record against GAE with 17.800) and Cambuur just need a promotion for a €19 and €15 million budget. Zero debt/zero assets clubs like Willem2, De Graafschap and NEC (€3.5 million debt) need to fix damage from the past but a future update seems not that complex once the money is available. They have the fans and need to find ways to improve facilities, capacity and many other aspects of their government-owned stadium and club. All 3 clubs are big enough for a €15 million budget in the near future but they need to expand their foundation, stadium and youth Academy, first. A thriving sponsor community is needed for this. And fresh management and coaching.
> 
> Final step for those lower ranked clubs is to transform stadiums to better host non-football events. Music and dance events in summer season continues to grow so investing in stadiums seems sensible. For this, stadiums need better architecture and acoustics, LED lightning systems (monitors, interior, exterior, commercial and pitch lightning) and a roof-upgrade to offer rain-protection. Specifically for FC Groningen, FC Zwolle, Roda JC, Willem II and NEC. Mostly, government owns stadium and club being most important tenant. So another combined €50 million investments are on the horizon.
> Other sensible investment are ofc more business seats to grow commercially (upfront skybox lease for access to capital), leasing it's stadium name, pitch sponsoring and better quality food&drinks, solar panels (crowd sourcing) and even the reuse of rainwater.


ps. 
normally fans post construction pictures with some enthusiasm but your post looked like it meant to downplay FC Zwolle. Just like the post before you was just meant to downplay Feyenoord and PSV without adding to the topic. I respect Zwolle and I love the effort and growth they showed in the last years. Remember, Eredivisie is a league dependent on matchday revenue and TV money is only a small part of club budgets.

I assume you've taken the pics yourself? Do you like to visit stadiums, post pics on a international forum, and then downplaying the work being done?


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## Damon Jay Wimborne (Dec 12, 2015)

Eredivisie Burlesque cq Soap Opera

Episode 1
FC Twente from Enschede have been relegated to the Jupiler League (second division) in the Netherlands as punishment for breaching and violating financial regulations linked to the transfer market, the Dutch football association announced.

It followed crisis talks between the Dutch FA and the club after FC Twente missed their latest deadline for meeting targets set in a financial recovery plan.

The issue dates back to February 2014 when the Royal Netherlands Football Association (KNVB) summoned FC Twente to adjust their deal with investment company Doyen Sports because it had too much say in transfer contracts.

Episode 2
FC Twente will play in the Dutch top-flight Eredivisie next season after all, following a successful appeal against a decision to demote the club following financial irregularities.

An independent appeals panel reversed the decision taken last month by the licensing commission of the Royal Netherlands Football Association (KNVB). Rather than demotion FC Twente have been fined 180,000 euros (approx $203,000).

Episode 3
De Graafschap - who were demoted after regular play-offs - could have remained in the Eredivisie if Twente's relegation had been upheld. However, FC Twente’s successful appeal means that De Graafschap from Doetinchem, which would have stayed up had Twente gone down, will be relegated to the second-tier Jupiler League next season.


Subsequently, De Graafschap said they were looking at taking legal steps to prevent them from being relegated to the Jupiler League.
"The ruling by the appeals commission however is final which means that De Graafschap's relegation is effective" the KNVB said.


Episode 4
*De Graafschap are ready to fight the KNVB following their decision to overturn the relegation of FC Twente which would leave them in the Jupiler League (second division) next season.*


De Graafschap are unhappy with the outcome of the long protracted saga between the Dutch FA and the financially-stricken FC Twente.
During the travesty DeGraafschap were left unable to attract players who weren't willing to commit to a team that didn't know which division they would be playing in for the 2016/17 campaign.
A statement on De Graafschap’s official website read: "The club want the KNVB to strictly enforce the rules in order to ensure a fair and level playing field for all competing teams. De Graafschap now, wanted and unwanted, take the lead in a process whose outcome should be a fair competition and clear regulations which is carefully monitored by the KNVB. We owe that to our employees, our volunteers, our supporters, but also those of all the other clubs."

Episode 5
The Graafschap indeed goes to court, refuting the decision of the appeals committee of the KNVB to reinstate FC Twente’s spot at top flight level. According to De Graafschap, FC Twente were wrongly admitted to the Eredivisie by the appeals comittee.

Episode 6
Friday 16 July 2016.
A court’s decision has ruled out the option of the Dutch Eredivisie kicking off the 2016/17 campaign with 19 clubs. The judge ruled that allowing De Graafschap in the Eredivisie as nineteenth club is 'impracticable'. 



The court ruled that adding an additional club is not feasible. Allowing De Graafschap would mess up both the fixtures lists of the Eredivisie as those of the Jupiler League. 


Episode 7

The Graafschap still feels victimised by ‘a chaos, orchestrated by the KNVB’ and are considering ‘to institute so-called substantive proceedings’.




One next possible step, the club’s lawyer says, is ‘submitting an emergency appeal’.

Episode 8
…


----------



## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

Damon Jay Wimborne said:


> Eredivisie Burlesque cq Soap Opera
> ...blablah ...


Congrats: You found a problem!

Yes, quite a soap. Yearly to see in the Mediterranean; now also in The Netherlands due to footballeaks uncovering shady club owners. Can you imagine the shitstorm heading to the Mediterranean? Those countries are not as adequate as The Netherlands in dealing with those leaks (or most other problems) but the leaks showed 100x more troubles for those countries, specifically Iberian Peninsula. Football landscape is always shifting and Eredivisie is ready: Hardly TPO- problems, operational deficits and non-stadium related debts. Only thing missing, are better foreign TV deals.

i.e. FIGC (Italian FA) said that if stronger rules (still less strict than Dutch rules) would be applied, only 2 clubs would play Serie A. However, UEFA is pushing forward and expect some clubs to become oligarch toy.

