# CENTRAL EUROPE | High Speed Rail (V4)



## zzelenika (Nov 23, 2008)

Please when thinking of connections between Vienna, Bratislava and Budapest don't forget about one more capital in the whole equation - Zagreb. Currently trains to Vienna run the long route west via Slovenia and Maribor/Graz and then via Semmeringbahn, even though both Bratislava and Vienna are *east *of Zagreb. A main line to Hungary is being upgraded and by 2024 there should be a full double-track grade-separated 160km/h-capable line to HR/HU border (near Nagykanisza), being part of international 5c, TEN-T and whatever other corridor routes (line to port of Rijeka). Some previous experiments and services actually did show that it's faster to reach Vienna from Zagreb via Hungary, but as this services didn't connect to larger cities in Hungary or some mainline routes it ended up being more of a vision then the plan.

So from perspective of Zagreb - reaching all three capitals (Vienna, Bratislava and Budapest) or vice-versa (reaching Zagreb and Rijeka and the coast from AT/HU/SK) in reasonable time is possible only via an upgraded north-south line in western Hugary that would connect Zagreb either via GySev network to Hegyeshalom or more to the east to Gyor, with modernization of some existing lines in Hungary (primarily electrification of Zalaszentivan-Nagykanisza and additionally Celldomok-Gyor in the case of more eastern routing). Even with 160km/h (not HSR) this would get Zagreb-Gyor to cca 2.5 hours and as Gyor would be cca 1 hour from Budapest, Bratislava and Vienna (if this would be preferred HSR routing in Hungary), it would get the Zagreb-Vienna/Bratislava/Budapest times to about 4 hours which is a tipping point for most rail/plane travels from todays' 6,5 for Vienna/Budapest and over 8 for Bratislava).

Also - line from Zagreb to Rijeka od the coast is also covered in several modernization projects, so this could also be cut from todays 3,5 hous to 2,5 hours giving end-to-end time to Rijeka do 6-7 hours, applicable both for daytime but also for night trains (there was a huge success this year even with Covid with RegioJet Prague-Rijeka overnight service which took much longer and complex route) and also provide room for reasonable timetabled overnight trains to Split.

Main driver for modernization in Croatia is still cargo and port of Rijeka, so it's unreasonable to expect any dedicated HSR lines, but even just modernized double-tracked 160km/h-capable lines would enable much faster service to all three capitals then today, so if anyone is looking into a integrated high(er)-speed network between Vienna, Bratislava and Budapest, please bear in mind that there is one additional capital to the south(west) which is also a gateway to port of Rijeka and Adriatic coast. Otherwise several separate routes would be needed (one to Budapest, one via Slovenia to Vienna, and no serious route to Bratislava and north (Prague and onwards) would exist.


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## Tonik1 (May 4, 2018)

437.001 said:


> 🔼 🔼 🔼
> The section between Ostrava and Katowice would involve a tunnel under the Tatras, wouldn't it?
> How long would it be?
> 
> Edit: I hadn't understood the graphic. I think there will be no such tunnel. Or at least, not yet.











Moravian Gate - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org


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## NCT (Aug 14, 2009)

It seems to me the path of least resistance for an HSL between Vienna and Budapest remains via Gyor. Bratislava doesn't have to be on the through route - it can be served on a spur and with a 'Bratislava South' station (which may be Petrzalka) connected to the main station with transit.


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## Natasza K (Aug 22, 2020)

It would be so cool to have high speed rail between Warsaw and Vienna or Budapest at least! Fingers crossed.


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## Sunfuns (Mar 26, 2012)

Wouldn't Warsaw-Berlin make more sense to connect directly with the West European HSR networks? Flat land, wouldn't even be particularly difficult to build. One would of course go straight through Poznan (5th largest city in Poland) for such a line.


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## Tonik1 (May 4, 2018)

Why not both. 

Sooner or later there will be connection to Prague, Vienna, Budapest, Bratislava, Berlin.


And later Moscow, Kyiv etc


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## Natasza K (Aug 22, 2020)

Sunfuns said:


> Wouldn't Warsaw-Berlin make more sense to connect directly with the West European HSR networks?


I think Vienna and Austria is a more interesting destination than Berlin and eastern Germany.

In Warsaw I have seen signs of Warsaw-Vienna railway... most likely because of historic railways, but it would be fantastic to have a high speed connection!


