# Israelis and Young Jews are flocking to Berlin



## Dr_Cosmo (Nov 8, 2010)

Young Israelis go crazy for Berlin

&

20 years on, Russians in Germany flocking to big cities


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## hadrett32 (Dec 8, 2010)

Berlin is the fastest growing Jewish community worldwide, with approx. 1000 people of Jewish origin moving in the city each year. Some stats say that there are 120,000 Jews in Berlin.


http://www.rferl.org/content/Article/1078688.html


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## KwIDF (Jul 9, 2010)

:dunno:...and what's the point ?


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## hadrett32 (Dec 8, 2010)

KwIDF said:


> :dunno:...and what's the point ?


good question :nuts: just a 'fact thread' maybe ?


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## Skrapebook (May 7, 2010)

Russians AND Jewish??!!!
That is NOT a good mix at all!
I know since I live with one (A living hell!) hno:


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## hadrett32 (Dec 8, 2010)

Skrapebook said:


> Russians AND Jewish??!!!
> That is NOT a good mix at all!
> I know since I live with one (A living hell!) hno:


But i think the Russians, who move to Berlin, are predominantly Jewish.


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## goschio (Dec 2, 2002)

Jewish communities are gorwing all over Germany.


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## hadrett32 (Dec 8, 2010)

goschio said:


> Jewish communities are gorwing all over Germany.


yeah and that's very nice in regard of the sad history. Seen from a historical perspective, Jews belong to Germany as Catholicism and Protestantism do. Nowadays, the Islam is also a part of Germany :lol:


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## pesto (Jun 29, 2009)

Glad to hear the Jewish community is reestablishing itself. But 120k sounds high. The temples I saw were either in disrepair or very lightly attended. If there are 120k Israelis there must be 1M Turks/Arabs/Palestinians or maybe the Jews are more scattered around the city.


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## hadrett32 (Dec 8, 2010)

The accurate numbers are unknown (because Germany does not collect data on Ethnicity and Religion) so, these 120,000 are rough estimations of a Jewish institution. However, the Jews in Germany are mostly liberal, secular and 'White/European looking' , which means that they are not a 'visible minority' like the Turkish or Arab people. But of course there are more Muslims in Berlin (and Europe in general) than Jews (due to the influx of Muslim immigration to Europe)


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## Dr_Cosmo (Nov 8, 2010)

hadrett32 said:


> The accurate numbers are unknown (because Germany does not collect data on Ethnicity and Religion) so, these 120,000 are rough estimations of a Jewish institution.


The official figures for the religious members of the Jewish community speak about 12.000.

BUT, the immigrant (mostly orthodox) Jews from former Soviet Union are not numbered and not yet members of the Jewish community.

Secondly, the Israelis settling in Berlin are in the majority liberal-secular and are not within the religious community either. 

PLUS, the Israelis are even coming with German passports, when having German parents or Grandparents. They are are not counted even as Foreigners/ Immigrants.

So all estimates are vague. I reckon 120.000 is a little to high, probably the real numbers are somewhere between 40.000-80.000.

Nevertheless, the Jewish revival is astonishing and is in line with the influx of young Europe to Berlin....


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## pesto (Jun 29, 2009)

I'm getting more confused. What is "Jewish origin"?

What we seem to be saying is that the Israeli (national) community if growing rapidly but the Jewish (religion) community if growing more slowly since most of the Israelis are of no religion (and presumably the older practicing Jews die out)?

The long-term the effect could be small since presumably the Israelis lose their Israeli status (or their children do) and become simply Germans, and if they are not religious they don't count as Jews.

But there has always been confusion about Jews (religion), Jews (ethnic/social group) and Isrealis (nationality). A constant topic in Israel (and for that matter, NY and LA as well).


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## hadrett32 (Dec 8, 2010)

pesto said:


> I'm getting more confused. What is "Jewish origin"?
> 
> What we seem to be saying is that the Israeli (national) community if growing rapidly but the Jewish (religion) community if growing more slowly since most of the Israelis are of no religion (and presumably the older practicing Jews die out)?
> 
> ...



I guess Jews aren't of a particular ethnicity, because the jewish diaspora started after the Romans destroyed the Temple in Jerusalem, hence, they emigrate to other regions (predominantly to other areas of the Roman empire) and stayed there. Although many Jews share a typical 'Jewish-looking', a lot of Jews intermingled with other Ethnic groups over the centuries. This is why many Russian Jews look similiar to Russo-Slavics, whereas Southern European Jews are more likely to look similiar to Latin people.


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## HelloMoto163 (Aug 13, 2005)

Please close this thread. I dont see the point of it and that will end in religion vs religion bash or ww2 againhno:


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## pesto (Jun 29, 2009)

HelloMoto163 said:


> Please close this thread. I dont see the point of it and that will end in religion vs religion bash or ww2 againhno:


Unfortunately, that often happens in these threads since it only takes 1 person to mess it up. But there is some interest in seeing what ethnic groups establish or reestablish themselves in new locations. The German-Jewish one of course has historic overtones but doesn't have to. It can be treated like the Portuguese or Dutch community in Germany (if there were any). 

I wouldn't lock-up until someone starts sticking negative value judgements into the discussion.


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## Dr_Cosmo (Nov 8, 2010)

pesto said:


> It can be treated like the Portuguese or Dutch community in Germany (if there were any).


Indeed. At least for the under 40 generation in Israel, Berlin has become a cultural mecca with largely positive associations.

BTW, not only a resettlement can be observed. 

Israelis are now the second highest Non-European tourist group in Berlin only after
the U.S. I personally have seen Israelis of all ages discovering Berlin....


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