This Twente-case will be a great reference to punish other clubs. Once again, the Dutch are first to deal with a complex problem (cheating club owners). KNVB ofc played a clumsy role in dealing with all this. Still, KNVB already send a detailed report to the UEFA with extra requirements for all clubs in Europe to prevent shit like this. This will be a start in jurisprudence against all money laundering football systems.
Anyway, besides one useless appeal, case is closed. Twente is still alive and kicking; De Graafschap simply relegated (based on sportive results) but their hope to replace Twente changed into desperation.

ps. Seems you're on a crusade. Proving what? Anything else to disrespect Zwolle stadium or Dutch Eredivisie? Why post pics anyway? Eredivisie still is a real football league; not a Oligarch toy league and neither a debt-riddled league. Contrary, Eredivisie is mostly debt-free with profitable clubs deeply embedded in local community.


Twente fans showing why this club is Dutch 4th club:








All this shit will result in an even stronger Twente, with a better ownership model.


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## Damon Jay Wimborne (Dec 12, 2015)

PEC Zwolle’s home ground has seen yet another name change. From the Gemeentelijk Sportpark aka Ceintuurbaan aka Oosterenk Stadion aka Ijsseldelta Stadion to now aka Mac3Park. 

PEC turned professional on 23 February 1955 and alternately played at the ‘ Vrolijkheid’ and the ‘ Gemeentelijk Sportpark’. The latter become their permament home in 1970.
The’ Gemeentelijk Sportpark’, aka the ‘ Ceintuurbaan’ , due to its location, was a basic affair, with a brick & wooden main stand running half the length of the pitch and shallow cinder terracing sweeping around three ends, open to the elements. The ground in its original basic shape can be seen top left in the picture. 
































PEC became PEC Zwolle in 1971 after having ‘absorbed’ local rivals Zwolsche Boys in 1969. The mid-seventies saw slight changes to the Gemeentelijk Sportpark with the erection over a covered terracing, running three quarters of the pitch opposite main stand, raising the capacity to 15,000.











In 1978 PEC Zwolle were promoted to the ‘ Eredivisie’ and enjoyed a relatively successful spell. By 1982, PEC Zwolle had amassed a debt of three million euro, resulting in a flirtation with bankruptcy. PEC Zwolle became PEC Zwolle '82 after real estate developer Marten Eibrink ensured power in 1982. 
The club’s name change coincided with a drastic metamorphosis of the Gemeentelijk Sportpark with the erection of covered terracing on three sides of the ground and the building of a main stand.It became known as the Oosterenk Stadion, named after the new and adjacent business park, developed by Marten Eibrink.






























By 1990 PEC Zwolle’82 were still plagued by the financial irregularities from the PEC Zwolle days. Eventually this led to the club's bankruptcy in March 1990 and the rise of FC Zwolle, the club severing previous ties of financial dire straits.
Subsequently, the Oosterenk Stadion, epitomising an unhappy era, was baptised FC Zwolle Stadion with a capacity reduced to a 6,800 all-seater.




FC Zwolle gained promotion to the top flight in 2012. It is time for a second reincarnation. FC Zwolle entered the ‘Eredivisie’ as PEC Zwolle and the FC Zwolle Stadion was branded the IJsseldelta Stadion, the river running through Zwolle , reflecting the city and the club’s catchment area.


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## Damon Jay Wimborne (Dec 12, 2015)

As of the start of the 2016-2017 campaign the Klaas Drost Stand at PEC Zwolle’s Mac3Park will boast a provision for visually impaired supporters.




It is the result of a social media campaign by club faithful Frank Maatman, in close harmony with club ambassador and rapper Sticks.




One easy accessible section of ten seats shall be designated to accommodate blind or visually impaired fans, their supervisors and two hostesses and commentators. A dedicated wireless system is to be installed.

A rotating scheme for volunteers and commentators shall be implied. I am going to apply for a session as guest commentator.


This unique service is scheduled to be available for the first time on Saturday, August 20 when PEC Zwolle are at home to league champions PSV Eindhoven.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

As ongoing rule unification between KNVB and UEFA, KNVB decided that from coming season all Eredivisie fields have to be UEFA sized (105x68m); untill now, Eredivisie clubs had a few meters variance.

No impact:
ADO Den Haag, Heracles, Ajax, AZ Alkmaar, Feyenoord, FC Groningen, PSV, FC Twente, Roda JC Kerkrade and Vitesse.

Impact:
SC Heerenveen needs to shorten their field, and PEC Zwolle and NEC Nijmegen need to make their fields less wide. Willem2 needs to shrink 4x3m.

FC Utrecht recently complied with a UEFA-sized pitch while I'm pretty sure GAE and Sparta have correct sizes. Excelsior is the only club being exempt. Still, they adapted to their abilities along with their new main building.


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## Damon Jay Wimborne (Dec 12, 2015)

NL-duketown said:


> I assume you've taken the pics yourself? Do you like to visit stadiums, post pics on a international forum, and then downplaying the work being done?



Uploaded with the best of intentions. 

However, with all due respect, it's not my ambition to be entertained by the delusions of a myopic, hostile and pedantic pedestrian, taking a few hundred seats more serious than a venereal disease.


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## bajanssen (Feb 20, 2009)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> - Funny you mention Willem 2: today the Tilburg city council will approve a bill for the stadium to be renovated. Willem 2 have already stated that closing the moats with additional seats is one of the priorities.


Since Tilburg is the owner of the stadium the club needs approval for any renovation. Hopefully this is not a problem and will the club succeed in finding the funding without having to use tax payers money. Slowly we will find our way up again after years of budget cuts and poor results, I hope.


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## NL-duketown (Jun 3, 2016)

bajanssen said:


> Since Tilburg is the owner of the stadium the club needs approval for any renovation. Hopefully this is not a problem and will the club succeed in finding the funding without having to use tax payers money. Slowly we will find our way up again after years of budget cuts and poor results, I hope.


Government is pretty much done investing in Willem2. They understand Tilburg need to reset is Sport strategy. In the meanwhile, they are open to do something once investors are ready.

So how is their business club doing? Most-likely, investors while be among them. Some sort of "Founding Father-concept", with banks, construction companies, event hosting party and food&drinks suppliers, you pretty much have all stakeholders.