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## Paziu (Jul 27, 2012)

Poland plans high-speed line called "Y" between Warsaw, Łódź and Poznań/Wrocław, probably the first one to be built. That should significantly cut the time between Warsaw and Poznań, from 150 minutes to around 90 (depending on the speed on the new line, with 250 km per hour savings will not be so significant). Furthermore, there was some analysis on upgrading Poznań - Frankfurt (Oder) line to 200 km/h, but with the current government, it's hard to call it a priority. It's also the main cargo corridor, so upgrading the speed might mess with capacity and unfortunately, Polish railways tend to underestimate the importance of that factor and are resistant to share fast tracks with cargo (there are no cargo trains on the fast Warsaw - Katowice/Kraków line). A few years back there was also an idea to build a new fast line between Poznań, Gorzów and Szczecin/Berlin (with Gorzów - Berline line in a corridor of former German Ostbahn). This project seems to be dumped, unfortunately.


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## geogregor (Dec 11, 2006)

Tonik1 said:


> Why not both.
> *Sooner or later* there will be connection to Prague, Vienna, Budapest, Bratislava, Berlin.


Later.

Let's be realistic, planning and construction of long HSR corridors take decades, even with ample funding available (which is still not resolved)

Don't take me wrong, I would love to see Warsaw - Vienna HSR corridor build as I come from town roughly half-way in between. But I'm too old and cynical to expect to see it before I retire. And that isn't happening any time soon...


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## Tonik1 (May 4, 2018)

Well, no one is saying it will be 2-3 years. It's work for decades. But all planning/corridor/technical woks can and should be done much earlier.


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## geogregor (Dec 11, 2006)

Tonik1 said:


> Well, no one is saying it will be 2-3 years. It's work for decades. But all planning/corridor/technical woks can and should be done much earlier.


Depending what you mean by "much earlier"

Here is interesting report about HSR corridors in Europe.

Special report: A European high-speed rail network

I especially recommend Table 2 which shows "assessment of time from planning to operation"

The quickest projects took 17 years from planning to operation, many took well over 20 or even 30 years. The quickest projects were in sparsely populated Spain, in one country. Crossing urban population of Silesia will be a real pain and it will take years to even just agree the route. Need of agreeing route between three countries will further complicate things.

For people in their 20s (as I suspect might be your case) it will be lucky if they will able to catch high speed train from Warsaw to Vienna while still in their 40s.


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## Trupman (May 17, 2010)

The Czech railway IM started the tendering process for a project and construction preparation of 33km of South-Moravian HSR (from Brno to Šakvice where the trains can continue further to Vienna or Bratislava via Břeclav on regular tracks).

source in Czech

The same process is running for two HSR constructions from Přerov to Ostrava. And finally the designer of the first HSR project in Czechia which is a line eastbound of Prague, has been already tendered in October.


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## Gusiluz (Apr 4, 2013)

Article written by me (in Spanish) on the *Geotrén *website on the new lines (especially those dedicated to passengers) in Eastern and Central Europe:









Proyectos ferroviarios para viajeros en el norte, centro y este de Europa


El más conocido es Rail Baltica, el mayor proyecto ferroviario en Europa, que conectará Estonia (y, eventualmente Finlandia), Letonia y Lituania con Polonia mediante una nueva línea para tráfico mi…



www.geotren.es


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

*Czechia *- preparations for high speed railway construction (2020)

















Momentum builds for Czech high-speed project


The Czech Republic is turning to the development of new high-speed lines as a way to improve connectivity across the country.




www.railjournal.com


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

*Hungary* / Slovakia:








Szijjártó: High-speed Rail Link next Top Slovak-Hungarian Transport Project


The next most important joint Hungarian-Slovak transport project is the construction of a high-speed railway connecting Budapest, Pozsony (Bratislava) and Warsaw, Hungarian Foreign Minister Péter Szijjártó said on Thursday. The new rail line would reduce travel time between Budapest and Warsaw...




hungarytoday.hu




*



The next most important joint Hungarian-Slovak transport project is the construction of a high-speed railway connecting Budapest, Pozsony (Bratislava) and Warsaw, Hungarian Foreign Minister Péter Szijjártó said on Thursday.

Click to expand...

*


> The new rail line would reduce travel time between Budapest and Warsaw to five and a half hours from the current 11-12 hours while the trip from Budapest to Bratislava would be cut to an hour and a half, Szijjártó told reporters ahead of the inauguration of a new bridge spanning the Danube between Hungary and Slovakia near Komárom, northern Hungary.
> 
> *The Hungarian section of the line would run from Budapest to Győr in the northwest, he said, adding that talks are ongoing on whether it should cross into Slovakia between Győr and Dunaszerdahely (Dunajská Streda) or at Rajka.*
> 
> ...


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## Coryza (Jan 2, 2018)

Based on the map it would almost seem more logical to build a HSR Prague-Pardubice-Brno with a branch to Wroclow from Pardubice via Hradec Králové. Would serve the biggest cities as well as limit the amount of km construction.


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

Study tenders for 700 km of new high speed rail lines in *Poland*:









CPK: Przetargi na studia dla 700 km nowych linii kolejowych


Od listopada do końca roku 2020 spółka CPK ogłosiła postępowania przetargowe na opracowanie Studiów Techniczno-Ekonomiczno-Środowiskowych (STEŚ) dla ośmiu odcinków kolejowych o łącznej długości 701 km.




www.rynek-lotniczy.pl




*



CPK: Przetargi na studia dla 700 km nowych linii kolejowych

Click to expand...

*


> *Od listopada do końca roku 2020 spółka CPK ogłosiła postępowania przetargowe na opracowanie Studiów Techniczno-Ekonomiczno-Środowiskowych (STEŚ) dla ośmiu odcinków kolejowych o łącznej długości 701 km.*
> 
> Na program inwestycji kolejowych CPK składa się w sumie 12 tras, w tym 10 szprych prowadzących z różnych regionów Polski do Warszawy i CPK. Łącznie to 30 zadań inwestycyjnych, które mają zostać zrealizowane do 2034 r. Połączenia kolejowe na terenie kraju mają umożliwić przejazd między Warszawą a największymi polskimi miastami w czasie nie dłuższym niż 2,5 godz.
> 
> ...


Komplecik przetargów na studia dla szprychy nr 9 CPK (linia LK85, LK86, LK267, LK268)


*CPK* (Centralny Port Komunikacyjny) is responsible in Poland for building of 1800 km new railways, including approx. 1000 km of high speed railway lines. Geometry of Y-high speed railway line and CMK Północ will allow for 350 km/h in the future, but these lines will be build initially to be operated at the speed of 250 km/h.
*PLK* (Polskie Linie Kolejowe) is responsible for modernizing existing rail lines, including high speed line CMK Południe (250 km/h) and Rail Baltica (160-250 km/h). PLK has speed-up railway #9 (Warszawa - Gdańsk) up to 200 km/h and it will probably do this for line #351 (Poznań-Szczecin) in the future.

CPK page:








#PolskaNaDobrychTorach | Program kolejowy CPK


Inwestycje kolejowe CPK to łącznie prawie 1800 km nowych linii, które mają powstać do końca 2034 r. Dla ponad 500 km z nich prace przygotowawcze już trwają albo ruszą w tym roku. Pierwsze roboty budowlane mają się rozpocząć już za trzy lata.




cpk.pl









Railway component - Centralny Port Komunikacyjny







cpk.pl












Aktualności


Najnowsze informacje o realizacji inwestycji Programu Centralnego Portu Komunikacyjnego




cpk.pl


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

CPK (Centralny Port Komunikacyjny) plans for building new high speed railways in *Poland*:


























































































































*CPK* (Centralny Port Komunikacyjny) is responsible in Poland for building of 1800 km new railways, including approx. 1000 km of high speed railway lines. Geometry of Y-high speed railway line and CMK Północ will allow for 350 km/h in the future, but these lines will be build initially to be operated at the speed of 250 km/h.
*PLK* (Polskie Linie Kolejowe) is responsible for modernizing existing rail lines, including high speed line CMK Południe (250 km/h) and Rail Baltica (160-250 km/h). PLK has speed-up railway #9 (Warszawa - Gdańsk) up to 200 km/h and it will probably do this for line #351 (Poznań-Szczecin) in the future.

CPK page:








#PolskaNaDobrychTorach | Program kolejowy CPK


Inwestycje kolejowe CPK to łącznie prawie 1800 km nowych linii, które mają powstać do końca 2034 r. Dla ponad 500 km z nich prace przygotowawcze już trwają albo ruszą w tym roku. Pierwsze roboty budowlane mają się rozpocząć już za trzy lata.




cpk.pl









Railway component - Centralny Port Komunikacyjny







cpk.pl












Aktualności


Najnowsze informacje o realizacji inwestycji Programu Centralnego Portu Komunikacyjnego




cpk.pl


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

Gusiluz said:


> Article written by me (in Spanish) on the *Geotrén *website on the new lines (especially those dedicated to passengers) in Eastern and Central Europe:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Your information about high speed railways in Poland is out of date. Please, check my two posts above.


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

Qtya said:


> Prague - Wrocław high-speed feasibility study tender launched
> 
> 
> SŽ has published a tender for a contractor to undertake of feasibility study for a proposed high-speed line from Prague, via Hradec Králové, to Wrocław.
> ...