Government could keep the ground, like many other Dutch stadiums, lease it for a €1 million a year for 30 years. Then stakeholders should bring in €20-30 million for an extended upgrade. Similar is happening in Nijmegen (NEC) right now. For both clubs, this could mean doubling their break-even budget to €20 million. While status quo, those clubs will fade. With development and solid management, both can become (again) stable Eredivisie clubs.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

werner10 said:


> @nl-duketown
> 
> It is a sign of maturity of you're able to listen to critique. So just listen - and don't feel threathened. Since it is an illusion to think that your identity has anything to do with being a Dutchmen or, for that matter, a stadium in a city somewhere on this planet.
> 
> Wake up, dude!


Don't worry, PSV is not sold out every match, no need for expansion, though it is an up to date stadium and Feyenoord, well... 2022 is based on nothing really, though that is a club which would do great with a new stadium, unfortunately even in Belgium things get done faster then in Rotterdam of the modern age.


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Damon Jay Wimborne said:


> Uploaded with the best of intentions.
> 
> However, with all due respect, it's not my ambition to be entertained by the delusions of a myopic, hostile and pedantic pedestrian, taking a few hundred seats more serious than a venereal disease.


https://youtu.be/GaSwPnsTFY4


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## dinamo_zagreb (Dec 23, 2011)

This is amazing!



AmsterdamArenA said:


>


What stadium is this? Venlo?


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

dinamo_zagreb said:


> This is amazing!
> 
> 
> 
> ...




It is indeed. _De Koel_, local dialect for ‘The Pit’.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

*Rotterdam - Feyenoord gives go-ahead & new renders*

From the New Feyenoord stadium thread 



> Breakthrough in Rotterdam: Feyenoord gives the green light for a new stadium
> 
> A major breakthrough for Feyenoord: the Rotterdammers continue with the plans for the new stadium. The club and Stadium Feijenoord have set the lights on green for 'de nieuwe Kuip' on Friday, reports the Algemeen Dagblad.
> 
> ...


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

*An overview of all current plans for new (N), renovated and expanded stadiums in the Netherlands:*

Feyenoord Rotterdam (N) 47,500 -> 63,000+

AZ Alkmaar 17,000 -> 21,000 max

Willem II Tilburg 14,500 -> 16,500

PEC Zwolle 14,000 -> 16,000

NEC Nijmegen 12,500 -> 15,000 ±

Cambuur Leeuwarden (N) 10,000 -> 15,000

Sparta Rotterdam 10,500 -> 12,500 ±

FC Emmen (N)/(E) 10,000 -> 10,500

VVV Venlo 8,000 -> 10,000 (finally 12,000)

Excelsior Rotterdam 4,400 -> 5,000+

FC Dordrecht 4,100 -> 5,000?

Almere City 3,000 -> 5,000±

SC Telstar IJmuiden 3,000 -> ?

Helmond Sport (N) 4,200 -> 4,500


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## Lumbergo (Nov 17, 2009)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> From the New Feyenoord stadium thread


I know it doesn't (probably) - but part of me really wants that sign to say "No Fishing" :cheers:


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> *An overview of all current plans for new (N), renovated and expanded stadiums in the Netherlands:*
> 
> Feyenoord Rotterdam (N) 51,000 -> 63,000


That should be 47,500 now, and >63,000 for the new stadium.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

*An overview of all current plans for new (N), renovated and expanded stadiums in the Netherlands, updated with (un)official renders:*

Feyenoord Rotterdam (N) 47,500 -> 63,000+









Feyenoord have approved the concept design of OMA/David Giannotten. A final design is expected to be presented later next year.









As EPA001 has stated on the dutch Feyenoord City thread, the design is inspired by the former Kuip, before renovation in the early nineties.

AZ Alkmaar 17,000 -> 21,000 max








A miserable MS Paint attempt by myself depicting a partial expansion of the stands towards the pitch. The plan would be to cover the corners too in order to reduce the infamous draft. In addition extra (supporter) facilities would be created under the stands and outside the stadium.

Willem II Tilburg 14,500 -> 16,500








Unoffical render from an architect. As for increasing capacity, the idea would be to close the steeply built moat.

PEC Zwolle 14,000 -> 16,000








Unofficial render(?) Two stands have been extended towards the pitch. The remaining two are expected to follow. It wouldn’t surprise me if plans would be stalled for the time being, considering PEC has had a very bad track record in 2018.

NEC Nijmegen 12,500 -> 15,000 ±








It is unclear whether this is an official render depicting the same project. The main building is transformed beyond recognition and new exterior cladding is added. The Pandasia Experience is a reference to billionaire Marcel Boekhoorn, who amongst others owns a zoo. Rumour has it he promised his father on his deathbed to support NEC, which he already has on multiple occasions. An important condition for him to continue to do so is for the stadium to be renovated.

Cambuur Leeuwarden (N) 10,000 -> 15,000









Sparta Rotterdam 10,500 -> 12,500 ±








Render from earlier plans (early 2000’s). The new plan would be to build four-storey buildings against the stands behind the goals and to lower the pitch in order to add the extra seats.

FC Emmen (N)/(E) 8,400 -> 10,000 - 10,500








The Oude Meerdijk does not allow FC Emmen to grow. Expanding and renovating the stadium towards 10,000 seats is said to be as expensive as building an equally sized new stadium: 30 million euros.

VVV Venlo 8,000 -> 10,000 (finally 12,000)








The 12,000 configuration

Excelsior Rotterdam 4,400 -> 5,000+








The corners to the right have been closed already. Just closing the remaining two won’t suffice, according to the club’s CEO. Coaches are practically sitting on eachother’s lap at the office, the fitness area is 30m2 small and there is no room and parking space to accomodate any more VIP’s. Plans are expected to be presented in 1Q or 2Q 2019.

FC Dordrecht 4,100 -> 5,000?