*Polish* tender for study involving high speed track section between Wrocław and Polish/Czech border:








CPK: Przetarg na studium dla nowej linii KDP Łódź – Wrocław


Kolejne opracowanie planistyczne będzie dotyczyło budowy nowej linii kolejowej w standardzie kolei dużych prędkości między Łodzią a Wrocławiem. CPK ogłosił właśnie przetarg na wykonanie studium techniczno-ekonomiczno-środowiskowego.




www.rynek-lotniczy.pl






Usługi - 643196-2020 - TED Tenders Electronic Daily



*



Kolejne opracowanie planistyczne będzie dotyczyło budowy nowej linii kolejowej w standardzie kolei dużych prędkości między Łodzią a Wrocławiem. CPK ogłosił właśnie przetarg na wykonanie studium techniczno-ekonomiczno-środowiskowego.

Click to expand...

*


> Przedmiotem zamówienia jest opracowanie studium techniczno-ekonomiczno-środowiskowego z elementami studium wykonalności dla projektu budowy linii kolejowej nr 85 na odcinku Łódź – Sieradz Północny i linii kolejowej nr 86 na odcinku Sieradz Północny – Kępno – Czernica Wrocławska – Wrocław Główny. Celem opracowania jest przygotowanie dokumentacji, wraz ze wskazaniem rekomendowanego przebiegu linii kolejowej w ramach projektu, w zakresie koniecznym do prowadzenia działań w kolejnych etapach procesu inwestycyjnego.
> 
> Założono liczne powiązania z infrastrukturą PKP PLK:
> 
> ...


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## SRC_100 (May 21, 2014)

Railways up to 350 km/h shouldn`t be considered as HRS. 
Railways with speed over 350 km/h may have been considered as HRS.


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## geogregor (Dec 11, 2006)

SRC_100 said:


> Railways up to 350 km/h shouldn`t be considered as HRS.
> Railways with speed over 350 km/h may have been considered as HRS.


Sorry but this is nonsense. Why 350 km/h and not 345? Or 360? This is completely arbitrary number.

Anyway, a lot of French and German HSR lines don't allow 350 km/h operation. How would you classify line from Lyon to Marseilles? Its operational speed is 320 km/h. How about Paris to Lyon (300 km/h). Would you call them "classic railways".


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

High speed railways in *Slovakia* (up to 200 km/h):


*(year 2017)*
https://unece.org/DAM/trans/main/ter/terdocs/TER_High-Speed_Master_Plan_Study.pdf (pages 78-80, 82).


*(year 2019)*
*High-speed railway to connect V4 capitals*


> Travel between the Czech Republic and Slovakia is about to get a major upgrade.
> 
> Czech Minister of Transport Vladimír Kremlík and his Slovak counterpart Arpád Érsek agreed to cooperate on the construction of the high-speed railway between Prague and Bratislava at a meeting of Czech and Slovak government representatives in Valtice, Czech Republic.
> 
> ...



*(year 2020)*
*Do Bratislavy dvoustovkou. Po 3 letech má být jasno, kdo opraví koridor z česko-slovenské hranice*
*Váhostav má na dosah víťazstvo v železničnom tendri za 300 miliónov*


> Tři roky od vyhlášení největší zakázky v dopravě této slovenské vlády by mohlo být jasno, kdo opraví trať z česko-slovenské hranice do Bratislavy a umožní zkrácení doby mezi českým a slovenským hlavním městem.
> 
> Rada Úradu pre verejné obstarávanie (ÚVO, obdoba českého antimonopolního úřadu) definitivně zamítla námitky dvou soutěžících a zadavatel, Železnice Slovenskej republiky (ŽSR), by měl po nabytí právní moci mít volné ruce k uzavření smlouvy na zakázku s odhadovanou cenou 305 milionů eur, tedy více než 7,5 miliardy korun.
> 
> ...


*Słowacy chcą zmodernizować pierwszą linię kolejową do prędkości 200 km/h*


> Wygląda na to, że kończy się epopeja związana z wyborem wykonawcy modernizacji odcinka słowackiej sieci kolejowej między Bratysławą a granicą słowacko-czeską. Ma być pierwszym w tym kraju, po którym pociąg pomkną z prędkością 200 km/h.
> Modernizacja odcinka linii kolejowej wykorzystywanego głównie przez pociągi międzynarodowe ma doprowadzić do podniesienia prędkości na nim. Na większym fragmencie 66 kilometrowej linii prędkość zostanie podniesiona do 200 km/h, a na pozostałych – do 160 km/h (obecnie pociągi mogą tu jeździć z maksymalną prędkością 140 km/h). Zbudowany zostanie nowy most kolejowy na granicznej rzece Morawie.
> 
> Słowacki zarządca infrastruktury (ŽSR) nie podpisał jeszcze umowy z wykonawcą, ale bardzo się to przybliżyło w związku z odrzuceniem odwołań dwóch z trzech konkurujących o wykonanie budowy. Wykonawcą zostanie prawdopodobnie konsorcjum słowacko-włoskie ICM - Váhostav SK. Koszt prac wyceniło ono na 275 milionów koron.
> ...


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

SRC_100 said:


> Railways up to 350 km/h shouldn`t be considered as HRS.
> Railways with speed over 350 km/h may have been considered as HRS.






> The definition of high-speed railway lines is based on corresponding specifications at EU level, e.g. “Council Directive 96/48/EC of 23 July 1996 on the interoperability of the trans-European high-speed rail system (modified by subsequent interoperability Directives) and, more specifically, TEN-T Regulation 1315/2013 [2], which foresee three categories of high-speed railway lines:
> i. Lines constructed explicitly for high-speed of 250 km/h as a minimum;
> ii. Conventional railway lines upgraded to 200 km/h as a minimum;
> iii. Conventional lines upgraded for high-speed trains, however below 200 km/h to allow for topographical particularities, such as in mountainous or urban areas.


Source: https://unece.org/DAM/trans/main/ter/terdocs/TER_High-Speed_Master_Plan_Study.pdf (page 1)


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## maziizam (Nov 24, 2014)

Sign the petition and support a social concept that straightens the Katowice-Ostrava high-speed rail route bent by politicians. Thanks!
https://www.petycjeonline.com/emb/304155


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## Vii87 (Jul 3, 2014)

Here there is a nice summary of plans for Trans Europe railway: How Trans Europe Express trains could be making a comeback


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

*Pociągiem między Warszawą i Budapesztem w 5,5 godziny?
By train between Warszawa and Budapest in 5,5 hours?*








Pociągiem między Warszawą i Budapesztem w 5,5 godziny?


Prezes Polskich Kolei Państwowych, kontynuując cykl spotkań z przedstawicielami kluczowych europejskich przedsiębiorstw kolejowych, spotkał się z szefem Kolei Węgierskich (Magyar Államvasutak). Krzysztof Mamiński i Róbert Homolya omówili dwustronną współpracę oraz działania zespołu roboczego ds...




www.rynek-kolejowy.pl






> Jak czytamy w komunikacie, trwają prace w ramach grupy roboczej V4 ds. kolei dużych prędkości oraz dotyczące operacyjności Bursztynowego Korytarza Kolejowego. Prezes Homolya poinformował, że MAV posiadają studium wykonalności pokazujące duży potencjał dla rozwoju konkurencyjności połączeń w regionie, poprzez skrócenie czasu przejazdu koleją między Warszawą i Budapesztem do 5,5 godziny. Uczestnicy spotkania zgodzili się, że utworzenie połączenia wysokich prędkości między obiema stolicami z rozszerzeniem o stolice Czech, Słowacji i Austrii pozwoli diametralnie zmienić sytuacje komunikacyjną w regionie Europy Środkowo-Wschodniej.


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## SRC_100 (May 21, 2014)

🔼 🔼
Summary: _ble ble ble we have a dream..._


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## Robert AB (Feb 29, 2020)

*Hungarian high-speed line feasibility study completed

Budapest-Warsaw high-speed rail line at 320 km/h will turn into Vienna and Székesfehérvár*











> *The feasibility study was carried out by NSV Varsó, a consortium of consultancy firm Trenecon and design companies Főmterv and Utiber, under a contract awarded in 2019.
> 
> STUDIES of the feasibility and alignment in Hungary of the planned Budapest – Bratislava – Brno – Warsaw high-speed line have been completed*, Hungary’s National Infrastructure Development Agency (NIF) announced at the end of April.
> 
> ...





> Plans are for a high-speed railway line linking the capitals of the Visegrad Group countries to also branch off to Vienna and Székesfehérvár, in central Hungary, the Ministry of Innovation and Technology (ITM) said on Wednesday.
> 
> *Trains on the planned rail line to be built over the next decade will be able to travel at speeds of up to 320kph*, the ministry said in a statement. The line will also be used by domestic InterCity trains, it added.
> 
> ...





> Hungarian authorities in charge of the project released a short animated film on how the project could look like once construction begins… in 2030.