Possibly outdated since the municipality offered cooperation to renew 80% of the stadium and in addition increase non-matchday use and revenue

Almere City 3,000 -> 5,000±








Founded in 2001 as FC Omniworld, Almere City FC became a professional football club in 2005. The stadium -with the former illustrious name of Mitsubichi Forklift Truck Stadion- is the smallest of all dutch professional football grounds. Note: Almere is the fifth largest city in the Netherlands, likely to grow much bigger. The idea would be to expand the stadium towards 5,000 places in one go, maybe as early as summer 2019. 

SC Telstar IJmuiden 3,000 -> ?








Home to the White Lions, this stadium is in dire need of maintenance and expansion. The club’s chairman is tired and embarrased of having to order additional toilets for more popular matches, which have become more frequent the last couple of years. Earlier this year, an extra temporary stand was added behind one of the goals for the promotion play-offs to the Eredivisie, which the club lost. Nevertheless, 4,400 in stead of 3,200 fans where able to visit this icon of dutch football grounds.

Helmond Sport (N) 4,200 -> 4,500


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Figures on attendances and stadium utilization for the first half of the current Eredivisie season.








With an average stadium utilization rate of *87%*, only stadiums in the Premier League (95%) and in the Bundesliga (88,9%) are better filled.

La Liga comes 4th with 75%, the Ligue 1 5th with 68% and the Serie A 6th with 66%.


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## Nopar King (Mar 21, 2018)

Klaas-Jan as a future spokesman for further improvement of the JCA?



> De aanvaller is blij dat de grachten grotendeels zijn opgevuld. ‘Het zou mooi zijn als het achter de goals ook gaat gebeuren. Hoe dichterbij, hoe beter. Dan krijg je meer sfeer en contact.’


https://www.ajaxshowtime.com/articl...118282/huntelaar-sfeer-slaat-over-op-de-ploeg

https://www.ajax.nl/streams/actueel/luistertip-ajax-podcast-met-klaas-jan-huntelaar.htm

You tell ‘em Klaas:cheers:


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

^^ Amen. Unfortunately closing the moat behind the goals with extra seats would be impossible without making extremely costly adjustments to the stand. The northern moat has already been closed and provides space for wheelchair users. Perhaps an additional platform could be added to the southern moat, though sightlines would a problem, especially for the recent extension there.


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## Nopar King (Mar 21, 2018)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> ^^ Unfortunately closing the moat behind the goals with extra seats would be impossible without making extremely costly adjustments to the stand.


True. Ofcourse cost recuperation will be a pipe dream. But you can’t put a price on emotion, on pride (in a good way), on having the biggest d*** in the country:banana:

They’ll come through. I can see it happen.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Nopar King said:


> True. Ofcourse cost recuperation will be a pipe dream. But you can’t put a price on emotion, on pride (in a good way), on having the biggest d*** in the country:banana:
> 
> 
> 
> They’ll come through. I can see it happen.




The most they could do, is to close two, maybe three of the corners.









From an old study by the engineers of Arcadis









An idea of how many seats could fit in the corners.









A schematic idea of how the corners could be filled effectively on the eastern side. They could provide for a net number of 2 x 250 additional seats.

The two corners on the western side were filled with additional stands during Euro 2000, with about 120 seats each. 









After the tournament one of them was moved to the northeastern corner.

The problem was that these stands were totally surrounded by safety barriers, which greatly reduced the view. In addition, they were only accessible either by the front row or by a pathway on the western and eastern stands, which cost a number of more expensive seats. They were removed in early 2000. The additional stands in the moat in front of the western and eastern stands remained there until the permanent covering of the moat.

Note the blue seats in the bottom picture. They were added in 2000 when trade in skyboxes was booming. Now these suites in the eastern corners are rarely used.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

*Spangen, Rotterdam - first renders of Sparta stadium expansion*

Ideas include adding some 1,100 seats by lowering the pitch, creating extra food corners and toilets and creating extra skyboxes. Capacity would go up to 12,500.



AmsterdamArenA said:


> More impressions


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

*Kralingen, Rotterdam - expansion plans announced*

Excelsior Rotterdam -the smallest professional club from Rotterdam behind Feyenoord and Sparta- yesterday expressed their intention to expand the stadium's capacity from roughly 4,500 to 7,500 seats.









Here is an idea from a booklet ordered by Excelsior on stadium expansion plans. The still comes from a documentary on Excelsior from about three years ago, but it could very well depict a redevelopment of the stadium as mentioned above.


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## Nopar King (Mar 21, 2018)

AmsterdamArenA said:


>



Oh dear... 

And what’s up with the cage for the goalie :lol:? Just an impression, I know.


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## Gombos (Feb 6, 2011)

respect! Netherlands is beautiful.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> Ideas include adding some 1,100 seats by lowering the pitch, creating extra food corners and toilets and creating extra skyboxes. Capacity would go up to 12,500.


Nice!
Build it!


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Unfortunately they appear to have chosen to replace the rarely-used blue lounge seats in the corners.










Creating a 3/4 tier by connecting North, E and S trough efficiently filling up these gaps with regular seats, seems out of question. 

QUOTE=AmsterdamArenA;155384462]The most they could do, is to close two, maybe three of the corners.









From an old study by the engineers of Arcadis









An idea of how many seats could fit in the corners.









A schematic idea of how the corners could be filled effectively on the eastern side. They could provide for a net number of 2 x 250 additional seats.

The two corners on the western side were filled with additional stands during Euro 2000, with about 120 seats each. 









After the tournament one of them was moved to the northeastern corner.

The problem was that these stands were totally surrounded by safety barriers, which greatly reduced the view. In addition, they were only accessible either by the front row or by a pathway on the western and eastern stands, which cost a number of more expensive seats. They were removed in early 2000. The additional stands in the moat in front of the western and eastern stands remained there until the permanent covering of the moat.

Note the blue seats in the bottom picture. They were added in 2000 when trade in skyboxes was booming. Now these suites in the eastern corners are rarely used.[/QUOTE]


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## skaP187 (Jan 10, 2006)

Well as long as they are sold...