> A visegrádi országok fővárosait felfűző nagysebességű összeköttetés, a Budapest-Varsó gyorsvasút, egy osztrák leágazással kapcsolhatja be a térséget a nyugat-európai gyorsvasúti hálózatba. A tervek szerint a következő évtizedben kiépülő vonal egyes szakaszain akár 320 kilométer/órás sebességgel járhatnának a vonatok. A pályát a belföldi InterCityk is használhatnák, például a balatoni utazásokban versenyképesebb alternatívát kínálva a közúti közlekedésnél.
> 
> *A tervezett nagysebességű vasútvonal Magyarország legforgalmasabb közlekedési tengelyében helyezkedik el. A Budapesttől északnyugati irányba tartó folyosó közúton, vasúton és a légi közlekedésben egyformán a legtelítettebb. Az 1. számú vasútvonal (Budapest-Hegyeshalom-Rajka) a napi 70 teher- és 400 személyvonat miatt már kapacitásai határán van, és ugyanez a helyzet a naponta 70 ezer egységjármű, felerészben teherautók, *kamionok által használt M1 autópályával. A térség közlekedési igényeinek jelentős hányadát a nemzetközi tranzitforgalom adja, de már a budapesti elővárosi forgalom kiszolgálása is korlátokba ütközik.
> 
> ...



Source:
2021:








Hungarian high-speed line feasibility study completed


Studies of the feasibility and alignment in Hungary of the planned Budapest – Bratislava - Brno - Warsaw high-speed line have been completed




www.railjournal.com












Budapest-Warsaw Rail Line to Branch off to Vienna, Székesfehérvár


Plans are for a high-speed railway line linking the capitals of the Visegrad Group countries to also branch off to Vienna and Székesfehérvár, in central Hungary, the Ministry of Innovation and Technology (ITM) said on Wednesday. Trains on the planned rail line to be built over the next decade...




hungarytoday.hu












High speed train to connect Budapest and Warsaw via Czech Republic and Slovakia - Kafkadesk


Budapest, Hungary - The much-anticipated "Visegrad high speed train" connecting the cities of Budapest and Warsaw is slowly inching closer to reality, although construction might only start in ten years. Confirmed by the government of Visegrad Group countries three years ago, the Budapest-Warsaw...




kafkadesk.org












Bécs és Székesfehérvár felé is leágazhat majd a több mint 300-zal száguldó gyorsvonat


A visegrádi országok fővárosait felfűző nagysebességű összeköttetés, a Budapest-Varsó gyorsvasút, egy osztrák leágazással kapcsolhatja be a térséget a nyugat-európai gyorsvasúti hálózatba. A tervek szerint a következő évtizedben kiépülő vonal egyes szakaszain akár 320 kilométer/órás sebességgel...




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Bécs és Székesfehérvár felé is leágazhat majd a Budapest-Varsó gyorsvasút


A visegrádi országok fővárosait felfűző nagysebességű összeköttetés egy osztrák leágazással kapcsolhatja be a térséget a nyugat-európai gyorsvasúti hálózatba. A tervek szerint a következő évtizedben kiépülő vonal egyes szakaszain akár 320 kilométer/órás sebességgel járhatnának a vonatok. A...




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2019:








Contract awarded for Budapest - Warsaw high-speed study


The latest news and analysis of the global railway industry from the world's leading international publication.




www.railjournal.com


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## Qwert (Jun 25, 2006)

First, using "Poszony (Bratislava)" in English written article on the Hungary Today is beyond pathetic. Anyway, as already mentioned in this thread, this is not Budapest - Warsaw line. This is Budapest - Vienna line with huge detour via Székesféhervár and with a branch to Warsaw which is practically impossible to build this way. Well done study. 

One would think if this is supposed to be joint V4 project, a joint feasibility study should be conducted.


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## geogregor (Dec 11, 2006)

SRC_100 said:


> 🔼 🔼
> Summary: _ble ble ble we have a dream..._


One of the best and most in-depth summary I have read in this thread  

But seriously you are spot on. We have all those studies and grand plans joining capitals and other cities in our region. Most of them have zero chance of being built in the next 30 years or so.


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## Ady (Mar 17, 2007)

Qwert said:


> Precisely. This HSR in Hungary is planned to suit Hungarian domestic traffic in the first place. Realistic travel time between Budapest and Bratislava would be more than 100 minutes in this alignment, because there is no feasible way to build fast enough connection between Rajka and Bratislava Central Station.
> 
> As opposed to that we can achieve almost exactly the same travel time (around 100 minutes) after upgrade of Slovak line from Bratislava to Szob (HU border) to 200 km/h (150 km distance) and if Hungarians do nothing with their part - the Szob - Budapest Nyugati line (64 km distance). The Slovak line is going to be modernised mostly for domestic reasons and it has been in early stages of preparations even before this V4 HSR project was officially introduced. It will be modernised irrespective of the V4 HSR. If Hungarians at least slightly upgrade their part too, travel time would be under 100 minutes, that means faster than the projected HSR.
> 
> ...


This is in fact the most illogical option as the part between Budapest and Esztergom is mountainous and densely populated as some of the most popular suburbs are here, so it would have to be (almost) entirely tunnelled. The current railway has recently been electrified and upgraded, but is still partially 1-track and has some very tight curves. Vmax is 100km/h, which is fine for a suburban line, but it is practically impossible to upgrade this line for high speed rail.


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## Ady (Mar 17, 2007)

Line 70 via Szob is also not an option as the whole line is a bottleneck with already very high traffic volumes. The stretch for BP Nyugati to Vác could be expanded to 4 tracks, but after Vác there is simply no room at a lot of places. Of course you could build a tunnel from Vác to Szob, but why? This option would have zero network advantage.


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## Qwert (Jun 25, 2006)

Ady said:


> This is in fact the most illogical option as the part between Budapest and Esztergom is mountainous and densely populated as some of the most popular suburbs are here, so it would have to be (almost) entirely tunnelled. The current railway has recently been electrified and upgraded, but is still partially 1-track and has some very tight curves. Vmax is 100km/h, which is fine for a suburban line, but it is practically impossible to upgrade this line for high speed rail.


Yeah right, because the proposed line Szekesfehervar - Gyor runs through uninhabited desert and contains no tunnels. And let's also ignore it is about 130 km longer than the line via Esztergom (only counting Hungarian part) and that is is practically impossible to built any kind of fast connection between Rajka and Bratislava Central station.

Doesn't "alagút" mean tunnel?


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## Ady (Mar 17, 2007)

Qwert said:


> Yeah right, because the proposed line Szekesfehervar - Gyor runs through uninhabited desert and contains no tunnels. And let's also ignore it is about 130 km longer than the line via Esztergom (only counting Hungarian part) and that is is practically impossible to built any kind of fast connection between Rajka and Bratislava Central station.
> 
> Doesn't "alagút" mean tunnel?


Of course no new route is easy to build. This is why I mentioned network advantages. While the now proposed route offers also faster connection to Győr, Vienna, Szombathely, Sopron, Székesfehérvár, Balaton and everything behind it. Your proposed route offers faster connections to zero significant destinations, not even Vienna, as having to struggle through Pressburg is a major inhibitor.

Also the difference is not 130 km (not sure where you get that insane number from?) but more like 50 km: ~225km vs ~175km. At these speeds that's 10 minutes. Significant, but not a dealbreaker imo.


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## Qwert (Jun 25, 2006)

Ady said:


> Of course no new route is easy to build. This is why I mentioned network advantages. While the now proposed route offers also faster connection to Győr, Vienna, Szombathely, Sopron, Székesfehérvár, Balaton and everything behind it. Your proposed route offers faster connections to zero significant destinations, not even Vienna, as having to struggle through Pressburg is a major inhibitor.
> 
> Also the difference is not 130 km (not sure where you get that insane number from?) but more like 50 km: ~225km vs ~175km. At these speeds that's 10 minutes. Significant, but not a dealbreaker imo.


Precisely, it is connection of Budapest with Győr, Vienna, Szombathely, Sopron, Székesfehérvár, Balaton etc., which are all except Vienna insignificant destinations for a HSR. It is not connection of Budapest with Bratislava. Of course I have nothing against construction of this line, but this is not V4 HSR. It is North-Western Hungary HSR with a branch to Vienna. Travel time between Budapest and Bratislava on this HSR line proposed by Hungary would be longer than travel time on existing conventional line via Vác and Štúrovo after modernisation of SK section, so it is kind of pointless to use this line as a V4 HSR.

The insane number 130 km/h is difference between length of HSR Budapest - Székesfehérvár - Gyor - AT/SK border line and Budapest - Esztergom - SK border line, i.e. counting only the Hungarian sections. The line Bratislava - Štúrovo is going to be modernised irrespectively of this or any other HSR project, so there is no need to count its length.

BTW, what is Pressburg, some kind of slovakophobic insult?