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Netherlands: Alkmaar working on stadium expansion



20.01.2019 02:10 source: StadiumDB.com



*Feasibility study is in the works, outcome should be known soon. AZ Alkmaar want to add seats to boost both capacity and atmosphere. The move should be beneficial economically.

*

Already upon opening in 2006, the Alkmaar stadium had an option of expansion discussed, possibly to as many as 40,000 seats. Obviously, that didn't reflect short- or even medium-term demand of AZ Alkmaar, rather it included the possibility of hosting the World Cup.



Eventually that bubble had burst upon bankruptcy of DSB, the official stadium owner. AZ Alkmaar had to wait long, until 2017, to buy their venue back and enjoy full control. Now, as announced in November by SLO Patrick Ton and then corroborated in regional and national media, the team is going forward with an expansion plan.



Admittedly, it's far less impressive than a 40,000 stadium would be but instead it's sensible. In the last decade, through thick and thin, the club enjoyed a following of no fewer than 14,700 people per game, which represents occupancy of 85%+, sometimes over 90%.



The most eocnomic way of adding seats is filling the space existing between the field and current front row. Like many stadia across the Netherlands, the stadium was built with a moat serving as main access/egress way for fans. This would now be reorganised, providing space for a few additional rows, especially in the semi-open corners.



_Based on this original photo by AZ Alkmaar we created a simulation to give you an idea of how it could look. Please mind, it's not an official image and we only wanted to show how much room there is to fill on the sides, ends and in the corners._














Aside from boosting matchday revenue and attendance rather cheaply, the change should also improve atmosphere. Fans would be brought closer to the field. Also, the semi-open corners, currently accused of causing serious draft inside on cold and windy days, would be filled.



Some issues remain to be resolved, results of a feasibility study are expected soon. StadiumDB understands the project is carried out by Zwarts en Jansma, original designers of the stadium.



While there have been news of safe standing also being introduced in a new way, we have no details on that proposal at this point.



Interestingly, adding seats between the players and front rows is becoming almost a signature way of expanding stadia in the Netherlands. It's been done at Johan Cruijff ArenA, De Kuip and MAC³PARK stadion, among others.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Feyenoord has started the introduction of rail seats in section S behind one of the goals.



AmsterdamArenA said:


> DE CLUB 14 MAART 2019 14:08
> 
> Eerste rail seats geplaatst in Vak S
> 
> ...


Bonus: priceless pictures


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

In the Netherlands, capacity for (safe-)standing sections is regulated as follows:

*< 3,000 spectators: no limit
3,000 > 15.000: max. 1,500 standing spectators allowed 
15,000 >: 20% of capacity/2,000 standing spectators*


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## slipperydog (Jul 19, 2009)

*AFAS Stadion - Alkmaar*

roof collapse this past weekend due to strong winds











https://twitter.com/TRstadyumlar/status/1160233630733672448


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## MikeC9180 (Mar 23, 2015)

slipperydog said:


> *AFAS Stadion - Alkmaar*
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Am I misremembering or is this the second time part of the roof at this stadium has collapsed or was that FC Twente?


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

MikeC9180 said:


> Am I misremembering or is this the second time part of the roof at this stadium has collapsed or was that FC Twente?


A couple of years ago a small part of the exterior cladding was blown away.

Last november AZ announced their intention to close the corners in order to reduce the infamous draft. Since then no announcements have been made.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

MikeC9180 said:


> Am I misremembering or is this the second time part of the roof at this stadium has collapsed or was that FC Twente?


In 2011 the roof of a new stand still under construction at the FC Twente stadium 'Grolsch Veste' collapsed. So this time it is a different stadium which has a partial roof collapse under different circumstances.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

EPA001 said:


> In 2011 the roof of a new stand still under constructies at the FC Twente stadium 'Grolsch Veste' collapsed. So this time it is a different stadium which has a partial roof collapse under different circumstances.


Apparently solarpanels. 
As stated in the promo film (Link down here, in Dutch), the roof wasn't calculated for panels. They thought of a lighter solution but as we noticed over the weekend, it wasn't light enough. 

https://www.dumpert.nl/mediabase/7737259/d989606b/sommige_promo_s_werken_niet_meer.html


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## MikeC9180 (Mar 23, 2015)

Thought I might have been mistaken. Thanks all for the clarification.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

The Dutch Safety Board has finished exploratory research on the site and has turned the stadium back over to AZ. The DSB has given AZ permission to remove the debree. 

The club will wait for the municipality of Alkmaar and the engineers of Royal HaskoningDHV to approve the necessary demolition plan.

Next week more will be revealed by the DSB on whether additional research will be required. The remainder of the roof construction has not been declared safe yet. This can only occur after additional research has been concluded.

The companies who rent space in the office building below the affected stand have been relocated to the main building.

The club’s spokesperson stated that it remains unclear atm where the club will play next month. The next home match is scheduled for 14 September. ADO The Hague will play away 15 September at Feyenoord. So this might leave some air. ADO - AZ is ‘already’ planned for 22 September.

Source (NL): https://www.nu.nl/binnenland/5978974/onderzoeksraad-rondt-verkennend-onderzoek-in-az-stadion-af.html

Ironically the english abbrevation for the Onderzoeksraad voor de Veiligheid, DSB, was also the name of the stadium between 2006 and 2010. It stands voor Dirk Scheringa Beheer, the mother company owned by club owner Dirk Scheringa, which went bankrupt in 2010.

AZ has spent a number of years paying off considerable debts, resulting from this bankruptcy and its forced process to acquire financial independence. 

They have managed to buy back the stadium in 2017 from a wealthy group of fans: about 15 million euros/17 million dollars was paid. They have also paid back other big loans, including 9 million euros for building a state of the art youth academy (Real Madrid comes by once or twice a year to learn from AZ). 

AZ have made a considerable amount of money the last 10 years by selling players. Between 09/10 and 19/20 they achieved a transfer balance of about 150 million euros (166m USD) by good scouting and training their own youth players. They have been working with a budget of about 25m EUR/27m USD the last couple of years.