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## rheintram (Mar 5, 2008)

I'm not well acquainted enough with the geography and topography to make any meaningful comment about the choice of route. Nevertheless, I am glad to see Hungary - at least on paper - is willing to invest in HSR infrastructure. It would make sense to link this line to the Vienna Airport Link under proposal:








Airport Link


Travelling quickly and easily from the east of Lower Austria and northern Burgenland to the airport and Vienna: the future connection between Bruck an der Leitha and Vienna International Airport will efficiently integrate the airport into the eastern Austrian railway network and create new...




infrastruktur.oebb.at


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## Ady (Mar 17, 2007)

Qwert said:


> Travel time between Budapest and Bratislava on this HSR line proposed by Hungary would be longer than travel time on existing conventional line via Vác and Štúrovo after modernisation of SK section, so it is kind of pointless to use this line as a V4 HSR.


Faster than 90 minutes? That's the planned travel time via the V4 HSR. Don't forget that the core section will have a 350 km/h Vmax. Since you're route via the Pilis mountains is and will remain a phantasy (for economical, ecological and transport policy reasons, as I have explained), you can't beat that, because the Danube Bend is a bottle neck where it's simply not feasible to increase the speed or build new tracks. Check for example on Google Maps how Nagymaros-Visegrád station how it's wedged between the town's buildings.


Qwert said:


> The insane number 130 km/h is difference between length of HSR Budapest - Székesfehérvár - Gyor - AT/SK border line and Budapest - Esztergom - SK border line, i.e. counting only the Hungarian sections. The line Bratislava - Štúrovo is going to be modernised irrespectively of this or any other HSR project, so there is no need to count its length.


And that's absolutely great. I hope there will be, like now, a 2-hourly intercity or interregio train, serving the main towns, I would suggest: Szenec, Galánta, Novi Zamki, Párkány, Nagymaros-Visegrád and Vác (so not Szob, which is the terminus anyway of several suburban trains per hour). Perhaps it could even be alternated with direct trains to Nyitra. Only the trains going further (to Prague, Berlin, Krakow and Warsaw) would use the V4 HSR.


Qwert said:


> BTW, what is Pressburg, some kind of slovakophobic insult?


Well it's where the original Slovak name "Presporok" is derived from, but if this confuses you, I can use the Hungarian names instead


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## Ady (Mar 17, 2007)

rheintram said:


> I'm not well acquainted enough with the geography and topography to make any meaningful comment about the choice of route. Nevertheless, I am glad to see Hungary - at least on paper - is willing to invest in HSR infrastructure. It would make sense to link this line to the Vienna Airport Link under proposal:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Well it's up to you, Liebe Schwager, how you build your, relatively short, section  But yeah, makes absolutely sense to run it through Schwechat and make branches to both Pressburg and Budapest. Similarly, Budapest Airport will be connect to the rail system and I hope it will not only be looped back to line 100 (direction Debrecen), but also to line 80 (Miskolc), 120 (Szolnok), 142 (Kecskemét) and a future eastbound HSR. This is doable with relatively few connecting stretches: 3 km to line 120, a further 6km parallel to ring road M0 to line 80 near Pécel, 4-5 km to line 100 and another 15 km to line 142. So less than 30km to connect 4 major lines, nowhere hindered by mountains or rivers or densely built-up areas is a bargain imo. The line of the eastbound HSR is obviously not yet decided, but I would favour a route south of line 100, to make it easy to create a further branch towards Szeged and hopefully Temeschwar.


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## Qwert (Jun 25, 2006)

Ady said:


> Szenec, Galánta, Novi Zamki, Párkány


If you could at least spell them right in your own language. Anyway, thanks for coming out as a chauvinist and for proving no sensible discussion with you is possible.


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## tunneltime (Aug 5, 2012)

*14.09.2021 

High speed railways in Slovakia*


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## 33Hz (Jul 29, 2006)

SZ and SNCF Network sign high-speed consultation agreement


SZ has signed an eight-year cooperation agreement with SNCF Network to develop the country’s first high-speed lines.




www.railjournal.com


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## Qtya (Aug 31, 2006)

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1547127394913353729


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## Limassoler (Jun 4, 2013)

*The "Solidarity Transport Hub" brings value to Poland and to Central & Eastern Europe's transport system*



> The project covers the construction of the appropriate airport, of a *new rail system based on high-speed concept* and the modernisation of the existing rail infrastructure, as well as the construction of road infrastructure.












*Rail, at the heart of STH system*












> Most of the STH railway investments belong to the *Trans-European Transport Network TEN-T*, according to the TEN-T Regulation review. This network is an instrument for coordinating and ensuring the coherence and complementarity of infrastructure investments.
> In addition, there are plans for cross-border railway connections. Preparatory work is already underway for the section *connecting Poland with the Czech Republic.* There are also planned *connections with Ukraine* through Lviv and Kyiv, and a *trip to Lithuania* will be possible using the *Rail Baltica* line.



_Published on 01 September 2022 on RailwayPro._​


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