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## Rev Stickleback (Jun 23, 2009)

Slightly odd to realise that when I went there last year, I was sat directly under the larger collapsed section.


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## Maartendev (Apr 19, 2010)

A investigation has been done on the roof and there are other areas in the stadium with issues. It seems like the entire roof construction is not strong enough at this moment.

AZ will not be able to use the stadium until the roof is finished and reinforced. For the moment they are able to use the stadium of ADO Den Haag which is located in The Hague and a one hour drive by car. Not sure if they are able to keep using it though since it has to fit in the agenda. They are also in the Europa League so they will have to play in a stadium that meets UEFA requirements.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

The Dutch Safety Board as presented a preliminary conclusion.

*The roof collapsed as a result of failed welding joints. What has caused these joints to snap, is unclear at the moment*

Two further cracks have been located in the remainder of the roof as well as two weak spots.

https://www.onderzoeksraad.nl/nl/page/14861/onderzoeksraad-geeft-tussentijdse-waarschuwing-AZ-stadion

Click the link for three overview pictures at the bottom of the page.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Yesterday First Division side Almere City FC began demolishing the first stand. It is set to be replaced by the end of this year after some delays.

Capacity will grow from about 3,000 to 4,501.

The club is owned by real estate tycoon Lesley Bamberger.



> Vandaag is de eerste tribune tegen de vlakte gegaan.
> 
> Klik op de afbeelding voor een grotere versie. De vervanger moet tegen de winterstop klaar zijn.
> 
> ...


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

News from AZ *(not ‘AZ Alkmaar’)* in Alkmaar:

According to a journalist from the dutch public news corporation (the NOS) the stadium will remain unused until the end of the year. The club will return to the AFAS Stadion after the winter break with the roof completely removed. 

*A renovation and revamp is scheduled to take place during the summer break.*

*The intention to renovate and revamp the stadium was already made public when former Ajax CEO Michael Kinsbergen was presented as the new COO about a year ago*.

The news from the journalist:


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Update from Alkmaar:

-work to remove the debris will start Wednesday 28 August

-the debris will be moved to the grounds next to the stadium for further inspection by the Dutch Safety Board

-Royal HaskoningDHV, the engineering consultancy, will also perform research on behalf of AZ

-the company responsible for clearing the site states that *at least for now it is not the intention to remove the entire roof*

-*Friday 30 August HaskoningDHV will present the outcome of its interim review*

Source: Dutch and behind paywall


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## Rev Stickleback (Jun 23, 2009)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> News from AZ *(not ‘AZ Alkmaar’)*


Undermined slightly by AZ's twitter handle.

I know what you mean though, as the "A" in "AZ" stands for Alkmaar.

Similarly, there is no club called HJK Helsinki.


For those who don't know, The Z is for Zaanstreek, who were the other of two clubs (along with Alkmaar '54) who formed to make AZ '67 (in 1967). They are from an area south of Alkmaar, with loads of windmills, and a cocoa factory which makes the area a bit smelly (oddly, more like cheese than chocolate)


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Rev Stickleback said:


> Undermined slightly by AZ's twitter handle.
> 
> I know what you mean though, as the "A" in "AZ" stands for Alkmaar.
> 
> ...


What was the saying about the merger between Alkmaar ‘54 and FC Zaanstreek? I believe something like: ‘You have the pitch, and I have the players, so let’s team up’. One club lacked the suitable team, but had decent facilities and the other lacked a suitable ground, but had good players. 

Amsterdamsche Football Club Ajax...’Amsterdam’.:bash:

It makes sense of course to include a geographical name.
Sometimes just to avoid confusion with similarly named clubs: Sparta is the best example. Sometimes the name is added after a local government bail-out. I believe NAC Breda did this.

Acronyms are also quite common:translated NAC stands for ‘*Never give up, always persevere. Pleasant for its entertainment and useful for its relaxation.’*

They stick by this. Although they ended last in the 2018/2019 Eredivisie season they had an attendance rate of close to 98%. 

Another one: ADO The Hague: *A*ll *T*hrough *P*ractice.
PEC Zwolle: *P*rince Hendrik *A*nd never despair *C*ombination
Former professional club AGOVV: Apeldoorn football club for teetallers.

My favorites are De Graafschap/The County and De Baronie/The Barony.

De Graafscap is the only dutch club as far as I know with a ‘Kop’. Their fanatics are located at the ‘Spinnekop’, a deliberate reference to Anfield Road. Ironically the name comes from the Afrikaans ‘Spioenkop’ which is directly related to dutch. It means something like ‘Spy hill’.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

*Amsterdam - 'Who want to come to the The Tunnel Club...?'*

They have one at Ajax now too, hidden in a broom cupboard. But then again you get to pay 550 euros per game to watch players scratch their dingdongs and pick some last-minute sports supplements from their noses. It's exclusive for 24 people.


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## Rev Stickleback (Jun 23, 2009)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> De Graafscap is the only dutch club as far as I know with a ‘Kop’. Their fanatics are located at the ‘Spinnekop’, a deliberate reference to Anfield Road. Ironically the name comes from the Afrikaans ‘Spioenkop’ which is directly related to dutch. It means something like ‘Spy hill’.


Anfield Road is actually the other end of Liverpool's ground. "Anfield" is just the name of the district.

The first Spion Kop was actually in London, at Arsenal's (then Woolwich Arsenal) ground, in Plumstead, in a completely different part of London.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

Three quarters of the roof of the AFAS-stadium in Alkmaar will be demolished. After that the stadium will undergo some improvements and small expansions to be topped off with a new and better constructed roof. The preliminary results of the investigations so far show that many things have gone wrong when constructing the current roof on the stadium. In the coming months a planning for all these works will have to be made, including a renewed permits phase for the to be designed and proposed improvements to the stadium.

Article in Dutch:

Foutenfestijn zorgde voor dakramp AZ (Errors festival caused the roof catastrophy at AZ) 



> ALKMAAR - Een opeenstapeling van fouten heeft geleid tot het ineenstorten van het dak van het AZ-stadion tijdens een storm eerdere deze maand. Dat zijn de voorlopige conclusies na een onderzoek van ingenieursbureau Royal HaskoningDHV.
> 
> "A culmination of errors has caused the roof of the AZ-stadium to collapse earlier this month. That is the preliminary conclusion of engineering from Royal HaskoningDHV"


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

A translation of the findings as presented by Royal HaskoningDHV, the engineers behind the investigation.



> Main points from the preliminary conclusions of the causes behind the roof collapse
> 
> - The roof collapsed through increased downward pressure, as a consequence of the storm. The designer did not take into account increased downward pressure from the wind.
> 
> ...


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Today the announcement came that AZ are welcome to play all their remaining home games of this calender year in The Hague. *This includes the EL encounters with Man Utd, FK Partisan and Astana FK.* One exception is the match against Ajax on 15 December. The mayor of the government seat does not allow this rather tense North Holland derby to take place in The Hague.

Furthermore, the club's spokeswoman declared that it cannot be excluded that AZ will return to Alkmaar before this winter break.


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## Bobby3 (Jun 26, 2007)

Wow, they dodged an enormous bullet all things considered.


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## Urmstoniain (Mar 23, 2015)

Rev Stickleback said:


> Undermined slightly by AZ's twitter handle.
> 
> I know what you mean though, as the "A" in "AZ" stands for Alkmaar.
> 
> ...


Good knowledge, and thanks for this - always like to get things like this right...

Don't get me started on Inter Milan.... :bash:


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## aidan88 (May 19, 2013)

Or Sporting Lisbon


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## RMB2007 (Apr 1, 2007)

^^ Deleted as it already has is own thread:

https://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1962921

This section is for stadiums and arenas in the Netherlands that don't meet the forum rules:

https://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=130402997&postcount=2


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

First division side SC Telstar have revealed preliminary plans to renovate and expand their stadium



AmsterdamArenA said:


> Plannen om te groeien, met Excelsior als inspiratie.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The idea is to renovate and expand the stadium, coupled with the creation of extra non-matchday related facilities, including restaurants and a cinema. 

With the expansion of the stadium in Almere, Telstar will soon have the smallest ground in professional dutch football. My guess is this plan could take capacity from the current 3k to about 4,5/5k.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Other first division sides with stadium plans:

- Cambuur Leeuwarden: the deadline for appeal against the zoning plan for the new stadium has expired. No appeals have meen made. New capacity should be just under 15k.









- SBV Excelsior (Rotterdam): intentions have been expressed to take capacity from 4,5 to about 7,5









- FC Dordrecht: after many years of talk, the intention is to present a new comprehensive redevelopment plan for the Krommedijk stadium, this year or early next year. Capacity should go up to about 5k. Plans include building adjacent appartments and healt care related facilities.









- Helmond Sport: a new sports campus with the stadium at its epic centre is planned. The idea is to surround the new stadium with amongst others a school campus. Capacity should go up from 4 to about 4,5k.









- Almere City: the youngest still active professional football side is currently expanding their ground from 3 to 4,5k. It appears no architect has been involved (and therefore neither hurt) in the process...

- NAC (Breda): the club with the best filled stadium over the past two seasons has relegated last season. The occupancy rate was close to 98%, urging the club to look for expansion. Capacity could go up from 19 tot about 20k. More important would be to add a third level on top of the main stand, allowing for more revenue. These plans have been frozen for about ten years now. An appeal to buy back parts of the stadium through fundraising proved highly successful, though relegation seems to have put things on hold for now.

-FC Eindhoven: in november a masterplan will be presented to take the club forward. The idea would he to leave the current 4,5k stadium for a new -multifunctional- stadium.

- Go Ahead Eagles (Deventer): the club with IMO the most beautiful stadium in the NL, has a new majority shareholder. Apparently, the club has a building permit to expand from 10 to about 13k, though there are no clear intentions as of this moment to do so.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

GAE should remodel the total stadium to the likes of the new stand in that pic. 
It is a gem already. 
Would be awesome.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Red85 said:


> GAE should remodel the total stadium to the likes of the new stand in that pic.
> It is a gem already.
> Would be awesome.


Amen.

I personally love how they incorporated the landmarks of the town of Deventer into the stand.
For those who have seen 'A Bridge Too Far', on the right you can see the bridge from that movie. *Ironically, the bridge at Deventer was ALSO a bridge too far since it had te be taken just AFTER the Arnhem bridge/John Frost Bridge. *


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

News from Alkmaar:

- 3/4 of the roof will be demolished
- the roof above the main stand may possibly be replaced as well
- stadium facilities will get an upgrade 
- capacity will be increased (earlier reports say by 3,000-4.000)
*- hopes are to return by mid december 2019 *

Source (NL)


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

PSV is considering redeveloping its Philips Stadium

An idea would be to host large (business) conferences. In addition, a roof may be added and a concrete floor could be installed to protect the pitch. Capacity could go up to about 40k.



More recently the club from Eindhoven declared it is currently looking into possibilities for expansion.



For the 2018 bid, a plan for expansion from 35 to 45k was considered.



In 2014, the intention was launched to for 50k. A plan of how to achieve this was to be conceived before 2020.



Sources (NL):



https://www.psvinside.nl/psv-onderz...il-uiterlijk-in-2030-derde-ster-op-het-shirt/



https://www.ed.nl/psv/psv-meldt-phi...ts-brainport-centrum-iconische-plek~a3895f59/



https://www.psvfans.nl/nieuws/hoofdnieuws/41994/psv-wil-philips-stadion-fors-gaan-uitbreiden


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

AZ have announced that the entire roof is to be dismantled. The engineers of Royal HaskoningDHV concluded that the roof over the main stand also lacks sufficient resistance against downward wind pressure.


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## GunnerJacket (Jan 25, 2008)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> AZ have announced that the entire roof is to be dismantled. The engineers of Royal HaskoningDHV concluded that the roof over the main stand also lacks sufficient resistance against downward wind pressure.


So will the roof be replaced? If so will the design look any different?


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

GunnerJacket said:


> So will the roof be replaced? If so will the design look any different?




Yes, the entire canopy will be replaced.

This is not a totall surprise. The possibility to remove the entire roof was already mentioned last month in AZ’s annual financial report.

The architects who designed the stadium -Zwarts en Jansma- are working on a new roof structure. They presented the idea behind the to-be demolished canopy as such: “In a continuous curve, the cover of the stadium follows the varying height of stands, skyboxes and other spaces.”


Meanwhile engineering firm Royal HaskoningDHV are performing wind tunnel tests in order to present a full report in the beginning of next year.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Small update

- FC Volendam are said to be considering relocation towards the outskirts of the old fishertown. They are however totally dependent on the local council.

- The Dordrecht local executive have again delayed any decisions on the fate of the Krommedijk Stadium. The club’s CEO has stated that a new stadium might be considered (again) and there are parties interested in taking over the club’s shares.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> Yes, the entire canopy will be replaced.
> 
> This is not a totall surprise. The possibility to remove the entire roof was already mentioned last month in AZ’s annual financial report.
> 
> ...


So for the second part of the season it will look somewhat like this:



















It remains unclear whether the roof over the adjacent main building will also be removed.


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## rebelheartous (Dec 28, 2008)

Thanks for latest updates.

And something a bit apart from stadia construction. Has Dutch FA finally released plans for promotion/relegation between Eerste and Tweede Divisie? It really buzzes me why they keep delaying this for several years now.


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## Quintana (Dec 27, 2005)

They're probably delaying it because basically nobody wants it. 

Second Division clubs are officially amateur clubs that want to stay that way. Most of them pay their players off the books (and a select few don't pay at all) and they play in humble accommodations which don't meet the requirements for the First Division. Promotion to the First Division means a lot more regulations which could financially ruin them and playing on Friday night which their fans don't want.

First Division teams don't want to be able to relegate because the loss of income would mean immediate financial problems (most can barely financially survive in the First Division as it is).


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## Temporarily Exiled (Sep 12, 2018)

Quintana said:


> They're probably delaying it because basically nobody wants it.
> 
> Second Division clubs are officially amateur clubs that want to stay that way. Most of them pay their players off the books (and a select few don't pay at all) and they play in humble accommodations which don't meet the requirements for the First Division. Promotion to the First Division means a lot more regulations which could financially ruin them and playing on Friday night which their fans don't want.
> 
> First Division teams don't want to be able to relegate because the loss of income would mean immediate financial problems (most can barely financially survive in the First Division as it is).


How about a single relegation play-off spot, the same as the system used at the foot of the Scottish Football League?

Although, honestly, it would be better to re-open talks with the Belgian and Dutch FA's and get a BeNeLux league going. BeNeLux D1 and BeNeLux D2, with domestic divisions below that, and a play-off system to decide who gets promoted.


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## EPA001 (Jan 13, 2008)

Alex Jr said:


> Does the rich Dutch state also invest in stadiums like the French one for instance? Or are you following the British model?


Sometimes the stadiums get public funding, if so then always from a municipality, but not from the national government. And if there is public money poored in it only contributes to a small amount. For example: the plan for the new Feyenoord stadium gets only € 40 million (contribution in stocks) on a € 448 million total development costs bill. That is almost negligible compared to what we frequently see in state or municipal contributions in other countries for stadium or big arena development.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

An update from AZ's stadium in Alkmaar. Work has started on the "mega truss". For more pictures, click here.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Things are speeding up



AmsterdamArenA said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1300336268858003456
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1301045289063772167


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

More pictures (16-09-2020)


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)




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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

In Alkmaar the buildup of the supporting structure for the new roof has started.



AmsterdamArenA said:


> Alkmaar: de eerste nieuwe spantpoten staan.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

Recent one from AFAS Stadion, Alkmaar:








https://twitter.com/AZAlkmaar


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

New design of the new Helmond Sport stadium
For the first time in a while stadium capacity will drop (4k to about 3,5k) though expansion should be relatively easy. Pictures are from the Helmond municipality.
















Meanwhile in Alkmaar the contours of the U-shaped part of the new roof are becoming more and more visible. The gap between the steel ’fence‘ and the existing stands is to be filled with additional rows. Picture from AZ on Instagram.


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

3D model maker Sebastiaan has remodelled the AZ Alkmaar stadium and shared his creations on Flickr









This view isn’t bad either (credits: Ed van de Pol) during AZ vs. Real Sociedad last month


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

AFAS Stadion, February 19, 2021:








https://twitter.com/edvandepol


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

AFAS Stadion, Alkmaar - March 2021:
























https://twitter.com/AZAlkmaar


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

AFAS Stadion, Alkmaar - March 9, 2021








https://twitter.com/victoriaalkmaar

























https://twitter.com/edvandepol


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Atm the mega truss is being put in place.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

Impressive.
Thats just cool. 

Reminds me a bit of old San Mames.


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

AFAS Stadion, Alkmaar - March 24, 2021








https://twitter.com/ej_moleman
















https://twitter.com/ESPNnl








https://twitter.com/StadiumDB


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1374728150438002694


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Ranma Saotome said:


> AFAS Stadion, February 19, 2021:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


And yesterday’s sunset


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## Ranma Saotome (Nov 3, 2007)

AFAS Stadion, Alkmaar 

March 24
















https://twitter.com/sebohofkamp

March 26
























AZ Alkmaar


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

A 360-impression of AZ’s revamped stadium from the fanatics stand.



AmsterdamArenA said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1396002060789854211


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## AmsterdamArenA (Apr 6, 2006)

Artist impressions of a revamped AFAS Stadion, with an external concourse for mid-stand entrance.


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## Red85 (Jan 23, 2007)

AmsterdamArenA said:


> Artist impressions of a revamped AFAS Stadion, with an external concourse for mid-stand entrance.
> View attachment 1805297
> View attachment 1805298


As we'd like to say:
'Dat is heel netjes hoor' 

Very nice place to play ball.


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